But please note, that have already had some pretty well organized fleets blazing through Elite with apparent ease. It kinda blows me away honestly. We have a lot of diversity on skill in STO, so finding the right balance point may take time. We want to make a real challenge for our top players, so if players are succeeding easily (and they are), expect it to probably get harder.
Yeah, it needs a massive buff if you want to stop those guys - multiply health by 5 again, that should keep them busy.
Take ISA - you've specced the content to require 15k DPS not to fail the timer - people can do over 80k DPS on Mk XII gear in certain ships in ISE, let alone Mk XIV gold gear.
Many of us have paid over $100 for the Delta Pack, and as you can see on the forums, our first experiences with our new tier 6 ships, and tier 5 upgrades is failure after failure. Even in regular fleet alerts! Please do go ahead and make elite truly elite, but let those of us who were happy playing STO up to now have a decent shot at advanced content just like we did until yesterday with elite content.
I hope PvE is adjusted with an emergency patch very soon. No one wants to pay to lose. Nobody!
How many specialization points do you have? Starship mastery unlocks? Are you lvl 60 yet? Is your gear at minimum MK XII?
If the answer to any of those is no, losing is fairly normal hehe
Advanced is more difficult than the old Elite, and built for the basic level of 60. The new Eilte is meant for lvl 60, but with the best stuff you can get. Or at least that's the gist of it
That being said, the queues are still newly released; they can tuned if the need arises.
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Many of us have paid over $100 for the Delta Pack, and as you can see on the forums, our first experiences with our new tier 6 ships, and tier 5 upgrades is failure after failure. Even in regular fleet alerts! Please do go ahead and make elite truly elite, but let those of us who were happy playing STO up to now have a decent shot at advanced content just like we did until yesterday with elite content.
I hope PvE is adjusted with an emergency patch very soon. No one wants to pay to lose. Nobody!
So you bought yourself a ship, as I am sure you have done before and this time your lack of gear and skill made your new shiny not shine? Whats the issue here?
Just accept it, if your not willing to spend hundreds of dollars if not thousands you should probably just quit playing Cryptic games. The Advance and Elite serve one purpose to weed out people not willing to pay. (and pay a lot not just a little)
Just like the crafting system, the upgrade system is for people who are willing to spends hundreds of dollars in a RNG lottery.
I personally came to the realization today that I am done with STO, I've been playing since before it was free to play, I have even paid more than i'd like to admit. But the crafting system plus Delta Rising have shown me the the cost of this game is far more than I am willing to pay.
I'll probably be done with Neverwinter next update as well.
I'll continue with Guild Wars 2 and Eve Online and Final Fantasy.
It really has become more obvious since season 7 (where they nerfed alot of dilithium farming and doffing for dilithium) nerfs to estf dilithium i remember getting nearly 2k per run plus chances for tokens you could turn in for even more sure they took longer then these days but not by too much. R&D system where if you want to get to even level 15 without paying to skip the timegate you have to wait 4 months and for level 20 a year.
And now a new upgrade gear dilithium sink and pay to upgrade tier 5 ships or buy new tier 6 ships on top of another dilithium nerf to Stf which now really make them a waste of time if your after dilithium.
From a spreadsheet i looked at for the cost of upgrading gear to take you ship from tier 12 rares to tier 14 is gonna cost you 356,000 dilithium and 331 superior tech upgrades (at the current exchange price of around 1 million per you gonna need nearly 330 million unless you craft them yourself. That figure assumes that you don't even skip the timegates.
This expansion is such a money obvious money grab i can't see how anyone could defend them after this.
Just did an advanced cure space pug our combined dps was just about 45k and we did't even come close to finishing it the kang was destroyed and we got 10 marks for about 12 minutes. If it stays this way your gonna need a team with each member doing an average of 20k+ dps to complete an advanced mission.
Normal on the other hand is really easy with enemies have 1/10 the hp that advanced queue enemies have but ofc you get about half the marks and only 480 dilithium and no implants. A group doing 5k dps per person on average will have no trouble beating normal with optional.
So you are saying that we aren't supposed to be able to do Fleet Alerts, or advanced STF unless you have attained level cap?
you see, I expected for normal to be normal, advanced to be the old elite, and elite is supposed to be something that you can only do at level 60 with the best gear.
The thing of it is, I took my new Mat'Ha into a fleet alert. That's 5 forward weapons, and 5 fleet tac disruptor consoles. I took 4 passes to kill a plain old Heg'Ta bird of prey. Fleet alerts don't have a normal, hard, or elite. This Mat'Ha is supposed to be a consummate KDF DPS monster, and it couldn't kill a freakin' bird of prey in one pass?
So you have to be level 60 today to enjoy STO like you did yesterday? I don't have that much patience, and there are other things that I can do that are actually as fun as STO was on October 13th. I do feel bad that I spend $120 on utter TRIBBLE, but I guess there are worse financial mistakes to make.
At least the forums are cheap fun. I ought to stand down, and enjoy some popcorn while I silently read.
From the Public Elite Channel, Got into a team for a STF today and i can summarize the concenssus of what we think of "Elite mode" including my own.
[11:48] Mueppe@x: whats going on??????????????
[11:49] Nelson@x: Everything got buffed, like 10x.
[11:49] D'raysan@x: yep
[11:49] Mueppe@x: unkillable
[11:49] Seren Talla@x: This is ****ing stupid
[11:49] Mueppe@x: ?????????
[11:49] Vorel@x: bug
[11:49] D'raysan@x: this is ****ing lame
[11:50] Seren Talla@x: Whoever thought this difficulty up needs to be shot
[11:51] D'raysan@x: i guess we can leave
[11:51] Nelson@x: Yup. I won't be running this again till they change it, or I can upgrade all my gear. This is just straight up no fun.
[11:51] Seren Talla@x: Upgrade you gear? T20 gold wont do **** to this
[11:51] Mueppe@x:
[11:51] D'raysan@x: wonder how ground looks like
Mind you 3 birds of prey at the start of the Cure Space, Could not be killed by 4 High DPS ships. [15-18k average] and The new lockbox ship which im not sure of its general average. [the one you pay for for lobi now.] Infact, these 3 basic birds of prey where invincible.
Lets not get into how a single sphere was 1 shotting people in the spawn. As they reloaded.
WOW, so much BS you could not master "ELITE" mode less than 1 hour after release you poor TRIBBLE, this **** is busted, they need to NERF everything NOW!!!!!!
So you are saying that we aren't supposed to be able to do Fleet Alerts, or advanced STF unless you have attained level cap?
you see, I expected for normal to be normal, advanced to be the old elite, and elite is supposed to be something that you can only do at level 60 with the best gear.
The thing of it is, I took my new Mat'Ha into a fleet alert. That's 5 forward weapons, and 5 fleet tac disruptor consoles. I took 4 passes to kill a plain old Heg'Ta bird of prey. Fleet alerts don't have a normal, hard, or elite. This Mat'Ha is supposed to be a consummate KDF DPS monster, and it couldn't kill a freakin' bird of prey in one pass?
So you have to be level 60 today to enjoy STO like you did yesterday? I don't have that much patience, and there are other things that I can do that are actually as fun as STO was on October 13th. I do feel bad that I spend $120 on utter TRIBBLE, but I guess there are worse financial mistakes to make.
At least the forums are cheap fun. I ought to stand down, and enjoy some popcorn while I silently read.
Thanks for the replies!
Well, the thing was, the old Normal/Advanced/Elite (and any other endgame) were built around lvl 50 only. The new Normal is 50, Advanced is 51-60 (budged up to 60 in practice), and Elite is 60 only - at least in idea; the actual practice is essentially what I've said above.
But still, it's only been a day, literally... plenty of time to consider everything, retune as necessary, etc etc
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
After playing the new 'Advanced,' I'm not even going to attempt Elite.
The enemies in Advanced are 100 times more powerful then they were on the old 'Elite.'
I was still able to complete it, but yeah.. I'll pass on Elite.
Do what you want with Elite, leave it super difficult to appeal to those that want that. There is nothing wrong with giving people that want a real challenge what they want.
Just please make Advanced a little more realistic for the 'average' player.
After playing the new 'Advanced,' I'm not even going to attempt Elite.
The enemies in Advanced are 100 times more powerful then they were on the old 'Elite.'
I was still able to complete it, but yeah.. I'll pass on Elite.
Do what you want with Elite, leave it super difficult to appeal to those that want that. There is nothing wrong with giving people that want a real challenge what they want.
Just please make Advanced a little more realistic for the 'average' player.
Just got to wave 4 in fleet alert with a competent group of captains in good ships. Starbase was destroyed and out of time.
I can't see even level 60 making all that much of a difference to ability to complete it, and anyway, you need something to do in between. Or are we all supposed to stop playing queues with other players? It's basically the only time we interact and it would be a shame to lose it.
Many of us have paid over $100 for the Delta Pack, and as you can see on the forums, our first experiences with our new tier 6 ships, and tier 5 upgrades is failure after failure. Even in regular fleet alerts! Please do go ahead and make elite truly elite, but let those of us who were happy playing STO up to now have a decent shot at advanced content just like we did until yesterday with elite content.
I hope PvE is adjusted with an emergency patch very soon. No one wants to pay to lose. Nobody!
So, like, Pay to Win motto.
Actually, I spent a day playing the advance stuff on Elite. I was blown to pieces most of the day.
Still I built up my skill to level 55 and assigned specialization that matched my playstyle and ship . The final groups I played with actually beat the new Fleet Alert, Borg Disconnected, and the new ISE on advance(elite). All Elite players.
I am playing with a Tier 4 Ha'feh until I can upgrade to the Fleet version. It's not about ship. I think it's more about skill and knowledge inner workings of the game.
Now that I know a T4 ship can beat this new content if organized, planned, and calculated. I'm upgrading all my gear for Elite level pvp.
you see, I expected for normal to be normal, advanced to be the old elite, and elite is supposed to be something that you can only do at level 60 with the best gear.
This was what I thought was going to happen.
"Advanced" will be the original Elite and the "new" Elite would be for those begging for fetish abuse.
Cryptic, can you please give us back our old Elite and save the chains and whips for those that enjoy that sort of thing?
AND return the only STF that's worth a damn, Khitomer Space.
Out of all the Borg STFs, you remove the best one.
NO to ARC RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
If something is not broke, don't try and fix it. Change should enhance the overall gaming experience not frak the whole thing up. Just because someone is not satisified with service that they have paid for does not mean that they are a better or worse player then anyone else. There is not one person who would not return a faulty piece of equipment to the store they bought it from or return a bad meal to the kitchen that served it. My friends we have just been served a mud pie, and when someone has a legit comment what happens? They are accused of not being skillfull enough and that they are whining like a child. A surgeon is skillfull, a military sniper is skillfull ... this my friends is a computer game about a fantasy sci-fi world and yes there should be an "I frakkin Win button".
Some people play this game to escape and unwind from a real world that is scary, and yes there is room at the table for you power players and your egos, so if sci-fi writers can bring Voyager back from the Gamma Quadrant then Cryptic writers and programmers should be able to let us in on that kind of fantasy winning as well. As it is, the game I knew on 10/14 is gone and something vastly different has taken its place. I will continue to play but please do not take my money and whiz down my back and say it's rain.
This was what I thought was going to happen.
"Advanced" will be the original Elite and the "new" Elite would be for those begging for fetish abuse.
Cryptic, can you please give us back our old Elite and save the chains and whips for those that enjoy that sort of thing?
AND return the only STF that's worth a damn, Khitomer Space.
Out of all the Borg STFs, you remove the best one.
Khitomer Space being gone could be a bug though, not intentional
They accidentally removed K-7 way back when, after all
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
I'm not sure they're really interested in our interaction with other players, just whether we find the 'challenges' hard enough that we put money towards dilithium to gear up.
Think I'm breaking from the queues, it's just not worth the time for the crippled rewards. That combination of increased time + increased difficulty + decreased rewards is just too ludicrous.
From the Public Elite Channel, Got into a team for a STF today and i can summarize the concenssus of what we think of "Elite mode" including my own.
[11:48] Mueppe@x: whats going on??????????????
[11:49] Nelson@x: Everything got buffed, like 10x.
[11:49] D'raysan@x: yep
[11:49] Mueppe@x: unkillable
[11:49] Seren Talla@x: This is ****ing stupid
[11:49] Mueppe@x: ?????????
[11:49] Vorel@x: bug
[11:49] D'raysan@x: this is ****ing lame
[11:50] Seren Talla@x: Whoever thought this difficulty up needs to be shot
[11:51] D'raysan@x: i guess we can leave
[11:51] Nelson@x: Yup. I won't be running this again till they change it, or I can upgrade all my gear. This is just straight up no fun.
[11:51] Seren Talla@x: Upgrade you gear? T20 gold wont do **** to this
[11:51] Mueppe@x:
[11:51] D'raysan@x: wonder how ground looks like
Mind you 3 birds of prey at the start of the Cure Space, Could not be killed by 4 High DPS ships. [15-18k average] and The new lockbox ship which im not sure of its general average. [the one you pay for for lobi now.] Infact, these 3 basic birds of prey where invincible.
Lets not get into how a single sphere was 1 shotting people in the spawn. As they reloaded.
Knew the feddys not be happy, they did not get the kill all npc on map ability
We did warn you that Elite is not for everyone. Its pretty extreme. Seriously, most players should not be able to do it.
But please note, that have already had some pretty well organized fleets blazing through Elite with apparent ease. It kinda blows me away honestly. We have a lot of diversity on skill in STO, so finding the right balance point may take time. We want to make a real challenge for our top players, so if players are succeeding easily (and they are), expect it to probably get harder.
I'd be curious to see the builds and ships these so called 'top players' were using... I can guess they were all tacs and in escorts and beam boats, this mean I should just throw out all my characters that aren't tacs and mothball all my science ships? What point is there being a healer or a drainboat? The rewards for queues suck now, a lot of things are bugged and laggy, and to be honest I'd rather just be more of a casual player now then really put any more effort into the game. Games need to be fun and have some kind of goal... right now these queues aren't fun, and if the only goal in this game is to do more damage than everyone else and then rub this fact into the faces of the 95% of people that can't make that mark then I guess this really isn't a Star Trek game because that's not what Trek is about...
Geko, Please ride it out. We need something to separate the men from the boys, were you need to use your brain.
When you refer to "something to separate the men from the boys" , you're just talking about filling your ship with Lobi consoles and Doffs worth hundreds of millions of EC .
That's not how this game was originally designed .
Your Eng console slots were designed for Eng consoles ... , to withstand the original punishment the Borg dished out .
You're just banging your chest over the mutilated DPS rat race that this game has sadly become .
Think I'm breaking from the queues, it's just not worth the time for the crippled rewards. That combination of increased time + increased difficulty + decreased rewards is just too ludicrous.
Wait for it ... -- they'll decrease the difficulty for Advanced and keep the crappy awards and ppl will be thanking them for their willingness to "compromise" . :rolleyes:
... see the Dil nerf in Season 7 for further details about their "generosity" ...
Welcome to Delta Rising. A lot has changed in the game difficulty, and we are looking for your feedback.
Delta Rising was a massive addition, and we anticipate that we will need to make adjustments. So over the next few weeks expect changes in the baseline difficulty, advanced difficulty, and elite difficulty - and also expect rewards to change as we gather more metrics on play-times and success rates.
Our goal was to make basic difficulty and the story content something everyone can play - even with a standard T5 ship. Levels 1-50 are generally pretty easy at basic difficulty, so we felt 51-60 should step things up a bit. Although we expect 51-60 accessible everyone, those in T5 ships and non-upgraded gear should to start to feel a definite challenge as they approach level 60. We expect Advanced to be for more skilled players and those who have invested in the game (ships and gear). And we expect Elite to be for the best of the best. We don't expect most players to succeed on elite difficulty.
If I were to guess, I would expect basic to get some minor tuning, Advanced to get a little easier and Elite to get a lot harder - and rewards, like dilithium rewards, could potentially go up across queues once we are sure we are hitting the right mark. But this is just my guess at this time.
Until then, let us know your thoughts here, and we will take your feedback into consideration.
Comments
Quite right.
Yeah, it needs a massive buff if you want to stop those guys - multiply health by 5 again, that should keep them busy.
Take ISA - you've specced the content to require 15k DPS not to fail the timer - people can do over 80k DPS on Mk XII gear in certain ships in ISE, let alone Mk XIV gold gear.
I hope PvE is adjusted with an emergency patch very soon. No one wants to pay to lose. Nobody!
Member since December 2009
Advanced is more difficult than the old Elite, and built for the basic level of 60. The new Eilte is meant for lvl 60, but with the best stuff you can get. Or at least that's the gist of it
That being said, the queues are still newly released; they can tuned if the need arises.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
It's clearly broken for this guy if there was one...
The size and power of your vessel means nothing if you don't know how to use it.
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
So you bought yourself a ship, as I am sure you have done before and this time your lack of gear and skill made your new shiny not shine? Whats the issue here?
It really has become more obvious since season 7 (where they nerfed alot of dilithium farming and doffing for dilithium) nerfs to estf dilithium i remember getting nearly 2k per run plus chances for tokens you could turn in for even more sure they took longer then these days but not by too much. R&D system where if you want to get to even level 15 without paying to skip the timegate you have to wait 4 months and for level 20 a year.
And now a new upgrade gear dilithium sink and pay to upgrade tier 5 ships or buy new tier 6 ships on top of another dilithium nerf to Stf which now really make them a waste of time if your after dilithium.
From a spreadsheet i looked at for the cost of upgrading gear to take you ship from tier 12 rares to tier 14 is gonna cost you 356,000 dilithium and 331 superior tech upgrades (at the current exchange price of around 1 million per you gonna need nearly 330 million unless you craft them yourself. That figure assumes that you don't even skip the timegates.
This expansion is such a money obvious money grab i can't see how anyone could defend them after this.
Just did an advanced cure space pug our combined dps was just about 45k and we did't even come close to finishing it the kang was destroyed and we got 10 marks for about 12 minutes. If it stays this way your gonna need a team with each member doing an average of 20k+ dps to complete an advanced mission.
Normal on the other hand is really easy with enemies have 1/10 the hp that advanced queue enemies have but ofc you get about half the marks and only 480 dilithium and no implants. A group doing 5k dps per person on average will have no trouble beating normal with optional.
you see, I expected for normal to be normal, advanced to be the old elite, and elite is supposed to be something that you can only do at level 60 with the best gear.
The thing of it is, I took my new Mat'Ha into a fleet alert. That's 5 forward weapons, and 5 fleet tac disruptor consoles. I took 4 passes to kill a plain old Heg'Ta bird of prey. Fleet alerts don't have a normal, hard, or elite. This Mat'Ha is supposed to be a consummate KDF DPS monster, and it couldn't kill a freakin' bird of prey in one pass?
So you have to be level 60 today to enjoy STO like you did yesterday? I don't have that much patience, and there are other things that I can do that are actually as fun as STO was on October 13th. I do feel bad that I spend $120 on utter TRIBBLE, but I guess there are worse financial mistakes to make.
At least the forums are cheap fun. I ought to stand down, and enjoy some popcorn while I silently read.
Thanks for the replies!
Member since December 2009
WOW, so much BS you could not master "ELITE" mode less than 1 hour after release you poor TRIBBLE, this **** is busted, they need to NERF everything NOW!!!!!!
On October 13th and the 4 years previous, all my ships came with an "I Win" button. They were freaking awesome!!!
Member since December 2009
But still, it's only been a day, literally... plenty of time to consider everything, retune as necessary, etc etc
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
The enemies in Advanced are 100 times more powerful then they were on the old 'Elite.'
I was still able to complete it, but yeah.. I'll pass on Elite.
Do what you want with Elite, leave it super difficult to appeal to those that want that. There is nothing wrong with giving people that want a real challenge what they want.
Just please make Advanced a little more realistic for the 'average' player.
Agreed in full.
i do think that players are jumping in too early, try doing the missions first and leave the pve ques till later.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
I can't see even level 60 making all that much of a difference to ability to complete it, and anyway, you need something to do in between. Or are we all supposed to stop playing queues with other players? It's basically the only time we interact and it would be a shame to lose it.
So, like, Pay to Win motto.
Actually, I spent a day playing the advance stuff on Elite. I was blown to pieces most of the day.
Still I built up my skill to level 55 and assigned specialization that matched my playstyle and ship . The final groups I played with actually beat the new Fleet Alert, Borg Disconnected, and the new ISE on advance(elite). All Elite players.
I am playing with a Tier 4 Ha'feh until I can upgrade to the Fleet version. It's not about ship. I think it's more about skill and knowledge inner workings of the game.
Now that I know a T4 ship can beat this new content if organized, planned, and calculated. I'm upgrading all my gear for Elite level pvp.
So, I say. Cryptic, Bring it on elite!
This was what I thought was going to happen.
"Advanced" will be the original Elite and the "new" Elite would be for those begging for fetish abuse.
Cryptic, can you please give us back our old Elite and save the chains and whips for those that enjoy that sort of thing?
AND return the only STF that's worth a damn, Khitomer Space.
Out of all the Borg STFs, you remove the best one.
RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
That doesn't help low DPS teams who are struggling against the time limit regardless of Kang.
Some people play this game to escape and unwind from a real world that is scary, and yes there is room at the table for you power players and your egos, so if sci-fi writers can bring Voyager back from the Gamma Quadrant then Cryptic writers and programmers should be able to let us in on that kind of fantasy winning as well. As it is, the game I knew on 10/14 is gone and something vastly different has taken its place. I will continue to play but please do not take my money and whiz down my back and say it's rain.
They accidentally removed K-7 way back when, after all
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Think I'm breaking from the queues, it's just not worth the time for the crippled rewards. That combination of increased time + increased difficulty + decreased rewards is just too ludicrous.
Knew the feddys not be happy, they did not get the kill all npc on map ability
I'd be curious to see the builds and ships these so called 'top players' were using... I can guess they were all tacs and in escorts and beam boats, this mean I should just throw out all my characters that aren't tacs and mothball all my science ships? What point is there being a healer or a drainboat? The rewards for queues suck now, a lot of things are bugged and laggy, and to be honest I'd rather just be more of a casual player now then really put any more effort into the game. Games need to be fun and have some kind of goal... right now these queues aren't fun, and if the only goal in this game is to do more damage than everyone else and then rub this fact into the faces of the 95% of people that can't make that mark then I guess this really isn't a Star Trek game because that's not what Trek is about...
When you refer to "something to separate the men from the boys" , you're just talking about filling your ship with Lobi consoles and Doffs worth hundreds of millions of EC .
That's not how this game was originally designed .
Your Eng console slots were designed for Eng consoles ... , to withstand the original punishment the Borg dished out .
You're just banging your chest over the mutilated DPS rat race that this game has sadly become .
It has nothing to do with being a man .
Wait for it ... -- they'll decrease the difficulty for Advanced and keep the crappy awards and ppl will be thanking them for their willingness to "compromise" . :rolleyes:
... see the Dil nerf in Season 7 for further details about their "generosity" ...