And where have I said that what is going on in the Dyson BZ is, or is not any different?
I only stated that taking action now would be corporate suicide and that I'm surprised the actions of a few have not resulted in a change to the way rewards are granted already...
How is that being an apologist, or in some way defining differing levels of 'cheating'?
You just stated how it is different in your own post. :rolleyes:
Blindly one-sided despite evidence? What evidence? Please, show me the evidence you speak of that what took place was not an exploit...
And where have I said that what is going on in the Dyson BZ is, or is not any different?
I only stated that taking action now would be corporate suicide and that I'm surprised the actions of a few have not resulted in a change to the way rewards are granted already...
How is that being an apologist, or in some way defining differing levels of 'cheating'?
he keeps spouting this nonsense, what am i supposed to do?
cant help a chronic whiner, just look at his handle, whiney as it gets.
Just imagine if they claim the dyson ground battlezone is an exploit tomorrow, and take away all dilithium gained there from everyone that spends more than 1 round there for the past year.
That's exactly what people here seem to be ok with.
This is why i almost don't play any-more..
My scimitar do 50.000 dps, so next time the dev's will say im a explorter cause i could do ise in 62 sec's or something like this and take-away dilitium..
I just lost all trust in Cryptic....
X2 after the fiasco of season 9 killed the fun out of this great game....
he keeps spouting this nonsense, what am i supposed to do?
You can't do anything with the "LALALA I can't hear you" people.
Some people are genuinely affected by this situation, and others aren't, but are borderline (or outright) insulting the affected anyway, regardless of fact.
You just stated how it is different in your own post. :rolleyes:
Puh-lease.
Then, you have me at a disadvantage as I am at a complete loss a to exactly what point you were trying to make?
I have never once denied that inappropriate behaviour goes on in the Dyson BZ, even going so far as to acknowledge I'm surprised steps have not been taken to avoid such behaviour...
You're making a straw man argument with your insistance on referring back to this...
You're merely deflecting what was the true issue here, without a shred of real evidence to support any argument you are making, or stance you have taken, and some how are claiming I'm changing my position, or contradicting myself...
My position has been pretty clear, use of Tau Dewa to gain XP at an unintentionally inflated rate was an exploit, even before Cryptic deemed it as such, which is why so many people flocked to it...
The official statement may have cited only 300 odd people, but that is probably the 300 who took the use of this exploit to the extreme and, like my Fallen Earth example, there would have been degrees of exploitation...
So, please, actually demonstrate to me how anything that I have said is in some way incorrrect...
Then, you have me at a disadvantage as I am at a complete loss a to exactly what point you were trying to make?
I have never once denied that inappropriate behaviour goes on in the Dyson BZ, even going so far as to acknowledge I'm surprised steps have not been taken to avoid such behaviour...
You're making a straw man argument with your insistance on referring back to this...
You're merely deflecting what was the true issue here, without a shred of real evidence to support any argument you are making, or stance you have taken, and some how are claiming I'm changing my position, or contradicting myself...
My position has been pretty clear, use of Tau Dewa to gain XP at an unintentionally inflated rate was an exploit, even before Cryptic deemed it as such, which is why so many people flocked to it...
The official statement may have cited only 300 odd people, but that is probably the 300 who took the use of this exploit to the extreme and, like my Fallen Earth example, there would have been degrees of exploitation...
So, please, actually demonstrate to me how anything that I have said is in some way incorrrect...
You call your self: imruined. But you cannot be because then you would not post here, so what you say is proven incorrect now, bye bye.
You just stated how it is different in your own post. :rolleyes:
Puh-lease.
And there is just as much of this sort of behaviour that goes on amongst the 'Cryptic Haters', especially those who have been caught out red handed doing the wrong thing...
And there is just as much of this sort of behaviour that goes on amongst the 'Cryptic Haters', especially those who have been caught out red handed doing the wrong thing...
Really? This is about as childish as it can get...
Not more childish then calling oneself: Imruined, bye bye.
You get personal in the first place and now continue to be personal. So your arguments finaly are dryed out else you would respond fact based and not assumptive from the start.
And in your childish behaviour you also seem to want to have the last say, the last word. Well if that makes you happy, you can have it. Please go on.
And there is just as much of this sort of behaviour that goes on amongst the 'Cryptic Haters', especially those who have been caught out red handed doing the wrong thing...
Really? This is about as childish as it can get...
cryptic did the wrong thing.
not that people like you will acknowledge it, but still.
rolling out reported bugs was their fault, without verifying to us that its unintended.
edit: also fences, man, fences. wheres the fence defences? dingos everywhere.
You get personal in the first place and now continue to be personal. So your arguments finaly are dryed out else you would respond fact based and not assumptive from the start.
I got personal in the first place? Really? Let's just recap here then shall we?
cryptic did the wrong thing.
not that people like you will acknowledge it, but still.
rolling out reported bugs was their fault, without verifying to us that its unintended.
edit: also fences, man, fences. wheres the fence defences? dingos everywhere.
Then, you have me at a disadvantage as I am at a complete loss a to exactly what point you were trying to make?
I have never once denied that inappropriate behaviour goes on in the Dyson BZ, even going so far as to acknowledge I'm surprised steps have not been taken to avoid such behaviour...
You're making a straw man argument with your insistance on referring back to this...
You're merely deflecting what was the true issue here, without a shred of real evidence to support any argument you are making, or stance you have taken, and some how are claiming I'm changing my position, or contradicting myself...
My position has been pretty clear, use of Tau Dewa to gain XP at an unintentionally inflated rate was an exploit, even before Cryptic deemed it as such, which is why so many people flocked to it...
The official statement may have cited only 300 odd people, but that is probably the 300 who took the use of this exploit to the extreme and, like my Fallen Earth example, there would have been degrees of exploitation...
So, please, actually demonstrate to me how anything that I have said is in some way incorrrect...
OK. Although I've explained repeatedly to you, I'll try one more time, in the simplest terms I can muster, in the off chance that somehow you're just not able to understand, instead of trolling:
Dyson Battlezone was, and is, considered exploitative. It is even more exploitative (according to the devs' definition, IE "stealing" dilithium) than what this debacle has been defined as being.
This has been going on for quite some time.
This has regularly been reported as exploitative.
This has been defined as "working as intended," and, thusly, not been changed, in any way.
This is what is commonly referred to as a "precedent."
Therefore, one can not assume one is knowingly exploiting or cheating, since precedent shows this is NOT exploitative.
And Dyson is just one such precedent, as others have been stated in this thread, and summarily ignored by you, because they do not suit your desire to insult players and/or blindly take the side of a very weakly worded developer explanation...thus leading to the obvious "dev apologist" moniker.
OK. Although I've explained repeatedly to you, I'll try one more time, in the simplest terms I can muster, in the off chance that somehow you're just not able to understand, instead of trolling:
Dyson Battlezone was, and is, considered exploitative. It is even more exploitative (according to the devs' definition, IE "stealing" dilithium) than what this debacle has been defined as being.
This has been going on for quite some time.
This has regularly been reported as exploitative.
This has been defined as "working as intended," and, thusly, not been changed, in any way.
This is what is commonly referred to as a "precedent."
Therefore, one can not assume one is knowingly exploiting or cheating, since precedent shows this is NOT exploitative.
And Dyson is just one such precedent, as others have been stated in this thread, and summarily ignored by you, because they do not suit your desire to insult players and/or blindly take the side of a very weakly worded developer explanation...thus leading to the obvious "dev apologist" moniker.
And please demonstrate how anything that goes on within the Dyson Battlezone has set a precedent to demonstrate that gaining greater than intended XP from Tau Dewa was not exploiting?
Had the issue been related to the gathering of dilithium, then yes, I would be in full agreeance with you and Cryptic should not have taken the action they did...
However...
The issue at hand does not involve the acquisition of dilithium, and the mechanics of the Dyson Battlezone involved in doing so, it is about the use of Tau Dewa patrols to glean exceedingly more XP than Cryptic intended...
Had this same XP be obtainanble from the Dyson Battlezone, but only those who undertook Tau Dewa patrols punished, then yes, your argument would be valid and I would have already conceded this point...
This is not, and never was the case however...
XP and dilithium gain are two seperate issues and trying to use one to discredit the other, is a straw man argument, as I stated...
And please demonstrate how anything that goes on within the Dyson Battlezone has set a precedent to demonstrate that gaining greater than intended XP from Tau Dewa was not exploiting?
Had the issue been related to the gathering of dilithium, then yes, I would be in full agreeance with you and Cryptic should not have taken the action they did...
However...
The issue at hand does not involve the acquisition of dilithium, and the mechanics of the Dyson Battlezone involved in doing so, it is about the use of Tau Dewa patrols to glean exceedingly more XP than Cryptic intended...
Had this same XP be obtainanble from the Dyson Battlezone, but only those who undertook Tau Dewa patrols punished, then yes, your argument would be valid and I would have already conceded this point...
This is not, and never was, the case however...
XP and dilithium gain are two seperate issues and trying to use one to discredit the other, is a straw man argument, as I stated...
OK, have fun with your fingers in your ears. :rolleyes:
At the end of all the xp gain, the end of the spec trees, lives level 110. After that point each refill of the xp bar awarded dilithum. Awarded, past tense, because they removed that with the Thursday patch. Seems to me that this really wasn't entirely xp gains based. Perhaps more indirectly related to xp and more directly related to the ability to gain that dilithium. While the two are tied together if they have slowed leveling to the bare crawl that they have then why remove the dil? Not to mention they have a bit of a history of immediately dealing with problems that could possibly have an affect on that good old profit line...much as this was immediately dealt with.
So Iamruined, this did have a lot to do with dilithium.
At the end of all the xp gain, the end of the spec trees, lives level 110. After that point each refill of the xp bar awarded dilithum. Awarded, past tense, because they removed that with the Thursday patch. Seems to me that this really wasn't entirely xp gains based. Perhaps more indirectly related to xp and more directly related to the ability to gain that dilithium. While the two are tied together if they have slowed leveling to the bare crawl that they have then why remove the dil? Not to mention they have a bit of a history of immediately dealing with problems that could possibly have an affect on that good old profit line...much as this was immediately dealt with.
So Iamruined, this did have a lot to do with dilithium.
I was not actually aware that dilithium was rewarded once capping the Spec Tree...
Knowing this now, I can indeed see where sinn74 was going, albeit, still not a direct correlation between the underlying issues, I can however see the association now...
would love to see mister danglelow make a third appearance on forum now.
he accuses us of cheating, to cover his trails cause his team doing bad falls back on him.
and god his team did bad.
ignoring bugs on tribble, pushing them to holodeck, and then needing "METRICS" to notice their own team forgot to change exp values. clearly our fault.
he himself didnt notice, but he expects his players to do so.
yeah right mister danglelow, our job is your job, huh, big boss?
would love to see mister danglelow make a third appearance on forum now.
he accuses us of cheating, to cover his trails cause his team doing bad falls back on him.
and god his team did bad.
ignoring bugs on tribble, pushing them to holodeck, and then needing "METRICS" to notice his own team forgot to change exp values. clearly our fault.
he himself didnt notice, but he expects his players to do so.
yeah right mister danglelow, our job is your job, huh, big boss?
Confuzzled now. What was the alleged exploit then?!? Just going to Tau Dewa, instead of playing the DR content?! Tell me it ain't so, cuz that would be petty beyond belief! (Q.E.D.: I still can't fathom it)
Seriously, this changes everything! Or was the exploit having teamed, using trickery to lower NPC levels? if so, I have all the more reason to try and get a ticket thru, and have my case heard, as I solo-ed *everything*.
I go eat a bit, and 2 pages and multiple mutual insults later, LOL, I'm still trying to determine what the exploit was I allegedly committed. Cuz the supposed faulty XP tables are, as it would now appear, years old. (Sic!)
Time to reach deep within, Cryptic, and say to yourselves "Maybe it's time we got off your lazy butts, and started fixing some of these year-old bugs, lest we run into an entirely self-caused mess like this again!" You can start with the broken loadout system, as far as I'm concerned.
Comments
Dyson Battlezone.
You just stated how it is different in your own post. :rolleyes:
Puh-lease.
he keeps spouting this nonsense, what am i supposed to do?
cant help a chronic whiner, just look at his handle, whiney as it gets.
This is why i almost don't play any-more..
My scimitar do 50.000 dps, so next time the dev's will say im a explorter cause i could do ise in 62 sec's or something like this and take-away dilitium..
I just lost all trust in Cryptic....
X2 after the fiasco of season 9 killed the fun out of this great game....
You can't do anything with the "LALALA I can't hear you" people.
Some people are genuinely affected by this situation, and others aren't, but are borderline (or outright) insulting the affected anyway, regardless of fact.
What evidence does this constitute?
Then, you have me at a disadvantage as I am at a complete loss a to exactly what point you were trying to make?
I have never once denied that inappropriate behaviour goes on in the Dyson BZ, even going so far as to acknowledge I'm surprised steps have not been taken to avoid such behaviour...
You're making a straw man argument with your insistance on referring back to this...
You're merely deflecting what was the true issue here, without a shred of real evidence to support any argument you are making, or stance you have taken, and some how are claiming I'm changing my position, or contradicting myself...
My position has been pretty clear, use of Tau Dewa to gain XP at an unintentionally inflated rate was an exploit, even before Cryptic deemed it as such, which is why so many people flocked to it...
The official statement may have cited only 300 odd people, but that is probably the 300 who took the use of this exploit to the extreme and, like my Fallen Earth example, there would have been degrees of exploitation...
So, please, actually demonstrate to me how anything that I have said is in some way incorrrect...
You call your self: imruined. But you cannot be because then you would not post here, so what you say is proven incorrect now, bye bye.
And there is just as much of this sort of behaviour that goes on amongst the 'Cryptic Haters', especially those who have been caught out red handed doing the wrong thing...
Really? This is about as childish as it can get...
Not more childish then calling oneself: Imruined, bye bye.
Wow... Just... Wow...
If you really must know, it's derived from one of my favourite bands called My Ruin...
i also would like to see these so called "evidences" (if they exist at all)
Now that proves my point, it's very childish to call yourself after a band, instead of just using your name.
And far more if you are the one calling others childish in the first place.
You are beyond clueless...
You get personal in the first place and now continue to be personal. So your arguments finaly are dryed out else you would respond fact based and not assumptive from the start.
And in your childish behaviour you also seem to want to have the last say, the last word. Well if that makes you happy, you can have it. Please go on.
cryptic did the wrong thing.
not that people like you will acknowledge it, but still.
rolling out reported bugs was their fault, without verifying to us that its unintended.
edit: also fences, man, fences. wheres the fence defences? dingos everywhere.
I got personal in the first place? Really? Let's just recap here then shall we?
So, any other gems of pure brilliance?
Exploit...
not from you, so what youre doing here still?
obligate mentioning of fences, and flawed australian education system.
What an interesting statement.
OK. Although I've explained repeatedly to you, I'll try one more time, in the simplest terms I can muster, in the off chance that somehow you're just not able to understand, instead of trolling:
Dyson Battlezone was, and is, considered exploitative. It is even more exploitative (according to the devs' definition, IE "stealing" dilithium) than what this debacle has been defined as being.
This has been going on for quite some time.
This has regularly been reported as exploitative.
This has been defined as "working as intended," and, thusly, not been changed, in any way.
This is what is commonly referred to as a "precedent."
Therefore, one can not assume one is knowingly exploiting or cheating, since precedent shows this is NOT exploitative.
And Dyson is just one such precedent, as others have been stated in this thread, and summarily ignored by you, because they do not suit your desire to insult players and/or blindly take the side of a very weakly worded developer explanation...thus leading to the obvious "dev apologist" moniker.
did your small plan of covering up your and your teams mistakes by accusing us of being guilty
work out right?
did it? did it really?
And please demonstrate how anything that goes on within the Dyson Battlezone has set a precedent to demonstrate that gaining greater than intended XP from Tau Dewa was not exploiting?
Had the issue been related to the gathering of dilithium, then yes, I would be in full agreeance with you and Cryptic should not have taken the action they did...
However...
The issue at hand does not involve the acquisition of dilithium, and the mechanics of the Dyson Battlezone involved in doing so, it is about the use of Tau Dewa patrols to glean exceedingly more XP than Cryptic intended...
Had this same XP be obtainanble from the Dyson Battlezone, but only those who undertook Tau Dewa patrols punished, then yes, your argument would be valid and I would have already conceded this point...
This is not, and never was the case however...
XP and dilithium gain are two seperate issues and trying to use one to discredit the other, is a straw man argument, as I stated...
OK, have fun with your fingers in your ears. :rolleyes:
So, now you're refusing to acknowledge the flaw in your argument, and I'm the one with fingers in my ears apparently...
At the end of all the xp gain, the end of the spec trees, lives level 110. After that point each refill of the xp bar awarded dilithum. Awarded, past tense, because they removed that with the Thursday patch. Seems to me that this really wasn't entirely xp gains based. Perhaps more indirectly related to xp and more directly related to the ability to gain that dilithium. While the two are tied together if they have slowed leveling to the bare crawl that they have then why remove the dil? Not to mention they have a bit of a history of immediately dealing with problems that could possibly have an affect on that good old profit line...much as this was immediately dealt with.
So Iamruined, this did have a lot to do with dilithium.
I was not actually aware that dilithium was rewarded once capping the Spec Tree...
Knowing this now, I can indeed see where sinn74 was going, albeit, still not a direct correlation between the underlying issues, I can however see the association now...
he accuses us of cheating, to cover his trails cause his team doing bad falls back on him.
and god his team did bad.
ignoring bugs on tribble, pushing them to holodeck, and then needing "METRICS" to notice their own team forgot to change exp values. clearly our fault.
he himself didnt notice, but he expects his players to do so.
yeah right mister danglelow, our job is your job, huh, big boss?
Exploit...
I go eat a bit, and 2 pages and multiple mutual insults later, LOL, I'm still trying to determine what the exploit was I allegedly committed. Cuz the supposed faulty XP tables are, as it would now appear, years old. (Sic!)
Time to reach deep within, Cryptic, and say to yourselves "Maybe it's time we got off your lazy butts, and started fixing some of these year-old bugs, lest we run into an entirely self-caused mess like this again!" You can start with the broken loadout system, as far as I'm concerned.