AutismThese are the good guys I can count to be following players across instances while pretending in zone chat to be doing absolutely nothing. The good guys who use rl information from players they don't get along with to harass them in zone chat.AutismThe good guys who like to annoy players minding their business and follow them around. The good guys who troll chat channels until they go defunct.
AutismBy contrast, I help players daily in zone chat and in person not to brag how many followers I've gained, but because it's right. But in a game where the good guys make their own definition of what's good, I'm the bad guy.AutismI'm notorious for being un-bullyable across many a mainstream fleet and untouchable by their power-mongering drama. Despised by every fleet leader with a superiority complex and yet I've successfully built an active fleet of free players who kiss up to no one, not even me; all the while running a free game help channel that provides troll-free accurate help to the decent players from many fleets - even Dental.AutismThe nice players who don't start trouble and don't put up with none either, but who consist the majority of the game player base. Does that Wesley guy really want to start adding good guy/bad guy labels? I'm game.
AutismI seen what the good guys do and I'd rather be the bad guy who does what's right, than pseudo-good guy brats who go on troublemaking sprees then hide behind the good members of their fleet and pretend nothing happened.AutismSure they're helpful - to those who keep their mouth shut and go along with the nonsense. I don't. I bow and scrape before no one and I don't care if they don't like it.
AutismAnyone wonder why the majority of this thread revolves around a small group of fleets and their friends who are constantly defending themselves and trying the make believe it's the rest of us who are troublemakers? Because it's no secret what they do and who the names on top of their characters are whenever there is some trouble in-game. Funny thing about trouble, it sticks.
AutismThink about it: Threads like this don't arise from nowhere. There has to be a troublemaker for trouble to start in the first place. As I said before, it starts with the player and ends with the player.
But you know what? I guess it doesn't matter now does it? By being allowed to visit their studios Cryptic has pretty much signed off on you and your fleet haven't they? They've said in deed what most of us have suspected for years. They're not going to stop you. They're not going to correct you. You won. After long last, you really, really won. STO is yours and no one is going to do a thing about it. Congratulations.
I see you've taken the time to write several LENGTHY replies in this thread while failing to address in your other thread that I have offered you a completely valid and reasonable alternative to Dental/NOP affiliated trade channels. You jumped in to shout the word "troll" and disappeared when the replied didn't quite fit your warped perspective on how things really are.
Also, I do require an apology for the baseless slander of "most moderated and warned" player/user. I laid out my record straight for you, and, since it didn't really mesh with your rants, you've yet again decided to overlook it while continuing on your pointless crusade against Dental.
Read the OP -- Threads like this WEREN'T created from nowhere. The OP is not pointing to Dental. This is not a Dental thread. You and your ilk have made it one. No Dental posted in this thread until your tin foil hat brigade jumped in and made it all about Dental based on a screenshot of a Dental TACTICAL observing other players placing cover shields.
But you know what? I guess it doesn't matter now does it? By being allowed to visit their studios Cryptic has pretty much signed off on you and your fleet haven't they? They've said in deed what most of us have suspected for years. They're not going to stop you. They're not going to correct you. You won. After long last, you really, really won. STO is yours and no one is going to do a thing about it. Congratulations.
But you know what? I guess it doesn't matter now does it? By being allowed to visit their studios Cryptic has pretty much signed off on you and your fleet haven't they? They've said in deed what most of us have suspected for years. They're not going to stop you. They're not going to correct you. You won. After long last, you really, really won. STO is yours and no one is going to do a thing about it. Congratulations.
As someone with high functioning autism, I fail to see why autistic reasoning should be disregarded or hurled as an insult. I didn't care for it when certain segments of the community did it.
I personally don't mind it as a label for certain kinds of thinking. I'll freely admit that I engage in autistic thinking and some non-autistic thinking. Heck, I read some interesting reports on a way to supposedly temporarily induce high functioning autism with magnetic fields. I could see a future where people in specialized tasks can turn it on and off.
There are policies and decisions from Cryptic I'd classify as more autistic than others.
If we're talking about it as a mentality, value neutral, then fine. If we're being real, it should probably be statistically common in a Trek game and something we celebrate and accept as a part of the community... and not a fair source of criticism.
If it's being used as an insult or a way to dismiss thinking? That I have a problem with.
Neurotypical != always better. We're talking chocolate and vanilla thinking here. Just because someone may not care for chocolate does not make it objectively inferior.
As someone with high functioning autism, I fail to see why autistic reasoning should be disregarded or hurled as an insult. I didn't care for it when certain segments of the community did it.
I personally don't mind it as a label for certain kinds of thinking. I'll freely admit that I engage in autistic thinking and some non-autistic thinking. Heck, I read some interesting reports on a way to supposedly temporarily induce high functioning autism with magnetic fields. I could see a future where people in specialized tasks can turn it on and off.
There are policies and decisions from Cryptic I'd classify as more autistic than others.
If we're talking about it as a mentality, value neutral, then fine. If we're being real, it should probably be statistically common in a Trek game and something we celebrate and accept as a part of the community... and not a fair source of criticism.
If it's being used as an insult or a way to dismiss thinking? That I have a problem with.
Neurotypical != always better. We're talking chocolate and vanilla thinking here. Just because someone may not care for chocolate does not make it objectively inferior.
any one know what this thread is about im sooo not sure any more
It was originally about a glitch allowing engineers to set up Cover Shields in-game, and people using those to mess with the powerboard racers.
Then "the usual suspects" spotted it and descended like a horde of Anti-Starfleet-Dental locusts to make sure nothing was left but their irrational hatred. They backed their claims with a screenshot of a Tactical captain and several Cover Shields, which Tactical captains cannot create.
And then it...basically went the way of all such threads- it descended into a comedy of over-the-top errors and comparisons like "having screenshots that violate the rules removed is like being censored by World War II fascists," driven by the usual suspects' apparent belief (as evidenced by their own posts and practices) that all rules must be enforced whenever they can be applied against the people the usual suspects don't like but not against the usual suspects themselves because, you know, WWII fascism.
As someone with high functioning autism, I fail to see why autistic reasoning should be disregarded or hurled as an insult. I didn't care for it when certain segments of the community did it.
From as far as I can tell? Because it's being used as a crutch, and an excuse to give abhorrent social behaviour a free pass.
____GREAT LEADERS LET THEIR ACTIONS SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES. [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Heres a better idea, address the thread topic and stop using words you clearly don't know the meaning of.
The thread got derailed hours ago. This is what happens with discussions, they evolve and move around. You're not a mod so I'll discuss what's in the thread, cheers.
Cover shields in the pvp race on Risa are a pretty clear example of exploiting a glitch to grief other players.
Are they griefing though? Like I said earlier, the shield barriers were pretty clearly preventing the people exploiting the p2win nature of the race to lord it over more casual or poorer players. This is not the spirit of the Federation and Gene Roddenberry's vision. The barriers forcing everyone to stop at the end and have a true race without paying for an advantage is a great thing and makes it more a contest of skill, like the winter race.
Who are you to say what's fun and what's not? Dodging unpredictable obstacles is a great traditional racing game mechanic, and wouldn't be done if it weren't fun.
In conclusion, stop being wrong about everything please.
But you know what? I guess it doesn't matter now does it? By being allowed to visit their studios Cryptic has pretty much signed off on you and your fleet haven't they? They've said in deed what most of us have suspected for years. They're not going to stop you. They're not going to correct you. You won. After long last, you really, really won. STO is yours and no one is going to do a thing about it. Congratulations.
The thread got derailed hours ago. This is what happens with discussions, they evolve and move around. You're not a mod so I'll discuss what's in the thread, cheers.
Are they griefing though? Like I said earlier, the shield barriers were pretty clearly preventing the people exploiting the p2win nature of the race to lord it over more casual or poorer players. This is not the spirit of the Federation and Gene Roddenberry's vision. The barriers forcing everyone to stop at the end and have a true race without paying for an advantage is a great thing and makes it more a contest of skill, like the winter race.
How is it not clever? They found a way around the disabling effect on Risa. That's pretty clever.
Why is it not legitimate? Because you declared it so? Who made you the arbiter of legitimate methods of protest?
Who are you to say what's fun and what's not? Dodging unpredictable obstacles is a great traditional racing game mechanic, and wouldn't be done if it weren't fun.
In conclusion, stop being wrong about everything please.
You're defending using a glitch in game to effect the play experience of other players.
Pretty sure it's a breach of the TOS, so it's not legitimate. Pretty much by definition.
You might want to look up the definition of another word, sophistry.
No it's an exploit and using exploits are a violation of the TOS. The players didn't say that, Cryptic/PWE did in the TOS.
This is why this thread is so gut-busting funny.
Okay, back to the basics here: The two points Are. Not. Mutually. Exclusive.
The method of setting these things up despite them supposedly being disabled is, indeed, clever. This does not stop it from being an exploit, any more than it being an exploit automatically means it cannot be clever. It actually is both, simultaneously. It's even a violation of the TOS- which still doesn't stop it from being devilishly clever. It needs to be fixed- but it's still clever.
The entire "you have to be wrong in order for me to be right" logical fallacy is why major malfunctions like this thread keep occurring- because you get two sides that get along like Arabs and Israelis who can't let up until one side or the other is considered "completely right" which will never happen as long as both groups are extremist, all-or-nothing wingnuts.
But you know what? I guess it doesn't matter now does it? By being allowed to visit their studios Cryptic has pretty much signed off on you and your fleet haven't they? They've said in deed what most of us have suspected for years. They're not going to stop you. They're not going to correct you. You won. After long last, you really, really won. STO is yours and no one is going to do a thing about it. Congratulations.
To be fair, this is actually an extremely weak argument because according to the actual text of the TOS, everything is actually against the TOS and a bannable offense already. There is not actually anything you can do or not do to not be banned, everything is against the TOS and whether or not you are banned is entirely at the whim of the powers that be. There is no actual rule of law or due process, the entire thing is completely arbitrary.
To be fair, this is actually an extremely weak argument because according to the actual text of the TOS, everything is actually against the TOS and a bannable offense already. There is not actually anything you can do or not do to not be banned, everything is against the TOS.
True, yet not really relevant unless one wants to go "total anarchist" and insist that since every TOS has the same boilerplate which ultimately means "we can ban you for anything, anytime, for any reason or for none" they must all be abolished and "law of the jungle" instituted.
any one know what this thread is about im sooo not sure any more
It's about dozen or so people trying to give credibility to my assertion from a while ago in regards to just how dumb the STO forums have become lately.
It's about dozen or so people trying to give credibility to my assertion from a while ago in regards to just how dumb the STO forums have become lately.
But you know what? I guess it doesn't matter now does it? By being allowed to visit their studios Cryptic has pretty much signed off on you and your fleet haven't they? They've said in deed what most of us have suspected for years. They're not going to stop you. They're not going to correct you. You won. After long last, you really, really won. STO is yours and no one is going to do a thing about it. Congratulations.
Personally I thought the cover shields were hilarious. It's not hard to jump over them, or just go around. They do add a bit of variety to the race. With that said, kit powers are disabled on Risa, so however they are being spawned should be looked it. Is it game breaking? No.
If people are convinced that a certain fleet(s) are the people behind this, then here is an idea, change instances before the race. It's very easy to press "O" and see who's in your instance. If you see someone you don't like, switch. There's no need to blow a gasket. Rage leads to high blood pressure, which leads to other health problems. You are letting variety...however it's happening, shorten your lives.
I've been reading this thread from the beginning, I saw the pic originally posted. I have yet to see any remotely convincing evidence that Dental is behind this. What I have seen is this thread degrade into a couple of people hell bent on some personal vendetta/crusade against Dental. Reading the posts of these certain, clearly troubled, individuals I can only hope they seek the professional help they desperately need. Honestly, it's a game, it's pixels, calm down.
I have an opinion about the invoking of WWII service people and other comparisons to Nazism that certain, troubled, people have made. However what I want to say about that would most likely get me an infraction, and I'd like to avoid that.
To those Dental representatives monitoring this thread. I am truly sorry you are being subjected to this nonsense. Your fleet, and affiliates, have been nothing but generous, kind, and of great assistance to myself and my fleet. We are forever grateful to you.
Just my 2 cents, thank you for indulging me.
Thank you for the T6 Galaxy Class. - I support Tovan Khev. - Please bring back the exploration missions.
True, yet not really relevant unless one wants to go "total anarchist" and insist that since every TOS has the same boilerplate which ultimately means "we can ban you for anything, anytime, for any reason or for none" they must all be abolished and "law of the jungle" instituted.
Abolished? Instituted? Nothing has to be abolished or instituted. That very declaration IS "law of the jungle". Under a normal, functioning legal system, you can't be convicted of a crime that doesn't exist. They cannot simply make up a crime on the spot and throw you in prison anyway, unless you live in a country where the rule of law doesn't exist and things function by the arbitrary whims of the powers that be.
But that is precisely how the TOS works here. It is therefore meaningless. There is no rule, just the arbitrary whim of those in power. Nothing has to be abolished or instituted. It already has been.
I see you've taken the time to write several LENGTHY replies in this thread while failing to address in your other thread that I have offered you a completely valid and reasonable alternative to Dental/NOP affiliated trade channels. You jumped in to shout the word "troll" and disappeared when the replied didn't quite fit your warped perspective on how things really are.
Also, I do require an apology for the baseless slander of "most moderated and warned" player/user. I laid out my record straight for you, and, since it didn't really mesh with your rants, you've yet again decided to overlook it while continuing on your pointless crusade against Dental.
Read the OP -- Threads like this WEREN'T created from nowhere. The OP is not pointing to Dental. This is not a Dental thread. You and your ilk have made it one. No Dental posted in this thread until your tin foil hat brigade jumped in and made it all about Dental based on a screenshot of a Dental TACTICAL observing other players placing cover shields.
He complains about my posts because it doesn't match the warped perspective he wants others to believe. But the truth stands. I said he was one of the most moderated players I've seen, based on research several months ago of prior threads from years past that he participated in, most now conveniently deleted. They showed page after page of moderations by forum mods of his posts before he became clever enough to assume the 'victim' stance and pretend to play nice while trying to get everyone else in trouble. I only show what he does and how he does it, even if he don't like it.
He owes me more than an apology. For slandering me in pretense accusations that I'm slandering him, for following players around in game, for jumping instances to harass me in game, for having to witness and intervene to stop him and his cronies from trolling other players in zone chat and on the ground; he owes me that he keeps away from my threads, keeps away from me in game, doesn't talk to me and otherwise stays away from me as if he had a court-ordered injunction to do so. For his own protection. Because as anyone whose observed our confrontations can attest, I don't spare any punches in this forum, in game, or anywhere else he asks for trouble in. I owe his ilk nothing but will gladly give what their actions call for anytime they ask for it.
I'm saying that with complete sangfroid and utterly free of agitation, being neither this nor prior posts are rants as they will doubtless again falsely try to twist it as. Nor am I autistic or insane, but a free scientific individual with as much freedom to speak my mind as anyone else. He can waste all the time he wants replying as they no doubt will, but 5 minutes spent on them is 5 too many. He does not get to the point, so I will:
You don't like me, I don't like you. You can troll me all you want you won't get anything from me, and I can grind your face into your own dirt every time. That's what you're stuck with, can't say I didn't warn you all those months ago.
Now you can rant away all you like, I won't be listening. :cool:
Disclaimer: This post is directed to one person and his collaborators only, regardless of the fleets they're in. Their fleets are in no way representative of any unwholesome actions they choose to engage in, which bring shame upon any fleets they are in and disturb an otherwise great and fun game.
So, do you deny the behavior in question is a breach of the TOS, or are you saying that doesn't matter?
Either way, you're wrong.
But I'd love to see if you can come up with some more sophistry to defend the indefensible.
See, here's the thing. You're not interested in a debate. You're just here to scream at Dentals about how we're all griefers and need to be banned and blah blah etc. You've proved this time and time again in every previous iteration of this kind of thread. No matter what I write, you're going to resort to more personal attacks like above. I've said my piece already, if you can't take part in rational debate against my points it's your problem I guess.
But you know what? I guess it doesn't matter now does it? By being allowed to visit their studios Cryptic has pretty much signed off on you and your fleet haven't they? They've said in deed what most of us have suspected for years. They're not going to stop you. They're not going to correct you. You won. After long last, you really, really won. STO is yours and no one is going to do a thing about it. Congratulations.
Comments
"Captain's Log, Supplemental: Today we're continuing our exploration of the very, very strange Planet Charlie Sheen..."
Labelled the appropriate parts for you there.
This is hilarious.
You don't know much about autism.
Might want to avoid throwing a label around that you clearly don't know the meaning of.
I'm just doing what Xtern1ty did!
Are you twelve?
He did it, so I'm doing it?
Grow up.
system Lord Baal is dead
I'm trying to communicate in a way he'll understand. Please calm down.
Heres a better idea, address the thread topic and stop using words you clearly don't know the meaning of.
Cover shields in the pvp race on Risa are a pretty clear example of exploiting a glitch to grief other players.
It's not clever, it's not a legitimate way to protest the flag at the end and it doesn't make the race more fun.
As someone with high functioning autism, I fail to see why autistic reasoning should be disregarded or hurled as an insult. I didn't care for it when certain segments of the community did it.
I personally don't mind it as a label for certain kinds of thinking. I'll freely admit that I engage in autistic thinking and some non-autistic thinking. Heck, I read some interesting reports on a way to supposedly temporarily induce high functioning autism with magnetic fields. I could see a future where people in specialized tasks can turn it on and off.
There are policies and decisions from Cryptic I'd classify as more autistic than others.
If we're talking about it as a mentality, value neutral, then fine. If we're being real, it should probably be statistically common in a Trek game and something we celebrate and accept as a part of the community... and not a fair source of criticism.
If it's being used as an insult or a way to dismiss thinking? That I have a problem with.
Neurotypical != always better. We're talking chocolate and vanilla thinking here. Just because someone may not care for chocolate does not make it objectively inferior.
Well, that explains quite a bit.
It was originally about a glitch allowing engineers to set up Cover Shields in-game, and people using those to mess with the powerboard racers.
Then "the usual suspects" spotted it and descended like a horde of Anti-Starfleet-Dental locusts to make sure nothing was left but their irrational hatred. They backed their claims with a screenshot of a Tactical captain and several Cover Shields, which Tactical captains cannot create.
And then it...basically went the way of all such threads- it descended into a comedy of over-the-top errors and comparisons like "having screenshots that violate the rules removed is like being censored by World War II fascists," driven by the usual suspects' apparent belief (as evidenced by their own posts and practices) that all rules must be enforced whenever they can be applied against the people the usual suspects don't like but not against the usual suspects themselves because, you know, WWII fascism.
From as far as I can tell? Because it's being used as a crutch, and an excuse to give abhorrent social behaviour a free pass.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The thread got derailed hours ago. This is what happens with discussions, they evolve and move around. You're not a mod so I'll discuss what's in the thread, cheers.
Are they griefing though? Like I said earlier, the shield barriers were pretty clearly preventing the people exploiting the p2win nature of the race to lord it over more casual or poorer players. This is not the spirit of the Federation and Gene Roddenberry's vision. The barriers forcing everyone to stop at the end and have a true race without paying for an advantage is a great thing and makes it more a contest of skill, like the winter race.
How is it not clever? They found a way around the disabling effect on Risa. That's pretty clever.
Why is it not legitimate? Because you declared it so? Who made you the arbiter of legitimate methods of protest?
Who are you to say what's fun and what's not? Dodging unpredictable obstacles is a great traditional racing game mechanic, and wouldn't be done if it weren't fun.
In conclusion, stop being wrong about everything please.
You're defending using a glitch in game to effect the play experience of other players.
Pretty sure it's a breach of the TOS, so it's not legitimate. Pretty much by definition.
You might want to look up the definition of another word, sophistry.
This is why this thread is so gut-busting funny.
Okay, back to the basics here: The two points Are. Not. Mutually. Exclusive.
The method of setting these things up despite them supposedly being disabled is, indeed, clever. This does not stop it from being an exploit, any more than it being an exploit automatically means it cannot be clever. It actually is both, simultaneously. It's even a violation of the TOS- which still doesn't stop it from being devilishly clever. It needs to be fixed- but it's still clever.
The entire "you have to be wrong in order for me to be right" logical fallacy is why major malfunctions like this thread keep occurring- because you get two sides that get along like Arabs and Israelis who can't let up until one side or the other is considered "completely right" which will never happen as long as both groups are extremist, all-or-nothing wingnuts.
Thank you for not addressing half my points, you're doing great.
True, yet not really relevant unless one wants to go "total anarchist" and insist that since every TOS has the same boilerplate which ultimately means "we can ban you for anything, anytime, for any reason or for none" they must all be abolished and "law of the jungle" instituted.
It's about dozen or so people trying to give credibility to my assertion from a while ago in regards to just how dumb the STO forums have become lately.
Well, you aren't addressing the fact that it's a TOS violation at all.
Which is what makes the use of a cover shield different to a disco ball.
Fun, clever, none of that matters because the behavior in question is not legitimate in STO.
Simply put, within the rules of the game, there is no defence for this behavior.
It should be stopped.
"Trying?"
Bwaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahaha!
No "trying" to it, they've redefined the term "success" and then some.
Are you twelve?
He did it, so I'm doing it?
Grow up.
If people are convinced that a certain fleet(s) are the people behind this, then here is an idea, change instances before the race. It's very easy to press "O" and see who's in your instance. If you see someone you don't like, switch. There's no need to blow a gasket. Rage leads to high blood pressure, which leads to other health problems. You are letting variety...however it's happening, shorten your lives.
I've been reading this thread from the beginning, I saw the pic originally posted. I have yet to see any remotely convincing evidence that Dental is behind this. What I have seen is this thread degrade into a couple of people hell bent on some personal vendetta/crusade against Dental. Reading the posts of these certain, clearly troubled, individuals I can only hope they seek the professional help they desperately need. Honestly, it's a game, it's pixels, calm down.
I have an opinion about the invoking of WWII service people and other comparisons to Nazism that certain, troubled, people have made. However what I want to say about that would most likely get me an infraction, and I'd like to avoid that.
To those Dental representatives monitoring this thread. I am truly sorry you are being subjected to this nonsense. Your fleet, and affiliates, have been nothing but generous, kind, and of great assistance to myself and my fleet. We are forever grateful to you.
Just my 2 cents, thank you for indulging me.
Nice one, that was almost clever.
So, do you deny the behavior in question is a breach of the TOS, or are you saying that doesn't matter?
Either way, you're wrong.
But I'd love to see if you can come up with some more sophistry to defend the indefensible.
But that is precisely how the TOS works here. It is therefore meaningless. There is no rule, just the arbitrary whim of those in power. Nothing has to be abolished or instituted. It already has been.
He complains about my posts because it doesn't match the warped perspective he wants others to believe. But the truth stands. I said he was one of the most moderated players I've seen, based on research several months ago of prior threads from years past that he participated in, most now conveniently deleted. They showed page after page of moderations by forum mods of his posts before he became clever enough to assume the 'victim' stance and pretend to play nice while trying to get everyone else in trouble. I only show what he does and how he does it, even if he don't like it.
He owes me more than an apology. For slandering me in pretense accusations that I'm slandering him, for following players around in game, for jumping instances to harass me in game, for having to witness and intervene to stop him and his cronies from trolling other players in zone chat and on the ground; he owes me that he keeps away from my threads, keeps away from me in game, doesn't talk to me and otherwise stays away from me as if he had a court-ordered injunction to do so. For his own protection. Because as anyone whose observed our confrontations can attest, I don't spare any punches in this forum, in game, or anywhere else he asks for trouble in. I owe his ilk nothing but will gladly give what their actions call for anytime they ask for it.
I'm saying that with complete sangfroid and utterly free of agitation, being neither this nor prior posts are rants as they will doubtless again falsely try to twist it as. Nor am I autistic or insane, but a free scientific individual with as much freedom to speak my mind as anyone else. He can waste all the time he wants replying as they no doubt will, but 5 minutes spent on them is 5 too many. He does not get to the point, so I will:
You don't like me, I don't like you. You can troll me all you want you won't get anything from me, and I can grind your face into your own dirt every time. That's what you're stuck with, can't say I didn't warn you all those months ago.
Now you can rant away all you like, I won't be listening. :cool:
Disclaimer: This post is directed to one person and his collaborators only, regardless of the fleets they're in. Their fleets are in no way representative of any unwholesome actions they choose to engage in, which bring shame upon any fleets they are in and disturb an otherwise great and fun game.
See, here's the thing. You're not interested in a debate. You're just here to scream at Dentals about how we're all griefers and need to be banned and blah blah etc. You've proved this time and time again in every previous iteration of this kind of thread. No matter what I write, you're going to resort to more personal attacks like above. I've said my piece already, if you can't take part in rational debate against my points it's your problem I guess.