yes some sort of death penalty needs to be in the game......but nothing to detrimental or time restraining to keep both the hardcore mmo fans and the casual's both able to do what they want in game........repair bill would be my call or have to buy more crew.
btw...a death penalty is coming we should be trying to work with the dev team to make sure its not too much......devs we especially need more info on this
Quite the oppsite actually, the majority want a reasonable DP and a way to increase the difficulty, it is all over this forum and loads of external forums as the biggest negative issues with the game along with a lack of varied content.
No one can claim majority rule. The only way to determine that would be a forced poll set for account log in that would prevent the ability to play the dang game until a response was chosen. Even then, the data would not be accurate.
with out conclusive data that can be confirmed there is no wy for eitehr side to claim supremacy. It is a hot topic. LOL, its STOs equivalent to U.S. health care reform, at the moment. No one agrees and no one can agree to disagree.
nither side can agree but all of the no DP people can agree with that sides perspective while the people who want a DP cannot agree what it should be. I say Cryptic should go with the side that has the most congruent opinion: the no DP side.
the rason: Asuming ther is a 50/50 split, If a DP is put is and Cryptic is running the chance of losing those players and a good number of the pro DP players due to that side thinking the DP is either too little or too much. If they decide to not put in an increased DP they keep all of the no DP people and lose a smaller number of the pro DP people.
Adding a DP runs the chance of decimating the player population.
Not adding a DP means greater sub retention.
simple economics.
I want the game to survive. Adding a DP threatens the immediate survivability and resources that can be dedicated to improving STO.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VthuFmCA6d0Didn't you say in another thread you've never died in space combat? :rolleyes: All the while calling people liars whenever they disagree or say they can do something you're unable to?
Yeah, I never once died in space combat until I reached Crystalline Entity. Now I've died probably 20 times because 99% of groups have no freaking clue how to beat the thing. Since fleet actions are almost always PUGs, getting people to coordinate is almost impossible. Right now, you have to get lucky enough for someone to be able to SSL the thing in order to win. If there's no one able to do that, fighting this thing is rather futile.
It cant be any clearer- The MAJORITY DO NOT WANT A DEATH PENALTY----and we arent even hearing from all those casual players that dont give a TRIBBLE about the forums....I am sure the 'NO's' would tip the scale even more!!!!!!
Ya lol....
And because nobody wants it Cryptic is implementing it. Sounds reasonable. They try to forcefully implement stuff nobody wants...
Or maybe... maybe....
Cryptic spoke to people that ACTUALLY know games and have experience playing games and listened to them, cause they work for game review websites and magazines.
If you listen to casual gamers about what a game should have you will just wreck your game, cause they have no clue. The people that have a clue about balance, motivation and gameplay mechanics are the hardcore gamers. Thats how it is.
Cryptic knows that, and thats why they DID listen to the community.... just not to the casual gamers, cause they dont create the core community.
And because nobody wants it Cryptic is implementing it. Sounds reasonable. They try to forcefully implement stuff nobody wants...
Or maybe... maybe....
Cryptic spoke to people that ACTUALLY know games and have experience playing games and listened to them, cause they work for game review websites and magazines.
If you listen to casual gamers about what a game should have you will just wreck your game, cause they have no clue. The people that have a clue about balance, motivation and gameplay mechanics are the hardcore gamers. Thats how it is.
Cryptic knows that, and thats why they DID listen to the community.... just not to the casual gamers, cause they dont create the core community.
Yeah so by your flawed logic the casual gamers opinions doesn't count for squat! I doubt it. Casual or hardcore doesn't really matter at the end of the day, we are all paying customers so Cryptics choices should be based on everyones opinions not just the hardcore MMO players. Casual & hardcore alike!
Yeah so by your flawed logic the casual gamers opinions doesn't count for squat! I doubt it. Casual or hardcore doesn't really matter at the end of the day, we are all paying customers so Cryptics choices should be based on everyones opinions not just the hardcore MMO players. Casual & hardcore alike!
Yeah but one part of the paying customers knows what actually works as gameplay mechanics and the other does not.
Guess who you listen to when you design your game.
Casuals will usually play whatever you throw at them, they are easy to please.
Yeah so by your flawed logic the casual gamers opinions doesn't count for squat! I doubt it. Casual or hardcore doesn't really matter at the end of the day, we are all paying customers so Cryptics choices should be based on everyones opinions not just the hardcore MMO players. Casual & hardcore alike!
Less experience gives a person a more blinkered viewpoint on a subject. Its that simple. I'm not saying that anyone should be completely ignored, because like you say, we all pay the same fee.
However one cannot ignore the fact that a less experienced MMO player may not have as much previous MMO experience in order to formulate an opinion both whats good for them as a player AND good for the long term health of the game, as a more experienced MMO player may have. However, even the most experienced player can have a blinkered viewpoint for other reasons.
Which is why its down to the devs to take on board EVERYONES viewpoint and weigh up the pros and cons of the arguments used, both from casuals and more experienced players alike.
Casuals will usually play whatever you throw at them, they are easy to please.
Assuming really generaly is not a good idea! I count myself as a casual player simply because I do not have 5 hours a day to play nor is leveling to cap my priority or outfiting my ship to max optimization. Doesn't make me any less part of the core community or my opinion on the game any less valid even so I may not be 100% knowledgable about the game or MMO's general dynamics, however I do know what I'd like to see in the game & this doesn't mean I will play whatever Cryptic throws at me. I'm sure others who see themselves as casual players feel the same.
Now I am not saying that getting more seasoned players opinions is not a good idea but I do think finding out what the so-called casual players like myself want is also extremely important as well. After all we do play the game! All players as far as garneshing a general concensus is important.
In my opinion & this purely my opinion to make everyone happy Cryptic should simply implement an optional Death penalty so those who want can & those like myself who don't can simply ignore it.
What's worrying the current uncertainty on the matter. I feel something such as the DT hot topic should be addressed ASAP either way.
No. Maybe later when there is a more complete game, but as it is right now the game is already tiring and tedious.. a death penalty would make it worse.
Casual players far outnumber hardcore players. Casual players are the bulk of the game's income.
Yup, however they keep playing whatever you do. As long as the core community is around, the casuals are around as well.
It's like in a guild... there are core guild member, and as long as they are in the guild all the other members may come and go, but the guild always is fun and successful. As soon as one or two of the core members leave, the guild will fall apart, whatever you do.
As long as all the print magazines tell the casuals STO is the greatest game of all times, there will be so many subscribers that Cryptic will need a new safe to store the money. But if the reviewers say STO sucks TRIBBLE, guess what.... they all leave.
Casuals are like sheep. Their friends go, they go.
Casual players far outnumber hardcore players. Casual players are the bulk of the game's income.
I'm wondering what you are implying with this statement.
Your statement relies a lot on what you define as "casual". Which is subjective.
To counter your statement, it can be argued that those who are "hardcore" to a game are the ones who often stay with it the longest because they enjoy repetitive "raid" style encounters. Whereas the turnover of casual players can be rather high due to the lack of end game content which in some games is mainly reliant on raiding.
So who should the devs listen to? The hardcore player who keeps with the game or the greater number of casual players who jump from game to game and refuse to entertain the idea that some things are necessary evil in an MMO? Should Cryptic solely listen to those with lifetime subs? Or to those who are prepared to pay for longer than 18 months?
The answer is that we all pay a subscription fee in one form or another. Therefore we are all entitled to give our opinions, and all deserve to be listened to. Its down to the devs to form a balanced decision based on the mature and reasonable justifications provided by both sides.
Casual outnumber Hardcore. Hardcore are just as likely to get their panties in a wad as casual and leave. If a hardcore leaves, just like a casual, so do his friends.
Now, if you want to use the terms.. casual and fanbois then there is a distinct difference. Fanbois think the devs are infallible and may stick with a game to its finality. But a fanbois and a hardcore gamer are two different things.
Hardcore gamers are not going to stick with the game as it is now and it has nothing to do with the lack of a DP at present. They will leave because there is no end game and they become bored. The fanbois will stay and cite there is an end game even when their is not.
Hardcore is a term that should be limited to PvPers. Because those are the real hardcore players. People who raid every night should have a seperate term, I prefer the term... NoLifers since they are neither hardcore, some are fanbois, but they are not casual either. That and anyone who spends 3 months of their life to get a specific set of items just to do it all over again when the new content comes out really needs psychological help (and maybe gf or bf).
If we wanted to define the subset of players, we could look at them this way.
Casual
Hardcore (PvP title)
Raiders
Another subset would be
Fanbois, as they could be of any the groups above.
Another would include
Crafters
Auctioneers (those who live in the auction house amassing fotunes of pixels and love doing it - we all know at least one of these guys)
Lol, and so we reach the obligatory "Casual vs Hardcore" discussion that plagues all MMO forums
Whether the devs listen to one side or the other is essentially irelevant.
Because in the end they need to make decisions that benefit not only what the players want but they also need to ensure long term health of the game and its subscription base.
And right now, this game doesn't have much going for it that ensures such long term health.
Did you look at the other threads about DP at take into acount those numbers ?
I'm not sure other threads would yield that much of a difference. Anyway, that person was only looking at this thread and did not infer he was doing anything more than that. Irrationally holding someone in account of something beyond the scope of the immediate thread topic is uncalled for.
Yeah, there is a configuration up and around this topic, but that does not give anyone license to be mean or attempt to devalue the effort of an individual who is only trying to help.
Comments
btw...a death penalty is coming we should be trying to work with the dev team to make sure its not too much......devs we especially need more info on this
No one can claim majority rule. The only way to determine that would be a forced poll set for account log in that would prevent the ability to play the dang game until a response was chosen. Even then, the data would not be accurate.
with out conclusive data that can be confirmed there is no wy for eitehr side to claim supremacy. It is a hot topic. LOL, its STOs equivalent to U.S. health care reform, at the moment. No one agrees and no one can agree to disagree.
nither side can agree but all of the no DP people can agree with that sides perspective while the people who want a DP cannot agree what it should be. I say Cryptic should go with the side that has the most congruent opinion: the no DP side.
the rason: Asuming ther is a 50/50 split, If a DP is put is and Cryptic is running the chance of losing those players and a good number of the pro DP players due to that side thinking the DP is either too little or too much. If they decide to not put in an increased DP they keep all of the no DP people and lose a smaller number of the pro DP people.
Adding a DP runs the chance of decimating the player population.
Not adding a DP means greater sub retention.
simple economics.
I want the game to survive. Adding a DP threatens the immediate survivability and resources that can be dedicated to improving STO.
Exactly, make it optional for those who want it.
Yeah, I never once died in space combat until I reached Crystalline Entity. Now I've died probably 20 times because 99% of groups have no freaking clue how to beat the thing. Since fleet actions are almost always PUGs, getting people to coordinate is almost impossible. Right now, you have to get lucky enough for someone to be able to SSL the thing in order to win. If there's no one able to do that, fighting this thing is rather futile.
Ya lol....
And because nobody wants it Cryptic is implementing it. Sounds reasonable. They try to forcefully implement stuff nobody wants...
Or maybe... maybe....
Cryptic spoke to people that ACTUALLY know games and have experience playing games and listened to them, cause they work for game review websites and magazines.
If you listen to casual gamers about what a game should have you will just wreck your game, cause they have no clue. The people that have a clue about balance, motivation and gameplay mechanics are the hardcore gamers. Thats how it is.
Cryptic knows that, and thats why they DID listen to the community.... just not to the casual gamers, cause they dont create the core community.
Yeah so by your flawed logic the casual gamers opinions doesn't count for squat! I doubt it. Casual or hardcore doesn't really matter at the end of the day, we are all paying customers so Cryptics choices should be based on everyones opinions not just the hardcore MMO players. Casual & hardcore alike!
Yeah but one part of the paying customers knows what actually works as gameplay mechanics and the other does not.
Guess who you listen to when you design your game.
Casuals will usually play whatever you throw at them, they are easy to please.
Less experience gives a person a more blinkered viewpoint on a subject. Its that simple. I'm not saying that anyone should be completely ignored, because like you say, we all pay the same fee.
However one cannot ignore the fact that a less experienced MMO player may not have as much previous MMO experience in order to formulate an opinion both whats good for them as a player AND good for the long term health of the game, as a more experienced MMO player may have. However, even the most experienced player can have a blinkered viewpoint for other reasons.
Which is why its down to the devs to take on board EVERYONES viewpoint and weigh up the pros and cons of the arguments used, both from casuals and more experienced players alike.
Assuming really generaly is not a good idea! I count myself as a casual player simply because I do not have 5 hours a day to play nor is leveling to cap my priority or outfiting my ship to max optimization. Doesn't make me any less part of the core community or my opinion on the game any less valid even so I may not be 100% knowledgable about the game or MMO's general dynamics, however I do know what I'd like to see in the game & this doesn't mean I will play whatever Cryptic throws at me. I'm sure others who see themselves as casual players feel the same.
Now I am not saying that getting more seasoned players opinions is not a good idea but I do think finding out what the so-called casual players like myself want is also extremely important as well. After all we do play the game! All players as far as garneshing a general concensus is important.
In my opinion & this purely my opinion to make everyone happy Cryptic should simply implement an optional Death penalty so those who want can & those like myself who don't can simply ignore it.
What's worrying the current uncertainty on the matter. I feel something such as the DT hot topic should be addressed ASAP either way.
Anyway I'm done rambling lol.
Anyway, YES to DP
Approximate results at this time: (44%) Death Penalty vs (56%) Status Quo
Yeah everyone thinks his opinion is important, but its not. I think its more like:
1. Game reviewers
2. Other press
2. Own developers
3. Own staff
4. Other developers
5. Friends
6. Family
7. Professional players
8. Rest of Community
Yup, however they keep playing whatever you do. As long as the core community is around, the casuals are around as well.
It's like in a guild... there are core guild member, and as long as they are in the guild all the other members may come and go, but the guild always is fun and successful. As soon as one or two of the core members leave, the guild will fall apart, whatever you do.
As long as all the print magazines tell the casuals STO is the greatest game of all times, there will be so many subscribers that Cryptic will need a new safe to store the money. But if the reviewers say STO sucks TRIBBLE, guess what.... they all leave.
Casuals are like sheep. Their friends go, they go.
I'm wondering what you are implying with this statement.
Your statement relies a lot on what you define as "casual". Which is subjective.
To counter your statement, it can be argued that those who are "hardcore" to a game are the ones who often stay with it the longest because they enjoy repetitive "raid" style encounters. Whereas the turnover of casual players can be rather high due to the lack of end game content which in some games is mainly reliant on raiding.
So who should the devs listen to? The hardcore player who keeps with the game or the greater number of casual players who jump from game to game and refuse to entertain the idea that some things are necessary evil in an MMO? Should Cryptic solely listen to those with lifetime subs? Or to those who are prepared to pay for longer than 18 months?
The answer is that we all pay a subscription fee in one form or another. Therefore we are all entitled to give our opinions, and all deserve to be listened to. Its down to the devs to form a balanced decision based on the mature and reasonable justifications provided by both sides.
Now, if you want to use the terms.. casual and fanbois then there is a distinct difference. Fanbois think the devs are infallible and may stick with a game to its finality. But a fanbois and a hardcore gamer are two different things.
Hardcore gamers are not going to stick with the game as it is now and it has nothing to do with the lack of a DP at present. They will leave because there is no end game and they become bored. The fanbois will stay and cite there is an end game even when their is not.
Hardcore is a term that should be limited to PvPers. Because those are the real hardcore players. People who raid every night should have a seperate term, I prefer the term... NoLifers since they are neither hardcore, some are fanbois, but they are not casual either. That and anyone who spends 3 months of their life to get a specific set of items just to do it all over again when the new content comes out really needs psychological help (and maybe gf or bf).
If we wanted to define the subset of players, we could look at them this way.
Casual
Hardcore (PvP title)
Raiders
Another subset would be
Fanbois, as they could be of any the groups above.
Another would include
Crafters
Auctioneers (those who live in the auction house amassing fotunes of pixels and love doing it - we all know at least one of these guys)
Whether the devs listen to one side or the other is essentially irelevant.
Because in the end they need to make decisions that benefit not only what the players want but they also need to ensure long term health of the game and its subscription base.
And right now, this game doesn't have much going for it that ensures such long term health.
3.141592654 (need something)
198 Votes
115 No Statues Quo 58.08%
83 Yes Add Death Penalty 41.92%
Did you look at the other threads about DP at take into acount those numbers ?
I'm not sure other threads would yield that much of a difference. Anyway, that person was only looking at this thread and did not infer he was doing anything more than that. Irrationally holding someone in account of something beyond the scope of the immediate thread topic is uncalled for.
Yeah, there is a configuration up and around this topic, but that does not give anyone license to be mean or attempt to devalue the effort of an individual who is only trying to help.
10char