maybe it would be good to restrict Elite STFs to people with 1 tier of Omega rep
it's not like there is a shortage of the regular STFs
That wouldn't make any difference. Tactics commonly used in non-elite STFs (e.g. KASn: finish off one side, then move to the next, CSn: blow up generators & cube, then move to the next one, ISn: blow up generators and have 1-2 people intercept probes etc...) are usually what will make you fail the optional on Elite.
Also I'd think that playing 2 STFs on non-elite, which will reward the marks needed to get to Tier 1, won't make any player understand the tactics used in eSTFs any better.
My best was today vortex on elite completed within ten mins
Worse was worthy of the dumbest people ever award. .
Vortex elite me one side doing probes etc etc 4 yes 4 the other side so after I go boom a couple of times I lost it and shouted in chat to get some help and did I no not until they failed the optional which ok meh not bothered too much about that but it took 45mins to finish coz they obviously loved the I in team
I have done these missions more times than I care to count. I know how to do them, and I know what I am doing. If you don't like what or how I do it I no longer care. If you are doing something wrong or are flying a failboat once again I do not care (I will carry you typically).
In my Tac Defiant I like to destroy the spheres as they spawn on the first side in ISE. Blew a gen early and had someone flip out in chat. Mind you by early I dropped one to 10%, blew one, and on the way past helped drop the other to low 30s. Needless to say I told him to be silent and proceeded to kill all the spawns. Then had to turn around and kill the generator.
My personal experience is thus, if you are good enough that you feel the right to nit pick how others fly then you are good enough to carry a bad PuG to victory anyway. The vast majority of the time those who flip out or begin to shout orders are flying failboat cruisers FaWing at everything with tetryons and dealing pathetic damage while being unable to tank a standard cube. Your mileage may vary though.
My best was today vortex on elite completed within ten mins
Worse was worthy of the dumbest people ever award. .
Vortex elite me one side doing probes etc etc 4 yes 4 the other side so after I go boom a couple of times I lost it and shouted in chat to get some help and did I no not until they failed the optional which ok meh not bothered too much about that but it took 45mins to finish coz they obviously loved the I in team
4 on one side and one on the other doing probe duty is a perfectly legit tactic. Of course, they should have adapted to cover you once they saw you couldn't handle it, but seriously, most times I do KASE, one guy is enough to cover probes while the others work the other side over. You may have some problems with your build.
My best was today vortex on elite completed within ten mins
Worse was worthy of the dumbest people ever award. .
Vortex elite me one side doing probes etc etc 4 yes 4 the other side so after I go boom a couple of times I lost it and shouted in chat to get some help and did I no not until they failed the optional which ok meh not bothered too much about that but it took 45mins to finish coz they obviously loved the I in team
If you were doing probe duty how in the world did you go "Boom" a couple of times?? this makes no sense. You know you might have been the problem - no-one doing probe duty should be going boom unless
a) you spawned a cube you were in range of the gate
c)they spawned cubes and let them wander across the map
My personal experience is thus, if you are good enough that you feel the right to nit pick how others fly then you are good enough to carry a bad PuG to victory anyway.
I like that one, very true.
Last night was....strange. With my main toon, I did 3 eSTFs in a roll, all completed with good times (meaning at least 6 minutes left on the timer) - I had a cooldown of 32 minutes left so I switched to my alt (which is at T3 Omega and T2 Rommy rep). I queued for Azura nebula Rescue, I see a timer and I accept the mission......and I warp out in HSN - really!? Anyway, I went through it. After that I actually did an ANR and then queued for ISE, which was a complete fail, but we somehow completed it without turning it into the 100 years war.
Then I queued for KASE. As I mentioned on the last page, I experience a pure hatred toward the players spawning a cube and letting it wander untouched. And yeah, it happened again!
I assumed left probe duty* and started doing my routine. As I've mentioned before, I tend to pay great attention on what the other teammates are doing....or not doing. I see we're 3 on the left, the other 2 are on the right. The two on my side spawn a cube (I spawn mine after I clear the second spawn of probes) and ignore it completely....meanwhile I can see the cube moving toward me. I know I can kill it if I have to, but I'm not very confident in my ship without SSR and MACO shield. (yes, I can't carry very well with this toon...yet)
At that point I wrote "Aren't you going to kill the cube?" - seconds later the two heroes pay attention and......go puf! It turned out I had to kill it anyway. At that point I didn't care about letting probes through the portal (although i did not, but the teammates on the other side did) - we weren't going to make the optional anyway. 25 minutes later, we cleared the mission and went home.
All this made me think, that there is some kind of grouping together less experienced players, because this wasn't the first time that I see a huge difference in the level of player I'm grouped in on my main and on my alt.
*Probe duty in my vocabulary means killing the cube, the nanites and transformer, while waiting for the probes next spawn.
I have done these missions more times than I care to count. I know how to do them, and I know what I am doing. If you don't like what or how I do it I no longer care. If you are doing something wrong or are flying a failboat once again I do not care (I will carry you typically).
In my Tac Defiant I like to destroy the spheres as they spawn on the first side in ISE. Blew a gen early and had someone flip out in chat. Mind you by early I dropped one to 10%, blew one, and on the way past helped drop the other to low 30s. Needless to say I told him to be silent and proceeded to kill all the spawns. Then had to turn around and kill the generator.
My personal experience is thus, if you are good enough that you feel the right to nit pick how others fly then you are good enough to carry a bad PuG to victory anyway. The vast majority of the time those who flip out or begin to shout orders are flying failboat cruisers FaWing at everything with tetryons and dealing pathetic damage while being unable to tank a standard cube. Your mileage may vary though.
true dat. I tend to ignore chat in pugs, just because I concentrate on my game, as I am doing loads of micromanaging in my vesta to maximize effectiveness, and I do not have time to explain to them, I know what I am doing (well, I did yell on teamspeak in my previous fleet to some people, when they were totally stupid, and started to question me, but it only resulted me, losing some optimal approach angles)
HSE is not hard, I never understood the fear of it. I mean you literally do not even need planning there, just pure dps. the only planning it needs, is to define where you approach the hoard of cubes, and pretty much that is it
I don't have a problem with succeeding, but there's a huge difference in duration depending on if people know what they're doing or not. It's hard to get survival optional objectives if you have weaksauce members in your PUG, and hard to get the initial duration optional objective if the group lacks DPS.
I find it considerably more tolerable with folks I know rather than PUGs.
That wouldn't make any difference. Tactics commonly used in non-elite STFs (e.g. KASn: finish off one side, then move to the next, CSn: blow up generators & cube, then move to the next one, ISn: blow up generators and have 1-2 people intercept probes etc...) are usually what will make you fail the optional on Elite.
Also I'd think that playing 2 STFs on non-elite, which will reward the marks needed to get to Tier 1, won't make any player understand the tactics used in eSTFs any better.
Well it wouldn't cure cancer either, but what it would do is keep tourists out of ESTFs.
People would have to demonstrate the desire and the ability to claim enough Omega points for the purpose of unlocking Tier 1. It would reduce drive-by ESTF greatly.
I dont understand why this wasnt done from the start, tbh. There are plenty of regular STFs for the tourists to hit. The ESTFs should be for people who are chasing Omega rep, the borg warrior RP.
*Probe duty in my vocabulary means killing the cube, the nanites and transformer, while waiting for the probes next spawn.
This is only possible as a Tac captain in a escort - with very high DPS - can you do this with 3 probes coming in a crusier as an Eng or Sci Captain?
That's the problem with ESTF - the optionals are geared toward high DPS
I can handle 3 probes with my Fleet excel eng - but it's tough - I don't have the speed or dps to handle a cube, gens,trans and get back to probes in time to make sure they don't get through.
However, I can take a whole gate down while hanging around inside it at point blank range without ever dropping below 90% hull.
So should I be forced to change to a escort and tac just to play STF?
Half of this is incorrect. I'm an Eng captain in an escort and do that fine, but I have very high DPS. I'm also in a JHEC, so... :P
I am a engineer in a odyssey, and dont see any problem in doing probe duty + one side of the gate. The tricky part with the other side is to switch fast enough from targeting the probes to flying to the other side(of one gateway) and vice versa.
And I fly a Sci in a Fleet Reconnaissence Sci-ship. And have no problem doing this.
This is only possible as a Tac captain in a escort - with very high DPS - can you do this with 3 probes coming in a crusier as an Eng or Sci Captain?
That's the problem with ESTF - the optionals are geared toward high DPS
I can handle 3 probes with my Fleet excel eng - but it's tough - I don't have the speed or dps to handle a cube, gens,trans and get back to probes in time to make sure they don't get through.
However, I can take a whole gate down while hanging around inside it at point blank range without ever dropping below 90% hull.
So should I be forced to change to a escort and tac just to play STF?
If you wish to carry bad PuGs to victory then yes. At least the warship/escort part until Cryptic decides to re-balance the game anyway.
I personally love the steamrunner on my Eng, and the Akira on my other.
I am a engineer in a odyssey, and dont see any problem in doing probe duty + one side of the gate. The tricky part with the other side is to switch fast enough from targeting the probes to flying to the other side(of one gateway) and vice versa.
And I fly a Sci in a Fleet Reconnaissence Sci-ship. And have no problem doing this.
Sure anything is possible - you can bog the probes down in a Grav Well - or warp plasma
But on a normal basis - this stratagey is risky in a slow moving ship - and there are 5 players in the match.
Why would 1 person have to take the risk of letting a probe through so they can work the entire side? Does not make sense. There is no reason 1 player should have to work 1 whole side with 4 on the other.
This is only possible as a Tac captain in a escort - with very high DPS - can you do this with 3 probes coming in a crusier as an Eng or Sci Captain?
That's the problem with ESTF - the optionals are geared toward high DPS
I can handle 3 probes with my Fleet excel eng - but it's tough - I don't have the speed or dps to handle a cube, gens,trans and get back to probes in time to make sure they don't get through.
However, I can take a whole gate down while hanging around inside it at point blank range without ever dropping below 90% hull.
So should I be forced to change to a escort and tac just to play STF?
No, you should respec your ship and if necessary your skills. Being not capable of doing this with one of the finest cruisers out there is... disappointing. One side while on probe duty shouldn't be a problem. There are enough builds out there which are capable of tanking while doing damage. One point is an all-beam setup.
If you cant do damage on the fleet excel, you wont do significantly more with a escort. Granted you will do more, but in comparison to a normal escort (with an eng-captain), it will be near nothing. I cant stand "Cruisers are up, escorts are op"-talk, because it simply isnt true. You can do damage with every kind of ship -even sci, its just a different road. While escorts do damage with their tac-skill, cruisers buff themselves with their engineering skills and support that with their tac-skills.
No, you should respec your ship and if necessary your skills. Being not capable of doing this with one of the finest cruisers out there is... disappointing. One side while on probe duty shouldn't be a problem. There are enough builds out there which are capable of tanking while doing damage. One point is an all-beam setup.
If you cant do damage on the fleet excel, you wont do significantly more with a escort. Granted you will do more, but in comparison to a normal escort (with an eng-captain), it will be near nothing. I cant stand "Cruisers are up, escorts are op"-talk, because it simply isnt true. You can do damage with every kind of ship -even sci, its just a different road. While escorts do damage with their tac-skill, cruisers buff themselves with their engineering skills and support that with their tac-skills.
If I pushed my ship to the limit - yes then I should be "able" to do this. As a point and click mouse player it's harder. I don't like having to keep changing things up for the 1 STF - that I play per day.
Sure i could load her with cannons - CRF - or all beams with duals up front - constantly buffing and blasting and running around like a wild man - i can carry 2 duals up front - hit EPtw2, ATb2, ept, Nadion - Hit BO3 and those beams will cut through anything - i can dump weapons batterys and aux batteries like they were going out of style - i can use engine buffs and stuff to go faster.
The question is Why?? Why should i be doing the work of 2 or 3 players?
Khitomer space NORMAL, Myself and a Fleetmate decided to PUG in, How bad could it be, Everything starts great everybody chats, and we decide who is going where. The Cube in the middle drops like a rock, I'm thinking this is awesome.
My fleetmate takes off to do probes right, the rest of us go left, Everything is going good until the PUG on probes left runs into trouble! The other 2 run to help him and Never come back! And to top it all off they let a probe thru! My fleetmate and I end up taking both sides down by ourselves well these 3 PUGS flew around in circles NEEDING every drop,
I dunno if people (F2P) don't read the forums or what, But in the last week I have run into more Rainbow Beam Boats than ever before, And Cannons to PUG into Infected space Wednesday, counted red green and blue, on an Advance Escort. Every time he hit his Scatter Volley looked like a Pack of Skittles exploded
lmao! Trying to win over the borg! Or trying to force skittles down borgs mouth.. Screaming Taste The Rainbow, Taste the Rainbow, TASTE THE RAINBOW!!!!!!!
Sometimes I'll equip some rainbow cannons just for the lulz... If I know the other four Captains seem to know what they're doing. Oh, and when running rainbows, always have power going to your engines so you look super cool! :cool:
This is only possible as a Tac captain in a escort - with very high DPS - can you do this with 3 probes coming in a cruiser as an Eng or Sci Captain?
That's the problem with ESTF - the optionals are geared toward high DPS
I can handle 3 probes with my Fleet excel eng - but it's tough - I don't have the speed or dps to handle a cube, gens,trans and get back to probes in time to make sure they don't get through.
However, I can take a whole gate down while hanging around inside it at point blank range without ever dropping below 90% hull.
So should I be forced to change to a escort and tac just to play STF?
Yes, I can and I've done it - with a sci captain in a Star Cruiser (which has 2 tactical consoles) - badly build if I may add - my typical DPS was around 3500-4000 in a 3xDBB/Photon/Turrets configuration and 2 RCS consoles and without EPtW (how stupid of me, but I guess I've learned a lot in the past half an year since I switched to fleet ships). But you must be aware that if you're doing something like this, completing the optional is a big NO.
I wrote it just to explain what it means to me to be a probe guard and this is a standart I've set for myself, not for everyone else.
I'm looking at FHEC or Fleet Assault Cruiser (FAC? ) as my next project, hopefully I'll have refined enough dilithium to equip it from head to toe.
If I pushed my ship to the limit - yes then I should be "able" to do this. As a point and click mouse player it's harder. I don't like having to keep changing things up for the 1 STF - that I play per day.
Sure i could load her with cannons - CRF - or all beams with duals up front - constantly buffing and blasting and running around like a wild man - i can carry 2 duals up front - hit EPtw2, ATb2, ept, Nadion - Hit BO3 and those beams will cut through anything - i can dump weapons batterys and aux batteries like they were going out of style - i can use engine buffs and stuff to go faster.
The question is Why?? Why should i be doing the work of 2 or 3 players?
it is not the work of 2-3 players. it is your job, to do your best, and you are clearly not even trying. at this point you are even the one that has to be carried. someone who actually tries hard, will have a harder time, if he gets less support. this is not a solo game, and by this attitude, you are making this topic (and this kind of off topic) possible.
also it is not the work of other players, as you are doing yourself a favor by doing that, as the game will be faster and smoother, if you are doing well. but the problem is that I have to try and explain this, lol
I mean I out dps most escorts in my vesta in any pug, and I dont even need dhcs for that (hell, I am testing a beam build, that only in the initial tests with base consoles and equpment deals 9k dps, which most escorts never even reached). do I complain that I have to carry other people. yes ofc I do, because if a sci in a sci ship can do better than a tac in an escort, there is a problem, and I doubt that it is in my approach to do the things, how they should be done
If I pushed my ship to the limit - yes then I should be "able" to do this. As a point and click mouse player it's harder. I don't like having to keep changing things up for the 1 STF - that I play per day.
Sure i could load her with cannons - CRF - or all beams with duals up front - constantly buffing and blasting and running around like a wild man - i can carry 2 duals up front - hit EPtw2, ATb2, ept, Nadion - Hit BO3 and those beams will cut through anything - i can dump weapons batterys and aux batteries like they were going out of style - i can use engine buffs and stuff to go faster.
The question is Why?? Why should i be doing the work of 2 or 3 players?
If someone would ask me, why I do this, my answer would be: Because I can
Its just a matter of what you want to be, someone people can rely on, or someone who has to rely on others.
it is not the work of 2-3 players. it is your job, to do your best, and you are clearly not even trying. at this point you are even the one that has to be carried. someone who actually tries hard, will have a harder time, if he gets less support. this is not a solo game,
I will take on probes and 1 gen/trans/cube by myself if I am the only one over there - I won't run to the other side of the gate to get the other with 3 probes running - just too risky.
Your last point there is most important - you should read it again - this is not a solo game.
There is zero reason that 1 person in a 5 man team should have to carry 1 side by themselves. That IS a SOLO game!
No particular horror stories this time though a couple of miffed moments.
KASE for the second time in the last few weeks I end up guarding the lone side in a 4-1 split (we missed the optional the first of those also but not badly) and kill the initial probes before moving on a couple of nanites (maybe the cube can't remember how quickly I spawned it) turn back to kill my 2nd set of probes and as they die I glance and there are 2 probes right on the verge of the gate... 4 of them and not 1 dealt with their initial probes (if alone on a 4-1 split you're not expected to field all probes are you?) optional lost. We won but it felt annoying (those were the only probes we let through).
On another note I've started calling rainbow captains Joseph (after all they are flying the USS Technicolour Beam Boat) in my head, and thought I'd share that silly name with the forum.
Took a break for almost half a year from the game, come back to find it just as bad as before in terms of PuGs in STFs.
Can't remember the new names as they've changed them since I last played, but the one with the two generators/gate at the starbase. Start off and we drop the cube and first 2 spheres easy enough, then everyone heads for the gate on the left...except one escort who decides to go over to the right side and Leroy Jenkins the whole thing by himself. Multiple whispers and team chat asking him WTF he's doing but he doesn't respond, just parks himself about 6k out and starts spamming cannon scatter volley.
Guy probably died 3-4 times and just kept going back and doing the same thing, then the gate starts spitting out nanite probes/spheres on both ends and it just turned into a cluster ****. Myself(Vesta) and one of the escorts had to keep running back and forth between the two sides trying to destroy all the probes/spheres and the entire STF took about 30 minutes longer than it should and of course we lost the bonus objective pretty much right at the start.
Also WTF is up with everyone "Needing" on every single friggin' drop in STFs now? Yes I'm sure you're flying your fully outfitted ship in an STF and you have to "need" on that Mk IX green console or shield that you need so badly for your end game build.
There is zero reason that 1 person in a 5 man team should have to carry 1 side by themselves.
Wait, this is about the 4/1 split? That's a perfectly acceptable tactic. Both 4/1 and 3/2 are fine.
3/2 is for when all ships are competent, and can do both sides simultaneously. Since one person will be prioritizing probes, that means the other1-2 people need to be able to tackle a cube by themselves. If that one guy on your side pops because they can't handle a cube in the few seconds it takes you to clear probes, then they should have done 4/1.
4/1 is the easier method, since that puts 3 people on any particular target while the other two have probe duty. It's also the most efficient method if one guy can clear a side in the time it takes the others to clear theirs.
I don't mind either way, if it's 3/2 the gates tend to blow simultaneously, if it's 4/1 I tend to be working on the last transformer when they blow the gateway on the other side.
All of the above is still teamwork. In 4/1, you're holding off the other side so the other team can clear their side.
Also WTF is up with everyone "Needing" on every single friggin' drop in STFs now? Yes I'm sure you're flying your fully outfitted ship in an STF and you have to "need" on that Mk IX green console or shield that you need so badly for your end game build.
1. By blindly hitting "need", you minimize the distraction. Don't have to actually consider if it's useful or not.
2. Nobody should actually need it. If you're in an eSTF, you should already be properly outfitted and the generally crappy drops is just for cash anyway.
3. Even if you take the time you Need/Greed, you're just going to end up with some jerk who Needs everything anyway. Better to just have everyone Need/Pass.
Even in our own Fleet runs we just Need everything, and then after the STF is over we compare and share loot. No need for the distraction while the STF is going.
Took a break for almost half a year from the game, come back to find it just as bad as before in terms of PuGs in STFs.
Also WTF is up with everyone "Needing" on every single friggin' drop in STFs now? Yes I'm sure you're flying your fully outfitted ship in an STF and you have to "need" on that Mk IX green console or shield that you need so badly for your end game build.
This is Cryptic's doing - now with the new reputation system - and starbase system - every assignment costs massive amounts of EC(commodities) to run.
A Omega rep mission could cost as much as 200k of commodities - so people actually do NEED whatever they can get their hands on to recycle/sell to get EC to buy the commodities to run the rep system.
Wait, this is about the 4/1 split? That's a perfectly acceptable tactic. Both 4/1 and 3/2 are fine.
3/2 is for when all ships are competent, and can do both sides simultaneously. Since one person will be prioritizing probes, that means the other1-2 people need to be able to tackle a cube by themselves. If that one guy on your side pops because they can't handle a cube in the few seconds it takes you to clear probes, then they should have done 4/1.
4/1 is the easier method, since that puts 3 people on any particular target while the other two have probe duty. It's also the most efficient method if one guy can clear a side in the time it takes the others to clear theirs.
I don't mind either way, if it's 3/2 the gates tend to blow simultaneously, if it's 4/1 I tend to be working on the last transformer when they blow the gateway on the other side.
All of the above is still teamwork. In 4/1, you're holding off the other side so the other team can clear their side.
.
I will relent to your guys Kirk's awesomeness - if a player is capable of destroying one side without ever letting a probe get through without support - go for it.
I still think if a player can get through 1 side by themselves - then the other 4 must be doing jack all on the other side.
This is Cryptic's doing - now with the new reputation system - and starbase system - every assignment costs massive amounts of EC(commodities) to run.
Yep, everybody needs the money, not the item itself. And all the loot is trash anyway - your only hope of anything good is in the final (non-shared) award anyway.
_________________________________________________ [Kluless][Kold][Steel Heels][Snagtooth] [Louis Cipher][Outta Gum][Thysa Kymbo][Spanner][Frakk] [D'Mented][D'Licious]
Joined October 2009. READ BEFORE POSTING
Comments
That wouldn't make any difference. Tactics commonly used in non-elite STFs (e.g. KASn: finish off one side, then move to the next, CSn: blow up generators & cube, then move to the next one, ISn: blow up generators and have 1-2 people intercept probes etc...) are usually what will make you fail the optional on Elite.
Also I'd think that playing 2 STFs on non-elite, which will reward the marks needed to get to Tier 1, won't make any player understand the tactics used in eSTFs any better.
Worse was worthy of the dumbest people ever award. .
Vortex elite me one side doing probes etc etc 4 yes 4 the other side so after I go boom a couple of times I lost it and shouted in chat to get some help and did I no not until they failed the optional which ok meh not bothered too much about that but it took 45mins to finish coz they obviously loved the I in team
I have done these missions more times than I care to count. I know how to do them, and I know what I am doing. If you don't like what or how I do it I no longer care. If you are doing something wrong or are flying a failboat once again I do not care (I will carry you typically).
In my Tac Defiant I like to destroy the spheres as they spawn on the first side in ISE. Blew a gen early and had someone flip out in chat. Mind you by early I dropped one to 10%, blew one, and on the way past helped drop the other to low 30s. Needless to say I told him to be silent and proceeded to kill all the spawns. Then had to turn around and kill the generator.
My personal experience is thus, if you are good enough that you feel the right to nit pick how others fly then you are good enough to carry a bad PuG to victory anyway. The vast majority of the time those who flip out or begin to shout orders are flying failboat cruisers FaWing at everything with tetryons and dealing pathetic damage while being unable to tank a standard cube. Your mileage may vary though.
4 on one side and one on the other doing probe duty is a perfectly legit tactic. Of course, they should have adapted to cover you once they saw you couldn't handle it, but seriously, most times I do KASE, one guy is enough to cover probes while the others work the other side over. You may have some problems with your build.
If you were doing probe duty how in the world did you go "Boom" a couple of times?? this makes no sense. You know you might have been the problem - no-one doing probe duty should be going boom unless
a) you spawned a cube
c)they spawned cubes and let them wander across the map
I like that one, very true.
Last night was....strange. With my main toon, I did 3 eSTFs in a roll, all completed with good times (meaning at least 6 minutes left on the timer) - I had a cooldown of 32 minutes left so I switched to my alt (which is at T3 Omega and T2 Rommy rep). I queued for Azura nebula Rescue, I see a timer and I accept the mission......and I warp out in HSN - really!? Anyway, I went through it. After that I actually did an ANR and then queued for ISE, which was a complete fail, but we somehow completed it without turning it into the 100 years war.
Then I queued for KASE. As I mentioned on the last page, I experience a pure hatred toward the players spawning a cube and letting it wander untouched. And yeah, it happened again!
I assumed left probe duty* and started doing my routine. As I've mentioned before, I tend to pay great attention on what the other teammates are doing....or not doing. I see we're 3 on the left, the other 2 are on the right. The two on my side spawn a cube (I spawn mine after I clear the second spawn of probes) and ignore it completely....meanwhile I can see the cube moving toward me. I know I can kill it if I have to, but I'm not very confident in my ship without SSR and MACO shield. (yes, I can't carry very well with this toon...yet)
At that point I wrote "Aren't you going to kill the cube?" - seconds later the two heroes pay attention and......go puf! It turned out I had to kill it anyway. At that point I didn't care about letting probes through the portal (although i did not, but the teammates on the other side did) - we weren't going to make the optional anyway. 25 minutes later, we cleared the mission and went home.
All this made me think, that there is some kind of grouping together less experienced players, because this wasn't the first time that I see a huge difference in the level of player I'm grouped in on my main and on my alt.
*Probe duty in my vocabulary means killing the cube, the nanites and transformer, while waiting for the probes next spawn.
true dat. I tend to ignore chat in pugs, just because I concentrate on my game, as I am doing loads of micromanaging in my vesta to maximize effectiveness, and I do not have time to explain to them, I know what I am doing (well, I did yell on teamspeak in my previous fleet to some people, when they were totally stupid, and started to question me, but it only resulted me, losing some optimal approach angles)
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
I don't have a problem with succeeding, but there's a huge difference in duration depending on if people know what they're doing or not. It's hard to get survival optional objectives if you have weaksauce members in your PUG, and hard to get the initial duration optional objective if the group lacks DPS.
I find it considerably more tolerable with folks I know rather than PUGs.
Well it wouldn't cure cancer either, but what it would do is keep tourists out of ESTFs.
People would have to demonstrate the desire and the ability to claim enough Omega points for the purpose of unlocking Tier 1. It would reduce drive-by ESTF greatly.
I dont understand why this wasnt done from the start, tbh. There are plenty of regular STFs for the tourists to hit. The ESTFs should be for people who are chasing Omega rep, the borg warrior RP.
This is only possible as a Tac captain in a escort - with very high DPS - can you do this with 3 probes coming in a crusier as an Eng or Sci Captain?
That's the problem with ESTF - the optionals are geared toward high DPS
I can handle 3 probes with my Fleet excel eng - but it's tough - I don't have the speed or dps to handle a cube, gens,trans and get back to probes in time to make sure they don't get through.
However, I can take a whole gate down while hanging around inside it at point blank range without ever dropping below 90% hull.
So should I be forced to change to a escort and tac just to play STF?
Sure an Eng can do it - DPS and speed are necessary to do it - less so the type of Captain - beam weapons are the worst weapons type on probes.
Plus you have pets to continue to work the Gens/trans as you switch to probes if you fly a HEC
I am a engineer in a odyssey, and dont see any problem in doing probe duty + one side of the gate. The tricky part with the other side is to switch fast enough from targeting the probes to flying to the other side(of one gateway) and vice versa.
And I fly a Sci in a Fleet Reconnaissence Sci-ship. And have no problem doing this.
If you wish to carry bad PuGs to victory then yes. At least the warship/escort part until Cryptic decides to re-balance the game anyway.
I personally love the steamrunner on my Eng, and the Akira on my other.
Sure anything is possible - you can bog the probes down in a Grav Well - or warp plasma
But on a normal basis - this stratagey is risky in a slow moving ship - and there are 5 players in the match.
Why would 1 person have to take the risk of letting a probe through so they can work the entire side? Does not make sense. There is no reason 1 player should have to work 1 whole side with 4 on the other.
No, you should respec your ship and if necessary your skills. Being not capable of doing this with one of the finest cruisers out there is... disappointing. One side while on probe duty shouldn't be a problem. There are enough builds out there which are capable of tanking while doing damage. One point is an all-beam setup.
If you cant do damage on the fleet excel, you wont do significantly more with a escort. Granted you will do more, but in comparison to a normal escort (with an eng-captain), it will be near nothing. I cant stand "Cruisers are up, escorts are op"-talk, because it simply isnt true. You can do damage with every kind of ship -even sci, its just a different road. While escorts do damage with their tac-skill, cruisers buff themselves with their engineering skills and support that with their tac-skills.
If I pushed my ship to the limit - yes then I should be "able" to do this. As a point and click mouse player it's harder. I don't like having to keep changing things up for the 1 STF - that I play per day.
Sure i could load her with cannons - CRF - or all beams with duals up front - constantly buffing and blasting and running around like a wild man - i can carry 2 duals up front - hit EPtw2, ATb2, ept, Nadion - Hit BO3 and those beams will cut through anything - i can dump weapons batterys and aux batteries like they were going out of style - i can use engine buffs and stuff to go faster.
The question is Why?? Why should i be doing the work of 2 or 3 players?
CSN
Pugged in and said 'HI' as usual.
Someone says 'I have the Kang.'
I thought 'Yea, you mean 4 of you have the Kang. LOL'
I fly to the right cube and a Klink follows.
Three go to the Kang.
The Klink and I clear the first group of nodes and are working on the Cube.
Optional fails.
I say, 'Your kidding right? What do we have at the Kang, a bunch of Rainbows?'
The Klink says "Puny Humans!"
The guy who said he would protect the Kang calls us all Noobes and that we should have all been at the Kang.
I check him out, under 2000 accolade and Skittles.
I check out the other two at the Kang, sure enough, Rainbow/Technicolor beams.
The Klink and I finish off the second cube.
One guy is now off in LaLa Land collecting goodies.
The Klink and I work on the third cube while a Rainbow/Technicolor boat works on the spawn.
The Guy that thought he could watch the Kang in now off in LaLa land.
The Carrier shows up and there's just three of us working on it while the two in LaLa land are calling us Noobes.
Carrier Dies, it's over.
I say "lose the rainbows losers." :eek:
I don't very often use such language but it fit.
lmao! Trying to win over the borg! Or trying to force skittles down borgs mouth.. Screaming Taste The Rainbow, Taste the Rainbow, TASTE THE RAINBOW!!!!!!!
Yes, I can and I've done it - with a sci captain in a Star Cruiser (which has 2 tactical consoles) - badly build if I may add - my typical DPS was around 3500-4000 in a 3xDBB/Photon/Turrets configuration and 2 RCS consoles and without EPtW (how stupid of me, but I guess I've learned a lot in the past half an year since I switched to fleet ships). But you must be aware that if you're doing something like this, completing the optional is a big NO.
I wrote it just to explain what it means to me to be a probe guard and this is a standart I've set for myself, not for everyone else.
I'm looking at FHEC or Fleet Assault Cruiser (FAC?
it is not the work of 2-3 players. it is your job, to do your best, and you are clearly not even trying. at this point you are even the one that has to be carried. someone who actually tries hard, will have a harder time, if he gets less support. this is not a solo game, and by this attitude, you are making this topic (and this kind of off topic) possible.
also it is not the work of other players, as you are doing yourself a favor by doing that, as the game will be faster and smoother, if you are doing well. but the problem is that I have to try and explain this, lol
I mean I out dps most escorts in my vesta in any pug, and I dont even need dhcs for that (hell, I am testing a beam build, that only in the initial tests with base consoles and equpment deals 9k dps, which most escorts never even reached). do I complain that I have to carry other people. yes ofc I do, because if a sci in a sci ship can do better than a tac in an escort, there is a problem, and I doubt that it is in my approach to do the things, how they should be done
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
If someone would ask me, why I do this, my answer would be: Because I can
Its just a matter of what you want to be, someone people can rely on, or someone who has to rely on others.
I will take on probes and 1 gen/trans/cube by myself if I am the only one over there - I won't run to the other side of the gate to get the other with 3 probes running - just too risky.
Your last point there is most important - you should read it again - this is not a solo game.
There is zero reason that 1 person in a 5 man team should have to carry 1 side by themselves. That IS a SOLO game!
KASE for the second time in the last few weeks I end up guarding the lone side in a 4-1 split (we missed the optional the first of those also but not badly) and kill the initial probes before moving on a couple of nanites (maybe the cube can't remember how quickly I spawned it) turn back to kill my 2nd set of probes and as they die I glance and there are 2 probes right on the verge of the gate... 4 of them and not 1 dealt with their initial probes (if alone on a 4-1 split you're not expected to field all probes are you?) optional lost. We won but it felt annoying (those were the only probes we let through).
On another note I've started calling rainbow captains Joseph (after all they are flying the USS Technicolour Beam Boat) in my head, and thought I'd share that silly name with the forum.
Can't remember the new names as they've changed them since I last played, but the one with the two generators/gate at the starbase. Start off and we drop the cube and first 2 spheres easy enough, then everyone heads for the gate on the left...except one escort who decides to go over to the right side and Leroy Jenkins the whole thing by himself. Multiple whispers and team chat asking him WTF he's doing but he doesn't respond, just parks himself about 6k out and starts spamming cannon scatter volley.
Guy probably died 3-4 times and just kept going back and doing the same thing, then the gate starts spitting out nanite probes/spheres on both ends and it just turned into a cluster ****. Myself(Vesta) and one of the escorts had to keep running back and forth between the two sides trying to destroy all the probes/spheres and the entire STF took about 30 minutes longer than it should and of course we lost the bonus objective pretty much right at the start.
Also WTF is up with everyone "Needing" on every single friggin' drop in STFs now? Yes I'm sure you're flying your fully outfitted ship in an STF and you have to "need" on that Mk IX green console or shield that you need so badly for your end game build.
3/2 is for when all ships are competent, and can do both sides simultaneously. Since one person will be prioritizing probes, that means the other1-2 people need to be able to tackle a cube by themselves. If that one guy on your side pops because they can't handle a cube in the few seconds it takes you to clear probes, then they should have done 4/1.
4/1 is the easier method, since that puts 3 people on any particular target while the other two have probe duty. It's also the most efficient method if one guy can clear a side in the time it takes the others to clear theirs.
I don't mind either way, if it's 3/2 the gates tend to blow simultaneously, if it's 4/1 I tend to be working on the last transformer when they blow the gateway on the other side.
All of the above is still teamwork. In 4/1, you're holding off the other side so the other team can clear their side.
1. By blindly hitting "need", you minimize the distraction. Don't have to actually consider if it's useful or not.
2. Nobody should actually need it. If you're in an eSTF, you should already be properly outfitted and the generally crappy drops is just for cash anyway.
3. Even if you take the time you Need/Greed, you're just going to end up with some jerk who Needs everything anyway. Better to just have everyone Need/Pass.
Even in our own Fleet runs we just Need everything, and then after the STF is over we compare and share loot. No need for the distraction while the STF is going.
This is Cryptic's doing - now with the new reputation system - and starbase system - every assignment costs massive amounts of EC(commodities) to run.
A Omega rep mission could cost as much as 200k of commodities - so people actually do NEED whatever they can get their hands on to recycle/sell to get EC to buy the commodities to run the rep system.
I will relent to your guys Kirk's awesomeness - if a player is capable of destroying one side without ever letting a probe get through without support - go for it.
I still think if a player can get through 1 side by themselves - then the other 4 must be doing jack all on the other side.
Yep, everybody needs the money, not the item itself. And all the loot is trash anyway - your only hope of anything good is in the final (non-shared) award anyway.
[Kluless][Kold][Steel Heels][Snagtooth]
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Joined October 2009. READ BEFORE POSTING