ya pretty much the way it looks at the moment, Exodus anyone? (hope to god not but good lord ...)
hate to say it but if it does die, i don't care who did or did not like anyone here or where ever, i will miss everyone, cuz i had fun with a lot of people, and i will never forget that.
heading to kabali to check stuff out, take care you guys...
I came back after a while of not playing. Got to lvl 63. Then the patch. I have spent 2 days trying to get lvl 64. Around 10 hours of game play. And am still 2 bubbles away. I have done all the missions available. Ran 2 or 3 stfs an hour. And I am creeping along.
This game has really become not fun to play. Hundreds of thousands of skill points to gain to level up. Missions that gave a bit more points but dont even meet the need.
Who came up with this idea? It is the worst decision they have made since launch. Nothing can match this in the scope of daftness.
I dont want to level up lightening fast from 50-60. I just want to have fun and the occasional challenge. Not put a brick on my keyboard and come back 3 months later to find I have gained only 2 levels.
I see the point of this "skill point update" it wasn't a numerical correction, it was a metric based decision. Metrics showing a lot of people skipping DR content and DoFFing their way to 60. So instead of addressing the lack of progression and admitting it was a F***ing stupid decision they stealth nerf DoFFing by "fixing" a numerical discrepancy.
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
Let me Imitate geko: "If you would take your time to level instead of wasting forum space, you retarding kid, you would level 17x faster".
Fantastic imitation, dont you think?^^
Well, I for one am happy to have all core alts on lv60, now I just observe the forums, and take bets when they... redesign their xp-tables. If they dont want to end STO with the 5 year anniversity, they have to do something.
I got 500 Specialization points for Battle of Kortez 500! What the flying ****! Are you ****ing kidding me Craptic. Fix this ****, i am sick of this TRIBBLE xp "updates"
I see the point of this "skill point update" it wasn't a numerical correction, it was a metric based decision. Metrics showing a lot of people skipping DR content and DoFFing their way to 60. So instead of addressing the lack of progression and admitting it was a F***ing stupid decision they stealth nerf DoFFing by "fixing" a numerical discrepancy.
Sure was. I'm one of those doffing my way to 60.
I don't like the DR content. I think it's poorly written, dull, and frustrating rather than challenging. It had no immersion, I don't care about any of the characters in it. So I did one toon but won't do the other eight. I would have if it was just boring yet quick, rather than a long slow boring grind.
And the really extra-stupid thing about it?
This new nerf of doff XP won't change that. I still won't play DR. I still find it boring, dull, and frustrating. I still won't level any of my toons through DR. The only difference is that it will take even longer for my other 8 toons to get to 60.
Seriously Geko, it's over. DR is a bust. It's a failure. It won't work. It can't be rescued. Move on before you drive everyone to other offerings, permanently.
So I've been busy in RL the past couple days, didn't take a look at this post or the patch notes... logged onto STO to grind some Argala... I'm sure most of you understand the confusion and disappointment that resulted.
Congradulations, you got your wish. Your math is completely wrong. You win one internet!
First, spell check is your friend. "Congradulations" = Congratulations. Normally I don't correct spelling, as I don't have high expectations from forum posters - except for those who are here to represent their company (ie you). Unprofessional posts are bad. Calling out someone for being wrong, when you clearly know what they are talking about (indicated in the quote below), is just, again, unprofessional, and makes you look clueless.
Now I dont know if you are considering SP from critter kills. That is certainly going to vary greatly if you kill a lot of critters versus another with few critters (and the Delta Patrols vary greatly and each time you play many of them generate a random number of waves). But remember critters also received an increase in proportion to the new requirements.
Of course everyone considers SP from critters. That is what makes up most of the SP from a patrol run. Would you rather have the ~944 SP from finishing a patrol, or the ~3500 SP from killing things in a patrol (using the pre-nerf Argala numbers)?
Anyway, that's enough from me regarding your post
Onto the reason I came here to begin with - I am what most would probably consider a whale. I've spent thousands on this game. Most recently, I dropped $100 just to upgrade my shotgun to epic (and open a few lockboxes). A week before that, I spent $100 just to put a bunch of dilithium in a T5 Fleet Starbase upgrade. I've upgraded all of my ship consoles to Epic Mk14, and had started the long process of upgrading everything else. Just before DR, I spent $300 to buy and sell keys, so I could afford to buy every single Voth ship - I had wanted to try out (yes, just try out) a battle cloaking science harassment build for PVP (battle cloak + GW + TBR + LV15 Sci trait + ton of PartGens = fun in PVP). Before that, I upgraded science to level 15 in a day just for the trait. I have a significant number of the lockbox ships, most of which were acquired through the expensive route of opening boxed instead of just buying with EC off the exchange. I'm of course a lifetimer.
My point: I have no problem dropping money into this game. I like trying new things. I enjoyed playing the game. I even didn't mind the grind so much. However, logging in today, and seeing the ridiculous choice made to nerf Specialization leveling even more, just pissed me off. And then logging onto the forums, and reading a post where the players are flat out lied to saying the rate of leveling won't change (hint: it has significantly changed)... I'm guess I'm not really angry, it's more of a feeling of disappointment, I had really enjoyed this game, I enjoyed DR, the new ships, intel powers, upgrades, ect. But now, it just seems that you don't want anyone to play the game, you just want them to hand over money for shiny ships...
I'll keep playing the game (I guess, not sure what I'll be doing though), but I am not spending any more money. I never thought I'd say that - Cryptic has made poor decisions in the past that have annoyed me and I've still made purchases on things that made the game fun... but now I've been annoyed badly enough to make me not WANT to spend money and not see the value in any of the new stuff released. Also, decisions like this make me concerned for the future of the game - why should I keep dropping money in STO if you're actively trying to kill it off? That just doesn't make sense.
If you decide to call this a bug, and fix the problem, cool, that *might* help me decide to start spending money again. But even then, I'd still be a little concerned, just because at this point, there's a pattern of you making decisions that are bad for the game, and bad for your revenue.
So I've been busy in RL the past couple days, didn't take a look at this post or the patch notes... logged onto STO to grind some Argala... I'm sure most of you understand the confusion and disappointment that resulted.
So here I am.
First, spell check is your friend. "Congradulations" = Congratulations. Normally I don't correct spelling, as I don't have high expectations from forum posters - except for those who are here to represent their company (ie you). Unprofessional posts are bad. Calling out someone for being wrong, when you clearly know what they are talking about (indicated in the quote below), is just, again, unprofessional, and makes you look clueless.
Of course everyone considers SP from critters. That is what makes up most of the SP from a patrol run. Would you rather have the ~944 SP from finishing a patrol, or the ~3500 SP from killing things in a patrol (using the pre-nerf Argala numbers)?
Anyway, that's enough from me regarding your post
Onto the reason I came here to begin with - I am what most would probably consider a whale. I've spent thousands on this game. Most recently, I dropped $100 just to upgrade my shotgun to epic (and open a few lockboxes). A week before that, I spent $100 just to put a bunch of dilithium in a T5 Fleet Starbase upgrade. I've upgraded all of my ship consoles to Epic Mk14, and had started the long process of upgrading everything else. Just before DR, I spent $300 to buy and sell keys, so I could afford to buy every single Voth ship - I had wanted to try out (yes, just try out) a battle cloaking science harassment build for PVP (battle cloak + GW + TBR + LV15 Sci trait + ton of PartGens = fun in PVP). Before that, I upgraded science to level 15 in a day just for the trait. I have a significant number of the lockbox ships, most of which were acquired through the expensive route of opening boxed instead of just buying with EC off the exchange. I'm of course a lifetimer.
My point: I have no problem dropping money into this game. I like trying new things. I enjoyed playing the game. I even didn't mind the grind so much. However, logging in today, and seeing the ridiculous choice made to nerf Specialization leveling even more, just pissed me off. And then logging onto the forums, and reading a post where the players are flat out lied to saying the rate of leveling won't change (hint: it has significantly changed)... I'm guess I'm not really angry, it's more of a feeling of disappointment, I had really enjoyed this game, I enjoyed DR, the new ships, intel powers, upgrades, ect. But now, it just seems that you don't want anyone to play the game, you just want them to hand over money for shiny ships...
I'll keep playing the game (I guess, not sure what I'll be doing though), but I am not spending any more money. I never thought I'd say that - Cryptic has made poor decisions in the past that have annoyed me and I've still made purchases on things that made the game fun... but now I've been annoyed badly enough to make me not WANT to spend money and not see the value in any of the new stuff released. Also, decisions like this make me concerned for the future of the game - why should I keep dropping money in STO if you're actively trying to kill it off? That just doesn't make sense.
If you decide to call this a bug, and fix the problem, cool, that *might* help me decide to start spending money again. But even then, I'd still be a little concerned, just because at this point, there's a pattern of you making decisions that are bad for the game, and bad for your revenue.
Anyway, I guess that's all I have to say.
Very well said. Maybe it's white noise when I say some of these things because I've been saying some of them for five years and I sometimes slip into anger when I say them. I slip into anger when I say them because I've followed Cryptic since Jack Emmert was manning a little table at Comic-Con before City of Heroes launched. I liked him then. I liked it when Ghost Widow would go around Pocket D handing out temporary titles to players. I liked badge hunting in the streets of Paragon City.
I actually started a thread back in 2006 or so on the City of Heroes forums saying how I wanted to see Cryptic take their engine and get the Star Trek MMO license, how I could see flight mechanics being adapted for ships and pet mechanics being adapted for away teams. I was practically laughed off the forums for that one.
I signed up for e-mail updates when Cryptic got the STO license.
When the game was in beta and getting mixed reviews, I personally contacted a few developers to propose them the idea of featured episodes (5 parts or so) in a cluster of space. And I pitched them on the idea of having those episodes offer a time limited reward for playing while they were new, which they could bring back as "re-runs" seasonally to raise interest during content lulls.
After launch, I reviewed the game. And my editor knocked it back three times until I dropped it from an A- to a C+. But I did everything I could to look at the work being done with a limited team because I admired the indy spirit at Cryptic.
I used to hang out in Podcast UGC chat and talk to Mark Valentine and Thomas about ideas.
After the Foundry launched, I applied for a job there. My application got lost in the stacks and I had a senior person ask me about why I hadn't applied. It got dusted off and I took the tests and went through the first round of interviews. I was tired, coming from a day of volunteering with kids, I think they really got tired of hearing me say the word "story".
That sense of investment is what has led me to become what you would call a whale. LTS, obviously, but there were times when friends went to the beach or cool cities that I said, "I want to support this Star Trek game. I like that it's casual and if they could just sink some more money into it, other people would see what I see in it." I dropped most comic books. Working on two master's degrees didn't leave me rich but I'd double coupon like mad to have a spare $20, $30, $50 to drop on the game. Tax refund time or when I could get some work on the side beyond my day job, I'd drop $200. Not for pixels but for satisfaction and a sense of luxury and to support an atmosphere I liked, same reason my other big entertainment expense is Starbucks and little independent coffeeshops.
'A lot HAS improved. There have been many fresh coats of paint applied to the game. I flipped by gourd over the Jem'Hadar gift boxes and suggested they needed a second chance currency in every box that could be used to buy similarly exotic ships and items. I know I've butted heads with the community and developers on occasion. Melted down. Had heated words with moderators and developers. Generally when I perceived people as being exploited by either Cryptic's business strategies or by groups of players in the game. You don't exploit people; you satisfy them. You don't do jokes that punch down. You don't mock the weak or the unstable. You don't laugh at pain or provoke it. And you don't run business like a machine that can be engineered by tightening the bolts. You don't celebrate and have cake parties financed by tightly engineered manipulation of service models that are built on systematic exploitation of human irrationality. You don't treat human behavior like code that needs to serve a function. You don't put shareholders above other stakeholders. It's the wrong way to live. It's a hollow way to operate. And I expect better, as frequently disappointing and frustrating as that is.
But what sardocian said, it's dead on for me. So if what I said is too intense, go reread sardocian's post.
what if i told you this is all a nefarious plan to sell more skill point boosters?
step 1) make leveling impossible unless you literally do nothing but play sto 24/7.
step 2) sell skill point boosters. 10000 exp for ~1000 zen, the other one's just padding.
step 3) 1 level is around 150k, so you need to buy 15 boosters. 15k zen for each level.
step 4) [not clear yet, but it has something to do with forcing players to pay ludicrous money for nothing]
step 5) money is printing itself! $$
Now clowns, that's another story. They scare the crap out of me.
We fight them too. Entire armies spilling out of Volkswagens.
We do our best to fight them off, but they keep sending them in.
With each passing day I wonder if I stepped into an alternate reality. The Cubs win the world series. Donald Trump is President. Britain leaves the EU. STO gets a dedicated PvP season. Engineers are "out of control" in STO.
I'd rather pay to buy my Spec points if that's the case. Even if it requires one character be at level 60 before I can even buy Spec points for other characters starting at level 50.
And I'd rather pay for more original T6 ships. And for more costumes. Sell us the damn Tal Shiar set already. And also sell Mirror Universe Skins for all existing and future faction ships and the right to use the ISS/ARW/AKS Registry Prefix.
And while they're at it, also sell us multi-faction T6 Dreadnought packs, which also include T6 versions of existing Lobi/Lockbox ships. Such as a T6 Voth Citadel Dreadnought pack with a T6 Voth Bulwark, Bastion, and Palisade or a Tholian T6 Tarantula Dreadnought with a Recluse and Orb Weaver.
My money is waiting. Cryptic just needs to provide the right incentive to have it.
I'd rather pay to buy my Spec points if that's the case. Even if it requires one character be at level 60 before I can even buy Spec points for other characters starting at level 50.
And I'd rather pay for more original T6 ships. And for more costumes. Sell us the damn Tal Shiar set already. And also sell Mirror Universe Skins for all existing and future faction ships and the right to use the ISS/ARW/AKS Registry Prefix.
And while they're at it, also sell us multi-faction T6 Dreadnought packs, which also include T6 versions of existing Lobi/Lockbox ships. Such as a T6 Voth Citadel Dreadnought pack with a T6 Voth Bulwark, Bastion, and Palisade or a Tholian T6 Tarantula Dreadnought with a Recluse and Orb Weaver.
My money is waiting. Cryptic just needs to provide the right incentive to have it.
So, you want Pay-2-Win!
That doesn't address the BS "skill point" update slash Nerf for all the other players. Just a opinion.
A lot HAS improved. There have been many fresh coats of paint applied to the game. I flipped by gourd over the Jem'Hadar gift boxes and suggested they needed a second chance currency in every box that could be used to buy similarly exotic ships and items. I know I've butted heads with the community and developers on occasion. Melted down. Had heated words with moderators and developers. Generally when I perceived people as being exploited by either Cryptic's business strategies or by groups of players in the game. You don't exploit people; you satisfy them. You don't do jokes that punch down. You don't mock the weak or the unstable. You don't laugh at pain or provoke it. And you don't run business like a machine that can be engineered by tightening the bolts. You don't celebrate and have cake parties financed by tightly engineered manipulation of service models that are built on systematic exploitation of human irrationality. You don't treat human behavior like code that needs to serve a function. You don't put shareholders above other stakeholders. It's the wrong way to live. It's a hollow way to operate. And I expect better, as frequently disappointing and frustrating as that is.
But what sardocian said, it's dead on for me. So if what I said is too intense, go reread sardocian's post.
For the most part I am in the same boat as you. I did not like the Jem'Hadar Chance Boxes. I am against gambling from an ethical and moral perspective, and just because other companies do it doesn't make it right to me. But I do understand the necessary evils of business.
That said, sometimes I think they go to the unnecessary evils because they feel they are in a No Win Scenario. They're damned if they do and they're damned if they don't. The moderators at PWE are on a volunteer basis. Despite the efforts of Smirk and Trendy, there is way more venom in the forums than there needs to be. When this exacerbates over years and years, people at Cryptic not only start feeling worn down by the sheer amount of player hatred... I think they get desensitized to it.
And I do mean that in a very literal sense. They know abuse from players is coming beforehand over every decision (literally EVERY decision) made, so I think mentally they keep themselves 'clocked out' simply because there's only so much abuse from your customers you can take as a human being.
I know I'm desensitized to it. I've seen plenty of dark corners in my life, and I know what continued exposure to it can do to you, despite your best intentions. If it doesn't turn you malicious, it turns you callous.
What I am getting at, is when Cryptic's moral compass starts acting weird... I see a problem. Because Cryptic was founded on not being like the other game studios. But I see these changes they go with... and I see the root of all evil involved, which is money. PWE shows them how to make way more money than before, and they go with it.
Because pissing off the customers is something they were doing even when they couldn't afford styrofoam cups for coffee during our own Year of Hell(tm), so if they're going to TRIBBLE us off... they might as well take comfort in the fact their budget is a lot larger than it used to be, right? It's inevitable.
We get the game we ask for. We're so polarized on so many issues that the STO community is more or less playing Trekball, with players on one side or the other without any kind of middle ground. Toxic vitriol didn't just creep in one day, it's been persistent. Cryptic takes note of our feedback and does what they are currently doing.
Which is making what I (and others) consider to be bad decisions because they pretty much do not care at this point. They're going to get venom no matter what, so to them it really does not matter if they go for broke and start selling $7 T5-U Upgrade tokens one month, and then a T6 version of the same ship the next. They don't care if double dipping is unpopular, because everything they do is unpopular according to the cacophany of the STO playerbase.
These skill point changes, and the spec point nerf, and whatnot... these are all just symptoms of a larger problem that Cryptic is maybe out of touch with the community, and maybe they have their reasons for being so out of touch. It's simply an unfortunate scenario for everybody involved. You, me, the forums, people at Cryptic, people at PWE, it's unfortunate for CBS Studios and it's unfortunate for the Star Trek fans out there who are caught in a crossfire between callous developers who are tired of being a punching bag, and rabid fanboys and fangirls who offer literally nothing to the table except their rabid froth.
And if people think CBS Studios is going to greenlight another Star Trek MMO? They're even more delusional than I give them credit for. The STO players who want the game to die don't deserve another Star Trek MMO. If STO gets shut down or put on maintenance mode? This is probably it. We will have proven to the world, and to the video game industry that we aren't deserving of a Star Trek MMO.
That said, sometimes I think they go to the unnecessary evils because they feel they are in a No Win Scenario. They're damned if they do and they're damned if they don't.
If you damned if you do and damned if you don't? Then don't.
Let the band play on. Fiddle while Rome burns. Call up your bankruptcy lawyers. Walk out on the quarterly earnings report. Turn on, tune in, drop out.
If you damned if you do and damned if you don't? Then don't.
Let the band play on. Fiddle while Rome burns. Call up your bankruptcy lawyers. Walk out on the quarterly earnings report. Turn on, tune in, drop out.
I think it clashes with their genuine good intention to create a really awesome Star Trek game, which I do think is important to them. The amount of care and detail poured into the game is something I can't deny.
I just think when it comes to punishing the players through these questionable decisions, it's out of callousness to the inevitable player abuse, rather than genuine malice.
I think it clashes with their genuine good intention to create a really awesome Star Trek game, which I do think is important to them. The amount of care and detail poured into the game is something I can't deny.
I just think when it comes to punishing the players through these questionable decisions, it's out of callousness to the inevitable player abuse, rather than genuine malice.
I wish they didn't feel like they had to, or that it didn't matter if they did or not.
It's like being on the receiving end of the Boy Who Cried Wolf.
When your playerbase makes a battleground over everything, it's incredibly to difficult what negative criticism is legit and which negative criticism isn't.
At that point... they go down the pathway of what their metrics and profit margins say.
That said, sometimes I think they go to the unnecessary evils because they feel they are in a No Win Scenario. They're damned if they do and they're damned if they don't. The moderators at PWE are on a volunteer basis. Despite the efforts of Smirk and Trendy, there is way more venom in the forums than there needs to be. When this exacerbates over years and years, people at Cryptic not only start feeling worn down by the sheer amount of player hatred... I think they get desensitized to it.
If I read any further, I swear to you, I will get very choked up. Honestly, there could be tears.
Seriously, though, I think you got this figured backwards. It's really very simple: the people don't want the outrageous monetizing, Cryptic does it anyway. People want them to fix bugs, Cryptic gives them more grind. Cryptic is showing, time and again, they don't give a Targ's behind about what people think of the direction this game has taken. And this sheer contemptuous attitude towards their playerbase is simply adding up, accruing resentment over time, up to where people get totally desensitized to whatever Cryptic says, trusting almost nothing any more -- a situation you then turn around and translate to "Damned if they do and damned if they don't."
Trust me, though, if they actually DIDN'T do the ever-more ridiculous monetizing, for a change, no one would complain. Nary a one. Problem is just that they're stuck on DO.
That doesn't address the BS "skill point" update slash Nerf for all the other players. Just a opinion.
<redacted>
It's actually Pay-4-Convenience. Just like buying Dilithium to speed up R&D or upgrades. As I said, I wouldn't mind a little work for it (reaching level 60 on one character, and any character besides that one has to be level 50 minimum if I want to buy skill points for them). I also don't mind restrictions; such as it's limited to buying 10 Skill points (5 max per character) per week.
It doesn't cut into Cryptic's bottom line, since they did away with the Dilithium rewards for leveling up after getting all 60 Spec points. It's also more likely to make money than selling worthless XP boosters (I'd rather pay for things like hour long to 24 hour long 2x XP boosts that only count down for as long as I'm logged in on a character that most all other MMOs have).
The above stuff are just theoretical suggestions anyway, since I doubt Cryptic is desperate enough to capitalize on that easy source of money.
Do I want Cryptic to go and double check their coding and properly give the necessary XP increase from killing NPCs to keep to their intention of an illusion of leveling up faster? Hell yes.
But do I expect them to do so until December (since Thanksgiving is next week) if at all? Hell no.
If I read any further, I swear to you, I will get very choked up. Honestly, there could be tears.
Seriously, though, I think you got this figured backwards. It's really very simple: the people don't want the outrageous monetizing, Cryptic does it anyway. People want them to fix bugs, Cryptic gives them more grind. Cryptic is showing, time and again, they don't give a Targ's behind about what people think of the direction this game has taken. And this sheer contemptuous attitude towards their playerbase is simply adding up, accruing resentment over time, up to where people get totally desensitized to whatever Cryptic says, trusting almost nothing any more -- a situation you then turn around and translate to "Damned if they do and damned if they don't."
Trust me, though, if they actually DIDN'T do the ever-more ridiculous monetizing, for a change, no one would complain. Nary a one. Problem is just that they're stuck on DO.
I think that's all incorrect. Players don't want anything. If Cryptic does A, players complain B, C, D, E, and F aren't addressed and they're evil for doing so. If Cryptic does B, they complain A, C, D, E, and F aren't addressed and they're dumb and evil for not knowing that from before. If Cryptic tries to half-TRIBBLE C, D, and E, then players think they're incompetent for half-assing C, D, and E, and then not addressing A, B, and F.
So on, and so forth. Compile that over 4 years and you have our current situation regarding their questionable decision making.
Yes, because even going by what your metrics and profit margins say is in of itself a negative criticism.
And it all clashes with their good intentions. The road to hell, etc.
With the current progression mechanics the road to hell is a really long road, and I don't think there are enough good intentions available at this point to get there without repeating them a LOT. :P
With each passing day I wonder if I stepped into an alternate reality. The Cubs win the world series. Donald Trump is President. Britain leaves the EU. STO gets a dedicated PvP season. Engineers are "out of control" in STO.
Comments
omg LOLOLOL!!! this is awesome!! that was great lol! wow lol ...
Jumbo Shrimp = Lobster
Honest Politician = Dead Man Walking
That was VERY funny!
Oh that is perfect!! Dam I'm still laughing! No no wait I feel deep sadness coming on...oh no that wasn't fiction...it was...REALITY!!
Flat out sad when the forums are more entertaining than the game is.
Would you recommend STO to a friend?
ya pretty much the way it looks at the moment, Exodus anyone? (hope to god not but good lord ...)
hate to say it but if it does die, i don't care who did or did not like anyone here or where ever, i will miss everyone, cuz i had fun with a lot of people, and i will never forget that.
heading to kabali to check stuff out, take care you guys...
I came back after a while of not playing. Got to lvl 63. Then the patch. I have spent 2 days trying to get lvl 64. Around 10 hours of game play. And am still 2 bubbles away. I have done all the missions available. Ran 2 or 3 stfs an hour. And I am creeping along.
This game has really become not fun to play. Hundreds of thousands of skill points to gain to level up. Missions that gave a bit more points but dont even meet the need.
Who came up with this idea? It is the worst decision they have made since launch. Nothing can match this in the scope of daftness.
I dont want to level up lightening fast from 50-60. I just want to have fun and the occasional challenge. Not put a brick on my keyboard and come back 3 months later to find I have gained only 2 levels.
@Desdecardo since 2008.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
are you sure this is a geko imitation?
Sure was. I'm one of those doffing my way to 60.
I don't like the DR content. I think it's poorly written, dull, and frustrating rather than challenging. It had no immersion, I don't care about any of the characters in it. So I did one toon but won't do the other eight. I would have if it was just boring yet quick, rather than a long slow boring grind.
And the really extra-stupid thing about it?
This new nerf of doff XP won't change that. I still won't play DR. I still find it boring, dull, and frustrating. I still won't level any of my toons through DR. The only difference is that it will take even longer for my other 8 toons to get to 60.
Seriously Geko, it's over. DR is a bust. It's a failure. It won't work. It can't be rescued. Move on before you drive everyone to other offerings, permanently.
So here I am.
First, spell check is your friend. "Congradulations" = Congratulations. Normally I don't correct spelling, as I don't have high expectations from forum posters - except for those who are here to represent their company (ie you). Unprofessional posts are bad. Calling out someone for being wrong, when you clearly know what they are talking about (indicated in the quote below), is just, again, unprofessional, and makes you look clueless.
Of course everyone considers SP from critters. That is what makes up most of the SP from a patrol run. Would you rather have the ~944 SP from finishing a patrol, or the ~3500 SP from killing things in a patrol (using the pre-nerf Argala numbers)?
Anyway, that's enough from me regarding your post
Onto the reason I came here to begin with - I am what most would probably consider a whale. I've spent thousands on this game. Most recently, I dropped $100 just to upgrade my shotgun to epic (and open a few lockboxes). A week before that, I spent $100 just to put a bunch of dilithium in a T5 Fleet Starbase upgrade. I've upgraded all of my ship consoles to Epic Mk14, and had started the long process of upgrading everything else. Just before DR, I spent $300 to buy and sell keys, so I could afford to buy every single Voth ship - I had wanted to try out (yes, just try out) a battle cloaking science harassment build for PVP (battle cloak + GW + TBR + LV15 Sci trait + ton of PartGens = fun in PVP). Before that, I upgraded science to level 15 in a day just for the trait. I have a significant number of the lockbox ships, most of which were acquired through the expensive route of opening boxed instead of just buying with EC off the exchange. I'm of course a lifetimer.
My point: I have no problem dropping money into this game. I like trying new things. I enjoyed playing the game. I even didn't mind the grind so much. However, logging in today, and seeing the ridiculous choice made to nerf Specialization leveling even more, just pissed me off. And then logging onto the forums, and reading a post where the players are flat out lied to saying the rate of leveling won't change (hint: it has significantly changed)... I'm guess I'm not really angry, it's more of a feeling of disappointment, I had really enjoyed this game, I enjoyed DR, the new ships, intel powers, upgrades, ect. But now, it just seems that you don't want anyone to play the game, you just want them to hand over money for shiny ships...
I'll keep playing the game (I guess, not sure what I'll be doing though), but I am not spending any more money. I never thought I'd say that - Cryptic has made poor decisions in the past that have annoyed me and I've still made purchases on things that made the game fun... but now I've been annoyed badly enough to make me not WANT to spend money and not see the value in any of the new stuff released. Also, decisions like this make me concerned for the future of the game - why should I keep dropping money in STO if you're actively trying to kill it off? That just doesn't make sense.
If you decide to call this a bug, and fix the problem, cool, that *might* help me decide to start spending money again. But even then, I'd still be a little concerned, just because at this point, there's a pattern of you making decisions that are bad for the game, and bad for your revenue.
Very well said. Maybe it's white noise when I say some of these things because I've been saying some of them for five years and I sometimes slip into anger when I say them. I slip into anger when I say them because I've followed Cryptic since Jack Emmert was manning a little table at Comic-Con before City of Heroes launched. I liked him then. I liked it when Ghost Widow would go around Pocket D handing out temporary titles to players. I liked badge hunting in the streets of Paragon City.
I actually started a thread back in 2006 or so on the City of Heroes forums saying how I wanted to see Cryptic take their engine and get the Star Trek MMO license, how I could see flight mechanics being adapted for ships and pet mechanics being adapted for away teams. I was practically laughed off the forums for that one.
I signed up for e-mail updates when Cryptic got the STO license.
When the game was in beta and getting mixed reviews, I personally contacted a few developers to propose them the idea of featured episodes (5 parts or so) in a cluster of space. And I pitched them on the idea of having those episodes offer a time limited reward for playing while they were new, which they could bring back as "re-runs" seasonally to raise interest during content lulls.
After launch, I reviewed the game. And my editor knocked it back three times until I dropped it from an A- to a C+. But I did everything I could to look at the work being done with a limited team because I admired the indy spirit at Cryptic.
I used to hang out in Podcast UGC chat and talk to Mark Valentine and Thomas about ideas.
After the Foundry launched, I applied for a job there. My application got lost in the stacks and I had a senior person ask me about why I hadn't applied. It got dusted off and I took the tests and went through the first round of interviews. I was tired, coming from a day of volunteering with kids, I think they really got tired of hearing me say the word "story".
That sense of investment is what has led me to become what you would call a whale. LTS, obviously, but there were times when friends went to the beach or cool cities that I said, "I want to support this Star Trek game. I like that it's casual and if they could just sink some more money into it, other people would see what I see in it." I dropped most comic books. Working on two master's degrees didn't leave me rich but I'd double coupon like mad to have a spare $20, $30, $50 to drop on the game. Tax refund time or when I could get some work on the side beyond my day job, I'd drop $200. Not for pixels but for satisfaction and a sense of luxury and to support an atmosphere I liked, same reason my other big entertainment expense is Starbucks and little independent coffeeshops.
'A lot HAS improved. There have been many fresh coats of paint applied to the game. I flipped by gourd over the Jem'Hadar gift boxes and suggested they needed a second chance currency in every box that could be used to buy similarly exotic ships and items. I know I've butted heads with the community and developers on occasion. Melted down. Had heated words with moderators and developers. Generally when I perceived people as being exploited by either Cryptic's business strategies or by groups of players in the game. You don't exploit people; you satisfy them. You don't do jokes that punch down. You don't mock the weak or the unstable. You don't laugh at pain or provoke it. And you don't run business like a machine that can be engineered by tightening the bolts. You don't celebrate and have cake parties financed by tightly engineered manipulation of service models that are built on systematic exploitation of human irrationality. You don't treat human behavior like code that needs to serve a function. You don't put shareholders above other stakeholders. It's the wrong way to live. It's a hollow way to operate. And I expect better, as frequently disappointing and frustrating as that is.
But what sardocian said, it's dead on for me. So if what I said is too intense, go reread sardocian's post.
step 1) make leveling impossible unless you literally do nothing but play sto 24/7.
step 2) sell skill point boosters. 10000 exp for ~1000 zen, the other one's just padding.
step 3) 1 level is around 150k, so you need to buy 15 boosters. 15k zen for each level.
step 4) [not clear yet, but it has something to do with forcing players to pay ludicrous money for nothing]
step 5) money is printing itself! $$
We fight them too. Entire armies spilling out of Volkswagens.
We do our best to fight them off, but they keep sending them in.
I actually did laugh out loud at that. Then I realized something... I was right there on the forums rather than playing the queues... :eek:
And I'd rather pay for more original T6 ships. And for more costumes. Sell us the damn Tal Shiar set already. And also sell Mirror Universe Skins for all existing and future faction ships and the right to use the ISS/ARW/AKS Registry Prefix.
And while they're at it, also sell us multi-faction T6 Dreadnought packs, which also include T6 versions of existing Lobi/Lockbox ships. Such as a T6 Voth Citadel Dreadnought pack with a T6 Voth Bulwark, Bastion, and Palisade or a Tholian T6 Tarantula Dreadnought with a Recluse and Orb Weaver.
My money is waiting. Cryptic just needs to provide the right incentive to have it.
So, you want Pay-2-Win!
That doesn't address the BS "skill point" update slash Nerf for all the other players. Just a opinion.
<redacted>
For the most part I am in the same boat as you. I did not like the Jem'Hadar Chance Boxes. I am against gambling from an ethical and moral perspective, and just because other companies do it doesn't make it right to me. But I do understand the necessary evils of business.
That said, sometimes I think they go to the unnecessary evils because they feel they are in a No Win Scenario. They're damned if they do and they're damned if they don't. The moderators at PWE are on a volunteer basis. Despite the efforts of Smirk and Trendy, there is way more venom in the forums than there needs to be. When this exacerbates over years and years, people at Cryptic not only start feeling worn down by the sheer amount of player hatred... I think they get desensitized to it.
And I do mean that in a very literal sense. They know abuse from players is coming beforehand over every decision (literally EVERY decision) made, so I think mentally they keep themselves 'clocked out' simply because there's only so much abuse from your customers you can take as a human being.
I know I'm desensitized to it. I've seen plenty of dark corners in my life, and I know what continued exposure to it can do to you, despite your best intentions. If it doesn't turn you malicious, it turns you callous.
What I am getting at, is when Cryptic's moral compass starts acting weird... I see a problem. Because Cryptic was founded on not being like the other game studios. But I see these changes they go with... and I see the root of all evil involved, which is money. PWE shows them how to make way more money than before, and they go with it.
Because pissing off the customers is something they were doing even when they couldn't afford styrofoam cups for coffee during our own Year of Hell(tm), so if they're going to TRIBBLE us off... they might as well take comfort in the fact their budget is a lot larger than it used to be, right? It's inevitable.
We get the game we ask for. We're so polarized on so many issues that the STO community is more or less playing Trekball, with players on one side or the other without any kind of middle ground. Toxic vitriol didn't just creep in one day, it's been persistent. Cryptic takes note of our feedback and does what they are currently doing.
Which is making what I (and others) consider to be bad decisions because they pretty much do not care at this point. They're going to get venom no matter what, so to them it really does not matter if they go for broke and start selling $7 T5-U Upgrade tokens one month, and then a T6 version of the same ship the next. They don't care if double dipping is unpopular, because everything they do is unpopular according to the cacophany of the STO playerbase.
These skill point changes, and the spec point nerf, and whatnot... these are all just symptoms of a larger problem that Cryptic is maybe out of touch with the community, and maybe they have their reasons for being so out of touch. It's simply an unfortunate scenario for everybody involved. You, me, the forums, people at Cryptic, people at PWE, it's unfortunate for CBS Studios and it's unfortunate for the Star Trek fans out there who are caught in a crossfire between callous developers who are tired of being a punching bag, and rabid fanboys and fangirls who offer literally nothing to the table except their rabid froth.
And if people think CBS Studios is going to greenlight another Star Trek MMO? They're even more delusional than I give them credit for. The STO players who want the game to die don't deserve another Star Trek MMO. If STO gets shut down or put on maintenance mode? This is probably it. We will have proven to the world, and to the video game industry that we aren't deserving of a Star Trek MMO.
Because... we get the game we ask for.
If you damned if you do and damned if you don't? Then don't.
Let the band play on. Fiddle while Rome burns. Call up your bankruptcy lawyers. Walk out on the quarterly earnings report. Turn on, tune in, drop out.
I think it clashes with their genuine good intention to create a really awesome Star Trek game, which I do think is important to them. The amount of care and detail poured into the game is something I can't deny.
I just think when it comes to punishing the players through these questionable decisions, it's out of callousness to the inevitable player abuse, rather than genuine malice.
hey they got to lash out somewhere? :S lol
I wish they didn't feel like they had to, or that it didn't matter if they did or not.
It's like being on the receiving end of the Boy Who Cried Wolf.
When your playerbase makes a battleground over everything, it's incredibly to difficult what negative criticism is legit and which negative criticism isn't.
At that point... they go down the pathway of what their metrics and profit margins say.
If I read any further, I swear to you, I will get very choked up. Honestly, there could be tears.
Seriously, though, I think you got this figured backwards. It's really very simple: the people don't want the outrageous monetizing, Cryptic does it anyway. People want them to fix bugs, Cryptic gives them more grind. Cryptic is showing, time and again, they don't give a Targ's behind about what people think of the direction this game has taken. And this sheer contemptuous attitude towards their playerbase is simply adding up, accruing resentment over time, up to where people get totally desensitized to whatever Cryptic says, trusting almost nothing any more -- a situation you then turn around and translate to "Damned if they do and damned if they don't."
Trust me, though, if they actually DIDN'T do the ever-more ridiculous monetizing, for a change, no one would complain. Nary a one. Problem is just that they're stuck on DO.
Yes, because even going by what your metrics and profit margins say is in of itself a negative criticism.
And it all clashes with their good intentions. The road to hell, etc.
It doesn't cut into Cryptic's bottom line, since they did away with the Dilithium rewards for leveling up after getting all 60 Spec points. It's also more likely to make money than selling worthless XP boosters (I'd rather pay for things like hour long to 24 hour long 2x XP boosts that only count down for as long as I'm logged in on a character that most all other MMOs have).
The above stuff are just theoretical suggestions anyway, since I doubt Cryptic is desperate enough to capitalize on that easy source of money.
Do I want Cryptic to go and double check their coding and properly give the necessary XP increase from killing NPCs to keep to their intention of an illusion of leveling up faster? Hell yes.
But do I expect them to do so until December (since Thanksgiving is next week) if at all? Hell no.
I think that's all incorrect. Players don't want anything. If Cryptic does A, players complain B, C, D, E, and F aren't addressed and they're evil for doing so. If Cryptic does B, they complain A, C, D, E, and F aren't addressed and they're dumb and evil for not knowing that from before. If Cryptic tries to half-TRIBBLE C, D, and E, then players think they're incompetent for half-assing C, D, and E, and then not addressing A, B, and F.
So on, and so forth. Compile that over 4 years and you have our current situation regarding their questionable decision making.
With the current progression mechanics the road to hell is a really long road, and I don't think there are enough good intentions available at this point to get there without repeating them a LOT. :P
Yeah, well... Who are they making it for? Themselves?
"Hey, let's finance a game that's really fun to play on a private server with XP turned up, timers turned off, and unlimited ZEN."
Won't argue there.
this is pre-9.5 *giggles and ducks*