Rising Gold Prices

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  • Brael - Dreamweaver
    Brael - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,430 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Ty - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Firstly it must have been a pretty noob cleric to fail to kill you when you aren't wearing a charm and they are. If you're up against anyone with skill whilst charmless you're at a severe disadvantage, you may as well just sit in archo and duel.

    Those MP regen pots won't do jack in Blue Bubble, you'll be qualified as being in combat therefore MP regen is 1/4 of its normal rate. Also Jade powders can't be used while in bubble.

    And saying charms aren't needed to play the game try telling that to a barb in Rebirth...Also try completing Rebirth Delta without a squad with at least +5 refined gear. Have you tried to refine gear without Dragon Orbs?

    I've seen clerics use jade powders when in BB before.
    Dropped potions work while in combat
    50 or 100/sec potions are cut to 25% value, but are still superior for grinding (even when at 25% value), they don't extend BB long enough though on their own.
    Soul Transfusion genie
    Event food

    About 3/4 of the spots that people use BB for can be done without BB for lower cost. Of that remaining 1/4, you can safely use soul transfusion in about 1/3 of them (1/2 that I've seen but I haven't seen everything). So really you're looking at only about 17% of what people use BB for actually needing BB, then we go back to what I just said above. There's ways to sustain it without issue.
  • Alexeno - Sanctuary
    Alexeno - Sanctuary Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Ty - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Firstly it must have been a pretty noob cleric to fail to kill you when you aren't wearing a charm and they are. If you're up against anyone with skill whilst charmless you're at a severe disadvantage, you may as well just sit in archo and duel.

    Those MP regen pots won't do jack in Blue Bubble, you'll be qualified as being in combat therefore MP regen is 1/4 of its normal rate. Also Jade powders can't be used while in bubble.

    And saying charms aren't needed to play the game try telling that to a barb in Rebirth...Also try completing Rebirth Delta without a squad with at least +5 refined gear. Have you tried to refine gear without Dragon Orbs?

    i can tell you couple of the clerics were nubbish (sorta), but a couple of them i know to be fully competant from personal experience of working with them in squad... also, Chaos Powder + Life Powder + HP Potions + (the bm hp recovery skill) = one hell of a healing combo

    don't know whether or not your claim of jade powder being unusable in bubble is true or not, however that doesn't negate the fact that if the boss -requires- BB, and you can't do it with only one cleric using BB, then simply get another cleric b:chuckle

    no experience with RB, but afaik it's essentially a party-based oracle sorta thing, and not necessary for game progression (in other words, optional)
    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Provide for me concrete proof that *I* can o_O. (What is concrete proof anyways?)

    It is obviously a matter of opinion, so when you say "I can," and I disagree with you, there is nothing left to be said.

    On the same note, be careful with the word "play", because I don't consider grinding to be playing. I know that I can *technically* log into the game without spending a single dollar, but whether or not I can have fun playing this game for free is, once again, a matter of opinion. As it turns out many people feel like they can't. The technicality that I can spend years mining the noob mats to make some coins hardly proves to me that this game can be enjoyed for free. (Again your personal experiences and idea of fun is your own, so spare me the requests for proof.)

    Concrete -adjective
    1. constituting an actual thing or instance; real: a concrete proof of his sincerity.
    2. pertaining to or concerned with realities or actual instances rather than abstractions; particular (opposed to general ): concrete ideas.
    3. representing or applied to an actual substance or thing, as opposed to an abstract quality: The words
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "Hell hath no fury like Alexeno trying to prove his point" -Mizuoni
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Exactly my point. It is a matter of opinion. There is no concrete evidence to be give on either side. Just my testimony: This patch fails. Buy Zen or Quit.
  • Alexeno - Sanctuary
    Alexeno - Sanctuary Posts: 1,006 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Exactly my point. It is a matter of opinion. There is no concrete evidence to be give on either side.

    concrete proof would be SS of people doing supposedly "non-CS impossible" bosses without CS items (as one example)
    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Just my testimony: This patch fails. Buy Zen or Quit.

    your edit negates any further discussion you make, as you obviously are biased =S
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "Hell hath no fury like Alexeno trying to prove his point" -Mizuoni
  • Brael - Dreamweaver
    Brael - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,430 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Where can I get these Sesame Yuanxiaos? o.o

    Event food. They came from Jolly. Currently you can get Herb Yuanxiao which is 5000 MP though it requires level 75 unlike Sesame which is level 10 or something. It can be made from tokens, 3 tokens for 50. At DW prices, that's 720-960 coin for each one depending on what you can get tokens at, or if you would prefer 5.21-6.94 mp per coin. 410k gold means 1672800 coin for 900k mana or .54 mp per coin.
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Alexeno - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Concrete proof would be SS of people doing supposedly "non-CS impossible" bosses without CS items (as one example).

    Your edit negates any further discussion you make, as you obviously are biased. =S

    First off, everyone has an opinion. That doesn't void my "discussion" (?). As a matter of fact, that is what I am discussing xD [My opinion].

    Let me begin by saying, everything is possible. Theoretically, you can be a level 1 Wizard and solo Harpy Wraith (If the Harpy misses a billion times in a row). However, is that going to realistically happen?

    I am suggesting that the chances that the average F2Per beats a Cash Shopper in any competitive in game endeavor is low. More to the point, I am suggesting that that chance became even lower after this patch. What proof do I have, none save for my experiences, and any argument that you make against it would have the same type of evidence.

    Please keep in mind that since this is a game, people's opinions, and people's enjoyment are key. just because you tell me that I can do things at double the cost, and half my gain, as before the patch doesn't mean I will want to. And that I am told that it "is possible" doesn't change the fact that I find it lame as hell.
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Brael - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Event food. They came from Jolly. Currently you can get Herb Yuanxiao which is 5000 MP though it requires level 75 unlike Sesame which is level 10 or something. It can be made from tokens, 3 tokens for 50. At DW prices, that's 720-960 coin for each one depending on what you can get tokens at, or if you would prefer 5.21-6.94 mp per coin. 410k gold means 1672800 coin for 900k mana or .54 mp per coin.

    Oh, so the primary sources are a non-existent NPC or the Cash Shop? (Rhetorical Question)
  • Delia - Harshlands
    Delia - Harshlands Posts: 227 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    I was going to quote people but there are a lot to respond to.

    KotaroX: Wasn't trying to pick on you, it's just a general misconception. There are some people who stamp "stop buying gold and make the prices go down" on every thread about the economy.

    About charms:

    Yes, for now we have the sesames (from Jolly or the current event), but what happens when this event ends? After Jolly ended the first time they went back to near-charm prices. They are also a cash shop item. Sure, for know they are cheaper than charms, but once again, we are buying mana with dollars, whether it's ours or others. As long as the primary supply of these types of items is through the cash shop, there are going to be problems.

    And I'm sort of sick of all the venos saying this game is perfectly playable without charms. Of course, if forced, clerics can go buy potions, make MP powders, meditate a lot (assuming event items aren't available, because, let's face it, they aren't always there). But I've played both a cleric and a veno, and I never bought a charm or a potion or anything. Soul transfusion, metabolic boost, and nature's grace basically take care of you. Venos spells are cheaper, and clerics have high-MP cost heals and a higher repair bill. It's a lot easier to say you don't need charms when you have recovery skills. (Not that all venos don't appreciate this, but some don't seem to.)

    Does playing for 5 minutes then meditating for 5 count as playing the game though?

    As to the blue bubble, I think it's worth pointing out that it's about the same cost as spamming ironheart, depending on one's MP recovery (since healing can stay out of combat).
  • KotaroX - Dreamweaver
    KotaroX - Dreamweaver Posts: 74 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    after the gold prices went up, the prices for items in the boutique went up too. the Hellfire Drake that i really NEED was 20 gold, now is 25 gold. if the gold prices dont go down, they'll go up, which will make it even harder to buy Zen for this game. who's side are you on Falls?

    lol, dont really need the drake, but I already have 20 gold sitting there doing nothing T_T
    95% of teens would freak out if the saw The Jonas Brothers on a 247 foot tall building about to jump. 5% get popcorn, a chair, and a video camera and yell Jump @#$&! jump!
  • Aadi - Lost City
    Aadi - Lost City Posts: 4,449 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    boo4u wrote: »
    Look here is my theory:

    1.Be a nice gentalmen as myself.
    2.Address women in the correct manor.
    3.help themb:chuckle
    4.Become aquainted with them..tell them what they wanna hear.
    5.tada u start to get free stuff from them..consider them as sugar mama'sb:pleased

    I thought that's what girls did to get sugar daddies....
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "aadi is a forum ninja, always there, skirting thru the shadows... striking with quick posts while you are distracted by your own" -Alexeno(kin)
    "We talk about you because you're fab. b:cute" -Chillum
    "You live for forums. Like seriously."
  • Ty - Heavens Tear
    Ty - Heavens Tear Posts: 604 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Lies! I've finished a rebirth delta and my gear is only +4! Ha, you are incorrect in your claim of +5!b:victory

    Gratz veno. Depends on the rest of your squad though not just one individual's gear. A good Barb/BM combo can take any squad through but basically the BM needs a pretty good weapon to keep aggro off the wiz. It's a lot easier now with the blessing I agree. But if you're squads damage isn't sufficient enough you end up with compounding waves or having the barb running around with mobs chasing him and eventually they'll reset anyway.
    Calliope - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Sure, but Sesame/Herb Yuanxiao can. Sesame Yuanxiao restores 300 mp/sec, Herb restores 500 mp/sec.

    Blue bubble takes 100 mana/sec to maintain, a small pile of Yuanxiaos will work just as well as an MP charm.

    Now stop saying that clerics *need* mp charms, please. ^_^

    I never actually said clerics needed charms, I was just pointing out errors :P
    Alexeno - Sanctuary wrote: »

    don't know whether or not your claim of jade powder being unusable in bubble is true or not, however that doesn't negate the fact that if the boss -requires- BB, and you can't do it with only one cleric using BB, then simply get another cleric b:chuckle

    no experience with RB, but afaik it's essentially a party-based oracle sorta thing, and not necessary for game progression (in other words, optional)

    Rebirth Delta is required to get your 3rd fairy and Celestial Sage/Demon cultivation for your lvl 100 skills. So in terms of 'winning the game' you will need to finish it. Plus it unlocks other 'Past World' maps and gives you a damn good quest reward belt.

    And I'm pretty sure Jade powders can't be used in BB as you can't use them in Dragon's Breath (the wizard continuous AoE skill) so i would imagine it to be the same. Maybe a cleric can verify?

    And please don't say 'get another cleric' >< It really annoys me how certain instances need 2 clerics in a party. QQ for DDs
    I like pie
  • Brael - Dreamweaver
    Brael - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,430 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    And I'm sort of sick of all the venos saying this game is perfectly playable without charms. Of course, if forced, clerics can go buy potions, make MP powders, meditate a lot (assuming event items aren't available, because, let's face it, they aren't always there). But I've played both a cleric and a veno, and I never bought a charm or a potion or anything. Soul transfusion, metabolic boost, and nature's grace basically take care of you. Venos spells are cheaper, and clerics have high-MP cost heals and a higher repair bill. It's a lot easier to say you don't need charms when you have recovery skills. (Not that all venos don't appreciate this, but some don't seem to.)

    Duoed General Wurlord: Naught (2-2) last night using myself (85 veno), and a level 78 barb. He used a few heal potions (9 I think) I used a few Yuanxiao (8 I think). He didn't tick his charm once, I didn't use a charm. Charms sure are needed.

    Anyways, my argument only applies to PvE (since I'm sure someone will point out the difference between a charm/no charm in PvP). MP charms are one of the least efficient ways out there to play. Even if you don't use Yuanxiao you can make your own jade powder for about 1800 each (or less if you gathered your own herbs, but I'll ignore that) for 1.67 mp/coin. Still about 3x the value of an MP charm with current prices, and equal to an MP charm at 132k gold.

    The higher your level the better the potions you can use too, there's upgrades to jade powder. Infact, go high enough and you can make the 9k mp potions (think they're level 60 required), and in the event you can't use them while in BB, a veno can give you a spark every 15 seconds. Not a bad deal seeing as how it would take BB 90 seconds to eat through 9k mana. MP charms are convenient in that they do everything for you automatically, but they aren't needed. HP charms are a slightly different story since you can't substitute them as well (though in some places you can).
    Oh, so the primary sources are a non-existent NPC or the Cash Shop? (Rhetorical Question)

    Sold on catshops, very inexpensive. Buy in advance, use when you need to BB.
    Does playing for 5 minutes then meditating for 5 count as playing the game though?

    Find ways to meditate less?
  • Isala - Sanctuary
    Isala - Sanctuary Posts: 1,607 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Delia - Harshlands wrote: »
    And I'm sort of sick of all the venos saying this game is perfectly playable without charms. Of course, if forced, clerics can go buy potions, make MP powders, meditate a lot (assuming event items aren't available, because, let's face it, they aren't always there). But I've played both a cleric and a veno, and I never bought a charm or a potion or anything. Soul transfusion, metabolic boost, and nature's grace basically take care of you. Venos spells are cheaper, and clerics have high-MP cost heals and a higher repair bill. It's a lot easier to say you don't need charms when you have recovery skills. (Not that all venos don't appreciate this, but some don't seem to.)

    <<< Veno. Has never said anything of the sort. I've been burning through HP charms myself, being a constant runner of Rebirth Gamma. Not to mention I always try to keep one on me at all times, even when running instances. You never know when something is going to go wrong, and you're going to have to make an emergency decision that's going to get you beat on. Like when the cleric doesn't realize there's an add, and heals the Barb. Guess who goes into Fox Form and gets in the way while the Cleric gets the hell out of Dodge? b:victory

    Fact is, whether you're a Veno, Barb, Cleric, or whatever, Charms make you more effective. When prices go up, it starts **** entire parties. Barb can't get an HP charm, so they're completely reliant on the cleric and pots, but the Cleric doesn't have an MP charm. Meanwhile, we're fighting a boss with a nasty AoE, but the cleric can't use BB, because he has no Event Foods, and couldn't afford the charm to keep it up, so the Archer, and the Wizard are being pummeled, but couldn't afford their HP charms, so they're staying back so they don't die, only DDing every now and again, and the BM is up front, popping potion after potion so he doesn't die, and I'm switching in and out of Fox Form, so I can use Amplify Damage, and Ironwood on the boss, which keeps eating up my MP, but I don't have a Charm, so I'm burning through MP pot, after MP pot, as well as HP pots to survive the AoE. Do you see the point here? Without charms, you really shaft the normal dynamics of a party. It's "Possible". But do you really want to have to deal with all that **** just to say you can? I didn't think so.
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Brael - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Sold on cat shops, very inexpensive. Buy in advance, use when you need to BB.

    Just a technical point, but I did say primary source. My point was that to currently acquire those someone has to pay real money (Which doesn't help the Gold Price).

    Additionally, thank you for your suggestions on what I can do to play without Gold. But well, the only items I still need come from Ancient Evil in TT2-3. I would like to challenge anyone to do this without Gold and post a guide/video, I will thank them immensely if they can (No Cash Shop Items, including refines).
  • Brael - Dreamweaver
    Brael - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,430 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    ...except very few if any AE's should even be firing in the first place if you have a Barb+BM, not to mention some potential lightning chasers. Soul Banisher is the only guy I've seen so far that a single barb can't stop every single ae on. I fail to see why it's the clerics responsibility to cover for a lazy/incapable barb.

    Using your own scenario, the barb interrupts the ae's, veno chains befuddle/genie skill on boss, send pet on adds. You can heal/befuddle at the same time. Now you've got adds tanked, a boss doing almost 0 damage, and a pet that's being healed. The barb does his own physical debuff since it's better than IW, party doesn't lose that, you're already fox for debuffing so you can do amplify. Sustain your mana with soul transfusion/leech.

    Easy situation to deal with.
    Additionally, thank you for your suggestions on what I can do to play without Gold. But well, the only items I still need come from Ancient Evil in TT2-3. I would like to challenge anyone to do this without Gold and post a guide/video, I will thank them immensely if they can (No Cash Shop Items, including refines).

    No comment on him, having never done the fight. I'm sure there's a way however to at the very minimum heavily reduce the boutique items required. Also, when I say boutique items I'm thinking more of the consumable stuff like charms, I wouldn't put dragon orbs/socket stones in the same category. Though they're technically consumable they don't have a pre defined lifespan like charms do, but are instead good until you replace the gear.
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    NVM xD I thought when you typed AE you meant Ancient Evil.
  • Oichii - Dreamweaver
    Oichii - Dreamweaver Posts: 40 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    My future Predictions of this game :
    1> Gold doesn't revert back to 200K after Event, rather stays at 350 - 400K.
    2> Richer ppl get richer as poorer ppl get poorer. More ppl start to back out and it becomes only a game played by real-money-users.
    3> Soon to be added "x-mas packs" for 5 Gold Event, more ppl leave, leaving the game with meager 100 - 200 ppl on the whole server.
    4> You can guess whats next, PWI Staff -> b:cry

    Have fun and you KNOW my predictions are gonna come true 100% b:cute

    I dont care anymore coz I found a better game ! b:victory and hehe, guess what its free-to-play like it really says. b:thanks
  • WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary
    WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary Posts: 1,686 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Just my testimony: This patch fails. Buy Zen or Quit.
    Or buy all the dirt-cheap Tokens people are selling, then laugh heartily once the event ends and prices go back up and you more than double your coinage. Although, I realize it's not in vogue right now to talk about anything other than the end of PWI, so planning for the future is kinda lame.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    PWI Merchanting Guides: warrenwolfy.wordpress.com
  • Falls - Sanctuary
    Falls - Sanctuary Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Or buy all the dirt-cheap Tokens people are selling, then laugh heartily once the event ends and prices go back up and you more than double your coinage. Although, I realize it's not in vogue right now to talk about anything other than the end of PWI, so planning for the future is kinda lame.

    You're right, I should have replaced the "or" with an "and".
  • WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary
    WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary Posts: 1,686 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Falls - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You're right, I should have replaced the "or" with an "and".
    You mean like Vert did? (At least, I think that's what happened from reading WC)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    PWI Merchanting Guides: warrenwolfy.wordpress.com
  • koukou
    koukou Posts: 35 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Looks like it's time to bring back this thread and ask Xarfox some questions....
    xarfox wrote: »
    The reason why the price for Gold has shot through the roof, is because of the addition of Jolly Old Jones, not the Gear Shattering system.

    [...]

    Currently gold prices are inflated, however they should fall back down after this event/sale, perhaps even to a lower benchmark since so much coin is being sunk out of the game right now.

    Why did you lied to us? After JJ, you came back with more sales that continually raised the price of gold, culminating with the anniversary pack that sent gold price up through the roof.

    There are more coins on the server than there ever was before.
    Gold trading is something that we pay a lot of attention to at PWE. We realize that a large number of players get their gold through the auction house, and carefully watch that system with a variety of metrics, statistics, and tools. You can be sure that when you guys are upset about high Gold prices, we become concerned for our players who can't afford to charge their ZEN directly.

    More lies. PWI did everything to make sure the gold price would stay high and rise even more.

    So Xarfox, can you tell us why everything you said to us never happened? PWI did everything to make sure that the contrary of what you said would happen....
  • Caldaster - Lost City
    Caldaster - Lost City Posts: 184 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    When a GM doesnt reply to a post its a clear statement that they understood that they have done wrng ( u know wht i meant ).

    They squeeze now coz thats all tht they can do now. There is no three strikes for them. Their one stroke ended the whole game.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Poor thing ... lucky me b:victory
  • brutal1111
    brutal1111 Posts: 118 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    You are more likely to get a lock on this thread than an answer from the staff.
    You know... just sweep it under the carpet and hope noone sees or remembers.
  • Rumble - Harshlands
    Rumble - Harshlands Posts: 211 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    As a cash shop user I have continually lamented about the sales as it destroys the community as a whole. I recognize a symbiotic relationship with non-cash shop users. We need each for a healthy gaming environment.

    I have also gone on and on about the economic effect of sales, supply and demand, etc. GMs have responded but never commented officially on the gold prices. Just that they are gathering information, but then they go and have another sale so they are either really dumb or just don't care and want money. Or....or....

    wait for it....or.....they are really smart. I mean think about it. Everyone mentions that they will quit and go to the game that shall not be mentioned, but who are these people?

    Well the people really upset are those that don't use the Cash Shop and charge Zen at all. So to PWI it's no great fiscal loss. Or so you would think. But the fact is many cash shop users buy gear just to sell to non-cash users to get easy in game coin. So if non-cash shop users disappear then cashshop users loose an outlet for getting in game coin and have less of a need to buy Zen. So PWI suffers. I think every is on page with this and understands. But here is the real genius of it all. The game that everyone threatens to run to like high ground in a flood is not F2P. It's pay to play. So all the people who are non cash users don't spend real life money anyways so it's not like they'll go to a paying game. Especially if they haven't had a chance to play and see what it's all about. Maybe less then 1% of the non-cash users would convert blindly to playing on a game they've never seen before, but I doubt it.

    The next group is the players who spend just a little real life money in the game and probably could make an easy transition to the new game, but again it's a blind move and if you view your prior spendings as an investment it makes it harder to move and start over. It would be like writing off a huge loss. (Often times the smartest thing, but the hardest to do in a real life market) However PWI is having sales so those that only spend a little each month are getting more for their dollar.

    This then leaves the BIG cash spenders. These people spend a ton on the game and sales benefit them the most. They may have more disposable income then the rest (or their parents might) so it doens't matter to them. They are on top in this game and they aren't leaving to a game that puts them on ever par with everyone else and makes them start over. They love flying around with their gigantic epeen hanging out. They aren't going to be a level 1 noob ever again. They prefer to be a level 9x noob.

    So there you have it. Non-cash shop users aren't paying RL money. Never have never will. PWI is calling your bluff and raising the stakes. They're not worried at all. You're nothing but talk and a badge. You may leave for a week, but you'll be back. The small cash shoppers most likely will stay. The sales keep it intriguing enough. The BIG cash shoppers are staying put. There you have it. PWI genius corporation that doesn't give a rat's **** about it's players so long as the rake in the dough. As someone who believes in capitalism I applaud you.
  • Stickygreen - Heavens Tear
    Stickygreen - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,158 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    Rumble - Harshlands wrote: »
    As a cash shop user I have continually lamented about the sales as it destroys the community as a whole. I recognize a symbiotic relationship with non-cash shop users. We need each for a healthy gaming environment.

    I have also gone on and on about the economic effect of sales, supply and demand, etc. GMs have responded but never commented officially on the gold prices. Just that they are gathering information, but then they go and have another sale so they are either really dumb or just don't care and want money. Or....or....

    wait for it....or.....they are really smart. I mean think about it. Everyone mentions that they will quit and go to the game that shall not be mentioned, but who are these people?

    Well the people really upset are those that don't use the Cash Shop and charge Zen at all. So to PWI it's no great fiscal loss. Or so you would think. But the fact is many cash shop users buy gear just to sell to non-cash users to get easy in game coin. So if non-cash shop users disappear then cashshop users loose an outlet for getting in game coin and have less of a need to buy Zen. So PWI suffers. I think every is on page with this and understands. But here is the real genius of it all. The game that everyone threatens to run to like high ground in a flood is not F2P. It's pay to play. So all the people who are non cash users don't spend real life money anyways so it's not like they'll go to a paying game. Especially if they haven't had a chance to play and see what it's all about. Maybe less then 1% of the non-cash users would convert blindly to playing on a game they've never seen before, but I doubt it.

    The next group is the players who spend just a little real life money in the game and probably could make an easy transition to the new game, but again it's a blind move and if you view your prior spendings as an investment it makes it harder to move and start over. It would be like writing off a huge loss. (Often times the smartest thing, but the hardest to do in a real life market) However PWI is having sales so those that only spend a little each month are getting more for their dollar.

    This then leaves the BIG cash spenders. These people spend a ton on the game and sales benefit them the most. They may have more disposable income then the rest (or their parents might) so it doens't matter to them. They are on top in this game and they aren't leaving to a game that puts them on ever par with everyone else and makes them start over. They love flying around with their gigantic epeen hanging out. They aren't going to be a level 1 noob ever again. They prefer to be a level 9x noob.

    So there you have it. Non-cash shop users aren't paying RL money. Never have never will. PWI is calling your bluff and raising the stakes. They're not worried at all. You're nothing but talk and a badge. You may leave for a week, but you'll be back. The small cash shoppers most likely will stay. The sales keep it intriguing enough. The BIG cash shoppers are staying put. There you have it. PWI genius corporation that doesn't give a rat's **** about it's players so long as the rake in the dough. As someone who believes in capitalism I applaud you.

    you sir, just raised my IQ a couple points, kudos to you


    +1 for win post
    Less QQ more Pew Pewb:thanks

    "Don't argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience."

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Rumble - Harshlands
    Rumble - Harshlands Posts: 211 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    lol. Thanks. You know I had been thinking about all this for some time. Getting upset by the lack of response from GMs about the specific issue at hand, by the blatant lie by Xarfox (that was bad - he'll of course lock the thread instead of standing up and tacking it like a man that he was caught. Don't get me wrong. I understand he has to play the calm the masses role. It's his job, but he stretched the truth way too far and lost credibility), by the constant sales and obvious lack of comprehensive or listening skills by the PWI authorities.

    Then it hit me. They are geniuses. Plain and simple. Sharks, but geniuses none the less. You almost have to stand back in awe and pay homage to them for it. Well played. Well played. As a CS user I guess now I'll sit back, shut up and enjoy the sales. This train is leaving the station and I need to be on board.
  • exent
    exent Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Options
    Rumble - Harshlands wrote: »
    Then it hit me. They are geniuses. Plain and simple. Sharks, but geniuses none the less. You almost have to stand back in awe and pay homage to them for it. Well played. Well played. As a CS user I guess now I'll sit back, shut up and enjoy the sales. This train is leaving the station and I need to be on board.

    LOL, b:victory

    This is, and always have been, a capitalist game. All ''virtual economies'' are. Those who complain are just angry greedy players who want stuff from the cashshop without having to pay the price (with zen OR coins). Like you said, PWI don't care much for them.

    I, myself, have never put a dime in PWI, and have quite a few millions, high-end gear, gold pieces, fashion, mounts, flying devices, charms, etc, and all of that, without scamming anyone. Anyone can do it.

    I am thinking about putting a few bucks in this game, not because I need more stuff, but because i admire the way they made this game I want to encourage them (although I know they don't ''need'' my money lol).

    Anyway, to those who say they ''need'' stuff from the boutique but they can't afford it now (cause you don't want to use real life money and you failed at making coins), I can only say that there is NOTHING in the boutique that you NEED to play. You just forgot how to have fun without it...
  • Miugre - Heavens Tear
    Miugre - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,390 Arc User
    edited September 2009
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    And yet despite all that, the GMs HAVE said that they value the non-paying players. In this very thread, xarfox said that they watch the gold market closely. Now, everyone here has had various amounts of trouble believing xarfox... but I, for one, intend to hold PWE's toes to the fire until they either fix gold or release a statement saying they were lying. :P

    As for what you "need" to play - no, you don't NEED any of it to play, but we've continually seen how much of the game expects you to get it. How do you play in a TW without charms? How do you feasibly play on Lost City or Harshlands without the occasional guardian angel? Actually the biggest example I can think of is storage - I couldn't imagine not having a maxed-out inventory on at least one character. It seems pretty necessary if you ever craft things at all.

    Granted, PWI doesn't lock out huge portions of the game if you don't pay, or something... but the culture does still kind of demand you have certain CS items.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Yes, I'm still a stubborn holdout in favor of the old game. Haters gonna hate. ;]

    Other Active Characters:
    LigerKing (Barb), Girasole (BM), Shamsheer (Sin), ArborSoul (Mystic).
  • exent
    exent Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Options
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    And yet despite all that, the GMs HAVE said that they value the non-paying players. In this very thread, xarfox said that they watch the gold market closely. Now, everyone here has had various amounts of trouble believing xarfox... but I, for one, intend to hold PWE's toes to the fire until they either fix gold or release a statement saying they were lying. :P

    As for what you "need" to play - no, you don't NEED any of it to play, but we've continually seen how much of the game expects you to get it. How do you play in a TW without charms? How do you feasibly play on Lost City or Harshlands without the occasional guardian angel? Actually the biggest example I can think of is storage - I couldn't imagine not having a maxed-out inventory on at least one character. It seems pretty necessary if you ever craft things at all.

    Granted, PWI doesn't lock out huge portions of the game if you don't pay, or something... but the culture does still kind of demand you have certain CS items.

    The GMs care about the fact that their game stays F2P, cause they attrack more players that way. They are not doing this for free you know, they NEED people to pay, so buying zen still has to give you an edge...

    And about that Edge, no, it's not necessary.

    You don't HAVE to do TW. And even if you wanna do it, you don't get your access denied cause you don't have a charm.

    You don't HAVE to play on a PvP server. Everyone is fully aware of the consequences of dying without dolls.

    You don't HAVE to max out your inventory. Get some friends to craft stuff for you and pay them.

    All you are saying is more exemples of people wanting the cake and eat it to. Since when is a game fun ONLY when you are better than everyone else? You wanna play for free, you can, just don't expect to be quite as good as the guy who spends money. Remeber, he is paying so that you can play, he SHOULD get something more...
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