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Official Feedback Thread: Great Weapon Fighter Changes
gentlemancrush
Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 445Cryptic Developer › Cryptic Developer
Greetings Adventurers!
With some changes coming to the way Power interacts with player powers, we thought this was a good time to fix some issues with the Great Weapon Fighter and try to better define his Destroyer and Sentinel trees.
Overview
Deep Gash and Student of the Sword were both fairly problematic feats, being that they were very easy to reach, and Deep Gash was receiving way more damage than was ever intended. In some cases it could make up nearly 30% of the total damage output to some Great Weapon Fighters. Given this we wanted to fix this bug and move a lot of that damage deeper down the Destroyer tree to make them a much stronger DPS presence and provide them a more clear play cycle that rewarded smart use of powers and Unstoppable. To accomplish that goal we have made the following changes.
With some changes coming to the way Power interacts with player powers, we thought this was a good time to fix some issues with the Great Weapon Fighter and try to better define his Destroyer and Sentinel trees.
Overview
Deep Gash and Student of the Sword were both fairly problematic feats, being that they were very easy to reach, and Deep Gash was receiving way more damage than was ever intended. In some cases it could make up nearly 30% of the total damage output to some Great Weapon Fighters. Given this we wanted to fix this bug and move a lot of that damage deeper down the Destroyer tree to make them a much stronger DPS presence and provide them a more clear play cycle that rewarded smart use of powers and Unstoppable. To accomplish that goal we have made the following changes.
- Feats: Steely Defense: This feat now correctly grants 4/8/12/16/20% of your Defense as Power.
- Feats: Deep Gash: This feat no longer gains additional damage from the power that applies it.
- Feats: Deep Gash: This feat can no longer crit. This feat now applies a bleed that ticks for 4/8/12/16/20% of your Power (up from 3/6/9/12/15%).
- Feats: Deep Gash: This power no longer ticks immediately upon application. New applications will not reset the tick timer. Additionally this DoT now lasts 6 seconds (up from 5). It still ticks 6 times total.
- Feats: Student of the Sword: REWORK Your Critical Strikes now lower your target's Damage Resistance to your attacks by 1/2/3/4/5%. This effect cannot stack.
- Feats: Executioner's Strike: Indomitable Battle Strike now deals a bonus 6/12/18/24/30% bonus damage as the target's health diminishes (up from 2/3/6/8/10%).
- Feats: Relentless Battle Fury: NEW This feat now grants an additional effect. Activating Roar, Takedown, or Battle Fury now grants you Relentless. Relentless causes you to ignore an additional 1/2/3/4/5% of the target's resistance. Relentless lasts 5 seconds.
- Feats: Focused Destroyer: This feat now grants an additional .5/1/1.5/2/2.5% bonus damage per stack of Destroyer.
- Feats: Battle Awareness: Savage advance now grants shorter cooldowns for 15 seconds (up from 5).
- Feats: Destroyer's Purpose: NEW This feat now grants an additional effect. When you deal damage while Unstoppable, you gain a stack of Destroyer's Purpose (max 20). Each stack of Destroyer's Purpose increases your damage by 1%. Destroyer's Purpose lasts 20 seconds.
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Comments
We need to collect as much feedback as possible on this so we can tweak the Destroyer and Sentinel trees to better fit their intended roles. Given that, we would like you to categorize and color code your feedback so we can sort it and act on it most effectively! Please use the below format to submit bugs/feedback.
Type: Bug/Feedback (Please only choose one)
Spec: (Please enter the spec that you are providing feedback for here)
Please use “Bold” face text for the Type & Spec then type your feedback in the body of your post. If you are listing a bug please have this text in RED, if you are posting an opinion or feedback please use BLUE.
(Concise Feedback & Screen Shots are much appreciated)
Examples:
Bug: Destroyer
Destroyer’s Purpose didn’t grant stacks while dealing damage.
Feedback: Sentinel
I feel like I don’t have enough tools to stay alive under fire now and it makes tanking too hard.
Please try to play for a few hours to get used to the feat changes. Thank you again for all your help Adventurers! We look forward to hearing back from you!
Chris “Gentleman_Crush” Meyer
Destroyer's Purpose: Each stack now grants 2% (up from 1%) and lasts 25 seconds (up from 20 seconds).
Edit: Is this going on preview today or next week?
Steely Defense - As far as I am aware, this was already correctly giving 20% of Defense as Power. However, it was bugged in the player's favor in that is also considered Defense originating from Buffs (as opposed to Equip only). Is the note therefore saying that this particular issue has been resolved or could you clarify this?
Deep Gash - New applications do not reset the tick timer. So if a target's timer is at 2 ticks remaining and you strike it critically, the debuff will still expire in 2 ticks and you have to strike it critically once the effect as expired in order to keep Deep Gash on it?
Student of the Sword / Relentless - do these apply to personal damage only, to damage from all GWFs or to damage from all party members
Feedback:
Generally I feel it is a good thing that Destroyer paragon tree is getting some attention, and the changes make certain feats which were often skipped almost entirely worth taking/maxing now: In particular Relentless Battle Fury, Focussed Destroyer (maxing).
I am not sure whether Battle Awareness and Executioner Style would become desirable, as Battle Awareness from last testing pre-Feywild Patch only applied to the duration of level 1 Slam as opposed to being tied to the level of Slam (note upgrading Slam increases its duration).
Executioner Style buffs Indomitable Battle Strike, which is a bread and butter encounter, but the additional damage based on missing health is probably going to be more useful in PvP than PvE. The other part of the power buffs Reaping Strike, which pretty much noone really uses because of how slow it is and because it tends to bug out (stuck animation) quite often.
The feat Staying Power likely will still be skipped as its effect is fairly lacklustre. A larger bonus to Weapon Master's Strike itself may make it more attractive, especially for Swordmaster Paragon GWFs?
I am also still concerned that the Iron Vanguard Paragon feats were moved positionally as opposed to logically from GF to GWF andvice versa for the Swordmaster ones. I refer to Staying Power ending up on Protector Tree, Grim Promise in Tactician Tree, Battle Trample to Sentinel Tree and Improved Reaction to Destroyer Tree. These should really be moved to the suitable tree (based on role) instead and was acknowledged as a bug many months ago.
In terms of Instigator, which is a fairly overlooked tree for GWF, it might be worthwhile looking at making Instigator's Vengeance more useful for a damage/utility tree. Taking no damage when Threat is based on the damage you deal makes this Feat almost never active.
I'd also like to reiterate that Iron Vanguard continues to allow the GWF to deal more damage than the Swordmaster tree contrary to the description of the Paragon Specialization. This is because the powers are based on % Weapon damage of the Guardian Fighter (who has lower Weapon damage than the Great Weapon Fighter)
This is in addition to the previous effect. And ideally it is going today, but if it doesn't, next week for sure!
In order of asking.
Deep Gash will have its duration extended to 6 seconds each time you crit, but the time to next tick doesn't get reset. This means that critting rapidly will not "clip" and prevent you from applying damage from this feat. Long Story Short is that More uptime = more good!
Student of the Sword is now personal. Other people will not benefit from it.
Lol, not with Split Shot getting a 45% damage reduction.
Neverwinter Census 2017
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here is link to see how much crtic chance eye gives to main cw encounters person who recorded it have only 1k crtic strike http://s916.photobucket.com/user/Yhztro/media/Test-1_zps33194cee.jpg.html as u can see opresive force ty to eye have over 70% crtic chance on avrage
what is then with thaum cw last feat who gives 15% damage boost for everyone if 9% damage buff from gwf was op then this is to
what is then with thaum cw last feat who gives 15% damage boost for everyone if 9% damage buff from gwf was op then this is to[/QUOTE]
SoS give you 15% more dmg at 3 stacks. Then 2(maybe more) SoS stacks add up. This result in 6 stacks a 30% dmg increase. Far away from your funny stated 9%.
Question to Devs:
Deep Gash ticks: How many DoT stacks can be achieved by attacks within this 6s before it's capped? Or is it capped like on live(mean 1 stack only within it's time)?
The changes look really good. ^^
So the feat will exactly proc every second as long as you crit?
Seems like Destro GWFs will still want to stack as much power as possible, but some might want to sell their Vorpals. Overall it was abundantly clear that the class needed the fixes, we'll see how it feels on the field.
SoS give you 15% more dmg at 3 stacks. Then 2(maybe more) SoS stacks add up. This result in 6 stacks a 30% dmg increase. Far away from your funny stated 9%.
Question to Devs:
Deep Gash ticks: How many DoT stacks can be achieved by attacks within this 6s before it's capped? Or is it capped like on live(mean 1 stack only within it's time)?
The changes look really good. ^^[/QUOTE]
not it dose not give u 15% more damage it is is 3% per stack
Deep Gash does not stack. Neither does Student of the Sword.
Both of them are intended to either be on the target or not on the target. Some of the ramping up style play they had has been moved down into the capstone feat in the Destroyer tree (Destroyer's Purpose). And SoS shouldn't really be compared to Assailing Force (15% resistance debuff while affected by Conduit of Ice) seeing as Student of the Sword is a T1 paragon feat as opposed to a capstone paragon feat
Wizards will be getting looked at eventually as well, but with some changes to stats we *had* to fix Deep Gash right now and felt this was a really good time to improve the Destroyer Tree and make being a DPS GWF feel like more of a commitment.
Currently Student of the Sword currently reduces the opponent's defence by 15% per crit = 45% at the max of 3 stacks. This converts to a damage boost of 9% overall.
We are searching for slave labor, will pay with food from our farm!
u missed instigator path everyone is destroyer allready while almost noone use instigator
Something I'd like to see though is that Sentinel should become less tanky (passively), because currently you can tank (in the classical sense) with ease compared to what any Guardian Fighter can do.
Then again, even Destroyers and Instigators can tank (in the classical sense) better than Guardian Fighters, but that is due to high Damage coupled with the way Lifesteal works.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?627261-GWF-and-confessions-Feedback
Just make sure you are going to tackle the ArPen and Shard issues (at least). Otherwise you'll be balancing bugs.
Yes please tell me the name of a competitive cw that uses CoI in PVP. Keep talking about gwf cause you clearly know nothing about other classes in pvp.
We have not ignored Threatening Rush. We looked at the issue of it for quite a while but couldn't come up with a solution any of us were really happy with, and we are still monitoring the situation on it. With the changes to Deep Gash and moving a lot of that damage deeper down the Destroyer tree we hope to see the trade off for damage be much higher. This means Sentinels will be dealing substantially less damage and while it can be frustrating for a class to feel as quick as the GWF feels with Threatening Rush, we have toned down a good chunk of what was causing that up front burst (Deep Gash ticks critting and benefitting from Power in ways they shouldn't). Hopefully this makes them more squishy for the damage they deal and feel much less frustrating and overbearing.
That said, we are still strongly considering how to adjust this power so it doesn't provide the incredible utility and speed it does now, but we have not yet decided on a course of action yet.
so power will not give bonus damage to deep gash ticks anymore? dose this means 300 damage less per tick on some 7-7,5k power gwf
Is Threatening Rush still able to proc Deep Gash on all marked targets if it crits?
Right now, a 40k hit will apply a greater bleed than a 20k hit. It's changed to a flat DoT that's unaffected by the damage of the power that caused it.
I know some who play the class mentioned a 3 second cooldown. That kinda defeats the purpose of an "at-will" though. In a way I always thought they needed something new and different and leave that skill with Guardian Fighters. But that is just my 2 cents.
Therefore, I believe the problem you need to fix is the ability to hit sprint mid-animation on any ability. Perhaps by holding the at-will, you lock shift completely, and you fix all the animation cancelling that is possible by GWF.
I'm not a big fan of these changes so far and it makes me want to respec if things go the way you're presenting them. I hope you will give us a free respec to be able to switch over since some of the feats will be nerfed a bit.
Uhm. Tanky HRs exist..?
Yes the ones with ~35k life. Even if they are too bad to dodge my full combo with daily does like 25% of their life. Its like they have 100% deflect. Even GWFs with full rank 10s die 3x faster than a hr.
I'm not sure where the GWR are getting the idea that HR are tanky, thats the second GWF that has claimed such. I look at the DR and dmg of a GWF with envy. Their encounter powers typically do a great deal more dmg then mine do and half of mine are semi-worthless buffs.
The same group of enemies that a GWF can wade into and slaughter will kill a HR in nothing if they reach him. In dungeons it can be even worst.