i don't know if this has been asked anywhere (or addressed at all), but is there any possibility of having craftable warp cores?
even if there's a multi-part quest chain to make them, it would be better than only being able to buy them for dilithium or looting them from destroyed ships.
The sad thing is this: despite the buff/nerf/whatever this is, there's still nothing better to put in the slots, so nothing will change. You'll still put Power To Weapons and Power to Shields because they are still the most effective options in all situations, even if there's a gap in defence time or the damage has come down.
Without Tac team at all, I guarantee you won't stand more than 10-20 secs to a fully buffed DECENT (not great, or best or whatever, just decent) escort pilot. Unless 10 sec of that time you use rsp. but after rsp is over, you will die. When you have a moment and mood for a quick test, please let me know, I can prove what I just said (in a very friendly and non-cocky way of course ).
with doffs for eptox cooldown or aux2batt build (w 3 purple tech), why would you ever run 2 copies of the same ep2x? That would be silly...
Once shield is gone, so are you, 2-5 secs later, depending on how many buffs the escort that hits you has.
Lol as long if in all in good fun and to see if these changes are as bad as some have suggested. I would like to test this as I want cruiser continue to be quite tanky.... But i honestly have never used tac team but tend to last quite a bit vs a escorts even the ones in kumari's.... I don't use just RSP that would be stupid lol. But also if i get in really dire states especially when multiple ships targeting just me I will change to max shield power.
But also keep in mind I am built specifically to survive and not so much in the damage area so its not likely that I could kill a escort.. I am much more support in pvp.
I have face a lot of decently equipped escorts but maybe you will prove me wrong. Any one with a lot of purple doffs as long as they make sense to your build are more then decently equipped mind you.
I don't use purple tech can't afford them, and I'm primarily ept__ build.
i don't know if this has been asked anywhere (or addressed at all), but is there any possibility of having craftable warp cores?
even if there's a multi-part quest chain to make them, it would be better than only being able to buy them for dilithium or looting them from destroyed ships.
I certainly hope so, and it would certainly be very logical to actually build the things.
The sad thing is this: despite the buff/nerf/whatever this is, there's still nothing better to put in the slots, so nothing will change. You'll still put Power To Weapons and Power to Shields because they are still the most effective options in all situations, even if there's a gap in defence time or the damage has come down.
Leading to the general thinking that there needs to be a boff power revamp for engineers. The ens and lt abilities by and large are Emergency powers, except engineering team 1 I believe.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
The sad thing is this: despite the buff/nerf/whatever this is, there's still nothing better to put in the slots, so nothing will change. You'll still put Power To Weapons and Power to Shields because they are still the most effective options in all situations, even if there's a gap in defence time or the damage has come down.
Leading to the general thinking that there needs to be a boff power revamp for engineers. The ens and lt abilities by and large are Emergency powers, except engineering team 1 I believe.
Signed +1
/10char
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
Except you don't seem to understand how they stack, and Virusdancer does.
Here's an example formula using 125 Shield Power (35% res), EPTS 3 (30% res), Res A (15% Res) + [ADAPT]x10 stacks (20% res) vs. Phasers:
=1-((1-0.35)*(1-0.3)*(1-0.15)*((1-0.02)^10))*0.9
why *0.9 at the end? Where does it comes from? I knew it was something like that (you don't add resists, you use one resist after another, like layers) but this 0.9 modifier... I didn't expect this. Because adding % isn't precise but it works more or less if you don't want to do the math, but here you're ruining my estimate.
I want to make a point about EPtA, but I will also say that I'm dubious of the changes to EPtS as well. It seems like you've increased incoming damage and nerfed defense at the same time.
Anyway, EPtA needs to be adjusted to be in line with EPtW. In this form, EPtA gives a skill bonus to certain science skills. This represents diminishing returns when we consider captain training. It will have more effect for people not trained in a skill. It will have less effect on people who are fully trained and equipped. Conversely, EPtW adds a percentage increase to damage for the duration. EPtA should provide a percentage boost to the effect of a given set of science skills. Either that or it should provide a very large bonus (50 points or more) to the science skills. Also, you should include flow caps in the bonus. All the flow cap skills are resisted to high heck (at least in PvP), so we need some help there.
To put that another way... EPtA will do more for the tractor beam on an escort than big science skills on a science vessel. This shouldn't be.
why *0.9 at the end? Where does it comes from? I knew it was something like that (you don't add resists, you use one resist after another, like layers) but this 0.9 modifier... I didn't expect this. Because adding % isn't precise but it works more or less if you don't want to do the math, but here you're ruining my estimate.
I believe it comes from that fact that only 90% of the damage is applied to shields. The rest of the damage is applied to hull. If you have resilient shields, then only 5% of the damage is applied to hull instead of 10%; strangely, it seems that 90% of the damage is still applied to shields though.
This. In any MMO, the first sign that something isn't balanced is when absolutely everyone is doing it. If everyone is using 2x epts, it is no longer really an optional ability, is it? What probably really needs to happen is a general change to how shields work so it is no longer necessary to run it and new tactics can evolve. Changes like this in test give the devs a chance to see what works and what doesn't. Keeping everything the same just leaves things that are kinda broken, broken.
I kinda like this idea, I'd rather see many things change than be stuck with the boring EPTS x2.
Lets be honest even with the changes to the EPT A,E,and W most people are still going to be using S x2...so the work to buff the other three is kind of wasted.
I'd much rather see some possible buff to shields or whatever and not have 2 EPTS be mandatory, that way we can actually use these new changes you made to the other three.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
I hope this patch doesn't go live given how most here know nerfing EPTS is a bad idea now.
Instead of nerfing all versions of EPTS why not look at other ways to lower shield resistance. Lower amount of stacking elite shields can do, get rid of ResA/ResB, and consider looking at doffs that allow EPTS3 to be used with full uptime (technicians and damage control engineers)
Also why not make science useful to help stop unkillable zombie builds instead. Lets make things like tachyon beam, tachyon drones, CPB and anything else that can drain shields more effective by letting these abilities also lower shield resists. Power insultators resisting shield drain should also be toned down a little.
I believe it comes from that fact that only 90% of the damage is applied to shields. The rest of the damage is applied to hull. If you have resilient shields, then only 5% of the damage is applied to hull instead of 10%; strangely, it seems that 90% of the damage is still applied to shields though.
Agreed, though I'd make them 15s, 20s, 25s respectively to a give a little down time if that's what the devs are aiming at achieving in the top tier of the ability.
nerfs escort tanking, leaves cruisers with almost constant up time.
And I'd extend that mechanic to all other emergency powers too.
I hate the be the odd man out sometimes, but I have a very different view on the "nerf" of the EPtS.
I'll put it bluntly in my point of view: It's a buff to cruisers running EPtS, not a nerf.
Yes, I know all of you are looking at me crazy right now, but here's my reasoning:
Based on a standard build of running 2 copies of EPtS, this is indeed a nerf from this point of view.
However, I run a double Aux2Bat cruiser boat (3 very rare technicians) and it's looking very promising right now. Why? Because I can actually close that 10 second gap. Let me demonstrate:
0s: 1st use of EPtS3
0s: Use of 1st copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 30 seconds
10s: Use of 2nd copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in again (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 5 + however many seconds left on the timer of the buff duration.
Here's the basics: because the power buff currently on holodeck is at 30 seconds, the game system will not currently let me reduce the cooldown below that point. That means with this build, I still have to wait 30 seconds before the next EPtS. However, because of the coming changes foreshadowing from tribble, the power buff will be reduced to 20 seconds, which means...
Bottom line: I can now use EPtS3 every 20 seconds instead of 30 seconds.
EDIT: For those of you wondering, yes I only have 1 copy of EPtS3.
__________________________________________________
All hands! Prepare the popcorn and tinfoil hats!
I have to question the Devs decisions, it really makes me have a bad feeling.
They are making Escorts even more powerful in PvE and PvP, and Cruisers just less appealing ships to fly. Really losing the impression they really do play the game. Balance is just getting more and more unbalanced in these balancing attempts.
here's another thought, sci ships have innate subsytem targeting, maybe give cruisers innate emergency power too skills. those can actual be emergency power, say a +20 boost to 1 of the 4 subsystems, with a 2 minute cooldown. all completely separate from the now called 'power to' abilities. could think up something for escorts to maybe, but frankly they dont need or deserve some inate extra like this. they are already the bast chassis of ship by far. if you gave the patrol escort the assault cruisers station setup, it would be a hugely better assault cruiser then the current assault cruiser.
I like the idea.
Even if Cryptic doesn't want subsystems, maybe have them as innate ship characteristics. Like some cruisers enhancing shields to last longer and thus no 10 second gap. The Galaxy could give a flat power boost due to the large warp core, thus easier time to full power to shields.
Escorts, the Defiant could benefit from armor plating, the Prometheus a bonus to beam weaponry. And the Patrol, a bonus to speed.
I hate the be the odd man out sometimes, but I have a very different view on the "nerf" of the EPtS.
I'll put it bluntly in my point of view: It's a buff to cruisers running EPtS, not a nerf.
Yes, I know all of you are looking at me crazy right now, but here's my reasoning:
Based on a standard build of running 2 copies of EPtS, this is indeed a nerf from this point of view.
However, I run a double Aux2Bat cruiser boat (3 very rare technicians) and it's looking very promising right now. Why? Because I can actually close that 10 second gap. Let me demonstrate:
0s: 1st use of EPtS3
0s: Use of 1st copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 30 seconds
10s: Use of 2nd copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in again (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 5 + however many seconds left on the timer of the buff duration.
Here's the basics: because the power buff currently on holodeck is at 30 seconds, the game system will not currently let me reduce the cooldown below that point. That means with this build, I still have to wait 30 seconds before the next EPtS. However, because of the coming changes foreshadowing from tribble, the power buff will be reduced to 20 seconds, which means...
Bottom line: I can now use EPtS3 every 20 seconds instead of 30 seconds.
EDIT: For those of you wondering, yes I only have 1 copy of EPtS3.
The cooldown doesn't drop below 30 seconds with aux2bat because of the global cooldown, not because of the buff duration.
You're still only going to be able to activate it every 30 seconds.
Agreed, though I'd make them 15s, 20s, 25s respectively to a give a little down time if that's what the devs are aiming at achieving in the top tier of the ability.
nerfs escort tanking, leaves cruisers with almost constant up time.
Do you guys not understand that their are already built-in tiered benefits for taking the higher tiers of powers like EPTS already?
On top of that, you totally TRIBBLE any Cruiser that wants to actually be played like a proper healer and takes EPTS 1x2 in order to take powers like ES, Aux to SIF, ET 3, etc.
As much as I enjoy escort tanking with two EPtS1's, I do see this change as being necessary because the present EPtS with 30 seconds duration completely nullifies any required player activation considerations whether or not to use the ability. This makes the current EPtS a must-use macro function every time it is up, thereby diminishing player thought and strategy considerations.
Another problem with the current EPtS is that it completely nullifies shield subsystem targetting -- there is no window of opportunity to sneak torpedoes through an open shield simply because EPtS will always repair a disabled shield with 100% uptime. This will also make Engineering Team viable again since it will be needed to cover the 10-second EPtS-coverage gap that will result from the update. I haven't slotted Engineering Team in over a year because EPtS made it largely unnecessary.
I hate the be the odd man out sometimes, but I have a very different view on the "nerf" of the EPtS.
I'll put it bluntly in my point of view: It's a buff to cruisers running EPtS, not a nerf.
Yes, I know all of you are looking at me crazy right now, but here's my reasoning:
Based on a standard build of running 2 copies of EPtS, this is indeed a nerf from this point of view.
However, I run a double Aux2Bat cruiser boat (3 very rare technicians) and it's looking very promising right now. Why? Because I can actually close that 10 second gap. Let me demonstrate:
0s: 1st use of EPtS3
0s: Use of 1st copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 30 seconds
10s: Use of 2nd copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in again (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 5 + however many seconds left on the timer of the buff duration.
Here's the basics: because the power buff currently on holodeck is at 30 seconds, the game system will not currently let me reduce the cooldown below that point. That means with this build, I still have to wait 30 seconds before the next EPtS. However, because of the coming changes foreshadowing from tribble, the power buff will be reduced to 20 seconds, which means...
Bottom line: I can now use EPtS3 every 20 seconds instead of 30 seconds.
EDIT: For those of you wondering, yes I only have 1 copy of EPtS3.
Sorry, I tried that.
Think of it this way.
Once per cycle with tree purple technicians, you can reduce your boff recharge by 60% Two uses of aux to batt. on paper.
So that's something like 14 seconds off each, leading to a little less than 28 second reduction on Emergency powers.
But this allows us only to keep two powers active simultaneously. I have never once been able to overlap and have the same power active twice. So I can have EptW and EptS active consistently, but you can't double up on EptS, not the same one or different.
And it's not the buff you're running into, it's the cooldown. 45 seconds on the same ability. 30 second uptime. It cuts it down just enough so that the power is ready to use again. BUT, the cooldown remains the same and the power duration is shorter. The Devs knew what they were doing with this nerf across all builds.
Do you guys not understand that their are already built-in tiered benefits for taking the higher tiers of powers like EPTS already?
On top of that, you totally TRIBBLE any Cruiser that wants to actually be played like a proper healer and takes EPTS 1x2 in order to take powers like ES, Aux to SIF, ET 3, etc.
True. You'll have to be more selfish with your heals due to the possibility of being taken out.
As much as I enjoy escort tanking with two EPtS1's, I do see this change as being necessary because the present EPtS with 30 seconds duration completely nullifies any required player activation considerations whether or not to use the ability. This makes the current EPtS a must-use macro function every time it is up, thereby diminishing player thought and strategy considerations.
Another problem with the current EPtS is that it completely nullifies shield subsystem targetting -- there is no window of opportunity to sneak torpedoes through an open shield simply because EPtS will always repair a disabled shield with 100% uptime. This will also make Engineering Team viable again since it will be needed to cover the 10-second EPtS-coverage gap that will result from the update. I haven't slotted Engineering Team in over a year because EPtS made it largely unnecessary.
Do you mean sci team? Eng team repairs hull.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
No, I mean Engineering Team -- it repairs all disabled subsystems. If your shields get knocked out by Target Subsystem Shields-3 with an incoming High Yield 3 Quantum volley or Omega torpedo inbound while tractor-beamed, Sci-Team will not save you.
...because the present EPtS with 30 seconds duration completely nullifies any required player activation considerations whether or not to use the ability. This makes the current EPtS a must-use macro function every time it is up, thereby diminishing player thought and strategy considerations.
I don't think you understand how that is actually a deeper nerf to how cruisers function.
Take a look at the ensign powers available, there are ONLY 5 powers.
4 of which are in the same family of cooldowns.
These powers were specifically designed to be cycled so they could interact with one another and not held in reserve for some false notion of 'strategy' considerations.
So unless the devs want to completely unlock the shared cooldowns in the EPTx family their changes here are a net nerf to cruisers. (and from arbiterhawk's tone, I get the feeling they were not trying to nerf cruisers, but they are in fact doing this incidentally.
If you don't think Eng team is "viable" the only thing I can tell you is that you are most likely not playing in any actual competitive PvP environment.
I promise you both ET and ST, and the higher versions specifically, are not only "viable", they are absolutely critical healer skills.
Escorts cover the team with TT, Healers cover the team with ET and ST.
While I'm here I might as well some of the other, most likely accidental, nerfs to Cruisers in this new design.
Here's another fun consequence of a sudden gap vs. a toning down of resistance numbers.
Cruiser running EPTS 3
vs.
Escort running EPTS 1
Which one has larger resistance dip during the 10s gap?
(hint Cruiser loses 30% resistance and approx 35 power, Escort loses 18% resistance and approx 20 power)
Which ship class is running EPTW to hit that 125 (or overcap) to run their 8 weapons? (Answer = Cruisers)
Which ship will lose more DPS when that EPTW 10s gap happens?
(Answer = Cruisers)
Result = The ship class currently performing the worst in PvP, with the highest reliance on the worst weapon (Beam Arrays) actually continues to face even more nerfs and can no longer even count on higher resistance with gapless coverage.
Those higher shield modifiers that Cruisers have? They mean little when you can't maneuver well enough to bring other shield facings into play and have no resistance to protect them.
Instead of toning resistances down across the board to make pressure damage viable, instead we get a 33% gap in EPTS coverage - which is a net gain for spike damage and another loss to pressure damage.
Adding to this, ETPW which was a cruiser go to power for boosting their pressure DPS is now a power that will favor spikes instead of the energy intense 8x beam array Cruiser load with FAW.
I was thinking on this a bit, maybe a good start they can undo the Field Generator nerf from last year? Maybe give shields a little more buffing here and there or maybe a little nerfing of all energy weapons which is the less preferable option.
I'd like to be able to use EPTA on Sci/Carriers but even with these changes looks like will still need EPTS x2.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
I don't think you understand how that is actually a deeper nerf to how cruisers function.
Take a look at the ensign powers available, there are ONLY 5 powers.
4 of which are in the same family of cooldowns.
These powers were specifically designed to be cycled so they could interact with one another and not held in reserve for some false notion of 'strategy' considerations.
So unless the devs want to completely unlock the shared cooldowns in the EPTx family their changes here are a net nerf to cruisers. (and from arbiterhawk's tone, I get the feeling they were not trying to nerf cruisers, but they are in fact doing this incidentally.
I don't dispute that the EPtS duration cut is a nerf. However, I also don't agree that EPtS should remain the button mash-fest that it is now. Since Emergency Power to Shield can run non-stop, it might as well be renamed "Re-energize Shields" and de-coupled from the shared cooldown pool instead.
If you don't think Eng team is "viable" the only thing I can tell you is that you are most likely not playing in any actual competitive PvP environment.
I promise you both ET and ST, and the higher versions specifically, are not only "viable", they are absolutely critical healer skills.
Escorts cover the team with TT, Healers cover the team with ET and ST.
That's how optimized premade PvP teams function.
You are correct -- I don't usually participate in premade team PVP because it just isn't profitable (I make millions more EC from purple drops whenever I farm any of the PVE Fleet actions). However, I still enjoy team vs. team free-for-alls with fleet mates because it they are quite fun.
ET hasn't been needed in my builds because of the Red Matter Capacitor. The latter repairs system disables and doesn't interfere with my Tactical Team Rotation. Adapted MACO Engine hot-restart counter engine shut downs. EPtS counters shield disables. AP-Omega counters Viral Matrix (or used to... not sure about present status). Target-Aux... I don't see the latter used much at all. Given all of the above, Engineering Team has not been worth taking for quite some time. The upcoming EPtS revision will change this since shield subsystem targeting will become a viable threat again.
For every single person who is claiming this is such a hardcore nerf to devoted tanking cruisers, you have absolutely no idea how to tank. As a matter of fact, I am completely unphased by this change as a devoted tank cruiser. I do however take issue with the change to emergency power to engines because of the PvP implications regarding it. Particularly that there is still the power level increase to go with the new changes, you are essentially making someone's defense skyrocket right through the roof on for a full 20 seconds with no real way to counter that on an escort player who also runs a doffed omega 3. The only effective way to shut down an escort pilot with these changes is viral/SNB. If you take the defensive boost out of the equation for speed, I might not have have such an issue with that particular change. All of the other emergency power abilities I can live with except for engines. And as for shields, if you think this is a serious and brutal killing blow to being a devoted tank, then you have clearly not learned how to tank in a cruiser because I almost never have to rely on EPtS except in the case of an actual emergency. And all I do is run missions on elite difficulty both solo and STF not to mention PvP.
While I'm here I might as well some of the other, most likely accidental, nerfs to Cruisers in this new design.
Here's another fun consequence of a sudden gap vs. a toning down of resistance numbers.
Cruiser running EPTS 3
vs.
Escort running EPTS 1
Which one has larger resistance dip during the 10s gap?
(hint Cruiser loses 30% resistance and approx 35 power, Escort loses 18% resistance and approx 20 power)
Which ship class is running EPTW to hit that 125 (or overcap) to run their 8 weapons? (Answer = Cruisers)
Which ship will lose more DPS when that EPTW 10s gap happens?
(Answer = Cruisers)
Result = The ship class currently performing the worst in PvP, with the highest reliance on the worst weapon (Beam Arrays) actually continues to face even more nerfs and can no longer even count on higher resistance with gapless coverage.
Those higher shield modifiers that Cruisers have? They mean little when you can't maneuver well enough to bring other shield facings into play and have no resistance to protect them.
Instead of toning resistances down across the board to make pressure damage viable, instead we get a 33% gap in EPTS coverage - which is a net gain for spike damage and another loss to pressure damage.
Adding to this, ETPW which was a cruiser go to power for boosting their pressure DPS is now a power that will favor spikes instead of the energy intense 8x beam array Cruiser load with FAW.
Your statement is full of flaws for a multitude of reasons. Good cruiser pilots will barely be affected by these changes, particularly engineering cruisers. One of the best things about engineering cruiser pilots is that they don't "need" emergency power to shield to be an effective tank/support healer. Running at max shield power allows for mad shield regeneration and if you are an engineer, all you need is the full Mark 12 assimilated borg set and your shields will regenerate so much with the reputation bonuses as well that you might as well be flying a resilient shield. Not the mention the assimilated borg procs that are inherent to the assimilated set in the first place, allow for ridiculous self healing and makes for support healing far easier to manage. Considering that I only have one EPtS that I barely use, being an effective tank is something to consider when you take in consideration where strengths are with certain gear and power formats.
For every single person who is claiming this is such a hardcore nerf to devoted tanking cruisers, you have absolutely no idea how to tank. As a matter of fact, I am completely unphased by this change as a devoted tank cruiser. I do however take issue with the change to emergency power to engines because of the PvP implications regarding it. Particularly that there is still the power level increase to go with the new changes, you are essentially making someone's defense skyrocket right through the roof on for a full 20 seconds with no real way to counter that on an escort player who also runs a doffed omega 3. The only effective way to shut down an escort pilot with these changes is viral/SNB. If you take the defensive boost out of the equation for speed, I might not have have such an issue with that particular change. All of the other emergency power abilities I can live with except for engines. And as for shields, if you think this is a serious and brutal killing blow to being a devoted tank, then you have clearly not learned how to tank in a cruiser because I almost never have to rely on EPtS except in the case of an actual emergency. And all I do is run missions on elite difficulty both solo and STF not to mention PvP.
I dunno if you recognized, but there are other ships out there except cruisers. With a sci ship you mostly can?t afford to run max shield power. And for a matter of fact, cause of the weak hull sci ships have, you have to rely on shield tanking even more.
Reynolds/Thokal
U.S.S. Helios -Vesta Class/R.R.W. Dark Science - Dyson Surveillance Science Destroyer U.S.S. Donut - Fleet Advanced Research Vessel Retrofit TheWiseGuys
Comments
even if there's a multi-part quest chain to make them, it would be better than only being able to buy them for dilithium or looting them from destroyed ships.
A double edged sword maybe. I had help from others working all of that out by the way, I'm not trying to pass myself off as some math-wizard.
Lol as long if in all in good fun and to see if these changes are as bad as some have suggested. I would like to test this as I want cruiser continue to be quite tanky.... But i honestly have never used tac team but tend to last quite a bit vs a escorts even the ones in kumari's.... I don't use just RSP that would be stupid lol. But also if i get in really dire states especially when multiple ships targeting just me I will change to max shield power.
But also keep in mind I am built specifically to survive and not so much in the damage area so its not likely that I could kill a escort.. I am much more support in pvp.
I have face a lot of decently equipped escorts but maybe you will prove me wrong. Any one with a lot of purple doffs as long as they make sense to your build are more then decently equipped mind you.
I don't use purple tech can't afford them, and I'm primarily ept__ build.
Leading to the general thinking that there needs to be a boff power revamp for engineers. The ens and lt abilities by and large are Emergency powers, except engineering team 1 I believe.
/10char
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
why *0.9 at the end? Where does it comes from? I knew it was something like that (you don't add resists, you use one resist after another, like layers) but this 0.9 modifier... I didn't expect this. Because adding % isn't precise but it works more or less if you don't want to do the math, but here you're ruining my estimate.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
Anyway, EPtA needs to be adjusted to be in line with EPtW. In this form, EPtA gives a skill bonus to certain science skills. This represents diminishing returns when we consider captain training. It will have more effect for people not trained in a skill. It will have less effect on people who are fully trained and equipped. Conversely, EPtW adds a percentage increase to damage for the duration. EPtA should provide a percentage boost to the effect of a given set of science skills. Either that or it should provide a very large bonus (50 points or more) to the science skills. Also, you should include flow caps in the bonus. All the flow cap skills are resisted to high heck (at least in PvP), so we need some help there.
To put that another way... EPtA will do more for the tractor beam on an escort than big science skills on a science vessel. This shouldn't be.
I totally stink at math I'm afraid, so sorry for a dumb question.
Does all that equal 71% resistance?
I believe it comes from that fact that only 90% of the damage is applied to shields. The rest of the damage is applied to hull. If you have resilient shields, then only 5% of the damage is applied to hull instead of 10%; strangely, it seems that 90% of the damage is still applied to shields though.
See mancom's post on this:
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=7213421&postcount=32
I kinda like this idea, I'd rather see many things change than be stuck with the boring EPTS x2.
Lets be honest even with the changes to the EPT A,E,and W most people are still going to be using S x2...so the work to buff the other three is kind of wasted.
I'd much rather see some possible buff to shields or whatever and not have 2 EPTS be mandatory, that way we can actually use these new changes you made to the other three.
Instead of nerfing all versions of EPTS why not look at other ways to lower shield resistance. Lower amount of stacking elite shields can do, get rid of ResA/ResB, and consider looking at doffs that allow EPTS3 to be used with full uptime (technicians and damage control engineers)
Also why not make science useful to help stop unkillable zombie builds instead. Lets make things like tachyon beam, tachyon drones, CPB and anything else that can drain shields more effective by letting these abilities also lower shield resists. Power insultators resisting shield drain should also be toned down a little.
Just about, yep. That formula is excel friendly, lol. :cool:
Yep, that's who showed me the error in my original calc.
Agreed, though I'd make them 15s, 20s, 25s respectively to a give a little down time if that's what the devs are aiming at achieving in the top tier of the ability.
nerfs escort tanking, leaves cruisers with almost constant up time.
And I'd extend that mechanic to all other emergency powers too.
I'll put it bluntly in my point of view: It's a buff to cruisers running EPtS, not a nerf.
Yes, I know all of you are looking at me crazy right now, but here's my reasoning:
Based on a standard build of running 2 copies of EPtS, this is indeed a nerf from this point of view.
However, I run a double Aux2Bat cruiser boat (3 very rare technicians) and it's looking very promising right now. Why? Because I can actually close that 10 second gap. Let me demonstrate:
0s: 1st use of EPtS3
0s: Use of 1st copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 30 seconds
10s: Use of 2nd copy of Aux2Bat <-triple technician cooldown reduction kicks in again (-30% cooldown on all Boff abilities) -> EPtS3 cooldown is now at 5 + however many seconds left on the timer of the buff duration.
Here's the basics: because the power buff currently on holodeck is at 30 seconds, the game system will not currently let me reduce the cooldown below that point. That means with this build, I still have to wait 30 seconds before the next EPtS. However, because of the coming changes foreshadowing from tribble, the power buff will be reduced to 20 seconds, which means...
Bottom line: I can now use EPtS3 every 20 seconds instead of 30 seconds.
EDIT: For those of you wondering, yes I only have 1 copy of EPtS3.
All hands! Prepare the popcorn and tinfoil hats!
They are making Escorts even more powerful in PvE and PvP, and Cruisers just less appealing ships to fly. Really losing the impression they really do play the game. Balance is just getting more and more unbalanced in these balancing attempts.
I like the idea.
Even if Cryptic doesn't want subsystems, maybe have them as innate ship characteristics. Like some cruisers enhancing shields to last longer and thus no 10 second gap. The Galaxy could give a flat power boost due to the large warp core, thus easier time to full power to shields.
Escorts, the Defiant could benefit from armor plating, the Prometheus a bonus to beam weaponry. And the Patrol, a bonus to speed.
The cooldown doesn't drop below 30 seconds with aux2bat because of the global cooldown, not because of the buff duration.
You're still only going to be able to activate it every 30 seconds.
Do you guys not understand that their are already built-in tiered benefits for taking the higher tiers of powers like EPTS already?
On top of that, you totally TRIBBLE any Cruiser that wants to actually be played like a proper healer and takes EPTS 1x2 in order to take powers like ES, Aux to SIF, ET 3, etc.
A valid point. I guess I'll have to test it out. :rolleyes:
All hands! Prepare the popcorn and tinfoil hats!
Another problem with the current EPtS is that it completely nullifies shield subsystem targetting -- there is no window of opportunity to sneak torpedoes through an open shield simply because EPtS will always repair a disabled shield with 100% uptime. This will also make Engineering Team viable again since it will be needed to cover the 10-second EPtS-coverage gap that will result from the update. I haven't slotted Engineering Team in over a year because EPtS made it largely unnecessary.
Think of it this way.
Once per cycle with tree purple technicians, you can reduce your boff recharge by 60% Two uses of aux to batt. on paper.
So that's something like 14 seconds off each, leading to a little less than 28 second reduction on Emergency powers.
But this allows us only to keep two powers active simultaneously. I have never once been able to overlap and have the same power active twice. So I can have EptW and EptS active consistently, but you can't double up on EptS, not the same one or different.
And it's not the buff you're running into, it's the cooldown. 45 seconds on the same ability. 30 second uptime. It cuts it down just enough so that the power is ready to use again. BUT, the cooldown remains the same and the power duration is shorter. The Devs knew what they were doing with this nerf across all builds. True. You'll have to be more selfish with your heals due to the possibility of being taken out.
Do you mean sci team? Eng team repairs hull.
No, I mean Engineering Team -- it repairs all disabled subsystems. If your shields get knocked out by Target Subsystem Shields-3 with an incoming High Yield 3 Quantum volley or Omega torpedo inbound while tractor-beamed, Sci-Team will not save you.
I don't think you understand how that is actually a deeper nerf to how cruisers function.
Take a look at the ensign powers available, there are ONLY 5 powers.
4 of which are in the same family of cooldowns.
These powers were specifically designed to be cycled so they could interact with one another and not held in reserve for some false notion of 'strategy' considerations.
So unless the devs want to completely unlock the shared cooldowns in the EPTx family their changes here are a net nerf to cruisers. (and from arbiterhawk's tone, I get the feeling they were not trying to nerf cruisers, but they are in fact doing this incidentally.
If you don't think Eng team is "viable" the only thing I can tell you is that you are most likely not playing in any actual competitive PvP environment.
I promise you both ET and ST, and the higher versions specifically, are not only "viable", they are absolutely critical healer skills.
Escorts cover the team with TT, Healers cover the team with ET and ST.
That's how optimized premade PvP teams function.
Here's another fun consequence of a sudden gap vs. a toning down of resistance numbers.
Cruiser running EPTS 3
vs.
Escort running EPTS 1
Which one has larger resistance dip during the 10s gap?
(hint Cruiser loses 30% resistance and approx 35 power, Escort loses 18% resistance and approx 20 power)
Which ship class is running EPTW to hit that 125 (or overcap) to run their 8 weapons? (Answer = Cruisers)
Which ship will lose more DPS when that EPTW 10s gap happens?
(Answer = Cruisers)
Result = The ship class currently performing the worst in PvP, with the highest reliance on the worst weapon (Beam Arrays) actually continues to face even more nerfs and can no longer even count on higher resistance with gapless coverage.
Those higher shield modifiers that Cruisers have? They mean little when you can't maneuver well enough to bring other shield facings into play and have no resistance to protect them.
Instead of toning resistances down across the board to make pressure damage viable, instead we get a 33% gap in EPTS coverage - which is a net gain for spike damage and another loss to pressure damage.
Adding to this, ETPW which was a cruiser go to power for boosting their pressure DPS is now a power that will favor spikes instead of the energy intense 8x beam array Cruiser load with FAW.
just a thought, since switching my brel to 2 breens and trannies i dont even think about player sheilds......
I'd like to be able to use EPTA on Sci/Carriers but even with these changes looks like will still need EPTS x2.
I don't dispute that the EPtS duration cut is a nerf. However, I also don't agree that EPtS should remain the button mash-fest that it is now. Since Emergency Power to Shield can run non-stop, it might as well be renamed "Re-energize Shields" and de-coupled from the shared cooldown pool instead.
You are correct -- I don't usually participate in premade team PVP because it just isn't profitable (I make millions more EC from purple drops whenever I farm any of the PVE Fleet actions). However, I still enjoy team vs. team free-for-alls with fleet mates because it they are quite fun.
ET hasn't been needed in my builds because of the Red Matter Capacitor. The latter repairs system disables and doesn't interfere with my Tactical Team Rotation. Adapted MACO Engine hot-restart counter engine shut downs. EPtS counters shield disables. AP-Omega counters Viral Matrix (or used to... not sure about present status). Target-Aux... I don't see the latter used much at all. Given all of the above, Engineering Team has not been worth taking for quite some time. The upcoming EPtS revision will change this since shield subsystem targeting will become a viable threat again.
Your statement is full of flaws for a multitude of reasons. Good cruiser pilots will barely be affected by these changes, particularly engineering cruisers. One of the best things about engineering cruiser pilots is that they don't "need" emergency power to shield to be an effective tank/support healer. Running at max shield power allows for mad shield regeneration and if you are an engineer, all you need is the full Mark 12 assimilated borg set and your shields will regenerate so much with the reputation bonuses as well that you might as well be flying a resilient shield. Not the mention the assimilated borg procs that are inherent to the assimilated set in the first place, allow for ridiculous self healing and makes for support healing far easier to manage. Considering that I only have one EPtS that I barely use, being an effective tank is something to consider when you take in consideration where strengths are with certain gear and power formats.
I dunno if you recognized, but there are other ships out there except cruisers. With a sci ship you mostly can?t afford to run max shield power. And for a matter of fact, cause of the weak hull sci ships have, you have to rely on shield tanking even more.
U.S.S. Helios -Vesta Class / R.R.W. Dark Science - Dyson Surveillance Science Destroyer
U.S.S. Donut - Fleet Advanced Research Vessel Retrofit
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