You can't seriously think this of Paladins, I'm not a fan of nerfing either, but, come on, at some point too much is too much.
Ok, so you're saying Pallies are too OP because of the bubble? Cool, so lets say you have maxed your current character and dont need the bubble cuz... you're OP. If you think you're OP and dont need a bubble pally, go do the stronghold dragons or anything that will one hit kill you and your whole party no matter how super tanky you are.
You can't seriously think this of Paladins, I'm not a fan of nerfing either, but, come on, at some point too much is too much.
Ok, so you're saying Pallies are too OP because of the bubble? Cool, so lets say you have maxed your current character and dont need the bubble cuz... you're OP. If you think you're OP and dont need a bubble pally, go do the stronghold dragons or anything that will one hit kill you and your whole party no matter how super tanky you are.
Please think before saying such things.
I've been in a fight with Traven Blackdagger where the ENTIRE floor was covered in fire. No one toke damage, period, because of... guess what?
It's broken. No power should render your party immune to all damage for an entire fight.
0
klangeddinMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 882Arc User
You can't seriously think this of Paladins, I'm not a fan of nerfing either, but, come on, at some point too much is too much.
Ok, so you're saying Pallies are too OP because of the bubble? Cool, so lets say you have maxed your current character and dont need the bubble cuz... you're OP. If you think you're OP and dont need a bubble pally, go do the stronghold dragons or anything that will one hit kill you and your whole party no matter how super tanky you are.
Please think before saying such things.
You're the one that should do some thinking, first of all because it's not just the bubble (there's also the problem of how they can alternate it with Heroism while keeping both up at the same time in certain situations that makes them pretty much immortal). Healadins are over the top as well with their insane healing (PvE or PvP) leaving DCs in the dust in this department. I play one healadin (that totally trumps my poor DC so much I even stopped playing her entirely, since I wanted her to be a pure healer, not a dps buffbot hybrid.) and also on my GF tank I notice the difference immediately in fights like Orcus when there's a healadin rather than a priest. I'm sure that on avarage (not including the super groups that want to finish everythign as fast as possible and so want Into The Fray for dps boost reasons), other players notice the difference between GFs and Paladins as well. And second, I have done all content without paladins, so it's not like they're needed at all costs anyway, but still they reduce the difficulty to nearly zero for everything. Paladins need a nerf, simple as that.
Dont you remeber what happen 1 year ago? Yeah Mod 6 EE. What happen then? 50-80% of people leave What will happen if the same kind of mess is done to classes in general?
I have played Dc, OP, CW and GWF so far i can relate to many of the things said here.
DC: Does his job, but ap gain is kinda overpowered even if you dont built for it.
Cw: This class is nice (animation powers looks) but some improvemenst should be done on control . After all is his freaking name CONTROL wizard.
OP: I have a bulwark the less popular tree path as far as i know and i dont need bubble to do most of the content the only exeption is orcus somehow bubble does the trick. (while this shouldnt be the case cuz i should have enough dmg resis to take him yet he still gets me in 3 hits . I have 40% dmg resis default, rank 4 aura of truth, aura of protection and circle of power that without using shift/block)
GWF: does his job as well, doing high damage and being squishy, now i know that having high gear you can solo pretty much all dungeons (Lazalia im looking at you) but that doesnt mean all have the gear to do that. Also they nerf our temp hitpoints so im not sure some of the solo runs can be done without a companion tanking now. The difference on dps makes sense really, a berserkers-like class charm is to do high damage take that and whats left? yeah nothing, no more gwfs needed anymore.
The problem is the balance, nobody wants the 5 cw parties back, or whatever class gets to be op after their "changes". I would prefer classes get boosted instead of nerfed
Example:
Dc: improve some of their healing on other paths and self buffs and reduce their ap gain. Too many ways to get ap that dailies doesnt feel like dailies anymore, they are encounters at the moment.
Cw: Improve their control and their damage, reduce some of their buffs.
Op: Now this is tricky, bubble should be the one changed but making it give dmg resis wouldn make it different from a gf powers. I suggest it only affects the tank. Other idea is to only give chances to evade attacks, when you dont dodge well it wont have and effect so it it'll be ugly. Improve their defenses and reduce their temp hp a bit.
GWF: Reduce their defenses more but improve them on iron vanguard and sentinel paths. I dont want them to reduce their damage cuz normally they go overboard with the nerfs, but i guess a -10% would be ok but more than that is just a hammer nerf to the point of the class.
Other issue is the bugs and crazy numbers people have thanks to bondings multiprocs or companions doing more damage than their "hero".
Ofc this has issues with pvp, but powers should work different there. Even artifacts and some feats already do, why cant encounters, class features and dailies be like that as well?
My humble opinion instead of a nerf make the classes shine for what they are.
aimeesellersMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 342Arc User
Never used the LM set... never wanted it.... my CW's DPS is just fine, and my control even better using the VT set. If they do nerf LM, it isnt the end of the world. Everyone knew this was coming... and its the main reason I never bothered with that set.
It's broken. No power should render your party immune to all damage for an entire fight.
I second that. Thanks to the OPs nobody plays with GFs anymore. OP became the synonym for a tank class. GF is just a buff siren nowadays. It makes people super-lazy.
However, on the other hand, bosses that deal 5xYourHP are not fun either imho.
Currently OPs are what holds the Epic content together nowadays. I can't imagine how hard it is for low item level players playing anything without an OP. Also, can't imagine eToS without OP/DC combo at the current state.
True Neutral
Left the Game due to heavy Damage Control & Missing Spanish Language
0
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
depending on the nature of the nerf, and any or lack of composition, this will squarly remove CWs as a dps option at all.. leaving them only one roll and that is as debuff/buffer mof rene.. many of us have no desire to do that.. I already do that roll with my dc.
Sadly i played my cw alot and conisdered it one of my main 3 classes give or take, I will have to invest heavily next double rp into one of the actual viable classes, reroll cw as a debuff and sit it for farming purposes.
with the tests we ran.. HR trapper does really well in terms of a DPS class with no reliance on the set. might be time to get your PEW PEW on guys.
RP is the harsh mistress here.. as the 10 million or so I inevested in the last couple months in my CW will be totally lost .
RIP CW class.. 4/1/2017.. it may remain, but as a poor shell of what we all played with the last 3 years give or take.
and no.. i have no desire really to rip it apart, buy a whole bunch of raidant and use power set ups either.. sad that you have to rely on a lockbox item to dps.
=P
0
shadowgod244Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 44Arc User
nerfing lostmouth set is just plain stupid all it boils down to is a people expecting to do the most damage with little to no effort and forgetting that each class has different areas it excels in. the other mistake in doing this is that it make ELOL worthless as the drops there a virtually valueless EXCEPT the horn so it cuts off another place to make diamonds in game
It's broken. No power should render your party immune to all damage for an entire fight.
I second that. Thanks to the OPs nobody plays with GFs anymore. OP became the synonym for a tank class. GF is just a buff siren nowadays. It makes people super-lazy.
However, on the other hand, bosses that deal 5xYourHP are not fun either imho.
Currently OPs are what holds the Epic content together nowadays. I can't imagine how hard it is for low item level players playing anything without an OP. Also, can't imagine eToS without OP/DC combo at the current state.
eToS is easier with a GF+DC O_o
Everything just melts and you never get hit. You only need OPs for lower ilvl parties.
Hey guys we are going to introduce some changes that we think are fixes and improvements, but just may be entirely game breaking. Oh and we are going to do it at the end of the day Friday. So, um, yeah, good luck with that. See ya Monday.... *minion mic drop*
Lostmauth' set needs a nerf. I bet that it will still be used as ever and since people already have 3/3 they will stick with it no matter what as long as it provides the best DPS options out of all sets. That's how it's going to be.
On the other hand the fact is that no item should be preferred for use by everyone because of how good they are. Such items nowadays are
- Lostmauth' Set bonus [3/3] used for it's unreasonable damage which is applied on [every] critical strike. - Sigil of the Devoted [Cleric] used for it's ability to refresh a Daily power.
For instance, Sigil of the Controller adds a somewhat completely baffling stat [ + 600 Control Resist ]. It should add the control bonus to the user. Or make it into a bonus for Combat Advantage. Switch the Control resist (and give it to the agile TRs to escape more swiftly) and give Combat Advantage bonuses to the Strategist masterminds called Control Wizards. TA-DA.
True Neutral
Left the Game due to heavy Damage Control & Missing Spanish Language
It's broken. No power should render your party immune to all damage for an entire fight.
I second that. Thanks to the OPs nobody plays with GFs anymore. OP became the synonym for a tank class. GF is just a buff siren nowadays. It makes people super-lazy.
However, on the other hand, bosses that deal 5xYourHP are not fun either imho.
Currently OPs are what holds the Epic content together nowadays. I can't imagine how hard it is for low item level players playing anything without an OP. Also, can't imagine eToS without OP/DC combo at the current state.
eToS is easier with a GF+DC O_o
Everything just melts and you never get hit. You only need OPs for lower ilvl parties.
In the contest of low item level players, as written :} hehehe
Still we can't deny that the GFs are not as prominent as before. Things are doable with a skilled GF, that's not what I'm arguing about tho
True Neutral
Left the Game due to heavy Damage Control & Missing Spanish Language
Meh, Cryptic is going to do what they're going to do...no real point speculating on the changes.
I do want acknowledge two things they did right: 1. forewarning 2. bringing the changes to preview so that, whatever they are, at least the changes are not bugged. Nothing better than a nerf that is supposed to be balanced by an addition, and the addition is bugged so that it doesn't work...
It's broken. No power should render your party immune to all damage for an entire fight.
I second that. Thanks to the OPs nobody plays with GFs anymore. OP became the synonym for a tank class. GF is just a buff siren nowadays. It makes people super-lazy.
However, on the other hand, bosses that deal 5xYourHP are not fun either imho.
Currently OPs are what holds the Epic content together nowadays. I can't imagine how hard it is for low item level players playing anything without an OP. Also, can't imagine eToS without OP/DC combo at the current state.
eToS is easier with a GF+DC O_o
Everything just melts and you never get hit. You only need OPs for lower ilvl parties.
In the contest of low item level players, as written :} hehehe
Still we can't deny that the GFs are not as prominent as before. Things are doable with a skilled GF, that's not what I'm arguing about tho
At lower ilvls you just run T1s and even there GF is better.
OPs are only prominent because of the DR bug and now that it's gone you'll gradually see more GFs.
I find that the dev team is doing the right things at the right times.....can you imagine all they have to read and then to turn and have to re-code or whatever to the game??? Massive amounts of stuff to do......just kick back , go with the flow and let them do their thing! I take it the fixes arent done yet, as I still cant log in??
You can't seriously think this of Paladins, I'm not a fan of nerfing either, but, come on, at some point too much is too much.
Ok, so you're saying Pallies are too OP because of the bubble? Cool, so lets say you have maxed your current character and dont need the bubble cuz... you're OP. If you think you're OP and dont need a bubble pally, go do the stronghold dragons or anything that will one hit kill you and your whole party no matter how super tanky you are.
Please think before saying such things.
You're the one that should do some thinking, first of all because it's not just the bubble (there's also the problem of how they can alternate it with Heroism while keeping both up at the same time in certain situations that makes them pretty much immortal). Healadins are over the top as well with their insane healing (PvE or PvP) leaving DCs in the dust in this department. I play one healadin (that totally trumps my poor DC so much I even stopped playing her entirely, since I wanted her to be a pure healer, not a dps buffbot hybrid.) and also on my GF tank I notice the difference immediately in fights like Orcus when there's a healadin rather than a priest. I'm sure that on avarage (not including the super groups that want to finish everythign as fast as possible and so want Into The Fray for dps boost reasons), other players notice the difference between GFs and Paladins as well. And second, I have done all content without paladins, so it's not like they're needed at all costs anyway, but still they reduce the difficulty to nearly zero for everything. Paladins need a nerf, simple as that.
Except my palidan does no where near the damage that GFs do. I have a guildie that goes into eDemo part 3 last and comes out first in dps, mostly because of one single attack. Sure palidans are unkillable in most situations, however that is because they need to be. A lot of the content is built around that. I am for giving GFs a buff, but first you would have to nerf a couple of there damage skills.
It's broken. No power should render your party immune to all damage for an entire fight.
I second that. Thanks to the OPs nobody plays with GFs anymore. OP became the synonym for a tank class. GF is just a buff siren nowadays. It makes people super-lazy.
However, on the other hand, bosses that deal 5xYourHP are not fun either imho.
Currently OPs are what holds the Epic content together nowadays. I can't imagine how hard it is for low item level players playing anything without an OP. Also, can't imagine eToS without OP/DC combo at the current state.
eToS is easier with a GF+DC O_o
Everything just melts and you never get hit. You only need OPs for lower ilvl parties.
In the contest of low item level players, as written :} hehehe
Still we can't deny that the GFs are not as prominent as before. Things are doable with a skilled GF, that's not what I'm arguing about tho
At lower ilvls you just run T1s and even there GF is better.
OPs are only prominent because of the DR bug and now that it's gone you'll gradually see more GFs.
I saw GFs only in premade builds. I wish I could say otherwise, but I can't. Thanks for info
True Neutral
Left the Game due to heavy Damage Control & Missing Spanish Language
0
klangeddinMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 882Arc User
Bubble down to 6 seconds, Heroism down to 10 seconds and Shield of Faith down to 12 seconds. Way to go Cryptic! =D
My opinions are my own. I do not work for PWE or Cryptic. - Forum Rules - Protector's Enclave Discord - I play on Xbox Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official. Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
0
putzboy78Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,950Arc User
edited April 2016
and yet no fix for:
the 2 new broken enchantments introduced in mod 9
can't deposit IWD vouchers into coffer
bugged powers that still aren't working (some since beta)
Why the F we need another form of RP to stack (yes looking at you shattered weapons)
The rings and overload enchants that have ruined PVP?
I will have to say that as a returning player, seeing the announcement of a future revamp of the 60-70 leveling is great news indeed. I've gotten some needless frustration on this grind as I've gone into Spinward Rise and doing those vigilance quests out there and there have been times I've wanted to toss something because I'm starting to get sick of grinding those quests (my toon is 68 btw) and doing the skirmishes just doesn't seem to reward as much exp (accordingly) as the vigilance quests. Thankfully, the Maze Engine boost is sitting in my bank waiting use come 69.
The changes seem good and well rounded, but the biggest change that I would like to see for my DC is the ability to target party members with a key. Not a complicated string of text that I have to macro in, but just f1, f2, f3, f4 so I can target the party members individually for heals and buffs. This would also be great on my pally and GF. The icons of other players are not clickable during combat because of the interface (at least I haven't figured out how to do it), so I'm reduced to just big buffs for the group, and those that run around usually don't get a heal. This is not problematic with a bubble pally, but now that the bubble is going to be diminished, individual group targeting would be welcome.
And the gist of the post they put up is....instead of redoing all other items they will ..........." it’s only one set bonus being touched, instead of many, so our ability to test the change is greatly improved. We don’t have to spend tons of time rebalancing the game. We don’t have to worry about upending the reward cycle for the entire game."
Sounds about good to me!
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scaredstraitMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 42Arc User
i guess there new / redo castle never turned out to easy for a good group !! so they gotta nerf some thing to make it harder ! as for bugs in the game the DEVS need to step back and have no new mods / events till all the old bugs are fixed ! it took how long to fix 6-7 boon in the dragon campaign ? or how about my bound to char ( not acct ) 2 slayer of xvim necks , that i get a reply from them they know thers a proplem but cant/ wont help me !! pff i know they can help but choose not to so now i need to spend bank on keys or pay about 400k AD per slayer neck to replace !
Comments
Cool, so lets say you have maxed your current character and dont need the bubble cuz... you're OP.
If you think you're OP and dont need a bubble pally, go do the stronghold dragons or anything that will one hit kill you and your whole party no matter how super tanky you are.
Please think before saying such things.
¨˜ˆ”°¹~•-.„¸ρℓαуιиg иєνєяωιитєя ѕιи¢є 2015¸„.-•~¹°”ˆ˜¨
It's broken. No power should render your party immune to all damage for an entire fight.
And second, I have done all content without paladins, so it's not like they're needed at all costs anyway, but still they reduce the difficulty to nearly zero for everything.
Paladins need a nerf, simple as that.
What happen then? 50-80% of people leave
What will happen if the same kind of mess is done to classes in general?
I have played Dc, OP, CW and GWF so far i can relate to many of the things said here.
DC: Does his job, but ap gain is kinda overpowered even if you dont built for it.
Cw: This class is nice (animation powers looks) but some improvemenst should be done on control . After all is his freaking name CONTROL wizard.
OP: I have a bulwark the less popular tree path as far as i know and i dont need bubble to do most of the content the only exeption is orcus somehow bubble does the trick. (while this shouldnt be the case cuz i should have enough dmg resis to take him yet he still gets me in 3 hits
. I have 40% dmg resis default, rank 4 aura of truth, aura of protection and circle of power that without using shift/block)
GWF: does his job as well, doing high damage and being squishy, now i know that having high gear you can solo pretty much all dungeons (Lazalia im looking at you) but that doesnt mean all have the gear to do that. Also they nerf our temp hitpoints so im not sure some of the solo runs can be done without a companion tanking now. The difference on dps makes sense really, a berserkers-like class charm is to do high damage take that and whats left? yeah nothing, no more gwfs needed anymore.
The problem is the balance, nobody wants the 5 cw parties back, or whatever class gets to be op after their "changes". I would prefer classes get boosted instead of nerfed
Example:
Dc: improve some of their healing on other paths and self buffs and reduce their ap gain. Too many ways to get ap that dailies doesnt feel like dailies anymore, they are encounters at the moment.
Cw: Improve their control and their damage, reduce some of their buffs.
Op: Now this is tricky, bubble should be the one changed but making it give dmg resis wouldn make it different from a gf powers. I suggest it only affects the tank. Other idea is to only give chances to evade attacks, when you dont dodge well it wont have and effect so it it'll be ugly. Improve their defenses and reduce their temp hp a bit.
GWF: Reduce their defenses more but improve them on iron vanguard and sentinel paths. I dont want them to reduce their damage cuz normally they go overboard with the nerfs, but i guess a -10% would be ok but more than that is just a hammer nerf to the point of the class.
Other issue is the bugs and crazy numbers people have thanks to bondings multiprocs or companions doing more damage than their "hero".
Ofc this has issues with pvp, but powers should work different there. Even artifacts and some feats already do, why cant encounters, class features and dailies be like that as well?
My humble opinion instead of a nerf make the classes shine for what they are.
Pandora's Misfits Guild Leader
It makes people super-lazy.
However, on the other hand, bosses that deal 5xYourHP are not fun either imho.
Currently OPs are what holds the Epic content together nowadays. I can't imagine how hard it is for low item level players playing anything without an OP.
Also, can't imagine eToS without OP/DC combo at the current state.
Sadly i played my cw alot and conisdered it one of my main 3 classes give or take, I will have to invest heavily next double rp into one of the actual viable classes, reroll cw as a debuff and sit it for farming purposes.
with the tests we ran.. HR trapper does really well in terms of a DPS class with no reliance on the set. might be time to get your PEW PEW on guys.
RP is the harsh mistress here.. as the 10 million or so I inevested in the last couple months in my CW will be totally lost .
RIP CW class.. 4/1/2017.. it may remain, but as a poor shell of what we all played with the last 3 years give or take.
and no.. i have no desire really to rip it apart, buy a whole bunch of raidant and use power set ups either.. sad that you have to rely on a lockbox item to dps.
=P
Everything just melts and you never get hit. You only need OPs for lower ilvl parties.
Hey guys we are going to introduce some changes that we think are fixes and improvements, but just may be entirely game breaking. Oh and we are going to do it at the end of the day Friday. So, um, yeah, good luck with that. See ya Monday.... *minion mic drop*
Well Endowed (Xbox)
On the other hand the fact is that no item should be preferred for use by everyone because of how good they are. Such items nowadays are
- Lostmauth' Set bonus [3/3] used for it's unreasonable damage which is applied on [every] critical strike.
- Sigil of the Devoted [Cleric] used for it's ability to refresh a Daily power.
For instance, Sigil of the Controller adds a somewhat completely baffling stat [ + 600 Control Resist ]. It should add the control bonus to the user. Or make it into a bonus for Combat Advantage. Switch the Control resist (and give it to the agile TRs to escape more swiftly) and give Combat Advantage bonuses to the Strategist masterminds called Control Wizards.
TA-DA.
Still we can't deny that the GFs are not as prominent as before. Things are doable with a skilled GF, that's not what I'm arguing about tho
I do want acknowledge two things they did right:
1. forewarning
2. bringing the changes to preview so that, whatever they are, at least the changes are not bugged. Nothing better than a nerf that is supposed to be balanced by an addition, and the addition is bugged so that it doesn't work...
OPs are only prominent because of the DR bug and now that it's gone you'll gradually see more GFs.
I take it the fixes arent done yet, as I still cant log in??
Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official.
Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
the 2 new broken enchantments introduced in mod 9
can't deposit IWD vouchers into coffer
bugged powers that still aren't working (some since beta)
Why the F we need another form of RP to stack (yes looking at you shattered weapons)
The rings and overload enchants that have ruined PVP?
Sounds about good to me!