That just doesn't make sense. "Not using the system as intended" Then why did they create Guild Boxes in the first place.
I'm using the system as it was created! Small guilds are going to suffer with these changes... I think that's the intent.
They maybe making it better for MW crafters, but not Guild crafters.
I understand Balance changes. And typically don't care one way or the other. Time to move on....
Well, from what I've heard (and we all know how reliable that part makes the rest of this!), they are planning an update to guilds some time next year. I'm hopeful that they'll actually do that and make things a bit easier on small and mid-sized guilds. Of course, I'm not holding my breath. The only reason my guild is going to be okay for a while is because I've been crafting supplies at a frenetic pace the last two months. I think in their zeal for simplifying the system from their perspective that they have forgotten how important crafting crates for guild donations are for guilds. I also think they don't understand the satisfaction people derive from watching that mound of gold in the guild vault grow, knowing their guild will be able to progress a little more because they added to that mound just now.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,208Arc User
For making gold in the new profession, when will the yield be calculated? When you open it like the current profession? Or, is it calculated before you retrieve it? I asked because the current gold harvest is adjusted by gold bonus when you claim it and not when you set up the task. Will that be the same in the future?
The yield for gold crates are predetermined. If you succeed you receive 3 crates, if you fail you receive nothing. There is only success or failure. It was mentioned that a high-quality success would result in doubling what you receive.
I think that's the answer you're looking for, unless I misunderstood the question.
I was talking about gold (the currency in the purse). If gold crates means real gold and not for SH coffer, then yes. Otherwise, no.
May be I was not clear. The current leadership gives you gold (copper, silver). The amount of gold factors in gold bonus (e.g. +52%) when I claim it from leadership. My question is more about if the gold bonus has any effect to the gold (the currency) production of the future profession.
May be I misunderstood that future profession can make gold the currency but actually it can't.
Having a look at it on preview, gold as a currency cannot directly be made by any professions anymore, hence the gold bonus will not be applied to anything produced by professions (as far as I can tell).
The Crates of Transmuted Gold (Alchemy profession) can be donated to the SH coffer. You can create things in professions, and then sell that for gold/silver/copper, however, the cost to make them (time and gold) usually outweighs the amount of you would get by selling them to an NPC.
Thank you for the answer.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
That just doesn't make sense. "Not using the system as intended"
There is a lot of things in the design that make no sense. Many players like to do things in a different way than "intended", and when the developers block/nerf their mode of playing, they feel punished.
I have been hit with a few of those "punishments" in the past, and what is coming with Mod 15 might become a breaking point for me ... the destruction of the DC DO buff role and reduction to RP generation for solo players are pretty big issues for me, but well...I'll wait and see how bad things actually are.
From the nature of recent changes (random queues, AD limits, crafting "throw it all out and start over"), I'd guess that "the way they want you to play" is to move away from solo players quickly pugging a few queues, doing a little invoking and crafting, switch characters, repeat and move on. That is a fairly quick, solo style that garners you enough Exp/Gold/RP/stronghold crates to make some progress and get on with other things.
The end result they are pushing towards would seem to be more grindy, more direct gameplay rather than quick runs/crafting etc., and more "You have to work with your guild or a team if you are going to earn enough 'resource X' to be able to contribute'. They are also trying to minimize the use of alts so you have to focus on 1 or 2 mains.
In 30+ years of online gaming I've yet to see an MMO developer successfully push the gaming audience away from trying to efficiently play solo... but I've seen more than a few push their core audience away while they attempted it.
I guess we will have to wait and see... with less than a week before this drops I don't really see many QoL or player-friendly changes being made in that time. Hopefully they will at least remove some of the worst bugs and head-scratchers.
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micky1p00Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,594Arc User
edited November 2018
How about making the resources focus contribution as such:
20 / number of different resource types in the task = focus_per_resource_type // usually 1-4 resources
focus_per_resource_type / number of resources of that type = Item contribution
Simple. Capped at 20%. In most cases the task takes more of the cheaper products and less of the expansive, so this will balance out the contribution. And at the end the market will self regulate, if for some popular task it takes 1 type of cheap resources then the resource will gain value due to it's focus contribution over time.
If there is more information like resource type, level etc, weights can be added without trouble by type, into the first division.
Lets assume our resources have level 1-70 information, with MW given level 100, 120, 150, 175, 200 And some other weight, with some values if needed
So for a task that takes 3 ingredients, one type from MW 4 (175) one type adjusted from MW 4 with some other weight from complexity of manufacturing (175 + 50) one type from level 70 (70)
We need 2 of the first, We need 1 of the second And 20 of the last.
So each of the first will add 3.72% Second will be 9.57% And each of the last 0.15%
This is obviously just a random idea, but still simple to do, adjustable for any number of weights, KISS principle and simpler = less chance for debug headache.
I want to double-check that I understand this correctly: For surplus equipment, they expect us to craft things like armor, gloves/gauntlets, boots, rings, necklaces, etc and donate those to the coffer. Is this correct? If it is, then a follow-up question: Has anyone checked what any of that stuff is worth to the coffer? Does it follow the way it is on live right now where blue/rare stuff is worth 20 surplus equipment? Or have they adjusted this upward? I'm asking because I just worked out what it's going to cost my guild to build a Mason Guild, level the guild hall from L9 to L12 (including the minimum necessary buildings), get the Smelter's Yard and Mason Guild to L6, and level our Milling Yard from L1 to L4 .... and that comes out to 2,639,000 surplus equipment without our discount. With our discount it's "merely" 2,548,483. And between what's in the coffer and what I have banked, we have about half that amount right now. The icing on top? That's just to get my guild to the point where we can run the Assayer, Gemcutter, and Recruiter simultaneously every week indefinitely.
> @nunya#5309 said: > I want to double-check that I understand this correctly: For surplus equipment, they expect us to craft things like armor, gloves/gauntlets, boots, rings, necklaces, etc and donate those to the coffer. Is this correct? If it is, then a follow-up question: Has anyone checked what any of that stuff is worth to the coffer? Does it follow the way it is on live right now where blue/rare stuff is worth 20 surplus equipment? Or have they adjusted this upward?
With no Surplus Equipment crates, yes that's what will be expected of us. The same goes for Gems. You'll need to decide whether you donate the gems you craft or gather while playing, or use them to progress your character.
The decision to not include these crates makes us decide what we want to hinder the progress of, our characters or our strongholds.
Unfortunately I can't answer your other question. I'm not in a guild on preview.
For making gold in the new profession, when will the yield be calculated? When you open it like the current profession? Or, is it calculated before you retrieve it? I asked because the current gold harvest is adjusted by gold bonus when you claim it and not when you set up the task. Will that be the same in the future?
The yield for gold crates are predetermined. If you succeed you receive 3 crates, if you fail you receive nothing. There is only success or failure. It was mentioned that a high-quality success would result in doubling what you receive.
I think that's the answer you're looking for, unless I misunderstood the question.
I was talking about gold (the currency in the purse). If gold crates means real gold and not for SH coffer, then yes. Otherwise, no.
May be I was not clear. The current leadership gives you gold (copper, silver). The amount of gold factors in gold bonus (e.g. +52%) when I claim it from leadership. My question is more about if the gold bonus has any effect to the gold (the currency) production of the future profession.
May be I misunderstood that future profession can make gold the currency but actually it can't.
Having a look at it on preview, gold as a currency cannot directly be made by any professions anymore, hence the gold bonus will not be applied to anything produced by professions (as far as I can tell).
The Crates of Transmuted Gold (Alchemy profession) can be donated to the SH coffer. You can create things in professions, and then sell that for gold/silver/copper, however, the cost to make them (time and gold) usually outweighs the amount of you would get by selling them to an NPC.
Yea now 'gold bonus' will likely will only help when you sell items to a vendor. Might be a good time to buy Aurora's Catalog, I've begun seeing more using it again on LIVE. Perhaps rethink the Gold boon, yet that won't help, unless they slightly reduce commission cost, or in fact increase Silver Merchants offer for Crafted Gear.
So similar to what @forcemajeure stated "I guess we will have to wait and see..."
I too thing it will be interesting to see how this finally plays out... ...we not flying in the dark, but certainly on our brooms before sunrise! Getting excited for new Mod... ...even though they need to revise some things.
Thanks, @mdarkangel#4696 ! I'm planning to rely on the Gemcutter rather than having to craft gems to donate to the stronghold. Surplus equipment will end up being a problem for me. I may resort to donating my QM bags because I don't think I'll generate enough gold to sustain crafting garbage items to donate to the stronghold. Of course, if rare items are only worth 20 still, then I suppose all I would have to do is craft the lowest level piece of junk that's blue and throw it in the coffer. @asterdahlThis is incredibly stupid and player-hostile to remove the ability to craft crates to donate for surplus equipment and gems. I can handle my character progressing slowly. However, my guild already progresses slowly enough. I don't need any "help" from YOU in slowing my guild's progress.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,208Arc User
Thanks, @mdarkangel#4696 ! I'm planning to rely on the Gemcutter rather than having to craft gems to donate to the stronghold. Surplus equipment will end up being a problem for me. I may resort to donating my QM bags because I don't think I'll generate enough gold to sustain crafting garbage items to donate to the stronghold. Of course, if rare items are only worth 20 still, then I suppose all I would have to do is craft the lowest level piece of junk that's blue and throw it in the coffer. @asterdahlThis is incredibly stupid and player-hostile to remove the ability to craft crates to donate for surplus equipment and gems. I can handle my character progressing slowly. However, my guild already progresses slowly enough. I don't need any "help" from YOU in slowing my guild's progress.
Since there will be no salvage, the unwanted epic gear can be dumped to coffer or sell them for gold. I think epic gear gives a big value (at least it used to) as Surplus equipment and the unwanted epic gears are indeed "surplus equipment". That was what we did before there was any crate in profession.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
I had been asking earlier whether anyone had checked the coffer value of the 'labor/profession supplies' vouchers. A guildmate who in a guild on preview checked for me. The vouchers seem to have been created at their par coffer value. So a minor labor voucher was worth 65 to the coffer and the minor profession supplies that it becomes is also 65. An epic artisan was worth 12,500 and its equivalent a major bill of labor is worth 12,500.
I was interested in ensuring that it was not more profitable to donate before the 6th than after but it looks the same so I will hold off for some more data before deciding what to do.
I have asked what a basic gathering attempt might yield for Labor and he will look into that for me. His first impression was that using a level 70 gatherer for a level 1 item like copper ore produces 2 coffer credits per copper ore. The gatherer commission was 11 copper though the cost was actually 17 copper and generated 12 copper ore. There are 12 level 1 slots so the gatherer will pick up 144 copper ore in around 2 and a half hours at a cost of a couple of silvers. Most of the guild had level 17+ leadership so produced about 200 coffer credits from Corvee labour per day. They should be able to match that in the new system but at the cost of silver.
Labor was my main concern and the next was gold which looks more difficult and expensive. I looked at labor first because I crafted that from leadership. I donated found gold and the proceeds of merchant sales. That is likely to dry up now as people will be looking to hoard gold for their own use rather than donate it.
On live, my solution to gold was buying quicksilver from an Atelier with Guild Marks - a major click fest - then selling the quicksilver back to her. It may not have been the most efficient use of guild marks but it solved my gold issues, including the Guild's gold needs.
And for labor, I picked up profession items from the same Atelier, sold them for AD, bought purple Artisans and donated them to the mimic. Of course I am not doing either anymore (gold or labor), however, I still have an abundance of purple artisan's and with the voucher exchange on preview, I am yet to work out a use for them so may end up dumping them into the coffer of one our alliance guilds. All pending what I finally decide to use the vouchers on.
Adding focus of 155, grants (155-145)/(352-155) = 4.8% as expected. Adding +1 water makes it 10% Focus. Delta 5%
So: At 155 focus which is 5%, Adding the same water creates 10% Focus Delta 5% At 219 focus which is 36%, Adding the same water creates 48% Focus Delta 12% At 265 focus which is 58%, Adding the same water creates 61% Focus Delta 3% At 284 focus which is 67%, Adding the same water creates 75% Focus Delta 8% At 315 focus which is 82%, Adding the same water creates 85% Focus Delta 3% At 319 focus which is 84%, Adding the same water creates 91% Focus Delta 7% At 320 focus which is 85%, Adding the same water creates 96% Focus Delta 11%
It jumps all over the place... Once the same +1 ingredient in the same task adds 3%, another 12% A single point of focus from 319 to 320 changed the ingredient contribution from 7% to 11% !
I just wanted to add, that adding supplements to increase proficiency to a task can also decrease the focus for a task.
For example, gathering Raw Black Opal:
Initially: 750/800 (94%) Proficiency and 695/901 (20%) Focus
When I add a Supplement (Workman's Cordial, +40 Proficiency) the values are: 790/800 (99%) Proficiency, but then Focus drops even though it is the same value 695/901 (11%)!
Unless the calculation of focus somehow factors in the total proficiency, but still, this is very counterintuitive, and rather looks like it's very buggy.
Unless the calculation of focus somehow factors in the total proficiency, but still, this is very counterintuitive, and rather looks like it's very buggy.
You got that right. What's more, I am almost 100% certain this bug (and many others are going to go live). I expect to see a new Preview build tonight and that will be the build that will be released.
This build may fix some of the issues reported earlier, and there will probably not be any show-stopping bugs...however, it will have numerous smaller issues like the one you described, and most of those will only get fixed over 3-4 weeks following release. (And some will not get fixed at all, because the developers will be too busy working on Mod 16).
@antok500#4237 My solution for gold was to use Alchemy. I could buy Ebony Wood & Aqua Vitae from the Atelier and Aberrant Pelts from the Tannery, then turn those into Orange and Purple Vitriol. With the Vitriol and Aqua Vitae, I could make Aqua Regia, then use the Vitriol and Regia to make crates of gold. With three GM Alchemists, I'd spend a few weeks making Vitriol, then a couple of weeks making Regia, then burn them all up making crates. Though I probably would have used @lordtweety#3604's approach had I thought of it. LOL
As for what you'll do for gold after the update, the only thing I can recommend is rotating between the Assayer and the Gemcutter (to pay the Assayer's gem costs) until your guild is high enough level to not have to rotate between them anymore.
Let me start by saying that I certainly appreciate the effort you (Asterdahl) and the team have put into creating the new crafting system, even working weekends! The crafting is defintely more along the lines of D&D, and will allow for interesting changes in the future (I think the various value attributes of Artisans is great - now extended to tools as well!). I can appreciate the dual problems of balancing in-house needs/capabilites vs wants and expectations of us players, plus the fact you don't want the true 'live' values in preview to prevent AH shenanigans prior to the Mod dropping...
My 2 cents... : The trade-in value for White Rank 2 and 3 workers is the same as Rank 1, yet it manifestly takes (took) more time to create them - please consider at least 4 credits for Rank 2's and 16 credits for Rank 3's. At the end of the day they are minor quantities for trade-in and are not game breaking credits, but it is the perception that counts.
Commission cost (gold or AD) - this aspect I feel is a real pain in increasing the cost, and is fine when other stats show obvious benefits - and I know, preview and all, but seriously - you already have incredibly high gold drains on gathering, refining, and then creating the item. Since the latest build, 'poor' Artisans (125% or worse Comm, -75% speed, other stats not good, useless special skill like Virtuoso in gathering) seems to be the norm, and that just makes me sad. I would love to be paid 200% for being twice as slow and not being great at my job, or failing it completely... which leads to...
I feel Gold/AD should NOT be paid/consumed when a crafting task fails - yes the resources/time get consumed, but then having the failure also fully charged - that is just wrong! Especially when their commission is over 75% - which I seem to see all to frequently, especially at the Epic level!
CRATES 2 x Crate of Astral Diamonds (lvl 23 old, 70 new) with Gatherer at 390 Prof and Oak Crossbow (360 Prof), 94% chance of getting (after 6 hours and 1 gold 32 silver 46 copper - RNG again!) - that means 6% fail (higher for the RNG unlucky), wasting Gold and time...
3 x Crate Gold (lvl70 Alchemey) Need 3 x raw gold (lvl69 JewelCrafting, each needs 4xGold Sand [lvl69 Gath]), plus 1xAureus Index (lvl69 Artificing) - THAT requires 3xMats (Gold Sand, Fine Parchment [also 3xMats], Black Ink [another 3xMats], of THOSE 6 Mats: Linseed Oil-1 Mat, Fish Glue-1 Mat) - can you see the problem - 4 professions at lvl69+, approx 90% Proficiency chance at most steps? I know you expect we should buy those mats - but for a few crates?? Why not give the gold directly and save the pain! I see where you took the gold ingot from the MasterCrafting, but really, the mimic should eat lower level materials, so those without Mastercrafting can still help their guild.
ALL crates are only for the SH coffer - is it really world breaking to have lower costs associated with making them? Cryptic are putting such brakes on this, you should just really kill them off if they are that bad for the game - again, so much pain for what gain? Removing them would be kinder to us than this.
To re-state what I said earlier, these points are really taking the shine off of an absolute cracker implementation, and I do not feel the urge to buy Zen when this is the case. We know there will be bugs that will need ironing out, and we can live with that - as long as we feel a sense of it being fair and equitable. I know you have listened to our feedback and adjusted the delivery box size and given us Artisans, so please consider what many of us are saying about gold cost and crates...
Might is not always right - the powerful sometimes forget that.
all these seem to be workarounds, and only for large, levelled up guilds. what are the smaller guild supposed to do? the one i'm in is just a few of my friends. god forbid trying to start one. i really dont get the masterplan behind this. what do they want us to do? all be in one huge guild?
@rangerlenier It's going to be a logistical headache for sure. From looking at the numbers, it seems like guild level will matter most when it comes to generating gold, gems, and influence. The number of crafters and their dedication will matter most when it comes to generating Labor (soon to be called Profession Resources) and Astral Diamonds. I suspect the amount of gear you pick up and its quality will matter most when it comes to generating Surplus Equipment. Even now, we can donate salvageable gear to the coffer for 810 Surplus Equipment per purple item. So I expect that will be my guild's primary source of Surplus Equipment once we've exhausted the 1.3m between what we have in the coffer and what I've stockpiled in crates. My guild is level 9 right now. Guilds that are 6 or lower, in particular, are going to have rough going. If I were leading a guild that low in level right now, I would forgo the boons completely in order to get Metal/Stone/Wood production up (and Food, to a lesser extent), as well as the overall guild level. In fact, that's what I'm going to be doing with my guild even at level 9. I was going to include the Stable as one of our level 5 buildings to quality for level 11, but now I'm going to level the Smelter's Yard instead because I'll need that at level 6 once we get level 12.
Guilds that are 6 or lower, in particular, are going to have rough going. If I were leading a guild that low in level right now, I would forgo the boons completely in order to get Metal/Stone/Wood production up (and Food, to a lesser extent), as well as the overall guild level. In fact, that's what I'm going to be doing with my guild even at level 9. I was going to include the Stable as one of our level 5 buildings to quality for level 11, but now I'm going to level the Smelter's Yard instead because I'll need that at level 6 once we get level 12.
I am in a level 6 solo guild. A few days ago, I was planning to build the stable, but thanks to your (and others) advice, I changed my mind, and will start building a Milling Yard later today. I will forgo the boons, and instead, maximize resource production.
Guilds that are 6 or lower, in particular, are going to have rough going. If I were leading a guild that low in level right now, I would forgo the boons completely in order to get Metal/Stone/Wood production up (and Food, to a lesser extent), as well as the overall guild level. In fact, that's what I'm going to be doing with my guild even at level 9. I was going to include the Stable as one of our level 5 buildings to quality for level 11, but now I'm going to level the Smelter's Yard instead because I'll need that at level 6 once we get level 12.
I am in a level 6 solo guild. A few days ago, I was planning to build the stable, but thanks to your (and others) advice, I changed my mind, and will start building a Milling Yard later today. I will forgo the boons, and instead, maximize resource production.
It sucks to have to give up the boons. I was really looking forward to leveling our Stable, having just built it. (The Wizard's Workshop was built at level 5 by the former leader. ) But it's going to take a lot of metal, stone, and wood to be able to use the Gemcutter, Assayer, and Recruiter. I'm glad that I could help in however small a way.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,208Arc User
Guilds that are 6 or lower, in particular, are going to have rough going. If I were leading a guild that low in level right now, I would forgo the boons completely in order to get Metal/Stone/Wood production up (and Food, to a lesser extent), as well as the overall guild level. In fact, that's what I'm going to be doing with my guild even at level 9. I was going to include the Stable as one of our level 5 buildings to quality for level 11, but now I'm going to level the Smelter's Yard instead because I'll need that at level 6 once we get level 12.
I am in a level 6 solo guild. A few days ago, I was planning to build the stable, but thanks to your (and others) advice, I changed my mind, and will start building a Milling Yard later today. I will forgo the boons, and instead, maximize resource production.
It sucks to have to give up the boons. I was really looking forward to leveling our Stable, having just built it. (The Wizard's Workshop was built at level 5 by the former leader. ) But it's going to take a lot of metal, stone, and wood to be able to use the Gemcutter, Assayer, and Recruiter. I'm glad that I could help in however small a way.
Just curious, are you in an alliance? If you are, other more mature guilds will dump labor, metal, stone and wood to yours. Most smaller guilds in our alliance DISALLOW external donation of those material to give room to their own members to dump their labor, metal, stone and wood vouchers.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
Just curious, are you in an alliance? If you are, other more mature guilds will dump labor, metal, stone and wood to yours. Most smaller guilds in our alliance DISALLOW external donation of those material to give room to their own members to dump their labor, metal, stone and wood vouchers.
We are in an alliance. There doesn't seem to be that many vouchers for metal, stone, and wood. But, then, I don't know for sure, either. I've been able to cover our needs with the production structures and regular tending (they rarely get full, except when the coffer is full). Labor hasn't been much of a bottleneck for us, either, but that's because I've had 17 characters generating Labor 6x a day for the last two months, which comes out to about 70k Labor per week. I disallowed Labor donations from alliance members because I felt that since I could cover our needs that the Labor should be forced to go to other guilds in the alliance that might need it. Our coffer max is 312k Labor and we'll have that by Monday night, with probably some extra in the bank.
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micky1p00Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,594Arc User
edited November 2018
Well, the current build, patched moments ago and I'm 99.999% sure it is the one that will go live, doesn't have any gem crates.
Gold crate is a craft task, and AD crate is a gathering task, I didn't find anything else.
Comments
I have been hit with a few of those "punishments" in the past, and what is coming with Mod 15 might become a breaking point for me ... the destruction of the DC DO buff role and reduction to RP generation for solo players are pretty big issues for me, but well...I'll wait and see how bad things actually are.
The end result they are pushing towards would seem to be more grindy, more direct gameplay rather than quick runs/crafting etc., and more "You have to work with your guild or a team if you are going to earn enough 'resource X' to be able to contribute'. They are also trying to minimize the use of alts so you have to focus on 1 or 2 mains.
In 30+ years of online gaming I've yet to see an MMO developer successfully push the gaming audience away from trying to efficiently play solo... but I've seen more than a few push their core audience away while they attempted it.
I guess we will have to wait and see... with less than a week before this drops I don't really see many QoL or player-friendly changes being made in that time. Hopefully they will at least remove some of the worst bugs and head-scratchers.
How about making the resources focus contribution as such:
20 / number of different resource types in the task = focus_per_resource_type // usually 1-4 resources
focus_per_resource_type / number of resources of that type = Item contribution
Simple. Capped at 20%. In most cases the task takes more of the cheaper products and less of the expansive, so this will balance out the contribution. And at the end the market will self regulate, if for some popular task it takes 1 type of cheap resources then the resource will gain value due to it's focus contribution over time.
If there is more information like resource type, level etc, weights can be added without trouble by type, into the first division.
For example:
20 / (sum of wights) = modifier
modifier * weight1 = focus_for_type1
modifier * weight2 = focus_for_type2
modifier * weight3 = focus_for_type3
modifier * weight4 = focus_for_type4
Lets assume our resources have level 1-70 information, with MW given level 100, 120, 150, 175, 200
And some other weight, with some values if needed
So for a task that takes 3 ingredients,
one type from MW 4 (175)
one type adjusted from MW 4 with some other weight from complexity of manufacturing (175 + 50)
one type from level 70 (70)
20 / (175 + 175 + 50 + 70) = modifier = 0.042
Type1_focus = 0.042*175 = 7.44
Type2_focus = 0.042*(175+50) = 9.57
Type3_focus = 0.042*(70) = 2.98
Total sum = 20%
We need 2 of the first,
We need 1 of the second
And 20 of the last.
So each of the first will add 3.72%
Second will be 9.57%
And each of the last 0.15%
This is obviously just a random idea, but still simple to do, adjustable for any number of weights, KISS principle and simpler = less chance for debug headache.
Thanks!
> I want to double-check that I understand this correctly: For surplus equipment, they expect us to craft things like armor, gloves/gauntlets, boots, rings, necklaces, etc and donate those to the coffer. Is this correct? If it is, then a follow-up question: Has anyone checked what any of that stuff is worth to the coffer? Does it follow the way it is on live right now where blue/rare stuff is worth 20 surplus equipment? Or have they adjusted this upward?
With no Surplus Equipment crates, yes that's what will be expected of us. The same goes for Gems. You'll need to decide whether you donate the gems you craft or gather while playing, or use them to progress your character.
The decision to not include these crates makes us decide what we want to hinder the progress of, our characters or our strongholds.
Unfortunately I can't answer your other question. I'm not in a guild on preview.
So similar to what @forcemajeure stated "I guess we will have to wait and see..."
I too thing it will be interesting to see how this finally plays out... ...we not flying in the dark, but certainly on our brooms before sunrise! Getting excited for new Mod... ...even though they need to revise some things.
I was interested in ensuring that it was not more profitable to donate before the 6th than after but it looks the same so I will hold off for some more data before deciding what to do.
Labor was my main concern and the next was gold which looks more difficult and expensive. I looked at labor first because I crafted that from leadership. I donated found gold and the proceeds of merchant sales. That is likely to dry up now as people will be looking to hoard gold for their own use rather than donate it.
Guild: Ruathym Corsairs
Guild: Ruathym Corsairs
For example, gathering Raw Black Opal:
Initially: 750/800 (94%) Proficiency and 695/901 (20%) Focus
When I add a Supplement (Workman's Cordial, +40 Proficiency) the values are: 790/800 (99%) Proficiency, but then Focus drops even though it is the same value 695/901 (11%)!
Unless the calculation of focus somehow factors in the total proficiency, but still, this is very counterintuitive, and rather looks like it's very buggy.
This build may fix some of the issues reported earlier, and there will probably not be any show-stopping bugs...however, it will have numerous smaller issues like the one you described, and most of those will only get fixed over 3-4 weeks following release. (And some will not get fixed at all, because the developers will be too busy working on Mod 16).
As for what you'll do for gold after the update, the only thing I can recommend is rotating between the Assayer and the Gemcutter (to pay the Assayer's gem costs) until your guild is high enough level to not have to rotate between them anymore.
My 2 cents... :
The trade-in value for White Rank 2 and 3 workers is the same as Rank 1, yet it manifestly takes (took) more time to create them - please consider at least 4 credits for Rank 2's and 16 credits for Rank 3's. At the end of the day they are minor quantities for trade-in and are not game breaking credits, but it is the perception that counts.
Commission cost (gold or AD) - this aspect I feel is a real pain in increasing the cost, and is fine when other stats show obvious benefits - and I know, preview and all, but seriously - you already have incredibly high gold drains on gathering, refining, and then creating the item. Since the latest build, 'poor' Artisans (125% or worse Comm, -75% speed, other stats not good, useless special skill like Virtuoso in gathering) seems to be the norm, and that just makes me sad. I would love to be paid 200% for being twice as slow and not being great at my job, or failing it completely... which leads to...
I feel Gold/AD should NOT be paid/consumed when a crafting task fails - yes the resources/time get consumed, but then having the failure also fully charged - that is just wrong! Especially when their commission is over 75% - which I seem to see all to frequently, especially at the Epic level!
CRATES
2 x Crate of Astral Diamonds (lvl 23 old, 70 new) with Gatherer at 390 Prof and Oak Crossbow (360 Prof), 94% chance of getting (after 6 hours and 1 gold 32 silver 46 copper - RNG again!) - that means 6% fail (higher for the RNG unlucky), wasting Gold and time...
3 x Crate Gold (lvl70 Alchemey) Need 3 x raw gold (lvl69 JewelCrafting, each needs 4xGold Sand [lvl69 Gath]), plus 1xAureus Index (lvl69 Artificing) - THAT requires 3xMats (Gold Sand, Fine Parchment [also 3xMats], Black Ink [another 3xMats], of THOSE 6 Mats: Linseed Oil-1 Mat, Fish Glue-1 Mat) - can you see the problem - 4 professions at lvl69+, approx 90% Proficiency chance at most steps? I know you expect we should buy those mats - but for a few crates?? Why not give the gold directly and save the pain! I see where you took the gold ingot from the MasterCrafting, but really, the mimic should eat lower level materials, so those without Mastercrafting can still help their guild.
ALL crates are only for the SH coffer - is it really world breaking to have lower costs associated with making them? Cryptic are putting such brakes on this, you should just really kill them off if they are that bad for the game - again, so much pain for what gain? Removing them would be kinder to us than this.
To re-state what I said earlier, these points are really taking the shine off of an absolute cracker implementation, and I do not feel the urge to buy Zen when this is the case. We know there will be bugs that will need ironing out, and we can live with that - as long as we feel a sense of it being fair and equitable. I know you have listened to our feedback and adjusted the delivery box size and given us Artisans, so please consider what many of us are saying about gold cost and crates...
Might is not always right - the powerful sometimes forget that.
The Small BandI changed my mind, and will start building a Milling Yard later today. I will forgo the boons, and instead, maximize resource production.
Gold crate is a craft task, and AD crate is a gathering task, I didn't find anything else.