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Is it just me or are TR really going to any better after the Mod 4 changes?
kalinthar
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 21 Arc User
I have over 10 accounts all level 60; various classes. I made 2 tr's. One was a whisperknife drow, the other a traditional half-orc executioner melee rogue.
I regularly play PvP, had my share of wins and losses. However, I just cannot see a future for the melee rogue. You are out damaged by the HR, the HR has vastly better area damage effects, the HR has superior survivability and mobility as well as a stealth based heal and other tactics.
I simply cannot find a way to demonstrate my worth in dungeon parties due to a lack of survivability. and damage when compared to other classes.
Stealth is easily overcome by a commonly used artifact, so permstealth builds have little utility now.
I have come to the conclusion that the melee based rogue is of no value in dungeons and PvP.. Other classes have superior mobility, survivability and damage.
The fate of this class lies in the balance as I see no changes that can be made to improve it without a recognition that it has been nerfed into uselessness.
Should I simply reroll or delete it and start again?
I regularly play PvP, had my share of wins and losses. However, I just cannot see a future for the melee rogue. You are out damaged by the HR, the HR has vastly better area damage effects, the HR has superior survivability and mobility as well as a stealth based heal and other tactics.
I simply cannot find a way to demonstrate my worth in dungeon parties due to a lack of survivability. and damage when compared to other classes.
Stealth is easily overcome by a commonly used artifact, so permstealth builds have little utility now.
I have come to the conclusion that the melee based rogue is of no value in dungeons and PvP.. Other classes have superior mobility, survivability and damage.
The fate of this class lies in the balance as I see no changes that can be made to improve it without a recognition that it has been nerfed into uselessness.
Should I simply reroll or delete it and start again?
Post edited by kalinthar on
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Comments
Hi There,
I agree with some of your points but disagree totally with these two statements. I am a semi full PvP specced MI TR and I can hold a node easily against a CW, GF, TR(depending on skill), GWF and HR (depending on skill and build)
CWs and GFs are of no worries to me in PvP, some GWFs will always get me its just how it goes and MOST HRs get me and kill me in a flash lol but point being with those types of GWFs or HRs is to just basically stall them there and keep them out of the battle for the other 2 nodes.
Regarding PvE, I disagree to some extent too. I ran multiple runs the other day in VT 2/2 with rainbow parties and the typical party and i was consistently sitting in 3rd place for pain giver and this is with either 2CWs or 2GWFs, play style makes a big difference and choice of encounters and mind you my rotation was SB, PoBs and ITC, dailies Bloodbath and Whirlwind.
Where I am totally with you is at the part where you mention POST MOD4, I really don't know what they going to be doing to us and honestly the only thing I can think of is a nerf (not being funny) but its true, its basically the expected after every mod.
I don't know man, I also have 2 TRs I had 4 but yea, realised i dont need em lol, I don't think you should delete your TR, if you love it keep it and start playing to your max and possibly figure out a new build that would work for you, maybe wait for MOD4s re-roll feature and take it from there?
***Edit*** Regarding what I said about the CWs and GFs its not entirely true as I have fought the likes of Virus and Mageface they screwed me up pretty bad lol, and as for the GFs I have fought some pretty mean dudes out there mainly Godmode, he hits like a train, unfortunately I have not had the pleaseure of facing Kalous or Facecontrol but with the new GF buffs coming out I think the tables will turn slightly.
Regards,
Shnya
i will be waiting until the third week of mod 4, if no tr rework will be announced i will just stop playing and enjoy the summer hoping to find the strenght to play again in october. you never know.
The lack of response on the DF thing when other, less important bugs have gotten immediate dev response leaves me with little hope. (Hell, my stealth still bugs out and stops refilling sometimes to this day, despite that bug allegedly being fixed ages ago.) Even if it's unintentional(How can it be? I have a hard time imagining something like this could 'accidentally' happen.), it'll still make live, mark my words.
They don't care about TR, which is idiotic given how much of the population we still represent even after everything they're done to us to drive us into the ground.
So my Mod 4 prediction is that TR will continue to be senselessly nerfed and continue to be useless. And that I'm going to eventually say the hell with it and just give up already. It's not even funny in a 'oh god' sense anymore. We've gone past gallows humor to just plain misery.
For me, this Mod isn't so much about what they are not doing to TRs, but rather about what they are doing to the other classes. It will be very interesting to see how the final changes play out for GWFs, but the way it's looking right now, they are going to take a significant hit in both PvE and PvP with this update. HRs are going to get stronger because they were soooo weak before. (That was sarcasm in case you missed it)
GWFs were always a mixed bag in PvP anyway. Some were easy, some were simply godlike. I have a feeling that those godlike ones will remain that way, but maybe a tiny bit less so. And that's good for us. GFs may be a little harder now which really shouldn't impact us too much because they were generally dead meat anyway unless they were very, very, very good. And if HRs really do get even better, well, that's silly but not game breaking as a TR.
So, I'll be patient and take the changes that they've made to other classes and hope that in the next update they'll give us some love and not nerf us yet again.
When Im on my GWF, I rely more on DC artifact and multiple Slams, on HR .. speed and movement not to be hit and CW.. well CW, hope the tr isnt good.
This isnt a statement on whether the trs should be nerfed, or buffed or comment on the playstyle, just mentioning that to think the lantern really helps, Ive found its radius is way to small to matter. Thats my two cents on that. I know regret taking it on the GWF and wish I had taken good old waters, like the rest of my toons.
The uptime on lantern is what makes it most useless against a TR who can stealth in every 14-16 seconds with Shadow Strike...and what, lantern procs every 120 seconds if you are silly enough to rank it to Legendary. Just...no.
which top tr did u kill 1v1
i know that build.......u just leave
when real tr comes on cap
so before calling out any tr u should proly beat one 1v1 with
full hp ,not coming to only daily him
I'm confident we'll eventually get some love from the devs.
FotM chasers may leave, but who really cares about them?
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
on forum hehe.
gwf vs gwf - better geared wins most of the time,luck with crit,very little skill
cw vs cw- mostly never happens no one cares
hr vs hr- gear and very little skill
gf vs gf- who cares
dc vs dc-lol
and now kings of 1v1 tr vs tr
TRICKSTER VS TRICKSTER, trolll vc troll,ultimate ego fight
its the single most important duel in the game were gear is least important of all classes.
its a skill fight with very little luck.winer takes it all
loser loses everything and i mean everything coz when trickster gets tricked hes left with nothing.
so 99% trs are just randome people and cant deal with this pressure
so they come up with some wacky non viable builds so they cant 1v1.
they made a perfect aliby.
but thats not the end
they still feel bad coz someone is better so forum is the answer .
every single tr nerf thread was started and fired up from trs themself
best example of this is .............
he hates old burst tr he hates perma tr
he hates any tr that can posibly beat him 1v1.
he only likes his imaginery tr that in theory can win 1v1 in his dreams
and untill that happens(never will lol) tr nerf thread it is and talk HAMSTER abouth fotm.
ta ta mio amigos trs
I agree, that the TR is a loner in pvp, and can perform exceptionally by himself (and that is his role), though success of the match is still dependant on the success of the rest of the team.
The nature of the TR's role in pvp makes stealth pivotal in many cases, and many TRs get stomped outside of stealth, which makes perma/semi an easy go to.
I recently did an experiment on my non perma/semi PVE TR with 0 tenacity over the course of getting 24k glory. I have not touched PVP since leaderboards and tenacity. First match was a disaster, 12 deaths, as I got my footing, but from the 2nd match onwards, I put my PVE burst damage to good use. It was over 6 days where I fluctuated from 400-600 ranking. And led me to conclude TRs are still pretty fun to play at the pug level, where at top end, you would be competing in gear instead.
Attachment not found.
I've sinced gotten over 48K glory for 2 skulls, and while I find the queue mostly puts me up against casual pvp premades, it's only the occasional PVP guild premades where I'm reduced to cap and run for points with 1 or no kills.
The randomness of the queue sort of evens out my losses and wins though I lose more in general, and I'm assuming I'm right about there with casual pvpers to enjoy PVP enough to play occasionally, on top of mainly doing PVE. And that is good enough reason for me to keep playing my TR while still having fun.
Only the second part, I can agree on LOL. Since when did TR vs TR happen a lot. On a good PM vs PM, rogues would usually be sent to the away node, each being in the opposite end of the domination map. Tell you what, TRvsTR on a premade match is generally a bad idea cuz if the other 8 people are evenly matched, it's going to be about which team has the better TR. So no, bad strategy right there, almost never happens.
TR 1v1s more often occur in Zone chat in a TRoll vs TRoll contest.
Actually the only TRs I really hate, are those who rain down on other people's threads and discussions with the oh-so-boring "that never works in premade level fights", attitude.
Ohhhh yes, TRs of the Thieves Den. You know of which kind I mean.
■ It's those frickin hypocrites who casually tell you they don't really care about what you do, and even go so far as to say that they are glad you find something fun... and then as soon as you turn your back, they'd post insults on how anyone that don't follow their central dogma is simply "gimping themselves"
■ It's those types you see every now and then, that constantly need to be recognized as a "good player", and the fact that they beat someone in a certain game means that they feel they've got a snobby right to step on everyone else's toes. Oh yes, you've seen these. The one's that would show up when some other good-hearted TRs come to the boards to share their ideas.. and then suddenly would creep up with the "But I beat you. You suck, so what you say don't matter" posts.
■ It's those who would include the word "premade" in every subject they speak of. Everthing is a "premade-negative" -- like.. "Oh that never works in premades..." or.. "If you play like that you'll never be premade level" or... "That's why you're not premade level" and etc etc.. Don't these shi*burgers understand most people here don't really care?
■ And lastly but not in any sense least, it is the types that would get absolutely crushed in a casual debate, and then would retain their petty little grudge against you.. and then would follow you around to add in comments to try and insult you in every post you make. (Jesus dude... :rolleyes: this is like the 3rd? 4th post in this week you've been following around just to harass and annoy.
Take a hint.
I don't really care what you say, because the very fact that you need to follow me in every thread I become a part of. just to try and flash by an insult anyway you can, clearly states to others which one's got the massive inferiority complex and an obssession here. :rolleyes:
Besides, none of what you say really matter anyway, since its not like you post hints or tips or real opinions of any kind. All you do is follow people around with negatives and an insult.
Do you really feel that insecure?
Come on, rosy, tell us how you really feel. Why you need to keep derailing perfectly normal discussions by following me around and landing insults. Didn't momma love you enough when you were a child?
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
...and obviously also in the forums.. judging by how I've got a pervert that keeps stalking me with every post I write in every different thread.
Maybe they should make a "forum stealth" function or something so all of your posts stay invisible to the psycho that's stalking you!!
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
hehehe
why are u so angry dude
did i hit the nail on the head
you found it offending coz its so true lol .
u rather see all class destroyed then deal with yours lack of skill.
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if i was to beat oh lets say dinter 4 time in a row.
i would be better tr then him right away.and if i was to post it on youtube lool.
i dont need to beat anyone anymore or play a single premade no one cares i won.
every top tr knows this and its why i like the class in the first place.
its true tr 1v1 dont happen often but when they do its winner takes it all.
just look how many post had "who is the best tr in the game"
not a single class even had that thread
The Wilds did. It was canned to the unproductive posts section. Apparently it didn't go so well. There would be a few "bickering threads" here and there. I could name one from the DC forums, if I had the patience to dig it up LOL. Barracks is a garden of brokenhearted GF. I actually don't know what's going on in The Library ~ it's more or less quiet so far.
Until they fix that, it's very unlikely that they can fix and make melee rogues good again due to the current whining about perma-stealth in pvp. A couple classes honestly have this issue, where the primary stat simply isn't as good as other stats, but it is most glaring on the rogue.
Rangers are just as tough as ever. I don't know how they are so tanky but they are.
GF are pretty diesel now. They reflect damage so you gotta watch your (bugged) duelist flurry.
GWF aren't on easy mode anymore, the fights will be more fair. didn't get to play cw or dc
Gear up guys, its gonna be rough for a few months
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
We can do so much more than you all have ever imagined.
Video link ---> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-UyjaI-wB0&feature=youtu.be
First, nice video. Make some more with TR
Second, unfortunately that scenario tailored for the vid rarely if ever happen in pvp or dung. Thats why people ask for CW for dung runs or GWF, not really a learn to play issue.