Sins and Psys

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  • AlbireoTwo - Lost City
    AlbireoTwo - Lost City Posts: 2,056 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    /Skip 12 pages

    It's just you.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Thank you Forsakenx for the picture. b:thanks
  • Saitada - Sanctuary
    Saitada - Sanctuary Posts: 3,220 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    It is just you. Learn to counter them just like people had to learn to counter the Nix and Flesh Ream.

    ~S
  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I want my phoenix knock back in PVP an I will deal with bugged veno's phoenix and sins.
    OP is totally right. Assassin are very OP. How you can fight to some1 who's invisible? Also when is start from invisible he has always first hit and this first hit is huge advantage, because he will stunt you and you will be death till stunt goes off.b:angry
    If dev. not nerf them I will regret every dolar what I put to this game. And I will stop spending money for sure.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Limeball - Heavens Tear
    Limeball - Heavens Tear Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I don't mind if half the sever wants to call it quits because they're forced to use their brain again in PvP. It means less QQing and a more enjoyable gameplay for me.

    Let me tell you a secret. Assassins were designed for PvP.
    Reikara - 94 HA/AA Veno - Heaven's Tear - Retired
    Limeball -84 Assassin - Heaven's Tear - Retired
    Reikarah - 99 Seeker - Sanctuary - Retired

    Why do I stick around? I draw pwi fanart.
  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Limeball - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I don't mind if half the sever wants to call it quits because they're forced to use their brain again in PvP. It means less QQing and a more enjoyable gameplay for me.

    Let me tell you a secret. Assassins were designed for PvP.

    And other classes were designed for what? Especially on PvP servers.
    I don't mind assassins I just want game balanced.
    Tell me what brain I have to use on invisibility? When I cannot defense myself?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I want my phoenix knock back in PVP an I will deal with bugged veno's phoenix and sins.
    OP is totally right. Assassin are very OP. How you can fight to some1 who's invisible? Also when is start from invisible he has always first hit and this first hit is huge advantage, because he will stunt you and you will be death till stunt goes off.b:angry
    If dev. not nerf them I will regret every dolar what I put to this game. And I will stop spending money for sure.

    .....
    teh being invisible = not a problem
    the not being able to force em back out of stealth be a big problem....
    >.>
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
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  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »
    .....
    teh being invisible = not a problem
    the not being able to force em back out of stealth be a big problem....
    >.>

    I think that are very similar and together connected problems.b:chuckle
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Technotic - Sanctuary
    Technotic - Sanctuary Posts: 591 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    You'd figure after 100+ QQs about Tideborn being over-powered they would take a look at it. Tideborn is overpowered, simple as that.
    Say my name 3 times, I dare you.

    ~Technotic
    TrueMyths.Guildplex.com
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Technotic - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You'd figure after 100+ QQs about Tideborn being over-powered they would take a look at it. Tideborn is overpowered, simple as that.
    and wizards are far from? explain. there's a balance, FIND IT.
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • Softie - Harshlands
    Softie - Harshlands Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    zomgggg nobody has told me how to fight these new classes so im going 2 call them OPPPPPPPPPP

    really?
    how bout for sins u use abosolute domain and one shot em?

    psys i dno how 2 kill em in pvp yet but i kno a psy my lvl has 1000 less mag atk then me...not saying they suck cause they got some sick **** moves
  • GothicAngeI - Heavens Tear
    GothicAngeI - Heavens Tear Posts: 130 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    so in other words:

    my psy being able to take out a sin makes it godlike? so if a barbarian is able to clobber my psy that makes them WAY overpowered. But wait, a wizard can destroy a barb, THEY'VE GOTTA BE BROKEN! right?
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    on one's got anything to say on this?

    It was Sarcasm and a point to the fail logic of the thread.

    If X class is OPed then Y class must be Godlike to be able to kill them.

    But Y isnt Godlike and can still kill X .

    Hence X isnt OPed.
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    GothicAngeI - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    It was Sarcasm and a point to the fail logic of the thread.

    If X class is OPed then Y class must be Godlike to be able to kill them.

    But Y isnt Godlike and can still kill X .

    Hence X isnt OPed.
    if I'm reading your comment right, then yes. there is a balance there, just too many won't look for it
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • JadeFarmer - Dreamweaver
    JadeFarmer - Dreamweaver Posts: 126 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I want my phoenix knock back in PVP an I will deal with bugged veno's phoenix and sins.
    OP is totally right. Assassin are very OP. How you can fight to some1 who's invisible? Also when is start from invisible he has always first hit and this first hit is huge advantage, because he will stunt you and you will be death till stunt goes off.b:angry
    If dev. not nerf them I will regret every dolar what I put to this game. And I will stop spending money for sure.

    Try reading the posts!!!

    1: There are many ways to counter sins stealth!!!

    2: There are many ways to counter sins stealth!!!

    3: There are many ways to counter sins stealth!!!

    4: Did i mention that there are many ways to counter sins stealth?
    It is better to remain silent and be thought the fool then to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    idk if this was said. I didnt want to read all of it but, Psys arent OP and sins invis can be countered with genie.
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • JadeFarmer - Dreamweaver
    JadeFarmer - Dreamweaver Posts: 126 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    idk if this was said. I didnt want to read all of it but, Psys arent OP and sins invis can be countered with genie.

    Yep but it seems some ppl think they should be able to counter sin stealth without using genie/apoc, I wonder how these ppl deal with BM stun lock, cleric sleep etc etc......
    It is better to remain silent and be thought the fool then to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
  • FranzKafka - Dreamweaver
    FranzKafka - Dreamweaver Posts: 345 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    JadeFarmer - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Yep but it seems some ppl think they should be able to counter sin stealth without using genie/apoc, I wonder how these ppl deal with BM stun lock, cleric sleep etc etc......

    They close they eyes and hope somebody else killed them?
  • Davitiel - Heavens Tear
    Davitiel - Heavens Tear Posts: 978 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Hmm, Tideborn being "OP" seem to be all the rage these days...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    And now faith, hope, and charity remain; but the greatest of these is charity.
  • Boozer - Lost City
    Boozer - Lost City Posts: 30 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Sins are very weak against heavys lol. Dont know how that should be considered OP. Many classes aren't weak against any other class. Venos, barbs, high lvl wizards can **** anyone. Sins gets **** on even trying to mess with Bms and barbs, pretty sure they cant do much against heavy venos either.

    85+ sins with highly refined frost daggers is like a little angry bee tickling me with 300-700 dmg <.< I can tank it charmless with hp pots. And i have pretty bad gear. I guess a 100+ sin with +12 Nirvana daggers and interval gear will be another thing tho...

    lvl 11 ice dragon
    Armageddon
    purge

    There is so many skills just as OP as Stealth and no one is complaining about those O_O
  • Myriad_ - Lost City
    Myriad_ - Lost City Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Sins are definitely imba. Stealth is imba. Look, for those who know about dota, imagine rikimaru with a stun skill and a crit skill. nuf said. Although, in dota there are many ways to counter invis, like sentry wards and gem.

    Sins got the best crit-rate, infinite chi, the best dps, stun, teleport, they always have the first move and they have an escape mechanism ; and they dont have yet 79 and sage/demon skills. Whoever says that sins are not OP is clueless. Don't say they are squishy as hell because that doesn't matters if they kill you before u can do anything, and archers are squishy too, and they can't stealth.

    PWI definetely needs a counter to invis.
  • Risingson - Lost City
    Risingson - Lost City Posts: 499 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Myriad_ - Lost City wrote: »
    Sins are definitely imba. Stealth is imba. Look, for those who know about dota, imagine rikimaru with a stun skill and a crit skill. nuf said. Although in dota there is many way to counter invis, like sentry wards and gem.

    Sins got the best crit-rate, infinite chi, the best dps, stun, teleport, they always have the first move and they have an escape mechanism ; and they dont have yet 79 and sage/demon. Whoever says that sins are not OP is clueless. Don't say they are squishy as hell because that doesn't matters if they kill you before u can do anything.

    PWI definetely needs a counter to invis.

    Rikimaru has an AoE disabling skill, isn't that just 10 times more annoying than any stun ? He can deal x more damage while attacking from behind, etc... Rikimaru, on the other hand, is deadly when you meet him 1on1 and unprepared, but if he shows up on like two people, he's most likely gonna get slaughtered as he is very weak.

    edit : Not to mention, you just can't compare DotA to PWI. DotA is all about teamplay (so is PWI with TW I guess) and it has items. Riki actually can crit and stun if you get Basher or Buriza. Even with that stuff, he just can't face teamplay. Maybe people should learn that Sins are really a kamikaze class, they can tear a caster appart in TW, but they will most likely die in the process, as any teammate (no matter their class) could kill the Sin in less than 5 shots.

    Regarding PvP, it's a little different, but it doesn't take Sun Tzu to figure out a strategy. Get Badge of Courage and try to disable the Sin, once that's done he's a free target.
    Risingson - 7x Psychic
    Indalecio - 3x Cleric
  • Myriad_ - Lost City
    Myriad_ - Lost City Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Risingson - Lost City wrote: »
    Rikimaru has an AoE disabling skill, isn't that just 10 times more annoying than any stun ? He can deal x more damage while attacking from behind, etc... Rikimaru, on the other hand, is deadly when you meet him 1on1 and unprepared, but if he shows up with like two people, he's most likely gonna get slaughtered as he is very weak.

    Yes but any class in pwi will be owned 1vs2 assuming the level and gear is the same so this argument is useless.
  • Risingson - Lost City
    Risingson - Lost City Posts: 499 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Myriad_ - Lost City wrote: »
    Yes but any class in pwi will be owned 1vs2 assuming the level and gear is the same so this argument is useless.

    Not really. I've seen Barbs crush up to 3 people at the same time, on their own. Maybe I explained badly, but my point was Sins really can't handle a lot of hits. People are just whining like hell because they can't be arsed to find a solution, complaining is much easier.

    If you know DotA, you know that there is the same thing in that game too. How many people still complain about Riki ? How many people still complain about Kunkka ? How many people still complain about Bristleback ? How many people still complain about Spectre ?

    I could do this with like 10 more heroes.
    Risingson - 7x Psychic
    Indalecio - 3x Cleric
  • Myriad_ - Lost City
    Myriad_ - Lost City Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Ok barbs with a good perdition. But if 3 ppl are too stupid to perma disable, kite, heal each others or nuke to the death the barb its a different story.

    For DotA its completely different. Only noobs or pub gamers complain about noob agi hero like troll or mortred. You just need to disable them, ie guinso them and full focus them to the death. For noobs inv hero like bounty hunter or riki, just buy gem or wards.

    And dota is a team game, no one wonder why pro teams go mainly for int hero.
  • MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear
    MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear Posts: 4,377 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    On dota team play what people looking on their team is hero that has nuke skill since it hard to kill other hero with hero that depend on using normal attack to kill (except something like morthred or troll i guess but they has to survive and grind to become strong) or hero like nerubian weaver that people like to call it as naughty hero b:laugh has lots skill to escape but don't has skill to kill.
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  • timkalex
    timkalex Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I do agree with Risingson, if you are the type of person that goes into pk..EXPECT THE UNEXPECTED..I too have seen countless beyond countless of threads putting down the tideborn race chars. I have a lvl 80 Psychic and I love it. I am now working on my assasin, which he is more squishy then my psychic. Join us on the tideborn side.b:laugh
  • Myriad_ - Lost City
    Myriad_ - Lost City Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Win or lose in dota depends in team clashes 5vs5 during big pushes. So you need int heroes to make deadly combos like Earthshaker opening with fissure, stun and ulti, SK blink in => epicenter, or enigma blink in ulti, or puck full aoe : that kind of stuff lol. There is a reason why ES and Puck are always banned in -cm mode rofl.

    For sins and pwi, we just need some other tools to counter invis, thats it.
  • MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear
    MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear Posts: 4,377 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    When the whole team about to meet each other in dota . . .

    Warlock infernal aoe stun, magnataur use blink dagger then reverse polarity,
    earthshaker use dagger too then start doing stun lock, enigma start black hole,
    *add one more hero that has aoe stun or good use of cleaving attack here* b:laugh

    Pretty much in pwi is about your preparation and knowledge of your enemy ability x.x
    once you know what to counter it, it goes easier i guess
    some classes need special things to counter it
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Sorry i speak engrish b:chuckle
    Nickname doesn't have anything to do with sailor but related to a folklore
    Use search, it was your best friends to avoid many suffering in internet...
  • Myriad_ - Lost City
    Myriad_ - Lost City Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Pretty much in pwi is about your preparation and knowledge of your enemy ability x.x
    once you know what to counter it, it goes easier i guess
    some classes need special things to counter it

    Ok. So anyone can resume all the things which can be done to counter sins? Lol...
  • Risingson - Lost City
    Risingson - Lost City Posts: 499 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    DotA is about ganking people to make 5vs5 fight easier when you push. 5vs5 fights always happen, but your goal should be to prepare for it and make them easier by making the other team weaker with ganks. In those fights, you need at least two AoE disable, a support and a carry. No team can win without a carry, except if you go full-int and fast push, but those technics are obvious and easily countered by several heroes and teamplay.

    Anyway, giving away items that would allow to see Sins would be a little much. Take away their invisiblity and they're worth nothing, really. You might add a Genie Skill or a pot that allows you to see a Sin for like 10 seconds, but that would be all.

    I'm still certain Sins can be countered without that.
    Risingson - 7x Psychic
    Indalecio - 3x Cleric
  • Myriad_ - Lost City
    Myriad_ - Lost City Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Risingson - Lost City wrote: »
    DotA is about ganking people to make 5vs5 fight easier when you push. 5vs5 fights always happen, but your goal should be to prepare for it and make them easier by making the other team weaker with ganks. In those fights, you need at least two AoE disable, a support and a carry. No team can win without a carry, except if you go full-int and fast push, but those technics are obvious and easily countered by several heroes and teamplay.

    Lol guess what? best gankers are int obviously, and one of the best viable carry late game who can dominate lane during early game is silencer, an int hero.
    Akasha is a int hero really deadly early game and can easily turn to semi carry/support late game with necro book and guinsoo.
    Obsidian destroyer can have a crazy dps too. And all three have usefull teamplay skills. Anyway int is better because int items are better.
    The only agi one who is good is nevermore IMO. Quite dominating at all stages.

    Even without stealth sins can telestun, so meh. Stealth gives first shot, okay. But giving sins a 100% succes escaping tool is so so.

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