test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

SPOILERS, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru''; ETC.

thetaninethetanine Member Posts: 1,361 Arc User
edited November 2021 in Ten Forward
Captain Michael Burnham proves yet again that she's too ignorant to know that she's not qualified to wear the uniform, much less the four pips of Captaincy.

Captain Michael Burnham, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru'' Starts off well enough. However, with 10 minutes remaining in the episode, Burnham lives through being exposed fully to vacuum. Once back in the Discovery, she tells the President of the UFP that she's an idiot if she thinks she's an idiot. Go watch it. It will all click once you've seen it.

And! Once you've seen it, you can't unsee it!

That's all, Folks!!
Post edited by thetanine on
STAR TREK
lD8xc9e.png
Tagged:
«13

Comments

  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 15,371 Arc User
    thetanine wrote: »
    Captain Michael Burnham proves yet again that she's too ignorant to know that she's not qualified to wear the uniform, much less the four pips of Captaincy.

    Captain Michael Burnham, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru'' Starts off well enough. However, with 10 minutes remaining in the episode, Burnham lives through being exposed fully to vacuum. Once back in the Discovery, she tells the President of the UFP that she's an idiot if she thinks she's an idiot. Go watch it. It will all click once you've seen it.

    And! Once you've seen it, you can't unsee it!

    That's all, Folks!!

    I'm not sure she was exposed for more than a few seconds to be honest - the whole sequence was in slow-mo for dramatic effect. The 'delay' in her programmable matter EV suit activing was likely not as 'delayed' as the slow-mo sequence implied.

    However, I'm not going to argue the point that she shouldn't have been the one piloting the Workbee in the first place. But then - that was the point of the 'clash of viewpoints' between her and the President.

    And in my view, what the president said at the end was correct. As much as I, personally, enjoy Discovery I do take issue with the way Burham is portrayed.
    Burnham seems to have a pathologic need to be everyone's saviour and has continual put the needs of the few up against the needs of the many. She often, unnecessarily, puts people in harms way because she can't handle the idea that some scenarios are impossible. This could end up being a tremendous story arc for this season where Burnham has to come to grips with what it means to be a true leader and a real captain. It's something the show has tiptoed around since the beginning.

    My fear is that despite having all those faults laid out that Burnham and the crew are instead going to continue to keep trying to save everyone and everything always. And it's going to work because the writers want Burnham to be a superhero. And the one person who has clearly articulated the primary area for Burnham to grow (the president) will instead be viewed as a villain and antagonist for this season.
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    Why wasn't she just told...the Captain's place is on the bridge? That's what Disco is going to struggle with, is that old Mike is going to want to do everything herself. Yeah, you might have the best EVA abilities, but it's not logical for the Captain to leave the bridge in a situation like that. The hardest part of being a Captain is sending your officers to their deaths. She should have been on that bridge, making decisions, not off doing playing hero.

    I also really don't understand why Book's transformer ship was being used like a Starfleet shuttle ought to have been.

    If they're not going to have her parking her bum and instead acting like a loose-cannon First Officer, who could get away with such things, then forget about Voyager...she shouldn't even be captaining Discovery.
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan Member Posts: 36,862 Arc User
    No, she shouldn't be - Saru should be...it's about damn time we get a PERMANENT alien captain of a hero ship - too damn many humans have held that role. Azetbur was right about the Federation being a glorified 'Homo Sapiens only' club.​​
    Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!

    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

    RIP Breonna Taylor, George Floyd, Rayshard Brooks & Calvin Munerlyn

    blacklivesmatter.png

    #LegalizeAwoo

    A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
    An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
    A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
    A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"


    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."

    "Curiosity is bad! It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed...and more importantly, it makes you poor!"
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.
  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 15,371 Arc User
    edited November 2021
    I've real mixed feelings here - I generally enjoy Discovery, but as someone who has remained 'loyal' to it I'd have to confess that the writer's preoccupation with Michael Burham has worn me down a fair bit.

    I went into S4 E1 with an open mind but yet again we were presented with the tired old scenario of 'SuperBurnham' being the only one fast/smart/strong/qualified enough save the day/Galaxy/universe. And yes, they skirted around this issue, in a fashion, with the President - but they did so in a way that, in a sense, painted her (the President) in a bad light.

    The over-emphasis on Burnham really needs to stop.
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    I've real mixed feelings here - I generally enjoy Discovery, but as someone who has remained 'loyal' to it I'd have to confess that the writer's preoccupation with Michael Burham has worn me down a fair bit.

    I went into S4 E1 with an open mind but yet again we were presented with the tired old scenario of 'SuperBurnham' being the only one fast/smart/strong/qualified enough save the day/Galaxy/universe. And yes, they skirted around this issue, in a fashion, with the President - but they did so in a way that, in a sense, painted her (the President) in a bad light.

    The over-emphasis on Burnham really needs to stop.

    I could live with it if she was totally alone on the ship. If it was literally just a one-woman show, not figuratively.

    In absolutely every episode, it's Burnham or bust. There's no room for any of the other characters to develop, because she's always the best. The only one who can ever save the day. There's just no room to manoeuvre and ironically, Discovery might work if only her character was killed.
  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 15,371 Arc User
    edited November 2021
    kayajay wrote: »
    reyan01 wrote: »
    I've real mixed feelings here - I generally enjoy Discovery, but as someone who has remained 'loyal' to it I'd have to confess that the writer's preoccupation with Michael Burham has worn me down a fair bit.

    I went into S4 E1 with an open mind but yet again we were presented with the tired old scenario of 'SuperBurnham' being the only one fast/smart/strong/qualified enough save the day/Galaxy/universe. And yes, they skirted around this issue, in a fashion, with the President - but they did so in a way that, in a sense, painted her (the President) in a bad light.

    The over-emphasis on Burnham really needs to stop.

    I could live with it if she was totally alone on the ship. If it was literally just a one-woman show, not figuratively.

    In absolutely every episode, it's Burnham or bust. There's no room for any of the other characters to develop, because she's always the best. The only one who can ever save the day. There's just no room to manoeuvre and ironically, Discovery might work if only her character was killed.

    Its a pity really, because they clearly still want Burham to be the big hero - but that's pretty much all they've done for the past three seasons and it's tiresome now.

    I want to enjoy it more than I do and guess I can hope it'll get better; sadly think I'm fooling myself. I thought the same of previous seasons but the writers don't seem able to move beyond shallow world-building and letting any character that isn't Michael Burnham fade into the background. Heck, just look at Tilly - they don't actually seem to know what to do with her anymore, particularly since Adira basically replaced her as the ship's 'wunderkid'.
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    kayajay wrote: »
    reyan01 wrote: »
    I've real mixed feelings here - I generally enjoy Discovery, but as someone who has remained 'loyal' to it I'd have to confess that the writer's preoccupation with Michael Burham has worn me down a fair bit.

    I went into S4 E1 with an open mind but yet again we were presented with the tired old scenario of 'SuperBurnham' being the only one fast/smart/strong/qualified enough save the day/Galaxy/universe. And yes, they skirted around this issue, in a fashion, with the President - but they did so in a way that, in a sense, painted her (the President) in a bad light.

    The over-emphasis on Burnham really needs to stop.

    I could live with it if she was totally alone on the ship. If it was literally just a one-woman show, not figuratively.

    In absolutely every episode, it's Burnham or bust. There's no room for any of the other characters to develop, because she's always the best. The only one who can ever save the day. There's just no room to manoeuvre and ironically, Discovery might work if only her character was killed.

    Its a pity really, because they clearly still want Burham to be the big hero - but that's pretty much all they've done for the past three seasons and it's tiresome now.

    I want to enjoy it more than I do and guess I can hope it'll get better; sadly think I'm fooling myself. I thought the same of previous seasons but the writers don't seem able to move beyond shallow world-building and letting any character that isn't Michael Burnham fade into the background. Heck, just look at Tilly - they don't actually seem to know what to do with her anymore, particularly since Adira basically replaced her as the ship's 'wunderkid'.

    She needs to grow up. You basically need Burnham from 10 or 20-years in the future to arrive and take over, when she's middle-aged, cool-headed and ready to be a "captain". At the moment, she is NOT ready to be responsible for the lives of a crew. Yeah, she throws herself into the fray with no hesitation...but a captain is more than that. A Captain goes down with their ship...but why do I imagine that Burnham would be outside the ship, in an EVA Suit, trying to fix a problem that she could have delegated...and then get given the Voyager-J when Discovery goes down in flames?

    A Captain is detached and either she's not acting it, she's not being written as such, or there's some other glaring error in giving her the chair. They need to "grow" the character as an officer would grow to become a captain. At the moment, she wouldn't pass the command exam! Deanna would make a better ship's captain, because at least she'll make that call.

    Seriously...Discovery needs to make this woman behave the way a captain should and captain's don't leave the bridge. Well, unless you're Captain Kirk, but no one is Captain Kirk. Annddd let's not get into Mike being from the TOS era...she's still not calm and cool-headed as a Captain should be.
  • thetaninethetanine Member Posts: 1,361 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    thetanine wrote: »
    Captain Michael Burnham proves yet again that she's too ignorant to know that she's not qualified to wear the uniform, much less the four pips of Captaincy.

    Captain Michael Burnham, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru'' Starts off well enough. However, with 10 minutes remaining in the episode, Burnham lives through being exposed fully to vacuum. Once back in the Discovery, she tells the President of the UFP that she's an idiot if she thinks she's an idiot. Go watch it. It will all click once you've seen it.

    And! Once you've seen it, you can't unsee it!

    That's all, Folks!!

    I'm not sure she was exposed for more than a few seconds to be honest - the whole sequence was in slow-mo for dramatic effect. The 'delay' in her programmable matter EV suit activing was likely not as 'delayed' as the slow-mo sequence implied.

    However, I'm not going to argue the point that she shouldn't have been the one piloting the Workbee in the first place. But then - that was the point of the 'clash of viewpoints' between her and the President.

    And in my view, what the president said at the end was correct. As much as I, personally, enjoy Discovery I do take issue with the way Burham is portrayed.
    Burnham seems to have a pathologic need to be everyone's saviour and has continual put the needs of the few up against the needs of the many. She often, unnecessarily, puts people in harms way because she can't handle the idea that some scenarios are impossible. This could end up being a tremendous story arc for this season where Burnham has to come to grips with what it means to be a true leader and a real captain. It's something the show has tiptoed around since the beginning.

    My fear is that despite having all those faults laid out that Burnham and the crew are instead going to continue to keep trying to save everyone and everything always. And it's going to work because the writers want Burnham to be a superhero. And the one person who has clearly articulated the primary area for Burnham to grow (the president) will instead be viewed as a villain and antagonist for this season.

    I agree with you 100% Reyan01, kayajay, and legendarylycan.

    I'll share something with you guys that my wife told me way back before Discovery had even aired its first Season One Episode. She told me that if that actor (who plays Burnham) is to be the focus of the show that I might not like this series. I asked her why is that; she told me that Sonequa Martin-Green was in one of her shows: The Walking Dead. My wife said Green was a terrible actor--and that she couldn't find any way to like her character. I think she may have even said she was glad they killed her off or whatever.

    Anyways, I tried really hard to like Discovery by focusing on the other actors and ignoring Burnham. It doesn't work as well as I wish it could.
    STAR TREK
    lD8xc9e.png
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    thetanine wrote: »
    reyan01 wrote: »
    thetanine wrote: »
    Captain Michael Burnham proves yet again that she's too ignorant to know that she's not qualified to wear the uniform, much less the four pips of Captaincy.

    Captain Michael Burnham, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru'' Starts off well enough. However, with 10 minutes remaining in the episode, Burnham lives through being exposed fully to vacuum. Once back in the Discovery, she tells the President of the UFP that she's an idiot if she thinks she's an idiot. Go watch it. It will all click once you've seen it.

    And! Once you've seen it, you can't unsee it!

    That's all, Folks!!

    I'm not sure she was exposed for more than a few seconds to be honest - the whole sequence was in slow-mo for dramatic effect. The 'delay' in her programmable matter EV suit activing was likely not as 'delayed' as the slow-mo sequence implied.

    However, I'm not going to argue the point that she shouldn't have been the one piloting the Workbee in the first place. But then - that was the point of the 'clash of viewpoints' between her and the President.

    And in my view, what the president said at the end was correct. As much as I, personally, enjoy Discovery I do take issue with the way Burham is portrayed.
    Burnham seems to have a pathologic need to be everyone's saviour and has continual put the needs of the few up against the needs of the many. She often, unnecessarily, puts people in harms way because she can't handle the idea that some scenarios are impossible. This could end up being a tremendous story arc for this season where Burnham has to come to grips with what it means to be a true leader and a real captain. It's something the show has tiptoed around since the beginning.

    My fear is that despite having all those faults laid out that Burnham and the crew are instead going to continue to keep trying to save everyone and everything always. And it's going to work because the writers want Burnham to be a superhero. And the one person who has clearly articulated the primary area for Burnham to grow (the president) will instead be viewed as a villain and antagonist for this season.

    I agree with you 100% Reyan01, kayajay, and legendarylycan.

    I'll share something with you guys that my wife told me way back before Discovery had even aired its first Season One Episode. She told me that if that actor (who plays Burnham) is to be the focus of the show that I might not like this series. I asked her why is that; she told me that Sonequa Martin-Green was in one of her shows: The Walking Dead. My wife said Green was a terrible actor--and that she couldn't find any way to like her character. I think she may have even said she was glad they killed her off or whatever.

    Anyways, I tried really hard to like Discovery by focusing on the other actors and ignoring Burnham. It doesn't work as well as I wish it could.

    You're not wrong. She actually reminds me of Danny Dyer in the respect that when you cast Danny Dyer in a role, the character you get is Danny Dyer. And nothing against Danny Dyer, because he does what he does well...I'm just not convinced that she's necessarily as likeable a person to get away with just playing herself, playing captain.
  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 15,371 Arc User
    I will say, slightly in Burham's defense, that they are probably trying to show her as a person of her time. I mean, fair is fair - can't really bemoan Captain Burnham feeling the need to be on almost every away team for example, as that's something that Captain Kirk did frequently. In fact, I'd argue it's slightly worse in Kirk's case as he quite often took his senior staff with him too.

    This habit was actually addressed a few times in later series. For example, Captain Picard chose Riker as the Enterprise XO specifically because of the note on Riker's service record that stated that he refused to let Captain DeSoto lead an away team due to the dangers present on the planet he planned to visit. And in 'Best of Both Worlds' Deanna Troi outright says ""Commander Riker. It is inappropriate for you to lead the away team. Until the return of Captain Picard, you are in command of the Enterprise. We're in a state of war, and your place is on the Bridge." Riker doesn't like it, but he does accept it.
    And the President actually said something similar to that to Burnham; however, it played out differently in this case - and that's a pity. Burnham actually stopping to consider, even if only for a moment, whether the President might have been correct would've been a great character development moment for her. Sadly they instead decided to turn it into an ego battle between the two characters, both of whom seem rather unlikable and self-centered at this point.

  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    I will say, slightly in Burham's defense, that they are probably trying to show her as a person of her time. I mean, fair is fair - can't really bemoan Captain Burnham feeling the need to be on almost every away team for example, as that's something that Captain Kirk did frequently. In fact, I'd argue it's slightly worse in Kirk's case as he quite often took his senior staff with him too.

    This habit was actually addressed a few times in later series. For example, Captain Picard chose Riker as the Enterprise XO specifically because of the note on Riker's service record that stated that he refused to let Captain DeSoto lead an away team due to the dangers present on the planet he planned to visit. And in 'Best of Both Worlds' Deanna Troi outright says ""Commander Riker. It is inappropriate for you to lead the away team. Until the return of Captain Picard, you are in command of the Enterprise. We're in a state of war, and your place is on the Bridge." Riker doesn't like it, but he does accept it.
    And the President actually said something similar to that to Burnham; however, it played out differently in this case - and that's a pity. Burnham actually stopping to consider, even if only for a moment, whether the President might have been correct would've been a great character development moment for her. Sadly they instead decided to turn it into an ego battle between the two characters, both of whom seem rather unlikable and self-centered at this point.

    Yep. She didn't take it onboard. It didn't register whatsoever and she didn't even consider for a moment that she might be being given some fair and sound advice. She's right, she's always right and everyone else is wrong. There's no character growth or development, which is essential now that she's captain. Her behaviour wasn't ever appropriate for any officer, but it's certainly not for a captain. I know exactly what would happen though if Starfleet tried to relieve her though...the crew would side with her and they'd all just skip off on Discovery, rogue.

    She needs to cool her jets, accept her responsibility and stay on deck one. Until she behaves like a captain, it's just not believable that she'd be allowed to be one, even in times of crisis.
  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 3,898 Arc User
    thetanine wrote: »
    reyan01 wrote: »
    thetanine wrote: »
    Captain Michael Burnham proves yet again that she's too ignorant to know that she's not qualified to wear the uniform, much less the four pips of Captaincy.

    Captain Michael Burnham, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru'' Starts off well enough. However, with 10 minutes remaining in the episode, Burnham lives through being exposed fully to vacuum. Once back in the Discovery, she tells the President of the UFP that she's an idiot if she thinks she's an idiot. Go watch it. It will all click once you've seen it.

    And! Once you've seen it, you can't unsee it!

    That's all, Folks!!

    I'm not sure she was exposed for more than a few seconds to be honest - the whole sequence was in slow-mo for dramatic effect. The 'delay' in her programmable matter EV suit activing was likely not as 'delayed' as the slow-mo sequence implied.

    However, I'm not going to argue the point that she shouldn't have been the one piloting the Workbee in the first place. But then - that was the point of the 'clash of viewpoints' between her and the President.

    And in my view, what the president said at the end was correct. As much as I, personally, enjoy Discovery I do take issue with the way Burham is portrayed.
    Burnham seems to have a pathologic need to be everyone's saviour and has continual put the needs of the few up against the needs of the many. She often, unnecessarily, puts people in harms way because she can't handle the idea that some scenarios are impossible. This could end up being a tremendous story arc for this season where Burnham has to come to grips with what it means to be a true leader and a real captain. It's something the show has tiptoed around since the beginning.

    My fear is that despite having all those faults laid out that Burnham and the crew are instead going to continue to keep trying to save everyone and everything always. And it's going to work because the writers want Burnham to be a superhero. And the one person who has clearly articulated the primary area for Burnham to grow (the president) will instead be viewed as a villain and antagonist for this season.

    I agree with you 100% Reyan01, kayajay, and legendarylycan.

    I'll share something with you guys that my wife told me way back before Discovery had even aired its first Season One Episode. She told me that if that actor (who plays Burnham) is to be the focus of the show that I might not like this series. I asked her why is that; she told me that Sonequa Martin-Green was in one of her shows: The Walking Dead. My wife said Green was a terrible actor--and that she couldn't find any way to like her character. I think she may have even said she was glad they killed her off or whatever.

    Anyways, I tried really hard to like Discovery by focusing on the other actors and ignoring Burnham. It doesn't work as well as I wish it could.

    She actually is a good dramatic actress, which is why Fuller delayed the show to give her time to finish her run in The Walking Dead (which underutilized her talents too). Her forte seems to be nested personality layers, she plays the spy/traitor/multiple personality villain type really well, which was probably what Fuller was looking for if he planned to explore the Human-hosting-Vulcan-Katra-fragment thing much.

    When CBS decided to cram several of Fuller's pitches together and use a standard fixed-cast serial format instead of the two-or-three arc per season anthologies they kind of blurred the Burnham character so she does not have a solid center to switch from one personality to the other, and that along with the sometimes-cheesy melodramatic dialog spotlights her weaknesses instead of her strengths as an actress.
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    thetanine wrote: »
    reyan01 wrote: »
    thetanine wrote: »
    Captain Michael Burnham proves yet again that she's too ignorant to know that she's not qualified to wear the uniform, much less the four pips of Captaincy.

    Captain Michael Burnham, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru'' Starts off well enough. However, with 10 minutes remaining in the episode, Burnham lives through being exposed fully to vacuum. Once back in the Discovery, she tells the President of the UFP that she's an idiot if she thinks she's an idiot. Go watch it. It will all click once you've seen it.

    And! Once you've seen it, you can't unsee it!

    That's all, Folks!!

    I'm not sure she was exposed for more than a few seconds to be honest - the whole sequence was in slow-mo for dramatic effect. The 'delay' in her programmable matter EV suit activing was likely not as 'delayed' as the slow-mo sequence implied.

    However, I'm not going to argue the point that she shouldn't have been the one piloting the Workbee in the first place. But then - that was the point of the 'clash of viewpoints' between her and the President.

    And in my view, what the president said at the end was correct. As much as I, personally, enjoy Discovery I do take issue with the way Burham is portrayed.
    Burnham seems to have a pathologic need to be everyone's saviour and has continual put the needs of the few up against the needs of the many. She often, unnecessarily, puts people in harms way because she can't handle the idea that some scenarios are impossible. This could end up being a tremendous story arc for this season where Burnham has to come to grips with what it means to be a true leader and a real captain. It's something the show has tiptoed around since the beginning.

    My fear is that despite having all those faults laid out that Burnham and the crew are instead going to continue to keep trying to save everyone and everything always. And it's going to work because the writers want Burnham to be a superhero. And the one person who has clearly articulated the primary area for Burnham to grow (the president) will instead be viewed as a villain and antagonist for this season.

    I agree with you 100% Reyan01, kayajay, and legendarylycan.

    I'll share something with you guys that my wife told me way back before Discovery had even aired its first Season One Episode. She told me that if that actor (who plays Burnham) is to be the focus of the show that I might not like this series. I asked her why is that; she told me that Sonequa Martin-Green was in one of her shows: The Walking Dead. My wife said Green was a terrible actor--and that she couldn't find any way to like her character. I think she may have even said she was glad they killed her off or whatever.

    Anyways, I tried really hard to like Discovery by focusing on the other actors and ignoring Burnham. It doesn't work as well as I wish it could.

    She actually is a good dramatic actress, which is why Fuller delayed the show to give her time to finish her run in The Walking Dead (which underutilized her talents too). Her forte seems to be nested personality layers, she plays the spy/traitor/multiple personality villain type really well, which was probably what Fuller was looking for if he planned to explore the Human-hosting-Vulcan-Katra-fragment thing much.

    When CBS decided to cram several of Fuller's pitches together and use a standard fixed-cast serial format instead of the two-or-three arc per season anthologies they kind of blurred the Burnham character so she does not have a solid center to switch from one personality to the other, and that along with the sometimes-cheesy melodramatic dialog spotlights her weaknesses instead of her strengths as an actress.

    I honestly felt the same way about Archer and Reed. Quantum Leap gave Scott such room to manoeuvre as an actor and Desmond's actually gave Dominic a more character too. It really can come down to casting, which is of course why Genevieve was replaced...it totally wasn't the right role for her, despite how good of an actor she is in other things.

    In the original Alien, Veronica believed she'd been cast as Ripley when she turned up to start filming on the first day and only then found out she was Lambert...but I can't imagine her playing Ripley. They made the right casting decision, so having a cast of great actors isn't always enough, if they're playing the wrong roles.
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan Member Posts: 36,862 Arc User
    Speaking of otherwise great actors playing the wrong roles...are people still laughing about Chris Pratt's Mario?​​
    Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!

    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

    RIP Breonna Taylor, George Floyd, Rayshard Brooks & Calvin Munerlyn

    blacklivesmatter.png

    #LegalizeAwoo

    A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
    An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
    A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
    A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"


    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."

    "Curiosity is bad! It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed...and more importantly, it makes you poor!"
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.
  • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 9,610 Arc User
    I'm not laughing until I see it, because I still remember how many people laughed at Michael "Mr. Mom" Keaton playing Batman.
    Lorna-Wing-sig.png
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    Oh, Michael was and still is a God. Robert Pattinson being Batman is just embarrassing in principal.
  • saurializardsaurializard Member Posts: 4,173 Arc User
    Michael Keaton as Batman was great because you look at his Bruce Wayne and you go "no way this awkward dork could be Batman!", which works in this universe.

    Chris Pratt as Mario is downright stupid, especially since Charles Martinet has proven in Skyrim, among others, he can act other than repeating catchphrases, he's available (heck, he's even in the movie as someone else).

    And Jesus Christ, after so many decades, we want to properly hear him FULLY play Mario as a complete developed character at least once.

    It also doesn't help that, outside of some of Pratt's controversial takes, it also happens when his Star Lord is being overshadowed by Chadwick Boseman -may he rest in power-'s way more badass version from the What If series.
    #TASforSTO
    Iconian_Trio_sign.jpg?raw=1
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    There was only one Mario...RIP Bob.
  • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 9,610 Arc User
    Y'all kids. You just can't remember that time when Keaton playing Batman was going to destroy the franchise and shut down superhero movies forever. Or, apparently, when Ben Affleck as an older Batman was going to be laughed out of the theaters.

    The clips I've seen of Pattinson as Year One Batman look pretty awesome, to be honest. A lot will hinge on how well he can play the dichotomy between Bruce Wayne, international playboy, and the Darknight Detective, and having seen him in Water For Elephants I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt.

    And thus I'll see what's going on with Mario and Pratt. Is the use of a frankly bigoted Italian-accent stereotype really that central to the character?
    Lorna-Wing-sig.png
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    jonsills wrote: »
    Y'all kids. You just can't remember that time when Keaton playing Batman was going to destroy the franchise and shut down superhero movies forever. Or, apparently, when Ben Affleck as an older Batman was going to be laughed out of the theaters.

    The clips I've seen of Pattinson as Year One Batman look pretty awesome, to be honest. A lot will hinge on how well he can play the dichotomy between Bruce Wayne, international playboy, and the Darknight Detective, and having seen him in Water For Elephants I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt.

    And thus I'll see what's going on with Mario and Pratt. Is the use of a frankly bigoted Italian-accent stereotype really that central to the character?

    In fairness, Val Kilmer and Doug Ross worked together to kill the franchise in the 90's, until Nolan brought it back.

    Pratt though...his is an apt name, for any English person.
  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,571 Arc User
    thetanine wrote: »
    Captain Michael Burnham proves yet again that she's too ignorant to know that she's not qualified to wear the uniform, much less the four pips of Captaincy.

    Captain Michael Burnham, Season 04; Ep. 01 "Kobayashi Maru'' Starts off well enough. However, with 10 minutes remaining in the episode, Burnham lives through being exposed fully to vacuum. Once back in the Discovery, she tells the President of the UFP that she's an idiot if she thinks she's an idiot. Go watch it. It will all click once you've seen it.

    And! Once you've seen it, you can't unsee it!

    That's all, Folks!!

    Exposure to vacuum does not cause instant death, back in the 60s a NASA astronaut was accidentally exposed to a vacuum for 30 seconds without dieing, and theoretically a human should be able to survive for a minute and a half though most would lose consciousness after about 15 seconds. Burnham was only exposed for a second or two at most, so she'd be fine.

    As for her leaving the ship herself yes it was a mistake, but I think it's fine as long as future episodes treat this as a learning experience and show her accepting her place as being on the bridge delegating these tasks to her crew going forward. When first taking a leadership role it's easy to feel like you need to do everything yourself even though that isn't your job.
    Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
    eaY7Xxu.png
  • saurializardsaurializard Member Posts: 4,173 Arc User
    As long as you exhale before being exposed to vacuum, you'll be "fine" for a while (as in about 15 seconds before losing consciousness, a few minutes before dying and in-between various nasty swelling effects in the most vulnerable body parts) but need some medical treatment if you stayed there long enough, which was one mistake made in an episode of TNG where someone is told to inhale before being exposed, which is a deadly mistake as it'll rupture your lungs.
    #TASforSTO
    Iconian_Trio_sign.jpg?raw=1
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan Member Posts: 36,862 Arc User
    Problem is, that's something most people would do on instinct anyway - when you're suddenly exposed to conditions resulting in you having no air, the first thing you'll think to do is collect as much of it as possible.​​
    Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!

    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

    RIP Breonna Taylor, George Floyd, Rayshard Brooks & Calvin Munerlyn

    blacklivesmatter.png

    #LegalizeAwoo

    A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
    An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
    A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
    A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"


    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."

    "Curiosity is bad! It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed...and more importantly, it makes you poor!"
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.
  • saurializardsaurializard Member Posts: 4,173 Arc User
    Problem is, that's something most people would do on instinct anyway - when you're suddenly exposed to conditions resulting in you having no air, the first thing you'll think to do is collect as much of it as possible.​​
    I sincerely hope Starfleet does have holodeck drills to... well, drill this into the mind of their crew, considering that's the kind of things that can happen on a starship.

    Then, again, it's also in the same universe where a breach sucks everything violently into space and force fields take just enough time to activate to lose at least one crewmember and emergency transportation when blown into space doesn't exist.
    #TASforSTO
    Iconian_Trio_sign.jpg?raw=1
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan Member Posts: 36,862 Arc User
    Isn't it SUPPOSED to suck everything violently into space? When you're going from the pressure of...whatever atmosphere is present aboard the ship to the nothing of a vacuum...pressure equalization tends to be very violent.

    Also the same problem with the hulls of any aquatic-based ship - like the ones in the recently released Aquatics species pack for Stellaris - one small crack in the hull on some of those pressurized water containers and they'll rupture violently.​​
    Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!

    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

    RIP Breonna Taylor, George Floyd, Rayshard Brooks & Calvin Munerlyn

    blacklivesmatter.png

    #LegalizeAwoo

    A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
    An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
    A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
    A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"


    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."

    "Curiosity is bad! It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed...and more importantly, it makes you poor!"
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.
  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 3,898 Arc User
    edited November 2021
    Isn't it SUPPOSED to suck everything violently into space? When you're going from the pressure of...whatever atmosphere is present aboard the ship to the nothing of a vacuum...pressure equalization tends to be very violent.

    Also the same problem with the hulls of any aquatic-based ship - like the ones in the recently released Aquatics species pack for Stellaris - one small crack in the hull on some of those pressurized water containers and they'll rupture violently.​​

    That is why all the large open areas NuTrek likes to show are a very bad idea in a starship, there is so much more air in the section trying to escape, especially one with big windows and thin skins like the DSC ships. You can see in the silly blowout scenes that the outer hull is built a bit like a house wall and isn't very thick.

    In TOS, (according to Roddenberry and Jefferies in interviews and convention talks) the Enterprise hull was nine inches of tritanium armor over a duranium pressure hull (they never said how thick that was) and that all the equipment (with a few exceptions like the physical deflector dish) was fixable from the inside.

    If you look at the big Enterprise model at the Smithsonian the hull has that kind of hammered look that tanks, heavy construction vehicles, and armored ships and other things with very thick metal hulls get after a while, but unfortunately the budget of the show did not allow them to shoot extreme closeups much.

    In fact, most of the passes that were supposed to be used as stock shots were lost and could not be reshot, that is why they reused the few they had left so much, and most of those used the three-foot model instead of the eleven-foot one (because the ones using that model were the bulk of the missing ones) so that level of detail was not even in the shots.

    Also, if you look at the sets and listen to the dialog in The Conscience of the King, it didn't have any windows in the outer hull except for the three on either side of the shuttlebay in the "catwalk" tubes. The glowing "window like lights" as they were called in memos were left undefined, they were just a convenient way of showing the audience (who were assumed to have seen a cruise liner before) how big the ship was supposed to be without burning dialog time talking about it every few episodes.

    Holes punched or burned in the TOS ship's hull were probably more like the railgun hole in The Expanse, a baseball to basketball sized hole (or maybe a blown seal or ruptured seam) instead of a huge garage door sized chunk of hull ripping away.

    Also, in addition to all the hull-adjacent rooms being fairly small, all of those 'A' shaped archways in the halls are section seal doors that close when there is danger of a hull puncture but are left open the rest of the time to help keep the crew from feeling they are living in a rat maze.
  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,571 Arc User
    Isn't it SUPPOSED to suck everything violently into space?

    From what I've heard movies and TV shows greatly exaggerate just how violent it is.
    Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
    eaY7Xxu.png
  • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 9,610 Arc User
    Isn't it SUPPOSED to suck everything violently into space?​​
    That's frequently exaggerated in fiction; remember that the Russian module of the ISS had a leak that went undetected for quite a while, and then took (if I recall correctly) about a week to repair. They did evacuate the module, but that was more out of an excess of caution than because it was about to violently erupt.

    After all, even if the ship is pressurized as much as air at sea level on Earth, that still only gives you a pressure differential of one atmosphere. Submarines have tougher hulls than spaceships out here in the real world, because they have to survive pressure differentials of up to nine hundred atmospheres.
    Lorna-Wing-sig.png
  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 15,371 Arc User
    edited November 2021
    I'll be honest, whilst still have mixed feelings, S4 Ep2 did improve on this a little. Burnham wasn't the big hero of this episode and there were times where she was shown to be struggling with her new position. Her immediate acceptance of Saru's offer to support and advise was played out perfectly.

    Also noteworthy that almost everyone on the crew was able to make significant contributions for a change - a byproduct of them dialing-down the over emphasis on Burnham. This needs to happen more. Much more.

    I won't say anything more as this isn't a thread for discussing S4 Ep2 (although I do feel it'd be nice to have a thread specifically to discuss S4 in it's entirety.

    One thing I will say though - I do wish they'd stop with the lame FX on the bridge; those flamethrowers bursting out from specific points and sparklers falling from the ceiling are preposterous and make me feel like I'm watching a Nightwish concert!
  • kayajaykayajay Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    I'll be honest, whilst still have mixed feelings, S4 Ep2 did improve on this a little. Burnham wasn't the big hero of this episode and there were times where she was shown to be struggling with her new position. Her immediate acceptance of Saru's offer to support and advise was played out perfectly.

    Also noteworthy that almost everyone on the crew was able to make significant contributions for a change - a byproduct of them dialing-down the over emphasis on Burnham. This needs to happen more. Much more.

    I won't say anything more as this isn't a thread for discussing S4 Ep2 (although I do feel it'd be nice to have a thread specifically to discuss S4 in it's entirety.

    One thing I will say though - I do wish they'd stop with the lame FX on the bridge; those flamethrowers bursting out from specific points and sparklers falling from the ceiling are preposterous and make me feel like I'm watching a Nightwish concert!

    Maybe a Mod could change the title to something like Disco S4 episode discussion (warning spoilers)?
Sign In or Register to comment.