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Holy Nerf to Plasmonic Leech Batman!!

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    ussvaliant#6064 ussvaliant Member Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    Maybe they realised that the majority of the playerbase are not DPS, Op'd, PvE Vaping monsters that nuke maps within secs to a few mins, and realised that targeting nerfs towards that end of the spectrum was just plain stupid.
    The vast majority of the playerbase are within the 0-25k DPS range. Nerfing skills into the ground would have had a huge impact to the majority rather than the minority and i could see regarding the public queues another Delta Rising brewing where those guys can no longer pull their weight and the higher DPS spectrum players go back into private queues. Or was Delta Rising nothing more than incorrect reporting rather than empty queues ?
    maR4zDV.jpg

    Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
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    meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    Maybe they realised that the majority of the playerbase are not DPS, Op'd, PvE Vaping monsters that nuke maps within secs to a few mins, and realised that targeting nerfs towards that end of the spectrum was just plain stupid.
    The vast majority of the playerbase are within the 0-25k DPS range. Nerfing skills into the ground would have had a huge impact to the majority rather than the minority and i could see regarding the public queues another Delta Rising brewing where those guys can no longer pull their weight and the higher DPS spectrum players go back into private queues. Or was Delta Rising nothing more than incorrect reporting rather than empty queues ?


    ^^ A very sensible post! And I agreed with it all.

    On that note, just spent money on the game again, and got me a shiny new T6 Tal'Shiar Adapted Destroyer. :) The equation is really very simple: they don't try and destroy all my gear, and I give them money again. Glad the boss-man wised up on that. As for the rest, who wanted to see everything nerfed, just slot a single wep from here on in, and you'll feel nerfed well enough.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
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    meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    patrickngo wrote: »
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    Maybe they realised that the majority of the playerbase are not DPS, Op'd, PvE Vaping monsters that nuke maps within secs to a few mins, and realised that targeting nerfs towards that end of the spectrum was just plain stupid.
    The vast majority of the playerbase are within the 0-25k DPS range. Nerfing skills into the ground would have had a huge impact to the majority rather than the minority and i could see regarding the public queues another Delta Rising brewing where those guys can no longer pull their weight and the higher DPS spectrum players go back into private queues. Or was Delta Rising nothing more than incorrect reporting rather than empty queues ?


    ^^ A very sensible post! And I agreed with it all.

    On that note, just spent money on the game again, and got me a shiny new T6 Tal'Shiar Adapted Destroyer. :) The equation is really very simple: they don't try and destroy all my gear, and I give them money again. Glad the boss-man wised up on that. As for the rest, who wanted to see everything nerfed, just slot a single wep from here on in, and you'll feel nerfed well enough.

    you better spend enough Meimei, because you and your friends are likely to be the only ones opening their wallets. Better not move on either-because to preserve your meta you've pretty much cut off Cryptic from any actual future growth or diversity.


    I see it the other way around: the Devs having come to their senses is what will cause people to spend money again. :)

    As for 'future growth or diversity,' they can do all that, without reverting the game to the stone-age again.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
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    risingwolfshadowrisingwolfshadow Member Posts: 619 Arc User
    The 0-25k majority doesn't have to worry about the nerfs at all and never have. Using them as an argument against nerfs is stupid, pointless and shortsighted because they aren't relying on broken and unbalanced equipment to achieve unrealistic and unintended numbers with their DPS. As such they are not affected by nerfs, if anything they have more to gain because there's still plenty they can do with abilities and standard equipment alone to boost their build.

    The fact that idiots whine about their OP shinies getting nerfed is stupid on their part and on the part of the Devs who listen to them because they want their cake and eat to and their argument is simple: "if I have to use teamwork then I'm going to cry because I should be able to do ISA by myself with my spacebar FAW boat.

    If the Devs don't want to get shouted at by these spoilt little idiots they should send new equipment to tribble before release them and test wether it's balanced with the current equipment before people spend their money on it. That way nobody will cry about buying something broken then having it nerfed. Instead they'll buy it knowing it's not op but instead another way to build your ship.

    And to the idiots who whine insist on keeping this game in an appalling state of imbalance where it's tac FAW with plasma consoles, kemocite, etc or GET OUT! you deserve that lost of investment because if you knew it was broken and OP why did you buy it!? I'll tell you why, you wanted to get your ego stroked by having the new "it" thing so that you could feel more powerful than the rest and hit huge DPS numbers for bragging rights. It was all for your own selfish ego so that you don't have to play as a team.
    You knew it was going to be fixed, it's your lack of common sense, so on your own head be it.

    And to the Devs who listen and cater to these 14 year old DPS minmaxers who live in their mothers basement, don't. Stop listening to them whining because they'll cry about it and then deal with it once they realise the changes were for the better and that it's improved play for the other classes. Listen instead to the ones that know what they're talking about and are invested in balanced content, variety and teamwork.
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    meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    The 0-25k majority doesn't have to worry about the nerfs at all and never have. Using them as an argument against nerfs is stupid, pointless and shortsighted because they aren't relying on broken and unbalanced equipment to achieve unrealistic and unintended numbers with their DPS. As such they are not affected by nerfs, if anything they have more to gain because there's still plenty they can do with abilities and standard equipment alone to boost their build.

    Yeah, no. Nerf to Leech will affect everyone. There's no 'magical gain' from less DrainX. And all the proposed nerfs would have caused the 0-25k majority to now do 12.5k, and no longer have any fun at all.
    The fact that idiots whine about their OP shinies getting nerfed is stupid on their part and on the part of the Devs who listen to them because they want their cake and eat to and their argument is simple: "if I have to use teamwork then I'm going to cry because I should be able to do ISA by myself with my spacebar FAW boat.

    You're pretty much describing yourself as part of the "14 year old DPS minmaxers who live in their mothers basement" you're decrying. Cuz the lardballs in their mothers' basements, with headsets, TeamSpeak, and what not, try and wrap you're brain around the notion that this is a casual game. That 0-25k you're talking about, they just wanna come home and do a wee bit of mindless pew-pewing. They don't want to be nerfed to death, just so you can force them to team up. Would be nice if they did, for sure, but ain't gonna happen. Whilst this is an MMO, the game is also geared towards everyone being more or less self-sufficient. It can't be any other way for a casual game.
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    markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    You really think that EVERYONE in the game relied on Leech to do DPS? lol, no. Nerfing Leech to what it should have been in the first place only affects those who actually use it.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
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    ussvaliant#6064 ussvaliant Member Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    edited April 2017
    The 0-25k majority doesn't have to worry about the nerfs at all and never have. Using them as an argument against nerfs is stupid, pointless and shortsighted because they aren't relying on broken and unbalanced equipment to achieve unrealistic and unintended numbers with their DPS. As such they are not affected by nerfs, if anything they have more to gain because there's still plenty they can do with abilities and standard equipment alone to boost their build.

    The fact that idiots whine about their OP shinies getting nerfed is stupid on their part and on the part of the Devs who listen to them because they want their cake and eat to and their argument is simple: "if I have to use teamwork then I'm going to cry because I should be able to do ISA by myself with my spacebar FAW boat.

    If the Devs don't want to get shouted at by these spoilt little idiots they should send new equipment to tribble before release them and test wether it's balanced with the current equipment before people spend their money on it. That way nobody will cry about buying something broken then having it nerfed. Instead they'll buy it knowing it's not op but instead another way to build your ship.

    And to the idiots who whine insist on keeping this game in an appalling state of imbalance where it's tac FAW with plasma consoles, kemocite, etc or GET OUT! you deserve that lost of investment because if you knew it was broken and OP why did you buy it!? I'll tell you why, you wanted to get your ego stroked by having the new "it" thing so that you could feel more powerful than the rest and hit huge DPS numbers for bragging rights. It was all for your own selfish ego so that you don't have to play as a team.
    You knew it was going to be fixed, it's your lack of common sense, so on your own head be it.

    And to the Devs who listen and cater to these 14 year old DPS minmaxers who live in their mothers basement, don't. Stop listening to them whining because they'll cry about it and then deal with it once they realise the changes were for the better and that it's improved play for the other classes. Listen instead to the ones that know what they're talking about and are invested in balanced content, variety and teamwork.

    Or maybe the Dev's know better than you and you're opinion here is wrong.

    If Tribble feedback in the past has taught me anything about Cryptic's decision making, it is if their mind is made up about something no amount of feedback/bugs or evidence that something is fundamentally broken will alter/change their minds, and they will press forward with it dragging the Playerbase along kicking and screaming if ness.

    So for a lot of the purposed changes to suddenly be dropped, this won't be due to Player outrage/whining, this is due to Cryptic looking at the bigger picture and seeing that the changes have a potentially damaging affect upon their game. I.E the bottomline $$$

    We maybe the customers and our money keeps the servers running, but when it comes to having an opinion and voice on how Cryptic want to run this game, our voice is so small, tiny and quite that it may not even have enough decibels for anyone to hear it.

    maR4zDV.jpg

    Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
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    mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User

    Or maybe the Dev's know better than you and you're opinion here is wrong.

    If Tribble feedback in the past has taught me anything about Cryptic's decision making, it is if their mind is made up about something no amount of feedback/bugs or evidence that something is fundamentally broken will alter/change their minds, and they will press forward with it dragging the Playerbase along kicking and screaming if ness.
    The important thing is that one has to realize what feedback is Cryptic actually asking the feedback for.

    If they say: "We want to make a skill revamp", they are not asking for feedback that you don't want a skill revamp. They already decided that with all the pro and cons that would bring, that they'd make it. What they want to know is if their skill revamp achieves its goals, whatever they were.

    If they say:" We want to make a balance pass", then giving feedback that you think that the OP equipment should remain OP is not useful. They are going to make a balance pass, the only thing you tell them is that they correctly identified the OP equipment, but they obviously already knew beforehand that some people would hate losing their advantages. The reasons for that were already known and since they decided to do a balance pass, not seen as sufficient counter-argument against a balance pass.
    What they need to know is if their changes actually achieve the goal of a balance pass, and if not, where and why.
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
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    markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    Or maybe the Dev's know better than you and you're opinion here is wrong.

    If Tribble feedback in the past has taught me anything about Cryptic's decision making, it is if their mind is made up about something no amount of feedback/bugs or evidence that something is fundamentally broken will alter/change their minds, and they will press forward with it dragging the Playerbase along kicking and screaming if ness.
    The important thing is that one has to realize what feedback is Cryptic actually asking the feedback for.

    If they say: "We want to make a skill revamp", they are not asking for feedback that you don't want a skill revamp. They already decided that with all the pro and cons that would bring, that they'd make it. What they want to know is if their skill revamp achieves its goals, whatever they were.

    If they say:" We want to make a balance pass", then giving feedback that you think that the OP equipment should remain OP is not useful. They are going to make a balance pass, the only thing you tell them is that they correctly identified the OP equipment, but they obviously already knew beforehand that some people would hate losing their advantages. The reasons for that were already known and since they decided to do a balance pass, not seen as sufficient counter-argument against a balance pass.
    What they need to know is if their changes actually achieve the goal of a balance pass, and if not, where and why.
    Yeah the sheer number of people complaining about the Leech change was a signal to Cryptic that Leech had to be changed. The only question was how much.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
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    ussvaliant#6064 ussvaliant Member Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    coldnapalm wrote: »
    Considering that the devs who actually started this game ain't here no more and that they have repeatedly proven that they have no idea how their system works by not even knowing why people can reach 500+k DPS...yeah...maybe not. Spartan not withstanding...he has shown off that he maybe knows a thing or two...but even he is woefully ignorant of the system comapred to what the DPS community here knows...and they don't have access to the code and ACTUAL formula. This is why they don't give us detailed numbers when they list changes...They don't bloody KNOW what the changes will ACTUALLY produce due to the interactions of their systems.

    It certainly can feel that way. Whoever reworked the skill tree last time, did a great job of increasing powercreep
    > that way instead of the rebalance it was supposed to be.

    Now my concern isn't the fact my consoles and builds could be made obsolete. Obviously i'd like them to retain value as I have 22 characters which I kitted out and invested in.

    But my main concern is I grind dilithium on all 22. And I don't use Admiralty as anything other than a bonus. So I play through 22 toons to earn 8k a day. My concern with this rebalance is its quicker to PUG than putting a pre-made together and i'm concerned a real hard nerf will TRIBBLE public queues to the point where it just is not worth the effort running them as the low end players will feel the rebalance, and they will, meaning my pink rock runs per character take longer because i'm losing marks due to optional failures, there goes my fun of running ISA/KSA/CSA/CCA/TFA as penalty after penalty isn't fun.

    Ah I long for the good old days before reputation and upgrades when this game didn't rely on farming so many different currencies to advance a character.





    maR4zDV.jpg

    Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
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    lucho80lucho80 Member Posts: 6,600 Bug Hunter
    He took his sweet time the past year to bond with good players in game to find out what combinations exactly lead to the OP performance of some.

    df50cc5714293897b386643f7fc21e86.jpg


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    ussvaliant#6064 ussvaliant Member Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    there are other options to earn dilithium. But I prefer and enjoy the run I do.

    If Dyson Battlezone is populated and people are working towards completing the zone instead of silo camping then its a good source of dil. However I've found the best time to farm this map is after midnight. Which is a tad late for my time zone.

    The Romulan patrols, sure between Japori/Acamar/Carraya and Gamma Eridon I can pick up 8160 minus mark contribution within 20-22mins.

    But I enjoy PvE maps more.
    maR4zDV.jpg

    Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
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    ussvaliant#6064 ussvaliant Member Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    patrickngo wrote: »
    there are other options to earn dilithium. But I prefer and enjoy the run I do.

    If Dyson Battlezone is populated and people are working towards completing the zone instead of silo camping then its a good source of dil. However I've found the best time to farm this map is after midnight. Which is a tad late for my time zone.

    The Romulan patrols, sure between Japori/Acamar/Carraya and Gamma Eridon I can pick up 8160 minus mark contribution within 20-22mins.

    But I enjoy PvE maps more.

    so...try other maps? Try adding some of the wrapper missions to boost output? try new things??

    It's all about time and my current farming methods are pretty efficient. Just need to keep those mining claims dropping from the lockboxes.

    I'd add a few other PvE's to my list but they pay poor, looking at you Iconian Space Stf's and Terran ones.
    maR4zDV.jpg

    Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
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    ussvaliant#6064 ussvaliant Member Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    edited April 2017
    quote="patrickngo;c-13197779"]
    there are other options to earn dilithium. But I prefer and enjoy the run I do.

    If Dyson Battlezone is populated and people are working towards completing the zone instead of silo camping then its a good source of dil. However I've found the best time to farm this map is after midnight. Which is a tad late for my time zone.

    The Romulan patrols, sure between Japori/Acamar/Carraya and Gamma Eridon I can pick up 8160 minus mark contribution within 20-22mins.

    But I enjoy PvE maps more.

    so...try other maps? Try adding some of the wrapper missions to boost output? try new things??

    It's all about time and my current farming methods are pretty efficient. Just need to keep those mining claims dropping from the lockboxes.

    I'd add a few other PvE's to my list but they pay poor, looking at you Iconian Space Stf's (Normal borg space pays better than a advanced Gre'thor) and Terran ones.
    maR4zDV.jpg

    Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
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    ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,569 Arc User
    A Leech, what did they used to do with a Leech on people? Burn it off. Here, they burn it so it will come off people's builds. Simple. ;)

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KU7_G2grxJE
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
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    meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    azrael605 wrote: »
    @meimeitoo

    The changes to leach will absolutely not affect everyone no matter what you say. For example, it will not affect me in any way as I do not use leach on any of my 16 characters. I have not bought the KDF ship it comes on & I have never bought one from the exchange on the other side. I believe 1 of my characters pulled one from a lockbox years ago, it sits in the bank, unused & unwanted.


    Then I commend you for having achieved this. Me? I think my Fed Engineer will likely survive the steep power loss; my Rom Tact, I'm not so sure of.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
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    nikephorusnikephorus Member Posts: 2,744 Arc User
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    azrael605 wrote: »
    @meimeitoo

    The changes to leach will absolutely not affect everyone no matter what you say. For example, it will not affect me in any way as I do not use leach on any of my 16 characters. I have not bought the KDF ship it comes on & I have never bought one from the exchange on the other side. I believe 1 of my characters pulled one from a lockbox years ago, it sits in the bank, unused & unwanted.


    Then I commend you for having achieved this. Me? I think my Fed Engineer will likely survive the steep power loss; my Rom Tact, I'm not so sure of.

    I find it super funny how people who don't use leech are all happy about the nerf. There is one form member who is super excited about all these nerfs...he will remain nameless, but I saw him whining on the tribble notes thread. He was all for all the nerfs of things he doesn't give a TRIBBLE about, but was fighting vigorously for the things he does use. It was amusing because he seems to enjoy the protests for the nerfs, but also whined himself when something he liked was affected. Anyway, I'm excited for this patch... waiting for all the fun cryptic promised.
    Tza0PEl.png
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    risingwolfshadowrisingwolfshadow Member Posts: 619 Arc User
    I have plasmonic and I'm happy with the nerf.
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    ussvaliant#6064 ussvaliant Member Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    edited April 2017
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    Then I commend you for having achieved this. Me? I think my Fed Engineer will likely survive the steep power loss; my Rom Tact, I'm not so sure of.

    Your Rom Tact should be ok as long as you're playing him as a Tact with Subsystem power in weapons and not trying to create a Tact/Sci hybrid. Which I've tried to do with a Vulcan Tact flying a Nebula using Partgen and FBP

    Where the problem for Roms I see really comes into play is Science Captains or trying to be a jack of all trades like a Fed Captain can be with the plentiful subsystem power they have, if leech power is substantially reduced then you're going to seriously struggle maintaining power in both Weapons and Aux. Isn't Aux used to enhance Science powers like Gravity Well, Feedback Pulse ect ?. I guess extending battery uptime will be essential
    maR4zDV.jpg

    Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
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