Science Slot = Dual Slot. It fits either Science Module, whether they are Medic or Research.
What would be great is if half of the science powers are either fixed that are broken or the ones that have no purpose are revamped to be useful. Examples Anethizine Gas(haven't even recieved any kind of feedback if this skill is being looked into being fixed or not)=Broken Biofilter=Worthless unless you are fighting romulans or breen if you have some kind of ground set.
With the new Undine cross command kit, it's being labelled as a kit bag. When will this be up for testing, and how can we expect it to differ from current kit abilities? Will it feature new visuals, like the romulan turret for engineers? Will it be a melee focused kit for the Tacs, since they don't have the fleet kit for that yet?
Also, going forward, since we're being allowed to create a costume slot using the kits and armor, can we expect new kits and armor (specifically from reps and factions) to have their own unique visual unlocks?
The only way I could enjoy the revamp is if you treated the Kits like we think of spaceships and mods like we think of Boff skills currently.
What do I mean? Ok let me explain it as simply as possible:
Tactical Captain - has special tactical captain abilities. That's your class bonus skills. Each type of captain has both space and ground abilities that are unique to them even when not wearing a kit or piloting a ship.
Escort (Tactical Ship), has more Slots for DPS oriented consoles typically and provides a higher possibility of using Boff command slots allowing for more tactical skills. This ship however can be piloted by any captain. Additionally, a science captain can have a tactical officer in the Commander slot which gives them access to QL III abilities despite them not being a tactical captain.
Revamped Tactical Kit - Requires you to be a tactical captain, use only tactical abilities in one of several different kinds of kits each with a different slot configuration split between two types of slots. Then several different kinds of mods each in one of the two categories which are locked to a particular class kit type. These come in multiple flavors and colors. This has to be the most convoluted silly system I've heard of recently. It just over complicates the system for no reason while giving little in terms of actual play style choice rewards to the players.
I know you are already headlong into this system and chances of you fixing it to be a good system before release is slim to none, but just in case:
"Tactical Kit" - Usable by (Any Captain), Contains a special ability or set of stats relating to Tactical stuff (since that's what you seem to be doing here anyway), has 1 to 5 mod slots. These mod slots are universal allowing for any kind of mod to be inserted.
If you want to get just a tiny bit more convoluted than the elegant simplicity of my design then by all means you could make it to where there are in fact white/green/blue/purple/ultra-violet kits which determine the number of universal slots you have access to. Or just keep it simple and make the color effect the passive bonuses or the extra ability that is not part of the mod design so you have something to sell in the c-store.
The distinguishing visual factor should be the accent color on the kit textures but the models should be available for everyone. (Eg, I can't stand the visual style of the Tactical kits, but I do like the science and engineering ones from a visual stand point.)
The end result would be my tactical captain can deploy a turret, shield fabricator, have a self heal, stealth if I want or toss a grenade.. and those options determine how my character looks visually.
Are the Mk II kits supposed to be restricted to Lieutenant Commander and higher?
Because right now, if a new player tossed a Mk I kit, they can't access kits until they hit Level 10.
Yes Mk II kits are Lt. Commander and higher. The various ground equipment vendors throughout the game will have common quality Mk I kits and modules, just like they already have Mk I ground and ship weapons, armor, deflectors, etc.
I have to say that I like the way the system for giving kits as mission rewards works. I do have one question though.... How will we acquire Mk X or Mk XI purples? The current system on tribble has no means of acquiring kits like that. AFAICT, mission rewards for kits only go up to Mk X green, not purple, or blue.
You can make a kit out of Mk X green pieces that's approximately equal to a Mk X purple kit, but that's only true if you pick a kit box with a mod that boosts your chosen kit powers.
Yes Mk II kits are Lt. Commander and higher. The various ground equipment vendors throughout the game will have common quality Mk I kits and modules, just like they already have Mk I ground and ship weapons, armor, deflectors, etc.
Except I haven't found any of these vendors. Oversight?
Except I haven't found any of these vendors. Oversight?
Probably an oversight. From the looks of it, EC vendors don't have common quality kit modules yet. But they do have common quality kit frames. The kit frames start at Mk XII, then III, etc. This is strange because usually EC vendors sell common equipment starting at Mk I and going in uneven numbers up to Mk IX (9). So it should go Mk I, Mk III, Mk V, Mk VII, Mk IX.
Probably an oversight. From the looks of it, EC vendors don't have common quality kit modules yet. But they do have common quality kit frames. The kit frames start at Mk XII, then III, etc. This is strange because usually EC vendors sell common equipment starting at Mk I and going in uneven numbers up to Mk IX (9). So it should go Mk I, Mk III, Mk V, Mk VII, Mk IX.
Right. The frames on Tribble were all even numbered commons, starting from II.
What has me confused, though, is that there is only one slot on the Mk II kit - what is the effective difference between an LT and an LTC kit if both only have one slot?
It's possible within the system, but a cross-career kit slot would be extremely powerful. A universal kit slot would be even more powerful. It's something we've planned around making eventually, but not something we're going to roll out with the launch of the revamp.
I really hope this idea never sees the light of day. Class specific powers is a major part of any class based game.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
Right. The frames on Tribble were all even numbered commons, starting from II.
What has me confused, though, is that there is only one slot on the Mk II kit - what is the effective difference between an LT and an LTC kit if both only have one slot?
I don't know. But for my reman character it was showing for the Mk II kits that centurion rank (level 10) was required. That is false. Mk 1 and Mk 2 items are for character levels 1-9 so there seems to be a bug. http://sto.gamepedia.com/Mark#Mark_Tiers
It doesn't make sense since currently with the old system you can get common quality kits in uneven numbers from Mk I to Mk IX from EC vendors, as well as all other types of ground and ship equipment EC vendors sell. And like I said, the kit vendor at DS9 at least has Mk II and Mk III, so they don't have the standard of the old system or even whatever the current system will have.
The only change to the new kits I would make is that the skill boosts that come on kits should be slottable so we can pick what type of skill we want to boost. Will stop us from having to choose between the slot lay out we want or getting the skill boost we want.
: "One important note about this new slotting system: older Kits never contained a full suite of Rank III powers, but new Kits can be filled with all Very Rare (equivalent in power to Rank III) Modules. This means players who participate in the new Kit system will slowly overtake the power level they had reached with previously existing Kits, as they fill out their Modules with better quality powers.
That is very wrong information with the current build on Holodeck.
I will point you to the crafting system on Holodeck... there are MK X purple kits with 4 rank III powers (you deleted those kits from the Tribble crafting by the way...)
EDIT: due to me having posted incorrect information about fleet kits on holodeck.
I'll fix up my post to avoid confusion.
On Holodeck as of April 1 2014
MK X *purple from crafting has 4 rank III abilities
MK XI fleet kit has 3 rank III, 1 rank IV and 1 rank I abilities
MK XII fleet kit has 3 rank III, 1 rank IV and 1 rank II abilities.
--
end of EDIT.
also I strongly disagree with decision to limit kit modules to non purple and only dropping MK XI as loot. Doing elite content should have chance to drop MK XII purple modules. *limit to existing modules if you wish...
I really hope this idea never sees the light of day. Class specific powers is a major part of any class based game.
I really hope you are kidding or trolling. The classes have class based powers.. Those are the things that exist when you take off all your gear.
You can fly any starship you want, train up any Boff to have any skill you want.. What makes you think Ground abilities when they are linked to equipped items should be any different? How about we lock which weapons you can pickup too while we are at it.. can't have those pesky science officers and engineeers using miniguns and assault rifles.. :rolleyes:
Rank 4 is easy. That's the equal of a new Mk XII purple kit module.
Green X mods seem to be the equivalent of a rank 2 power on a MK X kit though.
Yeah, I was forgetting the modules themselves also had MK levels assigned to them. Though it does still make me a little curious in the long run because the slots themselves aren't restricted by MK level. For instance, I can use a MK X module in a MK II kit... So that means anybody who can afford to buy all of the MK XII fleet kits for their class could then use only MK XII very rare modules in their kit, so they'd end up with a kit using all Rank IV equivalent powers.
Actually, just noticed that (at least on Tribble) these modules are all account bind on equip... That means you could give a new level 1 toon a MK X or XII module to use in a low level kit... that's surely not right. With any luck the ability to slot a higher level module into a lower level kit is a bug, but it does still open those questions.
I really hope you are kidding or trolling. The classes have class based powers.. Those are the things that exist when you take off all your gear.
You can fly any starship you want, train up any Boff to have any skill you want.. What makes you think Ground abilities when they are linked to equipped items should be any different? How about we lock which weapons you can pickup too while we are at it.. can't have those pesky science officers and engineeers using miniguns and assault rifles.. :rolleyes:
I'm neither joking nor trolling.
What you mention is not actually something I like about the game. Nothing kicks me more than entering a space battle and seeing a science captain ploughing in head long with an escort.
Not only that, but you are a little mistaken in your point of "train up any Boff to have any skill you want"... no you can't. Certain skills are only trainable at rank III by a captain of that class who has unlocked that skill for training by putting enough skill points in the right boxes. For instance BFAW III can only be trained by Tactical Captains. Or Gravity Well III which can only be trained by Science Captains. So by that same logic, I would not like to see a Science Captain running around with a rank III chroniton mine module, or an Engineering Captain running around with a rank III medical tricorder module.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
Actually, just noticed that (at least on Tribble) these modules are all account bind on equip... That means you could give a new level 1 toon a MK X or XII module to use in a low level kit... that's surely not right. With any luck the ability to slot a higher level module into a lower level kit is a bug, but it does still open those questions.
I think the bug here is that you can use a higher level ability with a low level toon. Even if you give your 1st level character Mark X white gear, he can't use it.
That the kit can slot it doesn't seem like a big issue to me, you can after all equip a Very Rare Mark XII set item in a Miranda - but not if you're still a 1st level character.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Yeah, I was forgetting the modules themselves also had MK levels assigned to them. Though it does still make me a little curious in the long run because the slots themselves aren't restricted by MK level. For instance, I can use a MK X module in a MK II kit... So that means anybody who can afford to buy all of the MK XII fleet kits for their class could then use only MK XII very rare modules in their kit, so they'd end up with a kit using all Rank IV equivalent powers.
Actually, just noticed that (at least on Tribble) these modules are all account bind on equip... That means you could give a new level 1 toon a MK X or XII module to use in a low level kit... that's surely not right. With any luck the ability to slot a higher level module into a lower level kit is a bug, but it does still open those questions.
Well... the modules themselves have a character level associated. Thus I don't think a lower level character could actually USE it. I suspect the kit box will inherit the level requirement of the modules inside it.
On left is a green mk X sonic pulse module, in the center is a fleet Mk XII purple sonic pulse, and on right is a MK X purple legacy kit with sonic pulse. As you can see the stats vary greatly.
Oh and I DO have five powers slotted, but.... the display box is too big.
I think the bug here is that you can use a higher level ability with a low level toon. Even if you give your 1st level character Mark X white gear, he can't use it.
That the kit can slot it doesn't seem like a big issue to me, you can after all equip a Very Rare Mark XII set item in a Miranda - but not if you're still a 1st level character.
Well... the modules themselves have a character level associated. Thus I don't think a lower level character could actually USE it. I suspect the kit box will inherit the level requirement of the modules inside it.
I took this screenshot to demonstrate that it IS a problem.
I put a mark X green module in my account bank then rolled a new toon (sadly couldn't skip tutorial on Tribble so played until I got access to a kit). I was able to slot the MK X green module in my MK I kit with my Level 2 character.
I've no doubt this is not intended behaviour, but very worth reporting so it doesn't end up over looked.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
I put a mark X green module in my account bank then rolled a new toon (sadly couldn't skip tutorial on Tribble so played until I got access to a kit). I was able to slot the MK X green module in my MK I kit with my Level 2 character.
I've no doubt this is not intended behaviour, but very worth reporting so it doesn't end up over looked.
Where you able to USE the Mk X power associated with the module?
Where you able to USE the Mk X power associated with the module?
Yes I was able to use the power. And it had the same stats as it should have for a base MK X green module, without any skill points added to the characters tree. I'm going to put an official bug report up about it in case it gets missed in this thread.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
Comments
What would be great is if half of the science powers are either fixed that are broken or the ones that have no purpose are revamped to be useful. Examples Anethizine Gas(haven't even recieved any kind of feedback if this skill is being looked into being fixed or not)=Broken Biofilter=Worthless unless you are fighting romulans or breen if you have some kind of ground set.
It stays exactly as it was before. If you want to re-make it in the new system, you can do that as well.
Systems Designer - Cryptic Studios
Twitter: @JeffAHamilton
Also, going forward, since we're being allowed to create a costume slot using the kits and armor, can we expect new kits and armor (specifically from reps and factions) to have their own unique visual unlocks?
Oh snap! Didn't notice the 'Science' part. I'm gonna crawl back under my rock before my ginger head gets sunburned.
What do I mean? Ok let me explain it as simply as possible:
Tactical Captain - has special tactical captain abilities. That's your class bonus skills. Each type of captain has both space and ground abilities that are unique to them even when not wearing a kit or piloting a ship.
Escort (Tactical Ship), has more Slots for DPS oriented consoles typically and provides a higher possibility of using Boff command slots allowing for more tactical skills. This ship however can be piloted by any captain. Additionally, a science captain can have a tactical officer in the Commander slot which gives them access to QL III abilities despite them not being a tactical captain.
Revamped Tactical Kit - Requires you to be a tactical captain, use only tactical abilities in one of several different kinds of kits each with a different slot configuration split between two types of slots. Then several different kinds of mods each in one of the two categories which are locked to a particular class kit type. These come in multiple flavors and colors. This has to be the most convoluted silly system I've heard of recently. It just over complicates the system for no reason while giving little in terms of actual play style choice rewards to the players.
I know you are already headlong into this system and chances of you fixing it to be a good system before release is slim to none, but just in case:
"Tactical Kit" - Usable by (Any Captain), Contains a special ability or set of stats relating to Tactical stuff (since that's what you seem to be doing here anyway), has 1 to 5 mod slots. These mod slots are universal allowing for any kind of mod to be inserted.
If you want to get just a tiny bit more convoluted than the elegant simplicity of my design then by all means you could make it to where there are in fact white/green/blue/purple/ultra-violet kits which determine the number of universal slots you have access to. Or just keep it simple and make the color effect the passive bonuses or the extra ability that is not part of the mod design so you have something to sell in the c-store.
The distinguishing visual factor should be the accent color on the kit textures but the models should be available for everyone. (Eg, I can't stand the visual style of the Tactical kits, but I do like the science and engineering ones from a visual stand point.)
The end result would be my tactical captain can deploy a turret, shield fabricator, have a self heal, stealth if I want or toss a grenade.. and those options determine how my character looks visually.
/thread
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Campaign: The Battle of Neverwinter - NWS-DOQXFA4ZD
Prologue: A not so simple plan - NW-DCJG75B9D
Because right now, if a new player tossed a Mk I kit, they can't access kits until they hit Level 10.
Yes Mk II kits are Lt. Commander and higher. The various ground equipment vendors throughout the game will have common quality Mk I kits and modules, just like they already have Mk I ground and ship weapons, armor, deflectors, etc.
You can make a kit out of Mk X green pieces that's approximately equal to a Mk X purple kit, but that's only true if you pick a kit box with a mod that boosts your chosen kit powers.
My character Tsin'xing
Except I haven't found any of these vendors. Oversight?
Probably an oversight. From the looks of it, EC vendors don't have common quality kit modules yet. But they do have common quality kit frames. The kit frames start at Mk XII, then III, etc. This is strange because usually EC vendors sell common equipment starting at Mk I and going in uneven numbers up to Mk IX (9). So it should go Mk I, Mk III, Mk V, Mk VII, Mk IX.
Right. The frames on Tribble were all even numbered commons, starting from II.
What has me confused, though, is that there is only one slot on the Mk II kit - what is the effective difference between an LT and an LTC kit if both only have one slot?
I really hope this idea never sees the light of day. Class specific powers is a major part of any class based game.
That is fun to play
I don't know. But for my reman character it was showing for the Mk II kits that centurion rank (level 10) was required. That is false. Mk 1 and Mk 2 items are for character levels 1-9 so there seems to be a bug. http://sto.gamepedia.com/Mark#Mark_Tiers
It doesn't make sense since currently with the old system you can get common quality kits in uneven numbers from Mk I to Mk IX from EC vendors, as well as all other types of ground and ship equipment EC vendors sell. And like I said, the kit vendor at DS9 at least has Mk II and Mk III, so they don't have the standard of the old system or even whatever the current system will have.
That is very wrong information with the current build on Holodeck.
I will point you to the crafting system on Holodeck... there are MK X purple kits with 4 rank III powers (you deleted those kits from the Tribble crafting by the way...)
EDIT: due to me having posted incorrect information about fleet kits on holodeck.
I'll fix up my post to avoid confusion.
On Holodeck as of April 1 2014
MK X *purple from crafting has 4 rank III abilities
MK XI fleet kit has 3 rank III, 1 rank IV and 1 rank I abilities
MK XII fleet kit has 3 rank III, 1 rank IV and 1 rank II abilities.
--
end of EDIT.
also I strongly disagree with decision to limit kit modules to non purple and only dropping MK XI as loot. Doing elite content should have chance to drop MK XII purple modules. *limit to existing modules if you wish...
Fleet kits have 3 rank III, 1 rank IV and 1 rank II abilities.
Though you are correct that Mark X purple kits and above have at least 4 rank III abilities already so the statement in the dev blog is false.
I am curious to see how the rank IV powers will be handled.
Green X mods seem to be the equivalent of a rank 2 power on a MK X kit though.
My character Tsin'xing
So even I get things wrong.
I'll fix up my post to avoid confusion.
On Holodeck as of April 1 2014
MK X *purple from crafting has 4 rank III abilities
MK XI fleet kit has 3 rank III, 1 rank IV and 1 rank I abilities
MK XII fleet kit has 3 rank III, 1 rank IV and 1 rank II abilities.
I really hope you are kidding or trolling. The classes have class based powers.. Those are the things that exist when you take off all your gear.
You can fly any starship you want, train up any Boff to have any skill you want.. What makes you think Ground abilities when they are linked to equipped items should be any different? How about we lock which weapons you can pickup too while we are at it.. can't have those pesky science officers and engineeers using miniguns and assault rifles.. :rolleyes:
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Campaign: The Battle of Neverwinter - NWS-DOQXFA4ZD
Prologue: A not so simple plan - NW-DCJG75B9D
Yeah, I was forgetting the modules themselves also had MK levels assigned to them. Though it does still make me a little curious in the long run because the slots themselves aren't restricted by MK level. For instance, I can use a MK X module in a MK II kit... So that means anybody who can afford to buy all of the MK XII fleet kits for their class could then use only MK XII very rare modules in their kit, so they'd end up with a kit using all Rank IV equivalent powers.
Actually, just noticed that (at least on Tribble) these modules are all account bind on equip... That means you could give a new level 1 toon a MK X or XII module to use in a low level kit... that's surely not right. With any luck the ability to slot a higher level module into a lower level kit is a bug, but it does still open those questions.
Don't worry man, happens to all of us.
I'm neither joking nor trolling.
What you mention is not actually something I like about the game. Nothing kicks me more than entering a space battle and seeing a science captain ploughing in head long with an escort.
Not only that, but you are a little mistaken in your point of "train up any Boff to have any skill you want"... no you can't. Certain skills are only trainable at rank III by a captain of that class who has unlocked that skill for training by putting enough skill points in the right boxes. For instance BFAW III can only be trained by Tactical Captains. Or Gravity Well III which can only be trained by Science Captains. So by that same logic, I would not like to see a Science Captain running around with a rank III chroniton mine module, or an Engineering Captain running around with a rank III medical tricorder module.
I think the bug here is that you can use a higher level ability with a low level toon. Even if you give your 1st level character Mark X white gear, he can't use it.
That the kit can slot it doesn't seem like a big issue to me, you can after all equip a Very Rare Mark XII set item in a Miranda - but not if you're still a 1st level character.
My character Tsin'xing
On left is a green mk X sonic pulse module, in the center is a fleet Mk XII purple sonic pulse, and on right is a MK X purple legacy kit with sonic pulse. As you can see the stats vary greatly.
Oh and I DO have five powers slotted, but.... the display box is too big.
My character Tsin'xing
I took this screenshot to demonstrate that it IS a problem.
http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff233/khamseen_air/2014-04-02_00001_zps821b596b.jpg
I put a mark X green module in my account bank then rolled a new toon (sadly couldn't skip tutorial on Tribble so played until I got access to a kit). I was able to slot the MK X green module in my MK I kit with my Level 2 character.
I've no doubt this is not intended behaviour, but very worth reporting so it doesn't end up over looked.
My character Tsin'xing
Yes I was able to use the power. And it had the same stats as it should have for a base MK X green module, without any skill points added to the characters tree. I'm going to put an official bug report up about it in case it gets missed in this thread.