How important was that for you to type QFT? Did that make you important today?
Ignore it @sheldoncooper, it's not worth it. Let them talk amongst themselves.
"Great men are not peacemakers, Great men are conquerors!" - Captain Archer" "When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway #Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
"Great men are not peacemakers, Great men are conquerors!" - Captain Archer" "When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway #Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
How is sexting got any relevance to this? lol...
Saying it's about revenge and resentment would of sufficed.
Nope, the scenario had to be outlined properly to appreciate the level of inapropriateness/betrayal...
Besides, posting the pic of Jean-Luc when Beverly started asking for child-support for Wesley, that's really irrelevant
You're comparing a IP property to sexting pictures of someone's spouse is relevant in what world?
The gif is from the episode 'The Drumhead'. And it has more relevance here than trying to create feelings of sympathy for CBS.
The fact you think I'm talking about the IP, is a pretty sad state of affairs... I was talking about Alec Peters behaviour with regards scamming donors by using their love for Star Trek, to fund his own for-profit business... The comparison to someone behaving inappropriately to someone else's spouse, is one of a lack of respect, impropriety, and betrayal... If you still claim to not get it, I'll have no choice but to consider your comments as deliberately disingenuous...
Nowhere was I trying to create feeling of sympathy for CBS, but to illustrate why donating fans would have been angry enough to try and sue Alec Peters for their money back... I'm sorry you did not understand that...
The fact is it's a stupid comparison and should never have been made. It's was completely painfully obvious that you're trying to insinuate CBS loving spouse IP was being abused by Alec. The rest of the nonsensical rant is a attempt to rally hate in others to stir some trouble. If you want to sue, good luck to you.
There is nothing to get except you unsuccessfully getting people to agree with your odd point. And I am not sorry if you can't comprehend that. Take that how you will with any follow up reply. But I'll probably ignore it.
Oh, another wannabe moderator trying to tell someone what they can and can't say...
So you didn't like the example I used... Boo-****-hoo... I wasn't talking to you, so really couldn't care less if you agree with/like/dislike the example... And no, that is NOT what I was trying to suggest, so don't put words into my mouth. I clearly explained above that it was THE TRUST AND GOODWILL OF THE FANS which was being abused... Don't accuse me of 'rallying anything', because I did nothing of the sort... I don't need to sue Alec, I never donated, but I do feel that those who donated, deserve to be able to get refunds, by whatever channels are available... Feel free to ignore... In fact, feel free to ignore anything I ever post again
Nowhere was I trying to create feeling of sympathy for CBS, but to illustrate why donating fans would have been angry enough to try and sue Alec Peters for their money back... I'm sorry you did not understand that...
This doesn't happen except as part of a single class action. The sums are too small individually for anyone to pursue this fantasy.
Really? I thought people were able to take people to the small claims court for costs upto $5000? Does it need to be a class action for anyone to get any money back? Also, what if KickStarter turns round and decides that he was deliberately scamming people? Someone mentioned them having rules about that upthread (although apparently not always enforced) so I'd think that at the very least, KickStarter could enforce refunds (PayPal like doing things like that, such as taking money directly out of a sellers account (even a bank account if it is verified) It wouldn't surprize me if somehow, folks get their donations back...
You can but if it's Limited Civil (IE under $1500 - in my case were I to file, it would be $75); and if I got a complete Judgement in my favor - Alec Peters would have a Judgement on file against him for $75 (plus court fees - basically they'd add the filing fee I paid to the Judgement); BUT it's up to ME to collect it from him (IE under $1500 they won't garnish wages, put any liens on property, etc.); so my option then is to sell it to a collection agency (for pennies on the dollar) or just hope one day Alec Peters grew a conscience and fulfilled the Judgement.
And while it would go on his credit rating; a $75 dollar Judgement against wouldn't really ding it that hard.
And if a group of disgruntled pledgers were to file a Class Action suit (assuming you could find a willing lawyer/firm); the firm would typically take between 35%-40% of the settlement; AND Alec Peters/Axanar could simply declare bankruptcy (which would at least nuke his credit rating and hamper his ability to get loans or lines of credit in a major way for years) - but again, you'd get pennies (if anything at all) on the dollar.
For me, for my $75 pledge - it's just not worth the hassle, and that's what most small time grifters hope. That said, if they could make a case, at this point I would mind if the CA attorney general decided/were able to bring Alec Peters up on criminal fraud charges <-- IMO he really deserves it. But that's me - and it likely won't happen.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
I'm not a lawyer but I could actually see a court challenge to #5 at least as a violation of contract law. Strikes me that C/P are trying to impose new terms not just on the fan film crew but more specifically on former employees who are no longer under contract to them.
Sorry, you can't bring a court challenge when what you're basically saying is:
"If someone decides to illegally use CBS/Paramount's Star Trek IP to make a film (which is illegal under copyright law) - the actors on that project deserve to get paid."
You'll be laughed out of court and your case summarily dismissed.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
So you didn't like the example I used... Boo-****-hoo... I wasn't talking to you, so really couldn't care less if you agree with/like/dislike the example... And no, that is NOT what I was trying to suggest, so don't put words into my mouth. I clearly explained above that it was THE TRUST AND GOODWILL OF THE FANS which was being abused... Don't accuse me of 'rallying anything', because I did nothing of the sort... I don't need to sue Alec, I never donated, but I do feel that those who donated, deserve to be able to get refunds, by whatever channels are available... Feel free to ignore... In fact, feel free to ignore anything I ever post again
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqtwDuJi6Cg
Got a feeling that you're emotionally combusting again. If the first pages between you and thekodanarmada are anything to go by.
"Great men are not peacemakers, Great men are conquerors!" - Captain Archer" "When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway #Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
I doubt there would be much laughter if you were Nichelle Nichols or Walter Koenig bringing a suit against cbs/paramount for intentional interference with contractual relations.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
If you're hired on to do work, and someone does not pay you, you absolutely have a case.
The legitimacy of an employers business dealings is not the responsibility of the employee. If I'm working for a bank and the bank is engaged in illegal finance, I am still entitled to my paycheck.
Well, that's a real pity. I was looking forward to more Renegades and Axanar. I guess this means Star Trek Continues where even STO got so many great talents is dead, too.
Well, that's a real pity. I was looking forward to more Renegades and Axanar. I guess this means Star Trek Continues where even STO got so many great talents is dead, too.
Renegades is redacting all mention of Star Trek and pressing on. It appears that all previously committed cast members are staying. I just upped my donation.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
"Great men are not peacemakers, Great men are conquerors!" - Captain Archer" "When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway #Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
If you're hired on to do work, and someone does not pay you, you absolutely have a case.
The legitimacy of an employers business dealings is not the responsibility of the employee. If I'm working for a bank and the bank is engaged in illegal finance, I am still entitled to my paycheck.
But that's not the situation here - the poster wanted to sue C/P on the basis that Guidline #5 is illegal. Again, you take that to court and you're arguing: "Hey, C/P can't tell me what to do with my unlicensed Star Trek production..."
^^^
Go ahead and file such a claim and see how quickly it gets dismissed. And also, technically, C/P isn't telling you not to pay participants in a fan film; just if you do, they may take legal action. So again, it's on you the fan film producer as to how you want to proceed - knowing full well, that the fan film you are making is STILL ILLEGAL under Copyright law. If you read the Guidelines C/P are NOT giving you a waiver or license, or officially sanctioning your production in any way (They STILL reserve all right; including the right to sue - EVEN IF you follow every Guideline - they could if they wanted, still sue you. They are just saying if you follow the Guidelines to the letter they probably won't.)
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Feel free to ignore... In fact, feel free to ignore anything I ever post again
I think the most effective method for this strategy is if you added this quote to your signature.
"Great men are not peacemakers, Great men are conquerors!" - Captain Archer" "When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway #Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
Nowhere was I trying to create feeling of sympathy for CBS, but to illustrate why donating fans would have been angry enough to try and sue Alec Peters for their money back... I'm sorry you did not understand that...
This doesn't happen except as part of a single class action. The sums are too small individually for anyone to pursue this fantasy.
Really? I thought people were able to take people to the small claims court for costs upto $5000? Does it need to be a class action for anyone to get any money back? Also, what if KickStarter turns round and decides that he was deliberately scamming people? Someone mentioned them having rules about that upthread (although apparently not always enforced) so I'd think that at the very least, KickStarter could enforce refunds (PayPal like doing things like that, such as taking money directly out of a sellers account (even a bank account if it is verified) It wouldn't surprize me if somehow, folks get their donations back...
You can but if it's Limited Civil (IE under $1500 - in my case were I to file, it would be $75); and if I got a complete Judgement in my favor - Alec Peters would have a Judgement on file against him for $75 (plus court fees - basically they'd add the filing fee I paid to the Judgement); BUT it's up to ME to collect it from him (IE under $1500 they won't garnish wages, put any liens on property, etc.); so my option then is to sell it to a collection agency (for pennies on the dollar) or just hope one day Alec Peters grew a conscience and fulfilled the Judgement.
And while it would go on his credit rating; a $75 dollar Judgement against wouldn't really ding it that hard.
And if a group of disgruntled pledgers were to file a Class Action suit (assuming you could find a willing lawyer/firm); the firm would typically take between 35%-40% of the settlement; AND Alec Peters/Axanar could simply declare bankruptcy (which would at least nuke his credit rating and hamper his ability to get loans or lines of credit in a major way for years) - but again, you'd get pennies (if anything at all) on the dollar.
For me, for my $75 pledge - it's just not worth the hassle, and that's what most small time grifters hope. That said, if they could make a case, at this point I would mind if the CA attorney general decided/were able to bring Alec Peters up on criminal fraud charges <-- IMO he really deserves it. But that's me - and it likely won't happen.
Damn, that's really disheartening to read... Thank you for taking the time to explain though, I guess Alec Peters is going to walk away from this one
Well, it's depressing, but I suppose it was inevitable that CBS/Paramount would finally decide to just give one big F**** YOU! to all the old fans and fully embrace new Trek as a jealously guarded generic summer action franchise.
Strict fundraising limitations would have been enough to head off any future Axanar types issues, but that list is needlessly crippling to the sort of fan work that has been going on for decades costing the studios nothing and building fan dedication and investment in the franchise.
Oh well, at least they can't sue us for unauthorized use of fond memories...yet anyway.
CBS/Paramount proposed Rule #11 would prohibit Unauthorized Fan Memories of more than three minutes.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
@crypticarmsman wrote: "Sorry, you can't bring a court challenge when what you're basically saying is: "If someone decides to illegally use CBS/Paramount's Star Trek IP to make a film (which is illegal under copyright law) - the actors on that project deserve to get paid."
You'll be laughed out of court and your case summarily dismissed."
That is not remotely what I'm saying. I'm not even talking about whether they're paid or not (one hopes NOT, considering these are supposed to be not-for-profit fan productions), I'm just saying that C/P cannot effectively retroactively attach what is in essence a non-compete clause to an actor or other crew member's employment contract, especially when (as with for example Tim Russ) the actor no longer works for them. They're not allowed to ban former employees from (what amounts to) employment, even uncompensated employment, unless that was a condition of their contract (and the unions would shut them down in a femtosecond if they tried).
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
If you're hired on to do work, and someone does not pay you, you absolutely have a case.
The legitimacy of an employers business dealings is not the responsibility of the employee. If I'm working for a bank and the bank is engaged in illegal finance, I am still entitled to my paycheck.
Lol first you claim that all IP rights should be dropped, allowing anyone to steal your or my original ideas and use them without paying us.
Then you claim that people not being paid have the right to sue, what reality do you live in.?
And before you bring up the bank is my employer (or any other employer) arguement again, don't bother.
Nowhere was I trying to create feeling of sympathy for CBS, but to illustrate why donating fans would have been angry enough to try and sue Alec Peters for their money back... I'm sorry you did not understand that...
This doesn't happen except as part of a single class action. The sums are too small individually for anyone to pursue this fantasy.
Really? I thought people were able to take people to the small claims court for costs upto $5000? Does it need to be a class action for anyone to get any money back? Also, what if KickStarter turns round and decides that he was deliberately scamming people? Someone mentioned them having rules about that upthread (although apparently not always enforced) so I'd think that at the very least, KickStarter could enforce refunds (PayPal like doing things like that, such as taking money directly out of a sellers account (even a bank account if it is verified) It wouldn't surprize me if somehow, folks get their donations back...
You can but if it's Limited Civil (IE under $1500 - in my case were I to file, it would be $75); and if I got a complete Judgement in my favor - Alec Peters would have a Judgement on file against him for $75 (plus court fees - basically they'd add the filing fee I paid to the Judgement); BUT it's up to ME to collect it from him (IE under $1500 they won't garnish wages, put any liens on property, etc.); so my option then is to sell it to a collection agency (for pennies on the dollar) or just hope one day Alec Peters grew a conscience and fulfilled the Judgement.
And while it would go on his credit rating; a $75 dollar Judgement against wouldn't really ding it that hard.
And if a group of disgruntled pledgers were to file a Class Action suit (assuming you could find a willing lawyer/firm); the firm would typically take between 35%-40% of the settlement; AND Alec Peters/Axanar could simply declare bankruptcy (which would at least nuke his credit rating and hamper his ability to get loans or lines of credit in a major way for years) - but again, you'd get pennies (if anything at all) on the dollar.
For me, for my $75 pledge - it's just not worth the hassle, and that's what most small time grifters hope. That said, if they could make a case, at this point I would mind if the CA attorney general decided/were able to bring Alec Peters up on criminal fraud charges <-- IMO he really deserves it. But that's me - and it likely won't happen.
Damn, that's really disheartening to read... Thank you for taking the time to explain though, I guess Alec Peters is going to walk away from this one
Been reading Armsman on STO since he's been here and one other gaming forum which of course im not at liberty to say.
The man does his homework, more than most.
All this boo hoo CBS/Paramount are big bullies and Axanar was Trek's last best hope is hilarious, and infantile.
I think Alec Peters is a crook, and whatever he gets he doesn't live well with he deserves.
The legitimacy of an employers business dealings is not the responsibility of the employee. If I'm working for a bank and the bank is engaged in illegal finance, I am still entitled to my paycheck.
Yes, in that situation you are entitled to a paycheck, because working at a bank is legitimate employment. In that scenario the illegal acts are separate from the business itself. What we're talking about is more similar to suing a drug dealer you work for cause he didn't pay you for selling a bunch of drugs for him. The entire situation is illegal, no different than an unauthorized fan film. You can't sue for payment for an illegal act
Then you claim that people not being paid have the right to sue, what reality do you live in.?
Actually, in most of the US people not being paid usually DO have the right to sue in many situations. That includes volunteers. Its been done. It happened to Origin years ago and was going to happen to 3DO before they folded for some bs that happened while it ran meridian. It scared many companies enough to terminate their volunteer programs, including Microsoft. Its wise to be careful with how you treat volunteers who work for you, they have more rights than most people realize.
That is not remotely what I'm saying. I'm not even talking about whether they're paid or not (one hopes NOT, considering these are supposed to be not-for-profit fan productions), I'm just saying that C/P cannot effectively retroactively attach what is in essence a non-compete clause to an actor or other crew member's employment contract, especially when (as with for example Tim Russ) the actor no longer works for them. They're not allowed to ban former employees from (what amounts to) employment, even uncompensated employment, unless that was a condition of their contract (and the unions would shut them down in a femtosecond if they tried).
You would be surprised what employers can legally do. Such things have been done before. and remember they are the multibillion dollar company with millions to spend on corporate lawyers and who can make absolutely sure that such people are permanently blacklisted in the industry. Ask anybody who has worked in the programming field or game development, this kind of thing goes on all the time.
The legitimacy of an employers business dealings is not the responsibility of the employee. If I'm working for a bank and the bank is engaged in illegal finance, I am still entitled to my paycheck.
Yes, in that situation you are entitled to a paycheck, because working at a bank is legitimate employment. In that scenario the illegal acts are separate from the business itself. What we're talking about is more similar to suing a drug dealer you work for cause he didn't pay you for selling a bunch of drugs for him. The entire situation is illegal, no different than an unauthorized fan film. You can't sue for payment for an illegal act
Then you claim that people not being paid have the right to sue, what reality do you live in.?
Actually, in most of the US people not being paid usually DO have the right to sue in many situations. That includes volunteers. Its been done. It happened to Origin years ago and was going to happen to 3DO before they folded for some bs that happened while it ran meridian. It scared many companies enough to terminate their volunteer programs, including Microsoft. Its wise to be careful with how you treat volunteers who work for you, they have more rights than most people realize.
That is not remotely what I'm saying. I'm not even talking about whether they're paid or not (one hopes NOT, considering these are supposed to be not-for-profit fan productions), I'm just saying that C/P cannot effectively retroactively attach what is in essence a non-compete clause to an actor or other crew member's employment contract, especially when (as with for example Tim Russ) the actor no longer works for them. They're not allowed to ban former employees from (what amounts to) employment, even uncompensated employment, unless that was a condition of their contract (and the unions would shut them down in a femtosecond if they tried).
You would be surprised what employers can legally do. Such things have been done before. and remember they are the multibillion dollar company with millions to spend on corporate lawyers and who can make absolutely sure that such people are permanently blacklisted in the industry. Ask anybody who has worked in the programming field or game development, this kind of thing goes on all the time.
The difference being that the Actors Union/Guild, has gone up against the Production Studio's before and has won just about every time.
I'm not even sure that the computer programming/game development field, even has a union.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I wasn't making the point that they dont have the right to sue, i was making the point that he says two different things in two different posts.
I am well aware that they have the right to sue, i live in the US, any volunteer by the very nature and definition of the word "expecting" to get paid, and then sueing over it is whats wrong with frivolous lawsuits in the US today.
Love how someone smokes for 40yrs, dies of disease from it, and then the family sues the cigarette maker, utter stupidity, and this from a person whos smoked 35yrs.
Comments
Ignore it @sheldoncooper, it's not worth it. Let them talk amongst themselves.
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
#Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
You say that like that's a bad thing. Lol
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
#Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
You can but if it's Limited Civil (IE under $1500 - in my case were I to file, it would be $75); and if I got a complete Judgement in my favor - Alec Peters would have a Judgement on file against him for $75 (plus court fees - basically they'd add the filing fee I paid to the Judgement); BUT it's up to ME to collect it from him (IE under $1500 they won't garnish wages, put any liens on property, etc.); so my option then is to sell it to a collection agency (for pennies on the dollar) or just hope one day Alec Peters grew a conscience and fulfilled the Judgement.
And while it would go on his credit rating; a $75 dollar Judgement against wouldn't really ding it that hard.
And if a group of disgruntled pledgers were to file a Class Action suit (assuming you could find a willing lawyer/firm); the firm would typically take between 35%-40% of the settlement; AND Alec Peters/Axanar could simply declare bankruptcy (which would at least nuke his credit rating and hamper his ability to get loans or lines of credit in a major way for years) - but again, you'd get pennies (if anything at all) on the dollar.
For me, for my $75 pledge - it's just not worth the hassle, and that's what most small time grifters hope. That said, if they could make a case, at this point I would mind if the CA attorney general decided/were able to bring Alec Peters up on criminal fraud charges <-- IMO he really deserves it. But that's me - and it likely won't happen.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Sorry, you can't bring a court challenge when what you're basically saying is:
"If someone decides to illegally use CBS/Paramount's Star Trek IP to make a film (which is illegal under copyright law) - the actors on that project deserve to get paid."
You'll be laughed out of court and your case summarily dismissed.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Got a feeling that you're emotionally combusting again. If the first pages between you and thekodanarmada are anything to go by.
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
#Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
I doubt there would be much laughter if you were Nichelle Nichols or Walter Koenig bringing a suit against cbs/paramount for intentional interference with contractual relations.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
The legitimacy of an employers business dealings is not the responsibility of the employee. If I'm working for a bank and the bank is engaged in illegal finance, I am still entitled to my paycheck.
Renegades is redacting all mention of Star Trek and pressing on. It appears that all previously committed cast members are staying. I just upped my donation.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
#Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
I think the most effective method for this strategy is if you added this quote to your signature.
^^^
Go ahead and file such a claim and see how quickly it gets dismissed. And also, technically, C/P isn't telling you not to pay participants in a fan film; just if you do, they may take legal action. So again, it's on you the fan film producer as to how you want to proceed - knowing full well, that the fan film you are making is STILL ILLEGAL under Copyright law. If you read the Guidelines C/P are NOT giving you a waiver or license, or officially sanctioning your production in any way (They STILL reserve all right; including the right to sue - EVEN IF you follow every Guideline - they could if they wanted, still sue you. They are just saying if you follow the Guidelines to the letter they probably won't.)
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
#Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
My character Tsin'xing
Strict fundraising limitations would have been enough to head off any future Axanar types issues, but that list is needlessly crippling to the sort of fan work that has been going on for decades costing the studios nothing and building fan dedication and investment in the franchise.
Oh well, at least they can't sue us for unauthorized use of fond memories...yet anyway.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
"Sorry, you can't bring a court challenge when what you're basically saying is:
"If someone decides to illegally use CBS/Paramount's Star Trek IP to make a film (which is illegal under copyright law) - the actors on that project deserve to get paid."
You'll be laughed out of court and your case summarily dismissed."
That is not remotely what I'm saying. I'm not even talking about whether they're paid or not (one hopes NOT, considering these are supposed to be not-for-profit fan productions), I'm just saying that C/P cannot effectively retroactively attach what is in essence a non-compete clause to an actor or other crew member's employment contract, especially when (as with for example Tim Russ) the actor no longer works for them. They're not allowed to ban former employees from (what amounts to) employment, even uncompensated employment, unless that was a condition of their contract (and the unions would shut them down in a femtosecond if they tried).
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
This is where we have come to these days, chuck all IP rights and watch actual talent in writing and films go down the toilet.
And this garbage that fan films have "saved" Star Trek from oblivion is well, garbage.
Lol first you claim that all IP rights should be dropped, allowing anyone to steal your or my original ideas and use them without paying us.
Then you claim that people not being paid have the right to sue, what reality do you live in.?
And before you bring up the bank is my employer (or any other employer) arguement again, don't bother.
Been reading Armsman on STO since he's been here and one other gaming forum which of course im not at liberty to say.
The man does his homework, more than most.
All this boo hoo CBS/Paramount are big bullies and Axanar was Trek's last best hope is hilarious, and infantile.
I think Alec Peters is a crook, and whatever he gets he doesn't live well with he deserves.
Yes, in that situation you are entitled to a paycheck, because working at a bank is legitimate employment. In that scenario the illegal acts are separate from the business itself. What we're talking about is more similar to suing a drug dealer you work for cause he didn't pay you for selling a bunch of drugs for him. The entire situation is illegal, no different than an unauthorized fan film. You can't sue for payment for an illegal act
Actually, in most of the US people not being paid usually DO have the right to sue in many situations. That includes volunteers. Its been done. It happened to Origin years ago and was going to happen to 3DO before they folded for some bs that happened while it ran meridian. It scared many companies enough to terminate their volunteer programs, including Microsoft. Its wise to be careful with how you treat volunteers who work for you, they have more rights than most people realize.
You would be surprised what employers can legally do. Such things have been done before. and remember they are the multibillion dollar company with millions to spend on corporate lawyers and who can make absolutely sure that such people are permanently blacklisted in the industry. Ask anybody who has worked in the programming field or game development, this kind of thing goes on all the time.
The difference being that the Actors Union/Guild, has gone up against the Production Studio's before and has won just about every time.
I'm not even sure that the computer programming/game development field, even has a union.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I am well aware that they have the right to sue, i live in the US, any volunteer by the very nature and definition of the word "expecting" to get paid, and then sueing over it is whats wrong with frivolous lawsuits in the US today.
Love how someone smokes for 40yrs, dies of disease from it, and then the family sues the cigarette maker, utter stupidity, and this from a person whos smoked 35yrs.
But that is a whole other topic.