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  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 48,147 Arc User
    The issue with the Dominion is that it is well documented that the ONLY species that actually does the fighting is the Jem'Hadar. There is no other Dominion soldier. Vorta are supervisor/strategist personnel, and Changelings are at the top. The story just wouldn't make sense.
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  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 425 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    The issue with the Dominion is that it is well documented that the ONLY species that actually does the fighting is the Jem'Hadar. There is no other Dominion soldier. Vorta are supervisor/strategist personnel, and Changelings are at the top. The story just wouldn't make sense.

    Except that DS9 makes it crystal clear that the Dominion does not operate at all like Starfleet or a regular military does (though they try to give that appearance to throw everyone else off). They mainly work by subterfuge and misdirection via agents, and those agents are almost always Vorta, though a few are Changelings in situations where a Vorta could not infiltrate).

    The Jem'Hadar are clearly nothing but meat droids, the only way Paramount could have made that more blatant would have been by having them answer "Roger Roger!" when given orders. They are the Dominion equivalent of low-level redshirts at best, not captain material at all (the Vorta fill that role even though they pretend not to). In fact, one Dominion official said something like "go ahead and kill them, we will just make more" or words to that effect in a totally unfazed way, which shows the utter lack of regard the Dominion had for the Jem'Hadar.

    The only time the Dominion has the upper hand is when they have some critical technical advantage arraigned by those agents (like getting the information to allow their weapons go right though Federation and Klingon shields) or cause confusion in their enemy's command structure so they make blunders and waste effort, or when they have a considerable advantage in numbers and throw an avalanche of Jem'Hadar at them the exact same way the CIS used battle droids in Star Wars.

    What does not make sense is those totally expendable grunts who only live for a few years (there was a humorous scene where the "old veteran" Jem'Hadar of the unit assigned to a mission with some of the DS9 people bragged about making it to five years old, then asked Dax how old she was and gaped when she said she stopped counting when she hit 200) and only get a basic skill set programmed into them in leu of experience suddenly being promoted to officers and not making ignorant mistakes because of that total lack of real life experience. It is like a cyberpunk plugging in a skill chip, they might know how to do something from virtual rote, but they often have no idea how to put it to use in a more generalized way.

  • guriphuguriphu Member Posts: 492 Arc User
    edited April 17
    rattler2 wrote: »
    The issue with the Dominion is that it is well documented that the ONLY species that actually does the fighting is the Jem'Hadar. There is no other Dominion soldier. Vorta are supervisor/strategist personnel, and Changelings are at the top. The story just wouldn't make sense.
    Absolutely, the Vorta and the Changelings are basically the Fleet Admirals of the Dominion :wink: :wink: :wink:
  • somtaawkharsomtaawkhar Member Posts: 5,924 Arc User
    Except that DS9 makes it crystal clear that the Dominion does not operate at all like Starfleet or a regular military does (though they try to give that appearance to throw everyone else off). They mainly work by subterfuge and misdirection via agents, and those agents are almost always Vorta, though a few are Changelings in situations where a Vorta could not infiltrate).
    That was never how The Dominion "mainly" work. The Dominion do basic spying and subterfuge operations, just like any military does, but the Dominion's primary means of attack was through sheer firepower, and overwhealing numbers, from mass Jem'Hadar assaults, and their very advanced technology.
    The Jem'Hadar are clearly nothing but meat droids, the only way Paramount could have made that more blatant would have been by having them answer "Roger Roger!" when given orders.
    Paramount had nothing to do with The Dominion, or DS9. It's all CBS.
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 8,539 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    The issue with the Dominion is that it is well documented that the ONLY species that actually does the fighting is the Jem'Hadar. There is no other Dominion soldier. Vorta are supervisor/strategist personnel, and Changelings are at the top. The story just wouldn't make sense.
    If we take the player character as the grunt they appear in the ground missions, yes.

    If we take the player character as the captain of a ship (or equivalent of the Fleet Admiral that we are supposed to be in the other origins), they should all be vorta.
  • serov141serov141 Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    with the T6 ships used by all levels news announced today. Will the Samsar count?
  • centurian821centurian821 Member Posts: 253 Arc User
    serov141 wrote: »
    with the T6 ships used by all levels news announced today. Will the Samsar count?

    I don't see why not. It's a T6 ship after all.
  • serov141serov141 Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    cool, now to make a kobali
  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 425 Arc User
    edited April 19
    Except that DS9 makes it crystal clear that the Dominion does not operate at all like Starfleet or a regular military does (though they try to give that appearance to throw everyone else off). They mainly work by subterfuge and misdirection via agents, and those agents are almost always Vorta, though a few are Changelings in situations where a Vorta could not infiltrate).
    That was never how The Dominion "mainly" work. The Dominion do basic spying and subterfuge operations, just like any military does, but the Dominion's primary means of attack was through sheer firepower, and overwhealing numbers, from mass Jem'Hadar assaults, and their very advanced technology.
    The Jem'Hadar are clearly nothing but meat droids, the only way Paramount could have made that more blatant would have been by having them answer "Roger Roger!" when given orders.
    Paramount had nothing to do with The Dominion, or DS9. It's all CBS.


    Yes, when the Dominion gets around to sending out ships and troops they use simple mass wave tactics (probably by necessity with the Jem'Hadar), and they do send out raiders to harass enemy forces, but long before any of that they use agents to gather intel, perform assassinations (and sometimes replacements) of key enemy leaders, sabotage and sow confusion, and all sorts of other nasty tricks. If you watch DS9 in order you can see that very thing happening (though some of it is not obvious and only comes to light later on).

    The point person of the Dominion was Eris, not Jem'Hadar in scout ships or whatever, a Vorta agent. The horneytoads are often used as distractions and the obvious "bad guy" to "chase" the agent or other similar uses, so the Vorta can do their agent thing unnoticed or unsuspected, but the Dominion always leads with Intelligence black ops missions, they do not scream and leap like the Klingons do or rattle sabers and try to talk out differences the way the Federation does when they initiate hostilities.

    Really, the Dominion makes the supposedly sneaky Romulans look downright straightforward in operations style.
  • duncanidaho11duncanidaho11 Member Posts: 7,546 Arc User
    edited April 20
    That was never how The Dominion "mainly" work. The Dominion do basic spying and subterfuge operations, just like any military does, but the Dominion's primary means of attack was through sheer firepower, and overwhealing numbers, from mass Jem'Hadar assaults, and their very advanced technology.

    Except that each conflict they were involved in was preceded by aggressive intelligence operations the likes of which the AQ/BQ hadn't seen before (in scope, aggressiveness, and methodology. See. Changelings.) It's more fair to say that the Dominion's primary means of attack is manipulation through Vorta and Founders with Jem'Hadar held in reserve. This is repeated time and again through the manipulation of the Klingon Empire, the secondary effects that had with the political transitions on Cardassia (leading to Alliance), decimating the Tal Shiar and Obsidian Order (prior to war) through carefully orchestrated subterfuge (not sheer firepower, firepower's application was carefully moderated to achieve maximum impact at minimum material effort), and the attempted manipulation through the FED including the attempt to start a war with the Tzenkethi (See. The Adversary) and attempted destruction of Bajor by changeling Bashir (see. By Inferno's Light.)

    This strategy is basic to the structure of the Dominion, both in examining the caste structure as well as their nominally friendly affiliations with other powers (in spite of said caste structure). Each specialized element works in tandem for defense and conquest, with the Jem'Hadar only supplying a final punch should political (1st stage) and intelligence (2nd stage) operations fail (allowing a nominally friendly face to be maintained in spite of the firepower on reserve. If one cooperates with the Dominion [see. Dosi, Karemma] then stage one is all that's required. The tertiary attack by Jem'Hadar is never brought into play.)

    For reference, see both:
    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Dominion_cold_war
    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Dominion_War

    Also: first lines from memory alpha regarding Dominion military strategy:
    "A Dominion strategy frequently used was to not use its military might during initial contacts, but rather, to take over via influence and espionage. While Jem'Hadar fighters destroyed the USS Odyssey as a show of force, the Dominion used its vast influential and espionage tactics to destabilize the Alpha Quadrant. "

    See also:
    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Teplan_blight
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  • somtaawkharsomtaawkhar Member Posts: 5,924 Arc User
    edited April 20
    Except that each conflict they were involved in was preceded by aggressive intelligence operations the likes of which the AQ/BQ hadn't seen before
    Except it was literally the same kind of TRIBBLE the Romulans had been pulling for over 200 years. The Dominion was just better at it due the fact they had literal shapeshifters.

    The infiltrations were just softening blows before they sent in their main force, the Jem'Hadar, which did the majority of the heavy lifting for the Dominion in taking over other species and area.
  • duncanidaho11duncanidaho11 Member Posts: 7,546 Arc User
    edited April 20
    Except it was literally the same kind of TRIBBLE the Romulans had been pulling for over 200 years. The Dominion was just better at it due the fact they had literal shapeshifters.

    The infiltrations were just softening blows before they sent in their main force, the Jem'Hadar, which did the majority of the heavy lifting for the Dominion in taking over other species and area.

    Well, for one that's a counterfactual hypothetical hinging on assertion. Canon would also suggest otherwise. The Romulans used...
    1. Direct attacks (relying on superiority through tech/firepower) without the prelude of subterfuge (See. TOS: Balance of Terror, DS9: The Die is Cast)
    2. Conflicts initiated with the near simultaneous use of power and subterfuge, as opposed to tiered use (see. TNG Reunification)
    3. Subterfuge without intent to ultimately subjugate opposing factions, but to seek greater political leverage for nebulous long term benefit (see. TNG: The Defector)
    4. Intelligence assets designed and used for multiple roles (see. ENT: The Aenar and more basically the concept of a Warbird)
    5. Alliances in service of subterfuge for ultimately shared gain (See. Redemption)

    ...in addition to point-instance analogs of Dominion intelligence operations (Holo-Spock, clone Picard, playing sides against each other, forming alliances of mutual convenience) which can just as well be attributed to being a sneaky faction and written across several decades. Romulan society is analogues to human society and thus is driven by intraspecific competition and cooperative groups, formed by ad hoc social contract (ex. Tal Shiar.) By nature their strategies and motivations are chaotic. To put it simply, Romulans are fundamentally a much broader society (see. Nemesis) and their military exploits reflect this (in simply following the pattern set by contemporary human society.) If given the same capabilities, they may strive for galactic ascendency but with very different methods and for very different reasons (based on what we know of their outlooks and culture throughout Star Trek.) There is no overarching ethos to their espionage besides a basic characterization and competition with the FED/KDF.

    The Dominion by contrast followed a very specific methodology (alien to other factions), artificially engineered into their society (see. the basics of Jem'Hadar, Vorta), in service of very specific goals. Ie. protecting the Founders from solids aggression through tiered subjugation of said solids (calibrated by their resistance to DOM expansion) with no resistance tolerated by the pre-Odo Dominion (if not Vorta, then infiltration. If not infiltration, then war. If not war, then force pyric victory.) Each component of the Dominion specifically and purposefully functions towards that goal and that was complimented by their use in military operations, which Trek followed very closely (given that this all played out according to a single series' dedicated arc.) There is no analog to this in other powers (the Changelings are not the Tal Shiar nor would the Tal Shiar become changelings if given perfect technology to replace enemy leaders.)

    Subterfuge is subterfuge but the Dominion were very particular with the how and why, informing and informed by their society (with direct implications for all DOM characters.) Ergo, STO's DOM being Jem'Hadar centric (to bring this back around to the point relevant to this thread) and additional conceits in writing necessary to justify our DOM's role in the game (ie. it's a Jem'Hadar story line.)

    This complicates potential updates to the DOM; new non-Jem DOM species would likely start after ViL, per dev comments on Ten Forward. So, one should be careful in setting expectations for how much further the DOM is going to be fleshed out. More ships? At some point, but probably at low frequency provided there's still significant demand for further DOM add-ons [more so on the scale of years, 2019 is likely to see something for them].
    Post edited by duncanidaho11 on
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  • madhatch1971madhatch1971 Member Posts: 160 Arc User
    Leaning slightly back more to topic...

    The news about T6 ships is AMAZING.

    Yep, we have known for a little while that this was coming - we've all seen the tests that have been put out, and many of us have joyfully used those ships and seen the advantage of a ship that levels up with you.

    For me, this is a game changer and opens up a new way of playing.

    I am curious about what will happen to the T1 to T5U ships. Will they remain in game? Or will they be "grandfathered" out? I'm going to go out on a limb here and say I think once this is implemented we will no longer see any new ships other than T6.
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  • duncanidaho11duncanidaho11 Member Posts: 7,546 Arc User
    edited April 20

    Yep, we have known for a little while that this was coming - we've all seen the tests that have been put out, and many of us have joyfully used those ships and seen the advantage of a ship that levels up with you.

    For me, this is a game changer and opens up a new way of playing.

    I am curious about what will happen to the T1 to T5U ships. Will they remain in game? Or will they be "grandfathered" out? I'm going to go out on a limb here and say I think once this is implemented we will no longer see any new ships other than T6.

    To your question: yes they will remain in game. They still serve a function while leveling since players are still free to jump ship in line with the original starting experience (even if they have the option to take one ship from T1 to T6.) The changes discussed so far include a cost reduction (perhaps more in line with T1-T5 ships as a delivery method for customization options and consoles, functions which are certainly still valid.) I'd also consider a separate scaling update (ex. scale all T1-T4 ships like the T4 Walker, scale T5 as T1-T5) but I don't think we've heard anything about that from the devs (at least directly, they've probably considered alternative scaling schemes but the only thing they've talked about that I know of is the cost reduction.)

    For the general point: add T6 scaling to AoD's mission journal update, allowing arcs to be skipped and played at any level. Starting a new character has so much more potential now (I easily tailored my AoD's leveling to the arcs which I thought told the best story for him, not just what I had to play for completion's sake) and while I'm a little burnt out right now from new character creation I do want to take advantage of this for a new toon when T6 scaling goes live. ;)

    (These are some great changes and it can be easy to lose sight of them.)
    Post edited by duncanidaho11 on
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  • madhatch1971madhatch1971 Member Posts: 160 Arc User
    edited April 20
    I've been aiming for a Gagarin Class - for the Shepard Class variant. Have gear made and ready to go (aside from the era appropriate weapons and the like, did the ol' rinse-&-repeat to get the DSC phasers ground/space and torps bumped them up to Mk 2, and gave them all the best starting modifiers I could - [Acc] [Dmg] for the space weapons, [DOT] and [KB1] on the ground weapons). Once I hit the mark on the ship voucher, I'll be nabbing the Gagarin. By then a few more DSC story arcs will have dropped in-game. And if they happen to add the DSC version of the Enterprise and make that a T6 scalable... (unlikely, I know - it will be a lock box ship me thinks. But that to is ok, I have a few of them), I'll go in that direction with the free ship token. But the free ship token is another thread's discussion, so I shall end that here.

    The news about the T6 ships is welcome and awesome. It's nice to hear that the T1-T5 ships I have will not fall by the wayside. Some of them have very interesting console abilities :-)

    Does it matter to me that the only signifier of a Toons rank will be on there uniform? No. Because that's how it should be anyways. And as a show of hands, how many people bother using the Admiral ranks and clothing options? Once I hit Captain with a toon, I don't feel the need to change the uniform or rank. Uniform and title wise they stay a "captain."

    Maybe that should be something that's looked at in the future - after all, you are effectively given a field promotion to Captain at the beginning. Why not make that official, and just be a Captain from the start? Doesn't mean you can't have the same levelling system - it's a field commission after all, officially you are still working through the rank system - you just get the privilege of being treated as a Captain (along with the uniform rank, and in game title). Eventually you will earn that rank.

    If you choose to stay a Captain rather than accept promotion to Admiral at lvl 40 you wouldn't be penalised - but maybe you don't get access to certain features. Where as if you accept the promotion to Flag Officer - you can only wear flag ranks/uniforms and have access to things Captains don't (like the Admiralty ship system). Maybe choosing to stay a Captain in rank once you hit lvl 40 gives you access to a "Captains System" - more to do with BOFs and DOFs rather than ships, as it could be more focused on a single ship. Means there would be advantages to choosing either. Hummmmm, both should have access to the reputation system. Captains would have more freedom in some respects, they keep command of a single ship - Admirals have to look after several ships - maybe split there BOFs between them, can easily switch between ships in missions (or have an escort of a sci/tac/eng ship). Admirals get to focus on building there fleet skills, where as Captains focus on building crew skills, and a group of Admirals and Captains compliment each other when working together.

    Just a pie in the sky idea.

    Possibly not a good one. Some people are going to want the option to pull rank. And some of us will want an appropriate emote response to our disgust with that, lol. But on the whole, it could work very well with Fleets.

    As I say, pie in the sky.

    Lets get back to the T6 ship announcement excitement :-)
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  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 5,875 Community Moderator
    edited April 20
    Yes, Dominion is soooo 2018. Let's stick with topic of the 2019 Road Map. :mrgreen:
    Post edited by baddmoonrizin on
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  • duncanidaho11duncanidaho11 Member Posts: 7,546 Arc User
    edited April 20
    I've been aiming for a Gagarin Class - for the Shepard Class variant. Have gear made and ready to go (aside from the era appropriate weapons and the like, did the ol' rinse-&-repeat to get the DSC phasers ground/space and torps bumped them up to Mk 2, and gave them all the best starting modifiers I could - [Acc] [Dmg] for the space weapons, [DOT] and [KB1] on the ground weapons). Once I hit the mark on the ship voucher, I'll be nabbing the Gagarin. By then a few more DSC story arcs will have dropped in-game. And if they happen to add the DSC version of the Enterprise and make that a T6 scalable... (unlikely, I know - it will be a lock box ship me thinks. But that to is ok, I have a few of them), I'll go in that direction with the free ship token. But the free ship token is another thread's discussion, so I shall end that here.

    The news about the T6 ships is welcome and awesome. It's nice to hear that the T1-T5 ships I have will not fall by the wayside. Some of them have very interesting console abilities :-)

    I can heartily recommend the Gagarin, the C-store model is fantastic (easily my favorite FED ship in the game right now, very well detailed and with a lot of neat facets) and I've used it across 3 separate toons (SCI/ENG/TAC) for great effect. It fits well with a variety of different character choices, being a large ship but not too large, new but not necessarily prestigious (a la Oddy). Also has a lot of skin types to play with, the TMP type 8 hull material in particular I love (but the whole range works pretty good on it.) The Shepard parts also mesh well.

    They've done a great job with ship design of late, and I think that strongly compliments the T6 scaling update. For as much focus as there is on the RNG ships, the game's doing really well by it's c-store alternatives and improving the core game. There isn't anything big listed on the roadmap to summer in this vein, but hopefully the year has a few more surprises in store (not necessarily RE. ships but these kinds of QoL updates.)
    Maybe that should be something that's looked at in the future - after all, you are effectively given a field promotion to Captain at the beginning. Why not make that official, and just be a Captain from the start? Doesn't mean you can't have the same levelling system - it's a field commission after all, officially you are still working through the rank system - you just get the privilege of being treated as a Captain (along with the uniform rank, and in game title). Eventually you will earn that rank.

    It would require a bit of a re-write for the tutorials, as we're cadets coming out of the academy (FED-side) a promotion to captain straight away would be problematic. There are also people who've become attached to the idea of being an Admiral. I think Cryptic's happy with letting players head-canon their character's role, as you can always chose to wear 4 pips even if more are available.

    (I think the best they could do to accommodate interests would be to allow players to designate their rank-in-dialog similar to their title. Ie. a dropdown menu you can set in character bio screen. That suggestion has come up in the past, but these things are worth bringing back up for re-examination. Sometimes things don't happen because there isn't the time or competing projects take priority.)
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  • madhatch1971madhatch1971 Member Posts: 160 Arc User
    > @baddmoonrizin said:
    > Yes, Dominion is soooo 2018. Let's stick the topic of the 2019 Road Map. :mrgreen:

    Why not? After all this thread is about the Road Map not the Dominion 😉
    People ask how long have I been playing STO - well the answer is simple: I have been here since the beginning. I just haven't always had a lot to say.
  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 3,387 Arc User
    Ok, how does one make the "Mr. Green" smiley? :o
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  • captaincelestialcaptaincelestial Member Posts: 1,063 Arc User
    Yes, Dominion is soooo 2018. Let's stick with topic of the 2019 Road Map. :mrgreen:
    Ok, how does one make the "Mr. Green" smiley? :o

    : mrgreen : but without the spaces :mrgreen:
  • darakossdarakoss Member Posts: 838 Arc User
    Except that DS9 makes it crystal clear that the Dominion does not operate at all like Starfleet or a regular military does (though they try to give that appearance to throw everyone else off). They mainly work by subterfuge and misdirection via agents, and those agents are almost always Vorta, though a few are Changelings in situations where a Vorta could not infiltrate).
    That was never how The Dominion "mainly" work. The Dominion do basic spying and subterfuge operations, just like any military does, but the Dominion's primary means of attack was through sheer firepower, and overwhealing numbers, from mass Jem'Hadar assaults, and their very advanced technology.
    The Jem'Hadar are clearly nothing but meat droids, the only way Paramount could have made that more blatant would have been by having them answer "Roger Roger!" when given orders.
    Paramount had nothing to do with The Dominion, or DS9. It's all CBS.

    When DS9 was made it was under Paramount Domestic Television if you want to be technical about it.
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  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 3,387 Arc User
    Yes, Dominion is soooo 2018. Let's stick with topic of the 2019 Road Map. :mrgreen:
    Ok, how does one make the "Mr. Green" smiley? :o

    : mrgreen : but without the spaces :mrgreen:

    :mrgreen:
    Tankies!
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  • badgerpants999badgerpants999 Member Posts: 240 Arc User
    Hey guys. It's May. Where's my Leveling Tier 6 ships? Wait My STO Launcher's pre-patching, Are you guys getting ready to launch the update?
  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 9,095 Arc User
    Tuesday May 14.
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  • dexterbateman416dexterbateman416 Member Posts: 41 Arc User
    Yes, Dominion is soooo 2018. Let's stick with topic of the 2019 Road Map. :mrgreen:

    ah as always, and I say this without sarcasm, Bad, you are a hoot and a delight, also took the words out of my mouth. Also not crazy about the new content being disco, but at least I'm more tolerant than some of of my Armada-mates. Although I do hope the TFOs will slow down for a while, because while I love the stuff and the game, I do not enjoy only a week break in some cases. and yes I know I don't have to play grindfest, but doing nothing is just as bad. and as a lifer, I chose to support the game and content so, I'd be an idiot not to play. besides, it through these TFOs that I met some of my best of buddies for the past 3 to 5 years out of the 7 years I've been playing. so its a funny love-hate thing I suppose. anyways, back to topic on hand, go Roadmap 2019! whoo!
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  • crypticarmsmancrypticarmsman Member Posts: 3,229 Arc User
    edited May 8
    Paramount had nothing to do with The Dominion, or DS9. It's all CBS.

    Um, until 2005, Paramount had full control over the Star Trek IP - so sorry, you're incorrect here as DS9 ran from 1993-1999 and was fully produced by, and at Paramount Studios.
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  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 9,095 Arc User
    Viacom
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!
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  • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 8,472 Arc User
    edited May 8
    Paramount had nothing to do with The Dominion, or DS9. It's all CBS.

    Um, until 2005, Paramount had full control over the Star Trek IP - so sorry, you're incorrect here as DS9 ran from 1993-1999 and was fully produced by, and at Paramount Studios.
    Your statement is inaccurate. When Viacom sold off their properties, Paramount got the Trek movies and novels, while CBS got the Trek TV rights. That's not really terribly uncommon - as another example, Warner Brothers holds all rights to the Babylon 5 IP, with the sole exception of movie rights (which are held by the show's creator, J. Michael Straczynski). That's why we're not seeing a B5 revival, reboot, or reissuing with updated CGI, because the division of WB that got the TV rights, the Prime Time Entertainment Network (PTEN), ruffled the feathers of senior WB executives, who responded by basically embargoing the rights to anything PTEN controlled. (This is no small annoyance to JMS, who would love to either see the show revived or the followon series Crusade rebooted, but who can't do anything with it whatsoever. He refuses to try a Kickstarter for a theatrical production, as he feels it's unjust to expect the fans to pay the tens to hundreds of millions of dollars a decent movie version would cost, and he doesn't have the rights to do anything else.)

    There are rumors that Viacom may yet emerge from the grave and reclaim those rights, reunifying them under a single company again, but as those rumors have been floating around since about the turn of the century I'm not holding my breath.
    Lorna-Wing-sig.png
  • captaincelestialcaptaincelestial Member Posts: 1,063 Arc User
    jonsills wrote: »
    Paramount had nothing to do with The Dominion, or DS9. It's all CBS.

    Um, until 2005, Paramount had full control over the Star Trek IP - so sorry, you're incorrect here as DS9 ran from 1993-1999 and was fully produced by, and at Paramount Studios.
    Your statement is inaccurate. When Viacom sold off their properties, Paramount got the Trek movies and novels, while CBS got the Trek TV rights. That's not really terribly uncommon - as another example, Warner Brothers holds all rights to the Babylon 5 IP, with the sole exception of movie rights (which are held by the show's creator, J. Michael Straczynski). That's why we're not seeing a B5 revival, reboot, or reissuing with updated CGI, because the division of WB that got the TV rights, the Prime Time Entertainment Network (PTEN), ruffled the feathers of senior WB executives, who responded by basically embargoing the rights to anything PTEN controlled. (This is no small annoyance to JMS, who would love to either see the show revived or the followon series Crusade rebooted, but who can't do anything with it whatsoever. He refuses to try a Kickstarter for a theatrical production, as he feels it's unjust to expect the fans to pay the tens to hundreds of millions of dollars a decent movie version would cost, and he doesn't have the rights to do anything else.)

    There are rumors that Viacom may yet emerge from the grave and reclaim those rights, reunifying them under a single company again, but as those rumors have been floating around since about the turn of the century I'm not holding my breath.

    To be perfectly honest, what's the point of the splintering of CBS/Viacom in the days of mega entertainment mergers, like Disney/Fox Entertainment and AT&T/Time-Warner?

    They might as well as get their act together.
  • fu11ofstarsfu11ofstars Member Posts: 36 Arc User
    edited May 10
    (Trolling, gatekeeping comments moderated out. - BMR)
    Post edited by baddmoonrizin on
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