Spider-Man now in the MCU

artan42

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I'm in two minds about this. One one hand, moving Spider-Man into the MCU in any form is fantastic, though I would actually preferred a Netflix series on him rather than a film, it now cuts the film universe down to two (X-Men and MCU).

My main issues however are :REBOOT!!!!! and recast :mad:. The first TAS film was good, the second was okay (I think a Daredevil style directors cut might have saved it), the main issue everybody had with the first film was the fact it was a reboot. Also the two films did fit seamlessly into the MCU anyway, so TRIBBLE a reboot, if you must, just do a 'the other Darrin' and replace any actors you need to keep the previous two films in continuity.
Secondly, for me, Andrew Garfield IS Peter Parker / Spider-Man, in the same way Hugh Jackman, Sir Patrick Stewart, and, Sir Ian Mckellen are intrinsically their roles, I'll just have a hard time seeing anyone else in that role.

Edit: Actually, having seen the new stand alone film date, there's another thing. It's bumping up all my other films :sad:, I want my Captain Marvel film, it hasn't even had its lead actor announced yet, it's such a shame Marvels first female lead film (and worlds first good female lead superhero film) is getting further and further away. I'd like them to swap it with GotG 2 ideally.

Now let's just tie the new Fantastic Four film into the MCU and call it a draw,... well until someone sorts out who owns Namor this week :P.

grylak

This makes my Spidey-Sense tingle all warm and fuzzy. I was hoping Garfield would be allowed to stay, but eh.


I've just thought of what would make a brilliant after credit scene for Ultron now. One of the Avengers, probably Cap, is walking down the street when he hears some gunshots nearby. As he run there, all we hear is a couple of THWICK's and some guys screaming. Cap rounds the corner to see the goons tied up in webbing, hanging from some street lights. Cap just responds with a "Huh."

jonsills

Since we have Ultimate Nick Fury in the MCU, and elements of the Ultimates in the movie Avengers, and since they've been willing to buck expectations with casting before, I hope (although I'm not holding my breath) that the Spider-Man we see in the Marvel movies is Miles Morales.

hawkwing43

Awwww I was going to post this news. lol

Oh well, I will post this update.

Update: Marvel Studios and Disney have announced the new release schedule for their films, based on the Spider-Man news. Four films have new release dates, starting with Thor: Ragnarok, shifting to November 3, 2017. Black Panther hits on July 6, 2018. Captain Marvel moves to November 2, 2018. Finally, Inhumans will now hit July 12, 2019, putting that film after the release of both parts of the two-part Avengers: Infinity War, which keeps its release dates of May 4, 2018 for Part 1, and May 3, 2019 for Part 2.

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eiledon

Now if only Fox would give up the ghost with Fantastic Four and let them go home. It is unlikely they would let x-men go unfortunately - still too much money to be wrung from it.

steamwright

Maybe its just an ego trip for them, but I've been puzzled why the various studios have not previously lined up to bring their controlled characters into alignment with the smoking-hot MCU. If you've been getting mediocre (read: greatly criticized, and sometimes weak box office) results doing it on your own, why not let the guys that know the characters best do it better and you reap the rewards?

I guess I do understand the X-guys holding out. The last two films were good, recovering rather nicely from several floundering efforts. But I suspect their days may be numbered. Regardless, Fantastic Four still needs the treatment.

worffan101

Days of Future Past, despite its issues and the Wolverine Publicity, was good. Even though Fassbender wasn't a tenth the Magneto Sir Ian McKellen is.

I want Age of Apocalypse to work out the Unfortunate Implications and give female characters bigger, more independent roles. And I want Sir Ian McKellen and Sir Patrick Stewart to work together to defeat Apocalypse in truly badass fashion, bickering like an old married couple along the way.

As for Spidey--I want him to just happen to be Latino. Not a Latino!Spidey, but a Spidey who's Latino under his mask and commands the exact same public opinion and attractiveness as White Spidey. If he meets up with Cap, Widow, and Falcon, so much the better.

steamwright

worffan101 wrote: »

I want Age of Apocalypse to work out the Unfortunate Implications and give female characters bigger, more independent roles. And I want Sir Ian McKellen and Sir Patrick Stewart to work together to defeat Apocalypse in truly badass fashion, bickering like an old married couple along the way.

As for Spidey--I want him to just happen to be Latino. Not a Latino!Spidey, but a Spidey who's Latino under his mask and commands the exact same public opinion and attractiveness as White Spidey. If he meets up with Cap, Widow, and Falcon, so much the better.

Regarding Age of Apocalypse, I loved the comic arc, and really want double-saber wielding Nightcrawler. I also want the fatal showdown between Nightcrawler and alternate Deadpool. Nightcrawler unleashed is one very dangerous hombre.

Not that he's been in a movie, but wasn't Spidey 2099 Latino? (Checks) Oh,yeah, Miguel O'Hara. So Latin/Irish. Great character. I wouldn't want to replace Peter Parker, nor make Parker a Latino, but I'd love a 2099 film.

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artan42

hawkwing43 wrote: »

Awwww I was going to post this news. lol

Well get up earlier then :P.

valoreah wrote: »

And no to an ethnic Spider-Man.

You realise that Caucasian is an ethnicity right?

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worffan101

valoreah wrote: »

IIRC neither Ian McKellen or Patrick Stewart will be in X-Men: AoA. Expect another "Wolverine and Friends" film.

Damn.

valoreah wrote: »

And no to an ethnic Spider-Man.

Why not? He's canon in the Ultimates universe, and may be canon in the super-reboot thing they're doing.

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worffan101

Why not make George Take be the next Professor X? That would be epic.

Literally every time you say "I don't see the point for making the SWM character X minority", I can say "Why not?"

artan42

worffan101 wrote: »

Why not make George Take be the next Professor X? That would be epic.

Literally every time you say "I don't see the point for making the SWM character X minority", I can say "Why not?"

They are exceptions to certain characters where you cant change a race, Black Panther for instance, having him be anything other than white would have unfortunate implications for him being king of an African country.
Or Magneto being anything other than a white European (I suspect the amount of non white, none Europeans killed in the holocaust was incredibly small, and that is the major part of his back story).
Or the Asguardians being played with anything other than (various attempts at :P ) English accents ('cos that's how you show something as being classical )

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hawkwing43

Well now that Spiderman will be part of the MU, under a Sony/ Disney deal, how far behind will it be from a Fox/ Disney deal to use a few of those other guys. Like..............Wolverine?

moonshadowdark

artan42 wrote: »

Secondly, for me, Andrew Garfield IS Peter Parker / Spider-Man, in the same way Hugh Jackman, Sir Patrick Stewart, and, Sir Ian Mckellen are intrinsically their roles, I'll just have a hard time seeing anyone else in that role.

Andrew Garfield was a terrible Peter Parker. He was a great Spiderman, but a poor Parker. His Peter was way to "indie cool". TAS had an entire montage of him SKATEBOARDING. Peter is supposed to be a shy, awkward teen who uses the mask to unveil his heroic and cool personality. That's why Tobey Maguire was a fantastic Peter Parker, but a flat Spiderman. He had no charisma or snark that made Spiderman pop. It's very diffucult to find an actor who can pull off both dynamics in a single character.

hawkwing43 wrote: »

Well now that Spiderman will be part of the MU, under a Sony/ Disney deal, how far behind will it be from a Fox/ Disney deal to use a few of those other guys. Like..............Wolverine?

I would prefer Wolverine just stay in Canada or Japan or Russia or slap him into the Negative Zone for Lee's sake. I don't ever want to see that furry little rage cage for a good LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG while.

artan42

moonshadowdark wrote: »

Andrew Garfield was a terrible Peter Parker. He was a great Spiderman, but a poor Parker. His Peter was way to "indie cool". TAS had an entire montage of him SKATEBOARDING. Peter is supposed to be a shy, awkward teen who uses the mask to unveil his heroic and cool personality. That's why Tobey Maguire was a fantastic Peter Parker, but a flat Spiderman. He had no charisma or snark that made Spiderman pop. It's very diffucult to find an actor who can pull off both dynamics in a single character.

Well each to their own, but I have no problem with him being slightly cooler than how he was in the comics, he really struck me as a person that would WANT to be Spider-Man, the introverted nerd played by Tobey Maguire never did. There's no reason to keep Parkers personality the same as in the comics if it makes more sense to the story (and modern times) to change him.

hawkwing43 wrote: »

Well now that Spiderman will be part of the MU, under a Sony/ Disney deal, how far behind will it be from a Fox/ Disney deal to use a few of those other guys. Like..............Wolverine?

I hope not, the X-Men need to stay their own separate universe separate from the MCU. Cross the Fantastic Four over, but not the X-Men, sharing the FF would let Marvel use Galactus and the Skruls for GotG 2.

moonshadowdark

artan42 wrote: »

Well each to their own, but I have no problem with him being slightly cooler than how he was in the comics, he really struck me as a person that would WANT to be Spider-Man, the introverted nerd played by Tobey Maguire never did. There's no reason to keep Parkers personality the same as in the comics if it makes more sense to the story (and modern times) to change him.

But one of the core elements of the character development of Spiderman is that he reaches moments of crisis where he wonders if he shouldn't be Spiderman. Spiderman holds the record of most times quitting than any other hero in the Marvel universe. He walks away because he realizes that with great power not only comes great responsibility, but even greater risk to the ones he loves. Garfield's Peter ended up being so out of character that even the ending of TAS spat in the face of that dynamic with that exchange about "Don't make promises you can't keep". He blatantly ignores Captain Stacey's final wishes and pursues Gwen solely because the "updated" Parker has no concept of struggle with his personas.

Peter wants to Spiderman, but Spiderman wants to be Peter. It's two personalities clashing with one another to prove which is the more ideal lifestyle they need to chose. It's that core concept that makes the character timeless.

artan42

moonshadowdark wrote: »

But one of the core elements of the character development of Spiderman is that he reaches moments of crisis where he wonders if he shouldn't be Spiderman. Spiderman holds the record of most times quitting than any other hero in the Marvel universe. He walks away because he realizes that with great power not only comes great responsibility, but even greater risk to the ones he loves. Garfield's Peter ended up being so out of character that even the ending of TAS spat in the face of that dynamic with that exchange about "Don't make promises you can't keep". He blatantly ignores Captain Stacey's final wishes and pursues Gwen solely because the "updated" Parker has no concept of struggle with his personas.

To be quite honest, that's the single worst character trait of any superhero I can think of, most of them have moments of self doubt, but for it to be a defining characteristic is a bit sad. 'Sides he does that anyway, at the end of Rise of Electro he spends months having quit until the Rhino starts his rampage.

gfreeman98

moonshadowdark wrote: »

Andrew Garfield was a terrible Peter Parker. He was a great Spiderman, but a poor Parker. His Peter was way to "indie cool".

Yes I had the same reaction: way too "hip". That and the fact there was no need for a reboot so soon, made me sour on the "new" Spiderman. (Watched the 1st one when it aired on broadcast TV, never saw the 2nd one.)

Grats to Marvel for bringing a major character back to their stable.

moonshadowdark

artan42 wrote: »

To be quite honest, that's the single worst character trait of any superhero I can think of, most of them have moments of self doubt, but for it to be a defining characteristic is a bit sad. 'Sides he does that anyway, at the end of Rise of Electro he spends months having quit until the Rhino starts his rampage.

After he got Gwen killed and even then, it was a shoe horned attempt to force the dynamic when, as you said, his "needed character development update" would have more likely had resulted in even higher casualty counts and he would have most likely sunk even deeper. It was a very strange attempt to return to the Parker/Spiderman dynamic after discarding it for the majority of the series.

And the constant quitting is actually a great trait, as it allows him to remember why he chose to be a hero to begin with. He spent his whole life being the underdog while everyone around him watched without helping him. The second he became an observer and let a crime happen despite knowing it was wrong, resulted in Uncle Ben's death and fueled his "I must help people because I have this great power" aspect that always keeps him going.

hawkwing43

well besides Spiderman, will we see any other Spiderman characters cross over too?

How about the following:

1. Jessica Drew: Spider-Woman - Didn't she work with S.H.I.E.L.D.?

2. J. Jonah Jameson - He's good for a like comic relief.

3. AGENT Venom - GotG anyone?

4. Black Cat - Well I think it's time for her to just show up in Spiderman Prime movie Period. Then cross over for light work in the MCU.

Not to speak of the different villians that could do a small cameo in the MCU.

moonshadowdark

hawkwing43 wrote: »

well besides Spiderman, will we see any other Spiderman characters cross over too?

How about the following:

1. Jessica Drew: Spider-Woman - Didn't she work with S.H.I.E.L.D.?

2. J. Jonah Jameson - He's good for a like comic relief.

3. AGENT Venom - GotG anyone?

4. Black Cat - Well I think it's time for her to just show up in Spiderman Prime movie Period. Then cross over for light work in the MCU.

Not to speak of the different villians that could do a small cameo in the MCU.

I think technically Spider-Woman is her own character, not a "canon" to Spiderman mythos. I'm surprised she hasn't been on AoS yet.

worffan101

TRIBBLE it, I want Spider-Gwen. She's awesome.

organicmanfred

hawkwing43 wrote: »

well besides Spiderman, will we see any other Spiderman characters cross over too?

How about the following:

1. Jessica Drew: Spider-Woman - Didn't she work with S.H.I.E.L.D.?

2. J. Jonah Jameson - He's good for a like comic relief.

3. AGENT Venom - GotG anyone?

4. Black Cat - Well I think it's time for her to just show up in Spiderman Prime movie Period. Then cross over for light work in the MCU.

Not to speak of the different villians that could do a small cameo in the MCU.

5. Julia Carpenter: Spider-Woman, Arachne.

organicmanfred

worffan101 wrote: »

TRIBBLE it, I want Spider-Gwen. She's awesome.

and won't survive either the series or the sales.

grylak

I want a proper venom done right. None of this agent venom, or gargan venom. Eddie Brock. Symbiote. As a dual entity. That uses we instead of I. And is the brutal defender of innocents. Hell, he'd be perfect as a recurring guest on agents of shield if they don't want to put him in a film. Or even have him clashing with punisher in his series! Awww heck, my mind is exploding with possibilities. Kraven could have a cameo in black panther. An unnamed bird guy gets taken down quickly in a pretty opening credits of ms marvel (who would obviously be the vulture). I know each character has their own rogues gallery to use, but have the odd Spidey villain cameo like that would be pretty sweet.

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