"WoW classes weren't unique! That's bad!"
"NWO classes can all do the same thing! That's good!"
Apologies for being facetious, but you are kinda contradicting yourself there. Listen, I want NWO to be good, and I certainly don't want a WoW v NWO discussion. I'd just like it if NWO had more starting classes, and I'm pretty sure everyone would. I don't have a masses of time to play games any more so, if I want to keep up with the end game, new classes coming out in 6 months doesn't really help me much .
Having a companion is the sort of thing that all classes should have. Whether it's a person or an animal is something reasonably left to the desires of the player, not something that needs to be determined by class.
NWO classes have a lot of difference in how they play, and how they approach combat. That's where variety is important.
Obviously, more classes would be better. But we can't always get everything we want. The launch classes look great to me, and represent a solid (meaningful) amount of variety.
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iamtruthseekerMember, Moonstars, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
You do realize most MMO's only release with 4-6 classes right? WoW is 8+ years old and has only released 2 new classes in 4 expansions... Now thats a game I would be pissed at.
Anyone want to guess how many levels WoW started with also?
Oh what the heck:
DOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!
Tension breaker, had to be done!
I'd quote link it the reference but some mean ole managers don't let us do our off topic quotes no mor' 'ere .
Having a companion is the sort of thing that all classes should have. Whether it's a person or an animal is something reasonably left to the desires of the player, not something that needs to be determined by class.
NWO classes have a lot of difference in how they play, and how they approach combat. That's where variety is important.
Obviously, more classes would be better. But we can't always get everything we want. The launch classes look great to me, and represent a solid (meaningful) amount of variety.
Yeah, but in WoW there was a specific Hunter class. I was rebuking the comment about WoW classes lacking uniqueness, which was in defence of the lack of NWO classes. They didn't lack uniqueness, and if a Hunter specced a certain way their pet was a huge percentage of their DPS. It went far beyond a companion.
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quorforgedMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Don't know if this has been mentioned, but in the stream last night on MMORPG, it was pretty much confirmed that the ranger would be added sometime in the near* future. It's a new MMO, give it a chance. If I may compare it to WoW, I believe there were what 7 or 8 at launch? Not that much more IMO. Also this is a lot different to that.
Nine. One off being twice as many as NWO. Again, I don't want to compare the two games but there's some reality distortion going on here. Five classes is not many, some would say not enough.
It really isn't so much how many classes we have in an MMO as it is what we can do in said MMO. And as has been said, more races and classes will be added to the game over time.
You can't beat the entry cost to play the game...
You are correct it is not the number of classes but what we can do. So for me to do what I want in this game they need more classes.
Do love the cost.
Now five from nine leaves four. hmmmmm four more classes couls increase choice quite a bit here is a random list. Paladin, Bard (pick a build), Ranger (Duel weapon and ranged) to me that adds quite a bit to the game.
Except it doesn't work like mana at all. It's a damage absorption meter.
Exactly how should a tumble and a short ranged teleport be more different?
On the basis of what?
1. "Damage Absorption Meter" - thank you. This is why I asked. Previous answers I saw were less than helpful.
2. Concerning tumble I believe any character who puts training into it should be able to tumble, not just the Rogue. Teleport should not be just the same thing dressed up different. Perhaps teleport should take you to a different place in the dungeon - a safe place you've already been or a point on the map you designate (not sure exactly how it might work).
3. It seems like Gauntlet to me because the characters all seem to have the same basic powers, regardless of whether they are magical or physical. They all look like they behave the same way but are simply dressed up different to represent "Wizard" as opposed to "Rogue".
I truly hope I'm wrong and their is depth to this game. You can also bet I will play. I've been waiting a long time for this. I'm just a bit apprehensive it won't will live up to the Neverwinter Nights brand. It seems watered down to me so far. Neverwinter Nights completely rocked and I just want to see this game take it up a level and be better.
I'm here to learn more & I truly hope my fears are invalid.
Well I for one disagree with the OP on every point, The combat looks fun and exciting to me and I'm hardly a "kiddie" as has been drilled into the ground more classes are coming, but the most inane thing is, this is a f2p game and some of these armchair critics are already crying fail before it's launched never mind it's not going to cost them a red cent...so what they are saying is it isn't even worth a download...and that is really sad.
Face it folks, this is Gauntlet, not Dungeons and Dragons. The only thing anybody has said on this thread so far that I can see in defense of the game is that it's free. The OP seems right about this.
What exactly should a D&D MMO look like in your opinion then?
muzrub333Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited February 2013
After watching the MMORPG, and Massively streams, my optimism for this game is at an all time low, with the only things keeping me around is the fact that it's F2P, and I can try it without losing anything but my time, and the hope that the foundry will be really good. The rest of the game, with it's omission of just very basic things, seems like the devs worked very hard on gimmicks. I think they truly wanted to make a cutting edge game, but got so involved in that pursuit, that they forgot about things that are needed in an MMORPG. Esp. one that is going to claim a D&D pedigree. Sorry, but 5 classes on a D&D based game is not good enough, and it's totally irrelevant what other games released with; this isn't some other game. Makes you wonder what they spent all their development time on; balancing for PvP, pop up stat/parse boards at the end of encounters, golden trails to hold your hand on your epic adventures...
BUT...even though I am thoroughly annoyed at the thought that the devs couldn't figure out how to animate a frikkin axe, I will STILL give it a shot when it releases, and pray that it is more than just another little kids game hiding behind the MMORPG descriptor.
We'll see I guess.
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iamtruthseekerMember, Moonstars, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Right.... yeah people at launch could just charge at bosses without any tactic whatsoever and overcome on first attempts. That is completely not what I saw. If people just charged in you died, plain and simple. While yeah Deadmines there was little mechanics but other early dungeons were not that case at all. And AoC was NEVER easy, one of the perks about FunCom was that they knew how to make dungeons.
The dungeon could have been watered down for the press event then again it could be fully working as intended.
Sorry the first dungeon in WoW I played was Ragefire Chasm on my Druid and I never healed nor did I ever have to worry about dieing because the mobs including the bosses dropped supremely quick. As for AoC I vaguely remember tanking on my Barbarian (A Rogue class and not even no tanking abilities) in Bubshur House and not one death.
The only MMO that had hard entry level dungeons of the hundreds of MMO's Ive played was GW2. Died about 50 times the first time I did Ascalonian Dungeons with my guild group on vent coms. Besides its not the starter dungeons that matters its the endgame level cap dungeons that matter.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Character is what a man is in the dark
After watching the MMORPG, and Massively streams, my optimism for this game is at an all time low, with the only things keeping me around is the fact that it's F2P, and I can try it without losing anything but my time, and the hope that the foundry will be really good. The rest of the game, with it's omission of just very basic things, seems like the devs worked very hard on gimmicks. I think they truly wanted to make a cutting edge game, but got so involved in that pursuit, that they forgot about things that are needed in an MMORPG. Esp. one that is going to claim a D&D pedigree. Sorry, but 5 classes on a D&D based game is not good enough, and it's totally irrelevant what other games released with; this isn't some other game. Makes you wonder what they spent all their development time on; balancing for PvP, pop up stat/parse boards at the end of encounters, golden trails to hold your hand on your epic adventures...
BUT...even though I am thoroughly annoyed at the thought that the devs couldn't figure out how to animate a frikkin axe, I will STILL give it a shot when it releases, and pray that it is more than just another little kids game hiding behind the MMORPG descriptor.
We'll see I guess.
The 2nd and 4th edition players handbooks each had 8 classes, the 1st edition players handbook had 6. 3rd was pretty unique in that it had 11. Regardless I fail to see how 5 classes at release showhow makes you less excited for the game, were you planning on playing all 8 at once if they had that many?
2. Concerning tumble I believe any character who puts training into it should be able to tumble, not just the Rogue. Teleport should not be just the same thing dressed up different. Perhaps teleport should take you to a different place in the dungeon - a safe place you've already been or a point on the map you designate (not sure exactly how it might work).
Re: tumble: why "should" any character be able to tumble as well as the Rogue? Why shouldn't the Rogue have its own things its exceptionally good at doing?
Re: teleport: But it's not a long ranged teleport. It's a short ranged teleport, usable quickly within the battlefield. What's wrong with having that available? Think more Dimension Door spell, not Teleport spell. Perhaps there will be longer ranged teleports available, but that's not this ability, and wouldn't serve the purpose that this one does.
3. It seems like Gauntlet to me because the characters all seem to have the same basic powers, regardless of whether they are magical or physical. They all look like they behave the same way but are simply dressed up different to represent "Wizard" as opposed to "Rogue".
Except they don't. Their attacks are very different, they each have different "charge up" mechanics (Cleric's Channel Divinity is completely different from Rogue's Stealth).
You seem to be latching on to one minor thing (the "get out of trouble" ability) and viewing that as indicative of sameness all around. Which isn't even true in that specific case, because the Guardian doesn't get a tumble or a teleport analog.
Re: tumble: why "should" any character be able to tumble as well as the Rogue? Why shouldn't the Rogue have its own things its exceptionally good at doing?
Re: teleport: But it's not a long ranged teleport. It's a short ranged teleport, usable quickly within the battlefield. What's wrong with having that available? Think more Dimension Door spell, not Teleport spell. Perhaps there will be longer ranged teleports available, but that's not this ability, and wouldn't serve the purpose that this one does.
Except they don't. Their attacks are very different, they each have different "charge up" mechanics (Cleric's Channel Divinity is completely different from Rogue's Stealth).
You seem to be latching on to one minor thing (the "get out of trouble" ability) and viewing that as indicative of sameness all around. Which isn't even true in that specific case, because the Guardian doesn't get a tumble or a teleport analog.
I never said any character should be able to tumble as good as a Rogue. There are varying degrees of proficiency. Why should a Wizard *not* be able to learn to tumble?
Dimension Door should have a decent enough range to take you to a different room. Can you use the Control Wizard teleport to get to a different room?
Concerning latching on to "one minor thing", the wizard gets "Chill Strike" while the Rogue gets "Dazing Strike". Now we're up to two.
After watching the MMORPG, and Massively streams, my optimism for this game is at an all time low, with the only things keeping me around is the fact that it's F2P, and I can try it without losing anything but my time, and the hope that the foundry will be really good. The rest of the game, with it's omission of just very basic things, seems like the devs worked very hard on gimmicks. I think they truly wanted to make a cutting edge game, but got so involved in that pursuit, that they forgot about things that are needed in an MMORPG. Esp. one that is going to claim a D&D pedigree. Sorry, but 5 classes on a D&D based game is not good enough, and it's totally irrelevant what other games released with; this isn't some other game. Makes you wonder what they spent all their development time on; balancing for PvP, pop up stat/parse boards at the end of encounters, golden trails to hold your hand on your epic adventures...
BUT...even though I am thoroughly annoyed at the thought that the devs couldn't figure out how to animate a frikkin axe, I will STILL give it a shot when it releases, and pray that it is more than just another little kids game hiding behind the MMORPG descriptor.
We'll see I guess.
Listen this is a F2P game and the developers and Jack Emmert himself said you cant go balls to the wall (basically) you have to pick and choose what your identy of the game is going to be and its fairly obvious from hundreds of interviews NWO is going for a Action Style content heavy, Dungeon Delving MMO. I do not expect things like PvP, raiding or intricate character classes to take a backseat.
What you call gimmicks I call D&D source material to give it that vibe. Like I said in an earlier post this game wont be for everyone and that is fine but theres no use crying over spilled milk on percieved development shortages when the things it does do it does them amazingly well.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Character is what a man is in the dark
Another thing for those not fond of the character classes (or the percieved lack of classes) you got to hand it to the devs they recently implemented the Tab functionality to further give the classes another form of character identity. To me this has been the biggest reason to be optimistic as I was not expecting that at all.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Character is what a man is in the dark
Re: tumble: why "should" any character be able to tumble as well as the Rogue? Why shouldn't the Rogue have its own things its exceptionally good at doing?
Re: teleport: But it's not a long ranged teleport. It's a short ranged teleport, usable quickly within the battlefield. What's wrong with having that available? Think more Dimension Door spell, not Teleport spell. Perhaps there will be longer ranged teleports available, but that's not this ability, and wouldn't serve the purpose that this one does.
Except they don't. Their attacks are very different, they each have different "charge up" mechanics (Cleric's Channel Divinity is completely different from Rogue's Stealth).
You seem to be latching on to one minor thing (the "get out of trouble" ability) and viewing that as indicative of sameness all around. Which isn't even true in that specific case, because the Guardian doesn't get a tumble or a teleport analog.
not to mention the class specific escape ability is different for all classes unlike say GW2 where everyone gets the same dodge. Plus he should realize this is an action MMO and all the combat skills should focus on combat. Sounds like he wants more fluff skills which isnt what this game is about.
I always hated hearing guildies talking about watching a movie, eating a sandwhich or doing other nonsense while playing a tab target based MMO like WoW. Cringed every time I heard that and it happened alot. Nothign exciting about that style of gaming.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Character is what a man is in the dark
I never said any character should be able to tumble as good as a Rogue. There are varying degrees of proficiency. Why should a Wizard *not* be able to learn to tumble?
Dimension Door should have a decent enough range to take you to a different room. Can you use the Control Wizard teleport to get to a different room?
...
Wizard should not tumble because their dress will get dirty. And they do not like their dress to get dirty.
*someone shouts. 'its not a dress! its a robe'*
Dimension Door??? huh??? I think you mean utility teleport spell, no?
That is not a dimesion door. Its a simple teleport.
For the teleport utility to work, you should be able to see the terrain (unless you are completely familiar with it). Otherwise instead of teleporting where you want, you can get teleported inside groud mixing you blood vessles with sand and dying instantly.
Hope that answered your questions?
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xantrisMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited February 2013
Why are D&D tabletop guys so damned and determined to plug their turn based dice game into a live action video-game environment. Nobody played games like Neverwinter Nights for their combat mechanics.
I think there is a legitimate concern about how mediocre Cryptic does questing and storyline content, but the combat and skill mechanics aspect is not a concern.
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muzrub333Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The 2nd and 4th edition players handbooks each had 8 classes, the 1st edition players handbook had 6. 3rd was pretty unique in that it had 11. Regardless I fail to see how 5 classes at release showhow makes you less excited for the game, were you planning on playing all 8 at once if they had that many?
I would expect it to have all the classes available for the rules set it is supposedly being based upon at release. It's not a game like EQ, or Wow, where you don't have any existing lore/IP, and can just add a class here and there. It's D&D, and when I buy the PHB, there isn't a comment in the margins saying that I'll get rangers or monks or fighters at a later date, and that we might introduce bows and axes later too, but they are just so darn tough to figure out. Nope, I get them all right now, and probably some odd specialized classes as well. And yeah, I generally have at least one character of every available class, and trade class if those are available. Right now, I am actually hoping they are just lying to us, and that all the other classes will need to be purchased, at least then I could see why the classes aren't available. I figure they aren't, but /shrug
Like I said above though, I will still give it a try; not like I bought a founders pack, so I won't need to feel obligated to play to get my moneys worth. I really do hope we see real D&D weapon choices, bows, classes, and some more races pretty quickly, and that the games succeeds. I am just really flabbergasted by the info that has come to light in the past few days, and frankly need to vent a bit.
...
Re: teleport: But it's not a long ranged teleport. It's a short ranged teleport, usable quickly within the battlefield. What's wrong with having that available? Think more Dimension Door spell, not Teleport spell. Perhaps there will be longer ranged teleports available, but that's not this ability, and wouldn't serve the purpose that this one does.
...Except they don't. Their attacks are very different, they each have different "charge up" mechanics (Cleric's Channel Divinity is completely different from Rogue's Stealth).
You seem to be latching on to one minor thing (the "get out of trouble" ability) and viewing that as indicative of sameness all around. Which isn't even true in that specific case, because the Guardian doesn't get a tumble or a teleport analog.
No dear lord! Its not dimention door!
Its teleport utility spell!
According to laws of Mordenkien,
"Distance traveled in teleport is direcly proportional to concentration of wizard."
Hence utility teleport, which requires a moment instead of a few days required to prepare teleport spell, teleports to to a small distance. Not only that you can only teleport to a terrain you can see (as otherwise it is not accurate).
Guardian gets shield block. GWF also gets something else than dodge (see in videos)
Also one more thing, cleric can also get something other than dodge : but it is probably not the right time to reveal it.
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dequixoticMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I would expect it to have all the classes available for the rules set it is supposedly being based upon at release. It's not a game like EQ, or Wow, where you don't have any existing lore/IP, and can just add a class here and there. It's D&D, and when I buy the PHB, there isn't a comment in the margins saying that I'll get rangers or monks or fighters at a later date, and that we might introduce bows and axes later too, but they are just so darn tough to figure out. Nope, I get them all right now, and probably some odd specialized classes as well. And yeah, I generally have at least one character of every available class, and trade class if those are available. Right now, I am actually hoping they are just lying to us, and that all the other classes will need to be purchased, at least then I could see why the classes aren't available. I figure they aren't, but /shrug
This isn't true. Barbarian, Bard, and Druid weren't available in 4E until Player's Handbook 2. Classes and mechanics are added all the time. D&D doesn't release everything at once--every edition they add supplements and new/old classes and monster.
I would much prefer continued support after launch than a tacked on or incomplete version of a class.
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quorforgedMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I never said any character should be able to tumble as good as a Rogue. There are varying degrees of proficiency. Why should a Wizard *not* be able to learn to tumble?
They should all be able to learn to fiddle and bake cakes too, but an MMO's mechanics focuses on what characters are good at doing that it's useful. Rogue is the only one that is good enough at it for it to be an effective tool in combat. For others, you can write "amateur gymnast" in the bio field. I don't see anything wrong with that.
Dimension Door should have a decent enough range to take you to a different room. Can you use the Control Wizard teleport to get to a different room?
I said similar, not that it is Dimension Door. It's not designed to get you to a different room. It's designed to be an emergency "get out of the way" teleport. The sort of thing that works great for action combat, but would be less useful in a turn-based PnP setting.
What is wrong with:
1) There existing a teleport ability that is short range, and requires line of sight
2) That teleport serving a purpose similar to a tumble
Concerning latching on to "one minor thing", the wizard gets "Chill Strike" while the Rogue gets "Dazing Strike". Now we're up to two.
Chill Strike is ranged. A huge icicle through the chest is also a little different than being knocked upside the head.
In any event, I'm not sure what variety you're expecting to see?
..., and the hope that the foundry will be really good. ..s.
It is not going to be "really" good. And I am not talking on basis of some cryptic information only I have.(pun intended )
It is just that it is a good oppurtunity to see UGC creation in MMO. If you think it will be really good, you are probably mistaken as afaik, it is the first UGC for D&D based MMO. It is suosed to establish protocols, as it has no one to get compared to.
So if you compare with single player games UGC, it is going to be very limited. It will probably be very cubersome to use too. However, it is the first of its kind and that is what makes us excited!
...
That said, it's a block meter, not mana. Deal with it.
You are absolutely correct on this point... except... its not block meter.
It is different for each class - like a HUD indicator. But D&D has no concept of mana.
And anyone knowking 4e, would understand how alien it sounds that 4e D&D based game will ever recognize something as mana after unveiling At-wills and encounters.
I would expect it to have all the classes available for the rules set it is supposedly being based upon at release. It's not a game like EQ, or Wow, where you don't have any existing lore/IP, and can just add a class here and there. It's D&D, and when I buy the PHB, there isn't a comment in the margins saying that I'll get rangers or monks or fighters at a later date, and that we might introduce bows and axes later too, but they are just so darn tough to figure out. Nope, I get them all right now, and probably some odd specialized classes as well. And yeah, I generally have at least one character of every available class, and trade class if those are available. Right now, I am actually hoping they are just lying to us, and that all the other classes will need to be purchased, at least then I could see why the classes aren't available. I figure they aren't, but /shrug
Like I said above though, I will still give it a try; not like I bought a founders pack, so I won't need to feel obligated to play to get my moneys worth. I really do hope we see real D&D weapon choices, bows, classes, and some more races pretty quickly, and that the games succeeds. I am just really flabbergasted by the info that has come to light in the past few days, and frankly need to vent a bit.
Monks were only a initial release D&D class in 3rd edition, they were added on after release of 2nd and 4th edition. So while there was no comment that you'd get them at a later date in the 4th edition players handbook they weren't present at release. Is only 3rd edition D&D therefore proper D&D to you? If its not then your comment about getting monks all right now is factually inaccurate.
4th edition's release included warlocks and warlords, two classes that didn't exist at all prior to 4th edition(although warlocks replaced sorcerers, a class that didn't exist until 3rd edition.) Bards were a release class in 2nd and 3rd edition but not 4th. Druids were a release class in 2nd and 3rd but not 4th. You are right again, there was no comment in the margins explaining their absence, but you didn't get them at release.
In fact, the only two classes available at release in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th editions that aren't available at release in Neverwinter online are the Ranger and the Paladin.
johnny305Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited February 2013
I like how it looks. Seems to be Tera + D&D Online as far as gameplay.
-Graphics are not up to par with the best out there, but nice enough for me
-Combat looks spammy but fun and you need teamwork and the trinity
-Most content seems to be instanced but they said there are also open world areas
-The menu system to find PVE/PVP content looks kinda fun as it lets you find what you want to do fast
It looks fun enough for me, I will be playing this for sure.
Comments
Having a companion is the sort of thing that all classes should have. Whether it's a person or an animal is something reasonably left to the desires of the player, not something that needs to be determined by class.
NWO classes have a lot of difference in how they play, and how they approach combat. That's where variety is important.
Obviously, more classes would be better. But we can't always get everything we want. The launch classes look great to me, and represent a solid (meaningful) amount of variety.
Anyone want to guess how many levels WoW started with also?
Oh what the heck:
DOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!
Tension breaker, had to be done!
I'd quote link it the reference but some mean ole managers don't let us do our off topic quotes no mor' 'ere
Yeah, but in WoW there was a specific Hunter class. I was rebuking the comment about WoW classes lacking uniqueness, which was in defence of the lack of NWO classes. They didn't lack uniqueness, and if a Hunter specced a certain way their pet was a huge percentage of their DPS. It went far beyond a companion.
Except it doesn't work like mana at all. It's a damage absorption meter.
Exactly how should a tumble and a short ranged teleport be more different?
On the basis of what?
Nine. One off being twice as many as NWO. Again, I don't want to compare the two games but there's some reality distortion going on here. Five classes is not many, some would say not enough.
You are correct it is not the number of classes but what we can do. So for me to do what I want in this game they need more classes.
Do love the cost.
Now five from nine leaves four. hmmmmm four more classes couls increase choice quite a bit here is a random list. Paladin, Bard (pick a build), Ranger (Duel weapon and ranged) to me that adds quite a bit to the game.
1. "Damage Absorption Meter" - thank you. This is why I asked. Previous answers I saw were less than helpful.
2. Concerning tumble I believe any character who puts training into it should be able to tumble, not just the Rogue. Teleport should not be just the same thing dressed up different. Perhaps teleport should take you to a different place in the dungeon - a safe place you've already been or a point on the map you designate (not sure exactly how it might work).
3. It seems like Gauntlet to me because the characters all seem to have the same basic powers, regardless of whether they are magical or physical. They all look like they behave the same way but are simply dressed up different to represent "Wizard" as opposed to "Rogue".
I truly hope I'm wrong and their is depth to this game. You can also bet I will play. I've been waiting a long time for this. I'm just a bit apprehensive it won't will live up to the Neverwinter Nights brand. It seems watered down to me so far. Neverwinter Nights completely rocked and I just want to see this game take it up a level and be better.
I'm here to learn more & I truly hope my fears are invalid.
And I cant wait for the 2 weeks after release and non-players and haters forget about the game and move onto the next haterade material.
Character is what a man is in the dark
What exactly should a D&D MMO look like in your opinion then?
Neverwinter Official Wiki - http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/
BUT...even though I am thoroughly annoyed at the thought that the devs couldn't figure out how to animate a frikkin axe, I will STILL give it a shot when it releases, and pray that it is more than just another little kids game hiding behind the MMORPG descriptor.
We'll see I guess.
Sorry the first dungeon in WoW I played was Ragefire Chasm on my Druid and I never healed nor did I ever have to worry about dieing because the mobs including the bosses dropped supremely quick. As for AoC I vaguely remember tanking on my Barbarian (A Rogue class and not even no tanking abilities) in Bubshur House and not one death.
The only MMO that had hard entry level dungeons of the hundreds of MMO's Ive played was GW2. Died about 50 times the first time I did Ascalonian Dungeons with my guild group on vent coms. Besides its not the starter dungeons that matters its the endgame level cap dungeons that matter.
Character is what a man is in the dark
The 2nd and 4th edition players handbooks each had 8 classes, the 1st edition players handbook had 6. 3rd was pretty unique in that it had 11. Regardless I fail to see how 5 classes at release showhow makes you less excited for the game, were you planning on playing all 8 at once if they had that many?
Neverwinter Official Wiki - http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/
Re: tumble: why "should" any character be able to tumble as well as the Rogue? Why shouldn't the Rogue have its own things its exceptionally good at doing?
Re: teleport: But it's not a long ranged teleport. It's a short ranged teleport, usable quickly within the battlefield. What's wrong with having that available? Think more Dimension Door spell, not Teleport spell. Perhaps there will be longer ranged teleports available, but that's not this ability, and wouldn't serve the purpose that this one does.
Except they don't. Their attacks are very different, they each have different "charge up" mechanics (Cleric's Channel Divinity is completely different from Rogue's Stealth).
You seem to be latching on to one minor thing (the "get out of trouble" ability) and viewing that as indicative of sameness all around. Which isn't even true in that specific case, because the Guardian doesn't get a tumble or a teleport analog.
That and Lemon pucker up.
Character is what a man is in the dark
I never said any character should be able to tumble as good as a Rogue. There are varying degrees of proficiency. Why should a Wizard *not* be able to learn to tumble?
Dimension Door should have a decent enough range to take you to a different room. Can you use the Control Wizard teleport to get to a different room?
Concerning latching on to "one minor thing", the wizard gets "Chill Strike" while the Rogue gets "Dazing Strike". Now we're up to two.
Listen this is a F2P game and the developers and Jack Emmert himself said you cant go balls to the wall (basically) you have to pick and choose what your identy of the game is going to be and its fairly obvious from hundreds of interviews NWO is going for a Action Style content heavy, Dungeon Delving MMO. I do not expect things like PvP, raiding or intricate character classes to take a backseat.
What you call gimmicks I call D&D source material to give it that vibe. Like I said in an earlier post this game wont be for everyone and that is fine but theres no use crying over spilled milk on percieved development shortages when the things it does do it does them amazingly well.
Character is what a man is in the dark
Character is what a man is in the dark
not to mention the class specific escape ability is different for all classes unlike say GW2 where everyone gets the same dodge. Plus he should realize this is an action MMO and all the combat skills should focus on combat. Sounds like he wants more fluff skills which isnt what this game is about.
I always hated hearing guildies talking about watching a movie, eating a sandwhich or doing other nonsense while playing a tab target based MMO like WoW. Cringed every time I heard that and it happened alot. Nothign exciting about that style of gaming.
Character is what a man is in the dark
Wizard should not tumble because their dress will get dirty. And they do not like their dress to get dirty.
*someone shouts. 'its not a dress! its a robe'*
Dimension Door??? huh??? I think you mean utility teleport spell, no?
That is not a dimesion door. Its a simple teleport.
For the teleport utility to work, you should be able to see the terrain (unless you are completely familiar with it). Otherwise instead of teleporting where you want, you can get teleported inside groud mixing you blood vessles with sand and dying instantly.
Hope that answered your questions?
I think there is a legitimate concern about how mediocre Cryptic does questing and storyline content, but the combat and skill mechanics aspect is not a concern.
I would expect it to have all the classes available for the rules set it is supposedly being based upon at release. It's not a game like EQ, or Wow, where you don't have any existing lore/IP, and can just add a class here and there. It's D&D, and when I buy the PHB, there isn't a comment in the margins saying that I'll get rangers or monks or fighters at a later date, and that we might introduce bows and axes later too, but they are just so darn tough to figure out. Nope, I get them all right now, and probably some odd specialized classes as well. And yeah, I generally have at least one character of every available class, and trade class if those are available. Right now, I am actually hoping they are just lying to us, and that all the other classes will need to be purchased, at least then I could see why the classes aren't available. I figure they aren't, but /shrug
Like I said above though, I will still give it a try; not like I bought a founders pack, so I won't need to feel obligated to play to get my moneys worth. I really do hope we see real D&D weapon choices, bows, classes, and some more races pretty quickly, and that the games succeeds. I am just really flabbergasted by the info that has come to light in the past few days, and frankly need to vent a bit.
Its teleport utility spell!
According to laws of Mordenkien,
"Distance traveled in teleport is direcly proportional to concentration of wizard."
Hence utility teleport, which requires a moment instead of a few days required to prepare teleport spell, teleports to to a small distance. Not only that you can only teleport to a terrain you can see (as otherwise it is not accurate).
Guardian gets shield block. GWF also gets something else than dodge (see in videos)
Also one more thing, cleric can also get something other than dodge : but it is probably not the right time to reveal it.
This isn't true. Barbarian, Bard, and Druid weren't available in 4E until Player's Handbook 2. Classes and mechanics are added all the time. D&D doesn't release everything at once--every edition they add supplements and new/old classes and monster.
I would much prefer continued support after launch than a tacked on or incomplete version of a class.
They should all be able to learn to fiddle and bake cakes too, but an MMO's mechanics focuses on what characters are good at doing that it's useful. Rogue is the only one that is good enough at it for it to be an effective tool in combat. For others, you can write "amateur gymnast" in the bio field. I don't see anything wrong with that.
I said similar, not that it is Dimension Door. It's not designed to get you to a different room. It's designed to be an emergency "get out of the way" teleport. The sort of thing that works great for action combat, but would be less useful in a turn-based PnP setting.
What is wrong with:
1) There existing a teleport ability that is short range, and requires line of sight
2) That teleport serving a purpose similar to a tumble
Chill Strike is ranged. A huge icicle through the chest is also a little different than being knocked upside the head.
In any event, I'm not sure what variety you're expecting to see?
It is not going to be "really" good. And I am not talking on basis of some cryptic information only I have.(pun intended
It is just that it is a good oppurtunity to see UGC creation in MMO. If you think it will be really good, you are probably mistaken as afaik, it is the first UGC for D&D based MMO. It is suosed to establish protocols, as it has no one to get compared to.
So if you compare with single player games UGC, it is going to be very limited. It will probably be very cubersome to use too. However, it is the first of its kind and that is what makes us excited!
You are absolutely correct on this point... except... its not block meter.
It is different for each class - like a HUD indicator. But D&D has no concept of mana.
And anyone knowking 4e, would understand how alien it sounds that 4e D&D based game will ever recognize something as mana after unveiling At-wills and encounters.
*sigh*
Monks were only a initial release D&D class in 3rd edition, they were added on after release of 2nd and 4th edition. So while there was no comment that you'd get them at a later date in the 4th edition players handbook they weren't present at release. Is only 3rd edition D&D therefore proper D&D to you? If its not then your comment about getting monks all right now is factually inaccurate.
4th edition's release included warlocks and warlords, two classes that didn't exist at all prior to 4th edition(although warlocks replaced sorcerers, a class that didn't exist until 3rd edition.) Bards were a release class in 2nd and 3rd edition but not 4th. Druids were a release class in 2nd and 3rd but not 4th. You are right again, there was no comment in the margins explaining their absence, but you didn't get them at release.
In fact, the only two classes available at release in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th editions that aren't available at release in Neverwinter online are the Ranger and the Paladin.
Neverwinter Official Wiki - http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/
-Graphics are not up to par with the best out there, but nice enough for me
-Combat looks spammy but fun and you need teamwork and the trinity
-Most content seems to be instanced but they said there are also open world areas
-The menu system to find PVE/PVP content looks kinda fun as it lets you find what you want to do fast
It looks fun enough for me, I will be playing this for sure.