Sounds like they fixed a small aspect from minor interest to me, and what exactly does not crit from stealth on your char? The pants should not proc disabling/cc-feature during Daily spamming, so yes please nerf them in case you talk of your sandy pants?
To fix things, Dailies need a cooldown 30 sec at least, especially when those Dailies make you untouchable, I mean how lame is that? Prevent classes from daily spamming in PVP in general, a mayor broken aspect of PVP since long. But to begin with needed fixes, stop Bloodbath to multiproc buffs up to x8 and prevent one daily to kill many classes right at the start of a fight by proccing a cascade of 30k crits in a row, they can´t evade (BB->limit on single targets in PVP). There is a lot stuff abused all day long in PVP and Bloodbath is one of it since long. Maybe some of the 110% TR´s do not know, if they do, they obviously cheat all day long
Asking for fixes should be the first attempt to balance a class, in case it is overperforming, sadly I never saw that much knowledgeable TR´s except that @trgluestickz to even mention stuff like this: "... In short, using bloodbath causes infiltrator's action, invisible infiltrator, and razor action to give your their buff X2 instead of X1. Each successive BB you do before these passives wear off adds another X2 of their damage buffs. So you get X4, X6, and momentarily can get X8 of these passive's damage bonuses..." So you run untargetable doing dailies and in between run doublebuffed x1.2 x 1.2, maybe double lasting CA bonus on top. In the end no TR will stack x8 Infiltrators action in PVP I hope ... maybe vs Paladins, lately I saw that 400k proc from SoD on one of them
Although these are some ok ideas for how to survive against a TR, that is pretty much only what you are doing is "surviving". The main gripe most players have is that there is really no effective way between ITC and bloodbath to fight a TR with high recovery. IMO bloodbath is what makes this problematic.
The main issue is the fact that BB makes you immune to damage and untargetable during its duration and when BB is down ITC is up. I never see any pve TR's using this power however because the damage output in pve is very low compared to other powers you could be using (ie. Not being "locked" down for its duration).
The current plan of reducing it by .7 seconds and to 9 hits instead of 10 is really not enough. As long as the power does high damage and grants invulnerability during the duration players will continue to use and abuse this as their go to power. This the reason why every pvp TR has this power slotted and every pvp TR uses it.
why dont you take tr out of pvp? result: no more nerf this, nerf that....first it was sod, then bloodbath with sod, then too much stealth, now gloaming cut...lolol what´s next? ppl find a woraround asap and the whine is the same again.....
we whine becouse we have no counterplay against it, you think i didnt notice that TR with 800 armor pen hits me with 63% effectiveness, while GWF with 20k+ scraches me at 30-45%? sod ignores pvp dmg reduction, i looked throught TR feat tree and i didnt find anything that stated, you ignore ANY and ALL armour. Kinda odd dont you think? expectially since legit powers that have piercing hit exactly at 63%.
At the end of the day, every class has to find work arounds with a TR. That they wouldn't have to do with any other class. And even then, those work arounds probably only give a few extra seconds of survival rather than be offensive.
All the PvP TRs complain about changes because this is their feel good game in which they can say they're good. That's why they don't like the concept of fighting on equal ground. They are used to fighting 4v1s and winning and they want to keep that feeling.
But TRs can't justify why they deserve the best of any class. Best stun, best damage, best Dodge, no stun ITC and 100% deflect. Only class with invisibility (based on class not items). Infinite dailies(Bloodbath and Lashing Blade then repeat.) Every TR does this and then says it's because they know their class. Lol Even I know their class at this point because of how bogus it is.
At the end of the day though, most classes only get about 2 seconds to actually do damage if they survive a full rotation from a TR which is unfair.
Also, need the Devs to explain what makes SoD transfer to someone else in their fantasy world because it makes no sense. SoD should be based off the damage done to the player marked, not any damage done to any enemy. It's supposed to work like a wound or poison, not just a transfer of damage. Imagine you see your partner die after a Bloodbath and you just step on the node, and automatically die like lmao. How is that fair ?
Anywho, Mod 15's looking like a PvP Buff for TRs and a slight Nerf for PvE. Which is also not so good.
i am yet to see BiS TR in pvp, they all quit or something? most run around with some random enchants, not fully refined weapons. The fact that is good enaught to 1shot poeple while being immortal is sad. Time to wait for mod 16, 17 . . . 18? no 19 will fix it for sure.
I dont think it matters anymore... at least not on the xbox. Tried queuing today and 25mins later I gave up...
So tried again tonight, finally got into a game after 10mins and it was a pathetic TR slaughter house and pretty much unable to play that game. Next game I was dropped half way into a game where 3 people had left and 2 TR had over 15 kills. Finally got into a 3rd game and it was far worse than the 1st 2.
PvP has pretty much died on the Xbox... after stupid broken multiprocs and now TR abusing the hell out of helmets and other mechanics I just cant be bothered any more either, there is no fun to be had with the few players left making the game unplayable for everyone else.
Main - Rydia (HR70) - Xbox One Player only Alts : Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
3
demonmongerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,350Arc User
edited October 2018
Q> @schietindebux said: > Sounds like they fixed a small aspect from minor interest to me, and what exactly does not crit from stealth on your char? > The pants should not proc disabling/cc-feature during Daily spamming, so yes please nerf them in case you talk of your sandy pants? > > To fix things, Dailies need a cooldown 30 sec at least, especially when those Dailies make you untouchable, I mean how lame is that? > Prevent classes from daily spamming in PVP in general, a mayor broken aspect of PVP since long. > But to begin with needed fixes, stop Bloodbath to multiproc buffs up to x8 and prevent one daily to kill many classes right at the start of a fight by proccing a cascade of 30k crits in a row, they can´t evade (BB->limit on single targets in PVP). > There is a lot stuff abused all day long in PVP and Bloodbath is one of it since long. > Maybe some of the 110% TR´s do not know, if they do, they obviously cheat all day long > > Asking for fixes should be the first attempt to balance a class, in case it is overperforming, sadly I never saw that much knowledgeable TR´s except that @trgluestickz to even mention stuff like this: > "... In short, using bloodbath causes infiltrator's action, invisible infiltrator, and razor action to give your their buff X2 instead of X1. Each successive BB you do before these passives wear off adds another X2 of their damage buffs. So you get X4, X6, and momentarily can get X8 of these passive's damage bonuses..." > So you run untargetable doing dailies and in between run doublebuffed x1.2 x 1.2, maybe double lasting CA bonus on top. > In the end no TR will stack x8 Infiltrators action in PVP I hope ... maybe vs Paladins, lately I saw that 400k proc from SoD on one of them
Bloodbath does not make you untouchable
Post edited by frozenfirevr on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
in module 15 we try with Brollax 1v1 again, we will see, did they balanced something or they dont. Even if they dont, idc couse i kill on my pally almost every tr in server:) Anyway the point is, they should to do pvp more playable, not just becouse Tr is to strong ( ofcourse as class it is ) but they should bring it back Preamades. I remember when we play alot of times 5v5 , we w8 for the match against strong team. One times we lose, another we win, that was really exiting:) Now u just w8 for q, when u finelly get in, then u get pug like 2,5k, and in opposide side 5 players 14k atleast. THis is the biggest problem with the game right now, couse even if ure good ( no matter what build u have ) Exept tr, u do nothing alone right now. Thats why many trs play in pvp now, couse mostly ( when u have some skill to play on it ) of them can win that match alone:) Other players are confused, couse they cant the same with they own classes. They need alot of help in team. For the best example is DC, and OP. THis two classes (even if that person on this class is really expert ) nead support. I mean good team to winI see many matches when 2 teams was almost equal ( almost couse in one of them was tr, very good tr ) and guess what happent one team lose badly, another team win, and score was something like that - the best players in both sides (exept trs) have 4-5 kills ( teams was almost equals) tr in that team 30-0, no deaths:) that match could be nice, but one very good tr , clear everything:) Anyway as i said, the game need preamedes back, i hope the changes what comes in mod 15 helps with that, but if still will be solo q, that will be very hard:):):)
THey should to do solo q depend the GS - ofcourse players can do something like that ( thay take of gear, go in q for 10-13k gs, and when is in, they put on the gear ) but than, Devs should made something like - when u in match get more than u should have GS, than u automatic kiked from instance and 5h panalty:) that will be fair:):)
"Flash around the battlefield, slashing into your foes so quickly that you can not be targeted." Just tell me what the exact strategy looks like for different classes. You mean all should slot low damage aoe encounter maybe with cc effect only to counter Bloodbath in a somehow ineffective way? That´s what we talk about actually-> all classes build arround one class to defend themself sicne long. Devs don´t care, PVP is dead and some go on defend that BS.
I played PVP since mod 4 . There were only few TR´s all through the years that admitted to be broken in PVP, named broken stuff etc.. Those players, I call them insightfull or selfdeflected, allready left for ages. So why should I discuss with the rest of PVP TR´s, who stick with that class since 5 years now, even though knowing they play a broken class in PVP, comfort zone 24/7 but obviuosly don´t recognize -> "it´s not them, it´s the class", when the healthy ones stopped PVP with their TR since long or left the game allready ?
in module 15 we try with Brollax 1v1 again, we will see, did they balanced something or they dont. Even if they dont, idc couse i kill on my pally almost every tr in server:)
That´s because allmost 100% of skilled TR´s left the game, maybe out of boredomness. So you become "king of the scrubs" in the end.
Simple soulutions are there but devs are blind or simply "watch" since ages. It was said 4 years ago and 3 years ago and during the remainig years also -> "Chaining dailies and having unlimited AP in PVP isn´t a healthy thing"
- be me - walk on node - see teamfight, wanna join - get hit for 250k from sod, wasnt even in combat - TR is fine, i got outplayed, should know how to counte the bug - TR sees, chases - pop the wheel - pop the pot - run like a HAMSTER ( manly HAMSTER ) - bloodbath - i gotthis.jpg - shielded - mytimetoshine.gif - charge bl - doesntwork ITC - ah time to shield another bloodbath - Lay for 200k I GOT THIS - another sod for 250k - ded
For me end of story. couse i just wanna show what Op can to do against Tr like brollax. thats all. if Devs do something with that, good, if not, idc, couse anyway if premades don't back, many ppl wont returned to NWN. For what they should to returned, to solo q with no rewards?:)
NWO PVP is the place where TR's get to run around on murder sprees. That's it. Now go home.
The dev's clearly have no intention on balancing the game in pvp, and even if they did, doesn't seem like they would have half a clue as to what to do. After how many years? Seriously, it's never going to happen. All they do is make changes, then say "lets see what happens", there are so many bugs that are in the game, live, that could have been avoided if they practiced proper TDD (Test Driven Development). My guess is that their code base is a mess, and maybe only one or two people have a clue as to what the hell is actually going on in the game.
Looking at this stuff, and seeing it being backed up by a dev, makes me remember why i left PvP to rot. PvP is dead, but still, it's nice to see people do not learn. It does not matter if you're the genius of all TRs in game. Some stuff should not happen in a balanced game. Domination is 5v5, but since composition is random, and it's fought on 3 nodes (which means there a re a lot of 1v1 situations), you must balance classes to be able to at least put up a fight against everyone, and may be reverse the outcome through skill. Skill should be measured through the ability to time dodges and attacks. Knowledge through the ability to build the toon to maximize it. For example, GWF sprint does nothing against piercing damage, so a GWF can be super-skilled but still get dominated by a less skilled TR. That's not balance. The first step would be to remove, as said previously, all the extra stuff from PvP, not just companions: SH boons, Mount insignias, mount powers and bonuses, and add a cooldown to dailies to avoid spam.
0
demonmongerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,350Arc User
Looking at this stuff, and seeing it being backed up by a dev, makes me remember why i left PvP to rot. PvP is dead, but still, it's nice to see people do not learn. It does not matter if you're the genius of all TRs in game. Some stuff should not happen in a balanced game. Domination is 5v5, but since composition is random, and it's fought on 3 nodes (which means there a re a lot of 1v1 situations), you must balance classes to be able to at least put up a fight against everyone, and may be reverse the outcome through skill. Skill should be measured through the ability to time dodges and attacks. Knowledge through the ability to build the toon to maximize it. For example, GWF sprint does nothing against piercing damage, so a GWF can be super-skilled but still get dominated by a less skilled TR. That's not balance. The first step would be to remove, as said previously, all the extra stuff from PvP, not just companions: SH boons, Mount insignias, mount powers and bonuses, and add a cooldown to dailies to avoid spam.
stuff should not happen in a balaced game.. you mean like GF 1 shotting or 2 shotting a DPS character? or mmhmm should I continue?
You guys back certain classes and hate the hell out of others. Plus there is no more true piercing damage anymore.... nothing goes 100% through defenses. If you dont know.. now you know...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I hate paying taxes! Why must I pay thousands of dollars in taxes when everything I buy is taxed anyways!
stuff should not happen in a balaced game.. you mean like GF 1 shotting or 2 shotting a DPS character? or mmhmm should I continue?
You guys back certain classes and hate the hell out of others. Plus there is no more true piercing damage anymore.... nothing goes 100% through defenses. If you dont know.. now you know...
Never backed up GFs, in fact in the past i posted about GFs too. But it's the usual lies and accuses people throws in this section when someone talks about balance. I also play both TR and GF, so i have no reason to favor a class or the other. Simply noted that unbalanced stuff is still there. The old story of "every class got something unbalanced in their favor" is also quite funny since it's pretty clear to everyone since ages that some classes in PvP have clearly something more on their side. Nothing goes 100% through defenses but some things go through defenses more than others, and every class got something that works (dodge immunity, SW 1 second immunity, GF shield) and is effective for defense, while sprint is still a bad tool for defense since even when enemies hit sprint, a noticeable part of the damage goes through it, while when you hit GF shield/ dodges/ SW 1 second immunity, you deal close to no damage. In fact, GWFs still require a lot of gear and self heals to be strong, and are a free kill at lower gear levels, more than other classes. We also all know that GWFs have been free kills for TRs since modules now, expecially due to the fact that if a GWF times his shift mechanic on a TR he still gets damage, while if the TR times correctly his shift mechanics, he avoids damage completelyI still PvP sometimes on my HR and this did not change. GWFs are a far easier target to kill compared to most other classes. Cause all classes have tools to consistently mitigate or negate incoming damage, while GWFs don't, and rely on gear, self heals and boons. For example, when on my HR archer glass cannon i target a GWF, it goes down very fast, even geared ones. Other classes avoid/ negate the damage much more consistently and are, in my experience, more survivable. Been like this since years. In PvP GWFs were never more survivable, compared to other classes at same gear level. Sprint is an outdated mechanic that the devs never touched, and is far behind shift mechanics of other classes. It was supposed to be weaker because "it lasted longer" than a dodge. But now dodging classes can spam dodges and GFs can perma-shield. Sprint is over when the other class still has some stamina left. Other shift mechanics are for defensive purposes only (dodge, shield, SW shadow slip), while sprint is supposed to be to both defend and close gaps. BUT consumes so much stamina that in the end you are out of sprint faster than your opponent. For example, TRs out-roll GWF sprint. GFs can block for a long time with a proper build, while GWFs have to sprint again and again to get behind them, with the result that they end up out of stamina, open to GFs rotations, while GFs still have stamina left to block. Example:
@pando83 Here is another one, GWF is a victim for a TR but no that much for other classes. Here you see a high ranked GF vs a skilled GWF. Funny video, especially that raging TR, by that more entertainng than urs Think it´s mod 13. And honestly that GF Robb, is by no means that glorious or mature as commentet by Minimi, he runs mad and turns into cheatmode the moment he loses a match, witnessed many times myself .. in the end little egomaniac childs, all of them In the second part of the vid GF get´s badly facerolled, maybe skill>class a bit (on GWF's side).
@pando83 Here is another one, GWF is a victim for a TR but no that much for other classes. Here you see a high ranked GF vs a skilled GWF. Funny video, especially that raging TR. Think it´s mod 13 or 14
STAND ON THE NODE RICK OR ILL START SCREAMING.... ha ha lol made me laugh
Main - Rydia (HR70) - Xbox One Player only Alts : Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
against rob i was healing targets he wanted to kill and dazed him with BL when he was going for combo, then we grouped up and killed him, guy got mad started chasing me around with 2 others off node, killed me and corpse jumped ;p
Yes mod 15 will show ... what all those last mods since mod 5 allready showed, lol TR=skilled player , most other = scrubs , good argument btw
Honestly, we will see the same "No-arp-no-crit-deflect-builds" 50k+power 20k recvovery, since that´s a TR have to invest in PVP, nothing else. It´s about the ability to ignore DR paired with 100% crit from stealth. Up to 85% deflectseverity, ITC+Bloodbath, rolls on top will do the rest. TR´s with some gear will have the same easy game. We all know that anyway. Only difference may be -> now you can watch TR killing you PVP in this game is allready burried since 2-3 mods on PC and mod 15 will by no means revive anything.
@pando83 Here is another one, GWF is a victim for a TR but no that much for other classes. Here you see a high ranked GF vs a skilled GWF. Funny video, especially that raging TR, by that more entertainng than urs Think it´s mod 13. And honestly that GF Robb, is by no means that glorious or mature as commentet by Minimi, he runs mad and turns into cheatmode the moment he loses a match, witnessed many times myself .. in the end little egomaniac childs, all of them In the second part of the vid GF get´s badly facerolled, maybe skill>class a bit (on GWF's side).
Top geared GWFs are strong. What i pointed out is that defensive mechanics on GWF side are outdated compared to dodge/shadow slip/shield block exc...Sprint and also Unstoppable let a good portion of the damage pass through, compared to the other mentioned mechanics. And right now sprint does not grant more uptime than dodges or shield block, but may be even less, and Unstoppable DR lets a lot of damage pass through. I see this on my HR because GWFs are really easier to take down compared to most other classes that can dodge or mitigate more damage, more consistently.
I think the problem with people that attempt to defend the tr- the same one's that point to other classes strengths as arguments for tr balance- is that they don't understand what the class is capable of when recovery is stacked past a certain amount (say about 25-30k range). The powers trs have are very strong, but the tr class is quite squishy when they are actually targetable and don't have itc up. So to be clear, it's trs that have high recovery that are the problem. No one cares about your garbage innovative tr builds with low to normal levels of recovery.
How trolls on here defend high recovery trs:
Why do class changes in regards to pvp only come with the release of a mod, and aren't even addressed until many mods after it's clear there are balance issues? Why are broken items left in pvp for multiple mods? Why are drains still in the game? Why are extremely low iL players allowed to q up for domination? At this point it should be clear the devs don't care much about pvp, but the real question is... WHY SHOULD THEY?
@wdj40 :Yep... roll about invincible until stealth pops... drop a smoke bomb on you that you cannot see coming, stunned slowed dazed etc etc. Followed by Bloodbath so more invincibility and invisibility doing lots of damage at the same time, during this knocked prone for even more damage, followed by some stab in the back if not dead by this point. By this time most of TR powers are back off cooldown so if you somehow managed to survive that its just starts again without you being able to fight back. If I do get a lucky shot off inbetween the stuns/dazes/[prones I have a 1 in 10 chance of it actually hitting then around a 1 in 10 chance if it doing any decent damage.
Yeah PvP at its finest and I have not come across a TR for weeks who is not doing this. -----------------------------------------------------------
if u cant fallow, predict,and use instincs thats your fail not trs or game
I think the main issue is mostly the fact that any veteran player can tell you what is wrong with the TR class in pvp in about 5 seconds. It's mainly the same broken powers and broken builds that have persisted throughout multiple mods and the heavy reliance on daily power spams. The problem is that the developers don't listen to veteran players calling for time to be spent fixing broken powers they should, and instead spend time developing items that cause even more problems (curse bringer rings, pvp drain overloads, reflect damage helmets, prone helmets etc.), and then have to be subsequently fixed because they cause more problems then the fundamental class issues that are being neglected. Even if you choose to ignore people that have played the class continuously since the games outset, merely looking through any TR threads on the forums and a clear picture will emerge.
Instead we get "suggestions" on how to play against a class by the developer staff that comes off as pretty tone deaf in regards to what the complaints are about. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to see devs like @scarabman engaging with the community and trying to be helpful. I respect the fact that it can be challenging to try and balance something and make everyone happy in the process. I just wish they would listen more and open up a dialogue to acknowledge that there are massive issues with the way damage works with the TR class in a risk vs reward scenario in PVP.
As it stands right now there really is no downside or "weakness" to the TR that can be exploited to counter the class using the flavor of the month builds, therefore no risk. The reward of high damage and guaranteed kills on your opponent however is overwhelming. Now sprinkle in cc and self buffs and you have a class that can do everything except heal. Of course when your taking no damage this isn't really a problem.
Also as a final rant which is kind of off topic, why would you add a prone on a helmet that is activated by dailies? This had TR written all over it, and is the last thing needed..... I mean seriously guys cmon
if u cant fallow, predict,and use instincs thats your fail not trs or game
This was the excuse also back then during permastealth era. TRs could hit from stealth on an open target, but it was the other class' fault for not being able to "guess" where the invisible TR was and catch it in between dodge roll spam and permastealth. So one class has all the tools for easy play and just need to build the stats needed and execute the rotation, with little skill involved. But the other class must "predict" and "use instincts" or it's their fault. Yeah, it totally makes sense.
@wdj40 :Yep... roll about invincible until stealth pops... drop a smoke bomb on you that you cannot see coming, stunned slowed dazed etc etc. Followed by Bloodbath so more invincibility and invisibility doing lots of damage at the same time, during this knocked prone for even more damage, followed by some stab in the back if not dead by this point. By this time most of TR powers are back off cooldown so if you somehow managed to survive that its just starts again without you being able to fight back. If I do get a lucky shot off inbetween the stuns/dazes/[prones I have a 1 in 10 chance of it actually hitting then around a 1 in 10 chance if it doing any decent damage.
Yeah PvP at its finest and I have not come across a TR for weeks who is not doing this. -----------------------------------------------------------
if u cant fallow, predict,and use instincs thats your fail not trs or game
what the HAMSTER do you want me to predict? there is nothing, nothing to dodge, i can shield your combo in my sleep, the problem is that you HAMSTER 1shot me throught the shield becouse your broken HAMSTER class ignores all defence while dealing 300k damage. and whats disgusting is that you are not even that well geared, i bet there is tr out there that can smack 1mil+ dmg combos but he doesnt bother since there is no competition whatsoever. I can outpley GF by dodging his CC, leting of of BL during his charge so he cant followup , breaking free from his GW combo, same goes for alot of classes, and our fight are dinamic, against archer i can switch encounters mid combat. agains tr? i hope they suck and thats all i can do. becose my class has no counterplay against yours. all i can do is either run ( you are faster ) or hope SOMEHOW tr misses bloodbath ( seen it happen it didnt even matter cuz he had it again in 5s ). and its all day with this HAMSTER, trs that forget to proc SoD before doin bloodbath, but it doesnt matter they run around 15 kills 0 deaths.
Comments
The pants should not proc disabling/cc-feature during Daily spamming, so yes please nerf them in case you talk of your sandy pants?
To fix things, Dailies need a cooldown 30 sec at least, especially when those Dailies make you untouchable, I mean how lame is that?
Prevent classes from daily spamming in PVP in general, a mayor broken aspect of PVP since long.
But to begin with needed fixes, stop Bloodbath to multiproc buffs up to x8 and prevent one daily to kill many classes right at the start of a fight by proccing a cascade of 30k crits in a row, they can´t evade (BB->limit on single targets in PVP).
There is a lot stuff abused all day long in PVP and Bloodbath is one of it since long.
Maybe some of the 110% TR´s do not know, if they do, they obviously cheat all day long
Asking for fixes should be the first attempt to balance a class, in case it is overperforming, sadly I never saw that much knowledgeable TR´s except that @trgluestickz to even mention stuff like this:
"... In short, using bloodbath causes infiltrator's action, invisible infiltrator, and razor action to give your their buff X2 instead of X1. Each successive BB you do before these passives wear off adds another X2 of their damage buffs. So you get X4, X6, and momentarily can get X8 of these passive's damage bonuses..."
So you run untargetable doing dailies and in between run doublebuffed x1.2 x 1.2, maybe double lasting CA bonus on top.
In the end no TR will stack x8 Infiltrators action in PVP I hope ... maybe vs Paladins, lately I saw that 400k proc from SoD on one of them
Although these are some ok ideas for how to survive against a TR, that is pretty much only what you are doing is "surviving". The main gripe most players have is that there is really no effective way between ITC and bloodbath to fight a TR with high recovery. IMO bloodbath is what makes this problematic.
The main issue is the fact that BB makes you immune to damage and untargetable during its duration and when BB is down ITC is up. I never see any pve TR's using this power however because the damage output in pve is very low compared to other powers you could be using (ie. Not being "locked" down for its duration).
The current plan of reducing it by .7 seconds and to 9 hits instead of 10 is really not enough. As long as the power does high damage and grants invulnerability during the duration players will continue to use and abuse this as their go to power. This the reason why every pvp TR has this power slotted and every pvp TR uses it.
All the PvP TRs complain about changes because this is their feel good game in which they can say they're good. That's why they don't like the concept of fighting on equal ground. They are used to fighting 4v1s and winning and they want to keep that feeling.
But TRs can't justify why they deserve the best of any class.
Best stun, best damage, best Dodge, no stun ITC and 100% deflect. Only class with invisibility (based on class not items). Infinite dailies(Bloodbath and Lashing Blade then repeat.)
Every TR does this and then says it's because they know their class.
Lol Even I know their class at this point because of how bogus it is.
At the end of the day though, most classes only get about 2 seconds to actually do damage if they survive a full rotation from a TR which is unfair.
Also, need the Devs to explain what makes SoD transfer to someone else in their fantasy world because it makes no sense.
SoD should be based off the damage done to the player marked, not any damage done to any enemy. It's supposed to work like a wound or poison, not just a transfer of damage.
Imagine you see your partner die after a Bloodbath and you just step on the node, and automatically die like lmao.
How is that fair ?
Anywho, Mod 15's looking like a PvP Buff for TRs and a slight Nerf for PvE.
Which is also not so good.
So tried again tonight, finally got into a game after 10mins and it was a pathetic TR slaughter house and pretty much unable to play that game. Next game I was dropped half way into a game where 3 people had left and 2 TR had over 15 kills. Finally got into a 3rd game and it was far worse than the 1st 2.
PvP has pretty much died on the Xbox... after stupid broken multiprocs and now TR abusing the hell out of helmets and other mechanics I just cant be bothered any more either, there is no fun to be had with the few players left making the game unplayable for everyone else.
Alts :
Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
> Sounds like they fixed a small aspect from minor interest to me, and what exactly does not crit from stealth on your char?
> The pants should not proc disabling/cc-feature during Daily spamming, so yes please nerf them in case you talk of your sandy pants?
>
> To fix things, Dailies need a cooldown 30 sec at least, especially when those Dailies make you untouchable, I mean how lame is that?
> Prevent classes from daily spamming in PVP in general, a mayor broken aspect of PVP since long.
> But to begin with needed fixes, stop Bloodbath to multiproc buffs up to x8 and prevent one daily to kill many classes right at the start of a fight by proccing a cascade of 30k crits in a row, they can´t evade (BB->limit on single targets in PVP).
> There is a lot stuff abused all day long in PVP and Bloodbath is one of it since long.
> Maybe some of the 110% TR´s do not know, if they do, they obviously cheat all day long
>
> Asking for fixes should be the first attempt to balance a class, in case it is overperforming, sadly I never saw that much knowledgeable TR´s except that @trgluestickz to even mention stuff like this:
> "... In short, using bloodbath causes infiltrator's action, invisible infiltrator, and razor action to give your their buff X2 instead of X1. Each successive BB you do before these passives wear off adds another X2 of their damage buffs. So you get X4, X6, and momentarily can get X8 of these passive's damage bonuses..."
> So you run untargetable doing dailies and in between run doublebuffed x1.2 x 1.2, maybe double lasting CA bonus on top.
> In the end no TR will stack x8 Infiltrators action in PVP I hope ... maybe vs Paladins, lately I saw that 400k proc from SoD on one of them
Bloodbath does not make you untouchable
Anyway the point is, they should to do pvp more playable, not just becouse Tr is to strong ( ofcourse as class it is ) but they should bring it back Preamades.
I remember when we play alot of times 5v5 , we w8 for the match against strong team. One times we lose, another we win, that was really exiting:)
Now u just w8 for q, when u finelly get in, then u get pug like 2,5k, and in opposide side 5 players 14k atleast. THis is the biggest problem with the game right now, couse even if ure good ( no matter what build u have ) Exept tr, u do nothing alone right now.
Thats why many trs play in pvp now, couse mostly ( when u have some skill to play on it ) of them can win that match alone:)
Other players are confused, couse they cant the same with they own classes. They need alot of help in team.
For the best example is DC, and OP. THis two classes (even if that person on this class is really expert ) nead support. I mean good team to winI see many matches when 2 teams was almost equal ( almost couse in one of them was tr, very good tr ) and guess what happent
that match could be nice, but one very good tr , clear everything:)
Anyway as i said, the game need preamedes back, i hope the changes what comes in mod 15 helps with that, but if still will be solo q, that will be very hard:):):)
THey should to do solo q depend the GS - ofcourse players can do something like that ( thay take of gear, go in q for 10-13k gs, and when is in, they put on the gear ) but than, Devs should made something like - when u in match get more than u should have GS, than u automatic kiked from instance and 5h panalty:) that will be fair:):)
Just tell me what the exact strategy looks like for different classes. You mean all should slot low damage aoe encounter maybe with cc effect only to counter Bloodbath in a somehow ineffective way?
That´s what we talk about actually-> all classes build arround one class to defend themself sicne long. Devs don´t care, PVP is dead and some go on defend that BS.
I played PVP since mod 4 . There were only few TR´s all through the years that admitted to be broken in PVP, named broken stuff etc.. Those players, I call them insightfull or selfdeflected, allready left for ages.
So why should I discuss with the rest of PVP TR´s, who stick with that class since 5 years now, even though knowing they play a broken class in PVP, comfort zone 24/7 but obviuosly don´t recognize -> "it´s not them, it´s the class", when the healthy ones stopped PVP with their TR since long or left the game allready ? That´s because allmost 100% of skilled TR´s left the game, maybe out of boredomness. So you become "king of the scrubs" in the end.
Simple soulutions are there but devs are blind or simply "watch" since ages.
It was said 4 years ago and 3 years ago and during the remainig years also -> "Chaining dailies and having unlimited AP in PVP isn´t a healthy thing"
- walk on node
- see teamfight, wanna join
- get hit for 250k from sod, wasnt even in combat
- TR is fine, i got outplayed, should know how to counte the bug
- TR sees, chases
- pop the wheel
- pop the pot
- run like a HAMSTER ( manly HAMSTER )
- bloodbath
- i gotthis.jpg
- shielded
- mytimetoshine.gif
- charge bl
- doesntwork ITC
- ah time to shield another bloodbath
- Lay for 200k I GOT THIS
- another sod for 250k
- ded
Ty for ur attention guys:)
The dev's clearly have no intention on balancing the game in pvp, and even if they did, doesn't seem like they would have half a clue as to what to do. After how many years? Seriously, it's never going to happen. All they do is make changes, then say "lets see what happens", there are so many bugs that are in the game, live, that could have been avoided if they practiced proper TDD (Test Driven Development). My guess is that their code base is a mess, and maybe only one or two people have a clue as to what the hell is actually going on in the game.
PvP is dead, but still, it's nice to see people do not learn.
It does not matter if you're the genius of all TRs in game. Some stuff should not happen in a balanced game.
Domination is 5v5, but since composition is random, and it's fought on 3 nodes (which means there a re a lot of 1v1 situations), you must balance classes to be able to at least put up a fight against everyone, and may be reverse the outcome through skill.
Skill should be measured through the ability to time dodges and attacks. Knowledge through the ability to build the toon to maximize it. For example, GWF sprint does nothing against piercing damage, so a GWF can be super-skilled but still get dominated by a less skilled TR. That's not balance.
The first step would be to remove, as said previously, all the extra stuff from PvP, not just companions: SH boons, Mount insignias, mount powers and bonuses, and add a cooldown to dailies to avoid spam.
or mmhmm should I continue?
You guys back certain classes and hate the hell out of others.
Plus there is no more true piercing damage anymore.... nothing goes 100% through defenses.
If you dont know.. now you know...
SWW bugged x 1.4
Start with fixes
Stop Daily chaining little changes more balance
Nothing goes 100% through defenses but some things go through defenses more than others, and every class got something that works (dodge immunity, SW 1 second immunity, GF shield) and is effective for defense, while sprint is still a bad tool for defense since even when enemies hit sprint, a noticeable part of the damage goes through it, while when you hit GF shield/ dodges/ SW 1 second immunity, you deal close to no damage. In fact, GWFs still require a lot of gear and self heals to be strong, and are a free kill at lower gear levels, more than other classes. We also all know that GWFs have been free kills for TRs since modules now, expecially due to the fact that if a GWF times his shift mechanic on a TR he still gets damage, while if the TR times correctly his shift mechanics, he avoids damage completelyI still PvP sometimes on my HR and this did not change. GWFs are a far easier target to kill compared to most other classes. Cause all classes have tools to consistently mitigate or negate incoming damage, while GWFs don't, and rely on gear, self heals and boons. For example, when on my HR archer glass cannon i target a GWF, it goes down very fast, even geared ones. Other classes avoid/ negate the damage much more consistently and are, in my experience, more survivable. Been like this since years. In PvP GWFs were never more survivable, compared to other classes at same gear level. Sprint is an outdated mechanic that the devs never touched, and is far behind shift mechanics of other classes. It was supposed to be weaker because "it lasted longer" than a dodge. But now dodging classes can spam dodges and GFs can perma-shield. Sprint is over when the other class still has some stamina left. Other shift mechanics are for defensive purposes only (dodge, shield, SW shadow slip), while sprint is supposed to be to both defend and close gaps. BUT consumes so much stamina that in the end you are out of sprint faster than your opponent. For example, TRs out-roll GWF sprint. GFs can block for a long time with a proper build, while GWFs have to sprint again and again to get behind them, with the result that they end up out of stamina, open to GFs rotations, while GFs still have stamina left to block. Example:
top GWF vs top geared GF:
Here is another one, GWF is a victim for a TR but no that much for other classes.
Here you see a high ranked GF vs a skilled GWF. Funny video, especially that raging TR, by that more entertainng than urs
Think it´s mod 13.
And honestly that GF Robb, is by no means that glorious or mature as commentet by Minimi, he runs mad and turns into cheatmode the moment he loses a match, witnessed many times myself .. in the end little egomaniac childs, all of them
In the second part of the vid GF get´s badly facerolled, maybe skill>class a bit (on GWF's side).
Hulk Hogan "Griffons" Ric Flair
Alts :
Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
TR=skilled player , most other = scrubs , good argument btw
Honestly, we will see the same "No-arp-no-crit-deflect-builds" 50k+power 20k recvovery, since that´s a TR have to invest in PVP, nothing else.
It´s about the ability to ignore DR paired with 100% crit from stealth.
Up to 85% deflectseverity, ITC+Bloodbath, rolls on top will do the rest. TR´s with some gear will have the same easy game.
We all know that anyway.
Only difference may be -> now you can watch TR killing you
PVP in this game is allready burried since 2-3 mods on PC and mod 15 will by no means revive anything.
I see this on my HR because GWFs are really easier to take down compared to most other classes that can dodge or mitigate more damage, more consistently.
about 25-30k range). The powers trs have are very strong, but the tr class is quite squishy when they are actually targetable and don't have itc up. So to be clear, it's trs that have high recovery that are the problem. No one cares about your garbage innovative tr builds with low to normal levels of recovery.
How trolls on here defend high recovery trs:
Why do class changes in regards to pvp only come with the release of a mod, and aren't even addressed until many mods after it's clear there are balance issues? Why are broken items left in pvp for multiple mods? Why are drains still in the game? Why are extremely low iL players allowed to q up for domination? At this point it should be clear the devs don't care much about pvp, but the real question is... WHY SHOULD THEY?
Yeah PvP at its finest and I have not come across a TR for weeks who is not doing this.
-----------------------------------------------------------
if u cant fallow, predict,and use instincs thats your fail not trs or game
Instead we get "suggestions" on how to play against a class by the developer staff that comes off as pretty tone deaf in regards to what the complaints are about. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to see devs like @scarabman engaging with the community and trying to be helpful. I respect the fact that it can be challenging to try and balance something and make everyone happy in the process. I just wish they would listen more and open up a dialogue to acknowledge that there are massive issues with the way damage works with the TR class in a risk vs reward scenario in PVP.
As it stands right now there really is no downside or "weakness" to the TR that can be exploited to counter the class using the flavor of the month builds, therefore no risk. The reward of high damage and guaranteed kills on your opponent however is overwhelming. Now sprinkle in cc and self buffs and you have a class that can do everything except heal. Of course when your taking no damage this isn't really a problem.
Also as a final rant which is kind of off topic, why would you add a prone on a helmet that is activated by dailies? This had TR written all over it, and is the last thing needed..... I mean seriously guys cmon
Yeah, it totally makes sense.