Could argue that there is time and money involved in the design process.
But then you see the tactical buckethead and know that a 5 year old with a roll of foil could make a better fitting helmet, assuming it wasn't made solely for a mr merrick.
I'm not saying that being able to use the same ship for your entire career has no merit. I am saying that it doesn't really have a mechanical value. If you like it and that floats your boat...by all means. I mean for you, if that is something you really want...it has whatever value you wanna add to it. Mechanically...is what I speak of. Mechanically...no new console at each tier or new costume unlocks means it doesn't add value over using the freebie ship for the like 5 hours before you get your next freebie ship. I am not against scaling ships. I actually quite like it in point of fact. I won't pay extra for it tho. And if you look at scaling ships released so far, the price for the ship having a scaling option hasn't made them cost anymore. But who know, cryptic has been on a roll for pissing off their playerbase.
It is not as if I don't have questions about pricing this pack.
It is less work to do just one scaling ship, isn't it??? Cryptic will not have to expend as much on art (if the art is not very different on each tier of a scaling ship). Or hooking up and balancing each console for the new Zen ships at each tier. Or making and hooking up those Admiralty cards at each tier.
But they are selling these ships to a different audience. Discovery fans. As well as ones who were not considering buying Zen ships while leveling up....who will think they are a value because they won't have to buy one for each tier and they get use of a T-6 ship at the end.
It remains to be seen if that will sell. And it most likely will because....are there other Zen ships for Discovery fans coming out? Hmmmm.....
If players bother to continue playing past "I got done with the Episodes"...they will realize "more scaling ships and less lower tier ships" have other implications in the game.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
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Well during the live stream I think they did a fair job at answering questions that I saw being asked multiple times, but not good nor did they seem to focus on this pack's concerns much. It seemed more of the same of their pick & choose but with more coverage this time so at least that is better.
I'm still not buying this pack. I don't like how Cryptic tried marketing this at all & it feels dirty & leaves a bad taste. It is like Cryptic's marketing are cross-overs from EA & Bethesda. Remember, if us players/customers hadn't voiced as we did there would've been no account wide & no starter pack discount changes at all & don't believe otherwise.
I still think this pack will sell well. Enough people will feel vindicated now with the changes that should've been part of the pack initially anyways to buy it. If the combat pet change to account wide isn't implemented before this initial sale pricing ceases then I think it indicates Cryptic really doesn't care about their player base but the open wallets.
There's good quality items in this pack for sure but far less content than previous packs. & if there is a buy zen bonus to coincide with this Disc pack sale as I suspect probably even more will buy it. Nothing more was added, all Cryptic had to do was with-hold what had been precedent in other packs & act like they listened & offer what should've already been. It was a good ploy & it will work on most.
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Flanking, and the type of raider flanking, should be listed in the stats for the M'Chla as it does for other ships. Also why does the M'Chla have 13 Boff seats while the T6 B'rel and D4x have only 12?
In the KDF shipyard it also lists one of the LtC Uni seats as Uni/Command which is quite a typo and perhaps should be given Uni/Command now that it is live on sale.
Flanking, and the type of raider flanking, should be listed in the stats for the M'Chla as it does for other ships. Also why does the M'Chla have 13 Boff seats while the T6 B'rel and D4x have only 12?
Based upon what was stated during the most recent Ten Forward Weekly live stream the raiders, both, have the regular raider flanking, sadly not the improved flanking that a couple of other older raiders have. I hadn't looked closely enough at the BOFF seating, but BoP/raiders sometimes are universals. Overall, I usually think the newest shiny has the best stuff if just merely for a selling more stand point so maybe that is why more BOFF seating but with this pack from the get go who knows.
Flanking, and the type of raider flanking, should be listed in the stats for the M'Chla as it does for other ships. Also why does the M'Chla have 13 Boff seats while the T6 B'rel and D4x have only 12?
Becausethe M'Chala (and Shran) both have dedicated Commander Tactical seats, whereas the B'rel/Kor and D4x have all universal seats. Fewer BOff stations is how they balance out the ability to do pretty much anything you want with all those universal statons.
I hope that despite all the "concessions" they've made, people will still see this pack as absolutely not worth the price. This includes the idea that it being on sale makes it more valuable, as if a sale is the actual asking price and not a tactic to show a good side.
Pack still isn't worth it in my opinion, and won't be until they either add more ships or drop the price. Character vs account unlocks isn't magically changing how I feel about this, and I hope that sales are still low just so this doesn't happen again.
Flanking, and the type of raider flanking, should be listed in the stats for the M'Chla as it does for other ships. Also why does the M'Chla have 13 Boff seats while the T6 B'rel and D4x have only 12?
Becausethe M'Chala (and Shran) both have dedicated Commander Tactical seats, whereas the B'rel/Kor and D4x have all universal seats. Fewer BOff stations is how they balance out the ability to do pretty much anything you want with all those universal statons.
@anubis0sarvour The changes made were that the BOFFs were made account-wide unlocks. The combat Tardigrade will be made account-wide unlock later. The discount for having already bought the previous Starter Pack was announced as well.
@storules Yes, those prices were confirmed during the livestream.
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I hope that despite all the "concessions" they've made, people will still see this pack as absolutely not worth the price. This includes the idea that it being on sale makes it more valuable, as if a sale is the actual asking price and not a tactic to show a good side.
Pack still isn't worth it in my opinion, and won't be until they either add more ships or drop the price. Character vs account unlocks isn't magically changing how I feel about this, and I hope that sales are still low just so this doesn't happen again.
I think you're being nice describing that as "concessions". I think this was a planned marketing ploy all along. However, doing so I'm sure there will be enough to buy it now so we as players, customers, should expect similar tactics down the road for STO more of this towards the player base & more gambling in more aspects of STO.
Unfortunately we're still left with a quandary. Until the tardigrade account wide is actually implemented why take the gamble on them sticking to their word? If this isn't done while the sale is on and the pack is actually at a reasonable price for its value, why get it at all?
Unfortunately we're still left with a quandary. Until the tardigrade account wide is actually implemented why take the gamble on them sticking to their word? If this isn't done while the sale is on and the pack is actually at a reasonable price for its value, why get it at all?
So nothing NEW was added to the pack. Just the BOff's made account unlocks and a promise the combat pet will be made the same way. Things that should have been that way from the beginning.
I WAS going to buy the ships separate in their respective 2-packs that they (almost) always do when offering similar cross-faction ships. So imagine my surprise that there are no cross-faction packs for the ships. You buy them singly or in the overpriced pack. They know that if they offered the ships in two 2-packs, that's where a lot of people would buy them and skip the pack since the pack is so low in value (IMO).
So instead of getting at least some sale, they will get nothing from me. Promises of things to come are not going to get me to bite. I'd still like some official word on the bait and switch that happened with the Elite Starter Pack suddenly becoming the Elite Services Starter Pack, though I don't actually expect any.
So, until the starting price of the Discovery Operations Pack is reduced, or more value is added to the pack (like more ships), no sale.
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@anubis0sarvour The changes made were that the BOFFs were made account-wide unlocks. The combat Tardigrade will be made account-wide unlock later. The discount for having already bought the previous Starter Pack was announced as well.
@storules Yes, those prices were confirmed during the livestream.
Thank you! I'm still at work and just trying to check out all the new stuff in the packs!
@anubis0sarvour The changes made were that the BOFFs were made account-wide unlocks. The combat Tardigrade will be made account-wide unlock later. The discount for having already bought the previous Starter Pack was announced as well.
@storules Yes, those prices were confirmed during the livestream.
Thank you! I'm still at work and just trying to check out all the new stuff in the packs!
What, "all the new stuff in the packs!"? It is the same items, nothing new, just a couple were made account wide unlocks, the BOFFs, with a promise that the combat pet, tardigrade, will be made account wide unlock too.
Do we know how long the sale will be going on for?
The zen bonus sale is till the 19th. I don't think there has been an official word for the Disc pack's sale duration. maybe until Cryptic sells so many then kaput lol.
You can not like the offering that is the Discovery Operations Pack. You can refuse to purchase it. But the accusations in here need to stop.
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Yeah, Kael said on the live stream that they will eventually make the combat pet an account unlock.
Still, I wouldn't go buying anything until it's actually done. A verbal intent on a live stream isn't enough when you're talking the type of outrageous price this pack costs. Buy at your own risk, but if you want the combat pet for your account you should wait until it's actually implemented. If that takes until the sale is over, then fine.. skip it.
Just remember the Starter Pack Bait and Switch scam.. you're not working with a company that's afraid to skirt the line when it comes to their customers. Keep that in mind before you type in a credit card number.
I was the one on the stream that asked that question (gwindalmir).
I took his answer to mean "it's something we're looking into, not sure yet. Definitely not at launch though."
Though I didn't quite hear all of his answer, so I may have missed something.
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But then you see the tactical buckethead and know that a 5 year old with a roll of foil could make a better fitting helmet, assuming it wasn't made solely for a mr merrick.
It is not as if I don't have questions about pricing this pack.
It is less work to do just one scaling ship, isn't it??? Cryptic will not have to expend as much on art (if the art is not very different on each tier of a scaling ship). Or hooking up and balancing each console for the new Zen ships at each tier. Or making and hooking up those Admiralty cards at each tier.
But they are selling these ships to a different audience. Discovery fans. As well as ones who were not considering buying Zen ships while leveling up....who will think they are a value because they won't have to buy one for each tier and they get use of a T-6 ship at the end.
It remains to be seen if that will sell. And it most likely will because....are there other Zen ships for Discovery fans coming out? Hmmmm.....
If players bother to continue playing past "I got done with the Episodes"...they will realize "more scaling ships and less lower tier ships" have other implications in the game.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Artwork for Sale:
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I'm still not buying this pack. I don't like how Cryptic tried marketing this at all & it feels dirty & leaves a bad taste. It is like Cryptic's marketing are cross-overs from EA & Bethesda. Remember, if us players/customers hadn't voiced as we did there would've been no account wide & no starter pack discount changes at all & don't believe otherwise.
I still think this pack will sell well. Enough people will feel vindicated now with the changes that should've been part of the pack initially anyways to buy it. If the combat pet change to account wide isn't implemented before this initial sale pricing ceases then I think it indicates Cryptic really doesn't care about their player base but the open wallets.
There's good quality items in this pack for sure but far less content than previous packs. & if there is a buy zen bonus to coincide with this Disc pack sale as I suspect probably even more will buy it. Nothing more was added, all Cryptic had to do was with-hold what had been precedent in other packs & act like they listened & offer what should've already been. It was a good ploy & it will work on most.
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In the KDF shipyard it also lists one of the LtC Uni seats as Uni/Command which is quite a typo and perhaps should be given Uni/Command now that it is live on sale.
Based upon what was stated during the most recent Ten Forward Weekly live stream the raiders, both, have the regular raider flanking, sadly not the improved flanking that a couple of other older raiders have. I hadn't looked closely enough at the BOFF seating, but BoP/raiders sometimes are universals. Overall, I usually think the newest shiny has the best stuff if just merely for a selling more stand point so maybe that is why more BOFF seating but with this pack from the get go who knows.
Anyone care to confirm?
Pack costs 8400 ZEN ? and 7350 ZEN if you already have an starter pack?
Pack still isn't worth it in my opinion, and won't be until they either add more ships or drop the price. Character vs account unlocks isn't magically changing how I feel about this, and I hope that sales are still low just so this doesn't happen again.
That explains it, thanks.
@storules Yes, those prices were confirmed during the livestream.
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I'm sure you are already aware now & in-game but the 7350 is the current sale price if you own the Disc starter pack.
I think you're being nice describing that as "concessions". I think this was a planned marketing ploy all along. However, doing so I'm sure there will be enough to buy it now so we as players, customers, should expect similar tactics down the road for STO more of this towards the player base & more gambling in more aspects of STO.
I think we can take Cryptic at their word -
I WAS going to buy the ships separate in their respective 2-packs that they (almost) always do when offering similar cross-faction ships. So imagine my surprise that there are no cross-faction packs for the ships. You buy them singly or in the overpriced pack. They know that if they offered the ships in two 2-packs, that's where a lot of people would buy them and skip the pack since the pack is so low in value (IMO).
So instead of getting at least some sale, they will get nothing from me. Promises of things to come are not going to get me to bite. I'd still like some official word on the bait and switch that happened with the Elite Starter Pack suddenly becoming the Elite Services Starter Pack, though I don't actually expect any.
So, until the starting price of the Discovery Operations Pack is reduced, or more value is added to the pack (like more ships), no sale.
Losing faith in humanity, one person at a time.
Thank you! I'm still at work and just trying to check out all the new stuff in the packs!
What, "all the new stuff in the packs!"? It is the same items, nothing new, just a couple were made account wide unlocks, the BOFFs, with a promise that the combat pet, tardigrade, will be made account wide unlock too.
The zen bonus sale is till the 19th. I don't think there has been an official word for the Disc pack's sale duration. maybe until Cryptic sells so many then kaput lol.
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Is it intended that the BOFFs can't wear faction uniforms only DSC uniforms though?
Bring the Enterprise XCV-330 to STO
I was the one on the stream that asked that question (gwindalmir).
I took his answer to mean "it's something we're looking into, not sure yet. Definitely not at launch though."
Though I didn't quite hear all of his answer, so I may have missed something.
And enough players are going to cave and buy it now, that's all the "proof" Cryptic needs that this can become the new normal.
CM