Another KS scenario?
Comments
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... <.<... >.>...b:sad
Everyone here that don't support the moral road really need to rethink how badly they have been screwed in life. Bye bye now...
Edit: (If you do not understand what this means, you need to get out more.)b:scorn...We are one, We are many, We are watching you...b:scorn0 -
Everyone would think and act different in this situation.
But honestly, if it was me, I'd have let them kill it even if it would've taken them forever. Especially if I've done that boss before and there is the possibility they have never done it before and wanted to do it for fun or just for the sake of killing because it's a new challenge for them.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Azzazin - Dreamweaver wrote: »Well guys, here's a little situation I ran into recently, and I'm curious to see what others have to say about it...
Thoughts?
Azzazin
Few things come to my mind.
1. No official rules prevent you from doing what you did.
2. If this was on Harshland you'd be pked for trying. (A full group of 70s have a decent chance if they ganged up, I don't know your gear so you might or might not win.)
3. Seems a bit counter-intuitive that you'd be ailenating people like that in a MMO, I assume those people and their factions probably blacklisted you and even your own faction's pissed off by your own admission.
I guess if you can do end game runs solo without any help or support then all the power to you; but your behavior, while acceptabe within server rules, aren't going to make you alot of friends.
Also, even if you could solo all end game content and do so what would be the point in playing a multiplayer game then? I mean you aren't even on harshlands, it's not like you can take your end game gear and go on pk sprees.
Just my 2 cents.0 -
Azzazin - Dreamweaver wrote: »Let me restate one thing: I am in no way 'justifying' my actions. Nor am I particularly upset that my I removed my alt from its previous faction as a result of this.
What I did want to see, and which many of you are doing, is discussing various points of view as to whether what I did was considering 'KSing' or not, as well as talking about what exactly constitutes KSing. Tell me how many forum posts you've seen recently where there was a healthy amount of debate over a topic?
My line of thought is by no means 'the one and only correct line of thought'. Different people in the same situation as I was in would undoubtedly react in many different ways. I was curious to see what the forum users here thought about my particular choice, including my reasoning for why I did what I did. Good reason or bad reason, I really don't do 'random' very much. Most things I do, I put some thought into. In this you have all been most obliging. I've been following this thread with great interest due to the variety of comments which have been posted here, for which I thank you all.
Incidentally, thanos, the others are right about the boss respawn: it is 24 hours. I do not, in fact, know of any bosses with a one week respawn (weekly events aside); Harpy Wraith, for instance, has a 1 month respawn. The reason we see her every week is due to maintenance. For world bosses, though, maintenance is key, because all of the world bosses come back to life. Its the only time you can reliably (as far as I know) know that a world boss will be there *for sure*.
Also, when my gear is ready for it, I will certainly attempt other world bosses
fear not.
Azzazin
b:surrender
btw did u see my post where i said that it would take them 80h?0 -
ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver wrote: »events and WB are 1 time every week usually.
looks like a pretty valid comparison to me. what's ur point?
WB: most damage gets kill and drops
event: everyone gets contribution point0 -
There are hundreds to thousands of players online in a server but only a few WBs. IMO, there's no KILL STEALing in WB killing. WBs spawn in public area, everyone may hit them that's why the requirement to win the drops is to deal the most damage to the boss. (it's not always 50% tho, if there are 3 ppl, 1 hit 30% hp; 1 other hit 34% hp and you hit 36% hp then you will just win the drops)
You were KS'ing the Boss only if the there was something on the boss name like "Abcd's Soul Hunter" then that WB belongs to Abcd. That's my thought.
I think you could just tell those ppl to lvl so they can do better damage than you, it sounds smarter for them than QQing to your faction leader. Sorry to say...SerenityMare - Dreamweaver wrote: »Everyone would think and act different in this situation.
But honestly, if it was me, I'd have let them kill it even if it would've taken them forever. Especially if I've done that boss before and there is the possibility they have never done it before and wanted to do it for fun or just for the sake of killing because it's a new challenge for them.
But I do agree with this (:0 -
Slivaf - Dreamweaver wrote: »"Every rule has it's exception"
In that case in a widespread event where numerous people are competing for the same prize it would be extremely futile to QQ to anyone about it.
Show me the link to those rules pls, would love to read them.
And enlighten me to explain where numerous people are not competing for the same drop the WB has.Tsubasaa - Heavens Tear wrote: »....I don't dont agree with your point of view at all. In nien event if u hit the boss you get points for it, and you get rewarded depending on the amount points gained in total. The event is meant for everyone to participate. Also the event has a time limit.
If you hit WB one time it will not give you anything. The WB does not have time limit. Therefore if they are there first and are trying to kill it, it is "counted" as theirs and is moral to let them continue. The OP did not offer any help, but simply said you people will take too long for it to die so i will go and kill it. This is called kill stealing. I'm pretty sure you would also be qqing if you were one of those people trying to kill WB but got rudely KSd by the OP.
b:bye
Oh? then change it to Rare Pets for another example?
Lets say there're 5 Veno going to Rare Pet location, and lets say Veno 1 got there 1st, should Veno 2, 3, 4 and 5 just let Veno 1 tame the Rare Pet and they all 4 just need to wait until the Rare Pet respawn again? Then go there and just to found out, oh, another Veno is already there, again.
Dont tell me its not the same, they took long time to respawn, and gives good Coin too, thou selling Rare Pet maybe not gives as many Coin as WB drop, but you get the idea.
about if its me trying to kill the WB?
appearantly you dont read much or simply dont understand:MyuMyu - Harshlands wrote: »Actually from your example, OP is right, if the Oreo, lets say, is mine, I bought it with my money, then you have no right to take it from me.
In this case, the WB, is just there standing, if you want to compare with Oreo, you're like in some party and the party holder put that Oreo in a plate for everybody, which means, if you can eat it faster than me, then by all means, finish it.
I've give my view on WB, if you can kill it faster than me or my party, then by all means, finish it.
And if I solo it, what would I try to accomplish?
An idiot hitting F1 F2 F3 nonstop for 8 hours+? And then gives an announcement to the world "hey peeps I can sit in front of comp hitting F1 F2 F3 nonstop for 8 hours!! I R good, I'm satisfied now I have accomplished one of my goal in life!!"
no thx, I have better things to do.
And I wondered about your reaction and respons about the WB if:MyuMyu - Harshlands wrote: »I wandered if it was me with this avatar toon, and not OP who hit the mob; wonder if everyone will judge me KS the WB
Oh, maybe they'll just think "LMFAO what is this Lv.6x idiot Veno doing? helping us reduce the WB's HP? We still got the drops bcos our damage is higher anyway LOLOLOL"
Based on your logic, since my damage wont outdamage them, I wont get the drops, so it was ok for me to KS them?
It seems lower level is permitted to KS, but higher level dont.
If your answer is yes, I still KS them, I bet you will be /facepalm and not throw the "good and bad" judgement on me.
And some ppl here really dont understand the meaning of KS >_>MyuMyu - Harshlands wrote: »if the number of the mob is many and respawn fast, yeah that might count as KS.
or if the mob is needed for important Quest, that is KS.
go to other MMO, tell me if there's someone or some party fighting a World Boss, then 9782346782634 other players waiting the same World Boss too should just leave and wait for it to respawn again.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Waterfal - Sanctuary wrote: »I would consider it ks. Seriously, a couple of lvl 70's taking on a challenge. if they see how hard they hit, and how much hp the boss has they can see that it will take hours. If they found it to be a problem they would just have left wouldn't they?
Imo you really are a complete jerk. If it were 2 factions who both wanted to kill and both had a chance of doing the most damage as in if it is a fair competetion. Then I don't consider it ks.
But stealing a boss from a group who you can easely outmatch, while they are taking on a challenge is just plain rude.
you already stated in your first post it had crappy drops anyway. So why not give them the chance to kill it?
I hope you're proud of yourself by "saving them 6 hours of work"
Like others that posted similar comments as yours..well stated and agreed with all of ya's
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Happy_Killer - Harshlands wrote: »In communist Harshlands, when you KS, you get PK'd.
IJS. Be thankful you don't run a PvP server. You'd die like....so fast.
They were there first. If you're so anal about not having to wait, join their squad. Can't join their squad? Get over it, leave.
It is an insult to a faction....back in the days where most had some form of honor, you'd probably have been kicked and then PK ganked. It doesn't reflect well on them at all. That's why if you have ONE person from a strong, land owning faction (Zulu for example) and ONE moron does ONE thing wrong, suddenly their whole faction is filled with weak, stupid, pathetic, cash shopping, hyper-sucking d-bags who are generally QQ'd about by everybody and their mom. (Luctiricia, COUGH.)
Olbaze said it best though.
Gee. tell us how you REALLY feel. LOLI **** bigger than you...
Shut up and play the game.....Damn0 -
Just like to say, it's nice to see a thread where opinions can be discussed without people trolling or being pricks =D
of course now that i've said that someone's going to come in and troll just to be a smart *** im sure ._.[SIGPIC]http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd414/FluffyPeace/screenies and such/2011-03-1116-04-45-1.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Well hi to you too Frankie b:cute0 -
So there was loot to be had and it would have taken them a while to kill it. So what?
These people obviously banded together to kill the WB, only to have an end-game character fly in and steal it. Just because they weren't in the same faction doesn't mean they're not friends banded together to do this.
Why should they bother to learn how to do anything that takes time and effort when this kind of example is given?
Its not a point of who owns what. Its a matter of courtesy and letting others enjoy themselves too. So what if you could kill it faster? That deprives them the right to try? Your impatience overwrites their willingness to have a go at something? I applaud them for trying it. Too many won't try doing things in game at this level because of incidents like this and I don't think anyone can complain about people not wanting to squad or do stuff on the main map when things like this go down daily.
I've seen lower level squads attempting 'regular' bosses (Ch'in, Eyes, Mantavip, ec..) only to have some high level endgame geared person come in, lose patience, and steal it away.
It kills the motivation in new people to the game to even try anything.
No, this is not a PvP server, and there is nothing anyone can do...but it also doesn't mean you have to be devoid of courtesy in the overall community.0 -
OK, so there is a (group) attempting to kill a wb. You (singulary) kill it faster an tell em not to waste thier time? Ok that may not be entirely acurate but that seems to be the general theme .
C'mon are you trying to get us nerfed?0 -
Silchas_ruin - Dreamweaver wrote: »So there was loot to be had and it would have taken them a while to kill it. So what?
These people obviously banded together to kill the WB, only to have an end-game character fly in and steal it. Just because they weren't in the same faction doesn't mean they're not friends banded together to do this.
Why should they bother to learn how to do anything that takes time and effort when this kind of example is given?
Its not a point of who owns what. Its a matter of courtesy and letting others enjoy themselves too. So what if you could kill it faster? That deprives them the right to try? Your impatience overwrites their willingness to have a go at something? I applaud them for trying it. Too many won't try doing things in game at this level because of incidents like this and I don't think anyone can complain about people not wanting to squad or do stuff on the main map when things like this go down daily.
I've seen lower level squads attempting 'regular' bosses (Ch'in, Eyes, Mantavip, ec..) only to have some high level endgame geared person come in, lose patience, and steal it away.
It kills the motivation in new people to the game to even try anything.
No, this is not a PvP server, and there is nothing anyone can do...but it also doesn't mean you have to be devoid of courtesy in the overall community.
I have to fully agree with this. I mean like...we call people noobs when they hyper their way to level 100 and not take the time to learn their class right?
This is kind of similar since they were willing to take the time to kill this WB even if it took them forever, but you just came in and took it from them, destroying their motive to kill the boss.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
SerenityMare - Dreamweaver wrote: »I have to fully agree with this. I mean like...we call people noobs when they hyper their way to level 100 and not take the time to learn their class right?
This is kind of similar since they were willing to take the time to kill this WB even if it took them forever, but you just came in and took it from them, destroying their motive to kill the boss.
i would prefer a hyper baby from someone that sits 80h killing a boss that doesnt even attack back.0 -
ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver wrote: »i would prefer a hyper baby from someone that sits 80h killing a boss that doesnt even attack back.
What do you mean by it doesn't attack back? o_o;;[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
SerenityMare - Dreamweaver wrote: »What do you mean by it doesn't attack back? o_o;;
that WB we're talking about, if attacked from range, it will only DeBuff and Stun, and will not do any damage to your HP at all.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
SerenityMare - Dreamweaver wrote: »What do you mean by it doesn't attack back? o_o;;
soul hunter, if the attackers arent in meelee range, does only some debuffs (stun, +chan, +int) and he doesnt hit anyone. any other WB would look at the 7x and one-shot them xd
so it's not a challenge; it's a trial of patience
considering that the stun debuff starts after 20min of fight and that when OP went to the boss the stuns have already started means that they did 100k dmg over 20min.
the boss has 24mil hp -> 80h = 3.3days0 -
Ya know, I only read to page 2... I'm going to go back and read the rest of everyone's posts. I'm the leader of the squad he KS'd. Three of us were already there, had the boss set up. It was at 21.5m HP when he showed up... that's alot more than his 100k he mentioned right? We'd been at it for a lil over 20mins hence the AoE Stun. The other venos that showed up, weren't intended to be there, but had to call some friends to maybe stand a chance of getting -our- kill.
And yes, we ENJOY the long drawn out kills.
You're lying on the forums... And you lied to your faction leader... You just admitted KSing. What more is there to it? I went directly to your Faction Leader. I could have QQ'd in world chat, but I didn't.
And now you're camping the boss every time it spawns.
Really dude... that's kinda all messed up.0 -
CharmingChu - Dreamweaver wrote: »Ya know, I only read to page 2... I'm going to go back and read the rest of everyone's posts. I'm the leader of the squad he KS'd. Three of us were already there, had the boss set up. It was at 21.5m HP when he showed up... that's alot more than his 100k he mentioned right? We'd been at it for a lil over 20mins hence the AoE Stun. The other venos that showed up, weren't intended to be there, but had to call some friends to maybe stand a chance of getting -our- kill.
And yes, we ENJOY the long drawn out kills.
You're lying on the forums... And you lied to your faction leader... You just admitted KSing. What more is there to it? I went directly to your Faction Leader. I could have QQ'd in world chat, but I didn't.
And now you're camping the boss every time it spawns.
Really dude... that's kinda all messed up.
ok, then it would be 3.2hAnd now you're camping the boss every time it spawns.
Really dude... that's kinda all messed up.
it's his right. this last part was really pathetic.
it's not like the boss is urs, ur fun matters more, u need it for a quest or you can efficiently farm it anyway0 -
CharmingChu - Dreamweaver wrote: »And now you're camping the boss every time it spawns.
Based on your logic, next time if you were there 1st, he cant KS you.
Then now he camping the Boss everytime it spawn, so that means you cant KS him either bcos he got there 1st.
Oh, the same as everyone that play in DW too, all of you cant KS Azzazzin bcos he camped there!!111!1!!
right?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
MyuMyu - Harshlands wrote: »Based on your logic, next time if you were there 1st, he cant KS you.
Then now he camping the Boss everytime it spawn, so that means you cant KS him either bcos he got there 1st.
Oh, the same as everyone that play in DW too, all of you cant KS Azzazzin bcos he camped there!!111!1!!
right?
sounds silly b:chuckle
the more i think about it, the more i start to believe that fighting for the WB, trying to out-DD the other squad is more fair and fun.0 -
ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver wrote: »the thing is, when OP arrived boss have lost 100k. that's less that 0.5% of his hp, it's 0,42% (~24mil hp).
since the boss used stun (which happens after 20min of fight) the were there for more than 20min and if they were left alone they would have to keep DDing for over 80h to kill it.
technically it would take even longer to kill then the 80 hours, because they dealt 100k damage, in the 20 mintues that the boss does not stun, so if the boss continued to not stun it would be 80 hours, BUT the boss started to stun after the 20 minutes which would lower there damage by about 1/3 or so? making instead of the 100k/ 20 mins around 66k hp / 20 mins making them take around 120 hours or so? gf i dont consider that ks and if i was in teh same situation id be getting myself some wb drops in 40 mins0 -
I come from EQoA... Rules of engagement applied in that game and KSing was not tolerated. I'm slowly learning this game is a free for all.
I wasn't mad about the KS per-say...
It's the attitude he had... He just swoops in after 20mins "Hiya! Imma KS you" then at the end "I warned ya" and flied off... That urked me. So yeah, I found his FL and spoke to her, he lied to her... Then he comes here and QQs on the forums and lies in his post.
He didn't offer help, I'd have let him in squad to speed it up. I knew the loot. We'd killed the boss 3x before. He lied about the loot that dropped as well.
>.<0 -
Cetzlaus - Heavens Tear wrote: »technically it would take even longer to kill then the 80 hours, because they dealt 100k damage, in the 20 mintues that the boss does not stun, so if the boss continued to not stun it would be 80 hours, BUT the boss started to stun after the 20 minutes which would lower there damage by about 1/3 or so? making instead of the 100k/ 20 mins around 66k hp / 20 mins making them take around 120 hours or so? gf i dont consider that ks and if i was in teh same situation id be getting myself some wb drops in 40 mins
well, we could assume that the cleric would purify all of them and he will have an antistun/stun removing genie so the debuffs would be that importand b:chuckle0 -
ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver wrote: »sounds silly b:chuckle
the more i think about it, the more i start to believe that fighting for the WB, trying to out-DD the other squad is more fair and fun.
Except how many casters does it take to out-DD a well geared 5 aps sin? @_@
"Fair" is a loose term xP[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
CharmingChu - Dreamweaver wrote: »I come from EQoA... Rules of engagement applied in that game and KSing was not tolerated. I'm slowly learning this game is a free for all.
I wasn't mad about the KS per-say...
It's the attitude he had... He just swoops in after 20mins "Hiya! Imma KS you" then at the end "I warned ya" and flied off... That urked me. So yeah, I found his FL and spoke to her, he lied to her... Then he comes here and QQs on the forums and lies in his post.
He didn't offer help, I'd have let him in squad to speed it up. I knew the loot. We'd killed the boss 3x before. He lied about the loot that dropped as well.
>.<
i just hear QQ like seriously ur dps fails hard and u cant get a boss oh no its the end of the world go to tt if u wanna do bosses then they really are yours. what makes WB fun, is ksing little noobs like you and watching you be like omg we lost lets tell there faction leader because were pathetic and want them in trouble cause we cant do anything ourselves0 -
ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver wrote: »well, we could assume that the cleric would purify all of them and he will have an antistun/stun removing genie so the debuffs would be that importand b:chuckle
you can asume that but even then ( i know they said more hp ) but even with a a cleric purifying for each dd theres still lost time and it is never the perfect amount0 -
Cetzlaus - Heavens Tear wrote: »technically it would take even longer to kill then the 80 hours, because they dealt 100k damage, in the 20 mintues that the boss does not stun, so if the boss continued to not stun it would be 80 hours, BUT the boss started to stun after the 20 minutes which would lower there damage by about 1/3 or so? making instead of the 100k/ 20 mins around 66k hp / 20 mins making them take around 120 hours or so? gf i dont consider that ks and if i was in teh same situation id be getting myself some wb drops in 40 mins
You realize the ks'd individuals have reported that the OP's estimate of damage dealt to the boss by them in 20 minutes was off by 2.9 mil or so?Cetzlaus - Heavens Tear wrote: »i just hear QQ like seriously ur dps fails hard and u cant get a boss oh no its the end of the world go to tt if u wanna do bosses then they really are yours. what makes WB fun, is ksing little noobs like you and watching you be like omg we lost lets tell there faction leader because were pathetic and want them in trouble cause we cant do anything ourselves
Um wow. You get enjoyment out of stealing bosses from people lower level than you on a PvE server?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
MyuMyu - Harshlands wrote: »Show me the link to those rules pls, would love to read them.
And enlighten me to explain where numerous people are not competing for the same drop the WB has.
I didn't mean for that to sound like a rule for killing, just a quote, (like the grass is always greener on the other side) which I obviously didn't come up with myself, I am sure that if one of us googled it we would find out who originally coined that phrase.
As for multiple people competing for the drops from a wb, I guess you got me there; (I never meant for that to be implied otherwise.) however, I still feel that this situation is different.
There were 4 or 5 level 60-80, and one other person who was able to out damage the 60-80's, where that one single person got the drops, the same thing happens at the events, except that multiple people get prizes at the end depending on how much damage/points they get per mob/boss they help kill.
What I am trying to get at, is that comparing the event to the wb kills kind of lacks oomph so to speak. =x At least in my opinion it does, especially considering what I said above. At events everyone still has a pretty good chance of coming out with something worthwhile, whereas if someone is able to steal a world boss kill one person could very likely end up with all the drops. =x
That aside... @OP reply on this thread, I do apologize if it seemed like I was taking a shot at you in any way, I do respect that you had a decision to make, and whether people like you for it or not, is entirely up to them. In the end this is just a game, and we all have to move on from each of the annoyances that others throw at us, and find the joy every day that keeps us coming back for more.Ah, Mistakes are so easily made. ~ laura resnick
What kind of message are you sending when you insult my intelligence? ~ Me ~ 5/29/2015 (Yes it is possible someone said this before just no idea who/where.)0 -
ElderSig - Dreamweaver wrote: »You realize the ks'd individuals have reported that the OP's estimate of damage dealt to the boss by them in 20 minutes was off by 2.9 mil or so?
yep i know ive read every post, i was just telling him his math was wrong anyways0
![http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd414/FluffyPeace/screenies and such/2011-03-1116-04-45-1.jpg[/SIGPIC]](http://i1218.photobucket.com/albums/dd414/FluffyPeace/screenies%20and%20such/2011-03-1116-04-45-1.jpg[/SIGPIC]){kind=link}
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