Only problem with using the Regent's ship as a Legendary Negh'var is that it's much bigger then the Prime Universe Negh'var just by how much is hard to say as it's based on scaling with the Defiant which has its own scaling issues.
On the other hand people want the K'vort, which is literally just an upscaled B'rel.
Its a bit of a trade off IMO. Yea it might get scaled down but its still kinda viable as a variant for the Negh'var.
Differing scale in Trek is not as much of a suspension-of-disbelief problem as it is in other shows as long as the ships are definitely different classes that just look the same and do not actually mix parts because of the way they are shown to design things by way of dialog with the computer.
They usually start out with a current model of something (a ship in this case) and then just tell the computer to do things like scale it up or down and add or subtract stuff until it fits whatever role the new one is being designed for. With the way most parts are replicated instead of molded it would mean that changing the scale of the parts used to build the new ship would not be a problem in of itself (though realistically they would have to watch out for the strength and weight of and whatnot since scaling would effect those traits and not necessarily in a good way).
I think we need a legendary Negh'Var. It's long overdue. It can have a nice looking disruptor lance with that shape it already has. Make it command and miracle worker 4 seat universal stations and let those shield drains come and go harmlessly.
Only problem with using the Regent's ship as a Legendary Negh'var is that it's much bigger then the Prime Universe Negh'var just by how much is hard to say as it's based on scaling with the Defiant which has its own scaling issues.
On the other hand people want the K'vort, which is literally just an upscaled B'rel.
Its a bit of a trade off IMO. Yea it might get scaled down but its still kinda viable as a variant for the Negh'var.
I'd be fine if it were a scaled up one-off like the Excel2 - provided it came with the performance package previously outlined.
Otherwise, if it were to get the legendary treatment, I hope it would come with the sleek, 'modern' 2410 styling the Vor'ral received(the Negh'tev is way too blocky/"inflatable"). The Vor'ral is the gold standard of 2410 klingon design, in my book. It looks and feels every bit the counterpart to designs like the 25th century Gagarin, Sao Paulo, Bellerophon/Pathfinder, Vesta, etc.
Probably my biggest frustration with the current KDF fleet is that most of their best performers are tied down with ancient pre-TOS Discovery era hulls that didn't get a modern visual overhaul. The Qugh, Chargh, Sech, and even Qoj and Batlh all look like a mishmash of things you'd find in an Alien Lockbox instead of the cutting edge of the current Klingon Empire's military might. (M'chla being obviously excluded because it can atleast use the modernized Klingon Recruit ship's model.)
In this day and age in STO...I guess all I can really ask for that is realistic would be to see more terran skins, there are still ships that have skins but were never released. Since the arc is over the odds of seeing more terran ships is slim...so maybe like a pack that just releases the rest that are already in game?
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
1.) JHV/Dominion Science Vessel with a SECONDARY DEFLECTOR.
This, please. The carriers are fun, but I would love a true Jem'hadar Vanguard science ship.
Similarly, I'd like to see the Romulans, Klingons, and Jem'hadar get scout ships. I think they make thematic sense for all of the factions, since scouts serve to collect information in advance of their fleets. Personally, I would go with a Romulan Intel scout, Klingon pilot scout, and JHV Miracle Worker scout.
Also, I think we're long overdue for a legendary Bortasq and Neg'var
I like my Jem'Hadar in actual Dominion ships. That being said, I don't believe the Dominion faction has a dedicated Intel ship. Therefore, I'd LOVE to see a Jem'Hadar Intel battleship with a 5/3 weapons layout. Something similar to the Legendary Kelvin Enterprise or the Intel Kelvin Dreadnought.
I like my Jem'Hadar in actual Dominion ships. That being said, I don't believe the Dominion faction has a dedicated Intel ship. Therefore, I'd LOVE to see a Jem'Hadar Intel battleship with a 5/3 weapons layout. Something similar to the Legendary Kelvin Enterprise or the Intel Kelvin Dreadnought.
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,596Community Moderator
I'd honestly love to see a Promelian Battlecruiser too.
Would be pretty cool to have that made in some way. Probably with Plasma weapons and some sort of Plasma console.
The Franz Joseph designed USS Federation Dreadnaught from the original Star Trek Technical Manual (circa 1975).
It WAS shown on the screen (at the Bar along with the 1701-D 'fat one' ) in the second episode of Picard S3 - Third nacelle on the primary hull and all...
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
The Franz Joseph designed USS Federation Dreadnaught from the original Star Trek Technical Manual (circa 1975).
It WAS shown on the screen (at the Bar along with the 1701-D 'fat one' ) in the second episode of Picard S3 - Third nacelle on the primary hull and all...
It was also shown in wireframe on background screens in at least one of the movies (though I forget which one it appeared in that way at the moment), and it was probably shown the same way in early TNG. The Federation class dreadnaught was not the only one either, the Ptolemy, Saladin, and Hermes classes were also shown that way, so they are all at least semi-canon in a way.
The Franz Joseph designed USS Federation Dreadnaught from the original Star Trek Technical Manual (circa 1975).
It WAS shown on the screen (at the Bar along with the 1701-D 'fat one' ) in the second episode of Picard S3 - Third nacelle on the primary hull and all...
I'm pretty sure I saw a tweet where one of the people involved with the show said it was not actually the TOS Dreadnought, but I can't find it now. Based on this picture that I found though the secondary hull does look like it has a slightly different shape, so my guess is they probably made enough changes to the design for it to legally be a different ship due to all the rights issues with Franz Joseph's designs.
The Franz Joseph designed USS Federation Dreadnaught from the original Star Trek Technical Manual (circa 1975).
It WAS shown on the screen (at the Bar along with the 1701-D 'fat one' ) in the second episode of Picard S3 - Third nacelle on the primary hull and all...
I'm pretty sure I saw a tweet where one of the people involved with the show said it was not actually the TOS Dreadnought, but I can't find it now. Based on this picture that I found though the secondary hull does look like it has a slightly different shape, so my guess is they probably made enough changes to the design for it to legally be a different ship due to all the rights issues with Franz Joseph's designs.
Nope - that secondary Hull matches exactly what was done for the Federation Dreadnaught in the FJ Tech Manual. The Hangar Bay was in the Front and there was another Deflector Dish in the rear - the model on te bar looks exactly like teh FJ design from the back:
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Look a little closer, because it doesn't (unless it's just the angle, but I don't think so). The FJ design has a smooth curve along the bottom of the secondary hull, but that miniature from Picard seems to be almost flat towards the front with a much sharper angle to the rear deflector (if that's still there, not enough resolution to tell for sure either way) starting about halfway back. I'm no artist, but here's a quick MS Paint edit to show what I mean (the top one is my interpretation of the Picard model):
If I'm right about the secondary hull then there are probably other differences as well, but without a better look at the miniature it would be impossible to tell.
Look a little closer, because it doesn't (unless it's just the angle, but I don't think so). The FJ design has a smooth curve along the bottom of the secondary hull, but that miniature from Picard seems to be almost flat towards the front with a much sharper angle to the rear deflector (if that's still there, not enough resolution to tell for sure either way) starting about halfway back. I'm no artist, but here's a quick MS Paint edit to show what I mean (the top one is my interpretation of the Picard model):
If I'm right about the secondary hull then there are probably other differences as well, but without a better look at the miniature it would be impossible to tell.
It was a cheap knockoff toy for Federation Day, probably cranked out by a Ferengi - I wouldn't read too much into its detailing.
Look a little closer, because it doesn't (unless it's just the angle, but I don't think so). The FJ design has a smooth curve along the bottom of the secondary hull, but that miniature from Picard seems to be almost flat towards the front with a much sharper angle to the rear deflector (if that's still there, not enough resolution to tell for sure either way) starting about halfway back. I'm no artist, but here's a quick MS Paint edit to show what I mean (the top one is my interpretation of the Picard model):
If I'm right about the secondary hull then there are probably other differences as well, but without a better look at the miniature it would be impossible to tell.
Honestly, I blew the 'photo' up just to check and I do think its both the angle as well as the 3-D casting itself.;To me, the area under discussion still seems more rounded with not quite the sharp angle that you inserted; but yeah, it's not 100% clear but it's still REALLY close to the original FJ schematic (IMO). I can definitely see where you're coming from as well.
But Bottom Line: I know this design will never appear in STO because Paramount doesn't own it (the design), and I wouldn't be surprised if Paramount got a legal letter from the FJ estate over even that use of that particular miniature in a shot of the actual streamed episode.
But what I enjoy is that it shows that somewhere in the canon Star Trek Universe the USS Federation Dreadnaught design DID exist.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
And that's all operating under the assumption that those issues haven't been long ironed out by now, as they have been with Niven - at least to the point someone can ask to include a Kzinti reference in S1 of Picard and get a 'sure' response back - to say nothing of the ACTUAL Kzinti Starfleet officer in LD.
Whatever issues existed between Franz Joseph and Gene Roddenberry...first of all, the latter has been dead for decades now and second of all, the first being true, that is a VERY long time to hold a grudge - most people are not THAT petty.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
And that's all operating under the assumption that those issues haven't been long ironed out by now, as they have been with Niven - at least to the point someone can ask to include a Kzinti reference in S1 of Picard and get a 'sure' response back - to say nothing of the ACTUAL Kzinti Starfleet officer in LD.
Whatever issues existed between Franz Joseph and Gene Roddenberry...first of all, the latter has been dead for decades now and second of all, the first being true, that is a VERY long time to hold a grudge - most people are not THAT petty.
Well, the fact is that the FJ Estate is still making A LOT of money for its licensing of his work to the Star Fleet Battles tabletop game line. Also, Paramount has plenty of Star Fleet ship designs that it owns and can make use of. I doubt anyone is "Holding a Grudge" at this point and time. It's probably more that Paramount doesn't see the need to license The FJ designs.
(And remember, after Paramount got the rights to the STAR TREK IP lock stock and barrel - the story goes that GR had the opportunity of first refusal on those rights but passed because he either couldn't afford it, or Paramount at the time offered him cash to let them keep them and GR.)
^^^
But my point: When GR and Majel created Lincoln Enterprises and started selling unlicensed STAR TREK items and memorabilia at STAR TREK conventions and mail order in the 70s, Paramount sued GR and the suit was ultimately settled out of court.
As for Larry Niven and the Kzinti in later STAR TREK productions after TAS, there's been a couples of situations where a producer asked for his approval to just do a small thing here or there, and he gave them a verbal 'Okay, if you do that I won't do anything..." and they've gone with that.
But, since this is the first time they've shown an actual FJ ship design on screen in a Paramount official Star Trek production since STIII:TSFS where they did use a computer rendered 'Heavy Cruiser' schematic on the screen that was recreated on an ATARI PC for use in the film; and there's been nothing in the news about Paramount making any new licensing deal the FJ Estate for his designs from the 1975 STAR TREK Technical Manual; I doubt anything has changed.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
4.) Klingon 5/3 "Mirror Negh'var" Dreadnought Cruiser with stats/performance similar to a Scimitar. Based on Mirror-Worf's Regent ship from DS9. Dual Siege Cannons console - the wing cannons in the episode were clearly designed to be sufficient to attack DS9 directly. Would go through a lockbox to get one, if needed and it didn't suck(miracle worker primary with 5 tac consoles would be mandatory if LB/Promo).[/quote]
This or just a Legendary Negh'Var with 5/3 and 5 Tac consoles. Command and Temp Ops seatings.
Or a Legend K'vort...
Experimental weapon which fires - you guessed it - some nicely coloured torpedo - or perhaps even a spread every couple of seconds.
15 console slots, 5 each.
2 hangar bays, equipped with ships that use tachyon beam, charged particle burst, torpedo spread 3
A console that has some passive torpedo and drain stats. Active ability similar to the one from the T5 Akira, but firing blue torpedoes in all directions. New set bonus: adds torpedo damage, removes hard cooldowns on torpedo Boff abilities.
Trait: The colours of the rainbow, so pretty in the sky, are also on the bows, of enemies flying by (or 'Strong-arming', if that's more practical).
Description: Has no practical use, just continuously changes all your torpedoes' colours while they travel to enemies. Also plays 'What a Wonderful World' by Louis Armstrong whenever you activate a Torpedo Boff ability (High Yield, Spread, Transport Warhead)
Part of a bundle. The other item is a William Riker Boff. Instead of a standard phaser, he comes equipped with a saxophone and a trumpet. When being placed in a Boff station, he'll be the one singing What a Wonderful World instead when you have this ship's trait active.
I'd love to see the franz Joseph designs in game. one thing that always bugged me since the D did the saucer seper, If the stardrive gets destroyed, the saucer is well screwed. It would need at least a minimal warp engine to get to friendly space
> @vetteguy904 said: > I'd love to see the franz Joseph designs in game. one thing that always bugged me since the D did the saucer seper, If the stardrive gets destroyed, the saucer is well screwed. It would need at least a minimal warp engine to get to friendly space
I thought the saucer section traveled to Farpoint at warp 2, but it has been a while since I saw the episode.
Comments
Differing scale in Trek is not as much of a suspension-of-disbelief problem as it is in other shows as long as the ships are definitely different classes that just look the same and do not actually mix parts because of the way they are shown to design things by way of dialog with the computer.
They usually start out with a current model of something (a ship in this case) and then just tell the computer to do things like scale it up or down and add or subtract stuff until it fits whatever role the new one is being designed for. With the way most parts are replicated instead of molded it would mean that changing the scale of the parts used to build the new ship would not be a problem in of itself (though realistically they would have to watch out for the strength and weight of and whatnot since scaling would effect those traits and not necessarily in a good way).
I'd be fine if it were a scaled up one-off like the Excel2 - provided it came with the performance package previously outlined.
Otherwise, if it were to get the legendary treatment, I hope it would come with the sleek, 'modern' 2410 styling the Vor'ral received(the Negh'tev is way too blocky/"inflatable"). The Vor'ral is the gold standard of 2410 klingon design, in my book. It looks and feels every bit the counterpart to designs like the 25th century Gagarin, Sao Paulo, Bellerophon/Pathfinder, Vesta, etc.
Probably my biggest frustration with the current KDF fleet is that most of their best performers are tied down with ancient pre-TOS Discovery era hulls that didn't get a modern visual overhaul. The Qugh, Chargh, Sech, and even Qoj and Batlh all look like a mishmash of things you'd find in an Alien Lockbox instead of the cutting edge of the current Klingon Empire's military might. (M'chla being obviously excluded because it can atleast use the modernized Klingon Recruit ship's model.)
Similarly, I'd like to see the Romulans, Klingons, and Jem'hadar get scout ships. I think they make thematic sense for all of the factions, since scouts serve to collect information in advance of their fleets. Personally, I would go with a Romulan Intel scout, Klingon pilot scout, and JHV Miracle Worker scout.
Also, I think we're long overdue for a legendary Bortasq and Neg'var
The Light Battlecruiser is pretty close, but it's unfortunately stuck in the lockbox system. (It doesn't have the vanguard wingmen or a commander intel seat though.)
https://sto.fandom.com/wiki/Jem'Hadar_Light_Battlecruiser
https://stowiki.net/wiki/Jem'Hadar_Light_Battlecruiser
Me Too That ship looks awesome!! I'll post it's name after I go back to the show and verify it.
Worf: A Promelian battle cruiser!
Would be pretty cool to have that made in some way. Probably with Plasma weapons and some sort of Plasma console.
The one that looks like the Love Boat. Make it a command/miracle worker and give it Centaur or Sao Paulo pets. I prefer Centaurs.
It would really be cool if one of the Centaur missions could be to follow and extend shields for an ally vessel.
i wouldn't be surprised if we get it has a promo or lockbox in the next couple of years
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
It was also shown in wireframe on background screens in at least one of the movies (though I forget which one it appeared in that way at the moment), and it was probably shown the same way in early TNG. The Federation class dreadnaught was not the only one either, the Ptolemy, Saladin, and Hermes classes were also shown that way, so they are all at least semi-canon in a way.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
If I'm right about the secondary hull then there are probably other differences as well, but without a better look at the miniature it would be impossible to tell.
But Bottom Line: I know this design will never appear in STO because Paramount doesn't own it (the design), and I wouldn't be surprised if Paramount got a legal letter from the FJ estate over even that use of that particular miniature in a shot of the actual streamed episode.
But what I enjoy is that it shows that somewhere in the canon Star Trek Universe the USS Federation Dreadnaught design DID exist.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Whatever issues existed between Franz Joseph and Gene Roddenberry...first of all, the latter has been dead for decades now and second of all, the first being true, that is a VERY long time to hold a grudge - most people are not THAT petty.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Well, the fact is that the FJ Estate is still making A LOT of money for its licensing of his work to the Star Fleet Battles tabletop game line. Also, Paramount has plenty of Star Fleet ship designs that it owns and can make use of. I doubt anyone is "Holding a Grudge" at this point and time. It's probably more that Paramount doesn't see the need to license The FJ designs.
(And remember, after Paramount got the rights to the STAR TREK IP lock stock and barrel - the story goes that GR had the opportunity of first refusal on those rights but passed because he either couldn't afford it, or Paramount at the time offered him cash to let them keep them and GR.)
^^^
But my point: When GR and Majel created Lincoln Enterprises and started selling unlicensed STAR TREK items and memorabilia at STAR TREK conventions and mail order in the 70s, Paramount sued GR and the suit was ultimately settled out of court.
As for Larry Niven and the Kzinti in later STAR TREK productions after TAS, there's been a couples of situations where a producer asked for his approval to just do a small thing here or there, and he gave them a verbal 'Okay, if you do that I won't do anything..." and they've gone with that.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
This or just a Legendary Negh'Var with 5/3 and 5 Tac consoles. Command and Temp Ops seatings.
Or a Legend K'vort...
Came up with the following idea:
Legendary Alita.
5 forward weapon slots, pre-loaded with newly coloured torpedoes
3 Aft
2 port, 2 starboard torpedo launcher weapon slots with yet differently coloured torpedoes.
Experimental weapon which fires - you guessed it - some nicely coloured torpedo - or perhaps even a spread every couple of seconds.
15 console slots, 5 each.
2 hangar bays, equipped with ships that use tachyon beam, charged particle burst, torpedo spread 3
A console that has some passive torpedo and drain stats. Active ability similar to the one from the T5 Akira, but firing blue torpedoes in all directions. New set bonus: adds torpedo damage, removes hard cooldowns on torpedo Boff abilities.
Trait: The colours of the rainbow, so pretty in the sky, are also on the bows, of enemies flying by (or 'Strong-arming', if that's more practical).
Description: Has no practical use, just continuously changes all your torpedoes' colours while they travel to enemies. Also plays 'What a Wonderful World' by Louis Armstrong whenever you activate a Torpedo Boff ability (High Yield, Spread, Transport Warhead)
Part of a bundle. The other item is a William Riker Boff. Instead of a standard phaser, he comes equipped with a saxophone and a trumpet. When being placed in a Boff station, he'll be the one singing What a Wonderful World instead when you have this ship's trait active.
A nebula strike cruiser
4/3 with an experiment weapon slot
A single hangar bay
Cmdr eng/mw
Ltc tac/pilot
Ltc sci
Ltc universal
4/4/4/1
Gets the battlecruiser trait tree
Can use dual cannons
10 turn rate
Uses the Melbourne model with the auxiliary warp nacelles
Some kind of console that makes use of the extra nacelles maybe with a passive speed/turn rate/inertia boost
Not everything you see on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
Occidere populo et effercio confractus
> I'd love to see the franz Joseph designs in game. one thing that always bugged me since the D did the saucer seper, If the stardrive gets destroyed, the saucer is well screwed. It would need at least a minimal warp engine to get to friendly space
I thought the saucer section traveled to Farpoint at warp 2, but it has been a while since I saw the episode.