Working together, working with a Mystic...ijs

Brillance - Raging Tide

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I posted at pretty much the same time you did. Never had a chance to see your post.

That said, your original post mentioned healing plants, and and AOE seals. The problem with the seals is that it forces the mobs out of range, and that's what's the problem is. No one has said, do not attack, but when your attack impedes your squads attacks, that's where the problem lies. Melee classes have to run, and then possibly press a different skill to match the now different situation. If you can attack, and not cause that frustration, it will make your runs a lot smoother and a lot better.

Is pausing a second for them to return really that much of a change up in gears? Im not being confrontational, Im just asking for serious consideration. If it truely is, then I of course have to take that into consideration.

Is it more than a simple adjustment, and if it is can you tell me how? Its helps to understand why even though it seems a great deal faster, this unnerving feeling for people who cant get used to the chaos they see cannot be overcome.

It is simply impossible not to chase it? I understand its a natural first reaction, especially for a meleer, but its impossible to learn not to in some cases?

Brillance - Raging Tide

Honestly, the BMs that I have had successful runs with usually dont act phased at all, and just keep doing what they would be doing anyway while the mobs return. Its great.

Some have more negative reactions, over a feeling - and make it clear that they have no intention of trying to adjust. Its really just smoke and mirrors when you look at it from a non-Mystic perspective.

Besides high damage on large mobs like in FC in a short time, it really seems like anyone that does complain either wants everything to remain as it always has been, kinda like, "Dont make room for the new kids, we dont need them!" When in reality we Mystics really dont take any attention away from you when you just stay still and continue on as you would have if we didnt just AoE. I think BMs and Mystics work just as well together as Clerics and Mystics do - when they want to.

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver

Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »

Is pausing a second for them to return really that much of a change up in gears? Im not being confrontational, Im just asking for serious consideration. If it truely is, then I of course have to take that into consideration.

Is it more than a simple adjustment, and if it is can you tell me how? Its helps to understand why even though it seems a great deal faster, this unnerving feeling for people who cant get used to the chaos they see cannot be overcome.

It is simply impossible not to chase it? I understand its a natural first reaction, especially for a meleer, but its impossible to learn not to in some cases?

Its not impossible, but it is an adjustment that doesn't necessarily have to be made. In squad, when dealing with multiple mobs that are about to be AOE'd, the squad typically does not want to see knockback moves being done, because that disrupts and halts the moves that they are trying to do. The question that I would pose to you on the opposite end of the spectrum is it really that hard not to use a move that disrupts the squad as a whole when you see that it does, and can you adjust to not doing it if it would benefit your squad as a whole if it didn't.

In truth, it may even increase the odds that people will squad you more if you aren't doing the seal which annoys them. Just a thought...

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver

Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »

Honestly, the BMs that I have had successful runs with usually dont act phased at all, and just keep doing what they would be doing anyway while the mobs return. Its great.

Some have more negative reactions, over a feeling - and make it clear that they have no intention of trying to adjust. Its really just smoke and mirrors when you look at it from a non-Mystic perspective.

Besides high damage on large mobs like in FC in a short time, it really seems like anyone that does complain either wants everything to remain as it always has been, kinda like, "Dont make room for the new kids, we dont need them!" When in reality we Mystics really dont take any attention away from you when you just stay still and continue on as you would have if we didnt just AoE. I think BMs and Mystics work just as well together as Clerics and Mystics do - when they want to.

Indeed, they do. However, both persons have to talk and compromise in events like this, otherwise its going to lead to squad comflicts with both resenting one another.

Brillance - Raging Tide

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Its not impossible, but it is an adjustment that doesn't necessarily have to be made. In squad, when dealing with multiple mobs that are about to be AOE'd, the squad typically does not want to see knockback moves being done, because that disrupts and halts the moves that they are trying to do. The question that I would pose to you on the opposite end of the spectrum is it really that hard not to use a move that disrupts the squad as a whole when you see that it does, and can you adjust to not doing it if it would benefit your squad as a whole if it didn't.

In truth, it may even increase the odds that people will squad you more if you aren't doing the seal which annoys them. Just a thought...

No, they aren't going to squad a char they dont think they need more, just cause Im not AoEing - but I am considering adjustment. It doesnt disrupt the squad as a whole, not that I have been told.

Just the BM. Why is what the BM wants so important? Because everyone wants him in their FC squad. I even want him in mine.

I would say HE is probably the 1 essential to a FC squad, other than a sin for the shades.

Seekers can replace a barb, although I want their buffs too - Mystics can replace a cleric as a solo heal - although a precarious one at times, like at Runewolf, adn again, all the buffs. But, everyone wants the BM and his buff.

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver

Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »

No, they aren't going to squad a char they dont they think they need more, just cause Im not AoEing - but I am considering adjustment. It doesnt disrupt the squad as a whole, not that I have been told.

Just the BM. Why is what the BM wants so important? Because everyone wants him in their FC squad. I even want him in mine.

I would say HE is probably the 1 essential to a FC squad, other than a sin for the shades.

Seekers can replace a barb, although I want their buffs too - Mystics can replace a cleric as a solo heal - although a precarious one at times, like at Runewolf. But, everyone wants the BM and his buff.

I don't know what to tell you in all honesty. I've run quite a few runs with no blademaster. I've done 5 sins with me as the only cleric, 3 clerics, 2 venos, and a psy, etc... so IDK what to say about why others feel that a bm is essential. If we couldn't find one, we went without one. Don't get me wrong. They are very good to have there,...just not essential from what I've seen.

Brillance - Raging Tide

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Indeed, they do. However, both persons have to talk and compromise in events like this, otherwise its going to lead to squad comflicts with both resenting one another.

I agree. Which is why I made the thread. b:victory

I also need to talk to my squads more often if I suspect this could happen. In hindsight on more than one occasion I say I should have told them about the fake BB - or the AoE...but I get complacent too, and think everyone already knows. b:chuckle

Brillance - Raging Tide

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I don't know what to tell you in all honesty. I've run quite a few runs with no blademaster. I've done 5 sins with me as the only cleric, 3 clerics, 2 venos, and a psy, etc... so IDK what to say about why others feel that a bm is essential. If we couldn't find one, we went without one. Don't get me wrong. They are very good to have there,...just not essential from what I've seen. [/COLOR]

Gosh, I would have hardly gotten to 97 without the random mish-mash squads, most of which are very good, and some of which make you wonder why you bothered to log on, lol.

But when you think of the best buffs your squad - you have to start with barb, cleric & BM. Its a natural thought process. Its just disheartening and boring, with a Mystic as my first and only leveled char to spend as much or more time spamming for a squad than I do earning XP. It would be easier if people knew more about Mystics, and what to expect from them in a squad.

Desdi - Sanctuary

Yeah, technically speaking, at level95+ FCC no class is really essential. It all depends on the squad set up. Anyways, that's going off topic.

Brillance you have good intentions, not everyone cares about being a competent player, but you lack some knowledge in the game's mechanics (of course, you're new to this game) and you'll have to understand a couple of things in regards of the mechanics and of teamplay.

Jokes and trolling aside, melee characters simply dislike seals on mobs. When you reach the point of being able to kill group of mobs in one go then you can use whatever skill you want, it won't matter but for pulls that you need to use at least two or more AOEs it's better to use Cragglord or Mistress instead. Lysing your plants may a very good option, their damage upon lysing is not bad at all.

Sometimes I have to limit myself and not do things that otherwise I would in order to fit the squad's needs. For example, I'm a pretty good DD myself. I can't compare to a Psychic or a Wizard(with the same gear, rank8 +8 wep) but I'm pretty good. Of course, I love to Triple Spark and DD (after debuffing) but sometimes I need to pass sparks to the Cleric often (Caster Nirvana case) and that doesn't give me many opportunities to spark however I did what was needed for the squad.

This is the idea we're been trying to get across. Sometimes you need to sacrifice something for the good of the squad. In your case, Gale Force shall be sacrificed (though it does not mean that you should never use it again).

Brillance - Raging Tide

Gale Force may very well go now Desdi. One thing I love about all the discussions I have in this forum, I ALWAYS walk away with something new to consider, and that makes me and my game play better.

If I walked away right now, I have Lysing Befudding Creeper, followed by replacing my healing herb, and if the Chi is with me throwing down my Thicket, and then whipping out Craggy or vice versa to try out. If I have away around Gale Force - Im good with that! b:pleased And everyone's happy.

And if someone thinks they can work with the adjustment to our AoEs for faster FC runs, well then they walked away with something too. b:thanks

Xainou - Sanctuary

I never thought someone could be that full of themselves that they just ignore every logical reasoning...

'tis just hopeless. Go on being an annoyance to squad, maybe one day you'll learn. lol

Hazumi_chan - Sanctuary

I'm so sad you aren't on my server. I'd bring you to fcc, whisper the rest of the squad to not attack, pull as much mobs as I can, drop vortex, unequip my gear, die, and then watch you handle 50+ mobs as your epic self b:sad

/I hate seals since it brings mobs out my vortex, making me use extra pots, or bringing magic mobs out range which I carefully gathered at the end of my pull so they are in range/

Brillance - Raging Tide

Hazumi_chan - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'm so sad you aren't on my server. I'd bring you to fcc, whisper the rest of the squad to not attack, pull as much mobs as I can, drop vortex, unequip my gear, die, and then watch you handle 50+ mobs as your epic self b:sad

/I hate seals since it brings mobs out my vortex, making me use extra pots, or bringing magic mobs out range which I carefully gathered at the end of my pull so they are in range/

Really, I derserve punishment for even trying to learn something? Nice people you are not! Lmao. Thank goodness BMs on my server are actually nice. And obviously epic, since they can work with a Mystics AoE without getting all emo, lol

Xainou - Sanctuary

Aw. I'm sorry if we offended you. But hey, you don't listen at all.
Or you're just being a hopeless diva that expects everyone else to adjust to your playstyle instead of playing with the squad.

You know, I got enough of a certain fail mystic who just comes here to insult people, resists every damn bit of logical advice and then goes butthurt defending calling everyone a noob. There were so many people telling you nicely how to do it better and why it might be bad but you just ignore everything. Go on with your *THE WORLD NEEDS TO REVOLVE AROUND ME*. Maybe one day you'll realize how ****ed up that is.

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Aw. I'm sorry if we offended you. But hey, you don't listen at all.
Or you're just being a hopeless diva that expects everyone else to adjust to your playstyle instead of playing with the squad.

You know, I got enough of a certain fail mystic who just comes here to insult people, resists every damn bit of logical advice and then goes butthurt defending calling everyone a noob. There were so many people telling you nicely how to do it better and why it might be bad but you just ignore everything. Go on with your *THE WORLD NEEDS TO REVOLVE AROUND ME*. Maybe one day you'll realize how ****ed up that is.

That would be you I guess. Sorry you dont like yourself much, Xainou. I can just imagine your heart racing and your face getting all red as you type. Why dont I listen? What did I last say?

No you dont know. All you know is how to b hateful and try to flame everything into something else. Maybe thats a skill on your server...Idk. You have shown you dont like me, on more that one forum and on at least 3 different chars. Im delighted I generate someone to expend so much energy on me.

At one point you said I think Im some kind of diva - which you will probably deny because you dont remember what you said a few posts ago, or you just like using childish tactics while you flame?

I neither know nor care. You are as much of everything to me, as I am to you.

So what now?

Xainou - Sanctuary

Oh. So you're stalking my core to see which char I'm posting on. Good to know
Shame it's not set to public, eh. lol

Cut the personal insults, girl. You're just making yourself look even more stupid than before.
You got NO base to even judge me or my rl. So stop making yourself look ridiculous, please.

You remind me of the schoolyard bullies you see around in schools. Harrasssing others and telling them they suck while going defensive and aggressive once you confront them. Maybe you should care about your own problems instead of calling others stupid?

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Oh. So you're stalking my core to see which char I'm posting on. Good to know
Shame it's not set to public, eh. lol

Cut the personal insults, girl. You're just making yourself look even more stupid than before.
You got NO base to even judge me or my rl. So stop making yourself look ridiculous, please.

You remind me of the schoolyard bullies you see around in schools. Harrasssing others and telling them they suck while going defensive and aggressive once you confront them. Maybe you should care about your own problems instead of calling others stupid?

Lol, you have spoken to me on Safeng, your Mystic, and on Xinaeco. And it has NEVER been anything close to an honest open discussion of anything.

Just you, putting me in opposition to you. I dont care about your profile, nor do I know how to access it. xD

Are you done yet? Or am I the freshest 'victim' you can find? b:cute

Xainou - Sanctuary

Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »

Lol, you have spoken to me on Safeng, your Mystic, and on Xinaeco b:cute

Not me. Althought she's a catveno with pretty much the same letters in her name as me, that's someone else. But yea, I remember her disagreeing with you. lol

As for the rest... not worth it. Just wanted to correct, xineaco is not me.

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Not me. Althought she's a catveno with pretty much the same letters in her name as me, that's someone else. But yea, I remember her disagreeing with you. lol

As for the rest... not worth it. Just wanted to correct, xineaco is not me.

Maybe...but you need to ask yourself..."Self, where have you posted pictures of you and all your alts?"

Im glad Im not worth it. I hope when you think of Brillance, you choose to treasure that thought.

Awesome!

Xainou - Sanctuary

Not maybe. If you bothered clicking the names below our avatars or the avatars themselves, you would see. xineaco is someone entirely else than me.
And I know very well which chars I posted on and which info I gave away, ty.

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Not maybe. If you bothered clicking the names below our avatars or the avatars themselves, you would see. xineaco is someone entirely else than me.
And I know very well which chars I posted on and which info I gave away, ty.

And possibly a different account means it has to be a different person? Really? That's like a rule, lol? Considering who is saying it to me, Ill be nice...and stick with maybe.

So if you know what you gave away, why would you pick a way for me to know something for me...like looking at your profile, lol?

Dont answer...I already know why, lmao!

Im going to be on these forums Xainou - you might as well try to get used to me. *giggles*

Xainou - Sanctuary

Lol then go on believing it's me. Not like I can convince you anyway.
I just know that the owner of that other account would most likely give you a fully censored **** storm if she saw this. b:laugh

And I doubt you will. Ragequit once. Ragequit again. I'm on here too long to not know how it works

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Lol then go on believing it's me. Not like I can convince you anyway.
I just know that the owner of that other account would most likely give you a fully censored **** storm if she saw this. b:laugh

And I doubt you will. Ragequit once. Ragequit again. I'm on here too long to not know how it works

What did I ragequit, Xainou?

The "We Worship Xainou's Awesomeness Fan Club"? xD

Yeah man...Im totally out!

I said I wasn't going to post on YOUR forums anymore, but I thought about it, and that means YOU win.

Im sorry Xainou, I desided Im not letting you win.

Im not a willfull participant in your personal need to disdribute hatefulness in your wake, but only you can change that.

So, you want to keep going? You had said Im not worth it, and I totally agreed.

I guess I AM the freshest 'victim' you can find! Yay! Boy, Im sooo lucky! lol

Xainou - Sanctuary

I'm a she. Not a 'man' ty. That's all I got to say to this bunch of personal attacks.

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver

"/I hate seals since it brings mobs out my vortex, making me use extra pots, or bringing magic mobs out range which I carefully gathered at the end of my pull so they are in range/"

You've got seekers, bm's, and everyone else informing you of the reason why they dislike seals. Let me categorize it. This example is assuming that everyone is attacking:

Barbs: Knocks the mobs out of sunder range, as well as range of their other AOE's.

Blademasters: Knocks the mobs out of range of heaven's flame, and their other AOE's.

Seekers: Knocks the mobs out of vortex range, and their other AOE's.

Wizards: Knocks the mobs out of Dragon's Breath range, and their other AOEs. (Yes, their other AOE's too, because they'd hit a few, but not all.

Archers: Knocks some of the mobs out of Barrage of Arrows range, and their other AOE's.

Venos: Knocks the mobs out of Nova and their other AOE's.

Sins: Knocks the mobs out of Subsea, and Earthen Rift.

Psychics: Knocks some of the mobs out of their AOE range, minimizing its effect.

Mystics: Knocks some of the mobs out of their other AOE's.

Clerics: Knocks some of the mobs out of tempest, razor feathers, and siren's kiss range.

Most of the time, for big pulls, we tend to use 2 spark skills, 1 spark at the lowest. This is done to AOE all targets, and kill them before they can kill us. In times like these, its unwise to use moves that disrupt your other teammates, and then say that they should adapt to you when all you need to do is not press that skill. You're also saying that they panic because of the chaos that ensues. Of course they do. You've created a chaotic situation from an orderly pull. Now more work has to be done, and since Xaniou said that it doesn't aggro, then I'm curious as to whether that seal from you will cause the mobs to back up out of the DD's/tanks AOE range, and then aggro upon me (or any other cleric that puts up BB in a normal pull) since they weren't hit in the AOE, and the cleric would have heal aggro at that point. If so, then it puts your team in even more jeapoardy.

I understand that you mean well, and you honesty like to do those skills, but we all have skills that we like to do, but shouldn't for the better interest of the squad.

Venos: Some like to triple spark. Some like to nova, or use any other sparked skills. For the better interest of the squad, they don't. They save and conserve their chi, and use lending hand to pass sparks on to others.

Wizards/Psychics/Archers/Barbs: Avoid the knockback skill for the better of the squad.

Assasins: Don't stealth ahead for the better of the squad.

Seekers: Save their chi for vortex, though some would love to triple spark.

Clerics: Coming from a cleric standpoint, I'll tell you, I love to triple spark. I love to throw tempest down. I love to DD, battle mobs, and test my power on my cleric. Seeing me in a squad, you'd never guess it. I throw down heals instead like no ones business. I almost never spark. Seeing my tempest is a rare thing...unless its an OP squad, in which case you'll see it every time I can. You'd also guess that my SOR was 10 before my tempest, my metal mastery and my wield thunder, and in both cases you'd be wrong. Some things have to be sacrificed for the better of the squad.

Mystics: Don't do their knockback skills for the better of the squad.

No one is trying to hinder you. The problem is that you are hindering the squad with your actions. When someone has gone through the work of pulling the mobs carefully, then with one move, you create a chaotic situation out of an orderly one, you are then damaging the squad Certain things have to be sacrificed in squadplay, and that's one of them. Try doing that seal in nirvana for the vampiric boss, and then continue to do it. You'll be kicked. Doing that in Delta and forcing the archers, stunners, mages, and various other types of mobs out of the seekers/archers/wizards static AOE will lead to disaster as well.

At your level you should know this already. There is a time and place for every move, and that's not the time and place for it.

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'm a she. Not a 'man' ty. That's all I got to say to this bunch of personal attacks.

A personal attack?...'man' is a figure of speech where Im from, and not an accusation of gender.

Yeah man, no man, cant help ya man - and even said to women. I dont hold it against you that you didnt already know that, just dont want to see you walk away mad!

Brillance - Raging Tide

Gale Force may very well go now Desdi. One thing I love about all the discussions I have in this forum, I ALWAYS walk away with something new to consider, and that makes me and my game play better.

If I walked away right now, I have Lysing Befudding Creeper, followed by replacing my healing herb, and if the Chi is with me throwing down my Thicket, and then whipping out Craggy or vice versa to try out. If I have away around Gale Force - Im good with that! b:pleased And everyone's happy.

And if someone thinks they can work with the adjustment to our AoEs for faster FC runs, well then they walked away with something too. b:thanks

The above is the last post I made on the topic. Is something wrong with this post in relation to peoples position and my reaction to it? o.0

I appreciate the info Serenity, but Im feeling a little beat up right now, lol xD

Xainou - Sanctuary

IJS try doing that seal in BH metal or fire. You will be like insta-kicked. b:laugh

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

IJS try doing that seal in BH metal or fire. You will be like insta-kicked. b:laugh

Is BH metal and fire also Eden and Brim? If it is, barbs do big pulls of mobs in there all the time for me to AoE. Never had a complaint in BH.

Some people complain if I use Thicket on a boss - just cause they know its an AoE. That's all it has to be. Doesn't matter that its short range, and there is no mobs in close range of it - they just go by some rule that you dont EVER use an AoE on a boss. (Note: I dont use Thicket in BH89 cause the bosses are generally too big - hit box to small for it to do anything.)

Some rules can be tested or modified apparently.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »

If it is, barbs do big pulls of mobs in there all the time for ME to AoE.

That sums up all the thread pretty nicely.

No, BH Metal/Fire are paths in Warsong City. Filled with magical aoeing mobs that hit pretty hard.