As a quick note, because I know what people are going to say - the Gamma Vanguard pack is not the only way to play a Cardassian,just the only currently announced way.
That said, we don't know what the other release mechanism might entail. Cryptic could, for example, be rewarding Cardassians for leveling a character (we know they were thinking about that for the Jem'Hadar) or simply putting it in the c-store, with Vanguard Jem'Hadar being exclusive to these packs.
All we can say at the moment is that...
Cardassians aren't exclusive to the large bundle
They probably won't be a default species either (else why market their unlock here?)
Something will likely be involved, we'll just have to see what.
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Was all ready to purchase this until I read limiting the Vanguard Dreadnought Cruiser to Jem’Hadar species only. With the amount of real money and time spent on my main character I am not about to abandon all that. Plus all my Jem’Hadar ships and gear is on my main character.
I love my Dreadnought Carrier and Jem’Hadar equipment and Bridge Officers but I am not going to abandon it all to start a Jem’Hadar species. You have really done yourself out of more money again.
Personally I do not care for the Cardassian bits.
EDIT: You should have done another pack. One just below the full pack without any of the Cardassian items. That would increase sales, increase money.
Oh, that's a typo. I fixed it on one pack but not the starter pack.
The ship is initially available to Jem'Hadar captains, but once you've unlocked the mastery for it it becomes available account wide.
That's a neat idea. Wasn't really sure about the vanguard pack compared to the previous ones, but with 8 cross-faction ships that's looking pretty appealing.
A bit saddened by the lack of a jem'hadar science ship, but I suppose that isn't really the jem'hadar way. Also there's a science dreadnought, cross-faction even. So I'm not going to complain too much on that. And while I'm a bit tired of seeing more intel ships, I think it's a perfect fit for the cardassian ones.
Also wonder if 'Vanguard' as all the new jem'hadar ships are labled is a new specialization or if "Jem'hadar Vanguard" is the full name of the new faction.
Canonically there is almost always a Vorta on any given Dominion ship, and they are ranked higher than the First. So are the Vorta just going unannounced for now, or are we pulling a Discovery where the Vorta will be there and in command of the ship, but you, the First, are the main character.
Not all the time, Kudak'Etan commanded his own force of Jem'Hadar as they stormed, secured and commanded the Defiant. Gelnon was the Vorta in charge who played simply as the mission giver and the rest fell on Kudak'Etan.
Goran'Agar had a vision where the Jem'Hadar can be freed of the dependence to K/White, although it was later found out that he was a mutant who could regular his own body with K/White. None the less there was no Vorta around to command the Jem'Hadar.
Omet'iklan needed to prove his loyalty and commitment to the Dominion and Founders by vaporizing Weyoun 4 in front of a Skeptical Sisko after the mission to destroy the Iconian gateway. It shows that there is a possibility that Vorta can be targets of the Jem'Hadar.
I would say there are cases where canonically it is possible that Jem'Hadar do not need to follow the orders of a Vorta and if the Dominion has advanced enough where Jem'Hadar can be programmed to lead a ship of Jem'Hadar without Vorta leadership an still remain in service to the founder on STO, all the better.
one of the main weaknesses in the dominion ranks were Jem'Hadar who had a felexible relationship with their Vorta overseers, and it could cause the Dominion major problems. The Dominion are nothing but adaptable and resilient to changing circumstances.
Kudak'Etan still reported to Gelnon, up to the point where Gelnon left to head back to their side of the border, and even then, Kudak'Etan still had orders from Gelnon to fix the ship and take it back behind the lines.
Goran'Agar was a rogue. He took his men to the planet to free them from the white, and the founders. A vorta would have been in direct confrontation to what Goran'Agar was doing.
As for Omet'iklan, it's not as if there was a Founder standing there telling him to do it, he chose to kill Weyoun 4 because he felt Weyoun had betrayed him and his men by not revealing the true nature of the mission, and not trusting them to keep their vow.
you aren't working with me on how these Jem'Hadar are acting, you are simply just arguing with me on how you see it. I am trying to point out that they are very capable of thinking for themselves without their Vorta around.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
way to many titles... i have never used a single one. if the title give you a boost when used... but they are nothing but fluff for accounts/forums.
bug ship should of been included... even if it's the original T5 version.
also those upgrades to equipment is seriously weak sauce. only only get 3 and it's one time only. and you only boost from mk12 to mk13 with zero quality upgrade. the upgrade should be 3 per character with quality upgrade as well, just make it bound to character.
Also wonder if 'Vanguard' as all the new jem'hadar ships are labled is a new specialization or if "Jem'hadar Vanguard" is the full name of the new faction.
Vanguard probably means "more offensive focus (and maybe an atypical extra forward weapon slot)" as with the Vanguard Science Vessel in the Discovery lock box (Cryptic did say they were looking to do more in the future).
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Also wonder if 'Vanguard' as all the new jem'hadar ships are labled is a new specialization or if "Jem'hadar Vanguard" is the full name of the new faction.
Vanguard probably means "more offensive focus (and maybe an atypical extra forward weapon slot)" as with the Vanguard Science Vessel in the Discovery lock box (Cryptic did say they were looking to do more in the future).
That's true, they all look great either way. Especially that warship... Definitely trying to get that one.
way to many titles... i have never used a single one. if the title give you a boost when used... but they are nothing but fluff for accounts/forums.
bug ship should of been included... even if it's the original T5 version.
also those upgrades to equipment is seriously weak sauce. only only get 3 and it's one time only. and you only boost from mk12 to mk13 with zero quality upgrade. the upgrade should be 3 per character with quality upgrade as well, just make it bound to character.
Perhaps they may give us the t5 bug for free
And that would probably be the best case scenario. If the T5 bugship was the jem'hadar starter ship. It would certainly add some reason to fly a jem'hadar over another character with one of their ships. Assuming it would unlock the bugship frigates of course.
Edit: Although there is still the jem'hadar battle cruiser, I'm pretty sure it's the only canon jem'hadar ship that isn't in sto.
I can't help but notice a distinct lack of any form of Jem'Hadar Attack Ship, which is odd considering it was pretty much the work horse of the Dominion fleets. It also seems to be quite popular if the prices on the exchange are any indication.
Yeah that is pretty disappointing. Though I suspect thats the very reason it isn't available, even if it makes more sense to have it than any other ship. Even so I think they screwed up on that one. They should have included it but limited it to the JH faction. That would have been an easily acceptable compromise
So are we going to get Liberated Borg Jem'Hadar or is any future addition to Lifetime Subscription just not happening until Tier 7 ships are introduced?
What happens with the old lobi/lockbox ships themselves? They weren't deleted from the game, just made more rare. I think I still have two ships in boxes I never decided who to give to.
I just got the Gamma Vanguard Starter Pack early and its only $20.00 and im so looking forward to this upcoming expansion and ive been waiting for this to come out since alpha and beta testing days of the game and since I became a lifer on the 2nd day that this game went live wow this game has gone better each yr in my opinion and I hope there are female cardassian toons as well lol and I hope some day cryptic/pwe can open up the cardassians home world so we can beam down with our cardassian toons lol
Don't forget, they usually add another ship to the pack after the initial annoucement. Like the Haakona warbird to the LoR Pack, the Guardian cruiser to the Delta Rising Operations pack and the Chronos temporal dreadnought cruiser to the Temporal special agent pack. Not guaranteed that it's going to happen this time as well though...
Are there any ships that stay unique to the Jem'Hadar or does everyone else just get all their ships?
So I don't understand why everyone gets Jem'Hadar ships and not, say, Romulan ships. Why take this away from the Jem'Hadar?
Precedent, Jem'Hadar ships have been multi-faction for a very long time. Romulan ships weren't.
So everyone else gets all the Jem'Hadar faction's ships, and their own faction's unique ships, and Jem'Hadars only get the ships that they're sharing with everyone else?
Seems like it takes away a lot from playing a Jem'Hadar character, if they have no unique ships of their own.
Is there any reason to pre-order the pack now? Or will there be discount later? Only thing that is missing for Cardassian
that I can see is uniforms, weapons, and Cardassian boffs. Otherwise looking good.
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I am praying that there is going to be LTS Vorta race in the future or something. I don't really want to play Dominion as ex-drug addicted Jem.
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Won't lie this was a bit of a disappointment. I highly considered that this was where the playable Vorta species would be hiding in this pack.... no mention of Vorta still.... unless that will be a lifetime perk???
Sure hope so. I don't imagine many want to play Dominion as ex-drug addicted fodder.
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Those (2) big experience boosts & especially those (3) high-end upgrade kits are laughable. Perhaps those upgrade kits are a "typo" with the Mk XII to a Mk XIII? If that's Cryptic's interpretation of "high-end" upgrading I would suggest that they play the actual game a little to get back in touch with what players go through. Then again Cryptic, just like other marketing plans, like to toss lots of trinkets in a package to soothe players & make them feel like they're getting more for their money. This might be the most titles tossed into a STO package so far with (6). Only a Jem'Hadar Tactical uniform is disappointing, a missed opportunity, & seems lackluster without a specific Cardassian uniform too. The ship line-up doesn't seem bad but it isn't great neither. There isn't even any "bug" ship included lol which is the most iconic Dominion ship arguably. Then again all of this will still have more announcements detailing more before the VIL expansion. So I'm curious, if these official Cardassians & Jem'Hadar Vanguards in the package have innate better stats compared to the regular Jem'Hadar & Cardassians to later maybe be allowed to be created is that pay-to-win? Also, if there is a limited time recruitment event but the only way to have a Cardassian for it is behind this package that is a major pay-wall. There's probably lots more details to come though so not too worried, but no way I'm pre-ordering based off of this lol.
Well one thing is guaranteed
you cant please everyone
lol
It certainly a vast improvement over the fed 2.0 faction imo.
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Kind of a disappointment that Jems have to share all their ships. I think people would have been fine if the Jems got their own and the lockbox ones were left as-is.
I realize all Jem'Hadar ships will be account unlocks. I want to know if the Cardassian ships will also be account unlocks for all characters currently on your account, or only available for Cardassian characters as per the Romulan ships.
So everyone else gets all the Jem'Hadar faction's ships, and their own faction's unique ships, and Jem'Hadars only get the ships that they're sharing with everyone else?
Seems like it takes away a lot from playing a Jem'Hadar character, if they have no unique ships of their own.
I think it's likely (though by no means certain) that Jem'Hadar are in a very similar position to TOS-FED. They offer a new starting point but aren't meant to offer a full faction experience on their own. I think they'll get their allies T6 ships as well. Think of how multi-faction packs would work if Jem'Hadar were given full parity. You'd have a FED, KDF, and ROM option, exclusive to each faction, and then a DOM option that anyone could use. It would be maddeningly counter productive (as the one DOM ship immediately invalidates the functional purpose [though not the aesthetic one] of having a big bundle.)
That doesn't necessarily preclude more DOM ships in future, separate from the other factions. But, I would not be trying to put the Dominion into the terms everyone else (besides TOS FED) plays by. These guys will function differently, whatever the specifics may actually be.
Kind of a disappointment that Jems have to share all their ships. I think people would have been fine if the Jems got their own and the lockbox ones were left as-is.
Provided DOM players continued getting ships, at 33% more workload per bundle for Cryptic. Again, Jem'Hadar don't have full parity. They are comparable to TOS-FED.
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I have not seen it mentioned. Is there going to be any form of increase to the number of Character slots? I have filled mine and do not wish to get rid of any of my Characters. Not being able to make a new Jem'Hadar would mean i could not access the new Jem'Hadar ships if i purchased the bundle.
Since there are going to be a few starter missions for Jem'Hadar Characters and they start at level 60. There is a good chance that they may be planing on giving the bug ship escort or variant of it as the starter ship.
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That said, we don't know what the other release mechanism might entail. Cryptic could, for example, be rewarding Cardassians for leveling a character (we know they were thinking about that for the Jem'Hadar) or simply putting it in the c-store, with Vanguard Jem'Hadar being exclusive to these packs.
All we can say at the moment is that...
Something will likely be involved, we'll just have to see what.
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That's a neat idea. Wasn't really sure about the vanguard pack compared to the previous ones, but with 8 cross-faction ships that's looking pretty appealing.
A bit saddened by the lack of a jem'hadar science ship, but I suppose that isn't really the jem'hadar way. Also there's a science dreadnought, cross-faction even. So I'm not going to complain too much on that. And while I'm a bit tired of seeing more intel ships, I think it's a perfect fit for the cardassian ones.
Also wonder if 'Vanguard' as all the new jem'hadar ships are labled is a new specialization or if "Jem'hadar Vanguard" is the full name of the new faction.
Overall looks pretty great.
you aren't working with me on how these Jem'Hadar are acting, you are simply just arguing with me on how you see it. I am trying to point out that they are very capable of thinking for themselves without their Vorta around.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Perhaps they may give us the t5 bug for free
Vanguard probably means "more offensive focus (and maybe an atypical extra forward weapon slot)" as with the Vanguard Science Vessel in the Discovery lock box (Cryptic did say they were looking to do more in the future).
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That's true, they all look great either way. Especially that warship... Definitely trying to get that one.
And that would probably be the best case scenario. If the T5 bugship was the jem'hadar starter ship. It would certainly add some reason to fly a jem'hadar over another character with one of their ships. Assuming it would unlock the bugship frigates of course.
Edit: Although there is still the jem'hadar battle cruiser, I'm pretty sure it's the only canon jem'hadar ship that isn't in sto.
Yeah that is pretty disappointing. Though I suspect thats the very reason it isn't available, even if it makes more sense to have it than any other ship. Even so I think they screwed up on that one. They should have included it but limited it to the JH faction. That would have been an easily acceptable compromise
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So everyone else gets all the Jem'Hadar faction's ships, and their own faction's unique ships, and Jem'Hadars only get the ships that they're sharing with everyone else?
Seems like it takes away a lot from playing a Jem'Hadar character, if they have no unique ships of their own.
that I can see is uniforms, weapons, and Cardassian boffs. Otherwise looking good.
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
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Sure hope so. I don't imagine many want to play Dominion as ex-drug addicted fodder.
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
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you cant please everyone
lol
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
#Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
I think it's likely (though by no means certain) that Jem'Hadar are in a very similar position to TOS-FED. They offer a new starting point but aren't meant to offer a full faction experience on their own. I think they'll get their allies T6 ships as well. Think of how multi-faction packs would work if Jem'Hadar were given full parity. You'd have a FED, KDF, and ROM option, exclusive to each faction, and then a DOM option that anyone could use. It would be maddeningly counter productive (as the one DOM ship immediately invalidates the functional purpose [though not the aesthetic one] of having a big bundle.)
That doesn't necessarily preclude more DOM ships in future, separate from the other factions. But, I would not be trying to put the Dominion into the terms everyone else (besides TOS FED) plays by. These guys will function differently, whatever the specifics may actually be.
Provided DOM players continued getting ships, at 33% more workload per bundle for Cryptic. Again, Jem'Hadar don't have full parity. They are comparable to TOS-FED.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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Since there are going to be a few starter missions for Jem'Hadar Characters and they start at level 60. There is a good chance that they may be planing on giving the bug ship escort or variant of it as the starter ship.