Here's a hint folks; A Tac in a Bird of Prey is NOT your best bet to cover the Kang!!! That's a CRUISER job, i.e. someone who can deal DPS AND heal.
Sorry pal, but I have to respectfully disagree with you. Killing a borg BoP faster means less damage the Kang takes. And guess who kills borg BoPs faster? You guessed it, tacs and escorts/BoPs. An escort is already ridiculously good at tanking, and while BoPs are not the same, they are darn close. Don't get me wrong here, I respect your opinion, but in my experience the tac in an escort/BoP is always the better guard. That's just what I think.
I get reasonable DPS, but I do so by sacrificing just about everything but movement to do it, at minimum you want some area-of-effect fire if you're going to try to just keep killing them faster than they can spawn. The problem here, is that I've got less hull than a Runabout, a Shield mult. that's a joke, and while I DO rock the Polarons, I do NOT have CC covered and put simply, I might be able to cover one side of CSE-for a while, until the Raptors and Negh'vars start spawning.
at which point, you NEED to have someone who can survive an Iso-charge hit, or survive a couple plasma torps, 'cause I ain't it.
More importantly, if you WANT the guy in the paper-hulled Bird of Prey to cover the Kang, it's useful to SAY SO, like, BEFORE 1/3 of the spawns have reached it, he's out of position, and you've just popped the first 'second tier' Probes (thus generating Raptors and Negh'vars...)
In a BoP, it's bad when the cubes notice you, it's worse when the Assimilated Bops start calling for reinforcements and the Raptors show up, but the absolute WORST, is when these things happen, and the rest of the team haven't noticed your icon's grayed out, because they're busy scattering fire from 9km away at the Cube/probes/whatever and they're also not LOOKING BEHIND THEM.
Now...(calming down) here's the deal, 'kay? I'm set up to deal lots of damage on specific targets, I don't run 'autofire' and I don't run 'aoe" fire-I have CRF1, 2, and 3, BO2, and that's about it. I can squish an Assimilated BoP in a very short period of time, I can pop probes pretty fast, I can even chew a Cube hard enough it forgets the Fleet Defiant on it's left to focus on my skinny KDF TRIBBLE.
I don't run Threat Control, I'm specced on Stealth instead. For Sci powers, I usually manage to run EPTS and TSS, and whenever I can sqeeze it in, HE-but space is limited as is power. I also run TT1 AND TT2.
Savvy? NOT THE GUY YOU WANT COVERING THE KANG-at least, not SOLO.
I can kill 'em, but I have to be IN RANGE to do it, and can't be in 2 places simultaneously.
Do you mind telling me what ship you're running? It's hard to picture this situation when I don't know what to put there.
so, I queue up for an ISE, and guess what I get. I get into an already failed optional, with 3 cruisers and one patrol escort.
I check out the ships more closely. there is one oddy that has only AP beams, and it is the only of the four ships that has no damages. the patrol escort has no cannons, only dual beam banks, there is an assault cruiser rainbow (he was NOVA CORE, I swear that fleet delibaretly collects all the bad stf players, 90% of my failed stfs had one of them guys in it), and another oddy which is half rainbow (only two kinds of weapon types).
so I easly assessed, that I alone have more dps than they are together in my vesta.
while the two oddys struggle with a normal sphere, and the assault cruiser is in respawn oblivion I go in, make a nice little group of the nanites and blow them to hell with some tricks of mine and a little help from the escort. as the last of them blow, the two oddys join me, and we are trying to kill the transformer. ofc it wouldnt work on first try, so kill another wave of nanites, and as my spec powers are reloaded, I can devastate the transformer, kill the two incoming spheres, and move to the other.
this goes relatively smotther, as it is, they know the tactics, they just have no means of making it work. compared to their dps, this part went relatively smooth (though admittedly there is not much to do, once I got the spheres into a grav well, sent a torp spread 3, CSV in their way, and as a parting gift an iso charge, that usually does the job in 1 minute)
so I move to the gate, again my powers are reloaded, so I can unload my 25k burst dps (I know escorts have higher, but with the vesta quantum phaser I can keep that dps up for twice the time), it goes down.
now the cube is a bit harder. I start working on it, ofc I get the aggro, so after a minute or so I have to jump out of the fight for a bit with evasives away. just at this moment, my phone rings, so I answer it, while watching how the cube makes nice explosions out of the big ships (that were neither dps, nor tank ships).
when I join back two are fighting the cube, the moment I enter 10km range I get targeted by the cube (I didnt do nothing, just entered the range, so I guess just my pure presence is more threatening than theirs). at this point all my powers are reloaded, so I just shoot everything at the cube, and watch it blow up, taking two of my glorious team with it.
and this would not have happened, if I wasnt joined into an already failed game. if it was KASE or CSE, I would have just let it fail, but with ISE, I couldnt do nothing, but fight...
with these games there should be atleast a notification, that I am joining an already running game, so I can avoid the misery.
Here's a hint folks; A Tac in a Bird of Prey is NOT your best bet to cover the Kang!!! That's a CRUISER job, i.e. someone who can deal DPS AND heal.
LOL. Sorry, I fell off my chair laughing when I read this.
A properly built escort, even a BOP, can defend the Kang without anything ever getting close enough to the Kang to fire a shot. No heals needed.
I quit watching the Kang even though I can do it by myself because there are usually 4 Rainbow/Technicolor beam and/or Skittle boats setting there at the Kang making a futile attempt to do just that.
Even then I usually have to fly back and take out two or three Borg at the Kang that they can't.
Last night at CSE there was something that left me really frustrated. We did the opt with 2 min to spare, and we wrote the standard "gg". Then left, after that one individual sent me a Pm "not good at all *insert a vulgar word here" and put me in his ignore list. I hope that in the future I'll never ever cross paths with such players.
Last night at CSE there was something that left me really frustrated. We did the opt with 2 min to spare, and we wrote the standard "gg". Then left, after that one individual sent me a Pm "not good at all *insert a vulgar word here" and put me in his ignore list. I hope that in the future I'll never ever cross paths with such players.
did you happen to kill the ship that comes after you finished the optional? (I would love if you said no. I dare you to make my day!)
Pug team (was too lazy to form team, and private queues are broken).
Team Comp: Tor'Kaht (me), Odyssey, Litter Bo... erm Caitan Atrox Carrier, Intrepid, Qin Heavy Raptor
Start of mission, everything goes fine. Cube and spheres have their privilege of existing forcibly removed. We blow away the generators, and the spheres spawn. All fine and dandy. Until... we start killing them... so it's all good. Or is it?
Right as the nanites swarm in, the Atrox drops a grav well with some aftershocks, perfect for myself and the qin to basically ruin them into nothing. The Odyssey is doing this odd dance near the gate (rainbow oddy) shooting at it and the spheres, and basically being useless (I kinda expect it tbh as soon as I saw plasma combined with polaron combined with tetryon and plasma torpedoes with no high yield). The Intrepid is kinda just sitting there doing nothing. Which is fine since the DPS from myself and the qin is removing a sphere roughly every 20 seconds (the atrox was helping with its weapons and its fighters). And then all of a sudden, the Intrepid goes in. Fine. Hits TBR and suddenly 3 spheres are now 29k away. Not so fine.
We caught and killed them, but he did it again on the other side. If the qin and I weren't so good at killing, we probably would have lost the opt. Also sufficed to say, that Intrepid also had a death wish, since he kept on trying to solo the tac cube and/or gate. He shot at whatever we WEREN'T shooting at. And died. And then called us noobs at the end of the match.
Freakin LOVE TBR... especially in the hands of an imbecile.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
What's with all the rainbow warriors! Every STF, every fleet run, every mission, it's one after another rainbow boat. Has the world gone nuts? Come on people! Grow a brain! Dump those rainbows and get some firepower! :P
Seriously, I ran three fleets and a cure normal today and didn't win any thanks to rainbows.
Totally bummed.
I believe they are the 25th century hippies
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
First cube and spheres go nice. Whole team go left and open fire at cube, but not Atrox. He and his fighters attack generator, destroing it when rest of generators were ~50-60%. Than he turn over and flight to right side, by the way he use TBR to push nanite sphears in transformer failing optional. Died from gate, resp and go attack right generators. His fleet friend go and help him. Die, resp, attack generators (cube still alive) over and over.
Had one KDF player today, come into ISE and blow up 1 generator on each side to fail the optional. Then when I asked him why he did he go to the other side instead of following the rest of us, he replied "I came, I trolled, I conquered".
Had one KDF player today, come into ISE and blow up 1 generator on each side to fail the optional. Then when I asked him why he did he go to the other side instead of following the rest of us, he replied "I came, I trolled, I conquered".
That's uncalled for, People should'nt be allowed to get away with that:mad:
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
That's common. I've seen it happen many times and it's always a KDF, I think the same one, that does it. I doubt there would be much anyone could do about it because #1, he's tecnically an enemy faction to the Feds (Sabatoge) and #2 it's part of the game.
With all of the rainbow horror stories, I'm curious to see what their ships are set up like.
Its one of the reasons I want an Inspect button in this game, to see exactly what other people are using.
Oh, how do I miss /c (/check) from my FFXI days. Always got a laugh from some setups.
Then again, often you could see the lulz without needing to check: armor was visible, as were weapons, only accessories (rings, earrings, throwing items,...) had no display.
It'd also be a nice way of checking the stats of an item that isn't in your store yet...
Patricngo: There's no reason a Tac/BoP shouldn't be able to kill KASE probes in a matter of seconds, even with CRF, leaving plenty of time to work on other targets.
All those "Fedscorts" have over you is 1 Turret, but they lack the Battle Cloak (double-tap it every 15s!*); so it's not surprising you'd pull Threat. Especially if they're wasting Weapon slots and BOFF slots on Torpedoes.
*but be careful of the bug: if the delay is too short, sometimes you're left half-cloaked: visible, but still unable to shoot and counting neither as cloaked or uncloaked. Quite an annoying bug.
Oh, how do I miss /c (/check) from my FFXI days. Always got a laugh from some setups.
IF people would read the forums and check the ship setups and setup guides there wouldn't quite be so much problem.
But instead they say, 'I'm in Middle School therefore I KNOW how to set up my ship even though I just downloaded the game yesterday and cant see through the brim of my hoodie.'
Or worse yet you suggest they read the forums to help correct their setups and they say, 'Read?'
:D:D
Oh Yea, I saw a KDF charactor in a CSN running tetryon and plasma beams and three different cannon types. He was protecting the Kang alone and lost the optional even though the rest of us were killing most of the Borg BOPs at the spawn points.
I typed quickly 'If you'd loose those rainbows we wouldn't have lost the optional.'
I warp in, only 4 of us. yay! I say. fortunately by the time we defeat the cube the 5th join in, so I am kinda ashamed for my attitude, and blame the missing person for the long time of taking down the cube.
so we move to the generators, everything works fine, just very slow, and I start to be suspicous. when we couldnt deal with the spheres in time, I check out my team more closely. there are two cat carriers, a heghta and a fleet aquarius. the carriers seem to be built well, however I couldnt se any actual pets other than mine, so they might have forgotten about that feature. the hehgha is a simple heghta, and now I focus on the aquarius, and my heart stops.
at this point it had 18 (!) injuries. it seemed to be built well, but appearantly the user only got advice on how to build the ship, not how to use it. at this point I was not surprised how I am aggroing anything by my mere presence (now that is not a good thing in a Vesta, by the end of the game I had 21 10000+ hits to my ship, which concluded 47k and 32k etc. hits too, so I died a lot due to the lack of help from anybody else). however I still didnt die as much as the rest, which is strange since whenever I was alive, I was the target O.o
still the problems only started with the second transformer down. the spheres come in, and I make a nice little pile with a grav well, send in an iso charge. now if even one (in this case with their low dps I would have needed atleast two) helps me, that group pretty much blows itselfup. however the hegtha now decided he can solo the cube, and from now on it didnt attack nothing else, the carriers were fighting off in the distance with the two spheres that spawn on top of the transformer, and the aquarius was making sure he closed the day with more than 2 dozen injuries. so I obviously sucked it, and got two 17k crits (actually they are not even crits according to the combatlog) and many smaller from the lovely group of spheres.
by the time I could get back, the heghta died, the aquarius managed to die again but before that he scrambled the spheres allover the place with a well placed aggro+evasive manouver combo, and the two carriers... now at this point my faith was in the two carriers. however one of the carriers broke off for the gate (ignoring the dozen spheres), and the other just blew up in front of me. now this one totally destrooyed my faith in them, because that explosion was made by one of them spheres that spawn on top of the transformers, and it was now only one of them, they separated! so I start to hunt down the spheres one by one, aggroing the cube as the heghta does no aggro, and me bing in 10km range is more of a threat, and get a 47k hit so I die.
at respawn I go for the gate, seeing how one carrier concentrates on it, and we kill it fast, when the rest join in. but the spheres and the cube is still left. so one by one I go after the spheres, while the rest get killed by the cube.
and from now on we start fighting one by one with the cube. I tried to wait for the others, but they didnt, so the best I could do, is chose one, and fight with him, and die from critical hits.
we finished real slow, and by then I was totally tired. atleast the loot was good (shield gen and deflector, so I got money )
I did my first STFs today. Two fleet events and a CSN. I already see what people in this forum are talking about. Thanks to this forum I knew what to do when I entered the CSN and thanks to my fleet leader I was able to build my ship up to kick some $&@.
The first fleet event someone bailed out leaving us with 4 people. We failed but only by a second or two. The second we won no problem and the third was a CSN which we won despite two skittle laden escorts and a cruiser with rainbows.
Thanks everyone for your reports on what to expect.
Comments
Sorry pal, but I have to respectfully disagree with you. Killing a borg BoP faster means less damage the Kang takes. And guess who kills borg BoPs faster? You guessed it, tacs and escorts/BoPs. An escort is already ridiculously good at tanking, and while BoPs are not the same, they are darn close. Don't get me wrong here, I respect your opinion, but in my experience the tac in an escort/BoP is always the better guard. That's just what I think.
Do you mind telling me what ship you're running? It's hard to picture this situation when I don't know what to put there.
I check out the ships more closely. there is one oddy that has only AP beams, and it is the only of the four ships that has no damages. the patrol escort has no cannons, only dual beam banks, there is an assault cruiser rainbow (he was NOVA CORE, I swear that fleet delibaretly collects all the bad stf players, 90% of my failed stfs had one of them guys in it), and another oddy which is half rainbow (only two kinds of weapon types).
so I easly assessed, that I alone have more dps than they are together in my vesta.
while the two oddys struggle with a normal sphere, and the assault cruiser is in respawn oblivion I go in, make a nice little group of the nanites and blow them to hell with some tricks of mine and a little help from the escort. as the last of them blow, the two oddys join me, and we are trying to kill the transformer. ofc it wouldnt work on first try, so kill another wave of nanites, and as my spec powers are reloaded, I can devastate the transformer, kill the two incoming spheres, and move to the other.
this goes relatively smotther, as it is, they know the tactics, they just have no means of making it work. compared to their dps, this part went relatively smooth (though admittedly there is not much to do, once I got the spheres into a grav well, sent a torp spread 3, CSV in their way, and as a parting gift an iso charge, that usually does the job in 1 minute)
so I move to the gate, again my powers are reloaded, so I can unload my 25k burst dps (I know escorts have higher, but with the vesta quantum phaser I can keep that dps up for twice the time), it goes down.
now the cube is a bit harder. I start working on it, ofc I get the aggro, so after a minute or so I have to jump out of the fight for a bit with evasives away. just at this moment, my phone rings, so I answer it, while watching how the cube makes nice explosions out of the big ships (that were neither dps, nor tank ships).
when I join back two are fighting the cube, the moment I enter 10km range I get targeted by the cube (I didnt do nothing, just entered the range, so I guess just my pure presence is more threatening than theirs). at this point all my powers are reloaded, so I just shoot everything at the cube, and watch it blow up, taking two of my glorious team with it.
and this would not have happened, if I wasnt joined into an already failed game. if it was KASE or CSE, I would have just let it fail, but with ISE, I couldnt do nothing, but fight...
with these games there should be atleast a notification, that I am joining an already running game, so I can avoid the misery.
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
LOL. Sorry, I fell off my chair laughing when I read this.
A properly built escort, even a BOP, can defend the Kang without anything ever getting close enough to the Kang to fire a shot. No heals needed.
I quit watching the Kang even though I can do it by myself because there are usually 4 Rainbow/Technicolor beam and/or Skittle boats setting there at the Kang making a futile attempt to do just that.
Even then I usually have to fly back and take out two or three Borg at the Kang that they can't.
"That's a CRUISER job" ROFLMAO
did you happen to kill the ship that comes after you finished the optional? (I would love if you said no. I dare you to make my day!)
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
Saty here. I think you have your answer
CSN
I PUGGED in and said 'hi' as usual.
No response.
I fly off to the right.
Four ships head for the Kang.
I kill the cube and nodes and look up at the other ships status.
THERE ALL DEAD! :eek:
All four have major damage that they brought with them from somewhere else.
There are now BOP all over the Kang.
We lost.
I think I could have healed their ship injuries but I've never tried and the mission was over too quick for me to try. :P
Pug team (was too lazy to form team, and private queues are broken).
Team Comp: Tor'Kaht (me), Odyssey, Litter Bo... erm Caitan Atrox Carrier, Intrepid, Qin Heavy Raptor
Start of mission, everything goes fine. Cube and spheres have their privilege of existing forcibly removed. We blow away the generators, and the spheres spawn. All fine and dandy. Until... we start killing them... so it's all good. Or is it?
Right as the nanites swarm in, the Atrox drops a grav well with some aftershocks, perfect for myself and the qin to basically ruin them into nothing. The Odyssey is doing this odd dance near the gate (rainbow oddy) shooting at it and the spheres, and basically being useless (I kinda expect it tbh as soon as I saw plasma combined with polaron combined with tetryon and plasma torpedoes with no high yield). The Intrepid is kinda just sitting there doing nothing. Which is fine since the DPS from myself and the qin is removing a sphere roughly every 20 seconds (the atrox was helping with its weapons and its fighters). And then all of a sudden, the Intrepid goes in. Fine. Hits TBR and suddenly 3 spheres are now 29k away. Not so fine.
We caught and killed them, but he did it again on the other side. If the qin and I weren't so good at killing, we probably would have lost the opt. Also sufficed to say, that Intrepid also had a death wish, since he kept on trying to solo the tac cube and/or gate. He shot at whatever we WEREN'T shooting at. And died. And then called us noobs at the end of the match.
Freakin LOVE TBR... especially in the hands of an imbecile.
Oh man! dont even get me started on that one!
We still live!!!!! Hahahahahahahahaa! We live and we will conquer!!!!! Hahahahahaaha!
-Roach, when asked about Klingon extinction!
2 words:
Three AFKers.
Needless to say, the other active guy and me decided to just leave and pop onto our alts.
I believe they are the 25th century hippies
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Its one of the reasons I want an Inspect button in this game, to see exactly what other people are using.
Shhhh! Those are elites. They like challenge:rolleyes:
I imagine if you have 3-4 of those guys in your team, it'll get very challenging indeed.
Then again, I suspect these guys are challenged in and of themselves.
First cube and spheres go nice. Whole team go left and open fire at cube, but not Atrox. He and his fighters attack generator, destroing it when rest of generators were ~50-60%. Than he turn over and flight to right side, by the way he use TBR to push nanite sphears in transformer failing optional. Died from gate, resp and go attack right generators. His fleet friend go and help him. Die, resp, attack generators (cube still alive) over and over.
After that I had enough and go AFK.
That's uncalled for, People should'nt be allowed to get away with that:mad:
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Welcome to PUGging. :cool:
That's common. I've seen it happen many times and it's always a KDF, I think the same one, that does it. I doubt there would be much anyone could do about it because #1, he's tecnically an enemy faction to the Feds (Sabatoge) and #2 it's part of the game.
Oh, how do I miss /c (/check) from my FFXI days. Always got a laugh from some setups.
Then again, often you could see the lulz without needing to check: armor was visible, as were weapons, only accessories (rings, earrings, throwing items,...) had no display.
It'd also be a nice way of checking the stats of an item that isn't in your store yet...
Patricngo: There's no reason a Tac/BoP shouldn't be able to kill KASE probes in a matter of seconds, even with CRF, leaving plenty of time to work on other targets.
All those "Fedscorts" have over you is 1 Turret, but they lack the Battle Cloak (double-tap it every 15s!*); so it's not surprising you'd pull Threat. Especially if they're wasting Weapon slots and BOFF slots on Torpedoes.
*but be careful of the bug: if the delay is too short, sometimes you're left half-cloaked: visible, but still unable to shoot and counting neither as cloaked or uncloaked. Quite an annoying bug.
IF people would read the forums and check the ship setups and setup guides there wouldn't quite be so much problem.
But instead they say, 'I'm in Middle School therefore I KNOW how to set up my ship even though I just downloaded the game yesterday and cant see through the brim of my hoodie.'
Or worse yet you suggest they read the forums to help correct their setups and they say, 'Read?'
Oh Yea, I saw a KDF charactor in a CSN running tetryon and plasma beams and three different cannon types. He was protecting the Kang alone and lost the optional even though the rest of us were killing most of the Borg BOPs at the spawn points.
I typed quickly 'If you'd loose those rainbows we wouldn't have lost the optional.'
He said, 'I'm not running Rainbows.'
I said 'Ok, fine then... Skittlebows.'
Nothing more was said.
I warp in, only 4 of us. yay! I say. fortunately by the time we defeat the cube the 5th join in, so I am kinda ashamed for my attitude, and blame the missing person for the long time of taking down the cube.
so we move to the generators, everything works fine, just very slow, and I start to be suspicous. when we couldnt deal with the spheres in time, I check out my team more closely. there are two cat carriers, a heghta and a fleet aquarius. the carriers seem to be built well, however I couldnt se any actual pets other than mine, so they might have forgotten about that feature. the hehgha is a simple heghta, and now I focus on the aquarius, and my heart stops.
at this point it had 18 (!) injuries. it seemed to be built well, but appearantly the user only got advice on how to build the ship, not how to use it. at this point I was not surprised how I am aggroing anything by my mere presence (now that is not a good thing in a Vesta, by the end of the game I had 21 10000+ hits to my ship, which concluded 47k and 32k etc. hits too, so I died a lot due to the lack of help from anybody else). however I still didnt die as much as the rest, which is strange since whenever I was alive, I was the target O.o
still the problems only started with the second transformer down. the spheres come in, and I make a nice little pile with a grav well, send in an iso charge. now if even one (in this case with their low dps I would have needed atleast two) helps me, that group pretty much blows itselfup. however the hegtha now decided he can solo the cube, and from now on it didnt attack nothing else, the carriers were fighting off in the distance with the two spheres that spawn on top of the transformer, and the aquarius was making sure he closed the day with more than 2 dozen injuries. so I obviously sucked it, and got two 17k crits (actually they are not even crits according to the combatlog) and many smaller from the lovely group of spheres.
by the time I could get back, the heghta died, the aquarius managed to die again but before that he scrambled the spheres allover the place with a well placed aggro+evasive manouver combo, and the two carriers... now at this point my faith was in the two carriers. however one of the carriers broke off for the gate (ignoring the dozen spheres), and the other just blew up in front of me. now this one totally destrooyed my faith in them, because that explosion was made by one of them spheres that spawn on top of the transformers, and it was now only one of them, they separated! so I start to hunt down the spheres one by one, aggroing the cube as the heghta does no aggro, and me bing in 10km range is more of a threat, and get a 47k hit so I die.
at respawn I go for the gate, seeing how one carrier concentrates on it, and we kill it fast, when the rest join in. but the spheres and the cube is still left. so one by one I go after the spheres, while the rest get killed by the cube.
and from now on we start fighting one by one with the cube. I tried to wait for the others, but they didnt, so the best I could do, is chose one, and fight with him, and die from critical hits.
we finished real slow, and by then I was totally tired. atleast the loot was good (shield gen and deflector, so I got money
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
The first fleet event someone bailed out leaving us with 4 people. We failed but only by a second or two. The second we won no problem and the third was a CSN which we won despite two skittle laden escorts and a cruiser with rainbows.
Thanks everyone for your reports on what to expect.