As someone who is just starting the game *sigh*this sounds really frustrating and makes me wonder if there is anything else to do at max level, other than get kicked form end game runs.
Also this is exactly why badge gear, and personal loot was invented...perhaps we need that at end game just to keep things flowing?
There is "badge gear" - running T1 dungeons give you Unicorn Seals, and running T2 dungeons give you Drake Seals, (the dungeons from Sharandar and Dread Ring have their own seals as well) - you turn those in for epic gear from vendors in the market in Protector's Enclave.
During the Dungeon Delve event, or if you have an epic dungeon chest key, (you get 1 free per day, and can by more for 5000 Astral Diamonds), you also get gear just for you, at the end of said dungeons.
The main point of contention are the boss drops - these tend to be more highly sought after, and it is those items that players compete for. Again, the main issue is when a person joins a team, no one ever discusses how they should roll for loot, and someone violates some unwritten rule that others in the party assumed - like everyone chooses "greed" when an item comes up for a roll.
I can't stress this enough - ask how things will be handled, when you join a team. You can also check out the NW_Legit_Community links in my signature as an alternative to the main zone or looking for group channels.
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Communicate. Ask "what are the loot rules for this run?". Don't assume, as there are not--contrary to the opinion of some--any "official" looting rules. A few seconds to communicate at the start can save you a lot of grief later.
If you can't accept the risk of running with PUGs, don't run with them. Find a guild that has established loot rules for DDs, or join a good channel.
ROLL TIDE ROLL
Great Weapon Fighter: Because when is today not a good day to die?
PC and PS4 player. Proud Guildmaster for PS4 Team Fencebane. Rank 5 Officer for PC Team Fencebane. Visit us at http://fencebane.shivtr.com
It is a frustrating topic. The "greed" method would work , unfortunately most greeders don't even greed on all purple items. Just watch when a greater mark of potency drops...
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juleadreamMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 372Arc User
Communicate. Ask "what are the loot rules for this run?". Don't assume, as there are not--contrary to the opinion of some--any "official" looting rules. A few seconds to communicate at the start can save you a lot of grief later.
-snip-
Excellent advice, of course, but it can be hard to do that when most people are off like a shot from the campfire the second they load in, an usually won't even bother to pause long enough to answer even that most basic of questions. One of the (many) reasons I won't randomly queue for anything other than skirmishes, and won't even join a group that doesn't have at least 2 friends and/or guild members in it.
Excellent advice, of course, but it can be hard to do that when most people are off like a shot from the campfire the second they load in, an usually won't even bother to pause long enough to answer even that most basic of questions. One of the (many) reasons I won't randomly queue for anything other than skirmishes, and won't even join a group that doesn't have at least 2 friends and/or guild members in it.
Your post reveals you are talking about joining a random PuG formed anonymously by joining it through the automated queue system. If the TS joined a group forming in LFG channel he would have ample time to ask the group leader if it's need or greed only, etc.
If you join a random PuG using the queue system it should be completely obvious that you won't know how everyone will roll on stuff. All you do for that is you wait and watch chat channel to see how everyone else rolls. If a boss drop is being rolled on and you don't know the rule, then simply wait patiently, watch the chat and take note of everyone's rolls. If you see everyone roll Need, then you roll Need, if you see everyone roll Greed, then you Greed. If you see two people roll greed and one person roll need, then if you can roll need you probably should otherwise that other guy automatically wins it. Otherwise, you start a votekick on the player who rolled Need and see if the others vote him out. Then after that you roll greed.
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juleadreamMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 372Arc User
Your post reveals you are talking about joining a random PuG formed anonymously by joining it through the automated queue system. If the TS joined a group forming in LFG channel he would have ample time to ask the group leader if it's need or greed only, etc.
If you join a random PuG using the queue system it should be completely obvious that you won't know how everyone will roll on stuff. All you do for that is you wait and watch chat channel to see how everyone else rolls. If a boss drop is being rolled on and you don't know the rule, then simply wait patiently, watch the chat and take note of everyone's rolls. If you see everyone roll Need, then you roll Need, if you see everyone roll Greed, then you Greed. If you see two people roll greed and one person roll need, then if you can roll need you probably should otherwise that other guy automatically wins it. Otherwise, you start a votekick on the player who rolled Need and see if the others vote him out. Then after that you roll greed.
Yeah.... that's why I stick with guild/friend runs... takes the guesswork and aggravation out of it lol
Just gonna list a set of rules I've observed while running with PUGs during DD (keep in mind, this is just my experience which may be simillar or differ drastically to yours):
Bind on Equip items
Armor and Weapon Sets (specific to a class):
- If a class is present in the party, he/she rolls first to make sure they don't roll a Need; If they roll Need they get kicked out via vote
- If there's no class present with respect to the item being rolled, everyone may roll Greed or Pass. If a player passes, it's up to the MAJORITY of the party's discretion whether they are kicked or not (usually not in most of my PUG runs)
- Notable Exceptions: In the super rare cases where MAJORITY of the party have agreed beforehand that one member can roll Need on the item for many various reasons (the player is low GS and really needs the item most, the item is deemed not of value to MAJORITY the other players, the other players just don't care and is after another loot or chest, etc.) after he/she HAS asked AND been given permission to do so by MAJORITY of the party
Belts, Necklaces, & Rings (common items to every class):
- Everyone rolls Need ONLY after a player has initially rolled a Need UNLESS there's a rule in place beforehand that no players are to roll Need, in which the initial player who rolled Need is kicked out via vote
- If an initial player rolls Greed, others MUST follow suit and roll Greed and/or Pass, those who roll Need after a Greed has been initially rolled is kicked out via vote
- If a player passes, it's up to the MAJORITY of the party's discretion whether they are kicked or not (usually not in all of my PUG runs)
Marks & Stones
- Same rules as Belts, Necklaces, & Rings
Bind on Pick-Up Items
Armor and Weapon Sets (specific to a class):
- Same rules as Bind on Equip Items
Belts, Necklaces, & Rings (common items to every class):
- Same rules as Bind on Equip Items
Footnotes:
MAJORITY = 3 out of the 4 or 5 members (in a 4 or 5 member party), or 2 out of the 3 members (in a 3 member pary) of the party has common agreement. Democratic majority rule is applied
- In some PUGs, there is a timer set and agreed on by MAJORITY (that varies between 10secs to a whole 60secs) for party members to make a decision roll to Need/Greed/Pass. If they don't make a decision after that time frame elapses they are kicked from the party via vote.
- These rules does not work in a 2 member party, whoever's the leader may or may not have the option to forcefully kick the other from the party.
- These rules only "work" if the MAJORITY of players care enough to abide by it. One party member may wish to kick another member out for violating any of the rules above BUT MAJORITY of the others have to also exercise the right judgement for it to work. If the MAJORITY of the other players just don't care or are even trolls and letting people who break the rules stay on the party even after breaking said rules, then there's not much you can do about it. (Anarchy rules?)
- Before adventuring further into the dungeon or even before the final boss, all players of the party must have a talk about these rules, permissions by players who need certain gear/item drops must be asked AND obtained prior to the item dropping, etc. Democratic majority rule is applied.
- Mutiny, although somewhat low, is always a possibility to happen so everyone has to watch their behavior when dungeon delving. I've only ever had this happen ONCE in a PUG party where the highest GS player was being extremely rude and disrespectful to everyone else in the party and only after the final boss did the party kicked him out after secretly agreeing via PMs. So watch your behavior in the dungeons too.
If loot rules come to this much work/hassle. Grouping for content is lost. Both devs, not either making individual drops or only greed button; and the playerbase for being so terrible are to blame.
If loot rules come to this much work/hassle. Grouping for content is lost. Both devs, not either making individual drops or only greed button; and the playerbase for being so terrible are to blame.
I weep for the community.
I don't find it too much work. It really just boils down to a simple logistical 2-step process:
- Don't Need unless mutually agreed beforehand
- Need ONLY after a player has rolled Need (usually everyone follows suit after a player has rolled Need anyways)
For everything else, there's MasterCa--- I mean Greed.
(and only a really kind-hearted, generous person would choose Pass anyways).
I don't find it too much work. It really just boils down to a simple logistical 2-step process:
- Don't Need unless mutually agreed beforehand
- Need ONLY after a player has rolled Need (usually everyone follows suit after a player has rolled Need anyways)
For everything else, there's MasterCa--- I mean Greed.
(and only a really kind-hearted, generous person would choose Pass anyways).
Just ask/communicate. The rest just seems excessive.
example
If a player passes, it's up to the MAJORITY of the party's discretion whether they are kicked or not (usually not in most of my PUG runs)
wtf? why even consider kicking the person, thats never even crossed my mind when they pass....
Just ask/communicate. The rest just seems excessive.
That's what I just stated in the Footnotes section of my other comment:
" -- Before adventuring further into the dungeon or even before the final boss, all players of the party must have a talk about these rules, permissions by players who need certain gear/item drops must be asked AND obtained prior to the item dropping, etc. Democratic majority rule is applied."
urlord283Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,084Arc User
edited March 2015
well... now you know
greed.... not need
0
thefabricantMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 5,248Arc User
edited March 2015
The reasons people vote kick for normally fall into 3 catagories:
1) Greed ( improve their chance of receiving a drop or someone needs in a greed run.)
2) Something strange an obscure (For example, I was once kicked from CN because upon queueing into them at the last boss, I volunteered to solo it for them, they thought it was impossible and that I was a moron, so vote kick. Another example is once I queued into CN and some player in the group spent too long staring at paingiver. He elected to vote kick me because, as a pug and relatively poor player, he believed it was impossible for someone to do so much more damage then him without exploiting.)
3 Gearscore.
Very rarely will it be for bad conduct/rudeness etc.
The guy needed that item, as far as i'm able to comprehend... Needed as in 'it would be an upgrade' over his current item. It only makes sense that he rolls need, since it is for his and not for your class. This is the reason why we can not roll need on items which we cannot use, in the first place (noticed how it's greyed out!?).
---
The fact that a 18k gs guy gets mad at a 10k gs character (new player) rolling need on an item he can use, is the only selfish thing that is mentioned in this thread. I'd be happy for the person and just let him loot, without throwing a tantrum over 5k AD.
---
The developers should consider disabling the 'greed' option, for the classes that cannot utilize an item... because, like in other mmorpg's, you win some and you lose some. No class specific drops for you? Then you are sadly out of luck >>> better luck next time. I also believe, the possibility to roll greed on other classes items is a huge turn off, for newcomers who are trying to earn (not buy) their starter gear.
It only makes sense that he rolls need, since it is for his and not for your class.
In Neverwinter people play dungeons to acquire purple items to sell on the AH or to salvage for AD. It doesn't matter what class the item is designed for. All players in the group did equal work to complete the dungeon and should have equal chances at winning the bosses loot. Only one major item usually drops. And you have the mistaken idea that you should get to need on it because it's for your class? That means no one else can win it because they cannot need on something that isn't their class.
In Neverwinter people play dungeons to acquire purple items to sell on the AH or to salvage for AD. It doesn't matter what class the item is designed for. All players in the group did equal work to complete the dungeon and should have equal chances at winning the bosses loot. Only one major item usually drops. And you have the mistaken idea that you should get to need on it because it's for your class? That means no one else can win it because they cannot need on something that isn't their class.
If they are going to equip it then, yes, I expect them to not only be able to need, but to actually need. If they didn't I'd ask why.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
... Tired of running dungeons with exploiters and cheaters? Join the legit channel by visiting http://goo.gl/1zfnTS to apply!
Performing ritual pony sacrifices to Tiamat to earn favor with the RNG Gods since 2014.
...
- Mutiny, although somewhat low, is always a possibility to happen so everyone has to watch their behavior when dungeon delving. I've only ever had this happen ONCE in a PUG party where the highest GS player was being extremely rude and disrespectful to everyone else in the party and only after the final boss did the party kicked him out after secretly agreeing via PMs. So watch your behavior in the dungeons too.
One statement and one question here. First of all, it is a selfish move to let the rude high GS player carry the team to a victory and kick him after the fight. If he is untolerable, just kick him.
The question is, what is concidered 'rude'. For example, in PUG ESOT runs, most ppl cant tank the boss. When I do a PUG run and no one can tank the boss or I end up with the boss aggro no matter what, I suggest, that I will tank the boss. I did it with CW, DC, TR, GWF and HR. To tank him without problems I need 90° around the boss to be free of red areas and one player in range, so I ask for it.
After a few more fails, I state again, that obviously no one else is able to tank and ask again, to do it my way. Most of the times ppl see, that doing it without tank or tactic does not work and do as I asked.
Sometimes it does not work out, bc some ppl either dont speak english or care about tactics. If and when this happened, I suggested, that they either suggest something else or do it my way. What is 'rude' in this situation? Killing off all other players on purpose, to solo the boss? Telling them, that you will leave the group, if they are unable to handle some basic tactics? Leave? Saying that their behavior is stupid?
I sometimes wonder, what players expect from other players. Be respectful, ok. Explain problems, ok. suggest solutions, ok. Tolerate bad tactics, playstyle or lack of understanding in infinitum, no.
Well this makes end-game seem depressing and not fun at all. not only will someone not be able to gear up for their class, they risk getting kicked for any number of reasons, or no reason at all.You can never learn from your mistakes, no one wants to help so the ones at the top sit at the top and the ones on the bottom get bored, and find something else to do.
Yea...lots of 'fun' to be had by all...as in no fun just frustration and elitism.
There really needs to be something else to do at end game.
Heyo,
not sure where to post this but I'm trying here.
I know all about this controversy between needing and greeding during greed runs and alike. But still, I am new to the game, and was running with a friend. We queued up for dungeon and noticed very quickly a guy in the party was really strong. Got gear score around 18k, which is a lot compared to ours around 10k.
So, we are gearing up, while running pug runs during dungeon delves. I know gearing feels pointless right now, but still.
So, I needed on a thing. And got vote-kicked out in the blink of an eye. The other people in party were as clueless as me and my friend, but I guess they clicked yes anyway. Worthy to mention, everyone had been needing everything before, this run and runs before, always everyone needs epics in pug runs. And this item was an obvious upgrade for me.
But yeah. I got kicked. Because I needed an item I needed because it was better than what I had.
I mean come on, pug run, no one cares there. I can understand getting kicked if I was running a greed run, but we weren't.
Is this really how things work? I'm not upset, I just can't wrap my head around what happened.
Good idea is to ask other party members, if they don't mind you needing^^...
It seems to be reaching the point where some players are so brainwashed by the need/greed thing that they will kick anyone who needs, even if it is not a greed run and even outside of dungeons! I saw several kicks in the CTA skirmish a couple of weeks ago. A quick fire pug skirmish and ppl are still kicking others. Craziness squared...
Well this makes end-game seem depressing and not fun at all. not only will someone not be able to gear up for their class, they risk getting kicked for any number of reasons, or no reason at all.
This is mostly totally untrue. I have seven level 60 characters who have all completed Sharandar, Dread Ring, and Icewind Dale. They all have excellent gear and they never ran EVEN ONE dungeon.
You guys don't seem to understand. The vast majority of these PuG dungeon runs are not to acquire gear to "equip" they are to get the purple boss item drop to turn into AD.
You people are making a mountain out of a molehill.
alternatively, NW could simply disallow kicks during combat and loot rolls.
This idea would be OK, if, and only if, you also allow the loot system to be set to "greed/pass only", AND make that changeable only by vote - majority or unanimous would have to be discussed separately. That way the "greed runs" would be ascertained, barred from being compromised by that needer, verifiable upon start by looking up loot rolls. But basically that's the better one of your suggestions, IMHO.
Personal loot => gallopping loot value inflation. Or everything goes BoP. Both are rather meh, IMHO.
I am totally in favor of everything going BoP. I would happily accept that.
want AD? Salvage.
This idea would be OK, if, and only if, you also allow the loot system to be set to "greed/pass only", AND make that changeable only by vote - majority or unanimous would have to be discussed separately. That way the "greed runs" would be ascertained, barred from being compromised by that needer, verifiable upon start by looking up loot rolls. But basically that's the better one of your suggestions, IMHO.
another idea would be to have the loot rules(for a premade) be set at the start of the dungeon. it'd be a setting that requires entering with a completely premade group and players would receive a notice at the time of queueing. perhaps when the leader queues it pops up and says "queueing for X dungeon. your party leader has selected PREMADE GROUP WITH CUSTOM LOOT SETTINGS. details below."
can't ninja if the system doesn't let you, and if we aren't going to get master looter options, might as well enforce fair looting mechanically.
Personal loot => gallopping loot value inflation. Or everything goes BoP. Both are rather meh, IMHO.
I am totally in favor of everything going BoP. I would happily accept that.
want AD? Salvage.
[...]
That would mean...
...you'd have to gather your stuff directly from dungeons/boss chests
...death to the AH (bar enchantments and lockbox stuff), and hence a lot less need for AD.
...breakdown of the economy for different reasons.
This way has been taken in D3, and AFAIK, it hasn't really boosted their playerbase...
And D3 has a lot greater loot variety - something fairly lacking in NWO.
You get obnoxious people in PUGs now and then who will kick you for stupid reasons or for no reason at all. I once got kicked from a group for rolling greed on too many greens. Yes, greens, not blues or purples. And yes, rolling greed, not need. But remember that the occasional kick-happy PUG idiots are only occasional and don't let them ruin the game for you. Even if Cryptic encouraged it by making it too easy to kick group members.
It's acceptable to roll need on items that are an upgrade for and will be equipped on the character you're playing right then unless the group has previously agreed otherwise. That's been the near-universal standard in MMORPGs for more than a decade. If a group agrees to other loot rules, then that overrides the default assumptions. But with the queue so often putting together people who don't even speak a common language, it's not possible for such groups to agree on other loot rules.
Comments
There is "badge gear" - running T1 dungeons give you Unicorn Seals, and running T2 dungeons give you Drake Seals, (the dungeons from Sharandar and Dread Ring have their own seals as well) - you turn those in for epic gear from vendors in the market in Protector's Enclave.
During the Dungeon Delve event, or if you have an epic dungeon chest key, (you get 1 free per day, and can by more for 5000 Astral Diamonds), you also get gear just for you, at the end of said dungeons.
The main point of contention are the boss drops - these tend to be more highly sought after, and it is those items that players compete for. Again, the main issue is when a person joins a team, no one ever discusses how they should roll for loot, and someone violates some unwritten rule that others in the party assumed - like everyone chooses "greed" when an item comes up for a roll.
I can't stress this enough - ask how things will be handled, when you join a team. You can also check out the NW_Legit_Community links in my signature as an alternative to the main zone or looking for group channels.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
If you can't accept the risk of running with PUGs, don't run with them. Find a guild that has established loot rules for DDs, or join a good channel.
Great Weapon Fighter: Because when is today not a good day to die?
PC and PS4 player. Proud Guildmaster for PS4 Team Fencebane. Rank 5 Officer for PC Team Fencebane. Visit us at http://fencebane.shivtr.com
Excellent advice, of course, but it can be hard to do that when most people are off like a shot from the campfire the second they load in, an usually won't even bother to pause long enough to answer even that most basic of questions. One of the (many) reasons I won't randomly queue for anything other than skirmishes, and won't even join a group that doesn't have at least 2 friends and/or guild members in it.
Your post reveals you are talking about joining a random PuG formed anonymously by joining it through the automated queue system. If the TS joined a group forming in LFG channel he would have ample time to ask the group leader if it's need or greed only, etc.
If you join a random PuG using the queue system it should be completely obvious that you won't know how everyone will roll on stuff. All you do for that is you wait and watch chat channel to see how everyone else rolls. If a boss drop is being rolled on and you don't know the rule, then simply wait patiently, watch the chat and take note of everyone's rolls. If you see everyone roll Need, then you roll Need, if you see everyone roll Greed, then you Greed. If you see two people roll greed and one person roll need, then if you can roll need you probably should otherwise that other guy automatically wins it. Otherwise, you start a votekick on the player who rolled Need and see if the others vote him out. Then after that you roll greed.
Yeah.... that's why I stick with guild/friend runs... takes the guesswork and aggravation out of it lol
Bind on Equip items
Armor and Weapon Sets (specific to a class):
- If a class is present in the party, he/she rolls first to make sure they don't roll a Need; If they roll Need they get kicked out via vote
- If there's no class present with respect to the item being rolled, everyone may roll Greed or Pass. If a player passes, it's up to the MAJORITY of the party's discretion whether they are kicked or not (usually not in most of my PUG runs)
- Notable Exceptions: In the super rare cases where MAJORITY of the party have agreed beforehand that one member can roll Need on the item for many various reasons (the player is low GS and really needs the item most, the item is deemed not of value to MAJORITY the other players, the other players just don't care and is after another loot or chest, etc.) after he/she HAS asked AND been given permission to do so by MAJORITY of the party
Belts, Necklaces, & Rings (common items to every class):
- Everyone rolls Need ONLY after a player has initially rolled a Need UNLESS there's a rule in place beforehand that no players are to roll Need, in which the initial player who rolled Need is kicked out via vote
- If an initial player rolls Greed, others MUST follow suit and roll Greed and/or Pass, those who roll Need after a Greed has been initially rolled is kicked out via vote
- If a player passes, it's up to the MAJORITY of the party's discretion whether they are kicked or not (usually not in all of my PUG runs)
Marks & Stones
- Same rules as Belts, Necklaces, & Rings
Bind on Pick-Up Items
Armor and Weapon Sets (specific to a class):
- Same rules as Bind on Equip Items
Belts, Necklaces, & Rings (common items to every class):
- Same rules as Bind on Equip Items
Footnotes:
MAJORITY = 3 out of the 4 or 5 members (in a 4 or 5 member party), or 2 out of the 3 members (in a 3 member pary) of the party has common agreement. Democratic majority rule is applied
- In some PUGs, there is a timer set and agreed on by MAJORITY (that varies between 10secs to a whole 60secs) for party members to make a decision roll to Need/Greed/Pass. If they don't make a decision after that time frame elapses they are kicked from the party via vote.
- These rules does not work in a 2 member party, whoever's the leader may or may not have the option to forcefully kick the other from the party.
- These rules only "work" if the MAJORITY of players care enough to abide by it. One party member may wish to kick another member out for violating any of the rules above BUT MAJORITY of the others have to also exercise the right judgement for it to work. If the MAJORITY of the other players just don't care or are even trolls and letting people who break the rules stay on the party even after breaking said rules, then there's not much you can do about it. (Anarchy rules?)
- Before adventuring further into the dungeon or even before the final boss, all players of the party must have a talk about these rules, permissions by players who need certain gear/item drops must be asked AND obtained prior to the item dropping, etc. Democratic majority rule is applied.
- Mutiny, although somewhat low, is always a possibility to happen so everyone has to watch their behavior when dungeon delving. I've only ever had this happen ONCE in a PUG party where the highest GS player was being extremely rude and disrespectful to everyone else in the party and only after the final boss did the party kicked him out after secretly agreeing via PMs. So watch your behavior in the dungeons too.
If loot rules come to this much work/hassle. Grouping for content is lost. Both devs, not either making individual drops or only greed button; and the playerbase for being so terrible are to blame.
I weep for the community.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
I don't find it too much work. It really just boils down to a simple logistical 2-step process:
- Don't Need unless mutually agreed beforehand
- Need ONLY after a player has rolled Need (usually everyone follows suit after a player has rolled Need anyways)
For everything else, there's MasterCa--- I mean Greed.
(and only a really kind-hearted, generous person would choose Pass anyways).
Just ask/communicate. The rest just seems excessive.
example
wtf? why even consider kicking the person, thats never even crossed my mind when they pass....
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
That's what I just stated in the Footnotes section of my other comment:
" -- Before adventuring further into the dungeon or even before the final boss, all players of the party must have a talk about these rules, permissions by players who need certain gear/item drops must be asked AND obtained prior to the item dropping, etc. Democratic majority rule is applied."
That's why I added in brackets: "(usually not in most of my PUG runs)"
Meaning that in 99.9% of the PUG runs that I have been in, NO ONE got kicked out for choosing Pass.
edit: to comment below so Im not psting 30 times here. hahahah cute.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Thanks
I named it Mustachu.
greed.... not need
1) Greed ( improve their chance of receiving a drop or someone needs in a greed run.)
2) Something strange an obscure (For example, I was once kicked from CN because upon queueing into them at the last boss, I volunteered to solo it for them, they thought it was impossible and that I was a moron, so vote kick. Another example is once I queued into CN and some player in the group spent too long staring at paingiver. He elected to vote kick me because, as a pug and relatively poor player, he believed it was impossible for someone to do so much more damage then him without exploiting.)
3 Gearscore.
Very rarely will it be for bad conduct/rudeness etc.
---
The fact that a 18k gs guy gets mad at a 10k gs character (new player) rolling need on an item he can use, is the only selfish thing that is mentioned in this thread. I'd be happy for the person and just let him loot, without throwing a tantrum over 5k AD.
---
The developers should consider disabling the 'greed' option, for the classes that cannot utilize an item... because, like in other mmorpg's, you win some and you lose some. No class specific drops for you? Then you are sadly out of luck >>> better luck next time. I also believe, the possibility to roll greed on other classes items is a huge turn off, for newcomers who are trying to earn (not buy) their starter gear.
---
- Just my humble and honest, 75 1/2 cents.
In Neverwinter people play dungeons to acquire purple items to sell on the AH or to salvage for AD. It doesn't matter what class the item is designed for. All players in the group did equal work to complete the dungeon and should have equal chances at winning the bosses loot. Only one major item usually drops. And you have the mistaken idea that you should get to need on it because it's for your class? That means no one else can win it because they cannot need on something that isn't their class.
If they are going to equip it then, yes, I expect them to not only be able to need, but to actually need. If they didn't I'd ask why.
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Tired of running dungeons with exploiters and cheaters? Join the legit channel by visiting http://goo.gl/1zfnTS to apply!
Performing ritual pony sacrifices to Tiamat to earn favor with the RNG Gods since 2014.
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That's not too smart because that will get you kicked and you'll get nothing...time to wake up to how Neverwinter works.
One statement and one question here. First of all, it is a selfish move to let the rude high GS player carry the team to a victory and kick him after the fight. If he is untolerable, just kick him.
The question is, what is concidered 'rude'. For example, in PUG ESOT runs, most ppl cant tank the boss. When I do a PUG run and no one can tank the boss or I end up with the boss aggro no matter what, I suggest, that I will tank the boss. I did it with CW, DC, TR, GWF and HR. To tank him without problems I need 90° around the boss to be free of red areas and one player in range, so I ask for it.
After a few more fails, I state again, that obviously no one else is able to tank and ask again, to do it my way. Most of the times ppl see, that doing it without tank or tactic does not work and do as I asked.
Sometimes it does not work out, bc some ppl either dont speak english or care about tactics. If and when this happened, I suggested, that they either suggest something else or do it my way. What is 'rude' in this situation? Killing off all other players on purpose, to solo the boss? Telling them, that you will leave the group, if they are unable to handle some basic tactics? Leave? Saying that their behavior is stupid?
I sometimes wonder, what players expect from other players. Be respectful, ok. Explain problems, ok. suggest solutions, ok. Tolerate bad tactics, playstyle or lack of understanding in infinitum, no.
Yea...lots of 'fun' to be had by all...as in no fun just frustration and elitism.
There really needs to be something else to do at end game.
Good idea is to ask other party members, if they don't mind you needing^^...
This is mostly totally untrue. I have seven level 60 characters who have all completed Sharandar, Dread Ring, and Icewind Dale. They all have excellent gear and they never ran EVEN ONE dungeon.
You guys don't seem to understand. The vast majority of these PuG dungeon runs are not to acquire gear to "equip" they are to get the purple boss item drop to turn into AD.
You people are making a mountain out of a molehill.
alternatively, NW could simply disallow kicks during combat and loot rolls.
Personal loot => gallopping loot value inflation. Or everything goes BoP. Both are rather meh, IMHO.
This idea would be OK, if, and only if, you also allow the loot system to be set to "greed/pass only", AND make that changeable only by vote - majority or unanimous would have to be discussed separately. That way the "greed runs" would be ascertained, barred from being compromised by that needer, verifiable upon start by looking up loot rolls. But basically that's the better one of your suggestions, IMHO.
want AD? Salvage.
another idea would be to have the loot rules(for a premade) be set at the start of the dungeon. it'd be a setting that requires entering with a completely premade group and players would receive a notice at the time of queueing. perhaps when the leader queues it pops up and says "queueing for X dungeon. your party leader has selected PREMADE GROUP WITH CUSTOM LOOT SETTINGS. details below."
can't ninja if the system doesn't let you, and if we aren't going to get master looter options, might as well enforce fair looting mechanically.
That would mean...
...you'd have to gather your stuff directly from dungeons/boss chests
...death to the AH (bar enchantments and lockbox stuff), and hence a lot less need for AD.
...breakdown of the economy for different reasons.
This way has been taken in D3, and AFAIK, it hasn't really boosted their playerbase...
And D3 has a lot greater loot variety - something fairly lacking in NWO.
It's acceptable to roll need on items that are an upgrade for and will be equipped on the character you're playing right then unless the group has previously agreed otherwise. That's been the near-universal standard in MMORPGs for more than a decade. If a group agrees to other loot rules, then that overrides the default assumptions. But with the queue so often putting together people who don't even speak a common language, it's not possible for such groups to agree on other loot rules.
Quaternion from the previous forum