Three Ensign powers wouldn't be so bad if all Team powers had the same "shield distributing" effect as Tactical Team. (of course TT would need a additional buff, like a damage effect as compensation)
Tactical Team wouldn't be as mandatory as it is now, Engineering Team would do the same job and it would free up the ensign Tactical station.
But still the GCS would be the most passive ship in the fleet...
Personally, i think the whole 3 ensign engineering discussion isn't very helpful.
Making the GCS the most extreme tank in STO is clearly not what the "original" ship is about.
Maybe we should think about the idea of giving the GCS a BOFF/Console Layout of a already existing ship. Not only that, i think the GCS should get a higher turnrate, especailly since a monster like the Scimitar has a turnrate of 7.
In my opinion, they should give the GCS (or a potential new variant) the BOFF/Console Layout of the D'Kora including a similar console.
That ship could have access to Galaxy -X and -R ship parts. So both ships problems would be solved in one single release and Cryptic wouldn't need to have too many GCS ship variants in their game.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Only problem is that as first officer, he really isn't doing much tactical while on-board, thats the tactical officer of the seasons tasks (Yar/Worf)
Well, Riker gave tactical commands too (never figured out how it is supposed to work with both, him and Picard on the bridge and STO doesn't make much sense anyway. My captain can perform Attack Pattern Alpha without sitting at a console. A tactical officer can perform other attack patterns etc.
He's the TNG version of WATSON, he was doing the job of anything and everything. He would be nearly impossible to replicate
No, he was Sherlock, Geordi was Watson.:D And he was very much like Spock. But on the bridge he mostly used the sensors, which is a science officer's job.
Don't forget an acting Ensign helmsman (does that make it half a power?) the has the penchant to getting told to shut up or nearly kill half of the crew :P
Then it would have more powers than other ships, so in the case of the Galaxy I would say that Crusher/Ro/Redshirt of the week were conn doffs.:D
FKA K-Tar, grumpy Klingon/El-Aurian hybrid. Now assimilated by PWE.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
While Riker did gave tactical orders in his role of commander, keep in mind that he was a engineer/ops to begin with. Riker wore gold in his early career, so a commander ENG makes sense
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
While Riker did gave tactical orders in his role of commander, keep in mind that he was a engineer/ops to begin with. Riker wore gold in his early career, so a commander ENG makes sense
Yes but Riker was better at breaking the ship than Troi........
Inertia just means you can do Powerslides in you carrier!
I am Il Shadow and i approve these Shennanigans!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The Exploration cruiser is the Least versatile when it was supposed to be the most versatile.
I get that the Oddy is better and the assualt/soveregin is more assaulty(new word). But the Ambassador and Excelsiors are better than the Galaxy?
This is where my primary problem comes from with that Galaxy.
This is why many people who think about a "New Galaxy Class" take the Nebula's or Ambassador's layout as a foundation. The Ambassador (Support Cruiser) is basically what the Galaxy should be. The problem is that the "Support Cruiser" as a subclass was introduced much much later. The Galaxy is here since the beginning and back then it was the payversion of the trinity (The Defiant R being the Tac part, the Intrepid R being the Sci and the Gal R being the Eng part of the triforce; their BOFF and console layouts are mirrors aside from their specialization). A hybrid class like the "Support Cruiser" didn't exist back then. It was pretty much introduced with the Odyssey I think. The Oddy is a "Command Ship" which is very versatile and able to do almost any task at least adequately. Since it is supposed to be the Galaxy Class' successor, which was the "Command Ship" before, the Galaxy should be inferior but at least be as versatile (Maybe LT. Uni instead of LTC).
That's basically where the problem lies. It wouldn't be a problem if ENG abilities wouldn't be so limited. The Galaxy would still be misrepresented but it is a relic from an earlier state of the game. It is basically the role she stuck with. hat most people don't see, however, is that it is pretty much impossible to turn a single ship that's here for three years around completely. The most we can hope for is a uni ENS on the fleet version to mirror the Negh'Var (what is supposed to be the KDF's Galaxy). As much as I like playing around with a "advanced support cruiser" idea, I think our best take would be revamped cruiser roles/BOFFs in general. The Galaxy will not change significantly because in this game the ship is just not as special as many of us want it to be.
Actually, I think STO hit a wall long ago. The sensible thing would be to decouple ship skins from their models. Allow us to interchange ship skins in a weight class, for example all T5 cruisers should be able to swap their skins - you just "buy" the layout in the store. This way we would still be stuck with Cryptics beloved power creep store model but could see more ship skins at endgame
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
While Riker did gave tactical orders in his role of commander, keep in mind that he was a engineer/ops to begin with. Riker wore gold in his early career, so a commander ENG makes sense
Ehm....
TNG:
Red = Command/Conn Gold = Engineering/Operations/Security/TACTICAL Blue = Medical/Science
FKA K-Tar, grumpy Klingon/El-Aurian hybrid. Now assimilated by PWE.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
Best investment I have in game is my Galaxy-X Dreadnought. She tears through enemies as if they were wet tissue paper, and that's before I fire the Spinal cannon.
Red = Command/Conn Gold = Engineering/Operations/Security/TACTICAL Blue = Medical/Science
I have always counted "tactical" officers in the command division as oposed to security personnel. While you are right that MA says tactical belongs to ops it also says it belongs to command (both articles mention tactical officers). I think that sentiment originates from Worf and Tuvok both wearing gold, though both of them served as security chiefs while Lieutenant Commander Shelby from Starfleet Tactical was shown wearing red and weapon control was the helms job in TOS which would also place it in the "red" division in TNG.
In the end we can't be sure. I think that is one of the things the creators of the show never put much thought into
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I have always counted "tactical" officers in the command division as oposed to security personnel. While you are right that MA says tactical belongs to ops it also says it belongs to command (both articles mention tactical officers). I think that sentiment originates from Worf and Tuvok both wearing gold, though both of them served as security chiefs while Lieutenant Commander Shelby from Starfleet Tactical was shown wearing red and weapon control was the helms job in TOS which would also place it in the "red" division in TNG.
In the end we can't be sure. I think that is one of the things the creators of the show never put much thought into
Don't forget Worf at DS9, he also wore red.
The TNG color code was a bit confusing alltogether IMO.
I think that STOs Tactical = red; Engineerign = gold; Science = Blue is one of the few things STO did actually improve.
We have seen many sudden code changes, the most obvious one came with ST: II.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
This is why many people who think about a "New Galaxy Class" take the Nebula's or Ambassador's layout as a foundation. The Ambassador (Support Cruiser) is basically what the Galaxy should be. The problem is that the "Support Cruiser" as a subclass was introduced much much later. The Galaxy is here since the beginning and back then it was the payversion of the trinity (The Defiant R being the Tac part, the Intrepid R being the Sci and the Gal R being the Eng part of the triforce; their BOFF and console layouts are mirrors aside from their specialization). A hybrid class like the "Support Cruiser" didn't exist back then. It was pretty much introduced with the Odyssey I think. The Oddy is a "Command Ship" which is very versatile and able to do almost any task at least adequately. Since it is supposed to be the Galaxy Class' successor, which was the "Command Ship" before, the Galaxy should be inferior but at least be as versatile (Maybe LT. Uni instead of LTC).
That's basically where the problem lies. It wouldn't be a problem if ENG abilities wouldn't be so limited. The Galaxy would still be misrepresented but it is a relic from an earlier state of the game. It is basically the role she stuck with. hat most people don't see, however, is that it is pretty much impossible to turn a single ship that's here for three years around completely. The most we can hope for is a uni ENS on the fleet version to mirror the Negh'Var (what is supposed to be the KDF's Galaxy). As much as I like playing around with a "advanced support cruiser" idea, I think our best take would be revamped cruiser roles/BOFFs in general. The Galaxy will not change significantly because in this game the ship is just not as special as many of us want it to be.
Actually, I think STO hit a wall long ago. The sensible thing would be to decouple ship skins from their models. Allow us to interchange ship skins in a weight class, for example all T5 cruisers should be able to swap their skins - you just "buy" the layout in the store. This way we would still be stuck with Cryptics beloved power creep store model but could see more ship skins at endgame
all of that is true, the logical demand we should ask is that this ship be given ( more or less ) what other ship in the same categorie have been given.
u universal ensign at least.
indeed, can we argue for a galaxy refit more powerfull than a negvar? than a DDeridex?
i don't known about other but i just can see the galaxy only as something "as" powerfull but not more powerfull than these ship.
of course this game is not cannon and cryptic have already do things that would not happened in the serie ( like an ambassador more powerfull than a galaxy for example ).
but i have alway try to stay coherent to the serie in my proposals.
anyway, drastically changing is bo layout will not do it, transform it into a tactical or science heavy ship is not the solution, but some slight adjustment will do.
i can't see people raging because we transform the ensign engi in universal.
something came to me, what about 2 lt commander engi only ( no commander engi ) and a lt commander sci?
thaught?
if built to be a thank, its one of the poorer tanks. or at least one of the most vulnerable to subnukes. with 3 ENS level eng skills, you cant take EPtS3, that right there pretty much disqualifies it as being anything close to the best tank. with all the eng, you might as well have 2 RSP, and those are just asking to get nuked. HE is the best hull heal, and TSS the best shield heal, something like the odyssey and recluse can have 2 copies of each, and thus have a MUCH higher volume of potential healing. those are also much more useful heals for allies. the galaxy is so good for nothing.
nevermind that all of that is an inferior form of tanking to begin with. high defense scores and speed allowing you to simply avoid damage is a far more effective way to tank anyway.
It is true that there are much better tanks out there, tanks that don't depend on Aux2Bat to keep themselves alive. I myself fly a Recluse, and I know that ship is far more effective at staying alive, with mediocre gear, than my Fleet Galaxy which requires top level gear in order to just stay alive.
HE and TSS are only effective given enough time. Against an alpha strike, Aux2SIF, EPtS are the best shield heals. (I think short term, since a lot of players decide to fly Tac-scort these days)
And yes, movement -> defense, and we all know the Galaxy isn't the best at moving around. The only way to keep this ship moving fast is to use EPtE with Aux2Bat, and even then, you will need to pop EPtA every other Aux2Bat cycle to keep aux powers up.
then you have recognised it as worthless and a ship, that being replaced with almost ANY other, results in an improvement.
It's only got worth to people who associate the ship with an iconic status from the shows. Given a different name and skin, and I wouldn't be flying this ship.
(Although I must say, there is no other ship that screams "SHOOT ME!" like this one does. Player Threat Control, I tell ya! )
I know it's Off Topic, but i never understood the "fun" people claimed to have by being limited to one role in a MMO.
(especially one that makes you get battered by the enemy all the time without any chance to strike back.)
Well it's just me and my crazy antics, I guess. I just love playing to stay alive... escorts don't like me very much in 1v1s, since that "phat Failaxy" they thought was so easy to kill takes 15 minutes... a half hour.... or never. Throw in ExtSh and a mediocre player in a cruiser, and the escort can't kill either of us.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
Could this "Battle Cruiser" possibly be a new Galaxy variant?
that strange, a federation ship other than the cannon galaxy x from an alternate possible reality and the defiant with the cloack given be romulan, will be able to cloack now?
what justification will they serve us? because as state in the path of 2409, the federation, appart from the 2 precedent exceptions ( i known the galaxy x isn't really one ) shoudn't have cloack.
will it be an enhanced galaxy version? would love to for the galaxy fan, but i found it hard to bielieve!
that strange, a federation ship other than the cannon galaxy x from an alternate possible reality and the defiant with the cloack given be romulan, will be able to cloack now?
what justification will they serve us? because as state in the path of 2409, the federation, appart from the 2 precedent exceptions ( i known the galaxy x isn't really one ) shoudn't have cloack.
will it be an enhanced galaxy version? would love to for the galaxy fan, but i found it hard to bielieve!
Possibly a different vessel altogether.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
And yet again a cloaking vessel. Yeah, because everyone else can. Come on, why does everything has to be uniform instead unique? Starfleet doesn't use cloak, period. They should circumvent that by other abilities. I hate that. EVERYTHING just cloaks and has lots of tac stuff. That's boring.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
And yet again a cloaking vessel. Yeah, because everyone else can. Come on, why does everything has to be uniform instead unique? Starfleet doesn't use cloak, period. They should circumvent that by other abilities. I hate that. EVERYTHING just cloaks and has lots of tac stuff. That's boring.
I bet it will be able to use DHCs, too.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Peronally i hope that new battlecrusier will be a ship that deserves that name and not another super nimble escort.
Regarding the GCS:
I hope there will be some anouncement or some information about the upcoming changes.
Three years without a good GCS is really enough.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
I'm certain of that. Every new ship that can't goes straight to the scrap heap
I just can't get over the fact that people seem to be personally offended when the ship they use does not have a "tactical", "battle", "war" or "dread" in it's name. And if that is really their take on improving the galaxy (because I'm fairly certain it will be a Gal (X) upgrade) I'd like to throw Geko his "No, we are not overdoing tactical stuff" in his face. The only thing to make cruiser players happy is to come up with a "battle" variant? Yupp. Because everything else is not cool enough
I am proud having a ship that fits in the "Explorer" category. I don't need a sleek military term for it. I like to be the ship that throws itself in the enemy firing line to buy an ally in distress some time. But neither is that possible in STO, nor is there need for such a playstyle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiENHeSoA1I ^^
EDIT: Oh, btw in the light of this thread: I'm reaching 1st and 2nd places in Crystalline Cataclysm in the Gal R quite regularily. Because it's a mission where pure DPS does not count as much. In fact in my Klingon destroyer I have virtually no fun doing the event. My Galaxy and Nebula (ENG and SCI toon) however rock.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
And yet again a cloaking vessel. Yeah, because everyone else can. Come on, why does everything has to be uniform instead unique? Starfleet doesn't use cloak, period. They should circumvent that by other abilities. I hate that. EVERYTHING just cloaks and has lots of tac stuff. That's boring.
Honestly, the first thing I chucked out the airlock of my Defiant and Galaxy-X was the cloaking device. I'm not really a fan of it. I will occasionally throw a ME2 for giggles though.
.
anyone with a ships of the line calender for this year should be looking at this now.
it will no doubt be introduced before the negvar refit :rolleyes: introduced at the same time though, that would be fine. a good battle cruiser for each
I'm certain of that. Every new ship that can't goes straight to the scrap heap
I just can't get over the fact that people seem to be personally offended when the ship they use does not have a "tactical", "battle", "war" or "dread" in it's name. And if that is really their take on improving the galaxy (because I'm fairly certain it will be a Gal (X) upgrade) I'd like to throw Geko his "No, we are not overdoing tactical stuff" in his face. The only thing to make cruiser players happy is to come up with a "battle" variant? Yupp. Because everything else is not cool enough
So much for the peaceful premise of Star Trek, lol.
But hey that's just my "point of view" about Star Trek.
Other people seem to have no problem with Starfleet blasting everything into pieces, but that's just me.
I am proud having a ship that fits in the "Explorer" category. I don't need a sleek military term for it. I like to be the ship that throws itself in the enemy firing line to buy an ally in distress some time. But neither is that possible in STO, nor is there need for such a playstyle http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiENHeSoA1I ^^
...
Man i loved that game. I wish there would be more games like that.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
anyone with a ships of the line calender for this year should be looking at this now.
it will no doubt be introduced before the negvar refit :rolleyes: introduced at the same time though, that would be fine. a good battle cruiser for each
I hope that's not that ugly Sovereign/Galaxy fan made ship that circulates the net.
As long as it has the option to make it look more like a GCS or at least a bit different, i am ok with it. (Getting the GCS from "Yesterdays Enterprise" would be my absolute fav.)
Other than angrytarg, i am ok with the GCS getting more firepower. But just as he, i think it is important to get all that under the right premise though.
I think a reworked GCS should be on the same level as a D'Deridex.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
LMAO!!!
Just saw neo1nx's post about the so called "battle cruiser".
Yup, because Starfleet's philosophy is to make pureblood battle ships and ya' know it! :rolleyes: Ofcourse it can slot a cloaking device, if you want to improve anyting in STO you slap a cloak or a hangar, haven't you seen the pattern? God forbid tinkering with the game mechanics or some new fresh directions.
And you betcha' it would have DHC yreodred! :P
WARNING!!! Below this, a dev's response on STO losing the Star Trek spirit:
I just can't get over the fact that people seem to be personally offended when the ship they use does not have a "tactical", "battle", "war" or "dread" in it's name.
hehe, what can i say? i love my dreadwartacticalcloack x :D
And if that is really their take on improving the galaxy (because I'm fairly certain it will be a Gal (X) upgrade)
HO GOD!!! this thaught just didn't even cross my mind!!! that strange, hehe!
i was thinking to the best of a simple galaxy push to tactical.
but indeed the galaxy x better fit that role.
anyway, it will not be a galaxy, i am sure, i was more thinking of this ugly things, that other people are pushing for, don't remember the name...
you known, the big ship that use to be the command ship in the gama orionis, it a cryptic design.
bah, i am a little sad to see that the cloack is no longer the exclusivity of the dread and defiant
I hope that's not that ugly Sovereign/Galaxy fan made ship that circulates the net.
As long as it has the option to make it look more like a GCS or at least a bit different, i am ok with it. (Getting the GCS from "Yesterdays Enterprise" would be my absolute fav.)
Other than angrytarg, i am ok with the GCS getting more firepower. But just as he, i think it is important to get all that under the right premise though.
I think a reworked GCS should be on the same level as a D'Deridex.
whats nice about the yesterdays enterprise galaxy was that its just a galaxy configured for a full scale war, its not loaded with science labs and luxury apartments. it shows the other extreme of possible configurations. thats the point of the class, at its most basic its an incredibly durable, large space frame with a ton of usable space. its size allows for weapons to be mounted that are more then twice as large as anything any previous class could fit. only a larger ship with larger weapons could exceed a galaxy's potential firepower. even set up as a ship purely for exploration, with its power grid fairly unoptimized for offensive action, 1 d'deridex, thats more then twice its size, wouldn't dare pick a fight with the enterprise alone.
the galaxy is not a support ship. its not a science ship. its not a battle ship. its the sum of whatever parts it was configured with. if that ends up making it a science ship, or a battleship, so be it. based on the configuration that single galaxy class has, you refer to it as what fits it best.
same is proboly true for the sovereign too. the enterprise E was set up more as a battlecruiser then an explorer, by the looks of it, thats the common consensus im sure. it could no doubt have a significant % of its interior configured for it to better serve other roles.
the point is its a mistake to pass judgment that something is this or that based on only 1 example that we have seen in depth. especially when there is also so much evidence that is counter to popular opinion.
Comments
Tactical Team wouldn't be as mandatory as it is now, Engineering Team would do the same job and it would free up the ensign Tactical station.
But still the GCS would be the most passive ship in the fleet...
Personally, i think the whole 3 ensign engineering discussion isn't very helpful.
Making the GCS the most extreme tank in STO is clearly not what the "original" ship is about.
Maybe we should think about the idea of giving the GCS a BOFF/Console Layout of a already existing ship. Not only that, i think the GCS should get a higher turnrate, especailly since a monster like the Scimitar has a turnrate of 7.
In my opinion, they should give the GCS (or a potential new variant) the BOFF/Console Layout of the D'Kora including a similar console.
That ship could have access to Galaxy -X and -R ship parts. So both ships problems would be solved in one single release and Cryptic wouldn't need to have too many GCS ship variants in their game.
Well, Riker gave tactical commands too (never figured out how it is supposed to work with both, him and Picard on the bridge and STO doesn't make much sense anyway. My captain can perform Attack Pattern Alpha without sitting at a console. A tactical officer can perform other attack patterns etc.
No, he was Sherlock, Geordi was Watson.:D And he was very much like Spock. But on the bridge he mostly used the sensors, which is a science officer's job.
Then it would have more powers than other ships, so in the case of the Galaxy I would say that Crusher/Ro/Redshirt of the week were conn doffs.:D
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
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Yes but Riker was better at breaking the ship than Troi........
I am Il Shadow and i approve these Shennanigans!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The Exploration cruiser is the Least versatile when it was supposed to be the most versatile.
I get that the Oddy is better and the assualt/soveregin is more assaulty(new word). But the Ambassador and Excelsiors are better than the Galaxy?
This is where my primary problem comes from with that Galaxy.
I am Il Shadow and i approve these Shennanigans!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
This is why many people who think about a "New Galaxy Class" take the Nebula's or Ambassador's layout as a foundation. The Ambassador (Support Cruiser) is basically what the Galaxy should be. The problem is that the "Support Cruiser" as a subclass was introduced much much later. The Galaxy is here since the beginning and back then it was the payversion of the trinity (The Defiant R being the Tac part, the Intrepid R being the Sci and the Gal R being the Eng part of the triforce; their BOFF and console layouts are mirrors aside from their specialization). A hybrid class like the "Support Cruiser" didn't exist back then. It was pretty much introduced with the Odyssey I think. The Oddy is a "Command Ship" which is very versatile and able to do almost any task at least adequately. Since it is supposed to be the Galaxy Class' successor, which was the "Command Ship" before, the Galaxy should be inferior but at least be as versatile (Maybe LT. Uni instead of LTC).
That's basically where the problem lies. It wouldn't be a problem if ENG abilities wouldn't be so limited. The Galaxy would still be misrepresented but it is a relic from an earlier state of the game. It is basically the role she stuck with. hat most people don't see, however, is that it is pretty much impossible to turn a single ship that's here for three years around completely. The most we can hope for is a uni ENS on the fleet version to mirror the Negh'Var (what is supposed to be the KDF's Galaxy). As much as I like playing around with a "advanced support cruiser" idea, I think our best take would be revamped cruiser roles/BOFFs in general. The Galaxy will not change significantly because in this game the ship is just not as special as many of us want it to be.
Actually, I think STO hit a wall long ago. The sensible thing would be to decouple ship skins from their models. Allow us to interchange ship skins in a weight class, for example all T5 cruisers should be able to swap their skins - you just "buy" the layout in the store. This way we would still be stuck with Cryptics beloved power creep store model but could see more ship skins at endgame
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Ehm....
TNG:
Red = Command/Conn
Gold = Engineering/Operations/Security/TACTICAL
Blue = Medical/Science
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
I have always counted "tactical" officers in the command division as oposed to security personnel. While you are right that MA says tactical belongs to ops it also says it belongs to command (both articles mention tactical officers). I think that sentiment originates from Worf and Tuvok both wearing gold, though both of them served as security chiefs while Lieutenant Commander Shelby from Starfleet Tactical was shown wearing red and weapon control was the helms job in TOS which would also place it in the "red" division in TNG.
In the end we can't be sure. I think that is one of the things the creators of the show never put much thought into
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The TNG color code was a bit confusing alltogether IMO.
I think that STOs Tactical = red; Engineerign = gold; Science = Blue is one of the few things STO did actually improve.
We have seen many sudden code changes, the most obvious one came with ST: II.
all of that is true, the logical demand we should ask is that this ship be given ( more or less ) what other ship in the same categorie have been given.
u universal ensign at least.
indeed, can we argue for a galaxy refit more powerfull than a negvar? than a DDeridex?
i don't known about other but i just can see the galaxy only as something "as" powerfull but not more powerfull than these ship.
of course this game is not cannon and cryptic have already do things that would not happened in the serie ( like an ambassador more powerfull than a galaxy for example ).
but i have alway try to stay coherent to the serie in my proposals.
anyway, drastically changing is bo layout will not do it, transform it into a tactical or science heavy ship is not the solution, but some slight adjustment will do.
i can't see people raging because we transform the ensign engi in universal.
something came to me, what about 2 lt commander engi only ( no commander engi ) and a lt commander sci?
thaught?
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
EDIT: Just noticed I've made the 3600'th post in this forum thread... wow.
It is true that there are much better tanks out there, tanks that don't depend on Aux2Bat to keep themselves alive. I myself fly a Recluse, and I know that ship is far more effective at staying alive, with mediocre gear, than my Fleet Galaxy which requires top level gear in order to just stay alive.
HE and TSS are only effective given enough time. Against an alpha strike, Aux2SIF, EPtS are the best shield heals. (I think short term, since a lot of players decide to fly Tac-scort these days)
And yes, movement -> defense, and we all know the Galaxy isn't the best at moving around. The only way to keep this ship moving fast is to use EPtE with Aux2Bat, and even then, you will need to pop EPtA every other Aux2Bat cycle to keep aux powers up.
It's only got worth to people who associate the ship with an iconic status from the shows. Given a different name and skin, and I wouldn't be flying this ship.
(Although I must say, there is no other ship that screams "SHOOT ME!" like this one does. Player Threat Control, I tell ya!
Well it's just me and my crazy antics, I guess. I just love playing to stay alive... escorts don't like me very much in 1v1s, since that "phat Failaxy" they thought was so easy to kill takes 15 minutes... a half hour.... or never. Throw in ExtSh and a mediocre player in a cruiser, and the escort can't kill either of us.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
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that strange, a federation ship other than the cannon galaxy x from an alternate possible reality and the defiant with the cloack given be romulan, will be able to cloack now?
what justification will they serve us? because as state in the path of 2409, the federation, appart from the 2 precedent exceptions ( i known the galaxy x isn't really one ) shoudn't have cloack.
will it be an enhanced galaxy version? would love to for the galaxy fan, but i found it hard to bielieve!
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
Possibly a different vessel altogether.
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Regarding the GCS:
I hope there will be some anouncement or some information about the upcoming changes.
Three years without a good GCS is really enough.
I'm certain of that. Every new ship that can't goes straight to the scrap heap
I just can't get over the fact that people seem to be personally offended when the ship they use does not have a "tactical", "battle", "war" or "dread" in it's name. And if that is really their take on improving the galaxy (because I'm fairly certain it will be a Gal (X) upgrade) I'd like to throw Geko his "No, we are not overdoing tactical stuff" in his face. The only thing to make cruiser players happy is to come up with a "battle" variant? Yupp. Because everything else is not cool enough
I am proud having a ship that fits in the "Explorer" category. I don't need a sleek military term for it. I like to be the ship that throws itself in the enemy firing line to buy an ally in distress some time. But neither is that possible in STO, nor is there need for such a playstyle
EDIT: Oh, btw in the light of this thread: I'm reaching 1st and 2nd places in Crystalline Cataclysm in the Gal R quite regularily. Because it's a mission where pure DPS does not count as much. In fact in my Klingon destroyer I have virtually no fun doing the event. My Galaxy and Nebula (ENG and SCI toon) however rock.
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I can't imagine the battle cruiser being very big because unless it can turn at 20-25' without giving up the home-world, it really isn't worth it.
Honestly, the first thing I chucked out the airlock of my Defiant and Galaxy-X was the cloaking device. I'm not really a fan of it. I will occasionally throw a ME2 for giggles though.
.
I betcha' my twist drive engine its gonna look something like this...
http://www.starwreck.com/pages/cgi5.html
http://www.starwreck.com/pages/cgi4.html
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130307220154/startrek/images/5/55/USS_Phalanx_in_shipyard.jpg
anyone with a ships of the line calender for this year should be looking at this now.
it will no doubt be introduced before the negvar refit :rolleyes: introduced at the same time though, that would be fine. a good battle cruiser for each
But hey that's just my "point of view" about Star Trek.
Other people seem to have no problem with Starfleet blasting everything into pieces, but that's just me.
Man i loved that game. I wish there would be more games like that.
I hope that's not that ugly Sovereign/Galaxy fan made ship that circulates the net.
As long as it has the option to make it look more like a GCS or at least a bit different, i am ok with it.
(Getting the GCS from "Yesterdays Enterprise" would be my absolute fav.)
Other than angrytarg, i am ok with the GCS getting more firepower. But just as he, i think it is important to get all that under the right premise though.
I think a reworked GCS should be on the same level as a D'Deridex.
Just saw neo1nx's post about the so called "battle cruiser".
Yup, because Starfleet's philosophy is to make pureblood battle ships and ya' know it! :rolleyes: Ofcourse it can slot a cloaking device, if you want to improve anyting in STO you slap a cloak or a hangar, haven't you seen the pattern? God forbid tinkering with the game mechanics or some new fresh directions.
And you betcha' it would have DHC yreodred! :P
WARNING!!! Below this, a dev's response on STO losing the Star Trek spirit:
>>>HERE<<<
Yeah, they made me a cynic. So what? :cool:
What if they introduce a ship similar in design to the dreadnought from Into Darkness?
Shaddup about JJTrek for a bit, and lets think about the ship design itself.
Maybe modernize it a little, Iono, I never saw much of that ship, damn JJ never let it have any good camera angles.
Seriously, the ship design, not derailing this into another dumbass "I HAET TTRAK" thread.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
My name is Rage, and I too support a revised Galaxy family.
hehe, what can i say? i love my dreadwartacticalcloack x
HO GOD!!! this thaught just didn't even cross my mind!!! that strange, hehe!
i was thinking to the best of a simple galaxy push to tactical.
but indeed the galaxy x better fit that role.
anyway, it will not be a galaxy, i am sure, i was more thinking of this ugly things, that other people are pushing for, don't remember the name...
you known, the big ship that use to be the command ship in the gama orionis, it a cryptic design.
bah, i am a little sad to see that the cloack is no longer the exclusivity of the dread and defiant
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
whats nice about the yesterdays enterprise galaxy was that its just a galaxy configured for a full scale war, its not loaded with science labs and luxury apartments. it shows the other extreme of possible configurations. thats the point of the class, at its most basic its an incredibly durable, large space frame with a ton of usable space. its size allows for weapons to be mounted that are more then twice as large as anything any previous class could fit. only a larger ship with larger weapons could exceed a galaxy's potential firepower. even set up as a ship purely for exploration, with its power grid fairly unoptimized for offensive action, 1 d'deridex, thats more then twice its size, wouldn't dare pick a fight with the enterprise alone.
the galaxy is not a support ship. its not a science ship. its not a battle ship. its the sum of whatever parts it was configured with. if that ends up making it a science ship, or a battleship, so be it. based on the configuration that single galaxy class has, you refer to it as what fits it best.
same is proboly true for the sovereign too. the enterprise E was set up more as a battlecruiser then an explorer, by the looks of it, thats the common consensus im sure. it could no doubt have a significant % of its interior configured for it to better serve other roles.
the point is its a mistake to pass judgment that something is this or that based on only 1 example that we have seen in depth. especially when there is also so much evidence that is counter to popular opinion.