Is Overwhelming Force good?

kylethetrue

Does it add much DPS to Beam Overload? With and without lots of shield drain?

Does it add much DPS to High Yield? With and without lots of exotic damage?

Is there a point where High Yield with Overwhelming force is preferable to Torpedo Spread?

duncanidaho11

Its broken on beam overload. On high yield it's not going to cause a lot of damage (never tracked the DPS, but I can tell you it's not particularly noticeable) but the repulsion effect can be huge depending on the torp and skills. If you have, for example, the Adv. biomolec torpedo the shockwave chains to every target hit by the radiation AOE. It is absolutely hilarious to use this during CCA after some poor fool has tried to grav well. :P

So, it has its uses (ex. control builds wanting to do more with torps) but if DPS is your prime concern then there's better options to min-max with.

samt1996

It's amazing for science builds and only becomes more potent with the revamp. On THY you get free Photonic Shockwaves which can have 7-8 second disables each and with concentrate firepower becomes easily spammable.

narthais

The Beam overload Proc was supposed to have been fixed several months ago actually, the issue with that is its basically a Charged Particle Burst rank 1 and does bugger all even if you have high drain skills. Does look pretty though.

rattler2

I kinda combo'd Overwhelming Force with the trait off the Xindi-Primate Cruiser that gives an extra Beam Overload 1 when you use Beam Overload. ^^

samt1996

Your not the only one.

legendarylycan

does overwhelming force proc off [Over]? i already know Superweapon Ingenuity doesn't but Subsystem Redundancies does (and the former really should, if you're reading this, borticus)​​

tousseau

Hmmm... does Overwhelming Force work off of [Over]?

nikephorus

Yes it works off [over], but it's pretty underwhelming.

legendarylycan

so that's two traits that proc off [Over] and one that doesn't...yeah, i really think SI need to work with that mod too, plus whatever other traits out there work off BO​​

narthais

I'm running Overwhelming Force with the Dreadnought beam trait on one of my characters, front loading DBB with the [over] proc, its triggering an overload nearly every 5 seconds between using BO3 myself occasionally. its been working quite nicely for me. Not optimal for DPS, but the synergy there is nice.

nikephorus

Yeah I was running a build with 6 [over] beams and both traits... It looked real flashy, but only the dreadnought trait really seemed to be effective.

warmaker001b

Overwhelming Force, as it stands right now on Holodeck, is an Absolute Garbage Ability.

Charged Particle Burst effect, if it *IS* working, suffers from being one of the FlowCaps based aspects that don't scale well at all anywhere in the game. Not against player shields, not against NPC shields. It sucks bad the same way Tetryon Proc does, because it too does not scale well with this game.

The Photonic Shockwave-aspect from HYT fire for most of this game is useless. For one, the "shockwave" aspect is Kinetic damage. Unlike Tractor Beam Repulsors, Gravity Well that do Kinetic damage, PSW has zero shield bypassing capability. Shields take up that damage and the PSW effect does TRIBBLE for damage to the hull.

On top of that questionable damage capability, it shares the other characteristic of PSW... It knocks targets around in every compass direction. In a game where players are trying to use Gravity Well or other CC attacks to cluster or keep bunched up NPCs for easier AOE attacks some moron fires an Overwhelming Force+HYT buffed torpedo into that destroys that effort. NPCs are scattered all over the place, including towards the Transformer in ISA. Targets that have could have been easily all hit by a Torpedo Salvo or Cannon Scatter Volley now cannot do their magic because the targets are all over the place, including behind you.

Overwhelming Force is one of the stupidest, most useless, most counterproductive traits in this game and I shake my head anytime I see someone use it.

kylethetrue

Ah, So it doesn't really do much with beam overload right now?

nikephorus

Overwhelming force? It looks pretty. ;-) but yeah I've ran it pretty extensively and it's pretty ineffective.

e30ernest

As a player whose style revolves around control and torps, I find this trait rather annoying on HY. I like to bunch things up to maximize my torps firepower so pushing stuff all around the map is rather counterproductive.


I did try this out with an [Over] build to create some radiation procs from my Secondary Deflector. The CPB from Overwhelming Force did not seem to proc my deflector though but it's been a while since I've last tried it.

warmaker001b

kylethetrue wrote: »

Ah, So it doesn't really do much with beam overload right now?

It procs the Charged Particle Burst-like effect. The problem is that it's a Charged Particle Burst-like effect and sucks badly even on a dedicated FlowCaps build.

nikephorus

@warmaker001b for sure...I have very high level flow caps on the build I was using with overwhelming force and it basically did nothing. Expect look pretty. ;-) I can't overestimate how pretty it looked while being completely ineffective. ;-)

legendarylycan

this is all on holodeck though...charged particle burst got a boost to its base effectiveness - all ranks - on tribble; anyone test OF to see if its pseudo-CPB also got the boost? if it's linked in any way to CPB1, it likely did

EDIT: and another trait i just thought of...that web trait from the new mirror box (can't remember if it's off the tarantula or a seperate thing) that creates a mini web on use of BO - does that proc off [Over] shots?​​

samt1996

That's a good question I think it's time to do some science!

warmaker001b

shadowfang240 wrote: »

this is all on holodeck though...charged particle burst got a boost to its base effectiveness - all ranks - on tribble; anyone test OF to see if its pseudo-CPB also got the boost? if it's linked in any way to CPB1, it likely did

EDIT: and another trait i just thought of...that web trait from the new mirror box (can't remember if it's off the tarantula or a seperate thing) that creates a mini web on use of BO - does that proc off [Over] shots?​​

The trait is off the Tarantula lockbox ship. The trait is quite garbage because of a huge 45 second lockout.

legendarylycan

the isokinetic cannon has a SIXTY second lockout, doesn't hold targets and takes up 2 weapons and a console...i'd say the trait is superior even though it does its damage over time instead of all at once​​

samt1996

I'd have to agree.... the disable can be boosted pretty high on Tribble now.

warmaker001b

shadowfang240 wrote: »

the isokinetic cannon has a SIXTY second lockout, doesn't hold targets and takes up 2 weapons and a console...i'd say the trait is superior even though it does its damage over time instead of all at once​​

And between all the Delta Weapon Set items, you have 8 weapon slots, up to 11 console slots to fit it in.

Meanwhile, this trait takes up a precious 1 out of 5 Starship Trait Slots.

I see NPCs move around just fine with web effects on them all the time, even with the mighty Web Cannon console's effects on them. It's not like it used to be where they no TRIBBLE were held into inaction.

So I'd still say it's a pretty garbage trait.

samt1996

You are entitled to that opinion but from what I can see it is actually quite good on certain builds. I'm honestly tired of god-mode traits for every build I like having ones with specific uses.

legendarylycan

1 out of 4...nobody has that 5th slot unless they're absolutely DONE spending dilithium on that character

and what else are you going to stick on an exotic boat? emitter synergy maybe, but only feds have access to that; AHOD is a given, and all factions have access to it so that 1 down...and that's about all i can think of - every other trait is more useful for tanks, healers, carriers, drain boats or DPS

i suppose there's always the trait off the vet ship if you happen to be a vet, your exotic boat uses torpedoes and it also happens to have an energy weapon (admittedly, most are like that)

that's still only 2 slots out of 4(5), or 3 if you happen to be a fed - that leaves 1(2) slots free​​

samt1996

Reciprocity... still amazing.

legendarylycan

it's only amazing if your enemy manages to live long enough to actually fire weapons so they can miss - on high-end builds (including partigen ones) most enemies won't live long enough to get off more than a shot or two, if that​​

darkknightucf

shadowfang240 wrote: »

does overwhelming force proc off [Over]? i already know Superweapon Ingenuity doesn't but Subsystem Redundancies does (and the former really should, if you're reading this, borticus)​​

Yes. Also, HY torps work nicely with this, but it's situational until they fix the damage coefficient with Photonic Shockwave and Charged Particle Burst.

darkknightucf

warmaker001b wrote: »

Overwhelming Force, as it stands right now on Holodeck, is an Absolute Garbage Ability.

Charged Particle Burst effect, if it *IS* working, suffers from being one of the FlowCaps based aspects that don't scale well at all anywhere in the game. Not against player shields, not against NPC shields. It sucks bad the same way Tetryon Proc does, because it too does not scale well with this game.

The Photonic Shockwave-aspect from HYT fire for most of this game is useless. For one, the "shockwave" aspect is Kinetic damage. Unlike Tractor Beam Repulsors, Gravity Well that do Kinetic damage, PSW has zero shield bypassing capability. Shields take up that damage and the PSW effect does TRIBBLE for damage to the hull.

On top of that questionable damage capability, it shares the other characteristic of PSW... It knocks targets around in every compass direction. In a game where players are trying to use Gravity Well or other CC attacks to cluster or keep bunched up NPCs for easier AOE attacks some moron fires an Overwhelming Force+HYT buffed torpedo into that destroys that effort. NPCs are scattered all over the place, including towards the Transformer in ISA. Targets that have could have been easily all hit by a Torpedo Salvo or Cannon Scatter Volley now cannot do their magic because the targets are all over the place, including behind you.

Overwhelming Force is one of the stupidest, most useless, most counterproductive traits in this game and I shake my head anytime I see someone use it.

Let me give you a different scenario here.

DOff'd for Photonic Shockwave, Overwhelming Force (OF) paired with High Yield (HY) can cause a very hilarious Photonic Shockwave "ripple" that will do considerable damage when it is fixed. For those with strong GravGens on Holodeck, GravWells can still pull those targets back into the center, causing more damage (and a brief disable). Add Invasive Control Programming into the mix, and watch subsystem disables come into play.

Then, there's the fly-by's, where OF will keep your target in front of you. Constantly. Until it dies. Ask any person who's running a torp boat and flying to keep Defense up AND move to the next target AND stop the current target from unloading on you.

Then, there are PuG Lyfe runs where you can be on a ship with no GravWell, but you can keep the Sphere's/unwanted mobs away from a target/area (read, Spheres never make it to Transformers in ISA). One HY will do it. Two if you want to laugh some more.

I use it. I like it. It's fun. It's useful. If the damage coefficient is fixed, it'll do more damage (see other fixes needed for torps). Is it useful in every situation? No. Is it useful in some cases, yes, and VERY MUCH SO.

legendarylycan

and if the PSW repel is REALLY that big of a concern for some people, isn't there a doff that removes it and makes the AoE larger in exchange?​​