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Mod 15 - Tr and Gloaming Cut ( atwill dmg from stealth )

terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
in PvP Discussion
When we tested i was put on: 24k Defensive, 21k Deflect, Shadowclad, combat advantage -50% dmg ( from mount ), two defensive auras ( protector, truth ), use defensive skills to temp hp and less dmg, and as u see, i cant do nothing. Just run away try to heal, try to do anything to stay alive.

Every build i try : Bulwark, full Healer, Protector, Devotion. Nothing helps against that. Daze all the time, as u see in film, run away try heal stay alive, resoult was always the same. Gloaming Cut hit me badly, sometimes when i was full stuck for defense even than 170k per hit... lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vccq8Efdx6k

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Comments

  • demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
    > @terylion said:
    > When we tested i was put on: 24k Defensive, 21k Deflect, Shadowclad, combat advantage -50% dmg ( from mount ), two defensive auras ( protector, truth ), use defensive skills to temp hp and less dmg, and as u see, i cant do nothing. Just run away try to heal, try to do anything to stay alive.
    >
    > Every build i try : Bulwark, full Healer, Protector, Devotion. Nothing helps against that. Daze all the time, as u see in film, run away try heal stay alive, resoult was always the same. Gloaming Cut hit me badly, sometimes when i was full stuck for defense even than 170k per hit... lol

    Thank god for slow motions... 170k not today bro... brollax is not your average tr also.. he is one of the best if not the best
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
  • terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    yeah but even now in this mod i mean 14, i have chance to do something, now, i can if At will hit so strong. everytime when i stop i get dmg like 80-90k per hit, when he is stuck like 170-200k so tell me where is balance here?:)
  • crollaxcrollax Member Posts: 255 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    i dont think anyone from these active trs(p1-p2-p3) can do same bro. now u will make GM`s to nerf it even more
  • lunartic666lunartic666 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 53 Arc User
    Cool, now add ~50% dmg on non-tank class. Nice nerf?
  • crollaxcrollax Member Posts: 255 Arc User
    lunartic666 said:

    Cool, now add ~50% dmg on non-tank class. Nice nerf?

    bro depend on my experience in pvp there is no tank or glasscannon everybody takes same damage nearly since they put that tenecity buff. ofc i might be wrong but for tr atleast stealth attacks are like that
  • terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    Brollax Maybe u right ( i hope u right ) the only one tr who can do that dmg is u:) i Really hope that, but, as u see now, many trs play with sod. In my opinion this is only matter of time when other trs figure out how do that dmg:):) Anyway i dont cry about that, im just say, i cant do nothing against that on this Class i mean on Op:) We will see what happent:)
  • crollaxcrollax Member Posts: 255 Arc User
    terylion said:

    Brollax Maybe u right ( i hope u right ) the only one tr who can do that dmg is u:) i Really hope that, but, as u see now, many trs play with sod. In my opinion this is only matter of time when other trs figure out how do that dmg:):) Anyway i dont cry about that, im just say, i cant do nothing against that on this Class i mean on Op:) We will see what happent:)

    yes bro i totally know and agree <3 dps is unavoidable:( , but sometimes if u remember i got 200k shots also from like like 1 or 2 time , but yes against op im kinda bad buttttttttttttt plssss bro dont judge things on 1v1 , 1v1 i think means nothing as long as its not same class :p
  • terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    u right 1v1 is not very good to judge everything. I hope in team tr like that will be more balnced, couse i can image hits from tr when he get buff from OP, GF, and DC. 600-900k per hit?:P we will see?:P and we can check easly:)
  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    "Why are we still here? Just to suffer? Every night, I can feel my leg… and my arm… even my fingers. The body I’ve lost… the comrades I’ve lost… won’t stop hurting… It’s like they’re all still there. You feel it, too, don’t you?"

  • crollaxcrollax Member Posts: 255 Arc User
    leonidrex said:

    "Why are we still here? Just to suffer? Every night, I can feel my leg… and my arm… even my fingers. The body I’ve lost… the comrades I’ve lost… won’t stop hurting… It’s like they’re all still there. You feel it, too, don’t you?"

    i do leonidrex:D
  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    crollax said:

    leonidrex said:

    "Why are we still here? Just to suffer? Every night, I can feel my leg… and my arm… even my fingers. The body I’ve lost… the comrades I’ve lost… won’t stop hurting… It’s like they’re all still there. You feel it, too, don’t you?"

    i do leonidrex:D
    at least you are the one cutting legs, im the one losing them :D

  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    guess we build movespeed and run ? we are all saber now
  • crollaxcrollax Member Posts: 255 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    leonidrex said:

    guess we build movespeed and run ? we are all saber now

    i think dont do 1v1 with tr but if u are gwf , at 2v2 3v3 4v4 u can be MEGA effective bro. gwf dps will be unignorable

    u can even cut most of the trs if u can preasure them <3
  • slysnow#2290 slysnow
    slysnow#2290
         Member Posts: 110 Arc User
    Use those same stats but use negation. negation is the enchant to use to go tanky. Not shadowclad. Shadows main feat is stealth. The defensive bonuses get cancelled/reset on deflect. What that means is, if you want to use shadow you should not have more than about 40% deflect chance (preferably you want 25-30% range).

    If you have 60% deflect chance with shadow you will keep deflecting and never build up the damage resist. The tool tip makes it clear on deflect stats reset. Use negation and keep those stats or drop deflect significantly top get better usage of shadow.

    I'm speaking from experience as well. In my tank setup i have 29k defense (DR Cap) and 21k deflect. I feel much weaker with shadowclad.
  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    slysnow#2290 said:

    Use those same stats but use negation. negation is the enchant to use to go tanky. Not shadowclad. Shadows main feat is stealth. The defensive bonuses get cancelled/reset on deflect. What that means is, if you want to use shadow you should not have more than about 40% deflect chance (preferably you want 25-30% range).



    If you have 60% deflect chance with shadow you will keep deflecting and never build up the damage resist. The tool tip makes it clear on deflect stats reset. Use negation and keep those stats or drop deflect significantly top get better usage of shadow.



    I'm speaking from experience as well. In my tank setup i have 29k defense (DR Cap) and 21k deflect. I feel much weaker with shadowclad.

    or balance the game so people can play it

  • crollaxcrollax Member Posts: 255 Arc User
    slysnow#2290 said:

    Use those same stats but use negation. negation is the enchant to use to go tanky. Not shadowclad. Shadows main feat is stealth. The defensive bonuses get cancelled/reset on deflect. What that means is, if you want to use shadow you should not have more than about 40% deflect chance (preferably you want 25-30% range).



    If you have 60% deflect chance with shadow you will keep deflecting and never build up the damage resist. The tool tip makes it clear on deflect stats reset. Use negation and keep those stats or drop deflect significantly top get better usage of shadow.



    I'm speaking from experience as well. In my tank setup i have 29k defense (DR Cap) and 21k deflect. I feel much weaker with shadowclad.

    they have to use elven for not staying in stun orrrr shadowclad for tankyness but listen mate, shadowclad proc min 2 time in combat and ruin all my combos and thing sometime and it saves them alot of time from alottttt of dps thats why.
  • crollaxcrollax Member Posts: 255 Arc User
    leonidrex said:


    slysnow#2290 said:

    Use those same stats but use negation. negation is the enchant to use to go tanky. Not shadowclad. Shadows main feat is stealth. The defensive bonuses get cancelled/reset on deflect. What that means is, if you want to use shadow you should not have more than about 40% deflect chance (preferably you want 25-30% range).



    If you have 60% deflect chance with shadow you will keep deflecting and never build up the damage resist. The tool tip makes it clear on deflect stats reset. Use negation and keep those stats or drop deflect significantly top get better usage of shadow.



    I'm speaking from experience as well. In my tank setup i have 29k defense (DR Cap) and 21k deflect. I feel much weaker with shadowclad.

    or balance the game so people can play it

    game is balance as long as u play 5v5 with a skilled players
  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    crollax said:

    leonidrex said:


    slysnow#2290 said:

    Use those same stats but use negation. negation is the enchant to use to go tanky. Not shadowclad. Shadows main feat is stealth. The defensive bonuses get cancelled/reset on deflect. What that means is, if you want to use shadow you should not have more than about 40% deflect chance (preferably you want 25-30% range).



    If you have 60% deflect chance with shadow you will keep deflecting and never build up the damage resist. The tool tip makes it clear on deflect stats reset. Use negation and keep those stats or drop deflect significantly top get better usage of shadow.



    I'm speaking from experience as well. In my tank setup i have 29k defense (DR Cap) and 21k deflect. I feel much weaker with shadowclad.

    or balance the game so people can play it

    game is balance as long as u play 5v5 with a skilled players
    well duuuh both teams can have broken trs on their team. i ment balance between classes

  • demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
    > @scarabman said:
    > As @slysnow#2290 mentioned, Negation would probably be a better enchant for your paladin because of the defense it gives. The recovery it also gives you is just gravy as Echoes of Light and Divine Call + Vengeful Judge (which it looks like you are using) should help on CD reduction. I haven't tried it much but if you already have high defense, Eclipse could be beneficial for the pure deflect it provides.
    >
    > Without seeing your build, and from watching that video, I'll give my personal opinion/experience on a couple of things:
    > * Absolution isn't great in PvP. Shields are reduced by too much for this to be effective.
    >
    > * Templar's Wrath is great for the brief disable with a little bit of damage and some temp HP.
    >
    > * Binding Oath can be blocked when it pops.
    >
    > * When you're going one-on-one with someone, 3x Bane + Feytouched will take care of a lot of that damage for you. Smite can help here too for some extra damage + damage reduction.
    >
    > * When I'm in a group, I like to hop in and drop a fully charged Burning Light on my enemies. It'll consistently shut down their long term plans with its pulsing interrupts if they let you get one off. It is also one of the better offensive tools in the paladin toolkit.
    >
    > * I used to use Binding Oath but since all of its mechanics are dependent on that shield it generates, it is severely weakened in PvP these days. Circle of Power or Bane are my choices for replacements.
    >
    > * It also looks like you weren't using your Shielding Strike. This is also weaker than it once was but it's probably still more effective than any benefit you'd gain from movement.
    >
    > * I try not to spam Divine Call. There's always a chance Echoes of Light will proc and then my CDR gained from it may have been wasted. I also space it out to maintain the buff.
    >
    > * Are you using Fey Thistle? Everfrost shirt/pants? Those are going to give your paladin a whole bunch of free damage while you keep yourself alive.
    >
    > * There are a lot of free heals that mounts can provide. They're pretty small individually but, collectively, they add up.

    Thank God you spoke here.

    Learn to play Is the issue.

    Plus enchantments.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
  • slysnow#2290 slysnow
    slysnow#2290
         Member Posts: 110 Arc User
    Wow a dev backed up what i mentioned. Its almost as if i know what I'm taking about (pvp) lol.
  • terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    scarabman said:

    As @slysnow#2290 mentioned, Negation would probably be a better enchant for your paladin because of the defense it gives. The recovery it also gives you is just gravy as Echoes of Light and Divine Call + Vengeful Judge (which it looks like you are using) should help on CD reduction. I haven't tried it much but if you already have high defense, Eclipse could be beneficial for the pure deflect it provides.

    Without seeing your build, and from watching that video, I'll give my personal opinion/experience on a couple of things:

    • Absolution isn't great in PvP. Shields are reduced by too much for this to be effective.
    • Templar's Wrath is great for the brief disable with a little bit of damage and some temp HP.
    • Binding Oath can be blocked when it pops.
    • When you're going one-on-one with someone, 3x Bane + Feytouched will take care of a lot of that damage for you. Smite can help here too for some extra damage + damage reduction.
    • When I'm in a group, I like to hop in and drop a fully charged Burning Light on my enemies. It'll consistently shut down their long term plans with its pulsing interrupts if they let you get one off. It is also one of the better offensive tools in the paladin toolkit.
    • I used to use Binding Oath but since all of its mechanics are dependent on that shield it generates, it is severely weakened in PvP these days. Circle of Power or Bane are my choices for replacements.
    • It also looks like you weren't using your Shielding Strike. This is also weaker than it once was but it's probably still more effective than any benefit you'd gain from movement.
    • I try not to spam Divine Call. There's always a chance Echoes of Light will proc and then my CDR gained from it may have been wasted. I also space it out to maintain the buff.
    • Are you using Fey Thistle? Everfrost shirt/pants? Those are going to give your paladin a whole bunch of free damage while you keep yourself alive.
    • There are a lot of free heals that mounts can provide. They're pretty small individually but, collectively, they add up.
    Ty for answer, but, this film is just short cut from 1h tested:)
    I tried everything, every build , change my skills, every enchant, bonus from mounts, bonuses from differnt enchants. Like i said before, resoult was always the same, Btollax can mean that. I just try to survive, so game like that i mean stay and spaming surviveble skills are realy boring.

    In my opinion helps against that is, many many HP and recovery like 25k+ + bulwark path.... but in thaT build i will be just stay in pvp. which means, no fun to play like that. in my opinion if Dev answer about that, is do with something like that, couse if at will ( i repeat At will ) hit like 170-200 per hit and this is 1v1 ( which mean no buff from other sources ) this is something wrong.

    Shielding strike i testet too, tell me when i should stuck it when i dont see a opponent. No, shielding strike work only when i hit opponet, end, even then my shield give me nothing against that dmg couse, those dmg probably are piercing dmg:)
    THats why like i said, against that help alot of hp, recovery 25k+ and bulwark path, than maybe ( maybe couse im all the time with daze ) i will survive that:)

    Tr is the class when he can spam his daily faster than encounters. Trs base is Recovery, there is no CAP for recovery so if u can have 56k base power than probably u can have same recovery so ur cooldowns are like 1 sec:) daily for 3 sec:) this is really really wrong:) Every class should have colldown for daily like 15 sek or more, couse this is crazy, and one more thing, TR no need arm pento do that dmg, so tell me for what i need defense ?:):)

    I thought balanced between classes is when every class have chance ( i repeat chance ) to kill others class, not just run away and try to heal. But this is only my opinion.

  • terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    And one more thing, if this stay like it is i really hope in team tr like that will be more balanced.

    And about Op, every class have something to dodge this dmg, Op have just shield who give him nothing against that dmg. Op have no counter about that, couse Op dont have bull charge when i have few sec to rotate opponent and do some dmg.
    Burning light is to slow, i need 4 sek to stuck it for 4 sec. when i use 0.5 sec, Burning like this work only 0.5 sek:) but it help against trs, couse BL is the only one skill when i can deal dmg against opponent who i cant see:) but if im all the time with daze, than i cant do alot:P

    Anyway think about hits from that at will couse this really strange when his at will deal more dmg than daily skill:):):)
  • schietindebuxschietindebux Member Posts: 4,292 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    I see that video showing a Paladin being permadazed. What about blocking instead running, any help doing so?
    Bane sounds nice.. in case you can place it on an invisible class 3x, being perma dazed on top.
    How much can you charge Burning Light against a skilled TR? I guess not that much.
    Does stealthmeter deminish at all in mod 15 getting hit in stealth?
    A GWF will be an option, if not that TR had at least 2 loadouts, and if BB is not fixed, what will keep me from running good old BB/SoD vs that GWF?
    OP on it´s own looks helpless in mod 15 and is allready helpess in mod 14 vs TR, from what I saw.
    What this will look in a 5 vs 5, who knows.
    Old problems will be new problems, until these devs balance PVP like they should have done since 5 years.
    Address perma-daily, same as the unnecessary geargap, get rid of SH-boons, drains and broken gear in PVP.
    Until this does not get fixed any attempt to balance is from no interest.
    Post edited by schietindebux on
  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    terylion said:

    scarabman said:

    As @slysnow#2290 mentioned, Negation would probably be a better enchant for your paladin because of the defense it gives. The recovery it also gives you is just gravy as Echoes of Light and Divine Call + Vengeful Judge (which it looks like you are using) should help on CD reduction. I haven't tried it much but if you already have high defense, Eclipse could be beneficial for the pure deflect it provides.

    Without seeing your build, and from watching that video, I'll give my personal opinion/experience on a couple of things:

    • Absolution isn't great in PvP. Shields are reduced by too much for this to be effective.
    • Templar's Wrath is great for the brief disable with a little bit of damage and some temp HP.
    • Binding Oath can be blocked when it pops.
    • When you're going one-on-one with someone, 3x Bane + Feytouched will take care of a lot of that damage for you. Smite can help here too for some extra damage + damage reduction.
    • When I'm in a group, I like to hop in and drop a fully charged Burning Light on my enemies. It'll consistently shut down their long term plans with its pulsing interrupts if they let you get one off. It is also one of the better offensive tools in the paladin toolkit.
    • I used to use Binding Oath but since all of its mechanics are dependent on that shield it generates, it is severely weakened in PvP these days. Circle of Power or Bane are my choices for replacements.
    • It also looks like you weren't using your Shielding Strike. This is also weaker than it once was but it's probably still more effective than any benefit you'd gain from movement.
    • I try not to spam Divine Call. There's always a chance Echoes of Light will proc and then my CDR gained from it may have been wasted. I also space it out to maintain the buff.
    • Are you using Fey Thistle? Everfrost shirt/pants? Those are going to give your paladin a whole bunch of free damage while you keep yourself alive.
    • There are a lot of free heals that mounts can provide. They're pretty small individually but, collectively, they add up.
    Ty for answer, but, this film is just short cut from 1h tested:)
    I tried everything, every build , change my skills, every enchant, bonus from mounts, bonuses from differnt enchants. Like i said before, resoult was always the same, Btollax can mean that. I just try to survive, so game like that i mean stay and spaming surviveble skills are realy boring.

    In my opinion helps against that is, many many HP and recovery like 25k+ + bulwark path.... but in thaT build i will be just stay in pvp. which means, no fun to play like that. in my opinion if Dev answer about that, is do with something like that, couse if at will ( i repeat At will ) hit like 170-200 per hit and this is 1v1 ( which mean no buff from other sources ) this is something wrong.

    Shielding strike i testet too, tell me when i should stuck it when i dont see a opponent. No, shielding strike work only when i hit opponet, end, even then my shield give me nothing against that dmg couse, those dmg probably are piercing dmg:)
    THats why like i said, against that help alot of hp, recovery 25k+ and bulwark path, than maybe ( maybe couse im all the time with daze ) i will survive that:)

    Tr is the class when he can spam his daily faster than encounters. Trs base is Recovery, there is no CAP for recovery so if u can have 56k base power than probably u can have same recovery so ur cooldowns are like 1 sec:) daily for 3 sec:) this is really really wrong:) Every class should have colldown for daily like 15 sek or more, couse this is crazy, and one more thing, TR no need arm pento do that dmg, so tell me for what i need defense ?:):)

    I thought balanced between classes is when every class have chance ( i repeat chance ) to kill others class, not just run away and try to heal. But this is only my opinion.

    dear Tery, Fellow Paladin.
    The reason dev even responded to defend it is becouse the changes are propably final so its literarly his job to defend them.
    As for someone saying "get good" Tery is currently top 1 OP on PC server, please dont use "git gud" argument.
    The only ways i can see any OP coming close to surviving that is using Cleansing touch, Bane and 1 situational aility,
    you would have to cleansing touch right after cc, shield block time gloaming cut when you hear it coming, followed by lay on hands/3bane.
    Or mb go devo, stack full stamina gain, go bulwark and literarly never drop the shield, be a crabwalking healbot

  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    scarabman said:

    As @slysnow#2290 mentioned, Negation would probably be a better enchant for your paladin because of the defense it gives. The recovery it also gives you is just gravy as Echoes of Light and Divine Call + Vengeful Judge (which it looks like you are using) should help on CD reduction. I haven't tried it much but if you already have high defense, Eclipse could be beneficial for the pure deflect it provides.

    Without seeing your build, and from watching that video, I'll give my personal opinion/experience on a couple of things:

    • Absolution isn't great in PvP. Shields are reduced by too much for this to be effective.
    • Templar's Wrath is great for the brief disable with a little bit of damage and some temp HP.
    • Binding Oath can be blocked when it pops.
    • When you're going one-on-one with someone, 3x Bane + Feytouched will take care of a lot of that damage for you. Smite can help here too for some extra damage + damage reduction.
    • When I'm in a group, I like to hop in and drop a fully charged Burning Light on my enemies. It'll consistently shut down their long term plans with its pulsing interrupts if they let you get one off. It is also one of the better offensive tools in the paladin toolkit.
    • I used to use Binding Oath but since all of its mechanics are dependent on that shield it generates, it is severely weakened in PvP these days. Circle of Power or Bane are my choices for replacements.
    • It also looks like you weren't using your Shielding Strike. This is also weaker than it once was but it's probably still more effective than any benefit you'd gain from movement.
    • I try not to spam Divine Call. There's always a chance Echoes of Light will proc and then my CDR gained from it may have been wasted. I also space it out to maintain the buff.
    • Are you using Fey Thistle? Everfrost shirt/pants? Those are going to give your paladin a whole bunch of free damage while you keep yourself alive.
    • There are a lot of free heals that mounts can provide. They're pretty small individually but, collectively, they add up.
    Try healing touch instead of templars wrath, using templars is kinda trolling your team by giving oponents free cc res stacks.

  • terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    Believe me i tried everything what u write:)

    Every single encounter what can helps me against that i tested, nomally i use bane Vow and BL or Sacread weapon, why that encounters? couse this three enc give me alot of boost to do strong dmg, but if u have opponent like brollax, its hard to do this...

    Bane, i can use it only when i see the opponent, same as Vow, so i change it for templar wrath ( TEmp Hp are reduce now to 25% your hp ) so that encounter give 1 sec more sirvavibility, ( cool ) ,
    same as bandhing out, why? couse there is a chnace to deal dmg what i take reverse to opponent. But its hard when he is invisible:)
    i try Cleaning tuch, cool, i get dazed i use cleaning tuch then i get other daze:) over and over:)

    i go for Devo get half bulwar path and full heal, i use alot of power and try to spaming at will to heal, get 2 auras to increse % healing, get more wisdom, get boon for more healing from wisdom, goess what happened:):)

    Like i said, i really tried every scenario who can keep me alive:)

    i Talk with Saga ( perhaps the Best Tank Pally on server ) he have exactly the same problems:)

  • someonediessomeonedies Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,257 Arc User
    Crazy nerfs. This is the last month of the rest of pvp.
    Rimuru?
    Dead 🔪
  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    i showed this vide to a friend that plays other mmo, and he asked me " why is that undergeared paladin trying to 1v1 the tr " :D
  • terylionterylion Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    Brollax we must w8 to the mod 15 then everyone will be know what exaclty they nerf or buff... we will see it.
This discussion has been closed.