The world is full of expensive things people buy, because they can.
The world is also full jealous people who insist that buying those expensive things is stupid or insane, because they can't.
I can. I can probably even get all of them with my Zen reserve.
The thing is, I won't, because it is insane.
^^ This right here! I won't. Like ever.
On a related note: Zen prices have jumped from 400 to 415, which is the exact opposite of what some people here claim to be Cryptic's intention. If this was really meant to be a dilithium sink intended to lower the cost of Zen, it has well and truly failed at that task.
Now isn't *that* hilarious!? LOL. All those wannabe Economists, and the exact opposite happens from what they thought! :P (Actually, they're not wrong: prices *should* have dropped, but I'm poking fun of them anyway).
This would actually be indicative that players are trying to buy up all the cheap dilithium that they can, and the Zen sellers are taking advantage of that.
Give it time. Day 1 is always volatile.
Yeah, of course. I just thought it was hilarious a bit, is all.
As to how effective this sink will really be, we'll see. A costume is not a 'must-have' item, like a super-console or something, so it may not have the intended effect. Personally, I didn't need an extra sink; nor an extra MACO costume, for that matter; so, either way, I'm not losing anything.
Is it really an effective sink when people can buy Zen with real money to exchange it for Dil?
If earning Dil was restricted to only what people actually earn in game without outside means, this would be a different story.
It is restricted to only what people actually earn in game.
All the dil people trade with Zen was farmed and refined by someone.
The world is full of expensive things people buy, because they can.
The world is also full jealous people who insist that buying those expensive things is stupid or insane, because they can't.
I can. I can probably even get all of them with my Zen reserve.
The thing is, I won't, because it is insane.
^^ This right here! I won't. Like ever.
On a related note: Zen prices have jumped from 400 to 415, which is the exact opposite of what some people here claim to be Cryptic's intention. If this was really meant to be a dilithium sink intended to lower the cost of Zen, it has well and truly failed at that task.
Now isn't *that* hilarious!? LOL. All those wannabe Economists, and the exact opposite happens from what they thought! :P (Actually, they're not wrong: prices *should* have dropped, but I'm poking fun of them anyway).
This would actually be indicative that players are trying to buy up all the cheap dilithium that they can, and the Zen sellers are taking advantage of that.
Give it time. Day 1 is always volatile.
Yeah, of course. I just thought it was hilarious a bit, is all.
As to how effective this sink will really be, we'll see. A costume is not a 'must-have' item, like a super-console or something, so it may not have the intended effect. Personally, I didn't need an extra sink; nor an extra MACO costume, for that matter; so, either way, I'm not losing anything.
Is it really an effective sink when people can buy Zen with real money to exchange it for Dil?
If earning Dil was restricted to only what people actually earn in game without outside means, this would be a different story.
Where do you think the Dilithium I buy with zen comes from? It comes from other players who obtained it in game, and when I spend it it's taken out of circulation, and the more people looking to obtain dilithium this way, the lower the exchange rate will go. Anything that must be purchased with dilithium is most definitely a dil sink, but the effectiveness of any given sink is determined by how desirable it is, if the cost is right, and how long the given sink remains relevant (by that I mean holdings, which only lower the exchange rate for so long).
I went on the test server to have a look at them myself.
Thanks .
Nothing there I feel the need to chase at any price higher than 'impulse buy'. I'd consider the excursion coat at micro-transaction prices ($2-$5) but yeah, no.
I'm really having trouble with this. After encouraging my fleetmates to donate to fleet projets...these are ludicrous prices.
Cryptic, we don't have a Ferengi supplier and we can turn to anyone else that can provide these outstanding items (competition is good for business). Since you are the sole supplier/provider, please reconsider these prices.
Was kinda looking forward to these, was even willing to spend a little real money to get them, but not 50 bucks for one outfit, thats just absurd.
This really just punishes the people that don't farm dilith on ten or more toons a day too, which I am not one of the people that do. I convert my 8k a day on two toons, maybee 3 sometimes, and thats it.
At these prices, zero chance of me ever getting them.
ITS NOT EVEN AN OUTFIT ITS VEST AND SHIRT ONLY EVERYTHING ELSE IN GAME ALREADY SO $50.00 VEST AND SHIRT
There are lots of new players and lots of new fleets still.
Also some old fleets with small numbers. I still spend an average of 100 dollars a month buying Zen to exchange to Dilithium so as to advance our fleet progress. We're still only tier 4 and we've been around since launch and started fleet progression the first day they were added, but we only have a small number of people. The Armada system did help a fair bit, but really even then mostly people just donate fleet marks. It's rare for anybody to donate any sizeable amount of DOFFs or Dilithium to projects.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
Also Upgrades. I make Mk II gear then try and keep it going with upgrades till Mk XII or XIV depending on if I am going with theme gear or not. That uses dil pretty fast.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I almost choked when I saw those prices. I don't mind paying for outfits. But those prices are insane. And only one toon at that. If we were closer to April 1st I would have thought this was clever.
It would have been really cool to combine them into some 50th anniversary pack and put in on the c store for a reasonable price.
You'd expect anyone born rich enough NOT to be previously familiar with this concept would be rich enough not to whine about "$50."
Based on this thread, apparently not.
Sounds like nobody buys/cares about how "rich" you are, too. If you were that rich, you'd have better things to occupy your valuable time than constantly trying to show off your epeen in an MMO thread.
The world is full of expensive things people buy, because they can.
The world is also full jealous people who insist that buying those expensive things is stupid or insane, because they can't.
I can. I can probably even get all of them with my Zen reserve.
The thing is, I won't, because it is insane.
^^ This right here! I won't. Like ever.
On a related note: Zen prices have jumped from 400 to 415, which is the exact opposite of what some people here claim to be Cryptic's intention. If this was really meant to be a dilithium sink intended to lower the cost of Zen, it has well and truly failed at that task.
Now isn't *that* hilarious!? LOL. All those wannabe Economists, and the exact opposite happens from what they thought! :P (Actually, they're not wrong: prices *should* have dropped, but I'm poking fun of them anyway).
This would actually be indicative that players are trying to buy up all the cheap dilithium that they can, and the Zen sellers are taking advantage of that.
Give it time. Day 1 is always volatile.
Yeah, of course. I just thought it was hilarious a bit, is all.
As to how effective this sink will really be, we'll see. A costume is not a 'must-have' item, like a super-console or something, so it may not have the intended effect. Personally, I didn't need an extra sink; nor an extra MACO costume, for that matter; so, either way, I'm not losing anything.
Is it really an effective sink when people can buy Zen with real money to exchange it for Dil?
If earning Dil was restricted to only what people actually earn in game without outside means, this would be a different story.
Where do you think the Dilithium I buy with zen comes from? It comes from other players who obtained it in game, and when I spend it it's taken out of circulation, and the more people looking to obtain dilithium this way, the lower the exchange rate will go. Anything that must be purchased with dilithium is most definitely a dil sink, but the effectiveness of any given sink is determined by how desirable it is, if the cost is right, and how long the given sink remains relevant (by that I mean holdings, which only lower the exchange rate for so long).
Of course, the problem with this theory- is that the Dilithium in game is not a finite source- it's an infinite one.
There's no "exhaustible" supply of Dil in game... it's limitless, the only thing limiting the market is the refinement cap, which is currently character-based. This also being a F2P game, people can create an unlimited amount of accounts and characters (albeit as many as the default account allows until they purchase more slots, which can be obtained with said Zen) to farm Dil with, which the "average" player won't have but perhaps 1-2 accounts. (usually one, but families, etc. may have more)
Then also complicate it with "Free" Zen given to players using Arc and doing Arc quests... which really cost them nothing but their time.
As far as the Exchange itself goes- there's no way to "regulate" this buy continuously buying Zen. The best suggestion I've seen yet is to limit the amount of Zen that can be purchased on an account with Dil... which would make the Zen more valuable (as it should be considering it's value is RL cash and not pixel currency) and help regulate the market a bit better. Character and account-based caps won't do squat unless there's a deterrent from opening unlimited accounts/characters to farm Dil with.
The current arbitrary methods PWE/C uses to try and regulate this (nerfing contraband, for example) will do absolutely nothing unless the others are addressed.
It's not you- it's me. I just need my space.
Being critical doesn't take skill. Being constructively critical- which is providing alternative solutions or suggestions to a demonstrated problem, however, does.
Not seeing any of that in the dil store, is that on Tribble?
Yes. Hitting holodeck tomorrow. They aren't even account unlocks.
Lack of account unlock is very disappointing, especially for something most people will be grinding dil on multiple toons for, but I gotta have it at least for my TOS toon, so just got the zen and sold it for the 2 million dil, figured if I wait until word gets out it might cost me more.
Disappointing? I welcome the price! I will grind for this stuff! This isn't communism where we get everything for free! Who said we were entitled to anything cheep? I will honestly grind this out with as much dil as I can because I think it is a benchmark I would be proud to reach!
Approach adversity with an open mind and a "I can do it and get out of my way I am making results happen" attitude and nothing stands in your way.
Way to make communism sound good, dude. Do you even hear yourself "Communism is bad because things are easy!"
Communism has real problems and it isn't "Things are too easy under communism!"
"Thou shalt respect the weak and shalt constitute thyself defender of them."
-3rd Commmandment of Chivalry
0
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,454Community Moderator
I got 1 well geared character, 2 decently geared alts, and the rest are passable. But I still feel that 1.7 mil for the MACO is Fleet Level pricing, and insane for a personal, single character unlock. If that was Energy Credits, no problem. I've paid 40-50 mil for ones off the Exchange, with 40 mil being the average for a popular outfit. But Dilithium? That's quite a stretch for casuals.
I don't know anyone in this game who only has 1 character, thus math based on 1 character is a fail.
Yeah, even back in SWG, which for the longest time only allowed one character per server, I still had three characters (at 15 bucks a month each that is).
I highly doubt anyone who puts any kind of time into any MMO has only one character.
Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
0
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,454Community Moderator
They don't have issues buying stuff from the Lobi or large items like KU ships, but they can't take a outfit. The Emotion is strong on this.
Yes. The complainers must want these outfits very badly. After all, nobody needs a 10-page (and counting) thread filled with expletives and personal insults just to say "I don't think it's worth the price, so I'm not going to buy it."
Exactly as planned. Sinks like this are based on envy, after all.
I highly doubt anyone who puts any kind of time into any MMO has only one character.
I only have one on Neverwinter and Defiance. Used to run only one on WoW because I was focusing on her alone...
I have been proven wrong
I really am quite surprised by that as well, particularly with WoW (I had at least 3 characters on my first day trying to figure out what class to main, lol).
I'll adjust my statement and say that the vast majority of MMO players have more than one character.
I have 11 Toons, but I don't not use any of them as "farmers".
That is not the way I play this game, I play to have fun, not make it a second job.
<shrug>
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I don't know anyone in this game who only has 1 character, thus math based on 1 character is a fail.
What were you saying earlier about the minority speaking as if they speak for everybody? I know several people who only have one character, most of whom have been playing since launch but have never had any interest in having any more than one character. Whilst I admit it's rare and I personally don't understand why you wouldn't want at least a few, it does happen and it shouldn't be assumed that everybody has an army of farming toons.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
Comments
Where do you think the Dilithium I buy with zen comes from? It comes from other players who obtained it in game, and when I spend it it's taken out of circulation, and the more people looking to obtain dilithium this way, the lower the exchange rate will go. Anything that must be purchased with dilithium is most definitely a dil sink, but the effectiveness of any given sink is determined by how desirable it is, if the cost is right, and how long the given sink remains relevant (by that I mean holdings, which only lower the exchange rate for so long).
they wont get that many sold, they expected wallet whales. wrong episode and wrong movie.
Thanks
Nothing there I feel the need to chase at any price higher than 'impulse buy'. I'd consider the excursion coat at micro-transaction prices ($2-$5) but yeah, no.
from twitter @LaughingTrendy 2h2 hours ago
I checked in with the team and they confirmed that those are the intended prices.
Wow! I was just sure that had to be a mistake. Yeah, uhm, I'm respectfully urging the price be reconsidered.
Thanks for letting me know.
Theres nothing to spend it on..?
although the backpack straps seems working weirdly with.... female chests :P
There are lots of new players and lots of new fleets still.
Cryptic, we don't have a Ferengi supplier and we can turn to anyone else that can provide these outstanding items (competition is good for business). Since you are the sole supplier/provider, please reconsider these prices.
ITS NOT EVEN AN OUTFIT ITS VEST AND SHIRT ONLY EVERYTHING ELSE IN GAME ALREADY SO $50.00 VEST AND SHIRT
Also some old fleets with small numbers. I still spend an average of 100 dollars a month buying Zen to exchange to Dilithium so as to advance our fleet progress. We're still only tier 4 and we've been around since launch and started fleet progression the first day they were added, but we only have a small number of people. The Armada system did help a fair bit, but really even then mostly people just donate fleet marks. It's rare for anybody to donate any sizeable amount of DOFFs or Dilithium to projects.
Sounds like your main has dil it could share with them?
Also Upgrades. I make Mk II gear then try and keep it going with upgrades till Mk XII or XIV depending on if I am going with theme gear or not. That uses dil pretty fast.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I almost choked when I saw those prices. I don't mind paying for outfits. But those prices are insane. And only one toon at that. If we were closer to April 1st I would have thought this was clever.
It would have been really cool to combine them into some 50th anniversary pack and put in on the c store for a reasonable price.
I wanted that jacket...
You'd expect anyone born rich enough NOT to be previously familiar with this concept would be rich enough not to whine about "$50."
Based on this thread, apparently not.
So spend that much dil then wait forever for the art team to fix it? No thanks.
Sounds like nobody buys/cares about how "rich" you are, too. If you were that rich, you'd have better things to occupy your valuable time than constantly trying to show off your epeen in an MMO thread.
They don't have issues buying stuff from the Lobi or large items like KU ships, but they can't take a outfit. The Emotion is strong on this.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Of course, the problem with this theory- is that the Dilithium in game is not a finite source- it's an infinite one.
There's no "exhaustible" supply of Dil in game... it's limitless, the only thing limiting the market is the refinement cap, which is currently character-based. This also being a F2P game, people can create an unlimited amount of accounts and characters (albeit as many as the default account allows until they purchase more slots, which can be obtained with said Zen) to farm Dil with, which the "average" player won't have but perhaps 1-2 accounts. (usually one, but families, etc. may have more)
Then also complicate it with "Free" Zen given to players using Arc and doing Arc quests... which really cost them nothing but their time.
As far as the Exchange itself goes- there's no way to "regulate" this buy continuously buying Zen. The best suggestion I've seen yet is to limit the amount of Zen that can be purchased on an account with Dil... which would make the Zen more valuable (as it should be considering it's value is RL cash and not pixel currency) and help regulate the market a bit better. Character and account-based caps won't do squat unless there's a deterrent from opening unlimited accounts/characters to farm Dil with.
The current arbitrary methods PWE/C uses to try and regulate this (nerfing contraband, for example) will do absolutely nothing unless the others are addressed.
Being critical doesn't take skill. Being constructively critical- which is providing alternative solutions or suggestions to a demonstrated problem, however, does.
Way to make communism sound good, dude. Do you even hear yourself "Communism is bad because things are easy!"
Communism has real problems and it isn't "Things are too easy under communism!"
-3rd Commmandment of Chivalry
Yeah, even back in SWG, which for the longest time only allowed one character per server, I still had three characters (at 15 bucks a month each that is).
I highly doubt anyone who puts any kind of time into any MMO has only one character.
I only have one on Neverwinter and Defiance. Used to run only one on WoW because I was focusing on her alone...
Exactly as planned. Sinks like this are based on envy, after all.
I have been proven wrong
I really am quite surprised by that as well, particularly with WoW (I had at least 3 characters on my first day trying to figure out what class to main, lol).
I'll adjust my statement and say that the vast majority of MMO players have more than one character.
That is not the way I play this game, I play to have fun, not make it a second job.
<shrug>
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
What were you saying earlier about the minority speaking as if they speak for everybody? I know several people who only have one character, most of whom have been playing since launch but have never had any interest in having any more than one character. Whilst I admit it's rare and I personally don't understand why you wouldn't want at least a few, it does happen and it shouldn't be assumed that everybody has an army of farming toons.