Charging for Ressurection

tenbatsu

Being smart or being a-hole-ish?

Assuming you have a 50% to 90% exp save revive. Enough to be worthwhile.

Haven't done it myself in game, but have thought about it. Just wanna gauge what community opinion in this game is for this practice. It's common in other games with similar exp loss system and specialized revive skills to charge for the service.

I'm pretty sure it's possible to trade while dead. Tested opening a trade on a corpse and was rejected by the player itself. Haven't actually made a trade to prove it.

Eliatron - Lost City

Totally agree. Clerics should charge for revive. Most of the time you use it on ppl who are not from your guild ! And we you die no one revive you.
So Im into a big YES into charging for revive xD

Onishi - Heavens Tear

Point of view of cleric: perfectly fair, you did spend a crapload of spirit and gold on a skill that will in no way shape or form benefit you ever, only the people who are revived by you gain any benefit at all from what you spent

Point of view from a dead barbarian: WTF, that jackass wants to charge me to do what his class does naturally? Not unless he is going to pay my armor bill after the next FB run.


___________________________________________________________________

In summery, yes it is reasonable and not really being an *******. However, most people will still think you are one, and to be honest, since you can't trade until after the person is alive, 95% are going to just run off with the res.

foostermonk

get a grip.

how are you ever gonna get paid to charge a res.

if you dont want to res... then they guy will just have to go back to town and hold ALL of you up for 20 minutes while he runs back to join the group

its counter productive to charge for a res and you wont get paid anyhow.

Didi i mention you hold back the whole group till the guy gets back jsut cause of your greed?

not to mention the cleric should prevent most deaths to begin with and the newly resurectd player.. how are you going to FORCE him to pay? you cant . you will all get ripped off and there aint nothing to do about it.

xlovex

Why would you charge for this.

Resurection, though a costly skill, doesn't use mats or stones or whatever to cast.

Why did you make a priest in the first place?

To save money? To make money? b:laughb:laugh

naw, it was to help people, because you liked support, or, ionno, maybe you liked blowing stuff up, but enjoyed your heal too.

I think charging would just make the community a bit more sour as a whole.

Everything would turn businesslike, and soon enough people will be charging to pull, to tank, to dd, everything.

You don't see archers asking people to give them money for arrows.

You don't see tanks asking for money for repairs, heiros (well maybe heiros).

And if people did do that, didn't it really ruin your day?

Games are supposed to be -fun- and -relaxing-, not so formal.

EDIT: I think its cool if you ask your party for some donations of herbs, or coins, for your heiro and mp consumption. I just don't think forcing people is gonna do anything.

deshin

I can't really see charging for a res but then the person getting the res should also not care what level res he is getting. The lvl 1 will restore the same hp as the lvl 10 the only difference is the death penalty. In effect asking for a level 10 res is asking for a angel.

If they have a angel then a lvl 1 res is as good any other. I can't see why a cleric would not always give a level 1 res it cost little mana and you have to take the skill to get higher skills on the tree.

I would say if you get a cleric that gives you a lvl 10 res you need to thank they very very much because they gave a huge amount of their gold and spirit points to save you a 30k angel.

Onishi - Heavens Tear

deshin wrote: »

I can't really see charging for a res but then the person getting the res should also not care what level res he is getting. The lvl 1 will restore the same hp as the lvl 10 the only difference is the death penalty. In effect asking for a level 10 res is asking for a angel.

If they have a angel then a lvl 1 res is as good any other. I can't see why a cleric would not always give a level 1 res it cost little mana and you have to take the skill to get higher skills on the tree.

I would say if you get a cleric that gives you a lvl 10 res you need to thank they very very much because they gave a huge amount of their gold and spirit points to save you a 30k angel.

Well unless there's a method that I don't know of, you can't chose what level of res you give someone, if you have level 10 res, every res you cast is level 10. If there were a way to do it I would love it, #1 because when someone dies from their own stupidity, I would really like to be able to make the punishment of death sting more, but not have to punish one of my friends who also died for that idiot's mistake. Also I would love to be able to scale it back so that res didn't cost me 885 MP in TW, when XP loss is irrelevant.

Also those talking about party roles, I don't think the person is referring to people in your party. I think he's talking more along the lines of if you are in an area and you hear that familiar "Is there a cleric in the area" yell from a corpse.

Eliatron - Lost City

To those who say Cleric "help" I DONT DID A CLERIC TO HELP. Just to play a role. When I die no one gives me a doll, no one gives 30k for buying one. And I have to say, if I die is because Tank couldnt take aggro, archer overaggro, wiz too... clerics dont usually die because they made a mistake. Its very rare.
Besides is not nice to die, lose 2.5% and when you revive someone theres not even a big THANK YOU!
We should be able to chose res level, but that wont be possible, cant be modified.
It also different... archers dont ask for money for arrows, bolts as barbs dont ask for repair, well, as I dont ask myself for pots and hiero... so I dont see the difference.
If I took res, Ok, was my choice, but Im making your life easier, paying a little fee is not that bad if you considerer the time I saved you.

Onishi - Heavens Tear

Eliatron - Lost City wrote: »

To those who say Cleric "help" I DONT DID A CLERIC TO HELP. Just to play a role. When I die no one gives me a doll, no one gives 30k for buying one. And I have to say, if I die is because Tank couldnt take aggro, archer overaggro, wiz too... clerics dont usually die because they made a mistake. Its very rare.
Besides is not nice to die, lose 2.5% and when you revive someone theres not even a big THANK YOU!
We should be able to chose res level, but that wont be possible, cant be modified.
It also different... archers dont ask for money for arrows, bolts as barbs dont ask for repair, well, as I dont ask myself for pots and hiero... so I dont see the difference.
If I took res, Ok, was my choice, but Im making your life easier, paying a little fee is not that bad if you considerer the time I saved you.

Never said it wasn't fair to charge a res, was saying you better be prepared to give that 10 minute speech every time someone dies, and still be considered a jerk, and more likely then not even after your 10 minute speech, the dead person is still going to run off without paying if it's outside of a party, and inside a party most likely no-one is going to back you on it.

Fair yes.
Fair from an outside point of view, no.

Psynopsis - Heavens Tear

Erm...if you wanna charge for a res, remind me why you even chose to play a cleric in the first place? After all, being a cleric pertty much means that you will just be a support class, a helper class.

Try running around and randomly buffing for reviving people. They'll be grateful for your generosity 9/10 times.

miago

in my opinion

charging for a res is okay.

A) random person asking and you don't really want to

it doesn't bother you if they port to town

C) they are not in your guild (since the main reason for getting it is for guildies)

D) if you have a high lvl res


it's funny no one even asked how much he would charge.

I don't think 5k-10k is to much to ask for a lvl 10 res...since the person would've spent 30k using an angel. they just saved 20k

while a res of low lvl maybe would be worth 500 coins.

to be honest I think I could get my guild mates to give that no problem if it wasn't my fault they died,

not to mention what happens when the priest dies....they have to port to town...group has to wait

Ermosa - Heavens Tear

then maybe u should pay for buffs too?

Eliatron - Lost City

Buffs avoid you to die, while res only benefits the one whos dead.
Im not saying that we should charge always, but I lvl res for my guild mates, not for anyone around... actually if you consider TW, I would almost be benefit from them to dying, because that means they had lost importante xp and slow down their lvl up.
My major problem is when I die because tank couldnt take aggro, and I just lose all my xp goin town If I dont have dolls.
Also ppl think that because theres a cleric they can go suicide killing every mob.
And oh, how many time Im left behind (slow speed) and some mob start chasing me or one slow member too and no one even notice that were being hit by some mob.
Most ppl dont look at bar in squad section

miago

Ermosa - Heavens Tear wrote: »

then maybe u should pay for buffs too?

the difference is buffs benefit you as well as everyone else.

but Ressurection will NEVER benefit you.

you HAVE TO lvl buffs cause you want to buff your own self

you DON'T have to lvl ressurection

and you don't have to get the 1hr party buffs, unless you're lazy...you can stick to the 30min solo buffs

/haiku/ - Lost City

Post f'd up and sent twice. Delete please. xd

/haiku/ - Lost City

Charging for res in this game isn't as smart as it is in others. If you wanna charge for your res, guess what, people just won't have your res. They'll call a guildmate, a friend, etc to res them, and all you do is make yourself look like a jerk where you could have made a friend to quest, grind, trumble, boss, or even HH/FB with. Sure, it's reasonable for you, but the majority just wouldn't count on you for anything / presume you're a greedy jerk.

Besides, if charging for res actually caught on in this game, everyone would start charging for their own specific class abilities (as someone said earlier). BMs charging for stunlock, barbs charging for aggro control/repair bills/tanking, archers charging for ammo, wizards charging for backup DD/backup healing, venos have a plethora of things they can charge for (pulling, tanking, taming, transferring chi, amplify damage, etc).. if everyone were charging for their services.. who would be left to pay? What of zhen, where everyone spends a large amount of money in the first place? I doubt it'd catch on in PW, but if it did, the results would be unpleasant for all.

If you want recognition for ressing someone, res randoms. It's not like the tank who just died and desperately needs to regain aggro after being revived has time to say thank you. In those situations, such an act benefits everyone.. including yourself. It's simply expected of you because if you don't do it, everyone including yourself will suffer. Most randoms I res/buff on my cleric say thanks, even if they asked me for them instead of me just giving them. If you're worried about dying so much, make more cleric friends to do things with so you can res each other.

1hr buffs = for zhen parties. The DDs waste MP charm attacking nothing while you take down bubble, rebuff everyone, get your spark up again, and then re-bubble. They have uses other than just "for lazy people".

Psynopsis - Heavens Tear

/haiku/ - Lost City wrote: »

Charging for res in this game isn't as smart as it is in others. If you wanna charge for your res, guess what, people just won't have your res. They'll call a guildmate, a friend, etc to res them, and all you do is make yourself look like a jerk where you could have made a friend to quest, grind, trumble, boss, or even HH/FB with. Sure, it's reasonable for you, but the majority just wouldn't count on you for anything / presume you're a greedy jerk.

Besides, if charging for res actually caught on in this game, everyone would start charging for their own specific class abilities (as someone said earlier). BMs charging for stunlock, barbs charging for aggro control/repair bills/tanking, archers charging for ammo, wizards charging for backup DD/backup healing, venos have a plethora of things they can charge for (pulling, tanking, taming, transferring chi, amplify damage, etc).. if everyone were charging for their services.. who would be left to pay? What of zhen, where everyone spends a large amount of money in the first place? I doubt it'd catch on in PW, but if it did, the results would be unpleasant for all.

If you want recognition for ressing someone, res randoms. It's not like the tank who just died and desperately needs to regain aggro after being revived has time to say thank you. In those situations, such an act benefits everyone.. including yourself. It's simply expected of you because if you don't do it, everyone including yourself will suffer. Most randoms I res/buff on my cleric say thanks, even if they asked me for them instead of me just giving them. If you're worried about dying so much, make more cleric friends to do things with so you can res each other.

1hr buffs = for zhen parties. The DDs waste MP charm attacking nothing while you take down bubble, rebuff everyone, get your spark up again, and then re-bubble. They have uses other than just "for lazy people".

Finally, someone who has sense about them...

Tiament - Heavens Tear

Psynopsis - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Erm...if you wanna charge for a res, remind me why you even chose to play a cleric in the first place? After all, being a cleric pertty much means that you will just be a support class, a helper class.
Try running around and randomly buffing for reviving people. They'll be grateful for your generosity 9/10 times.

The bolded couldn't be more wrong. A cleric DOES NOT HAVE TO BE SUPPORT.I've almost killed a level 52 wizard as a nuke cleric.

However,I do not agree with charging for revive.If you don't want to revive for free,don't get it all except to get purify and then just leave it at level 1.Only people who are desperate will want it then.

Klath - Sanctuary

I've almost killed a level 52 wizard as a nuke cleric.

Unless the wizard is lv59+, they arent even a challenge for any clerics.
Try the same without using plume shot. It will make the fight somewhat less unbalanced.

@Topic
As much as i agree that revive is the ONLY skill that clerics dont get ANY benefit from it, charging for reviving wouldnt work at all. A best idea would give the cleric some xp/spirit for reviving people, even if on small amounts.

Arenamanager - Sanctuary

Klath - Sanctuary wrote: »

A best idea would give the cleric some xp/spirit for reviving people, even if on small amounts.

I agree.

I understand where those who wish to be paid for their services are coming from, but do not support clerics charging for revive. However, in the long run, I don't think reviving is entirely altruistic. Many societies and cultures today expects one to repay what one receives - obviously not everyone will do this, especially not over a game, but some will, albeit not instantly. This repayment may come in the form of the revived individual going out of their way to help the cleric with a quest, giving some free mats when the cleric is short a few, perhaps even free weapons after some form of friendship has developed. Other things which both the cleric and the revived may receive are not so easily measured, such as happiness, satisfaction, etc.

Note that the aforementioned are possibilities, not every case, most likely not even the majority of the time.

Psynopsis - Heavens Tear

Klath - Sanctuary wrote: »

As much as i agree that revive is the ONLY skill that clerics dont get ANY benefit from it, charging for reviving wouldnt work at all.

You couldn't be more wrong...

As a cleric, if you level up your res skill, if you ever die, YOUR XP loss is reduced by however much percent the skill says. For example, a level 2 res would reduce xp loss by 20%, and a level 8 res would reduce xp loss by 80%. I've noticed it when I was dual leveling my barbarian and cleric: whenever my barbarian died, and I hit the "go to town" button, I always lost 5% xp; with my cleric, whenever I hit the "go to town" button, I tend to lose only 2-3% xp.

Nostic - Heavens Tear

Psynopsis - Heavens Tear wrote: »

You couldn't be more wrong... As a cleric, if you level up your res skill, if you ever die, YOUR XP loss is reduced by however much percent the skill says.

Don't be so quick to tell people they're wrong (especially when he was right). The XP you lose from dying reduces as your level and cultivation goes up. Your revive is not the reason you are losing less XP. I have a low level revive and have not lost anything close to 5% XP on a death in the past 30 or so levels. Read some of the threads on dying to see.

As for charging for revives, I'd never charge a party member or guildmate. But the same thought occurred to me too when grinding on scrolls, and random people repeatedly PM me to stop what I am doing to revive then or buff. And when somebody asks you to go all the way from the Swamps to Dragon Wilderness just to revive them, I wouldn't go unless they pay teleport fees. But no, I don't charge, I just say no.

Eliatron - Lost City

My point of charging for res comes more about this.
Lets say we go to HH... ok, everyone benefits from it, of course. Generally chars die (speaking particularly in my case) die because they aggro too many mobs, or the barb only aggro ONE mob and of course im the one running all over HH trying to stay alive, knowing the consecuences of dying. If i mantain alive and barb or whatever char die they "penalty" is only a bit, while if I die because of their mistake my penalty is XP or a doll... THATS my point. Why do I have to pay for mistakes of others? Ok, you learn not to party them anymore, of course, but meanwhile you just lost a doll o some very earned difficult xp.
Ive seen way too many partys (with +60) not caring about the cleric, just running and leaving me back. I have to stop every three second asking speed buffs or just wait for mana, while I always considerer most of variables (including the limited duration of Magic Shell, checking every single char). So if I do my work WELL, I do request the same from others... but that dont happen, I die and I have to be the PAYING for the mistakes of others???
Hope Ill make my point. I dont pretend charging for every res, but just dont make me die. XP is the most valuable thing in this game, yes, you risk it when going to parties, but is not always fair when you die because of others and have to lose all of it.

Klath - Sanctuary

Lets say we go to HH... ok, everyone benefits from it, of course. Generally chars die (speaking particularly in my case) die because they aggro too many mobs, or the barb only aggro ONE mob and of course im the one running all over HH trying to stay alive, knowing the consecuences of dying. If i mantain alive and barb or whatever char die they "penalty" is only a bit, while if I die because of their mistake my penalty is XP or a doll... THATS my point. Why do I have to pay for mistakes of others? Ok, you learn not to party them anymore, of course, but meanwhile you just lost a doll o some very earned difficult xp.
Ive seen way too many partys (with +60) not caring about the cleric, just running and leaving me back. I have to stop every three second asking speed buffs or just wait for mana, while I always considerer most of variables (including the limited duration of Magic Shell, checking every single char). So if I do my work WELL, I do request the same from others... but that dont happen, I die and I have to be the PAYING for the mistakes of others???

Just let them die.
After 10 deaths, they will learn to pay attention on the cleric (or will leave the squad, eitherway you win).
I dont heal people that got adds and havent controlled them yet, so they learn how to play, with death or not.

On squads with people you dont know, dont bother, put your safety above all others. If they die, it was for their own stupidity and they will recover xp when revived, so dont try bothering about keeping everyone alive. Even if the tanker dies, you wont draw aggro unless you have already healed him before he died, but when that happens, usually other people will have attacked and draw the aggro themselves, let all die and you will be safe to revive everyone and throw at their face "pay attention next time".

goronath

I would also agree that clerics must put their own safety above others. I consider it a part of a cleric's job to stay alive when everything goes to hell. So long as the cleric lives the rest of the party can be revived but if the cleric dies then the party must wait. Therefore if the cleric of a party dies then it is in part the failure of that cleric to prioritize their own safety.

There is no excuse for trying to charge for a rez to your own party since providing that rez is part of your job in that party. If a cleric in my party tried to charge me for a rez that would deserve an instant blacklist.

I see no problem charging strangers that are not part of your party though as this is perfectly normal in most MMOs and they are paying for your time.

Eliatron - Lost City

Im usually so inside my role that forget my safety :P
Im not dying that much now, you aggro, you die xD. Generally that happens bcs players dont know how to handle their chars, or tanks suxs, or just everyone goes suicide because they have a healer, or against a boss they dont even care about taking a pot!
But not dying is now my priority xD

Lucentshadow - Heavens Tear

Yeah well here's the error in your logic. BMs, Wizards, and tanks usually do NOT go out of their way to help you kill mini-bosses and whatever. Venos do NOT help pull away mobs when you're under attack. The only time they do this is if you're in a party with them and are working towards a common goal. In that case every class has their own role they have to fulfill. With that logic, a cleric with high level res is absolutely entitled to charging res for anyone out of their guild/party. The money spent on leveling the spell, the mana cost, and the time spent to walk and cast the dead person is worth more than an Angel. Clerics have every right to ask for a LITTLE bit of cash for saving you 5% or less. While logically it makes sense, I personally don't do it just because I feel nice =D.

/haiku/ - Lost City wrote: »

Charging for res in this game isn't as smart as it is in others. If you wanna charge for your res, guess what, people just won't have your res. They'll call a guildmate, a friend, etc to res them, and all you do is make yourself look like a jerk where you could have made a friend to quest, grind, trumble, boss, or even HH/FB with. Sure, it's reasonable for you, but the majority just wouldn't count on you for anything / presume you're a greedy jerk.

Besides, if charging for res actually caught on in this game, everyone would start charging for their own specific class abilities (as someone said earlier). BMs charging for stunlock, barbs charging for aggro control/repair bills/tanking, archers charging for ammo, wizards charging for backup DD/backup healing, venos have a plethora of things they can charge for (pulling, tanking, taming, transferring chi, amplify damage, etc).. if everyone were charging for their services.. who would be left to pay? What of zhen, where everyone spends a large amount of money in the first place? I doubt it'd catch on in PW, but if it did, the results would be unpleasant for all.

If you want recognition for ressing someone, res randoms. It's not like the tank who just died and desperately needs to regain aggro after being revived has time to say thank you. In those situations, such an act benefits everyone.. including yourself. It's simply expected of you because if you don't do it, everyone including yourself will suffer. Most randoms I res/buff on my cleric say thanks, even if they asked me for them instead of me just giving them. If you're worried about dying so much, make more cleric friends to do things with so you can res each other.

1hr buffs = for zhen parties. The DDs waste MP charm attacking nothing while you take down bubble, rebuff everyone, get your spark up again, and then re-bubble. They have uses other than just "for lazy people".

Kusaku - Lost City

.. it would be nice if u got a little bit of exp and game gold from rezing... about as much as a creep or 2 maby

it uses anough mana to mow down a decent selection of creeps anyay...

and it takes ages to cast.

i dont realy want to charge people just get a bit from the game engine itself u no ^^

Wwing - Heavens Tear

I sometimes request MP pots equivalent to the MP usage, for example, lvl 8 revive costs a 800MP pot. But putting in mind, this is donation-style.
Revive lvl 10 is quite costly to get, and clerics cannot use revive on him/herself.
I guess this is a really win-win situation.

Erinis - Heavens Tear

Psynopsis - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Erm...if you wanna charge for a res, remind me why you even chose to play a cleric in the first place? After all, being a cleric pertty much means that you will just be a support class, a helper class.

Try running around and randomly buffing for reviving people. They'll be grateful for your generosity 9/10 times.

Reviving someone close is one thing, but how about getting whispered for revive sometime every 10 minutes and from ppl that takes you several minutes get there ? In this case you spend hours just running arund map and paying a lot for teleports if wana get there faster ?

I usualy revive for free even ppl not in guild IF they are close (guild even if they are not), but if i have to run over half map and spend 20k for teleports i would like to get some compensation. Not mentioning i am not allways eager left everything i do and run to res someon.

So if you are next to me i ress buff for free, but if you want me to spent money and time to get to you i expect some compensation unless you are on my friend/guild list.

When i was in my 40's i got whisper from some noob barb for res so i spent 5 minutes getting there and res him and asked if he could help me kill some tough meele mob for my quest (they was next to him) and he not even thanks for revive but also told me "srry i dont have time" and left.

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

tenbatsu wrote: »

Being smart or being a-hole-ish?

Assuming you have a 50% to 90% exp save revive. Enough to be worthwhile.

Haven't done it myself in game, but have thought about it. Just wanna gauge what community opinion in this game is for this practice. It's common in other games with similar exp loss system and specialized revive skills to charge for the service.

I'm pretty sure it's possible to trade while dead. Tested opening a trade on a corpse and was rejected by the player itself. Haven't actually made a trade to prove it.

Bad idea. The money you make will be minimal to the money you loose from ticking people off. Not many people will want to party with you. Word gets around. On the flip-side...if you are known to be helpful and giving then odd things like people you've never met handing you stuff for free or grouping you to kill that Uber boss come out of the wood-work. How much is that worth?