I find it interesting that the new consoles blur the choice between mobility and damage soaking.
I always thought that trade-off was a nice touch, allowing one to prioritise and/or mix and match, depending on one's preferences/mindset. With these things, we can just get both.
On the one hand, allowing allroundness seems nice. On the other, allowing people to patch up all weaknesses without tradeoffs seems a recipe for dull gameplay.
I have a fleet excelsior which is the fastest base turn rate cruiser from the fed shipyard, with 2 purple MK 11 RCS consoles i still dont break the 20 degree turn rate and thats WITH the helmsman trait which i recently got. I dropped it down to one purp RCS console and stacked neutronium.
"You know when that shark bites, with its teeth dear... scarlet billows start to spread..."
I have a fleet excelsior which is the fastest base turn rate cruiser from the fed shipyard, with 2 purple MK 11 RCS consoles i still dont break the 20 degree turn rate and thats WITH the helmsman trait which i recently got. I dropped it down to one purp RCS console and stacked neutronium.
I am not sure what you are doing wrong mate. My tacs is rather new, and her fleet excelsior runs with 2 Mk Xi blue RCS and a Tachyo. My turn sits somewhere in the neighborhood of 23-25 before APO or APA. You do have 9 in SIT, yes? Engine power is somewhere around 80 with bonus.
I find it interesting that the new consoles blur the choice between mobility and damage soaking.
I always thought that trade-off was a nice touch, allowing one to prioritise and/or mix and match, depending on one's preferences/mindset. With these things, we can just get both.
On the one hand, allowing allroundness seems nice. On the other, allowing people to patch up all weaknesses without tradeoffs seems a recipe for dull gameplay.
well there is still a trade off. Its just not as much oof one.
And there are always those who werent using either of these consoles before and may not feel the need to get one.
It will be a bigger deal when they add fleet tac consoles. Since everybody uses them and they are all functionaly the same. Their lack of variation may make them too powerful with these kinds of additions.
As a time traveller, Am I supposed to pack underwear or underwhen?
Not everything you see on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
One thing is become VERY clear from all the QQing and Flaming in this thread: The Jem Bug needs a MAJOR NERF!!!:D
I hope this is sarcasm, because the Bug Ship definitely does not hold the title as the only best escort in the game anymore. Anyone still whining about the Bug ship is clearly uniformed to all of the new content, or simply lacking overall knowledge of escorts and possibly pvp in general.
So stop using bug ship as a scapegoat to not balance the game. It is a sad excuse for a strawman.
I hope this is sarcasm, because the Bug Ship definitely does not hold the title as the only best escort in the game anymore. Anyone still whining about the Bug ship is clearly uniformed to all of the new content, or simply lacking overall knowledge of escorts and possibly pvp in general.
So stop using bug ship as a scapegoat to not balance the game. It is a sad excuse for a strawman.
ALthough I agree, I find it hard to figure out what the best escort in the game is right now. I think it's probably the fleet Ha'feh however...
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Wow. Those consoles. How are we supposed to kill people now?
Yep thanks Cryptic for making sci captains in sci ships even less viable now. Unless they plan on changing back our particle abilities to exotic damage I don't see us doing anything to benefit anyone in either PVE or PVP.
More buffs for large developed fleets, leaving ANYONE else in the dust.
Bravo with your end-game content... Do these old missions over and over to build this new holding.. then buy some ultra OP equipment, and go back to doing the same old content. Or faceroll anyone who isnt in a T5 fleet.
Bravo Gents. Making the game better and better one update at a time. :rolleyes:
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Your Javelin deals 125417 (89066) Disruptor Damage(Critical) to Tholian Recluse. > lol
they are giving sensor analysis to other non-sci ships, they know sensor analysis is useless now with all the jamming procs, they gave subsys targeting to other non-sci ships too, they know it limits a ship with only 6 weapons slots to have a beam to fully get the advantage of the ship, reducing its effectiveness in other types of builds, i just feel bad for flying a sci ship in pvp ... its like they dont know what they are doing ... how many times i have to say to boost tachyon beam, cpb and psw ...
Skilling, Special Consoles that boost, Leech and even the use of cycling Energy Siphon are all routes to keeping a high power band.
So, essentially not possible for escorts than.
With Leech, 9 points in Flow Capacitors, RMC, Assimilated Module, other skills, and the +20 shield DOFF, I can get my power levels to 125 (actual is 166)/123/98/106. With the new warp cores, I should be able to get 125/123/102/106.
with only 2 energy syphons, 6 points in flow caps, leech and 3 mk xi rare super cheap flow caps consoles i can keep the whole ship at 125 for the whole match, and im using a nooby warp core and no maco shield and doffs
they are giving sensor analysis to other non-sci ships, they know sensor analysis is useless now with all the jamming procs, they gave subsys targeting to other non-sci ships too, they know it limits a ship with only 6 weapons slots to have a beam to fully get the advantage of the ship, reducing its effectiveness in other types of builds, i just feel bad for flying a sci ship in pvp ... its like they dont know what they are doing ... how many times i have to say to boost tachyon beam, cpb and psw ...
they are killing everything that is non-tac !
i called it back when they introduced the snb doff.
You know, I am going to probably get flamed hard for this, but I think it would have been better if a lot of these consoles were cruiser only. My reasoning being that even if they are designed for engineering heavy ships, which cruisers are, there are too many other non-cruiser ships that are just as engineering heavy console-wise. Example, the Fleet Patrol Escort, Fleet Mogai, Jem'hadar Attack Ship, etc. Those ships would also be able to take advantage of these very powerful consoles very effectively, since all 3 of the ones I listed have 4 engineering console slots. Something you usually only see on cruisers, but you get the idea behind my comment.
As for the warp cores, those look very interesting. I am looking forward to when they finally hit Holodeck, albeit that means I'll probably have to beg some fleet to gain access to them since my fleet is currently sitting at just under tier 3 and not likely to tier up anytime in the near future.
But those engineering consoles are quite... powerful, especially with the added bonuses, especially the turn ones. I can see it now, escorts using those nuetronium turn consoles, becoming harder to kill, cruisers running 4 RCS consoles with added resistance... man PvP will be highly entertaining IF those consoles ever hit holodeck.
My only concern here is that this level of power creep is just ridiculous. However, it will be somewhat mitigated by the requirement of a Tier V fabricator, which in theory SHOULD limit the number of these consoles making an appearance, which is then nullified by the sheer number of fleets that already have that XD.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
My only concern here is that this level of power creep is just ridiculous. However, it will be somewhat mitigated by the requirement of a Tier V fabricator, which in theory SHOULD limit the number of these consoles making an appearance, which is then nullified by the sheer number of fleets that already have that XD.
The consoles are tied to Dil MIne fleet holding coming the 20th, not to the base. I haven't heard about needing a T5 Fabricator for any of it.
I find these consoles to be disappointing, and not because they don't have good stats, but because their stats are too good. Cryptic should have done like they did with the Embassy Science consoles, add features to encourage use of unpopular consoles. If anything, RCS, Monotanium, and Neutronium are the exact consoles that should *NOT* have fleet variants (just like there is no Embassy Field Generator).
Cryptic missed a great chance to add some life to the Eng consoles that no one touches anymore.
Should have been stuff like this:
Advanced Booster Modulator Mk XII [Gra][Sen] (+4.2 Aux power, +10 Graviton Generators, +10 Sensors)
Advanced Injector Assembly Mk XII [Aux][Spd] (+4.2 Eng power, Clears Eng offline after 4 seconds, +5% flight speed)
Advanced Field Emitter Mk XII [Def][Em] (+4.2 Shd power, +2.5% Defense, +10 Shield Emitter)
Advanced Plasma Distribution Manifold Mk XII [Acc][Proc] (+4.2 Wep Power, +2.5% Accuracy, +.5% proc chance)
Advanced Diburnium Hull Plating Mk XII [Asb] (+42.5 Phaser/Disruptor Resist, 2.5% chance to nullify phaser/disruptor damage (cannot occur more than once every 10 seconds))
Advanced Emergency Force Fields Mk XII [Res][Rgn] (+42% Able and Alive Crewman Restistance, +10 to all damage resist, Slowly returns crew from disabled status)
Advanced EPS Flow Regulator Mk XII [Eff][Drn] (+85% Power Transfer Rate, +10 Warp Core Efficiency, 1% chance for a weapon to not drain power when firing)
I find these consoles to be disappointing, and not because they don't have good stats, but because their stats are too good. Cryptic should have done like they did with the Embassy Science consoles, add features to encourage use of unpopular consoles. If anything, RCS, Monotanium, and Neutronium are the exact consoles that should *NOT* have fleet variants (just like there is no Embassy Field Generator).
agreed but I think they know that and they want people to stop making them ingame or buy them with ec from other people.Looks like they are working to make all stuffs cost dilithium (so you either buy dilithium with zen or grind 1000 years ...no more easy to get ec).They will only kill the exchange ,nadorc doff asigment ,small fleets and ingame economy .
You know, I am going to probably get flamed hard for this, but I think it would have been better if a lot of these consoles were cruiser only. My reasoning being that even if they are designed for engineering heavy ships, which cruisers are, there are too many other non-cruiser ships that are just as engineering heavy console-wise. Example, the Fleet Patrol Escort, Fleet Mogai, Jem'hadar Attack Ship, etc. Those ships would also be able to take advantage of these very powerful consoles very effectively, since all 3 of the ones I listed have 4 engineering console slots. Something you usually only see on cruisers, but you get the idea behind my comment.
As for the warp cores, those look very interesting. I am looking forward to when they finally hit Holodeck, albeit that means I'll probably have to beg some fleet to gain access to them since my fleet is currently sitting at just under tier 3 and not likely to tier up anytime in the near future.
But those engineering consoles are quite... powerful, especially with the added bonuses, especially the turn ones. I can see it now, escorts using those nuetronium turn consoles, becoming harder to kill, cruisers running 4 RCS consoles with added resistance... man PvP will be highly entertaining IF those consoles ever hit holodeck.
My only concern here is that this level of power creep is just ridiculous. However, it will be somewhat mitigated by the requirement of a Tier V fabricator, which in theory SHOULD limit the number of these consoles making an appearance, which is then nullified by the sheer number of fleets that already have that XD.
As a captain with a bug ship that will most definatly be upgrading to an rcs neutronium I totally agree with you. It actually makes sense that cruisers were built amd designed to take advantage of more tanky equipment. Just like light, medium and heavy armors in other rpgs escorts, sci ships and cruisers should have similar limitations
I find these consoles to be disappointing, and not because they don't have good stats, but because their stats are too good. Cryptic should have done like they did with the Embassy Science consoles, add features to encourage use of unpopular consoles. If anything, RCS, Monotanium, and Neutronium are the exact consoles that should *NOT* have fleet variants (just like there is no Embassy Field Generator).
Cryptic missed a great chance to add some life to the Eng consoles that no one touches anymore.
Should have been stuff like this:
Advanced Booster Modulator Mk XII [Gra][Sen] (+4.2 Aux power, +10 Graviton Generators, +10 Sensors)
Advanced Injector Assembly Mk XII [Aux][Spd] (+4.2 Eng power, Clears Eng offline after 4 seconds, +5% flight speed)
Advanced Field Emitter Mk XII [Def][Em] (+4.2 Shd power, +2.5% Defense, +10 Shield Emitter)
Advanced Plasma Distribution Manifold Mk XII [Acc][Proc] (+4.2 Wep Power, +2.5% Accuracy, +.5% proc chance)
Advanced Diburnium Hull Plating Mk XII [Asb] (+42.5 Phaser/Disruptor Resist, 2.5% chance to nullify phaser/disruptor damage (cannot occur more than once every 10 seconds))
Advanced Emergency Force Fields Mk XII [Res][Rgn] (+42% Able and Alive Crewman Restistance, +10 to all damage resist, Slowly returns crew from disabled status)
Advanced EPS Flow Regulator Mk XII [Eff][Drn] (+85% Power Transfer Rate, +10 Warp Core Efficiency, 1% chance for a weapon to not drain power when firing)
Indeed that is the way I was thinking they would go. Still not too late to get some added tho.
As a time traveller, Am I supposed to pack underwear or underwhen?
Not everything you see on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
They finally throw a lifeline to Engi heavy ships and the alphascorts are already whining. :rolleyes:
There's a number of Escorts out there that have a respectable amount of ENG Console slots. Imagine those benefitting from these new consoles, on top of the already existing firepower and maneuverability Escorts can already do.
The consoles are tied to Dil MIne fleet holding coming the 20th, not to the base. I haven't heard about needing a T5 Fabricator for any of it.
You are correct, I thought they were like the standard Engineering things, but then I read the dev blog and saw that the warp cores and uber engi consoles required a tier III dil mine.
My mistake.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
I find these consoles to be disappointing, and not because they don't have good stats, but because their stats are too good. Cryptic should have done like they did with the Embassy Science consoles, add features to encourage use of unpopular consoles. If anything, RCS, Monotanium, and Neutronium are the exact consoles that should *NOT* have fleet variants (just like there is no Embassy Field Generator).
I agree with this sentiment.
But lets look at why Cryptic decided to power creep the heck out of these consoles. The embassy has a lot of new shinies to encourage players to grind for them. Boffs, kits, doffs, sci consoles, consumables, etc. What exciting new things is the mine bringing other than the Engi consoles? Horta doffs? Mining for extra Dil? It seems useful enough but hardly exciting. If anything its going to devalue Dil so the Dil farmers aren't happy and the regular players would not be excited were it not for the engi consoles.
So yeah,the engi consoles are very powerful as a way to make up for the lack of anything else exciting coming from mines. Its standard operating procedure for Cryptic, passify players with extra shiny shinies if there isn't much else to keep them interested.
Comments
I always thought that trade-off was a nice touch, allowing one to prioritise and/or mix and match, depending on one's preferences/mindset. With these things, we can just get both.
On the one hand, allowing allroundness seems nice. On the other, allowing people to patch up all weaknesses without tradeoffs seems a recipe for dull gameplay.
Name them, show me pictures or videos...
I have a fleet excelsior which is the fastest base turn rate cruiser from the fed shipyard, with 2 purple MK 11 RCS consoles i still dont break the 20 degree turn rate and thats WITH the helmsman trait which i recently got. I dropped it down to one purp RCS console and stacked neutronium.
I am not sure what you are doing wrong mate. My tacs is rather new, and her fleet excelsior runs with 2 Mk Xi blue RCS and a Tachyo. My turn sits somewhere in the neighborhood of 23-25 before APO or APA. You do have 9 in SIT, yes? Engine power is somewhere around 80 with bonus.
well there is still a trade off. Its just not as much oof one.
And there are always those who werent using either of these consoles before and may not feel the need to get one.
It will be a bigger deal when they add fleet tac consoles. Since everybody uses them and they are all functionaly the same. Their lack of variation may make them too powerful with these kinds of additions.
Not everything you see on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
Occidere populo et effercio confractus
I hope this is sarcasm, because the Bug Ship definitely does not hold the title as the only best escort in the game anymore. Anyone still whining about the Bug ship is clearly uniformed to all of the new content, or simply lacking overall knowledge of escorts and possibly pvp in general.
So stop using bug ship as a scapegoat to not balance the game. It is a sad excuse for a strawman.
| Join Date: January 2009 | Computer | Fleet: Broken Wings |
ALthough I agree, I find it hard to figure out what the best escort in the game is right now. I think it's probably the fleet Ha'feh however...
Is it not possible with Tactical officers in escorts?
I am most curious as well.
R.I.P
Yep thanks Cryptic for making sci captains in sci ships even less viable now. Unless they plan on changing back our particle abilities to exotic damage I don't see us doing anything to benefit anyone in either PVE or PVP.
More buffs for large developed fleets, leaving ANYONE else in the dust.
Bravo with your end-game content... Do these old missions over and over to build this new holding.. then buy some ultra OP equipment, and go back to doing the same old content. Or faceroll anyone who isnt in a T5 fleet.
Bravo Gents. Making the game better and better one update at a time. :rolleyes:
Your Javelin deals 125417 (89066) Disruptor Damage(Critical) to Tholian Recluse. > lol
they are killing everything that is non-tac !
With Leech, 9 points in Flow Capacitors, RMC, Assimilated Module, other skills, and the +20 shield DOFF, I can get my power levels to 125 (actual is 166)/123/98/106. With the new warp cores, I should be able to get 125/123/102/106.
i called it back when they introduced the snb doff.
they dont like science.
at all.
Do you even Science Bro?
As for the warp cores, those look very interesting. I am looking forward to when they finally hit Holodeck, albeit that means I'll probably have to beg some fleet to gain access to them since my fleet is currently sitting at just under tier 3 and not likely to tier up anytime in the near future.
But those engineering consoles are quite... powerful, especially with the added bonuses, especially the turn ones. I can see it now, escorts using those nuetronium turn consoles, becoming harder to kill, cruisers running 4 RCS consoles with added resistance... man PvP will be highly entertaining IF those consoles ever hit holodeck.
My only concern here is that this level of power creep is just ridiculous. However, it will be somewhat mitigated by the requirement of a Tier V fabricator, which in theory SHOULD limit the number of these consoles making an appearance, which is then nullified by the sheer number of fleets that already have that XD.
The consoles are tied to Dil MIne fleet holding coming the 20th, not to the base. I haven't heard about needing a T5 Fabricator for any of it.
I.R.W. Raptor's Claw
Storm Eagle Class Warbird Fleet Ha'feh
I have never trusted humans, and I never will
Cryptic missed a great chance to add some life to the Eng consoles that no one touches anymore.
Should have been stuff like this:
Advanced Booster Modulator Mk XII [Gra][Sen] (+4.2 Aux power, +10 Graviton Generators, +10 Sensors)
Advanced Injector Assembly Mk XII [Aux][Spd] (+4.2 Eng power, Clears Eng offline after 4 seconds, +5% flight speed)
Advanced Field Emitter Mk XII [Def][Em] (+4.2 Shd power, +2.5% Defense, +10 Shield Emitter)
Advanced Plasma Distribution Manifold Mk XII [Acc][Proc] (+4.2 Wep Power, +2.5% Accuracy, +.5% proc chance)
Advanced Diburnium Hull Plating Mk XII [Asb] (+42.5 Phaser/Disruptor Resist, 2.5% chance to nullify phaser/disruptor damage (cannot occur more than once every 10 seconds))
Advanced Emergency Force Fields Mk XII [Res][Rgn] (+42% Able and Alive Crewman Restistance, +10 to all damage resist, Slowly returns crew from disabled status)
Advanced EPS Flow Regulator Mk XII [Eff][Drn] (+85% Power Transfer Rate, +10 Warp Core Efficiency, 1% chance for a weapon to not drain power when firing)
I.R.W. Raptor's Claw
Storm Eagle Class Warbird Fleet Ha'feh
I have never trusted humans, and I never will
agreed but I think they know that and they want people to stop making them ingame or buy them with ec from other people.Looks like they are working to make all stuffs cost dilithium (so you either buy dilithium with zen or grind 1000 years ...no more easy to get ec).They will only kill the exchange ,nadorc doff asigment ,small fleets and ingame economy .
As a captain with a bug ship that will most definatly be upgrading to an rcs neutronium I totally agree with you. It actually makes sense that cruisers were built amd designed to take advantage of more tanky equipment. Just like light, medium and heavy armors in other rpgs escorts, sci ships and cruisers should have similar limitations
Indeed that is the way I was thinking they would go. Still not too late to get some added tho.
Not everything you see on the internet is true - Abraham Lincoln
Occidere populo et effercio confractus
There's a number of Escorts out there that have a respectable amount of ENG Console slots. Imagine those benefitting from these new consoles, on top of the already existing firepower and maneuverability Escorts can already do.
Nope, I don't have a bug either. I do however have a FPE.
You are correct, I thought they were like the standard Engineering things, but then I read the dev blog and saw that the warp cores and uber engi consoles required a tier III dil mine.
My mistake.
I agree with this sentiment.
But lets look at why Cryptic decided to power creep the heck out of these consoles. The embassy has a lot of new shinies to encourage players to grind for them. Boffs, kits, doffs, sci consoles, consumables, etc. What exciting new things is the mine bringing other than the Engi consoles? Horta doffs? Mining for extra Dil? It seems useful enough but hardly exciting. If anything its going to devalue Dil so the Dil farmers aren't happy and the regular players would not be excited were it not for the engi consoles.
So yeah,the engi consoles are very powerful as a way to make up for the lack of anything else exciting coming from mines. Its standard operating procedure for Cryptic, passify players with extra shiny shinies if there isn't much else to keep them interested.