Get the feeling this may or may not have character growth for the crew. Maybe Kirk could grow himself in a way. Thinking this because few times I watch TOS I always wondered what Kirk was like when he was younger when he was in Starfleet. Guess this is my way of seeing that even if it is an alternate universe.
In "Where No Man Has Gone Before", Kirk's old friend (and Academy classmate) described Midshipman Kirk as "a stack of books with legs," and implied that he was the one responsible for "aiming" Carol Marcus at Jim. We also know that Lt. Kirk was taken a bit aback when the Farragut, aboard which he was helmsman, encountered the gaseous entity that later attacked Enterprise, and blamed himself for not hitting it with the phasers soon enough. (During the second encounter, he berated the young man in the navigator's seat, but later learned that the phasers in both cases were fired in plenty of time - the creature was just immune to their effect.)
In short, Prime!Kirk was very serious about his job, and apparently not given to much blowing off of steam on leave. Probably why he and Spock got along so well when Kirk first took command of Enterprise.
Nu!Kirk, on the other hand, has been shown to be much more impetuous, less studious, and more likely to go with his gut rather than thinking things through, due in large part to his very different upbringing from his Prime counterpart. I'm anticipating some growth in the character here, but I don't think he and Prime!Kirk are ever going to be congruent.
Get the feeling this may or may not have character growth for the crew. Maybe Kirk could grow himself in a way. Thinking this because few times I watch TOS I always wondered what Kirk was like when he was younger when he was in Starfleet. Guess this is my way of seeing that even if it is an alternate universe.
kirk has always been a little prideful, somewhat stubborn, and lacking some patience but confident and almost arrogant in ways. in jjtrek, they made him hyper arrogant, insecure and lacking in patience and wisdom. it has lead to several notable incidents that showed that he is a hothead and fails to follow instructions, further he fails to understand that hes been properly punished for certain actions. maybe having the enterprise reduced to slagged metal would make him think twice that there are forces out there that go beyond his ego.
in someways they are alike, in other ways they not even the same kirk.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Get the feeling this may or may not have character growth for the crew. Maybe Kirk could grow himself in a way. Thinking this because few times I watch TOS I always wondered what Kirk was like when he was younger when he was in Starfleet. Guess this is my way of seeing that even if it is an alternate universe.
kirk has always been a little prideful, somewhat stubborn, and lacking some patience but confident and almost arrogant in ways. in jjtrek, they made him hyper arrogant, insecure and lacking in patience and wisdom. it has lead to several notable incidents that showed that he is a hothead and fails to follow instructions, further he fails to understand that hes been properly punished for certain actions. maybe having the enterprise reduced to slagged metal would make him think twice that there are forces out there that go beyond his ego.
in someways they are alike, in other ways they not even the same kirk.
Are you the AR version of @mirrorchaos ? You seem to be seething in less blind hatred than usual . Because that looks like character analysis and not bashing poor JJ.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
I don't think he and Prime!Kirk are ever going to be congruent.
I don't think they should be, given the premise. As you said, AR Kirk had a very different upbringing, which does (and SHOULD) effect that character. AR George Kirk, from what little we saw of him, was far more like Prime Kirk... so, take away that influence? You should get a snot-nosed brat that's lazy, skates by on his laurels, and has a real problem with authority.
Get the feeling this may or may not have character growth for the crew. Maybe Kirk could grow himself in a way. Thinking this because few times I watch TOS I always wondered what Kirk was like when he was younger when he was in Starfleet. Guess this is my way of seeing that even if it is an alternate universe.
kirk has always been a little prideful, somewhat stubborn, and lacking some patience but confident and almost arrogant in ways. in jjtrek, they made him hyper arrogant, insecure and lacking in patience and wisdom. it has lead to several notable incidents that showed that he is a hothead and fails to follow instructions, further he fails to understand that hes been properly punished for certain actions. maybe having the enterprise reduced to slagged metal would make him think twice that there are forces out there that go beyond his ego.
in someways they are alike, in other ways they not even the same kirk.
Are you the AR version of @mirrorchaos ? You seem to be seething in less blind hatred than usual . Because that looks like character analysis and not bashing poor JJ.
hah! how little you know me . shouldnt presume to know.
yeah, and then there is jj spock, he is more blinded by his emotions than he is by his logic at times, the prime spock would have great difficulty trying to find a balance in those emotions and logic, although he did try to purge them, it seems without much success. looks like spock and kirk in the jj side of things play off each other.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Very pleased to see the positive buzz about this trailer, and this film.
The JJ-Haters will still hate, but even some of them seem to be warming to this movie.
Still, someone said that Trek was rending all weekend on Twitter. That can only be a good thing!
so you hating the haters actually makes you a hater. hmm not sure what the logic behind that one is.
as for the warming up to it? being particularly cagey, i am not sure yet as i have not seen the film and probably wont until the end of the year when its out on dvd.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Very pleased to see the positive buzz about this trailer, and this film.
The JJ-Haters will still hate, but even some of them seem to be warming to this movie.
Still, someone said that Trek was rending all weekend on Twitter. That can only be a good thing!
so you hating the haters actually makes you a hater. hmm not sure what the logic behind that one is.
as for the warming up to it? being particularly cagey, i am not sure yet as i have not seen the film and probably wont until the end of the year when its out on dvd.
Me calling them what they are makes me a hater? Sorry, but I was just cursed out elsewhere on the the internet for being a a fan of these movies... and that's not the first time that's happened. (Such is Internet, sadly.)
I have no problems with people who don't like these movies. Spew irrational hatred towards JJ Abrams for making a movie? Okay, life is short, but I won't be able to change your mind, so whatever. Insult Abrams AND the fans that like the movies, though?
Sorry, but coming from a fan base that upholds tolerance, acceptance, and peace... yeah.
I literally spat out my drink with excitement when I saw the NX-class at the end. Was a bit disappointed to find out later that it wasn't actually an NX. Still, the Franklin looks cool.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
Very pleased to see the positive buzz about this trailer, and this film.
The JJ-Haters will still hate, but even some of them seem to be warming to this movie.
Still, someone said that Trek was rending all weekend on Twitter. That can only be a good thing!
so you hating the haters actually makes you a hater. hmm not sure what the logic behind that one is.
as for the warming up to it? being particularly cagey, i am not sure yet as i have not seen the film and probably wont until the end of the year when its out on dvd.
Me calling them what they are makes me a hater? Sorry, but I was just cursed out elsewhere on the the internet for being a a fan of these movies... and that's not the first time that's happened. (Such is Internet, sadly.)
cursed? nope and your ignorance is not my concern when you so clearly spit that "hater" word out with no regard.
I literally spat out my drink with excitement when I saw the NX-class at the end. Was a bit disappointed to find out later that it wasn't actually an NX. Still, the Franklin looks cool.
i also thought it was an nx class, it looks similar no question about that.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
so... *looks at the new antatgonist and dons asbestos suit* Why are JJ-Na'khul so pissed?
According to official statements they are not Na'Khul, and Justin wasn't involved in the Khan/Not Khan thing (which JJ said was a mistake anyway and wouldn't do it again).
LOL Im sure they're not but the visual resemblance and my smartass nature demanded I go there
Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but there are now rumors that Nathan Fillion is joining the cast of the new show. However it looks like this is mostly a fan campaign to get the actor on the show and no statements have been made by any of the parties.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Much better then the first trailer, which just didn't have the right feel to it. I'm hoping that if the Enterprise is destroyed and it look quite like it that, she puts up a good fight. We haven't really seen what she's capable of offensively in the previous two films .
i would say a full-on barrage against a massive mining ship augmented with late 24th century borg technology (which includes self-regeneration and possibly limited weapons adaptability) more than adequately demonstrates the AR enterprise's offensive capabilities, even if said mining vessel was being crushed by a black hole at the time
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
The Franklin is a nice ship. A very clear stage between the NX (and the Warp Delta come to think of it) and the Kelvin.
ENT really is served much better as a prequel to the AR films than it was as a prequel to TOS.
This is most apparent from the designs of the hand weapons, uniforms, and starships.
That makes a whole lot of sense. Not that it makes any of the two better, but it makes sense, even from a production standpoint as you'd naturally hook into the most recent installment oif the franchise instead of the first.
@OP The trailer looks better, but it wasn't really the trailer to begin with that made this movie seem like a generic action flick. We now even have deep voiced wrinklyfaced villians - MArvel gets away with a lot of stuff, but I'd expect different from Star Trek.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Was watching Entertainment Tonight's preview of upcoming summer films and Leonard Maltin had said how Star Trek isn't "Star Trek" anymore. The studio has taken away most all the aspects that made it unique in the sci-fi genre and turned it into just another sci-fi action adventure film laden with special effects.
I don't even know if I can put my hooves on what it is that these films lack. For me personally I don't like the visuals, they seem borrowed from Star Wars and don't fit and I don't like the retelling of classic stories instead of doing something different (if they had followed the Kelvin maybe it wouldn't have been that bad, but reimagining classic characters never works). You can have an enjoyable action flick and still add some meaningful dialogue and message into them, the MCU movies do that well (the shows are better, though - I guess it's natural for a TV show to be a better device sor those things). 09 and ID however didn't achieve this, I'd agree with that.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I will even admit that the Abrams series of films has proven one thing: Trek can't survive as a film franchise alone.
We all have known that, though... I mean, aside from the nuances of fandom that simultaneously new/bigger/better and familiar/continuity/depth... movies are not the place for long-form storytelling, and that has been the one lacking thing in the AR that has allowed the fan base to accept it, IMO. Comics are nice, but most fans won't read those.
I still think back to Abrams' original desire, to create a multi-platform mega-universe (films, TV, web content, games, comics)... oh, what might've been. And, no, it wouldn't have all been like the movies (action first, everything else last).
(...)
I still think back to Abrams' original desire, to create a multi-platform mega-universe (films, TV, web content, games, comics)... oh, what might've been. And, no, it wouldn't have all been like the movies (action first, everything else last).
Maybe that's where they go with the reborn Star Wars universe. And just to add that in regards to JJ Abrams - the new Star Wars movie he directed was extremely good in my opinion. This has nothing to do with "Abrams bashing", there are movies that proof he knows how to do it and given the *right* material the films turn out to be very good. Star Trek however wasn't the right material for him and his vision of things.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
(...)
I still think back to Abrams' original desire, to create a multi-platform mega-universe (films, TV, web content, games, comics)... oh, what might've been. And, no, it wouldn't have all been like the movies (action first, everything else last).
Maybe that's where they go with the reborn Star Wars universe. And just to add that in regards to JJ Abrams - the new Star Wars movie he directed was extremely good in my opinion. This has nothing to do with "Abrams bashing", there are movies that proof he knows how to do it and given the *right* material the films turn out to be very good. Star Trek however wasn't the right material for him and his vision of things.
Oh, yeah, I wasn't taking that as "Abrams bashing."
As much as I love the Abrams movies, that's on my list of legit issues about the movies. I, personally, have taken the time to read some of the tie-in comics, so that likely helps me buy more into the universe... but, not everyone is willing to do that.
Now, the potential Abrams series wasn't going to have Pine & Quinto in it, but the famed "Captain Sulu" idea seemed likely for a moment... having fans get the weekly dose of universe-building would have gone a long way to support the "flash" of the summer films. Plus, Abrams would have handed off the series to someone well-versed in doing a good series (doubtful it would be Orci, too, because they both did that with Fringe... that show was in different hands for the majority of its run).
It's why I think I'm willing to give Lin & Pegg a shot, with this film... they still won't be able to do what you can do in a TV series, but Abrams can hand it off to someone that can run with the vision.
Comments
In short, Prime!Kirk was very serious about his job, and apparently not given to much blowing off of steam on leave. Probably why he and Spock got along so well when Kirk first took command of Enterprise.
Nu!Kirk, on the other hand, has been shown to be much more impetuous, less studious, and more likely to go with his gut rather than thinking things through, due in large part to his very different upbringing from his Prime counterpart. I'm anticipating some growth in the character here, but I don't think he and Prime!Kirk are ever going to be congruent.
kirk has always been a little prideful, somewhat stubborn, and lacking some patience but confident and almost arrogant in ways. in jjtrek, they made him hyper arrogant, insecure and lacking in patience and wisdom. it has lead to several notable incidents that showed that he is a hothead and fails to follow instructions, further he fails to understand that hes been properly punished for certain actions. maybe having the enterprise reduced to slagged metal would make him think twice that there are forces out there that go beyond his ego.
in someways they are alike, in other ways they not even the same kirk.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Are you the AR version of @mirrorchaos ? You seem to be seething in less blind hatred than usual
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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I don't think they should be, given the premise. As you said, AR Kirk had a very different upbringing, which does (and SHOULD) effect that character. AR George Kirk, from what little we saw of him, was far more like Prime Kirk... so, take away that influence? You should get a snot-nosed brat that's lazy, skates by on his laurels, and has a real problem with authority.
hah! how little you know me
yeah, and then there is jj spock, he is more blinded by his emotions than he is by his logic at times, the prime spock would have great difficulty trying to find a balance in those emotions and logic, although he did try to purge them, it seems without much success. looks like spock and kirk in the jj side of things play off each other.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
The JJ-Haters will still hate, but even some of them seem to be warming to this movie.
Still, someone said that Trek was rending all weekend on Twitter. That can only be a good thing!
so you hating the haters actually makes you a hater. hmm not sure what the logic behind that one is.
as for the warming up to it? being particularly cagey, i am not sure yet as i have not seen the film and probably wont until the end of the year when its out on dvd.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Me calling them what they are makes me a hater? Sorry, but I was just cursed out elsewhere on the the internet for being a a fan of these movies... and that's not the first time that's happened. (Such is Internet, sadly.)
I have no problems with people who don't like these movies. Spew irrational hatred towards JJ Abrams for making a movie? Okay, life is short, but I won't be able to change your mind, so whatever. Insult Abrams AND the fans that like the movies, though?
Sorry, but coming from a fan base that upholds tolerance, acceptance, and peace... yeah.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
cursed? nope and your ignorance is not my concern when you so clearly spit that "hater" word out with no regard.
i also thought it was an nx class, it looks similar no question about that.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Hey, @mirrorchaos, I got news for you... I wasn't talking about you. You don't know me, and you certainly don't accompany me around the internet.
But go ahead, keep calling me ignorant about things YOU have no clue about... and let me know when you want to come down off of your high-horse.
The scene between Kirk and McCoy was my second favorite part of the trailer... sounds like a good character scene.
LOL Im sure they're not but the visual resemblance and my smartass nature demanded I go there
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1215954/a-new-trek-2017-rumor
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
That makes a whole lot of sense. Not that it makes any of the two better, but it makes sense, even from a production standpoint as you'd naturally hook into the most recent installment oif the franchise instead of the first.
@OP The trailer looks better, but it wasn't really the trailer to begin with that made this movie seem like a generic action flick. We now even have deep voiced wrinklyfaced villians - MArvel gets away with a lot of stuff, but I'd expect different from Star Trek.
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I don't even know if I can put my hooves on what it is that these films lack. For me personally I don't like the visuals, they seem borrowed from Star Wars and don't fit and I don't like the retelling of classic stories instead of doing something different (if they had followed the Kelvin maybe it wouldn't have been that bad, but reimagining classic characters never works). You can have an enjoyable action flick and still add some meaningful dialogue and message into them, the MCU movies do that well (the shows are better, though - I guess it's natural for a TV show to be a better device sor those things). 09 and ID however didn't achieve this, I'd agree with that.
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We all have known that, though... I mean, aside from the nuances of fandom that simultaneously new/bigger/better and familiar/continuity/depth... movies are not the place for long-form storytelling, and that has been the one lacking thing in the AR that has allowed the fan base to accept it, IMO. Comics are nice, but most fans won't read those.
I still think back to Abrams' original desire, to create a multi-platform mega-universe (films, TV, web content, games, comics)... oh, what might've been. And, no, it wouldn't have all been like the movies (action first, everything else last).
Maybe that's where they go with the reborn Star Wars universe. And just to add that in regards to JJ Abrams - the new Star Wars movie he directed was extremely good in my opinion. This has nothing to do with "Abrams bashing", there are movies that proof he knows how to do it and given the *right* material the films turn out to be very good. Star Trek however wasn't the right material for him and his vision of things.
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Oh, yeah, I wasn't taking that as "Abrams bashing."
As much as I love the Abrams movies, that's on my list of legit issues about the movies. I, personally, have taken the time to read some of the tie-in comics, so that likely helps me buy more into the universe... but, not everyone is willing to do that.
Now, the potential Abrams series wasn't going to have Pine & Quinto in it, but the famed "Captain Sulu" idea seemed likely for a moment... having fans get the weekly dose of universe-building would have gone a long way to support the "flash" of the summer films. Plus, Abrams would have handed off the series to someone well-versed in doing a good series (doubtful it would be Orci, too, because they both did that with Fringe... that show was in different hands for the majority of its run).
It's why I think I'm willing to give Lin & Pegg a shot, with this film... they still won't be able to do what you can do in a TV series, but Abrams can hand it off to someone that can run with the vision.