Balancing of the game

Olbaze - Sanctuary · January 2011

Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »

That's like saying you wanna have a map-wide nuke happen every three seconds killing every PKer because it makes PKing a bit more fun..

Not really. Just that the Tideborn are new classes, so obviously they have to be at least desirable in some way. And of course, they have to bring something new as well. Look at them, they've got stealth, massive chi and a reflect that works in PvP, not to mention skills that get better damage based on your refines.

And hey, they already nerfed the sins. Triple sparking in stealth, now that was imbalanced. But really, if you took away Shadow Escape from sins, you'd just be left with a bunch of Fist BM wannabes. Not to mention that absolutely all PvP would be all about timing IG and AD, which really doesn't suit a game like this. If you want to compete in reaction speed, go play an FPS.

And again, it's not like I'm completely against nerfing Shadow Escape. You could take away the 1 spark it gives for all I care. Or you could make it cost like 20-50 chi. Any more than that and it's going to be nerfing the everloving **** out of assassins, since they'd have to pump chi pots or use RDS every time they want to Shadow Escape after using Power Dash and triple spark. Not to mention that making it cost a spark would heavily limit Shadow Escape's usefulness in PvE. But then again I guess 100+ folk don't give a **** about Shadow Escape in PvE as long as they get their 5 aps nirvana squads working fine.

And you have to remember that Shadow Escape is a level 29 skill. On that level, you only have 1 spark. Making Shadow Escape cost 1 spark would pretty much make it useless until at least 59. Not only because of the low maximum chi, but because you only have Tackling Slash on that level. You get Rising Dragon Strike on 49 and Inner Harmony on 59.

When you talk about nerfs, you really should look at every aspect of what you're suggesting. Just because it might work nicely for endgame PvP doesn't mean it won't be **** for anything pre-endgame, not to mention PvE overall.

Michael_Dark - Lost City · January 2011

Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »

And hey, they already nerfed the sins. Triple sparking in stealth, now that was imbalanced. But really, if you took away Shadow Escape from sins, you'd just be left with a bunch of Fist BM wannabes. Not to mention that absolutely all PvP would be all about timing IG and AD, which really doesn't suit a game like this. If you want to compete in reaction speed, go play an FPS.

Umm... what?

Introducing sins put the requirement to have twitch gaming reflexes in PvP. If you cannot twitch reflex defend against a sin uncloaking as they attack you, you lose.

Naivety - Harshlands · January 2011

Susamajii - Lost City wrote: »

I don't see my point of knockback or bramble falling flat on anyone's reasons. That would almost immediately balance the game. Only an idiot is going to go full out APS on a person with bramble. The buff only last 10 minutes (unless sage version) so it's not like the other buffs that last 30+. I really don't understand why reflect doesn't work in pvp. The new Psychic reflect works why doesn't the old veno bramble? So it makes it difficult to kill someone but honestly should it be possible for a sin to drop a BM with 20k HP in pmarrow with full buffs roughly 26k pdef in about 8 seconds? If that's not unbalanced and you find this completely reasonable then by all means continue on in your land of face rolling on keyboards and being 1337 cuz your class is stupidly OP.

Ok, imagine THIS:

You drop in on a group and Armageddon.

3 of them have Bramble up.

You just died. In one hit.

THAT is why Bramble is not good for PVP. It would make Mage types almost immune to even being attacked by Physical classes.

If the impact of it was greatly reduced, then it wouldnt be so bad, but at like 60% return, its just stupid. For Bramble Hood im less incline to dislike it, due to it being temporary and having an expensive spark cost, much like a barbs 2 spark bless skill.

---As for knockbacks, in the air its already too hard to fight as a melee class vs archers, they stun, drop and fly sideways. You then have to follow them, while getting repeatedly stunned or immobilised, because you dont move fast. Remember there is no holy path in the air. As for immunity to stuns etc extending to pushbacks... Again no, youd be able to survive like 1 pushback, get in range and pewf, your (On average) 10 seconds of immunity are gone. Wizards can travel faster in the air than anyone else, at least for short distances, if they could will you away, youd have no chance in hell of covering the space again within cooldown. Earthquake (Genie skill) would become very popular all of a sudden as a second pushback in PVP too.

With both active as youd like, with buffs....

You sir, as a barb would never stand a chance against a wizard ever again. Ever. At all. Venos would laugh at you, nix pecking away while they cast and kite and you weaken yourself on bramble. Clerics would giggle, they wouldnt need to attack, just heal over the damage they take. Psychics would run around in black voodoo, knowing that the bramble means a sin is likely to 3shot themselves when they attack, as well as having their own omg power on tap, Other sins would be happy when they crit return on bramble against you, (Oh yes, sins crit with bramble returns and Wolf Emblem has effect, eat that)...... Just lol.

Archers would lol pushback you for fun, and I suspect with 2 archers you could have a damn good game of pong, using a corpse or 4 for goals. Other barbs would never frigging die, theyed knock you back, and by the time you got back to them, theyve had like another 2 seconds to cooloff charm, then bang knockbacked by Earthquake, another second, then bankg stunned, more time......

Your ideas suck for plenty of reason. And largly, they suck for you more than they suck for me. I can Shadow teleport / Shadow Jump to targets in the air within a good range, I can close in unseen with a good chance of immobilising and of course, I can Maze -Steps Ironguard through the reflect (You can do this, kinda I guess. But lol, not as effectively).

Oooh! Seals. If pushbacks work, Seals will too. Lol when you use Expel, youl end up pegging it for the horizon. If I use Throatcut, you run away for 4 seconds. Wizard Seal is ANOTHER pushback.... Lol and wow. The only one that wouldnt suck is Nova, and thats because you get immobilised too.

b:chuckle Lol ideas, thisd be amusing, for like a day.

--The only one that made sense was the Shadow Escape Nerf, and a few sins HAVE pointed out that losing the point of the skill (Escaping) because it costs sparks, would make the entire skill useless. We have a cooldown, and that is the problem. you need to take wave one, and then wave 2. If you survive wave 2, there is no wave 3, not for well over a minute, so we die. Try jumping around, it does wonders to stop you getting roflraped, especially when you get stunned in the air.

Im with the idea of it costing a spark, but only if you have one. If you cannot cast it without spark, then the skill is useless and you have broken the class, not nerfed them.

Aaaaaaaaaaand on a personal note. Im not APS built and never will be. However robes hate me all the more, because I often oneshot them

No time to AD from that, at all. I not be OP, I just be me.

Olbaze - Sanctuary · January 2011

Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »

Umm... what?

Introducing sins put the requirement to have twitch gaming reflexes in PvP. If you cannot twitch reflex defend against a sin uncloaking as they attack you, you lose.

And that's not really the fault of Shadow Escape at all. It's the stealth and high APS.

And really, would it be that much different without sins? Everyone walks around with IGs and AD on their genie, so it's all about those skills and whether you can deal high enough damage. Which damn as sure is boring as heck. Especially if you happen not to have either of those.

Santouryu - Raging Tide · January 2011

Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »

And you have to remember that Shadow Escape is a level 29 skill. On that level, you only have 1 spark. Making Shadow Escape cost 1 spark would pretty much make it useless until at least 59.

I just wanna point out barbs have a skill called firestorm that costs 1 spark and is pretty useless, compared to any other skill that costs one spark. So lol about QQing about a good skill that should cost a spark ;p...or that thing people mentioned where it would take 100chi or if you only have 50 chi take the 50 chi. Something like that I think

Nuke_Cleric - Sanctuary · January 2011

I like the knockback idea is new, fresh and creative but... what if the sin have a +12 nirvana g15 purge bow (or even an HS) and just triple spark u from afar until he purges you and if you're a squishy just kill you. My point is even with your idea (which I like) is like.. ugh... they shouldn't be able to wear bows, afterall if daggers are Assasin only weapon why can't all other weapons be restricted to specific classes as well?. They are too op'ed atm, even if this idea were to be implemented it is not enough, they will still have so many advantages we can't ignore or prevent. Also wouldn't the knockback effect count as a negative buff? if so, the sins have that skill which has a high chance to resist that negative effect (cant recall the name).

HealingBliss - Lost City · January 2011

Dying to any average geared sin before i can domain is pretty demoralizing. My gear isn't amazing but i don't think i should be dying to +5 rank 8 daggers before i even know i was killed =/ http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=6ad307b16b909d27

Michael_Dark - Lost City · January 2011

Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »

And that's not really the fault of Shadow Escape at all. It's the stealth and high APS.

And really, would it be that much different without sins? Everyone walks around with IGs and AD on their genie, so it's all about those skills and whether you can deal high enough damage. Which damn as sure is boring as heck. Especially if you happen not to have either of those.

High APS sins aren't the problem in PvP. They're easy to kill. It's the ones that know how to skill attack that are broken.

And yes, it was much different without sins.

Olbaze - Sanctuary · January 2011

Santouryu - Raging Tide wrote: »

I just wanna point out barbs have a skill called firestorm that costs 1 spark and is pretty useless, compared to any other skill that costs one spark. So lol about QQing about a good skill that should cost a spark ;p...or that thing people mentioned where it would take 100chi or if you only have 50 chi take the 50 chi. Something like that I think

If you want to get into the useless skills discussion, how about Vicious Arrow? Serrated Arrow? Tide Form? Healing Trance? Condensed Thorn? Spell Cutter?

Again, I wouldn't mind one bit if they took away the 1 spark. That alone would be plenty of a nerf in terms of PvP power, without making the skill unusable in PvE crisis situations. Really, you really don't want to end up in a situation where your party wipes because your sin couldn't Shadow Escape because he was out of chi.

And yes, on level 29, when you only have 1 spark, having Shadow Escape cost 1 spark would mean it's practically unusable. You'd have to wait until 49 or 59 for it to serve a purpose.

High APS sins aren't the problem in PvP. They're easy to kill. It's the ones that know how to skill attack that are broken.

And yes, it was much different without sins.

You're forgetting that close by with Sins was the whole high APS thing, high end shards and refines. You know, packs. And before packs, of course things were different. But you cannot really say much about how the game would be without sins, but with the packs, since the interval between the two was too small for high aps to be a common practice. Not to mention Rank 8 nowadays, too.

ReiMei - Lost City · January 2011

I think susa's ideas are fine, sins wouldnt be op as a class if their shadow escape wasnt so awesome, making it like soul trans is a good idea, or like Olbaze said just remove the given spark and may be make it cost some chi 30-50 that would make it less op and sins would need to think in what they are doing if their main barrage of attacks didnt work as they expected not just go invisible get some chi and go smack the person again when all skills cded etc, seriusly no other class has the hability to choose when their battles end aisde from sins. Now onto the other 2 suggestions.. in the knockback well it may be ok with pot update yes and bramble well im a veno so im 100% agreed and about the people saying its gonna be beast.. have you ever gotten soulburned by a psychic? tahts even worse than brable hood since it hits for their soulforce and doesnt require you to attack just to do ANYTHING, so even if youre a cleric and you heal while soulburned you suicide -___-. Also think of this: bramble works in open pvp right and in pvp theres dmg reductions so brable would abviously get a reflected dmg reduction, may be to 30-40% deflected dmg, and melee classes have way more hp than your regular arcane/light venos so you come with your 4aps deicide bm and hit a brambled la veno with 6kish hp while you have 8k hp, your dmg is about 500 since shes in human form, while she takes those 500 youll be taking 300s reflected dmg roughly IF IT DOESNT GET A DMG REDUCTION, asuming both of you are charmed and you have at least half of a brain and stunlock her you'll always have the winning chance as your hp is higher and the reflected dmg you take is lower than what you hit her for. For bramble hood... it can work in open pvp as i dont think ANY melee in their sane mind would attack a hooded veno if reflect worked in pvp as it has a very noticebale animation, bms could just use lion stun and stay away waiting till bramble comes off then ram into the veno, sins can shadow escape... and barbs have enough hp and pdef to stand the nix bite, its just 15 secs and you can blood clot or use genie bleed immunity skill, and take note casting bramble hood removes brable guard so after hood is gone no more reflect whatsoever unless you give the veno time to cast it. Just give it a though, ive seen many venos fail in duels cause they just hood and try to attack while the other person just runs away from the veno's range for those 15 secs, the come back and smack her **** away....

Santouryu - Raging Tide · January 2011

Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »

If you want to get into the useless skills discussion, how about Vicious Arrow? Serrated Arrow? Tide Form? Healing Trance? Condensed Thorn? Spell Cutter?

Again, I wouldn't mind one bit if they took away the 1 spark. That alone would be plenty of a nerf in terms of PvP power, without making the skill unusable in PvE crisis situations. Really, you really don't want to end up in a situation where your party wipes because your sin couldn't Shadow Escape because he was out of chi.

And yes, on level 29, when you only have 1 spark, having Shadow Escape cost 1 spark would mean it's practically unusable. You'd have to wait until 49 or 59 for it to serve a purpose.

Not trying to talk about useless skills(And I did say comparing it to skills that cost 1 spark) but was talking from a barb's point of view cause I can sorta see where Suji is coming from. But at level 29-59 I doubt you'll be taking aggro easily at all in a bh39 or something. So would that skill be just to get a quick spark? Isn't that a bit OP.

Olbaze - Sanctuary · January 2011

Santouryu - Raging Tide wrote: »

Not trying to talk about useless skills(And I did say comparing it to skills that cost 1 spark) but was talking from a barb's point of view cause I can sorta see where Suji is coming from. But at level 29-59 I doubt you'll be taking aggro easily at all in a bh39 or something. So would that skill be just to get a quick spark? Isn't that a bit OP.

Well yes, on levels 29-48, Shadow Escape has pretty much 2 purposes: 1. escape from mobs you accidentally aggro 2. get 1 spark when you log in.

Naivety - Harshlands · January 2011

Why did my entire lol about how **** the game would become get ignored? b:sad

Jadsia - Lost City · January 2011

Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »

Um, you know, I do have a level 92 Archer.

Also, making Shadow Escape cost 1 spark would limit the PvP options a sin has,

Thus forcing the player to use that skill more wisely rather than exploiting it just for chi...

As I said, I don't mind if the skill wouldn't give a spark, that's not really a crucial part of the skill. But making it cost a spark would just about make it useless.

Bramble hood costs venos 2 sparks for what? Some DD reduction? kind of useless in PvP I would say and bramble guard is just completely useless in PvP

The whole point of Susa's post is to add some balance to PvP between some classes and yes the consequence of such is that sins will have to have to rub a couple of brains cells together to come up with a more creative strategy to PvP.

Good post, Susa.

Santouryu - Raging Tide · January 2011

Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »

Well yes, on levels 29-48, Shadow Escape has pretty much 2 purposes: 1. escape from mobs you accidentally aggro 2. get 1 spark when you log in.

Thanks for clearing that up ;p. I like the skill in general but it's not balanced when it also gives you a spark especially when that's a skill that should cost chi and be used carefully. Like Invoke or Bramble hood.

Edit*

Jadsia - Lost City wrote: »

The whole point of Susa's post is to add some balance to PvP between some classes and yes the consequence of such is that sins will have to have to rub a couple of brains cells together to come up with a more creative strategy to PvP.

Good post, Susa.

+1

Clandore - Lost City · January 2011

Naivety - Harshlands wrote: »

Why did my entire lol about how **** the game would become get ignored? b:sad

It was good. But honestly, this kind of problem requires someone to sit down and workout a MECE framework in order to come up with any kind of viable solution. Too much time to spend on a game whose devs ignores suggestions in any case.

SlashSin - Lost City · January 2011

Biggest QQ thread eva b:shocked

/troll...actuallynvm

zomg i know! I hate sins too! Stealth is OP! Chi skills are OP! Stuns/sleeps/seals are OP! Tide form is OP! Twin Strike is OP!

Sound like someone needs to go reroll carebear b:bye

Naivety - Harshlands · January 2011

SlashSin - Lost City wrote: »

Biggest QQ thread eva b:shocked

/troll...actuallynvm

zomg i know! I hate sins too! Stealth is OP! Chi skills are OP! Stuns/sleeps/seals are OP! Tide form is OP! Twin Strike is OP!

Sound like someone needs to go reroll carebear b:bye

Hey Twinstrike is kool!

And Tide Form is useful. Great for pegging it if you fight anywhere near water and get caught in a bad situation. I spent 15 minutes running away form a barb and a veno near that Goshiki boss yesterday

I woulda stealthed but I had aggro off the boss >_> (Its a [?])

Jadsia - Lost City · January 2011

Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »

And really, if no sin can kill you solo, then why are you complaining so much?

I didn't see a complaint. I saw a suggestion for improving balance between the classes.

Oh come on, a little difference makes stuff more fun.

So would some balance between the classes.

Out of the OPs suggestions, two look like their main intention is to specifically **** on Assassins. Well, the Bramble would also make stuff tougher for BMs and Barbs. And trust me, PvP that is turned into a cat and mouse game really isn't fun.

Yes, the OP's suggestion would even make PvP for him a little more challenging so why do you think he would make such a suggestion? Apparently not out of selfishness there. Besides, last time I checked sins are capable of benefitting from one of our overpowered bramble guard buffs too were they ever to revert back to full reflect in PvP.

LOL! A cat and mouse game from one who can stealth right out of a fight? Comment made from hypocrisy at best.

Stop being so one sided and short sighted.

Sanctam - Dreamweaver · January 2011

Oblaze:

You think nerfing Shadow Escape will make sins useless in PvE? Heck, when I take aggro I have to pop either a 45 chi shield that breaks in one hit or a 1 spark WoG that only reduces damage by 25%. You should be thankful that you even get a skill that allows you to COMPLETELY ignore an attacking boss and have the aggro go back to the tank. Having that cost a spark makes perfect sense for PvE, considering archers don't have anything comparable.

Susamajii - Lost City · January 2011

Okay after reading all the new posts I'd like to say:

Bramble at least can be purged and yeah the reflect would be nerfed in PvP just like damage is that makes complete sense. Bramble Hood should work come on honestly, venos almost stand no chance unless they kite for days and faith/immune/feral. Oh and that's if they have lighting fast reflexes or else they are already dead. I've seen even the best venos with stupidly good gear get dropped in 3-4 seconds by a sin.. even bad ones that the veno outgears by a mile.

Knockback would definitely make the game more interesting and sure it would suck getting knocked back especially since I'm a melee character but there are anti-stun pots and skills that could be used to ignore this if it was added to them. That's like saying fighting 2 archers that keep chain stun/paralyzing you isn't almost exactly like this would be, what do you do? You anti-stun so you can kill them just like you would with this but it just gives characters more options to defend themselves other than just getting roflpwned by sins.

And as for the Forced Stealth I don't recall who first mentioned it but making it act like soul transfusion makes alot of sense actually. Having it give one spark makes no sense at all other then making them OP.

Naivety - Harshlands · January 2011

Susamajii - Lost City wrote: »

Okay after reading all the new posts I'd like to say:

Bramble at least can be purged and yeah the reflect would be nerfed in PvP just like damage is that makes complete sense. Bramble Hood should work come on honestly, venos almost stand no chance unless they kite for days and faith/immune/feral. Oh and that's if they have lighting fast reflexes or else they are already dead. I've seen even the best venos with stupidly good gear get dropped in 3-4 seconds by a sin.. even bad ones that the veno outgears by a mile.

Knockback would definitely make the game more interesting and sure it would suck getting knocked back especially since I'm a melee character but there are anti-stun pots and skills that could be used to ignore this if it was added to them. That's like saying fighting 2 archers that keep chain stun/paralyzing you isn't almost exactly like this would be, what do you do? You anti-stun so you can kill them just like you would with this but it just gives characters more options to defend themselves other than just getting roflpwned by sins.

And as for the Forced Stealth I don't recall who first mentioned it but making it act like soul transfusion makes alot of sense actually. Having it give one spark makes no sense at all other then making them OP.

Pushbacks would affect sins least of all characters, dont you get it? I can jump 30 metres or so with 2 skills, directly to my target. BMs can jump in a direction, but that is horizontal and wont help if their target is RISING. Barbs would just get dropped.

---Pots? Skills? They wouldnt work effectively in the air (Due to increadibly slow movement accelleration), and the air is where people will fight with pushbacks. 2 minute CD on pots, the longest of which lasts 20 Seconds if im correct. So you have to use it, get to your opponent, Stun them, tick charm and kill them, within 20 seconds. As soon as that time is up, you get knocked backand it begins again, cept for the next 2 minutes, you will not get close. Perhaps your anti-stun will let you get in close, but then lol, you hit them, and poooooooooooof pushed back to miles away.

Bramble is rebuffed in a moment. And bramble is castable on a full squad, from one veno.
The Psychic reflect people are on about is completely 1:1 with the amount of Psychics in play. If a Psychic has it up, noone else does. If someone else does, theres a Psychic somewhere who doesnt.

@The archer who complained about Escape and PvE. Your supposed to have about 30 metres between you and the boss. Sins dont get that, so theres your balence for Escape being chi cost free. We also dont get pushbacks or the rediculous evasion boost you can have (That 79 skill does have some use, but people underestimate it....Oh well, not my issue if they like me hitting 5+ times in a row as opposed to missing 6 times in a row....No matter how brief the buff

)

And if you bothered to read my posts properly, I suggested it be like Soul Trans as a spark cost.

Susamajii - Lost City · January 2011

Naivety - Harshlands wrote: »

And if you bothered to read my posts properly, I suggested it be like Soul Trans as a spark cost.

I did read your post I just didn't remember it was you that said it I was agreeing that it should be like soul trans.

Perhaps the knockback would be nerfed as well in pvp such as suggest for the bramble like if it says 12 meter knockback then half it to 6 it doesn't take long to run 6 meteres and knockback skills have a cooldown as well. Sure sins might be able to tele jump and tele stun so they have something to counteract the knockback but at least then they'd have to use these skills more often and in different ways. I usually only see sins using the shadow jump as they run away to jump to mobs to get away faster.

Naivety - Harshlands · January 2011

Susamajii - Lost City wrote: »

I did read your post I just didn't remember it was you that said it I was agreeing that it should be like soul trans.

Perhaps the knockback would be nerfed as well in pvp such as suggest for the bramble like if it says 12 meter knockback then half it to 6 it doesn't take long to run 6 meteres and knockback skills have a cooldown as well. Sure sins might be able to tele jump and tele stun so they have something to counteract the knockback but at least then they'd have to use these skills more often and in different ways. I usually only see sins using the shadow jump as they run away to jump to mobs to get away faster.

Knockbacks just wouldnt work in PvP properly, if you nerf the distance, they arnt effective enough, If you nerf the cooldowns, you ruin PvE.... Just no. (This is particular to our game btw.... In other games where charms dont exist and theres almost no such thing as a oneshot, they work fine).

And why jump to a mob lol. thats just something for them to get AoEd out of. Jump to another stealthed Sin

Susamajii - Lost City · January 2011

Naivety - Harshlands wrote: »

Knockbacks just wouldnt work in PvP properly, if you nerf the distance, they arnt effective enough, If you nerf the cooldowns, you ruin PvE.... Just no. (This is particular to our game btw.... In other games where charms dont exist and theres almost no such thing as a oneshot, they work fine).

And why jump to a mob lol. thats just something for them to get AoEd out of. Jump to another stealthed Sin

They jump to the mob as they run while forced stealth is in cd to get farther away faster.

Olbaze - Sanctuary · January 2011

Sanctam - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Oblaze:

You think nerfing Shadow Escape will make sins useless in PvE? Heck, when I take aggro I have to pop either a 45 chi shield that breaks in one hit or a 1 spark WoG that only reduces damage by 25%. You should be thankful that you even get a skill that allows you to COMPLETELY ignore an attacking boss and have the aggro go back to the tank. Having that cost a spark makes perfect sense for PvE, considering archers don't have anything comparable.

I never, ever, said anything about it making assassins completely useless, but the suggested nerf, adding a 1 spark cost to it, would make the skill useless.

And do I need to remind you that Archers got much luxury from being ranged? For example, being outside of aoes. Sins don't get that. Oh and if stuff gets ugly, an Archer can holy path out and be pretty decently safe, considering the distance they can put between themselves and the boss.

Quilue - Sanctuary · January 2011

So why not use a bow if you can't tank but will steal aggro? Or limit your attacking like every other DD who can't tank would do?

If stuff gets ugly the archer, or any other DD for that matter, is more likely tanking while the cleric is ressing the tank. Only a ****** would just go stealth and ditch everyone.

RouxLouka - Dreamweaver · January 2011

One of the mystic skills has different attack modifiers when used in pve or pvp. The devs could apply the same to bramble.

Olbaze - Sanctuary · January 2011

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

So why not use a bow if you can't tank but will steal aggro? Or limit your attacking like every other DD who can't tank would do?

If stuff gets ugly the archer, or any other DD for that matter, is more likely tanking while the cleric is ressing the tank. Only a ****** would just go stealth and ditch everyone.

There are actually situations where stealthing and letting everyone else die is preferable. For example, if a Trophy Mode run goes awry and people start dying, the only ones who have a chance of surviving are the sins. And believe me, when you have one or two level 100 high APS sins, that saves the Trophy Mode. Trust me, I've been there.

And really, in most squads, deaths really only get problematic when it's the cleric who dies. And when that happens, the others usually die quite quickly afterwards. Of course, that might not always be true. But when it does happen, I personally Shadow Escape. Though most often me Shadow Escaping or not wouldn't make any difference, since when a squad wipes, often it starts falling apart from that point.

And really, having taken my Archer to 92, I've experienced the so-called "tanking". At least on those levels, if the tank died and I got aggro, I was pretty much guaranteed to die.

Oh and yes, I do have a bow that I have used.

Now that I have 1.82 aps, I'll probably have to watch out more often in BHs.

And also, the whole "make Shadow Escape cost 1 spark" looks less like a nerf and more like a punishment for the assassins.

Ruxal - Harshlands · January 2011

In PvP as a wizard versus a sin once the sin goes stealth its a matter of having really quick reflexes or great anticipation/luck. The next part is being able to tick the sin charm, its extra life (I'm not dead yet buff) and finally killing it, all before it goes stealth again or uses some stun/seal combo. Assasins are the most annoying class I have to fight against but I could live with that.

What is beyond frustrating is that after 90 levels my damage in pve has become irrelevant. Now don't get me wrong. Its great to have sins in FC because the dungeon flies by BUT it makes you feel powerless. I am a demon wizard (save the demon vs sage for the wizard forums) and I fellt so proud going to fc to unleash my freshly earned demon skills only to see a sin simply equip some -intv gear and make my damage look like an old black and white tv compared to his 1080p 3d flatscreen.

Which brings me to my main gripe: 3-5 aps. It has destroyed the game. Why make balanced squads when all we need is 3-5 aps, bloodpaint and enough hp to survive most boss attacks 2/3 hitting you.

Nescessary changes:

1) APS has to be nerfed.

2) Sin stealth should never be giving a spark, how about I get a spark for using sutra eh?

3) Nerf the effectiveness of refines with respect to soulforce I mean wtf you really wanna compare demon stone barrier that has a definite limit to soulforce? as if vodoos were not enough eh!

4) Make TT easier to farm or increase the drop rate of ttt mats.

.......ahhh even though that all fell on deaf, uncaring ears, I still feel better for getting that off my chest. Back to hoping a fc squad feels for my wiz and lets it play alongside uber sins.

Balancing of the game

Comments

Categories