I made a new thread earlier (http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=11592181&postcount=630) that got merged into the CS sticky thread so it would not get any attention anymore. A "mild" version of censorship. Your open call for a boycott will probably get you a ban.....................
It's not really any form of censorship - it's the mods doing their job and keeping the billion threads that will no doubt be made on this subject in the same place to stop the main page from clogging up.
Hahahaha, good one. While the whole Tour the universe nerf was absolutely stupid, let me tell you a little somethin' about economics and business.
Business gets no money? Business dies.
If that business happens to be Cryptic? STO dies.
So you want STO to die?
Sounds like your perfectly at peace with the less the marginal customer service and game qualtiy and more than willing to continue to support these terrible decisions regardless if it upsets customers or not..
Yes, if a game dies, another will rise from somewhere else, and probably for the better
Business in trouble - business will start to think and reflect. Usually changes the way things go
Let's just for the sake of argument, say every player boycotted buying stuff for STO.
No money comes in to PWE from STO. PWE sees that STO is not profitable and is losing them money. They tell Cryptic to do something about it and that employees have to be let go because of the loss in revenue. Devs are fired, and the game development slows down. Even if they restore the Tour, the damage is still done. If they don't return it in time or at all, PWE decides to shut down STO.
Sounds like your perfectly at peace with the less the marginal customer service and game qualtiy and more than willing to continue to support these terrible decisions regardless if it upsets customers or not..
Yes, if a game dies, another will rise from somewhere else, and probably for the better
Wrong. Customer Service does suck. There are plenty of bugs. Removing the Tour was a terrible decision.
What I'm saying is a bad idea is boycotting spending money on this game.
Business in trouble - business will start to think and reflect. Usually changes the way things go
One minor flaw in this case. Think and reflect + Cryptic = ...does not compute.
Besides it's pwe calling the shots. I honestly can't believe that the people at cryptic would be so foolish as to......bahahahaha...no I can't even type that without bursting out laughing.
I don't see what the big deal is with the short course. It still required planning and constant attention. Also, it was much more repetitive than the normal course, mind-numbingly repetitive. That was the price to pay for doing it that way. But there was a price, and people could choose either method depending on their situation or mood.
Well, at least now I can just go through one run and save a lot of time, now that I don't have a choice. Although I don't see much point in making a fast ship anymore. Too bad.
Btw, someone said you can get just as much EC from foundry missions. Doesn't the loot cap prevent that?
Business in trouble - business will start to think and reflect. Usually changes the way things go
Not necessarily. MMO companies, especially ones like PWE with multiple MMOs, will just shut down the one that isn't performing well and refocus their assets toward the ones that are. I've seen it before. Basically if STO starts performing badly, they will transfer funds and personnel to NW (since it's the new shiny MMO on the block), and shut down STO.
It's possible that they could take the lessons learned and try to change the game to be more palatable, but it's also just as likely (maybe more so) that they will take those lessons and apply them to future ventures while discontinuing the under performing product instead.
I'm not saying that you should be happily paying Cryptic when you aren't happy with the game. Not at all. By all means speak with your wallet. Just realize that Cryptic shutting down the game is a very real possibility if it starts doing badly.
While there are many things about this I hate - the fact it is being called an "exploit" when it clearly isn't, and the fact it wasn't included in any patch notes - both stupid acts on behalf of cryptic that further damage everyone's opinion of them, I actually think this is a positive thing for the game economy.
Agreed, I don't think Cryptic would know an actual exploit, even if it came up and bit them on the......
Very bad and shoddy game design on the part of Cryptic, yes.
If your girlfriend does you wrong, you break up with that girl if warranted. It might take you awhile to find another girl who is into the same things that you are (like Star Trek), but in the end if can live without her you are better off.
If your girlfriend does you wrong, you break up with that girl if warranted. It might take you awhile to find another girl who is into the same things that you are (like Star Trek), but in the end if can live without her you are better off.
Usually when someone breaks up with STO they stalk it on the forums, talking trash about it making sure it's not having fun with another guy
This will only create INFLATION not DEFLATION. Run to an exchange terminal and see for yourself. People are not able to do this for EC will charge more for their items on the exchange to make up the difference. Other people placing items competitively will also sell at a higher level.
That's not how economies work. Reducing the money supply does not cause inflation.
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
This will only create INFLATION not DEFLATION. Run to an exchange terminal and see for yourself. People are not able to do this for EC will charge more for their items on the exchange to make up the difference. Other people placing items competitively will also sell at a higher level.
[ ] Understands how inflation works.
If there is less EC available in-game, people have less, and therefore people will pay less for items, driving the cost down.
How many players buy keys with zen, simply to put them on the exchange and make EC?
How many players will continue to do this?
How many players rely on this event as a source of income, to purchase said keys?
If fewer players can afford the keys, will the prices actually drop, or will the players paying with Zen to get them simply not sell them, as the profit margin is too low?
As the key sales decline, but demand stays the same, what happens to the key prices?
As the result of key prices increasing, what happens to lockbox ship prices?
Any form of work that results in EC contributes to the above situation. Keys are only one example, but they are one example of how removing one good form of EC income can hurt the economy in large scale ways, both in Zen sales and in EC sales. You could also apply this to fleet ship modules, which then trickles down, and impacts entire fleets.
I for one agree that the "not working as intended" (I'll refrain from calling it an exploit) part of the Tour needs addressing, but this is simply not a good way to do this. This solution has caused more problems than existed prior to the "fix".
This will only create INFLATION not DEFLATION. Run to an exchange terminal and see for yourself. People are not able to do this for EC will charge more for their items on the exchange to make up the difference. Other people placing items competitively will also sell at a higher level.
The EC still has to come from somewhere for that. They won't sell at higher prices due to lack of ec, and prices on the exchange will go down.
Usually when someone breaks up with STO they stalk it on the forums, talking trash about it making sure it's not having fun with another guy
True enough. I still play (we still hang out sometimes, like 3x a week), if only to get my fix of Trek.I write this as I was just booted from an Azure Nebula Rescue attempt, Server Not Responding then logged off.
Everybody is willing to deal with flaws but how long can one continue to point out flaws while new flaws constantly pop up only to continue to see old flaws ignored. It is a test of one's devotion.
That's not how economies work. Reducing the money supply does not cause inflation.
This is true. The reason some items sell for such ridiculously high amounts is because there is so much EC out there that people will actually pay it. Reduce the amount of EC they won't be able to pay and therefore the seller will have to drop the price.
Yes, there will be some short sighted people who will try to sell items for insanely high prices to compensate, but they'll be undercut. Especially if the trend of undercutting to the point of selling for less than vendor price continues as I've seen. (Incidentally, a result of loot farm abuse)
I don't think this was the right way to handle the Tour, but something did need to be done.
This nerf will help in driving players to illegally buy EC from outside sources I presume. Won't be me as I know under what conditions those grinders work but it's a sad predictable effect of what will happen.
Come on people, we are not sheep we are customers and we have rights!
You have the right to not play a free game. You have the right to not pay for Zen. You have the right to not participate. You have the right to get what you pay for, but not to dictate what they sell you, or for how much.
This is exactly the same as you going to the Supermarket and buying a pack of 6 beers for 5 (Insert local denomination here) and then when you get home someone from the shop comes and says sorry we nerfed that product and taking two beers off you.
No, it's more buying a six pack of beer for $5 and then later you go back to the store and the price has changed because the store realized they were losing money at that price, or because their supplier increased their price, or someone was buying beer from the store and reselling it for a higher price elsewhere, or for whatever reason the store owner realized they were charging too little. Then you go to the store and accuse them of ripping you off.
You have the choice to go buy your beer somewhere else.
This nerf will help in driving players to illegally buy EC from outside sources I presume. Won't be me as I know under what conditions those grinders work but it's a sad predictable effect of what will happen.
Comments
It's not really any form of censorship - it's the mods doing their job and keeping the billion threads that will no doubt be made on this subject in the same place to stop the main page from clogging up.
Kirk's Protege.
You forgot something.
Business in trouble - business will start to think and reflect. Usually changes the way things go
Sounds like your perfectly at peace with the less the marginal customer service and game qualtiy and more than willing to continue to support these terrible decisions regardless if it upsets customers or not..
Yes, if a game dies, another will rise from somewhere else, and probably for the better
Let's just for the sake of argument, say every player boycotted buying stuff for STO.
No money comes in to PWE from STO. PWE sees that STO is not profitable and is losing them money. They tell Cryptic to do something about it and that employees have to be let go because of the loss in revenue. Devs are fired, and the game development slows down. Even if they restore the Tour, the damage is still done. If they don't return it in time or at all, PWE decides to shut down STO.
:cool:
Tbh I am sure amazed that you moaning mummies boys want to kill this game off
Wrong. Customer Service does suck. There are plenty of bugs. Removing the Tour was a terrible decision.
What I'm saying is a bad idea is boycotting spending money on this game.
One minor flaw in this case. Think and reflect + Cryptic = ...does not compute.
Besides it's pwe calling the shots. I honestly can't believe that the people at cryptic would be so foolish as to......bahahahaha...no I can't even type that without bursting out laughing.
Well, at least now I can just go through one run and save a lot of time, now that I don't have a choice. Although I don't see much point in making a fast ship anymore. Too bad.
Btw, someone said you can get just as much EC from foundry missions. Doesn't the loot cap prevent that?
Yeah, s'like 400-700k per day per account
Kirk's Protege.
Not necessarily. MMO companies, especially ones like PWE with multiple MMOs, will just shut down the one that isn't performing well and refocus their assets toward the ones that are. I've seen it before. Basically if STO starts performing badly, they will transfer funds and personnel to NW (since it's the new shiny MMO on the block), and shut down STO.
It's possible that they could take the lessons learned and try to change the game to be more palatable, but it's also just as likely (maybe more so) that they will take those lessons and apply them to future ventures while discontinuing the under performing product instead.
I'm not saying that you should be happily paying Cryptic when you aren't happy with the game. Not at all. By all means speak with your wallet. Just realize that Cryptic shutting down the game is a very real possibility if it starts doing badly.
Mine Trap Supporter
Agreed, I don't think Cryptic would know an actual exploit, even if it came up and bit them on the......
Very bad and shoddy game design on the part of Cryptic, yes.
Well, IMO that is a good thing. Maybe a competent developer will get ahold of the IP and show us Trek fans what a quality trek MMO should be.
Usually when someone breaks up with STO they stalk it on the forums, talking trash about it making sure it's not having fun with another guy
That's not how economies work. Reducing the money supply does not cause inflation.
[ ] Understands how inflation works.
If there is less EC available in-game, people have less, and therefore people will pay less for items, driving the cost down.
It doesn't work the way you think it does....
Kirk's Protege.
How many players buy keys with zen, simply to put them on the exchange and make EC?
How many players will continue to do this?
How many players rely on this event as a source of income, to purchase said keys?
If fewer players can afford the keys, will the prices actually drop, or will the players paying with Zen to get them simply not sell them, as the profit margin is too low?
As the key sales decline, but demand stays the same, what happens to the key prices?
As the result of key prices increasing, what happens to lockbox ship prices?
Any form of work that results in EC contributes to the above situation. Keys are only one example, but they are one example of how removing one good form of EC income can hurt the economy in large scale ways, both in Zen sales and in EC sales. You could also apply this to fleet ship modules, which then trickles down, and impacts entire fleets.
I for one agree that the "not working as intended" (I'll refrain from calling it an exploit) part of the Tour needs addressing, but this is simply not a good way to do this. This solution has caused more problems than existed prior to the "fix".
The EC still has to come from somewhere for that. They won't sell at higher prices due to lack of ec, and prices on the exchange will go down.
Exploit: Anything the game's Chinese overlords don't perceive as "grindy" enough.
say for 100 Z-points you would get a $1 million or so
a bit less than keys to encourage people to still buy keys with Z-points and sell them for more EC
But Cryptic could inject EC into the game by making you spend more $$ on the game!!
True enough. I still play (we still hang out sometimes, like 3x a week), if only to get my fix of Trek.I write this as I was just booted from an Azure Nebula Rescue attempt, Server Not Responding then logged off.
Everybody is willing to deal with flaws but how long can one continue to point out flaws while new flaws constantly pop up only to continue to see old flaws ignored. It is a test of one's devotion.
This is true. The reason some items sell for such ridiculously high amounts is because there is so much EC out there that people will actually pay it. Reduce the amount of EC they won't be able to pay and therefore the seller will have to drop the price.
Yes, there will be some short sighted people who will try to sell items for insanely high prices to compensate, but they'll be undercut. Especially if the trend of undercutting to the point of selling for less than vendor price continues as I've seen. (Incidentally, a result of loot farm abuse)
I don't think this was the right way to handle the Tour, but something did need to be done.
You have the right to not play a free game. You have the right to not pay for Zen. You have the right to not participate. You have the right to get what you pay for, but not to dictate what they sell you, or for how much.
No, it's more buying a six pack of beer for $5 and then later you go back to the store and the price has changed because the store realized they were losing money at that price, or because their supplier increased their price, or someone was buying beer from the store and reselling it for a higher price elsewhere, or for whatever reason the store owner realized they were charging too little. Then you go to the store and accuse them of ripping you off.
You have the choice to go buy your beer somewhere else.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → Ⓑ Ⓐ
Man I hated that zone chat EC selling spam.
NOTHING HAS CHANGED ON THE EXCHANGE.
Simulated game economies work very similarly to real-world economies.
Kirk's Protege.