Still trying to draw me in. I'm feeling contrary and a little passive-aggressive myself. Anybody who wants to disprove my opinions is welcome to do their own point-by-point analysis of my posts and this thread in general. I decline.
people love to use various buzz words to distract attention, but when someone suddenly decides to bail on a conversation the moment they are asked for a single example to support their opinion, you know they were just BSing.
people love to use various buzz words to distract attention, but when someone suddenly decides to bail on a conversation the moment they are asked for a single example to support their opinion, you know they were just BSing.
I think the problem now isn't so much that noone has anything to say, it's that noone has anything else to say. Every argument for and against has been made and the only other recourse is to just start quoting posts or point out said posts for reference without much else in expanding the topic. Frankly, there really is nothing else to say. The opening calls for special treatment of a specific NPC with a title that suggests a specific degrading treatment of female NPCs, others point out that the lack of any special treatment for any NPCs, nor PCs for that matter, is a sign that there is no special treatment in play within the game and yet still others prefer resources better spent on new content than revamping old. We've come to the point in the discussion where it would naturally come back around into a circle at the benefit of noone. The only thing missing at this point is a reference to a World War II figure best left unnamed.
I don't see the harm in requesting a different animation, or pointing out that the animation in question doesn't fit the character in that situation. I find myself in agreement with that, just didn't think about it before.
I agree with this 100%.
I do see a problem with demanding that an animation be changed and that it is somehow a deliberate slam on all females if the animation isn't changed.
I also agree with this. But who are you saying did this? Surely you must think someone in this thread did that, or saying it would be stupid. As far as the OP, it concludes with "please correct this". Are you calling that a "demand"
It is a demand. Subtle, passive-aggressive, but a demand nonetheless...
Also I think the person above who called the OP a facist is disgusting.
Typical SJW tactic... When opposed, resort to emotive personal attacks, rather than refute what the person is saying
I find fascism, in whatever guise it takes, and those who condone, endorse or enforce it disgusting, and will always stand against it.
As has been pointed out by someone who I believe once worked on/for the game; it's one thing to consider changing an animation to better fit the plot, it is something else entirely to be coerced or expected to do so just to avoid offending certain types of over-sensitive people...
in this thread, you have been extremely intolerant of other people's views. you have been extremely aggressive towards anyone who disagrees with you, even throwing personal attacks at them. there is a definition for someone who is acting like you:
there is no doubt, you are extremely "intolerant towards those holding different opinions". that definition fits you perfectly. unfortunately.
Oh look another personal attack...
Yes, I am extremely intollerant of facist viewpoints and opinions, and I make no apology for it. What does your nice dictionary define someone as, who insists that someone of a particular gender must behave (Edit: Or not behave) in a specific way?
We can wait for you to look it up...
there is an old saying: "two wrongs don't make a right". even if someone else is being nasty, being equally nasty in response doesn't mean you win. it just means you are also a nasty person.
Two wrongs in the correct sequence can prevent a hundred wrongs though. I am intolerant of child abductions, and if I see one in progress the perpetrator should be glad if any wrong I commit stops at his nose, and a 9-1-1 call. I will not stand still when I see this creeping political correctness tyranny either. If my words are deemed rude and offend, then let it be if that is what is needed.
For my part, I do not accept the definition used above for anyone, just for being firm in their defense against oppression, soft or otherwise. The word 'bias' is acceptable.
A bias is generally an informed preference that something not be generally accepted, or is at least, unacceptable to the party so biased.
I have a bias against child molesters, because it harms children. Outside of a persons medical history, I have a bias against any requirements to mention 'race' in any documentation about a person, because it keeps reinforcing divisions that are at best superficial. I have a bias against all forms of tyranny, whether quietly creeping, or violently in your face, because this harms human liberty, and therefore harms us all.
I have a bias against people who start to make false accusations (saying someone is more than just biased because they oppose oppression), because when certain types of accusations gets made in an argument, it is usually a cheap attempt to deflect from the main point of the argument.
Which brings us to the point of there being SEXISM bold as brass right there in the actual name of this thread.
The logical implication of mentioning a strong character's gender is that the OP is only concerned because it is a female character. We can infer from this that male or transgender characters are not as important or there would be no need to make the special point that character we are talking about is female. We can infer that it is the femaleness of the character that makes their unfortunate portrayal, SO very unfortunate!
Some observations about gender are informed and qualify as bias. General statements like 'males can't bear young, and females have less proportional upper body strength' are not typically invalidated by real life experience. In this occasion the OP is observing gender of the character, when only observing the strength of the character would have been sufficient to make a point about an inappropriate portrayal. We can see the main focus of the OP is that the character is female, by the useless, pointless inclusion of that detail. That focus, excluding other gender options by implication, makes the whole complaint sexist, and some might say more than a little biased.
people love to use various buzz words to distract attention, but when someone suddenly decides to bail on a conversation the moment they are asked for a single example to support their opinion, you know they were just BSing.
I think the problem now isn't so much that noone has anything to say, it's that noone has anything else to say. Every argument for and against has been made and the only other recourse is to just start quoting posts or point out said posts for reference without much else in expanding the topic. Frankly, there really is nothing else to say. The opening calls for special treatment of a specific NPC with a title that suggests a specific degrading treatment of female NPCs, others point out that the lack of any special treatment for any NPCs, nor PCs for that matter, is a sign that there is no special treatment in play within the game and yet still others prefer resources better spent on new content than revamping old. We've come to the point in the discussion where it would naturally come back around into a circle at the benefit of noone. The only thing missing at this point is a reference to a World War II figure best left unnamed.
So...a person posts a thread about a character animation they don't like...and people start calling them a facist and comparing this situation to child abuse? I'm starting to think I made a mistake joining this community =(
I keep waiting for this thread to solve the problems it brings up!
1- Gender inequality on a global, nay GLACTIC scale
2- Coding limitations of cryptic's game engine (Tacofangs is needed for this!)
and 3- The absolutely insane amount of power creep that's unbalanced the game and left it in this state.
Personally I think the OP would be happier if we instead DEMANDED that Cryptic nerf BFAW! FOR Miral Paris.
So...a person posts a thread about a character animation they don't like...and people start calling them a facist and comparing this situation to child abuse? I'm starting to think I made a mistake joining this community =(
Don't give up on all this ... just move to the things you like best and hang on to those things. I like building fleets and helping people, and occasionally I get to go do a mission also. Find what makes this Star Trek for you, and go for it.
As for things like this thread, well, I have to say that there is a lot of tension in the world,and it creeps into the safe spaces everywhere. No game is safe, no dining room is safe, no lawn party, or anywhere. Sadly, I come to this game to avoid all of that, and sometimes it still finds me (or you, or whoever ...). Watch out for Earth Space Dock chat ... seriously.
Be the light you want to see shining ... don't wait for someone else to shine for you.
So...a person posts a thread about a character animation they don't like...and people start calling them a facist and comparing this situation to child abuse? I'm starting to think I made a mistake joining this community =(
The opening post isn't so much about a character animation but rather that said animation is being applied to their favorite character in a particular mission. The argument, though, is being made from a house of cards as the character itself, while written to act a certain way, was animated in a very general manner. Likely to expedite completion of the mission so that the development team involved with that part of the process could go on to populating and animating the next mission and the mission after that.
Yet there's this notion that the character was given this treatment in a purposeful and deliberate manner, which doesn't make any sense given there's characters in similar situations acting exactly the same in roles that are the same yet decidedly different. In the Klingon Warzone mission "Second Star to the Right, Straight on 'til Morning" you have a defiant male Federation captain whose sprite is cowering just as frightened.
Again, we're going in circles now, every argument has been made for either side. The sinple truth, though, is that there is no special treatment taking place here.
> @admiralkogar said: Don't give up on all this ... just move to the things you like best and hang on to those things.
Um. No offense. But you are the guy I was referencing who was talking about child abuse a few posts up. I try my best to avoid people who make those kinds of comments on video game forums. Please do not respond to me.
By the way, how do we block seeing other people's comments?
So...a person posts a thread about a character animation they don't like...and people start calling them a facist and comparing this situation to child abuse? I'm starting to think I made a mistake joining this community =(
> @admiralkogar said: Don't give up on all this ... just move to the things you like best and hang on to those things.
Um. No offense. But you are the guy I was referencing who was talking about child abuse a few posts up. I try my best to avoid people who make those kinds of comments on video game forums. Please do not respond to me.
By the way, how do we block seeing other people's comments?
Four posts, two of them on this topic, decrying the state of things, and asking someone not to respond to you... Forgive me for thinking you are nothing more than a sock-account (probably the OP) Even if you're not, and are a legitimately new member, if this is your attitude, then feel free to leave the conversation...
Oh, and the forum does not give users the ability to block other users...
I'm not sure what most of you said even means, but I will avoid this thread from now on.
A sock-account, is a secondary account a forum user creates, so they can either post without anyone realising it is them doing so, or to make an additional post in a discussion to make it look like they have more support. If that is not the case, I apologise, but I've seen how people behave on forums for a long time, and am sceptical and suspicious by nature, especially in circumstances like these...
OP means Original Poster/Opening Post etc...
And absolutely, feel free to avoid it, as mentioned immediately above, the discussion has played out, with the OP quickly disappearing once the sexism of their complaint was exposed... There really is no point in continuing the thread further...
So...a person posts a thread about a character animation they don't like...and people start calling them a facist and comparing this situation to child abuse? I'm starting to think I made a mistake joining this community =(
> @admiralkogar said: Don't give up on all this ... just move to the things you like best and hang on to those things.
Um. No offense. But you are the guy I was referencing who was talking about child abuse a few posts up. I try my best to avoid people who make those kinds of comments on video game forums. Please do not respond to me.
By the way, how do we block seeing other people's comments?
Four posts, two of them on this topic, decrying the state of things, and asking someone not to respond to you... Forgive me for thinking you are nothing more than a sock-account (probably the OP) Even if you're not, and are a legitimately new member, if this is your attitude, then feel free to leave the conversation...
Oh, and the forum does not give users the ability to block other users...
Well I guess I got told huh?
Anyway, I think my point was valid in the 'offensive' post. A bias is informed, and tolerance of things that are obviously wrong isn't indicative of a nobler spirit.
So...a person posts a thread about a character animation they don't like...and people start calling them a facist and comparing this situation to child abuse? I'm starting to think I made a mistake joining this community =(
> @admiralkogar said: Don't give up on all this ... just move to the things you like best and hang on to those things.
Um. No offense. But you are the guy I was referencing who was talking about child abuse a few posts up. I try my best to avoid people who make those kinds of comments on video game forums. Please do not respond to me.
By the way, how do we block seeing other people's comments?
Four posts, two of them on this topic, decrying the state of things, and asking someone not to respond to you... Forgive me for thinking you are nothing more than a sock-account (probably the OP) Even if you're not, and are a legitimately new member, if this is your attitude, then feel free to leave the conversation...
Oh, and the forum does not give users the ability to block other users...
Well I guess I got told huh?
Anyway, I think my point was valid in the 'offensive' post. A bias is informed, and tolerance of things that are obviously wrong isn't indicative of a nobler spirit.
Still a burning house here ...
Qapla!
Absolutely so... The sad thing is people like that are so brainwashed by the rhetoric they get fed, that they can't see just how wrong such 'values' truly are...
Sorry folks, but this has gone from bad to worse.
/Closed
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
Comments
Tell yourself whatever you want.
Two wrongs in the correct sequence can prevent a hundred wrongs though. I am intolerant of child abductions, and if I see one in progress the perpetrator should be glad if any wrong I commit stops at his nose, and a 9-1-1 call. I will not stand still when I see this creeping political correctness tyranny either. If my words are deemed rude and offend, then let it be if that is what is needed.
For my part, I do not accept the definition used above for anyone, just for being firm in their defense against oppression, soft or otherwise. The word 'bias' is acceptable.
A bias is generally an informed preference that something not be generally accepted, or is at least, unacceptable to the party so biased.
I have a bias against child molesters, because it harms children. Outside of a persons medical history, I have a bias against any requirements to mention 'race' in any documentation about a person, because it keeps reinforcing divisions that are at best superficial. I have a bias against all forms of tyranny, whether quietly creeping, or violently in your face, because this harms human liberty, and therefore harms us all.
I have a bias against people who start to make false accusations (saying someone is more than just biased because they oppose oppression), because when certain types of accusations gets made in an argument, it is usually a cheap attempt to deflect from the main point of the argument.
Which brings us to the point of there being SEXISM bold as brass right there in the actual name of this thread.
The logical implication of mentioning a strong character's gender is that the OP is only concerned because it is a female character. We can infer from this that male or transgender characters are not as important or there would be no need to make the special point that character we are talking about is female. We can infer that it is the femaleness of the character that makes their unfortunate portrayal, SO very unfortunate!
Some observations about gender are informed and qualify as bias. General statements like 'males can't bear young, and females have less proportional upper body strength' are not typically invalidated by real life experience. In this occasion the OP is observing gender of the character, when only observing the strength of the character would have been sufficient to make a point about an inappropriate portrayal. We can see the main focus of the OP is that the character is female, by the useless, pointless inclusion of that detail. That focus, excluding other gender options by implication, makes the whole complaint sexist, and some might say more than a little biased.
I think that gives all gagh for thought ...
Qapla!
It has become a 'burning house'. Point well made
Qapla!
1- Gender inequality on a global, nay GLACTIC scale
2- Coding limitations of cryptic's game engine (Tacofangs is needed for this!)
and 3- The absolutely insane amount of power creep that's unbalanced the game and left it in this state.
Personally I think the OP would be happier if we instead DEMANDED that Cryptic nerf BFAW! FOR Miral Paris.
Think of the children people!
#nerfitformiral
Don't give up on all this ... just move to the things you like best and hang on to those things. I like building fleets and helping people, and occasionally I get to go do a mission also. Find what makes this Star Trek for you, and go for it.
As for things like this thread, well, I have to say that there is a lot of tension in the world,and it creeps into the safe spaces everywhere. No game is safe, no dining room is safe, no lawn party, or anywhere. Sadly, I come to this game to avoid all of that, and sometimes it still finds me (or you, or whoever ...). Watch out for Earth Space Dock chat ... seriously.
Be the light you want to see shining ... don't wait for someone else to shine for you.
Qapla!
Qapla!
Yet there's this notion that the character was given this treatment in a purposeful and deliberate manner, which doesn't make any sense given there's characters in similar situations acting exactly the same in roles that are the same yet decidedly different. In the Klingon Warzone mission "Second Star to the Right, Straight on 'til Morning" you have a defiant male Federation captain whose sprite is cowering just as frightened.
Again, we're going in circles now, every argument has been made for either side. The sinple truth, though, is that there is no special treatment taking place here.
Um. No offense. But you are the guy I was referencing who was talking about child abuse a few posts up. I try my best to avoid people who make those kinds of comments on video game forums. Please do not respond to me.
By the way, how do we block seeing other people's comments?
Four posts, two of them on this topic, decrying the state of things, and asking someone not to respond to you... Forgive me for thinking you are nothing more than a sock-account (probably the OP) Even if you're not, and are a legitimately new member, if this is your attitude, then feel free to leave the conversation...
Oh, and the forum does not give users the ability to block other users...
OP means Original Poster/Opening Post etc...
And absolutely, feel free to avoid it, as mentioned immediately above, the discussion has played out, with the OP quickly disappearing once the sexism of their complaint was exposed... There really is no point in continuing the thread further...
Well I guess I got told huh?
Anyway, I think my point was valid in the 'offensive' post. A bias is informed, and tolerance of things that are obviously wrong isn't indicative of a nobler spirit.
Still a burning house here ...
Qapla!
/Closed
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider