So the Romulans are getting their own C-Store ships (with their own special consoles, presumably). And they'll get KDF or Fed Consoles as well. Now, I can see why you don't want us flying Rom ships as KDF or Fed, but wouldn't it at least be fair to allow us access to the consoles of the Rom Ships we've bought on our Fed and KDF chars?
why would they focus on the foundry at the start of the expansion, the foundry is not a necessity at the beginning of this expansion and can wait.
That is how it usually works, which is why nothing ever happens, despite things that Dan Stahl has said in public and in person with those of us who make missions. Season 9, or whatever it will be called with shift all focus and attention to something else. There is never a moment when anyone goes back to incorporate or complement the Foundry.
Now, the tool that adds content to the game is an afterthought when adding a new faction that needs new content.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dastahl
Thank you. No one is forced to play a Romulan. You may not agree with how we've implemented them and we are sorry if this doesn't meet your expectations. Some people will love it, others won't. You simply can't please everyone. That is an impossible task.
We acknowledge that it is a hot topic, but we have no comments at the present time other than we're looking closely at the feedback. Doesn't mean it will change, but we are understanding that this is upsetting to some.
I'm shocked to expect this response from the top of the line. I'm a leader and managed others for a real living and at the very least would have just keep my "peace" instead of portraying an annoyance to some player who is paying my salary. I know we can't please everyone but if you do this for a living it should be a bit more subtle instead of venting out in public. In leadership, always vent up not down...a wise mentor taught me :cool:
Here, venting up causes you to get fired
Otherwise... it is a free expansion.
And there is a saying about not looking a gift horse in the mouth.
As for a free expansion, this is already amazing. You usually pay for this kind of stuff.
Yeah... it could be better, but realistically its a good expansion if we factor in that its A : Free, B : Made by a smaller company.
So as for me, I'm happy with this expansion.
The only thing I can criticise is the fact that romulans can play Fed and Kdf ships. Otherwise its all super so far.
Oh! And remove the 50% health limit requirement from go down fighting please ! *Begs the developers*
Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
I don't think there is an unreasonable sense of entitlement to expect our EP to think:
A. Ok, so we're adding a new faction and it needs content...
B. How can help the UGC community help us do that?
C. Hmm... at the very least we should turn the thing on for Romulan missions and give them a reasonable amount of stuff to make Romulan missions.
It's not unreasonable to expect that minimum amount of thought and consideration.
I agree that at some point the assets should be added. As Zero said in one of your recent UGC podcasts I listened to, It's not as simple as cut and pasting assets to the foundry. Each asset has to be made specifically for foundry use so as not to be affected by changes to assets in the normal game. She said it was quite a time consuming process. My belief is those things will come to the foundry after the game story and content is finished, tested, and released. I wouldn't want the game team being pulled away from mainstream content to focus on reworking assets for use in the foundry before a major update to the game. The foundry in STO is still beta in a sense that was its purpose to begin with. It was to test it out and work out some kinks before it was put into use in Neverwinter. After NWO is released thats when the foundry improvements and the refined product was to come back to STO. Which the open beta for NWO isn't until Apr 30. I suspect in a few months the foundry is going to get the much needed love you're asking for. Cryptic created content is always going to come first with UGC taking the backseat.
Gold Sub since March 2010
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
The fact they are trying to rebuild Romulan society by having some Captain's ally with warring factions, then destroy each other makes no sense whatsoever either. Seems awfully expensive on their limited resources.
When Dukat allied with the Dominion the whole Cardassian Union went along with it, Dukat was not now a "war criminal" as you are claming but rather one of the leaders of the enemy.
Now we have Sela ... Sela is the leader of the Romulan Star Empire, doesnt matter what she calls herself but as long the Federation recognizes Sela as the legitimate leader of the Romulan Star Empire and the Romulan Star Empire ... they are aiding separatists and interfering with the internal matters of the Rmulan Star Empire.
They dont have to but until Sela is gone after cutting the cord if they recognize her as the leader of the Romulan Star EMpire this have repercussions, now if they dont ... well we need to have that stated clearly as what Sela is nothing but a illegitimate claim as leader of the Romulan Star Empire.
As it stands, the whole thing is aiding a separatist movement by supplying then with weapons so they can overthrown a recognized government.
THAT is the problem we have.
It does need more clarification; has the Federation in STO ever actually acknowledged that they see her as the legitimate leader of the RSE? We've had at least one mission where we destroy a fleet orbiting her new capital directly, something I doubt the UFP would be caught doing so brazenly if they really took her claim that seriously.
Also, during the Romulan Front missions we perform a number of tasks that would very much be considered blatant interference in the internal matters of the RSE.
You kidding me? I hit 50 well before the Undine missions ... in fact you should hit 50 when Breen Episodes end as a Fed.
"Just enough"? if we are to hit 40 at "Cutting the Cord" as it stands that just leaves the Cardassian Front that seems to being refurnished for KDF (and RS) and the Borg front that I seen yesterday its also being refurnished for KDF (and RS), the Undined front was already cross fraction anyway.
That leaves us just the Romulan Front and the Klingon/Federation Front, several missions of the Romulan Front can be refurnished for KDF (and RS) anyway.
Please re-read what I stated being that I basically summarized what is happening without a wall of text If it was too much to understand I was stating the fed side has more content than it needs to hit 50. As the KDF stood before f2p and present on holodeck it would not have enough content to hit 50 without grinding certain missions over and over just to reach the next rank.
What I actually stated and what you are stating "just enough" is the fed side has more content than it needs so what I was stating is that they are trying to make it where Romulan and KDF players have just enough without the kind of grinding we had to do before F2P.
I was thanking him for his viewpoint, and I didn't say the words (despite the way you edited the quote). Those were someone else's words. It is illustrating the point that you can't please everyone all the time. The fact that we've created a Romulan faction at all is testimony that we listened to player requests. Some people are happy with it, some aren't. We are listening and considering the feedback. We'll consider changes as we have in the past. If at the end of the day you decide that you just don't like our decisions, then all I can say is that I'm sorry.
I'm very happy on the whole but, again, I think it would be a MAJOR step forward if:
1) Non-Romulan ships were costumed as Romulan ships when a Romulan flies them. (For example, the Sovereign LOOKS LIKE a D'deridex with Fed hull colors, to show it was basically build with Fed support. The Vor'cha would LOOK LIKE a D'deridex with Klingon hull colors.)
This would mean:
The Mogai model would need MVAM, wing cannons, and Tactical mode.
The D'deridex model needs saucer separation and support craft launch.
The Scimitar model would need phaser lance and siege mode
But if you had that, you could ensure Romulan ships LOOK Romulan. Instead of the Fed and KDF handing out tech, they're providing DESIGN CONSULTATION.
2) Romulans get to use the embassy as their primary fleet holding, with features TIED TO Starbase progression but allowing access to those features AT THE EMBASSY. This helps in allowing them to feel properly ROMULAN. A roleplay fleet could then level the starbase for perks but could conduct ALL business at the embassy. This basically means adding NPCs who have extra dialogues for Romulan faction players, allowing them access to starbase amenities directly from the embassy.
I'd also look at making sure Romulans have a Mol'Rihan transwarp.
I have more thoughts beside these. I realize these are even a tall order at this late a date. But these two things are IMHO essential to making Romulans FEEL like a faction.
You might also want to drop the faction term at some point in your marketing literature as that connotes WoW too much. I'd go with Affiliation. Affiliation is a fun term. Decipher used it.
The word "Faction" connotes a hard divide, an adversarial relationship which Romulans don't necessarily have. The word "Affiliation" is considerably less aggressive. It doesn't imply hostility towards people of a different group. It's looser. Friendlier. Probably too late to do anything about right away but I wouldn't use the term "faction" at all, not to describe Romulans, not to describe Federation. In the future, I'd probably say, "Other MMOs do factions. Star Trek Online has opted for a different approach. Instead, we have Affiliations that encourage teaming with members of other cultures as much as we can justify. Most Affiliations give you a choice of sides in the Federation-Klingon conflict."
What about all the goodies today released for the foundry, cool huh? cue the ungrateful attitude ~
I'm grateful for the new stuff, sure. Those things are added one by one by Zero, as far as I know. She does it most likely on her down-time or while staying late. I'm talking about a higher level of leadership that thinks in terms of greater game.
There is a huge disconnect between each season's new push and how the existing and future work of UGC can be supported in conjunction with that push.
Romulus was on the track to recovery, and if you read the data chip entries, Sela as Empress actually comes off pretty good. Using Diplomacy instead of just shear brutality, that sort of stuff. She was opposed to the Tal Shiar. Now Cryptic seems to have retconned her into being an Iconian Lackey by makign her the head of the Tal Shair, with Hakeev as her right hand.
Now instead of being able to rebuild and unite the RSE and wrest back what is rightfully Romuan from the grubby mits of the Federation and KDF, we get to take back seat to the FED and KDF and instead tear ourselves apart in Civil War, throw away the RSE and all vestiges of the old ways (presumably killing/ousting Sela in the process), and appoint a reunificationist as our leader. Oh, and we are playing as pointy-eared Bajorans now. Ugh. Every single new update so far has made me less enthusiastic about the New Romulan faction, and STO in general. Romulans in Name Only.
Romulus was on the track to recovery, and if you read the data chip entries, Sela as Empress actually comes off pretty good. Using Diplomacy instead of just shear brutality, that sort of stuff. She was opposed to the Tal Shiar. Now Cryptic seems to have retconned her into being an Iconian Lackey by makign her the head of the Tal Shair, with Hakeev as her right hand.
Now instead of being able to rebuild and unite the RSE and wrest back what is rightfully Romuan from the grubby mits of the Federation and KDF, we get to take back seat to the FED and KDF and instead tear ourselves apart in Civil War, throw away the RSE and all vestiges of the old ways (presumably killing/ousting Sela in the process), and appoint a reunificationist as our leader. Oh, and we are playing as pointy-eared Bajorans now. Ugh. Every single new update so far has made me less enthusiastic about the New Romulan faction, and STO in general. Romulans in Name Only.
Well, that's your opinion, doesn't make it fact, just so you know. You might not like how Cryptic has decided to implement the faction (which it is, by the way, despite your assertion to the contrary), but that doesn't mean that others share your opinion. I certainly don't, I am veritably excited for it.
Romulus was on the track to recovery, and if you read the data chip entries, Sela as Empress actually comes off pretty good. Using Diplomacy instead of just shear brutality, that sort of stuff. She was opposed to the Tal Shiar. Now Cryptic seems to have retconned her into being an Iconian Lackey by makign her the head of the Tal Shair, with Hakeev as her right hand.
Now instead of being able to rebuild and unite the RSE and wrest back what is rightfully Romuan from the grubby mits of the Federation and KDF, we get to take back seat to the FED and KDF and instead tear ourselves apart in Civil War, throw away the RSE and all vestiges of the old ways (presumably killing/ousting Sela in the process), and appoint a reunificationist as our leader. Oh, and we are playing as pointy-eared Bajorans now. Ugh. Every single new update so far has made me less enthusiastic about the New Romulan faction, and STO in general. Romulans in Name Only.
Rebuilding the Romulan Star Empire is what I wanted. Not a Republic divided between the Federation and Klingon Empire fighting their war. Oh well...
Well, that's your opinion, doesn't make it fact, just so you know. You might not like how Cryptic has decided to implement the faction (which it is, by the way, despite your assertion to the contrary), but that doesn't mean that others share your opinion. I certainly don't, I am veritably excited for it.
You would have to be blind to not notice that others share my opinion on this matter. Cryptic's Romulans are nothing more than Bajorans with pointy ears and better ship access. Listen, you know what? If I wanted to play a Bajoran, I would play a Bajoran. I don't look for an authentic Bajoran experience when I look into a potential Romulan faction. These Romulans have almsot nothing 'Romulan' about them aside from those poitny ears. Heck, the interview talks about them throwing off their 'old ways' and overthrowing Sela. They obviously don't have the Romulan culture angle going for them, or their government. All they have is their pointy ears and their warbirds, which does not a Romulan make. They have clearly and excessively been starched, bleached, and sterilized of all Romulan traits that could possibly offend anyone, in order to appeal to a wider audience. The audience that the Federation already exists for. This faction was just made for people who want to fly warbirds, not for people who want to play Romulans, in a Romulan faction.
You would have to be blind to not notice that others share my opinion on this matter. Cryptic's Romulans are nothing more than Bajorans with pointy ears and better ship access. Listen, you know what? If I wanted to play a Bajoran, I would play a Bajoran. I don't look for an authentic Bajoran experience when I look into a potential Romulan faction. These Romulans have almsot nothing 'Romulan' about them aside from those poitny ears. Heck, the interview talks about them throwing off their 'old ways' and overthrowing Sela. They obviously don't have the Romulan culture angle going for them, or their government. All they have is their pointy ears and their warbirds, which does not a Romulan make. They have clearly and excessively been starched, bleached, and sterilized of all Romulan traits that could possibly offend anyone, in order to appeal to a wider audience. The audience that the Federation already exists for. This faction was just made for people who want to fly warbirds, not for people who want to play Romulans, in a Romulan faction.
Sucks if you like TNG Romulans ...not if you likeTOS Romulans :P
I have a question for Dan. What do the Federation and the KDF factions get for essentially handing over ships and weapons to arm them with?
What new tech will they get, Federation and KDF enhanced cloaks for all ships?
From a canon point of view, the Federation would never hand over ships and arms willingly, especially to Romulans and The KDF would just wipe them out and take all there land/tech for themselves....
They are not the Borg. Romulans do not have a hive mind and one singular personality that defines them all.
Some. Not all, act like the honorable Romulan captain that Kirk blew up. The majority act completely differently, and even where they are 'nice' Romulans, they almost invariably have the best interests of the RSE in heart, they aren't out to destroy it. There's a reason why Klingons consider Romulans as trecherous and dishonerable-because those are highly important traits in the cutthroat Romulan society. Face it-there is a far greater precedent for trecharous, sneaky Romulans than your idealized vision of all Romulans secretely wanting to be Federation citizens that you keep in your head.
Two questions. First, will Romulans Captains in the new Republic have the choice to join the Tal Shiar, in building the former Romulan Star Empire? Secondly, in the Latest Ask Cryptic release, it sounded like a Romulan faction starbase may becoming down the road. If so, can you give a rough estimate when this may happen?
@dstahl: Thanks for answering my Foundry question. While it isn't exactly what I was hoping to hear I'm glad you're going to allow us to make Romulan exclusive missions eventually. Please keep on your guys and make sure you follow through on that.
I'm really excited by what I see from LoR so far, my only complaint is what took so long?
Why couldn't we have had Romulans from the start? I like them way better then Fed or Klingon. I always play Romulans in all Star Trek games and wish I didn't have to spend so much time in this game playing Fed and KDF.
Now I have to much invested to just delete my KDF and Fed characters, but I never would have made them if Romulans were available before and don't know if I will even play them much now.
I know this is a long shot but I would like to be able to repack my Jem'hadar attack ship, lockbox and lobi ships and turn in my fleet ships to get the modules back as I would never have wasted any of this stuff on my Fed or KDF characters if I knew Romulans would be out.
If this isn't possible maybe consider letting us respec current characters as a Romulan.
They should go back to level 1 and lose all accolades, rep, commendations, and quest progression, but be allowed to keep all fleet ships, lockbox ships, lobi ships, JHAS, and bound items, and just be restricted from accessing them until back to the appropriate level.
This actually isn't true. They are small but very vocal minority. They are in no sense a majority.
Then again you can't know how the silent majority really feels, the rest of the player base might be just as divided as the forums. Most disgruntled players still play the game, its the only star trek mmo we got. The proof that cryptic made the right choices about the game expansion will come in may and future months.
Comments
That is how it usually works, which is why nothing ever happens, despite things that Dan Stahl has said in public and in person with those of us who make missions. Season 9, or whatever it will be called with shift all focus and attention to something else. There is never a moment when anyone goes back to incorporate or complement the Foundry.
Now, the tool that adds content to the game is an afterthought when adding a new faction that needs new content.
Here, venting up causes you to get fired
Otherwise... it is a free expansion.
And there is a saying about not looking a gift horse in the mouth.
As for a free expansion, this is already amazing. You usually pay for this kind of stuff.
Yeah... it could be better, but realistically its a good expansion if we factor in that its A : Free, B : Made by a smaller company.
So as for me, I'm happy with this expansion.
The only thing I can criticise is the fact that romulans can play Fed and Kdf ships. Otherwise its all super so far.
Oh! And remove the 50% health limit requirement from go down fighting please ! *Begs the developers*
I agree that at some point the assets should be added. As Zero said in one of your recent UGC podcasts I listened to, It's not as simple as cut and pasting assets to the foundry. Each asset has to be made specifically for foundry use so as not to be affected by changes to assets in the normal game. She said it was quite a time consuming process. My belief is those things will come to the foundry after the game story and content is finished, tested, and released. I wouldn't want the game team being pulled away from mainstream content to focus on reworking assets for use in the foundry before a major update to the game. The foundry in STO is still beta in a sense that was its purpose to begin with. It was to test it out and work out some kinks before it was put into use in Neverwinter. After NWO is released thats when the foundry improvements and the refined product was to come back to STO. Which the open beta for NWO isn't until Apr 30. I suspect in a few months the foundry is going to get the much needed love you're asking for. Cryptic created content is always going to come first with UGC taking the backseat.
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
The fact they are trying to rebuild Romulan society by having some Captain's ally with warring factions, then destroy each other makes no sense whatsoever either. Seems awfully expensive on their limited resources.
It does need more clarification; has the Federation in STO ever actually acknowledged that they see her as the legitimate leader of the RSE? We've had at least one mission where we destroy a fleet orbiting her new capital directly, something I doubt the UFP would be caught doing so brazenly if they really took her claim that seriously.
Also, during the Romulan Front missions we perform a number of tasks that would very much be considered blatant interference in the internal matters of the RSE.
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
Please re-read what I stated being that I basically summarized what is happening without a wall of text
What I actually stated and what you are stating "just enough" is the fed side has more content than it needs so what I was stating is that they are trying to make it where Romulan and KDF players have just enough without the kind of grinding we had to do before F2P.
I'm very happy on the whole but, again, I think it would be a MAJOR step forward if:
1) Non-Romulan ships were costumed as Romulan ships when a Romulan flies them. (For example, the Sovereign LOOKS LIKE a D'deridex with Fed hull colors, to show it was basically build with Fed support. The Vor'cha would LOOK LIKE a D'deridex with Klingon hull colors.)
This would mean:
The Mogai model would need MVAM, wing cannons, and Tactical mode.
The D'deridex model needs saucer separation and support craft launch.
The Scimitar model would need phaser lance and siege mode
But if you had that, you could ensure Romulan ships LOOK Romulan. Instead of the Fed and KDF handing out tech, they're providing DESIGN CONSULTATION.
2) Romulans get to use the embassy as their primary fleet holding, with features TIED TO Starbase progression but allowing access to those features AT THE EMBASSY. This helps in allowing them to feel properly ROMULAN. A roleplay fleet could then level the starbase for perks but could conduct ALL business at the embassy. This basically means adding NPCs who have extra dialogues for Romulan faction players, allowing them access to starbase amenities directly from the embassy.
I'd also look at making sure Romulans have a Mol'Rihan transwarp.
I have more thoughts beside these. I realize these are even a tall order at this late a date. But these two things are IMHO essential to making Romulans FEEL like a faction.
You might also want to drop the faction term at some point in your marketing literature as that connotes WoW too much. I'd go with Affiliation. Affiliation is a fun term. Decipher used it.
The word "Faction" connotes a hard divide, an adversarial relationship which Romulans don't necessarily have. The word "Affiliation" is considerably less aggressive. It doesn't imply hostility towards people of a different group. It's looser. Friendlier. Probably too late to do anything about right away but I wouldn't use the term "faction" at all, not to describe Romulans, not to describe Federation. In the future, I'd probably say, "Other MMOs do factions. Star Trek Online has opted for a different approach. Instead, we have Affiliations that encourage teaming with members of other cultures as much as we can justify. Most Affiliations give you a choice of sides in the Federation-Klingon conflict."
I'm grateful for the new stuff, sure. Those things are added one by one by Zero, as far as I know. She does it most likely on her down-time or while staying late. I'm talking about a higher level of leadership that thinks in terms of greater game.
There is a huge disconnect between each season's new push and how the existing and future work of UGC can be supported in conjunction with that push.
I'll stop ranting now.
Now instead of being able to rebuild and unite the RSE and wrest back what is rightfully Romuan from the grubby mits of the Federation and KDF, we get to take back seat to the FED and KDF and instead tear ourselves apart in Civil War, throw away the RSE and all vestiges of the old ways (presumably killing/ousting Sela in the process), and appoint a reunificationist as our leader. Oh, and we are playing as pointy-eared Bajorans now. Ugh. Every single new update so far has made me less enthusiastic about the New Romulan faction, and STO in general. Romulans in Name Only.
Rebuilding the Romulan Star Empire is what I wanted. Not a Republic divided between the Federation and Klingon Empire fighting their war. Oh well...
Sucks if you like TNG Romulans ...not if you likeTOS Romulans :P
TNG ,DS9,VOY,ENT, Movies,other games,books, and in TOS they where still villains.
What new tech will they get, Federation and KDF enhanced cloaks for all ships?
From a canon point of view, the Federation would never hand over ships and arms willingly, especially to Romulans and The KDF would just wipe them out and take all there land/tech for themselves....
Really hmmmm someone tell Kirk that when he stole a Romulan cloak from them by tricking them...Federation were the bad guys there.
The Romulans inTOS were not the paranoid evil villains they became in TNG.
Some. Not all.
They are not the Borg. Romulans do not have a hive mind and one singular personality that defines them all.
Never said evil , I said villians. Im sure Kirk didn't like the fact that his ship was almost blown up by the Romulans when they first meet.
I always wondered what, or who, made them so paranoid in the decades between TOS and TNG.
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
Living in a police state will do that to a person.
Why couldn't we have had Romulans from the start? I like them way better then Fed or Klingon. I always play Romulans in all Star Trek games and wish I didn't have to spend so much time in this game playing Fed and KDF.
Now I have to much invested to just delete my KDF and Fed characters, but I never would have made them if Romulans were available before and don't know if I will even play them much now.
I know this is a long shot but I would like to be able to repack my Jem'hadar attack ship, lockbox and lobi ships and turn in my fleet ships to get the modules back as I would never have wasted any of this stuff on my Fed or KDF characters if I knew Romulans would be out.
If this isn't possible maybe consider letting us respec current characters as a Romulan.
They should go back to level 1 and lose all accolades, rep, commendations, and quest progression, but be allowed to keep all fleet ships, lockbox ships, lobi ships, JHAS, and bound items, and just be restricted from accessing them until back to the appropriate level.
This actually isn't true. They are small but very vocal minority. They are in no sense a majority.
Then again you can't know how the silent majority really feels, the rest of the player base might be just as divided as the forums. Most disgruntled players still play the game, its the only star trek mmo we got. The proof that cryptic made the right choices about the game expansion will come in may and future months.