I don't think the I-Phone or Car buying analogy holds water. With that said, I'd gladly help pay for expansion 2. I'm willing to pay to upgrade my T5 ship to full T6. What I'm not ok with is paying to upgrade my T5 ship to anything less than T6. There could be so many ways to fund X2 I honestly don't get why they chose to go this route they way they did.
One of the things that, imho, folks are overlooking with all of this is that it's also about being able to provide a variety of ships. Adding the new mechanic to the current ships would defeat the ability to increase the variety of ships.
My biggest question regarding X2....do people honestly believe that the content is going to go up so much that current ships capable of doing 15-80k dps won't just melt face?
Cmon.....current ships will be plenty viable. t5-u helps pay for more content....it's all good.
My biggest question regarding X2....do people honestly believe that the content is going to go up so much that current ships capable of doing 15-80k dps won't just melt face?
Cmon.....current ships will be plenty viable. t5-u helps pay for more content....it's all good.
Pug an ISE...parsing it...take note of all the folks doing 1-2k DPS. Compare that to the number of folks doing over 10k DPS...er...see how many times you can run ISE before you come across somebody that does over 10k DPS actually, eh?
The only thing more rare than folks doing that 15-80k DPS are folks that PvP.
I have little doubt that there will be folks in T5-U (11 console)/T6 boats that are complaining things are too hard while there will be folks in T5 (9 console) boats complaining that things are too easy.
My biggest question regarding X2....do people honestly believe that the content is going to go up so much that current ships capable of doing 15-80k dps won't just melt face?
Cmon.....current ships will be plenty viable. t5-u helps pay for more content....it's all good.
Wow, strawman
I do not want to feel like I should stick to the Single-Player maps, which is all they promise that normal players will be able to do with older ships. I will not pay to upgrade 20 fleet ships to sub-T6. I will not start over with all new T6 ships. Especially since this is only happening because Cryptic wants to shake the money tree.
Its not that hard, you dont need to make up debate points for the other side, hero
Here's my take on the whole T5U/T6 deal. Make a T6 ship that I am going to want, not just for stats, but appearance and I will be more than happy to walk away from my T5 (which I have spent quite a lot of Zen on) and hand you(Cryptic) my money. From what I have seen so far, that is not happening. The Fed' ship looks like the remains of a Star Wars B5 love-fest that went wrong. Please give us Star Trek starships that look somewhat close to Star Trek starships. They don't have to be canon, just not "that" (pointing at all of it).
Cryptic, I dare you to make me want for you to take my money.
Not ranting, but I have to say I am moderately disappointed that there wasnt a temporary T5 upgrade freebie, even if only for 3 days, for current lvl 50s to take advantage of. I wouldnt say make it perma-free, but at least a 72 hour window would have been nice.
When the player went from T4 to T5, was there an option to upgrade their T4 ships? No. It was all about buying a new ship at whatever price was required for the player to pay (though some got a token to get the basic T5, any past that required full price).
<snip>
When the Fleet ships came out, did they offer to upgrade the normal T5 ships that the players were using to the new level of play these ships represented? No. First, the player had to spend the full price for the Refit/Retrofit versions in the Z-Store and then a small amount of Zen to upgrade to the Fleet version, or else pay an equivalent amount of Zen to buying a Retrofit/Refit from the Z-store to outright purchase the Fleet version.
Minor clarification:
From what I understand, the "basic" T5s - Patrol & Advanced Escort, RSV & DSSV, Star and Attack cruisers - have always been the "T5 token ship awarded for hitting L40. Has been this way since F2P started.
The T5+1 ships - especially the "TNG Era Retrofits", started out as "full on pay" ships, however, at the 600 day reward point, they issued a "VA ship token" only to those veterans, capable of purchasing those "Iconic" T5s - and a small handful of KDF ships...
When T5.5 "Fleet" was first announced, they "respected" the prior purchases of any T5 level C-store ship with the "module discount". They also provided a straight-on path straight to fleet level ship - however, said path was on a per-character basis only (so $20 to outfit one character, or $20 to get the base ship for the account then +5 per character...)
Most $25 C-store ships are already at the "fleet" specifications (10 consoles, "enhanced" shield and hull levels compared to the "Basic" T5s) and therefore do not qualify for the "fleet" variant. My Vesta and DSDs, for example, are prime examples of this, along with Oddy/Bort, Regent, etc. cruisers...
Note, the "basic" T5s, the 6 I announced earlier - never got the module discount for owning the previous version - because they are not C-store ships...
Detecting big-time "anti-old-school" bias here. NX? Lobi. TOS/TMP Connie? Super-promotion-box. (aka the two hardest ways to get ships) Excelsior & all 3 TNG "big hero" ships? C-Store. Please Equalize...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
Someone please tell me how the upgrades are competitive?? This comes from Cryptic themselves. I will still stick to the cannon looking upgrades. This makes me think whoever brought a T5 ship and lockbox ship had their money went down the drain. The upgrade ships won't even compete with the T6 ships especially PVP players.
One example of a new T6 ship
A Tier 6 cruiser, the Eclipse is a light and nimble ship for its class, taking some inspiration from battle cruisers. It is equipped with a Cloaking Device and Active Sensor Arrays that allow it to gather information about a target to expose a vulnerability. The Eclipse Intel Cruiser is also equipped with a Structural Integrity Field universal console. This device drains the structural integrity fields of enemy starships and overloads its own. The effect not only causes significant hull damage to affected foes, it also provides the Eclipse with additional hull strength.
There is one simple thing you all have missed about this zen upgrade cost thing.... Unless you are a Steam user, the lowest zen "package" you can get is 1000 which is 10 USD. Assuming the upgrade will be 500 zen (5 USD) we are being forced to pay twice what we need for one ship just to upgrade it. THAT is an obvious cash grab.
Some players have asked about the Fleet Patrol Escort. Specifically about the now retired Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class. For those who dont remember, the original ship in the Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom was removed from the store and replaced with the Fleet Patrol Escort Refit. The Refit has improved stats and a fused Tempest Tail Gun. The Refit is upgradable to a Fleet T5-U. So the question is - what about the original Maelstrom?
If you own either the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit OR the original Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class, both will be upgradable for Zen to the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit T5-U.
Some players have asked about the Fleet Patrol Escort. Specifically about the now retired Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class. For those who dont remember, the original ship in the Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom was removed from the store and replaced with the Fleet Patrol Escort Refit. The Refit has improved stats and a fused Tempest Tail Gun. The Refit is upgradable to a Fleet T5-U. So the question is - what about the original Maelstrom?
If you own either the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit OR the original Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class, both will be upgradable for Zen to the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit T5-U.
Some players have asked about the Fleet Patrol Escort. Specifically about the now retired Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class. For those who dont remember, the original ship in the Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom was removed from the store and replaced with the Fleet Patrol Escort Refit. The Refit has improved stats and a fused Tempest Tail Gun. The Refit is upgradable to a Fleet T5-U. So the question is - what about the original Maelstrom?
If you own either the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit OR the original Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class, both will be upgradable for Zen to the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit T5-U.
Of all the concerns going around on this thread, THAT is the one you choose to clarify? I guess getting much needed info will be like pulling teeth with you guys.
Of all the concerns going around on this thread, THAT is the one you choose to clarify? I guess getting much needed info will be like pulling teeth with you guys.
It was likely an answer that could be given because it's not likely something that was taken into consideration for any of the upcoming blogs...
Of all the concerns going around on this thread, THAT is the one you choose to clarify? I guess getting much needed info will be like pulling teeth with you guys.
Or maybe the rest of the info is planned to be revealed in blogs. And they don't reveal info that'll be available in a blog that's only a week away.
It was likely an answer that could be given because it's not likely something that was taken into consideration for any of the upcoming blogs...
Well under the assumption that all the blogs are already preconceived, It's even more important that they address ALL the issues in this thread as well as others that have to do with Delta Rising. It seems they were not taken into consideration ahead of time, otherwise it wouldn't be as big of an issue as it actually is, for one reason or another. Which means its even more important that we get answers now. Hopefully, that makes sense.
Just saw the fed T6 ships and 3 of them are just butt ugly. what were they thinking? Fix this whole upgrade issue because the fed T5 ships are Starfleet ships not those hunk of junk T6's.
Just saw the fed T6 ships and 3 of them are just butt ugly. what were they thinking? Fix this whole upgrade issue because the fed T5 ships are Starfleet ships not those hunk of junk T6's.
I agree with you, but I have to admit that the guardian or whatever cruiser doesn't look half bad. But the rest have got to go. I'm not buying that filth.
I'm sorry guys. I try not to be downright rude, because I'm sure someone put a lot of hard work into those ships. They might be fine work for some other game, but they DO NOT look like Federation ships. As a person who is committed to Federation design and feel- I can't be seen in one of those.
The only ship in that whole pack that is attractive is the MaHa Klingon ship. It is mean, modern, and looks genuinely Klingon. Good job there.
I would've been interested in buying this pack if it wasn't for the design direction that those Federation ships have taken. They are unforgivable. To create a new top-tier class of starships, then to make them so visually undesirable is a hard pill for me to swallow. Count me out.
I agree with you, but I have to admit that the guardian or whatever cruiser doesn't look half bad. But the rest have got to go. I'm not buying that filth.
yeah just saw the concept art for it. it's the ONLY one that looks fed.
Just got done looking over that upgrade list. Only 1 ship on there I have that will be a "free" upgrade. Looks like I'll be falling "Behind the Curve" when the new CashPack is dropped.
Some players have asked about the Fleet Patrol Escort. Specifically about the now retired Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class. For those who dont remember, the original ship in the Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom was removed from the store and replaced with the Fleet Patrol Escort Refit. The Refit has improved stats and a fused Tempest Tail Gun. The Refit is upgradable to a Fleet T5-U. So the question is - what about the original Maelstrom?
If you own either the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit OR the original Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class, both will be upgradable for Zen to the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit T5-U.
Thanks for the heads up.
Just to clarify: So when I upgrade my old FPE: Maelstrom to T5-U it's going to have the console and boff layout and fused tail gun of the new FPE Refit? :eek:
As in, both "input" ships will upgrade into the same "output" ship?
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
Just to clarify: So when I upgrade my old FPE: Maelstrom to T5-U it's going to have the console and boff layout and fused tail gun of the new FPE Refit? :eek:
As in, both "input" ships will upgrade into the same "output" ship?
Yeah, that's pretty much what he said.
"Go play with your DPS in the corner, I don't care how big it is." ~ Me "There... are... four... lights!" ~Jean Luc Picard
Lots and lots and lots and lots and........you get the idea.........of T5 ships in the game that will require an upgrade token.
Personally I wouldn't mind paying something like 5,000 zen to have all current and future T5 ships upgraded as a single cost on my account.
But you're stone cold set in asking us to pay for each and every type of ship to upgrade. Sure you pay to upgrade a ship only once and all current and future characters have access to that upgraded ship for 1 price, but most of my characters have several ships and not all of them have the same ships either.
So.........you say it will cost "between $5 and $10".
If you just said it will cost $5 then everybody would be asking for cheaper. You know damn well nobody would go for a price of $10 per upgrade, but insinuating a possibility of a higher price means we would be more willing to accept a $5 fee and I'm guessing that is exactly what you want.
Upgraded Lockbox ships aren't inferior to T6s ships. Existing lockbox ships lack the 13th bridge officer power once they're upgraded and they don't have a Starship Trait, but they generally have superior hull and shield mods. Additionally a T5-U upgraded lockbox/lobi ship will have 11 console slots vs. a standard T6 ship's 10 console slots.
Thanks,
Phil "Gorngonzolla" Zeleski
Cryptic Studios
Systems Designer
The 13th bridge officer power, is that a Commander/L.C./Lt or Ens. power ??
Understand I haven't seen the stats on T6 but based on the latest release notes about them T5-U is in no way competitive.
I read this is only a partial truth. It reads to me that the T5-U ships will be competitive with the basic T6 ships but have absolutely no way of standing up to the intelligence T6 ships with their extra powers.
I read this is only a partial truth. It reads to me that the T5-U ships will be competitive with the basic T6 ships but have absolutely no way of standing up to the intelligence T6 ships with their extra powers.
Well yeah, got to sell those new tier 6 ships! Seriously though, I saw this coming the moment they released the upgrade details. It doesn't even come as a shock.
Comments
One of the things that, imho, folks are overlooking with all of this is that it's also about being able to provide a variety of ships. Adding the new mechanic to the current ships would defeat the ability to increase the variety of ships.
edit: Argggh, thread merge - brain spasm - help!!! :P
Cmon.....current ships will be plenty viable. t5-u helps pay for more content....it's all good.
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
Pug an ISE...parsing it...take note of all the folks doing 1-2k DPS. Compare that to the number of folks doing over 10k DPS...er...see how many times you can run ISE before you come across somebody that does over 10k DPS actually, eh?
The only thing more rare than folks doing that 15-80k DPS are folks that PvP.
I have little doubt that there will be folks in T5-U (11 console)/T6 boats that are complaining things are too hard while there will be folks in T5 (9 console) boats complaining that things are too easy.
That's just the way of it...
Wow, strawman
I do not want to feel like I should stick to the Single-Player maps, which is all they promise that normal players will be able to do with older ships. I will not pay to upgrade 20 fleet ships to sub-T6. I will not start over with all new T6 ships. Especially since this is only happening because Cryptic wants to shake the money tree.
Its not that hard, you dont need to make up debate points for the other side, hero
Cryptic, I dare you to make me want for you to take my money.
Minor clarification:
From what I understand, the "basic" T5s - Patrol & Advanced Escort, RSV & DSSV, Star and Attack cruisers - have always been the "T5 token ship awarded for hitting L40. Has been this way since F2P started.
The T5+1 ships - especially the "TNG Era Retrofits", started out as "full on pay" ships, however, at the 600 day reward point, they issued a "VA ship token" only to those veterans, capable of purchasing those "Iconic" T5s - and a small handful of KDF ships...
When T5.5 "Fleet" was first announced, they "respected" the prior purchases of any T5 level C-store ship with the "module discount". They also provided a straight-on path straight to fleet level ship - however, said path was on a per-character basis only (so $20 to outfit one character, or $20 to get the base ship for the account then +5 per character...)
Most $25 C-store ships are already at the "fleet" specifications (10 consoles, "enhanced" shield and hull levels compared to the "Basic" T5s) and therefore do not qualify for the "fleet" variant. My Vesta and DSDs, for example, are prime examples of this, along with Oddy/Bort, Regent, etc. cruisers...
Note, the "basic" T5s, the 6 I announced earlier - never got the module discount for owning the previous version - because they are not C-store ships...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
One example of a new T6 ship
http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/game-pack/detail/718-delta-rising-operations-pack
I thought the Federation was forbidden to use cloak technology except for the Defiant.
So, tier 6 ship get built in cloak, active sensor array, probably cruiser commands, and a structural integrity field universal console?
If you own either the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit OR the original Fleet Patrol Escort: Maelstrom Class, both will be upgradable for Zen to the new Fleet Patrol Escort Refit T5-U.
Good to know. Cheers.
Of all the concerns going around on this thread, THAT is the one you choose to clarify? I guess getting much needed info will be like pulling teeth with you guys.
It isn't. It's the 7th ship listed (scrolling down columns rather than across rows).
It was likely an answer that could be given because it's not likely something that was taken into consideration for any of the upcoming blogs...
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
Well under the assumption that all the blogs are already preconceived, It's even more important that they address ALL the issues in this thread as well as others that have to do with Delta Rising. It seems they were not taken into consideration ahead of time, otherwise it wouldn't be as big of an issue as it actually is, for one reason or another. Which means its even more important that we get answers now. Hopefully, that makes sense.
I see it now. It IS listed, but it's listed as a Promo ship instead of with the other non-fleet Vet ships.
I agree with you, but I have to admit that the guardian or whatever cruiser doesn't look half bad. But the rest have got to go. I'm not buying that filth.
The only ship in that whole pack that is attractive is the MaHa Klingon ship. It is mean, modern, and looks genuinely Klingon. Good job there.
I would've been interested in buying this pack if it wasn't for the design direction that those Federation ships have taken. They are unforgivable. To create a new top-tier class of starships, then to make them so visually undesirable is a hard pill for me to swallow. Count me out.
yeah just saw the concept art for it. it's the ONLY one that looks fed.
Thanks for the heads up.
Just to clarify: So when I upgrade my old FPE: Maelstrom to T5-U it's going to have the console and boff layout and fused tail gun of the new FPE Refit? :eek:
As in, both "input" ships will upgrade into the same "output" ship?
Joined January 2009
Yeah, that's pretty much what he said.
"There... are... four... lights!" ~Jean Luc Picard
Personally I wouldn't mind paying something like 5,000 zen to have all current and future T5 ships upgraded as a single cost on my account.
But you're stone cold set in asking us to pay for each and every type of ship to upgrade. Sure you pay to upgrade a ship only once and all current and future characters have access to that upgraded ship for 1 price, but most of my characters have several ships and not all of them have the same ships either.
So.........you say it will cost "between $5 and $10".
If you just said it will cost $5 then everybody would be asking for cheaper. You know damn well nobody would go for a price of $10 per upgrade, but insinuating a possibility of a higher price means we would be more willing to accept a $5 fee and I'm guessing that is exactly what you want.
The 13th bridge officer power, is that a Commander/L.C./Lt or Ens. power ??
I read this is only a partial truth. It reads to me that the T5-U ships will be competitive with the basic T6 ships but have absolutely no way of standing up to the intelligence T6 ships with their extra powers.
Still waiting to be able to use forum titles
Well yeah, got to sell those new tier 6 ships! Seriously though, I saw this coming the moment they released the upgrade details. It doesn't even come as a shock.