Just look through the last half-dozen or so patch notes and see how many events they've updated and bugfixed *after* they were just held
As a bit of clarification on why changes are sometimes made to events just after they've run: we schedule our builds far in advance, as they need to go through testing before we can push them live. That same department is also hard at work looking through content for upcoming modules. While there will always be bugs that slip through, the more last minute changes and hotfixes we make, the more chance there is for additional bugs to pop up.
While there are certainly emergencies that can be hotfixed, not all issues can be hotfixed and hotfixes can be difficult on the team as they risk introducing other problems. While hotfixes are generally associated with exploits, there are other situations where outright bugs would warrant a hotfix as well.
The reason therefore that you might see changes or bugfixes for events that ran recently, is that we are definitely watching your feedback, and of course, playing the events ourselves. Therefore, please continue to give your feedback, regardless of the nature of your feedback—we truly appreciate it!
It takes 2 min for one ball to vanish, leaving two bronce tickets.
Just wanted to jump in here to clarify something in regards to the ticket-balls. While it is certainly possible to only receive 2 copper tickets from a single ticket-ball, each of the 30 volleys on a single ball is capable of rewarding a copper ticket. In addition, there are 3 rewards that will drop out of the ball when it reaches 30 volleys or hits the ground, it is possible for any or all of those 3 to be copper tickets as well. The same can be said for silver and mithral tickets, given that you have the requisite number of volleys overall to see those tickets appear.
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ghoulz66Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,748Arc User
@asterdahl so how can a player make the difference between the content you are keep releasing , since it get's released with features that do not work as intended, for example the balls from practice field, how can someone know if playin the game is legit or not at this point? because i've seen so many players doing the practice balls in the corner, that i wouldn't have guessed that could've been someth wrong.
it's just a shame, i feel that at some point you guys will punish players over these mistakes that happen at the QA department when you guys still keep pushin content like this (remember 22 december), it's just not safe for our acc anymore.
at this moment , every player in this game has 'exploited' one of the not so working features that got released, without even knowin' that. Problably not everyone, except those that do not play this game that frequently and roleplayers.
Hi metalldjt, you bring up a lot of great points! Certainly, when a bug goes live that can allow obtaining loot in an unintended manner, you could call that an exploit, that being said, as you point out, it's not always obvious particularly as you're playing through new content whether something is "unintended" or not.
In this case, the onus is on us for shipping that content with a bug. In the case of the training and novelty balls exploding and granting rewards, that was a big oversight on our part and we've made the necessary adjustments to our test plans to hopefully account for similar situations in the future.
Because the functionality that was being experienced could be misconstrued as intended and the system was not being exploited maliciously, no action was taken against anyone who earned rewards via the bug. We apologize for any confusion the bug caused and appreciate the many concerned reports sent by players.
Of course in addition to actually fixing issues and shipping less issues in general, there's also the matter of communication. We'd like to reduce the gray area in terms of what would and would not be considered an exploit. Naturally, there will always be some ambiguity with a sensitive topic like this. However, communication like the recent clarification that hitting ticket-balls into a wall is not exploitative behavior will hopefully help to reduce confusion.
@asterdahl As this is a new event I wanted to ask something in regards to the Summer Height event where the rewards for event activities are increased. Will the tickets (copper, silver, mithril) from the ticket-balls have improved drop rates during this event? I am asking because a lot of our guild members are saving ticket-balls to do volley parties during the height event, but I am wondering if we should be or not?
Thanks for any information you may be able to provide on this subject!
@asterdahl - again, just wanted to say thanks for your interaction on this thread. I know these forums aren't the most friendly sometimes, and walking in a minefield is never fun... but even so, your interaction here is important, vital in fact, so I do hope you (and/or others) make a habit of it.
i've noticed from all the balls placed togheter that the average rewards are 10% copper tickets and 1% mithral tickets, it's kinda weird to have an event like this that is gated behind 2 RNGs walls, i cannot complain since i won a legendary mount by luck, but i am willin to invest more to have some ROI out of this.
Thanks for the continued feedback metalldjt, and the bug report regarding the volleys when multiple party members hit the ball at once. I've logged that issue for investigation, in the meantime, I recommend letting a second or so pass between each volley to avoid the problem.
In addition, I'd like to make a quick note about the two layers of chance. While it is true that there are two layers of chance here, the combined chance of getting a mithral ticket and then getting an epic item out of a raffle is roughly equivalent to getting an epic item from a starlight parcel which is similarly priced and available at the same rate of one per day.
As the flavor for this event is a bit different, and we set it up via a ticket exchange, it might seem like your overall chance is lower because there are two factors. In addition, because there is a legendary raffle for which the chances are lower than the epic raffle, it may feel like there is a much lower chance overall. On the other hand, you have more freedom about what low and middle-tier prizes you earn with the ticket exchange system.
@asterdahl As this is a new event I wanted to ask something in regards to the Summer Height event where the rewards for event activities are increased. Will the tickets (copper, silver, mithril) from the ticket-balls have improved drop rates during this event? I am asking because a lot of our guild members are saving ticket-balls to do volley parties during the height event, but I am wondering if we should be or not?
Thanks for any information you may be able to provide on this subject!
Because we did not want to encourage players to hold on to their ticket balls and have an overwhelming amount of volleys to go through on the last few days, nor did we want players who used their balls during the first few weeks to feel as if they missed out, we did not include the ticket-ball system in the height of summer. So you are safe to use the ticket-balls as is.
@asterdahl - again, just wanted to say thanks for your interaction on this thread. I know these forums aren't the most friendly sometimes, and walking in a minefield is never fun... but even so, your interaction here is important, vital in fact, so I do hope you (and/or others) make a habit of it.
As always it is my pleasure and we appreciate the continued feedback, positive or otherwise.
It takes 2 min for one ball to vanish, leaving two bronce tickets.
Just wanted to jump in here to clarify something in regards to the ticket-balls. While it is certainly possible to only receive 2 copper tickets from a single ticket-ball, each of the 30 volleys on a single ball is capable of rewarding a copper ticket. In addition, there are 3 rewards that will drop out of the ball when it reaches 30 volleys or hits the ground, it is possible for any or all of those 3 to be copper tickets as well. The same can be said for silver and mithral tickets, given that you have the requisite number of volleys overall to see those tickets appear.
I really don't understand why you would actually allow an item to fail so spectacularly to give proper rewards if a player screws up. The balls shouldn't even be able to pop until they've hit at least 30 volleys. Having them fail at 5 volleys or some such just makes players feel like they've wasting their time and/or money. Even if you do get 30 volleys the rewards are so much worse than lockboxes that it actively discourages players from bothering with the balls.
Did you even compare the rewards to lockboxes before you set drop rates? Because I can open just about any lockbox and get 20-40k AD worth of drops + ~4-12k worth of tradebars. This means that on the low end a lockbox is worth about 4-5 preservation wards. A ball willl usually at best drop enough for 1 pres ward if that. I could understand having lower drop for party members but having such abysmal rewards for the player that activated the ball makes no sense.
In addition, I'd like to make a quick note about the two layers of chance. While it is true that there are two layers of chance here, the combined chance of getting a mithral ticket and then getting an epic item out of a raffle is roughly equivalent to getting an epic item from a starlight parcel which is similarly priced and available at the same rate of one per day.
Starlight parcels had much better lower and mid tier rewards and the possibility to drop BtC versions of the bag. I don't think anyone would be complaining as much if they had BtC balls with tickets for BtC loot and mid/lower tier rewards dropped at a rate that made it worth their time. No one was really doing starlight parcels for the higher tier rewards anyways. We all knew we weren't gettting a forgehammer but getting a warlock, some pres wards, retraining tokens, seasonal event mounts etc. wasn't anywhere near as bad a deal as the balls are.
Just as a request for the upcoming blog posts for class reworks/balancing, could you and the other devs please write in-depth blog posts about some of the important changes coming like was done with the Lostmauth set change and the OP changes? I am foreseeing ITF being hit hard and having a blog post explaining your views on what you think buffs should look like and why you handled the manner in the way that you did would be greatly appreciated. The same goes for any other large scale changes that happen to the classes (extensive SW/HR rework blogs are a given I hope )
Guild - The Imaginary Friends We are searching for slave labor, will pay with food from our farm!
Lesson learned. Devs are telling us to go in a corner and play with our balls by ourselves. Just bring a group to watch because it's more rewarding that way.
A lesson everyone should have learned from their high school gym teacher, anyway.
Umm... yeah, I'm tempted, but no. Must. Not. Say. It.
So the copper ticket drop rate is wai then? The percentage drop rate for copper tickets has been estimated to be at around 10%. Popping this up to 25% at least is in order please.
As far as the Legendary Mount, I suppose I'll keep waiting for the day you guys decide to sell an account wide one for cash money. My money is waiting.
Lesson learned. Devs are telling us to go in a corner and play with our balls by ourselves. Just bring a group to watch because it's more rewarding that way.
A lesson everyone should have learned from their high school gym teacher, anyway.
Umm... yeah, I'm tempted, but no. Must. Not. Say. It.
a ticket downgrade vendor would have been great think that would solve some problems with missing coppertickets, if we were able to sell silver for coppertickets on a reasonable exchange rate
I guess I was quite misguided by the first day of the event. I could have been more confident, and now that I tried ticket-balling, it seems reasonable with copper ticket drops. Thank you for showing up!
... This time a similar item with no rewards, as the lantern, perfect to trick players into thinking that a teammate actually shared anything, is not present.
However, scamming players of their sahha balls is omnipresent nevertheless. The push towards "team only with people you know from your guild" is very detrimental. I deleted my FL entries because nobody logged in anymore.
Please implement some kind of safeguard, players who does not contribute to the share does not get anything, if they did contribute but less than others any extra popped by the teammates will give him nothing.
Again, a scammer-prone event with tons of frustrated players.
If you use your free sahha ball, solo in a corner, every day (and don't screw it up), plus the extra free one from the first day, it will take you exactly 9 days to reach 300 volleys, provided you don't pay for any free balls and you didn't accidentally exploit the practice balls without realizing that wasn't intentional (frankly, 1 volley after 30 hits takes SO LONG per single volley that I personally thought it was completely intentional and was a nod to free players that preferred to play NW solo... but I digress). So, 9 days out of what, 21? 28? (can't recall how long this runs including the extra Height of summer week) - after which you will be able to use your remaining free balls, solo, for a chance to win mythral tickets. It's important to realize - after 300 volleys - there is NO extra special unlocked thing. 150 gets you silver, 300 allows for mythral, 2500 gets you nothing extra, nor would 3 million (other than all those chances to have gotten a mythral ticket after reaching 300).
So - in some ways, you're right - people that pay zen for extra balls DO get an advantage here, and people that group up will get to 300 much faster (I had 300 on day one, for example).
If you're complaining that you shared a ball (and therefore got all the awards you would have gotten anyway) but then the person you teamed with split without sharing - I mean... I don't know that a technical solution is in order here. If you were on the street having lunch, and a complete stranger asked if they could eat your lunch and promised to let you eat theirs when they were done, then afterward said they didn't actually have a lunch and jump in a cab and took off before you could do anything... would you blame the police for not protecting you from that person or would you blame yourself for being stupid and agreeing to share with a total stranger?
Sucks that your friends have quit the game - I know the feeling. Make new friends, there's lots of good folks out there. But with all the massive flaws, bugs and missteps Cryptic has made, crying because you got your full reward along with someone else too (which is way better than them getting your reward - lunch - and you getting none by the way) but them not reciprocating just seems... radically out of touch.. like being in a massive 10 car pile up and, amid ambulances and smoke, worrying that your shoe got a scuff mark on it...
So- my opinion on this event. I like Sahha. The matches are too long and I agree it should be "indoors" (that is, no out of bounds), and I think there should be a way to exchange up and exchange down tickets. Other than that, I actually think sahha makes a really fun addition to the summer fest and, while I would play more matches if they were shorter, I still enjoy it. My only real question is: @asterdahl when can we expect a Sahha pitch on our Stronghold maps?!!!
As always it is my pleasure and we appreciate the continued feedback, positive or otherwise.
Please implement some kind of safeguard, players who does not contribute to the share does not get anything, if they did contribute but less than others any extra popped by the teammates will give him nothing.
If this would actually happen then players in farming groups would not get anything out of the first Zenball volley round. 1 ball volley farming groups would not be possible either. Basically, your first and only free Zen ball per day would not hand out any rewards...
The idea was, if they designed it that way, one player can have guaranteed 20x5 CHANCES of rewards instead of their own chances, seeing the insanely low percentages. Not to give everything away to idiots joining every team and not contributing anything, who at the end of the event will be much better off AD wise at least than honest players.
And I can tell you with complete confidence that every group I was in, everyone contributed exactly the number of balls to the group that they were expected to when the group was formed in the first place. In some cases, that was several from one person and one from another, and none from anyone else, in other cases, it was 1 from everyone, etc. Never once did someone not use a ball when the group expected it to. Why? Because I didn't group with strangers. If you are not social enough in NW to maintain a group of friends (the keyword here is maintain - that is, as friends leave, you find new friends... be that via a guild, one of the many social channels, whatever) then you're relegated to the shark tank. When you swim with the sharks, expect to get bitten. (I guess in NW, they're more like ill-tempered sea bass... and yes, I do love my analogies)
I haven't asked for groups in public chat areas in years. I can't even remember the last time I used Zone and I have NEVER used the LFG or Trade channels, ever. That's what Guild and Alliance channels are for... so again - if you are doing business with strangers, you should simply expect this sort of thing and don't be shocked when it happens. Sad state of affairs? Sure. But the onus is on YOU to protect yourself, and the way you do that isn't to complain to the devs, rather it's to form (and reform as needed) friendships or at least relationships with people you can trust not to "scam" you. If you're not willing to do that, you probably shouldn't be playing an MMO or at the very least, not participating in any of the team-oriented features (which also means reconciling yourself to never getting the rewards that go along with that content).
It seems harsh... but it's the reality. There are so many other things that need to be prioritized over this that you'd forget why you were counting before you got to this item on the list. Simple as that. So whether you like it or not... the solution to your problem is changing your behavior (as much as people hate being told to do that, it is what it is), not Cryptic implementing some nanny feature.
My only real question is: @asterdahl when can we expect a Sahha pitch on our Stronghold maps?!!!
While we don't currently have any plans, I can't say this isn't something we discussed. It would take a fair bit of work to make something like that happen, but if there's enough demand there's always the possibility that we would consider it.
@asterdahl, has the team discussed the possibility of a ticket downgrade vendor? Currently we're looking at somewhere around 8000-9000 volleys to get enough copper tickets for a complete fashion set -- for only one toon. This is really distressing for those of us with alts.
Second...have you seen the thread I posted about the blue beholder ball? Spending all that time and Zen to acquire a ball that despawns after just a second is really disheartening. It means that while it's possible to kick it around solo, it's nowhere near fun: rushing to it before it goes *poof* is just an exercise in stress.
Harper Chronicles: Cap Snatchers (RELEASED) - NW-DPUTABC6X Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
@asterdahl Pretty please add Sahha to the game in some permanent fashion! However, can the out-of-bounds part of the game be changed? As other people have mentioned having an indoor arena, or nets, or magical barriers, anything really to keep the ball in-play until a goal is scored or the game ends would be amazing.
Right now, while the game is fun, the flow of the game is constantly broken up by resetting to our positions... especially in matches where people purposely kick the ball OOB to prevent anyone getting it!
Thanks for your great feedback in this thread, it really is appreciated. Oh yes and I +1 the entire idea of a ticket downgrade system, or better yet, bump up the copper ticket drop rates if possible. I am only 20% of the way to my fashion outfit!
Comments
While there are certainly emergencies that can be hotfixed, not all issues can be hotfixed and hotfixes can be difficult on the team as they risk introducing other problems. While hotfixes are generally associated with exploits, there are other situations where outright bugs would warrant a hotfix as well.
The reason therefore that you might see changes or bugfixes for events that ran recently, is that we are definitely watching your feedback, and of course, playing the events ourselves. Therefore, please continue to give your feedback, regardless of the nature of your feedback—we truly appreciate it! Just wanted to jump in here to clarify something in regards to the ticket-balls. While it is certainly possible to only receive 2 copper tickets from a single ticket-ball, each of the 30 volleys on a single ball is capable of rewarding a copper ticket. In addition, there are 3 rewards that will drop out of the ball when it reaches 30 volleys or hits the ground, it is possible for any or all of those 3 to be copper tickets as well. The same can be said for silver and mithral tickets, given that you have the requisite number of volleys overall to see those tickets appear.
That laid back casual response further brings my blood to a boil.
It only further convinces me that they know they're duping the player base.
In this case, the onus is on us for shipping that content with a bug. In the case of the training and novelty balls exploding and granting rewards, that was a big oversight on our part and we've made the necessary adjustments to our test plans to hopefully account for similar situations in the future.
Because the functionality that was being experienced could be misconstrued as intended and the system was not being exploited maliciously, no action was taken against anyone who earned rewards via the bug. We apologize for any confusion the bug caused and appreciate the many concerned reports sent by players.
Of course in addition to actually fixing issues and shipping less issues in general, there's also the matter of communication. We'd like to reduce the gray area in terms of what would and would not be considered an exploit. Naturally, there will always be some ambiguity with a sensitive topic like this. However, communication like the recent clarification that hitting ticket-balls into a wall is not exploitative behavior will hopefully help to reduce confusion.
Thanks for any information you may be able to provide on this subject!
Sekhmet@kvetchus_
Guilds: Greycloaks, Blackcloaks, Whitecloaks, Goldcloaks, Browncloaks, Spiritcloaks, Bluecloaks, Silvercloaks, Black Dawn
Tredecim: The Cloak Alliance
In addition, I'd like to make a quick note about the two layers of chance. While it is true that there are two layers of chance here, the combined chance of getting a mithral ticket and then getting an epic item out of a raffle is roughly equivalent to getting an epic item from a starlight parcel which is similarly priced and available at the same rate of one per day.
As the flavor for this event is a bit different, and we set it up via a ticket exchange, it might seem like your overall chance is lower because there are two factors. In addition, because there is a legendary raffle for which the chances are lower than the epic raffle, it may feel like there is a much lower chance overall. On the other hand, you have more freedom about what low and middle-tier prizes you earn with the ticket exchange system. Because we did not want to encourage players to hold on to their ticket balls and have an overwhelming amount of volleys to go through on the last few days, nor did we want players who used their balls during the first few weeks to feel as if they missed out, we did not include the ticket-ball system in the height of summer. So you are safe to use the ticket-balls as is. As always it is my pleasure and we appreciate the continued feedback, positive or otherwise.
Did you even compare the rewards to lockboxes before you set drop rates? Because I can open just about any lockbox and get 20-40k AD worth of drops + ~4-12k worth of tradebars. This means that on the low end a lockbox is worth about 4-5 preservation wards. A ball willl usually at best drop enough for 1 pres ward if that. I could understand having lower drop for party members but having such abysmal rewards for the player that activated the ball makes no sense. Starlight parcels had much better lower and mid tier rewards and the possibility to drop BtC versions of the bag. I don't think anyone would be complaining as much if they had BtC balls with tickets for BtC loot and mid/lower tier rewards dropped at a rate that made it worth their time. No one was really doing starlight parcels for the higher tier rewards anyways. We all knew we weren't gettting a forgehammer but getting a warlock, some pres wards, retraining tokens, seasonal event mounts etc. wasn't anywhere near as bad a deal as the balls are.
Just as a request for the upcoming blog posts for class reworks/balancing, could you and the other devs please write in-depth blog posts about some of the important changes coming like was done with the Lostmauth set change and the OP changes? I am foreseeing ITF being hit hard and having a blog post explaining your views on what you think buffs should look like and why you handled the manner in the way that you did would be greatly appreciated. The same goes for any other large scale changes that happen to the classes (extensive SW/HR rework blogs are a given I hope
We are searching for slave labor, will pay with food from our farm!
So the copper ticket drop rate is wai then? The percentage drop rate for copper tickets has been estimated to be at around 10%. Popping this up to 25% at least is in order please.
As far as the Legendary Mount, I suppose I'll keep waiting for the day you guys decide to sell an account wide one for cash money. My money is waiting.
think that would solve some problems with missing coppertickets, if we were able to sell silver for coppertickets on a reasonable exchange rate
So - in some ways, you're right - people that pay zen for extra balls DO get an advantage here, and people that group up will get to 300 much faster (I had 300 on day one, for example).
If you're complaining that you shared a ball (and therefore got all the awards you would have gotten anyway) but then the person you teamed with split without sharing - I mean... I don't know that a technical solution is in order here. If you were on the street having lunch, and a complete stranger asked if they could eat your lunch and promised to let you eat theirs when they were done, then afterward said they didn't actually have a lunch and jump in a cab and took off before you could do anything... would you blame the police for not protecting you from that person or would you blame yourself for being stupid and agreeing to share with a total stranger?
Sucks that your friends have quit the game - I know the feeling. Make new friends, there's lots of good folks out there. But with all the massive flaws, bugs and missteps Cryptic has made, crying because you got your full reward along with someone else too (which is way better than them getting your reward - lunch - and you getting none by the way) but them not reciprocating just seems... radically out of touch.. like being in a massive 10 car pile up and, amid ambulances and smoke, worrying that your shoe got a scuff mark on it...
So- my opinion on this event. I like Sahha. The matches are too long and I agree it should be "indoors" (that is, no out of bounds), and I think there should be a way to exchange up and exchange down tickets. Other than that, I actually think sahha makes a really fun addition to the summer fest and, while I would play more matches if they were shorter, I still enjoy it. My only real question is: @asterdahl when can we expect a Sahha pitch on our Stronghold maps?!!!
Sekhmet@kvetchus_
Guilds: Greycloaks, Blackcloaks, Whitecloaks, Goldcloaks, Browncloaks, Spiritcloaks, Bluecloaks, Silvercloaks, Black Dawn
Tredecim: The Cloak Alliance
Basically, your first and only free Zen ball per day would not hand out any rewards...
I haven't asked for groups in public chat areas in years. I can't even remember the last time I used Zone and I have NEVER used the LFG or Trade channels, ever. That's what Guild and Alliance channels are for... so again - if you are doing business with strangers, you should simply expect this sort of thing and don't be shocked when it happens. Sad state of affairs? Sure. But the onus is on YOU to protect yourself, and the way you do that isn't to complain to the devs, rather it's to form (and reform as needed) friendships or at least relationships with people you can trust not to "scam" you. If you're not willing to do that, you probably shouldn't be playing an MMO or at the very least, not participating in any of the team-oriented features (which also means reconciling yourself to never getting the rewards that go along with that content).
It seems harsh... but it's the reality. There are so many other things that need to be prioritized over this that you'd forget why you were counting before you got to this item on the list. Simple as that. So whether you like it or not... the solution to your problem is changing your behavior (as much as people hate being told to do that, it is what it is), not Cryptic implementing some nanny feature.
Sekhmet@kvetchus_
Guilds: Greycloaks, Blackcloaks, Whitecloaks, Goldcloaks, Browncloaks, Spiritcloaks, Bluecloaks, Silvercloaks, Black Dawn
Tredecim: The Cloak Alliance
Second...have you seen the thread I posted about the blue beholder ball? Spending all that time and Zen to acquire a ball that despawns after just a second is really disheartening. It means that while it's possible to kick it around solo, it's nowhere near fun: rushing to it before it goes *poof* is just an exercise in stress.
Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO
Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF
Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP
The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
Right now, while the game is fun, the flow of the game is constantly broken up by resetting to our positions... especially in matches where people purposely kick the ball OOB to prevent anyone getting it!
Thanks for your great feedback in this thread, it really is appreciated. Oh yes and I +1 the entire idea of a ticket downgrade system, or better yet, bump up the copper ticket drop rates if possible. I am only 20% of the way to my fashion outfit!