I use shocking execution in PvE. It works great on the bosses in epic dungeons especially when they're under half health. I use it my husband uses it several of our guild members use it as well. I could live with the nerf but yes I think 60% is a bit excessive.
If you're using Shocking Execution over Lurker's Assault in PvE you're pretty much gimping your damage.
That lone 30k crit (which will now become a lone 10k crit, if not less if we count the Deadly Momentum nerf) is nowhere near what 10 seconds of Lurker's Assault give you considering a usual "stealth and spam at wills, finish with Lashing Blade" rotation with a 20% severity boost.
Incoming overpowered GWFs. They are already borderline OP in PvP already, being able to permastun people for 3-4 seconds while they kill them. You nerfed two standout abilities in PvP (Rays and Shocking Execution), but damage in general is too high (pretty much any class can kill another in 4 seconds if they arent within an astral shield), and CC duration (not even by wizards, its the fighters and rogues who have too much CC) is too long. You need to implement diminishing returns for CC, noone should get CCed for more than 4 seconds.
You have never been oneshot by it. Its the only dependable skill to kill someting in PvP together with Lashing Blade and to some extent Cloud of Steel that only hits 10 times before its useless for 2 mins. Now 1 of the 2 skills are useless, TR will become so gimp in PvP.
I most certainly have been one shot by it, in PvP on both my CW and DC, both are in Castle Never gear. There were no debuffs first, just them coming from stealth and unloading their daily. The only way you wouldnt die from it is by standing in Astral Shield, preferably two.
Watch the servers get flooded with the new GF & GWF FOTMs now in prep for the patch. Hey PW nice move. There'll be a new batch up purchases for the characters slots now as people re-roll the FOTM. Great $ strategy right there.....
"Shocking Execution: The base damage of this power has been reduced by 60%."
It is understandable to reduce the base damage of shocking execution cus it is not meant to 1 shot ppl in pvp from 100% HP to dead. But i would say it should have been balanced rather than nerfed. By balancing i mean, reduce the base damage but increase the multiplier on the amount of HP lost. That means increase the multiplier on the damage increase due the reduced HP on the target, so it will not be a 1 shot, it will be what its name suggest SHOCKING EXECUTION!!! If a rouge is fool enough to use it on target with 100% HP that skill does less damage than a AT-Will, but on a target with 30% HP, it will execute it right-away.
Another thing i wanna add is that there should be something done to the Daily, Bloodbath. Most player stop using it in later game due to the way it works. The rouge jumps to random targets with random hits that deal insignificant damage. I am putting up some suggestions to improve it in later times.
1. Allow something like target painting, where the player can select the targets he wants to jump(Switch Target) on. It perfectly makes sense, a rouge will plan and select his pray b4 going for it not just mindlessly jump(Switch Target) here and there.
OR
2. Increase the amount of damage dealt on every jump(Switch Target). Well, on single target increasing the damage will make it an over powered skill for pvp but instead increasing the damage on every jump will make it an interesting skill. Maybe after 4th jump(Switch Target) it can even kill a player with 100% HP, but none, not even the rouge himself will know who will be the victim This skill will then may find its use for harassment creation in group PvP and a decent AOE attack for dungeons crawling. For single target, i would actually suggest to reduce the damage a bit. So, the base damage should be reduced but the damage should increase significantly on every jump(Switch Target). This can be implemented as a buff stack or just plain increase in damage on hits.
let me explain what that is always show map transfer shows a dialogue any time you go somewhere so you can choose what instance of that map you go to i found it very handy due to the fact you could choose an instance with less people and therefore less lag i would say they ditched it for 2 reasons firstly if a new player had it turned on by mistake they wouldnt know what was going on and would lodge a ticket to support and the second is that they probally dont want people picking other instances because they want it all stream lined
1. Why remove the skill nodes near entrances? People like to farm during the Professions event which is only a half hour at a time. So being able to do a circuit that starts at the beginning of an area is more efficient.
2. Cleanse not removing the recently died debuff sucks. The recently died debuff is already inconvenient in dungeons.
3. Nerf on Shocking Execution is beyond ridiculous. 60%, really? That's totally overkill. That is the daily you have to wait until almost max level to acquire. It should be the strongest daily. In hard boss fights it helps the entire team to have the TR dealing a good sized shot of damage every so often. I could see 25% maybe. 60% is total nerf into the ground. C'mon guys, let's balance not destroy.
4. Threat from healing spread across enemies. Not sure about this one. Will it decrease aggro on clerics enough? Right now the amount of aggro clerics pull is completely ridiculous. Not sure if this alone is going to fix that.
5. Queue refilling with one of the same class? Why in the WORLD would you make it work like that? PLEASE RETHINK THIS. If you are kicking the last person in to the party to try and get a DC this means you will just keep getting the same class making the entire party a fail and forcing the whole party to requeue. If it is Dungeon Delves and you just waited 45 minutes to get in that is completely unfair.
Other than that, everything else is looking fairly promising. I am so thrilled about the NEED gray out. One less thing to cause animosity in dungeons. Yay!
I am excited about the majority of this update. The balance changes to the GWF however are a joke. The problem with the GWF is you nerfed the overall damage of the class by to much (50%). People have been able to get by that hardcore nerf by investing heavily in armor pen and crit instead of the, from the stats of the T2 gear, intended power, crit. So in other words we have to take the defense of the mobs or boss completely down in order to do damage that compares or excedes the other classes. Even with these nerfs to CW and rogue, which I didnt want to be honest, I still dont see there being that big a difference made. So please just increase the GWF overall damage, not just a few encounters, by even 10% and it would make such a big difference. This would also make stacking power, crit, and recovery more effective seeing as that is what ALL of the Tier 2 Gear, besides the tanky ones, has on it. I just dont see this making a big difference. Im still going to have to stack as much armor pen and crit as I can in order to be effective.
The problem with the GWF is you nerfed the overall damage of the class by to much (50%).
The problem with the GWF, and with most of the class design, is that classes are not unique enough. Both due to design and due to broken mechanics. Hopefully new paragon paths will resolve some of this issue. But fundamentally speaking, each class needs to bring something unique to the table. Otherwise everybody is just fighting over two numbers: Damage and healing. There shouldn't be a dps competition with GWF and Rogue. GWF should be bringing something unique to the table aside from damage that makes you want to bring a GWF along instead of a second Rogue.
That's the fundamental flaw in the class design. There should be a desire to bring another, different class along for a unique benefit than a desire to bring along another of the same class. The party, especially in D&D, should have a nice spread of classes that all bring something unique to the table that helps the party as a whole.
Currently, Neverwinter's class design is very muddy in that regard. All that really matters is damage, healing and to a lesser extent control. Tanking, buffing and debuffing need to matter more and each class should have access to buffs or debuffs that other classes do not have. As long as you put similar abilities on two different classes, people will take the one that's "best". GWF should bring offensive group buffs / multi target debuffs to the table. Guardian should bring group defensive buffs. Rogue should bring single target debuffs.
Everyone should do something unique that benefits the party as a whole that another class cannot replicate. Otherwise there will always be this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> measuring content over which class is the "best" to bring into a dungeon for what role.
Exactly why I hate the loot changes.
Here is an example of why this blows and is a stupid idea.
Ancient weapon drop values from Castle Never:
DC drop value 3 million AD
CW drop value 2.5 million AD
GWF drop value 1.25 million AD
GF drop value .5 million AD
TR drop 2.75 million AD
So thanks a lot devs.....as a GF I now have no chance at a valuable item while rogues, clerics, and wizards get their valuable stuff with no competition. What a slap in the face.
I most certainly have been one shot by it, in PvP on both my CW and DC, both are in Castle Never gear. There were no debuffs first, just them coming from stealth and unloading their daily. The only way you wouldnt die from it is by standing in Astral Shield, preferably two.
Nah, not true.
A rich rogue nowadays is fit company for any gentleman; and the world, my dear, hath not such a contempt for roguery as you imagine. - John HAMSTER
Exactly why I hate the loot changes.
Here is an example of why this blows and is a stupid idea.
Ancient weapon drop values from Castle Never:
DC drop value 3 million AD
CW drop value 2.5 million AD
GWF drop value 1.25 million AD
GF drop value .5 million AD
TR drop 2.75 million AD
So thanks a lot devs.....as a GF I now have no chance at a valuable item while rogues, clerics, and wizards get their valuable stuff with no competition. What a slap in the face.
Are you talking about AH values? Those are set by supply and demand, not by the devs.
1. Why remove the skill nodes near entrances? People like to farm during the Professions event which is only a half hour at a time. So being able to do a circuit that starts at the beginning of an area is more efficient.
Cause couple of my friends are farming those nodes 24\7 using bots. Still farming even after 'fix'
Carnage TR Dragon shard - retired? hell yea it's retired along with Nevewinter
so they are nerfing many of the skills of CW across the board when its dps was pretty lackluster to begin w.... still wont fix the fact that the BOSSEs cant be tanked......(why even have a GF) control magic wont knockback/stun/or freeze bosses...... Boss mechanics in this game are complete ***. FFS they even nerfed Storm Cloud DPS when it was ****ty to begin. And why was there a -5 cast reduction on avalanche if that was never the case to begin why the hell was it ever included on the tooltip does this company only employ dip****s?
The problem with the GWF, and with most of the class design, is that classes are not unique enough. Both due to design and due to broken mechanics. Hopefully new paragon paths will resolve some of this issue. But fundamentally speaking, each class needs to bring something unique to the table. Otherwise everybody is just fighting over two numbers: Damage and healing. There shouldn't be a dps competition with GWF and Rogue. GWF should be bringing something unique to the table aside from damage that makes you want to bring a GWF along instead of a second Rogue.
That's the fundamental flaw in the class design. There should be a desire to bring another, different class along for a unique benefit than a desire to bring along another of the same class. The party, especially in D&D, should have a nice spread of classes that all bring something unique to the table that helps the party as a whole.
Currently, Neverwinter's class design is very muddy in that regard. All that really matters is damage, healing and to a lesser extent control. Tanking, buffing and debuffing need to matter more and each class should have access to buffs or debuffs that other classes do not have. As long as you put similar abilities on two different classes, people will take the one that's "best". GWF should bring offensive group buffs / multi target debuffs to the table. Guardian should bring group defensive buffs. Rogue should bring single target debuffs.
Everyone should do something unique that benefits the party as a whole that another class cannot replicate. Otherwise there will always be this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> measuring content over which class is the "best" to bring into a dungeon for what role.
there wouldnt be a DPS competition between GWF/Rouge if Gearscore and end of Dungeon Parser wasnt present. The game designers made this tension happen by using a gearscore and parser system they are solely to blame for this.
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iircMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 22Arc User
edited June 2013
-Log to the game
-Looks at chat and reads "Looking for GWF and GF to dps CN......no TR"
-Yells **** this game in zone
-Log out Delete TR and CW
Spent $30 on this game since I started playing, I think it was worth it while it lasted.
Proceeds to download Dragon's Prophet.
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silknightMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 199
edited June 2013
These changes, while pretty, don't fix the core problems with the Great Weapons Fighter.
Lots of good stuff in there, with "The "Need" button is now disabled for items your class cannot use." standing out as something that will solve a lot of the community conflicts.
Many, many good changes. Really looking forward to testing this on the Test Shard.
Be a Leet D00D, can't think of something smart? Always blame the economy.
These Are some really nice updates to be honest i dint really think this game was gonna turn out like it did but i was very impressed, love the memory problem changes and i hope the next class is A Ranger like class theres a couple in game so i know you guys are thinking about it.
Feat: Cleanse: The cleanse effect now only removes one debuff at a time.
Feat: Cleanse: The cleanse effect no longer removes the "recently died" debuff.
because cleanse can only remove 1 debuff as mentioned in the feat state, and yes "recently died" debuff should be un-cleanse-able but why with 20 sec?
best free to play game ive played by far, ive played all but two classes and had no problems adventuring solo. im not sure what people are cryin about when it comes to the cleric, keep hearing theyre bad for some reason but i went solo in an area 3 levels early and did absolutely fine. I've had lots of fun with it over the control wizard and rogue, havent played a fighter yet. Game is great. Even for items that have to be paid for i havent had any problems really, i put 5$ on n got quite a decent amount to put on AH and turn around for stuff i needed. and for Astral diamonds, the leadership proff has been easy to gather and the dailies help a lot, it doesnt make the game stupid hard to get cool stuff but not stupid easy to make it into end-game content either. All around id give this game an easy 5 stars if there was a rating system.
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rapticorMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,078Arc User
i dont see a problem with it honestly, i get the effect so constantly its getting to be kinda boring to see it. It's making it too easy to remove the debuffs, feels kinda cheap to me. One of those things that's makin it too easy for the class and ruining the challenge of playing it.
yes, been a lot of this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> with one person inviting for dungeons/skirmishes, whatever and kicking people at the end n taking all the loot, geting annoying. cool add
Comments
If you're using Shocking Execution over Lurker's Assault in PvE you're pretty much gimping your damage.
That lone 30k crit (which will now become a lone 10k crit, if not less if we count the Deadly Momentum nerf) is nowhere near what 10 seconds of Lurker's Assault give you considering a usual "stealth and spam at wills, finish with Lashing Blade" rotation with a 20% severity boost.
I most certainly have been one shot by it, in PvP on both my CW and DC, both are in Castle Never gear. There were no debuffs first, just them coming from stealth and unloading their daily. The only way you wouldnt die from it is by standing in Astral Shield, preferably two.
Occam's Razor makes the cutting clean.
"Shocking Execution: The base damage of this power has been reduced by 60%."
It is understandable to reduce the base damage of shocking execution cus it is not meant to 1 shot ppl in pvp from 100% HP to dead. But i would say it should have been balanced rather than nerfed. By balancing i mean, reduce the base damage but increase the multiplier on the amount of HP lost. That means increase the multiplier on the damage increase due the reduced HP on the target, so it will not be a 1 shot, it will be what its name suggest SHOCKING EXECUTION!!! If a rouge is fool enough to use it on target with 100% HP that skill does less damage than a AT-Will, but on a target with 30% HP, it will execute it right-away.
Another thing i wanna add is that there should be something done to the Daily, Bloodbath. Most player stop using it in later game due to the way it works. The rouge jumps to random targets with random hits that deal insignificant damage. I am putting up some suggestions to improve it in later times.
1. Allow something like target painting, where the player can select the targets he wants to jump(Switch Target) on. It perfectly makes sense, a rouge will plan and select his pray b4 going for it not just mindlessly jump(Switch Target) here and there.
OR
2. Increase the amount of damage dealt on every jump(Switch Target). Well, on single target increasing the damage will make it an over powered skill for pvp but instead increasing the damage on every jump will make it an interesting skill. Maybe after 4th jump(Switch Target) it can even kill a player with 100% HP, but none, not even the rouge himself will know who will be the victim
a PROUD zephyr of αlpha GUILD
" It's a cold cruel world and you'll freeze if you're weak. "
Claymore
AMEN to that my friend!
1. Why remove the skill nodes near entrances? People like to farm during the Professions event which is only a half hour at a time. So being able to do a circuit that starts at the beginning of an area is more efficient.
2. Cleanse not removing the recently died debuff sucks. The recently died debuff is already inconvenient in dungeons.
3. Nerf on Shocking Execution is beyond ridiculous. 60%, really? That's totally overkill. That is the daily you have to wait until almost max level to acquire. It should be the strongest daily. In hard boss fights it helps the entire team to have the TR dealing a good sized shot of damage every so often. I could see 25% maybe. 60% is total nerf into the ground. C'mon guys, let's balance not destroy.
4. Threat from healing spread across enemies. Not sure about this one. Will it decrease aggro on clerics enough? Right now the amount of aggro clerics pull is completely ridiculous. Not sure if this alone is going to fix that.
5. Queue refilling with one of the same class? Why in the WORLD would you make it work like that? PLEASE RETHINK THIS. If you are kicking the last person in to the party to try and get a DC this means you will just keep getting the same class making the entire party a fail and forcing the whole party to requeue. If it is Dungeon Delves and you just waited 45 minutes to get in that is completely unfair.
Other than that, everything else is looking fairly promising. I am so thrilled about the NEED gray out. One less thing to cause animosity in dungeons. Yay!
The problem with the GWF, and with most of the class design, is that classes are not unique enough. Both due to design and due to broken mechanics. Hopefully new paragon paths will resolve some of this issue. But fundamentally speaking, each class needs to bring something unique to the table. Otherwise everybody is just fighting over two numbers: Damage and healing. There shouldn't be a dps competition with GWF and Rogue. GWF should be bringing something unique to the table aside from damage that makes you want to bring a GWF along instead of a second Rogue.
That's the fundamental flaw in the class design. There should be a desire to bring another, different class along for a unique benefit than a desire to bring along another of the same class. The party, especially in D&D, should have a nice spread of classes that all bring something unique to the table that helps the party as a whole.
Currently, Neverwinter's class design is very muddy in that regard. All that really matters is damage, healing and to a lesser extent control. Tanking, buffing and debuffing need to matter more and each class should have access to buffs or debuffs that other classes do not have. As long as you put similar abilities on two different classes, people will take the one that's "best". GWF should bring offensive group buffs / multi target debuffs to the table. Guardian should bring group defensive buffs. Rogue should bring single target debuffs.
Everyone should do something unique that benefits the party as a whole that another class cannot replicate. Otherwise there will always be this <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> measuring content over which class is the "best" to bring into a dungeon for what role.
Here is an example of why this blows and is a stupid idea.
Ancient weapon drop values from Castle Never:
DC drop value 3 million AD
CW drop value 2.5 million AD
GWF drop value 1.25 million AD
GF drop value .5 million AD
TR drop 2.75 million AD
So thanks a lot devs.....as a GF I now have no chance at a valuable item while rogues, clerics, and wizards get their valuable stuff with no competition. What a slap in the face.
Nah, not true.
Are you talking about AH values? Those are set by supply and demand, not by the devs.
Cause couple of my friends are farming those nodes 24\7 using bots. Still farming even after 'fix'
Seze - Rogue - Necropolis -
there wouldnt be a DPS competition between GWF/Rouge if Gearscore and end of Dungeon Parser wasnt present. The game designers made this tension happen by using a gearscore and parser system they are solely to blame for this.
-Looks at chat and reads "Looking for GWF and GF to dps CN......no TR"
-Yells **** this game in zone
-Log out Delete TR and CW
Spent $30 on this game since I started playing, I think it was worth it while it lasted.
Proceeds to download Dragon's Prophet.
Those "friends" should be banned for using bots. Why do the good players have to suffer because of stupid cheaters?:(
I can get about the other fixes like these 2:
because cleanse can only remove 1 debuff as mentioned in the feat state, and yes "recently died" debuff should be un-cleanse-able but why with 20 sec?
I like how everyone proceeds to tell us they're going to another game, and what that game happens to be, when they quit. What's the point?
Oh and btw, Dragon's Prophet is... meh. But guess you'll find that out!