Resist it? BS. The NPCs cheat, period. The fact that there's no drain -- it's just GONE, is also BS. You can't prepare for or recover from it. You just are defenseless. End of story.
On top of that, not EVERY SHIP should have tachyon beam. It's not a standard loadout. On top of THAT glaring BS-ness, you have 20+ ships firing it all at once while you only have 1 HE and maybe 2 shield heals if you're lucky.
This is a major "TRIBBLE you!" to the players. It was presented under the guise of making it more useful for players. Bullflop. It was a major middle finger when all is said and done.
Please, I'd like to see the long list of ships out there with Tachyon Beam.
When you fire off your HE, it's a HOT effect... The NPCs can keep slamming you with TachBm but it won't matter, it will continuously get cleared :rolleyes:
It's probably about time people had to account for other things. I take it your hull resists are not up to snuff nor your immediate actions in protecting yourself against further effects of Drains are not up to snuff. Like a lot of people on here.
If you have HE, that should take care of the problem right away if you use it right. If it's on CD, good hull resists or abilities to give you those resists will cover you for the time being until you get yourself protected. Or maybe someone may help you out with a heal.
I did not expect a veteran player like you to have trouble with a simple Drain ability.
Edit:
The PVP crowd should know what to do in these cases. There's enough Science players out there that fly Drain Boats as well as guys flying builds that land lots of effects and hazards on you in an attempt to debilitate you for an easier kill. The PVPers have long dealt with lots of hazards.
110 Insulators dont really cut it against the whole mob. The problem isnt that a single TB does much, the problem it comes in mobs and the one with the dps will draw agro.
I propose: The Threatmechanic should be revamped: The one with the least dps should have the most aggro. That would make pugs even more fun. /irony
110 Insulators dont really cut it against the whole mob. The problem isnt that a single TB does much, the problem it comes in mobs and the one with the dps will draw agro.
I propose: The Threatmechanic should be revamped: The one with the least dps should have the most aggro. That would make pugs even more fun. /irony
Hrmm, if threat only worked off of actual threat...where it was actually DPS...and not me flying around with my [+Th] consoles, using Attract Fire, and so forth to inflate my threat artificially...
...it leaves me feeling like I'm a wee bird puffin' out my chest and telling yo momma jokes at the Borg.
So what are you going to do about it??? some more?
The ways to resist it are there. The immediate action to take to STOP the drain is there. Or are you angry that you actually have to worry about your hull resists now? Are you angry that you have to take an immediate action against a serious danger and not just faceroll it?
First of all I'm not angry, more like annoyed/irritated. I don't see the point in putting any more points into Power Insulators as the 150 odd points I do have don't seem to be having any kind of affect as it is now!
Could you elaborate further on where you stand on this topic as I'm finding it hard to understand exactly what your position is and therefore where your coming from with your arguments.
The PVP crowd should know what to do in these cases. There's enough Science players out there that fly Drain Boats as well as guys flying builds that land lots of effects and hazards on you in an attempt to debilitate you for an easier kill. The PVPers have long dealt with lots of hazards.
But not so much in the PVE crowd it seems
Never mind my previous post I get it now! :rolleyes:
Yeah, after experienceing this new drain, I changed a few things, First the Delta shield 50% Drain Resistance...hmm. not good enough.
Slapped on a Particle Field exciter with 40 Something Plasma resist. Changed a few skills, Added Rally Point III to my Command ship. And made sure to leave them Rally Points where a couple teammates would be for the Clusters.
Took in 70% of the Overall Damage and hits. And did 79% of outgoing heals and such. Felt good. Like a reason for a Healing/Tank to exist. lol.
I was concerned exactly about this (and inertial dampeners) situation happening whenever we get the skillpoint revamp, but it seems like the drain-spam issue has already surfaced by other means..
I'm still on the fence about the overall implications of the change; but it's clear that it benefits the (inflated) NPCs a LOT more than it does the players.
Yup, sci captains playing pure sci in STFs are always frowned upon. I'd be perfectly fine if they did both of those.
FYI - The spheres do still use EPtE, but it was nerfed compared to the payers version in terms of length.
In ISA where i play i don't even notice EPTE on spheres. cant even read their buffs because of fast dying, but even if they do is not noticeable at all.
Try Elite patrol in delta quadrant with borg in. Well, those spheres are what i imagine borg should be in space combat.
Hrmm, if threat only worked off of actual threat...where it was actually DPS...and not me flying around with my [+Th] consoles, using Attract Fire, and so forth to inflate my threat artificially...
...it leaves me feeling like I'm a wee bird puffin' out my chest and telling yo momma jokes at the Borg.
Well, at least ST can explain why you can enhance your threat like that and it is not magically bestowed upon you.
If you adjust your build AWAY from your 30-50K DPS builds, your shields will do fine. Those [Pla] embassy consoles instead of the shield repair ones aren't doing you any favors. My ship ran two ISAs and its shields did fine.
I dont think slotting a single powerins doesnt affect dps that much That aside, I have seen today, that from 30-50k you dont really need shields. A silver of it maybe, but the rest you can just migitade and heal.
The shieldrepairs ones are laughable in their performance.
Hrmm, if threat only worked off of actual threat...where it was actually DPS...and not me flying around with my [+Th] consoles, using Attract Fire, and so forth to inflate my threat artificially...
...it leaves me feeling like I'm a wee bird puffin' out my chest and telling yo momma jokes at the Borg.
Let's base threat on ship size and number of weapons. Total volume displaced times number of energy weapons = threat. Or, bonus point if you make it % of target's viewscreen blocked out times number of visible shots leaving your ship at a time. That gives credit for distance to target and FAW. :P
SCM - Crystal C. (S) - [00:12] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 8.63M(713.16K) - Fed Sci
Never mind my previous post I get it now! :rolleyes:
So you get how to counteract against the stronger NPC Tachyon Beams? Or are you going to be like many in this thread that will stamp their feet in anger that they have to do something else against these attacks?
I said what I said because it's a very simple and true observation. If it seems like a PVP vs PVE thing, it is... Because the PVP crowd is used to seeing very heavy hazards landing, in particular from some Science-heavy builds. If you didn't know how to resist and/or counter those, you were going to die. But PVE?... Other than the high end Borg Plasma DOTs, until now, what other Hazards in this game did the NPCs do on you on a regular basis that you had to take proper action against it or risk destruction?
NONE. ZILCH. ZERO.
Believe it or not, SPACEbar does not resolve all issues in STO's combat. The PVE in this game does absolutely NOTHING to prepare you for more serious threats, as this thread and the complainers has excellently shown. Most esp so with some coming from veteran players that have been around a while but seem to not be aware of how to clear a simple hazard, which Tachyon Beam basically is.
As I've said before, the means to counteract these drains are already there in the game, and can be done so with even Ensign level abilities. Not to mention the other means on removing hazards that have always existed in STO. Your shields will drop... Yes, but you can take immediate actions to remove the hazard and get your shields back up to protect your hull. Or you can have a variant on that and have your hull resists (remember those guys???) protecting you until your hazard removal abilities are back.
But by all means, continue to stamp your feet in anger.
I have both I and II Reverse shields. Almost bloody useless as they almost drain the shields faster then it can buff. Same with Shield Regen.
Lol, well, if if they aren't shooting at you with energy beams then yes, that will happen. RSP is also useless if someone drains your shield power to zero.
Lol, well, if if they aren't shooting at you with energy beams then yes, that will happen. RSP is also useless if someone drains your shield power to zero.
#PvPLessonsForPvEHeroes
Oh, hey! There's that Command Spec ability for "Captain Save A Ho" that can be used to save someone's behind also
NPC mechanics are like players ones except for bosses. If their Tachyon Beam seems too much, throw a powerful Tykens 3 at the mob and the drain becomes negligible because of low to no Aux. If their Siphon Lasts too long (I wish they buffed it on Been NPCs) then hit Aux and the length it lasts gets drastically cut.
Frankly I'm very glad the spheres got a science buff. Makes people actually have to think a bit more than just FAW and destroy.
Hell, I'll give you a new one. Drop a couple of the fixed AA consoles after Thursday.
Let's base threat on ship size and number of weapons. Total volume displaced times number of energy weapons = threat. Or, bonus point if you make it % of target's viewscreen blocked out times number of visible shots leaving your ship at a time. That gives credit for distance to target and FAW. :P
Still find it funny that targetable torpedoes explode on contact with the hit box of an enemy on the way to the intended target while non-targetable torpedoes fry right through other enemies to get there. Yeah, the resource requirements to put a collider around everything would...cause problems.
So you get how to counteract against the stronger NPC Tachyon Beams? Or are you going to be like many in this thread that will stamp their feet in anger that they have to do something else against these attacks?
It seems to me you're the one with the anger issue, at least that's how your posts are coming across, as I said before I'm not angry, at most I'm frustrated. I can assure you there won't be any foot stamping, angry or otherwise where I am concerned! :P
Personally I would like to hear from the Devs about whether the buff to the Borg/NPC Tachyon Beam is working as intended. If it is then fine, if it's not then I would like to see the Borg/NPC version fixed/nerfed without undoing the buff to the player version. :cool:
So I did some tests now after reading all those advices here. Using HEM to clean shield drain did work on the borg shield neutralizer, but the neutralizer is a joke compared with the TB. TB seems not to be affected by HEM. I could be wrong about this, but I could not restore shields with HEM and non RSP shield heals.
Using those new command abilities is not an option on my dkora. Rep and personal traits do help a bit of course, but not enough to be a real tank. I could do some hull tanking, but I am always feeling a bit like gambling with this. I am getting too often more than one of those mega torp crits.
I dont like that change and have not the feeling that it does improve gameplay. But if players like it, that seems to be a problem on my side. So conclusion for me, I will simply unslot most of my heals, increase my DPS again and stop pugging.
It seems to me you're the one with the anger issue, at least that's how your posts are coming across, as I said before I'm not angry, at most I'm frustrated. I can assure you there won't be any foot stamping, angry or otherwise where I am concerned! :P
Personally I would like to hear from the Devs about whether the buff to the Borg/NPC Tachyon Beam is working as intended. If it is then fine, if it's not then I would like to see the Borg/NPC version fixed/nerfed without undoing the buff to the player version. :cool:
I'm just pointing out how amusing it is how many players in this game, including some veterans players, have no clue what to do in removing a very basic hazard.
The counters to hazards are there... Easy to carry out. Matter of fact, people probably already knew the basics to removing hazards already due to the Borg Plasma DOTs I mentioned and did not realize the very same thing will save you from these Tachyon Beams. Instead, people are flying around here that it's an affront to the players, it's a conspiracy by Cryptic to get you to get Command related TRIBBLE.
You don't even need Command vessels to counter this. You don't even need Command Specialization abilities to counter this. You don't even need one single point into Command/Intel to counter this. What one needs is knowing what their fundamental abilities do and what's happening to their ship, then acting on it.
I'm laughing at all the panic going on as if a bunch of Tovan Khevs are screaming that it's a conspiracy against them. It's Basic STO Gameplay 101 to remove hazards. Nothing fancy.
I'm just pointing out how amusing it is how many players in this game, including some veterans players, have no clue what to do in removing a very basic hazard.
...snip...
I'm laughing at all the panic going on as if a bunch of Tovan Khevs are screaming that it's a conspiracy against them. It's Basic STO Gameplay 101 to remove hazards. Nothing fancy.
You're right. Using ST/HE to remove Dots/Tachyon is nothing new. When that actually has no effect on my survivability, however, I start to take issue with it.
SCM - Crystal C. (S) - [00:12] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 8.63M(713.16K) - Fed Sci
I'm just pointing out how amusing it is how many players in this game, including some veterans players, have no clue what to do in removing a very basic hazard.
I wasn't even aware that this was categorized as a hazard.
I'm not complaining about the changes; they're noticeable but not totally game breaking.
But, the game desperately needs better documentation found in-game, and the developers need to completely abandon the concept that keeping mechanics hidden is beneficial in any way.
by no less than SEVEN spheres using TB on me at the same time.
Yeah, that's an issue.
Similar to how crew seems like such a garbage mechanic, when really the NPCs populating content just have an overload of crew-slaughtering mechanics, with 1+ on low cooldown on every NPC.
"Tolerance and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society." - Aristotle
What's this, a change that makes the Borg like the Borg? An unstoppable force?
Now they just need to give each sphere 5 million hit points, an incredibly fast regeneration and a cutting beam that destroys your ship in 3 seconds and we'll really have some fun!!!!!
It's kind of hard to come up with a better tactic than having high base hull and shields, coupled with high shield and hull resist, high defense, high hull and shield hps, and ST/HE on global, when trying to tank the borg.
SCM - Crystal C. (S) - [00:12] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 8.63M(713.16K) - Fed Sci
Comments
Please, I'd like to see the long list of ships out there with Tachyon Beam.
When you fire off your HE, it's a HOT effect... The NPCs can keep slamming you with TachBm but it won't matter, it will continuously get cleared :rolleyes:
It's probably about time people had to account for other things. I take it your hull resists are not up to snuff nor your immediate actions in protecting yourself against further effects of Drains are not up to snuff. Like a lot of people on here.
If you have HE, that should take care of the problem right away if you use it right. If it's on CD, good hull resists or abilities to give you those resists will cover you for the time being until you get yourself protected. Or maybe someone may help you out with a heal.
I did not expect a veteran player like you to have trouble with a simple Drain ability.
Edit:
The PVP crowd should know what to do in these cases. There's enough Science players out there that fly Drain Boats as well as guys flying builds that land lots of effects and hazards on you in an attempt to debilitate you for an easier kill. The PVPers have long dealt with lots of hazards.
But not so much in the PVE crowd it seems
... Cuz hull tanking actually requires consoles other then the ones Cryptic's trying to sell you ...
I propose: The Threatmechanic should be revamped: The one with the least dps should have the most aggro. That would make pugs even more fun.
Hrmm, if threat only worked off of actual threat...where it was actually DPS...and not me flying around with my [+Th] consoles, using Attract Fire, and so forth to inflate my threat artificially...
...it leaves me feeling like I'm a wee bird puffin' out my chest and telling yo momma jokes at the Borg.
Could you elaborate further on where you stand on this topic as I'm finding it hard to understand exactly what your position is and therefore where your coming from with your arguments.
Slapped on a Particle Field exciter with 40 Something Plasma resist. Changed a few skills, Added Rally Point III to my Command ship. And made sure to leave them Rally Points where a couple teammates would be for the Clusters.
Took in 70% of the Overall Damage and hits. And did 79% of outgoing heals and such. Felt good. Like a reason for a Healing/Tank to exist. lol.
And did 30k. So I like it.
I was concerned exactly about this (and inertial dampeners) situation happening whenever we get the skillpoint revamp, but it seems like the drain-spam issue has already surfaced by other means..
I'm still on the fence about the overall implications of the change; but it's clear that it benefits the (inflated) NPCs a LOT more than it does the players.
In ISA where i play i don't even notice EPTE on spheres. cant even read their buffs because of fast dying, but even if they do is not noticeable at all.
Try Elite patrol in delta quadrant with borg in. Well, those spheres are what i imagine borg should be in space combat.
Super SpecialStar Trek Online Review
SpecialTemporal PUG 100K DPS Build
We are Travelers
Well, at least ST can explain why you can enhance your threat like that and it is not magically bestowed upon you.
I dont think slotting a single powerins doesnt affect dps that much
The shieldrepairs ones are laughable in their performance.
Let's base threat on ship size and number of weapons. Total volume displaced times number of energy weapons = threat. Or, bonus point if you make it % of target's viewscreen blocked out times number of visible shots leaving your ship at a time. That gives credit for distance to target and FAW. :P
SCM - Hive (S) - [02:31] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 30.62M(204.66K) - Fed Sci
Tacs are overrated.
Game's best wiki
Build questions? Look here!
Yes, because I'm amplifying my weapons signature and you're trying (albeit unsuccessfully) to nullify yours.
SCM - Hive (S) - [02:31] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 30.62M(204.66K) - Fed Sci
Tacs are overrated.
Game's best wiki
Build questions? Look here!
So you get how to counteract against the stronger NPC Tachyon Beams? Or are you going to be like many in this thread that will stamp their feet in anger that they have to do something else against these attacks?
I said what I said because it's a very simple and true observation. If it seems like a PVP vs PVE thing, it is... Because the PVP crowd is used to seeing very heavy hazards landing, in particular from some Science-heavy builds. If you didn't know how to resist and/or counter those, you were going to die. But PVE?... Other than the high end Borg Plasma DOTs, until now, what other Hazards in this game did the NPCs do on you on a regular basis that you had to take proper action against it or risk destruction?
NONE. ZILCH. ZERO.
Believe it or not, SPACEbar does not resolve all issues in STO's combat. The PVE in this game does absolutely NOTHING to prepare you for more serious threats, as this thread and the complainers has excellently shown. Most esp so with some coming from veteran players that have been around a while but seem to not be aware of how to clear a simple hazard, which Tachyon Beam basically is.
As I've said before, the means to counteract these drains are already there in the game, and can be done so with even Ensign level abilities. Not to mention the other means on removing hazards that have always existed in STO. Your shields will drop... Yes, but you can take immediate actions to remove the hazard and get your shields back up to protect your hull. Or you can have a variant on that and have your hull resists (remember those guys???) protecting you until your hazard removal abilities are back.
But by all means, continue to stamp your feet in anger.
Lol, well, if if they aren't shooting at you with energy beams then yes, that will happen. RSP is also useless if someone drains your shield power to zero.
#PvPLessonsForPvEHeroes
Oh, hey! There's that Command Spec ability for "Captain Save A Ho" that can be used to save someone's behind also
Frankly I'm very glad the spheres got a science buff. Makes people actually have to think a bit more than just FAW and destroy.
Hell, I'll give you a new one. Drop a couple of the fixed AA consoles after Thursday.
Still find it funny that targetable torpedoes explode on contact with the hit box of an enemy on the way to the intended target while non-targetable torpedoes fry right through other enemies to get there. Yeah, the resource requirements to put a collider around everything would...cause problems.
Personally I would like to hear from the Devs about whether the buff to the Borg/NPC Tachyon Beam is working as intended. If it is then fine, if it's not then I would like to see the Borg/NPC version fixed/nerfed without undoing the buff to the player version. :cool:
Using those new command abilities is not an option on my dkora. Rep and personal traits do help a bit of course, but not enough to be a real tank. I could do some hull tanking, but I am always feeling a bit like gambling with this. I am getting too often more than one of those mega torp crits.
I dont like that change and have not the feeling that it does improve gameplay. But if players like it, that seems to be a problem on my side. So conclusion for me, I will simply unslot most of my heals, increase my DPS again and stop pugging.
I'm just pointing out how amusing it is how many players in this game, including some veterans players, have no clue what to do in removing a very basic hazard.
It's amusing! Esp with the complaints that it's a "major TRIBBLE you!" to the players. Or that it's a CONSPIRACY by Cryptic to make you buy the Command Cruisers or whatever.
The counters to hazards are there... Easy to carry out. Matter of fact, people probably already knew the basics to removing hazards already due to the Borg Plasma DOTs I mentioned and did not realize the very same thing will save you from these Tachyon Beams. Instead, people are flying around here that it's an affront to the players, it's a conspiracy by Cryptic to get you to get Command related TRIBBLE.
You don't even need Command vessels to counter this. You don't even need Command Specialization abilities to counter this. You don't even need one single point into Command/Intel to counter this. What one needs is knowing what their fundamental abilities do and what's happening to their ship, then acting on it.
I'm laughing at all the panic going on as if a bunch of Tovan Khevs are screaming that it's a conspiracy against them. It's Basic STO Gameplay 101 to remove hazards. Nothing fancy.
You're right. Using ST/HE to remove Dots/Tachyon is nothing new. When that actually has no effect on my survivability, however, I start to take issue with it.
SCM - Hive (S) - [02:31] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 30.62M(204.66K) - Fed Sci
Tacs are overrated.
Game's best wiki
Build questions? Look here!
I'm not complaining about the changes; they're noticeable but not totally game breaking.
But, the game desperately needs better documentation found in-game, and the developers need to completely abandon the concept that keeping mechanics hidden is beneficial in any way.
Yeah, that's an issue.
Similar to how crew seems like such a garbage mechanic, when really the NPCs populating content just have an overload of crew-slaughtering mechanics, with 1+ on low cooldown on every NPC.
Now they just need to give each sphere 5 million hit points, an incredibly fast regeneration and a cutting beam that destroys your ship in 3 seconds and we'll really have some fun!!!!!
It's kind of hard to come up with a better tactic than having high base hull and shields, coupled with high shield and hull resist, high defense, high hull and shield hps, and ST/HE on global, when trying to tank the borg.
SCM - Hive (S) - [02:31] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 30.62M(204.66K) - Fed Sci
Tacs are overrated.
Game's best wiki
Build questions? Look here!
100+ speed Manasa (console from Astika), Delta rep trait 25% speed + trait forn Eclipce...
Fly like an Angel :cool: