Yep, it has to be fun, or people are just going to walk away.
Exactly, they could totally make it worth our while to actually play the game by giving us RP stipends to allocate as we please. Guarantee if they did something like this there would be A LOT more people farming manually...
I can't see it being very hard to turn this into profit, either, even if they have to script some new stuff.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
0
aaablacklady9Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 81Arc User
edited November 2014
This idea is so good, probably so good that will never see the ligth The current system, whit no more "easy" Rp will probably force new player to use real money for the Ruby in the zen store
I hope your idea will see the ligth, because it's a really nice idea and a nice improvement to kill golld seller and bot. Great work
I like the system you suggested DEV should think about it also not only artifact may they should include enchants too may be higher level
enchants since they require loads of RP to rank up.
0
ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
Exactly, they could totally make it worth our while to actually play the game by giving us RP stipends to allocate as we please. Guarantee if they did something like this there would be A LOT more people farming manually...
I can't see it being very hard to turn this into profit, either, even if they have to script some new stuff.
Which means more people out in campaign zones.
More people out doing dailies.
More people running dungeons.
More people running Foundries.
More people doing PvP for Exp.
Basically, more people PLAYING the game. I don't see the downsides here.
And I already talked about monetization here...if there goal was to monetize refinement, they've done a not great job of it with the current system. No one is going to pay over 3 YEARS worth of a subscription to a game like WoW or FF14 for ONE item (that's going to be replaced eventually, too). And if the Average Joe feels like that's the ONLY way to get to the best items in the game, guess what? He's probably going to take his money elsewhere.
Which means more people out in campaign zones.
More people out doing dailies.
More people running dungeons.
More people running Foundries.
More people doing PvP for Exp.
Basically, more people PLAYING the game. I don't see the downsides here.
And I already talked about monetization here...if there goal was to monetize refinement, they've done a not great job of it with the current system. No one is going to pay over 3 YEARS worth of a subscription to a game like WoW or FF14 for ONE item (that's going to be replaced eventually, too). And if the Average Joe feels like that's the ONLY way to get to the best items in the game, guess what? He's probably going to take his money elsewhere.
Yep, this is exactly what concerned me and why I've been vocal about this because once it becomes apparent that the grind is just utterly ridiculous (or they expect some obscene payment, instead) people will walk away. It's quite obvious that more artifact items are going to be added to the game in the future, Cryptic seemingly expects anybody that wants a quick legendary is gonna cough up 600$ or whatever nonsense price on the zen store for a single orange item... I think we all know better and that a system like this is really the only way to supplement RP for artifacts and artifact items.
The sheer quantity of RP needed by these items is just completely daunting and even adding RP from your XP pools, it's still gonna be SLOW GOING unless you want to pay the above mentioned obscene zen store price for blood rubies but XP boosters will be an option as well so I feel like this does nothing aside from create more options.
TLDR: Business priority #1 = Cashflow; Business priority #50 = Customer concerns
Only true in failing business. Successful business put the customer first. If you do that, the cash will flow.
Google "Elon Musk", founder of PayPal, SpaceX and CEO of Telsa. His philosophy is to put innovation and people first. And there's been no lack of success on his part.
Only true in failing business. Successful business put the customer first. If you do that, the cash will flow.
Google "Elon Musk", founder of PayPal, SpaceX and CEO of Telsa. His philosophy is to put innovation and people first. And there's been no lack of success on his part.
Except the publisher of Neverwinter isn't Paypal, its PWE.
Except the publisher of Neverwinter isn't Paypal, its PWE.
Exactly. I believe something like this will happen or a system will be put in place. But it wont be for a long time, not till RP is milked of every penny. Itll be a system like this for new players 2 years down the road to "catch up", or a gear reset. History will repeat itself here. The history of f2p MMOs and history of PWE. Why, because its big money. Id like them, not any player, them as in PWE to prove me wrong, but so far they havent.
Edit: I still believe this. But after clarifying what type of XP-RP ROI conversion. I am 100% backing suggetion
This is definitely something I am 100% for and I read a lot of suggestions by the Community (in game, in the forums, and elsewhere), most of which I either disagree with or could see potential in. It is rare when I see a fundamental mechanic change/addition suggestion that I agree with totally. With this proposed mechanic, I can see it working without the need for any feeling of potential, as it is awesome as it has been laid out, with no need for any changes to make it acceptable to me.
0
grogthemagnifMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,651Arc User
edited November 2014
Absolutely, without the customer and innovation there is no Ca$hflow.
Only true in failing business. Successful business put the customer first. If you do that, the cash will flow.
Google "Elon Musk", founder of PayPal, SpaceX and CEO of Telsa. His philosophy is to put innovation and people first. And there's been no lack of success on his part.
0
grogthemagnifMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,651Arc User
edited November 2014
It is possible to do over 250k xp in a day, but you might have to do 20 Dragons (5 in ToD and 15 in WoD) + about 20 other quests at 6k xp/quest (12-13 Skirmishes in 1 hour comes to mind).
Best idea eveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
0
calleanaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 5Arc User
edited December 2014
This is an excellent idea for players like me who cannot spend hours per day farming but who want to compete with the best gear I can. Bravo, ironzerg, for an ingenious idea. I really do home the Devs give it the consideration it deserves.
This addition would make it feel more like I am involved in upgrading my artifacts rather than feeling like I have to forgo "playing" or "having fun" in order to grind for items or AD (or buy Zen) to do so.
Hate to be the cynic, but this will probably never happen. Whole rationale to the current system is to turn refining into such a grind that you spend money on Zen in order to buy your way out of it.
Hate to be the cynic, but this will probably never happen. Whole rationale to the current system is to turn refining into such a grind that you spend money on Zen in order to buy your way out of it.
Well duh. They introduced green artifact gear with RNG nonesense that you have to spend millions of AD on to actually make it BIS instead of back then when you farmed dungeons to get the BIS ancient gear.
Well duh. They introduced green artifact gear with RNG nonesense that you have to spend millions of AD on to actually make it BIS instead of back then when you farmed dungeons to get the BIS ancient gear.
Feels a lot like the drug dealer/gambling casino business model. Get customers hooked on your product, and once they lose complete control of themselves, bilk them for all they are worth. Can't say that I am up in arms, yet, but I'd say that Criptic sure straddles the line of what is acceptable. I'd propose that users DO something to let them know when they've crossed it. For example, a day, or better yet, a week of protest where nobody logs in.
0
ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
edited January 2015
I've posted this many times in the thread, but it's not really an effective "cash sink". It's a time sink. And a big one.
Which is fine. A cornerstone of MMOs is getting players to sink their time into something while new content is delivered, to try and keep them hooked in the game.
The big problems to me are:
A) The mechanics of refining are simply not fun. The system sucks, quite frankly. It doesn't feel connected to the character. Picking up little stones and tossing them into your stuff isn't very epic.
C) The system hurts people trying to play multiple characters. It forces people to HAVE to focus on one toon, to make them feel like they're progressing.
D) And from an RP perspective, I think using EXP makes a lot more in-game sense than all these piles and piles of magic stones that have somehow been created. Or see a minion explode and drop 3-4 pieces of trash green loot.
"Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
0
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
Obviously. Rogers said so himself. If there's no money to be had from a certain change, don't expect that change to happen.
As noble as that intention is, you'll never convince people to keep away from the game. Not even for an hour. Even if you'd convince 100% of the forum population to refrain from logging on (which you won't, but for the sake of argument let's accept you would), there's still the remaining 80% of the game's population that doesn't read the forums. And then there's the 10% whales with too much money on their hands that simply don't give a dam. I honestly doubt the game would even notice if the active forum members alone left the game for a few days.
Its just a blimp, heck I stopped spending money months ago when ToD came out, I hated it that much. But they dont care.
They would have to see a pretty drastic reduction for them to change something, game companies can be too stubborn sometimes.
This is an awesome idea but I have to agree with the pessimists who say it will never happen because there's no money to be had in it. In fact, it would lead to less money since it would mean fewer people get fed up with the grind and buying RP stones. Too bad, because as you say it makes a lot more sense that experience using a weapon will forge stronger bonds between the wielder and the weapon, and such a system seems much less cumbersome than tossing RP stones in 5 at a time too.
Really sad how the F2P model works against making the best game possible for the players sometimes.
0
ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
edited January 2015
Personally, I'd like to see a Livestream where Arkomatik takes 4.6 million RP worth of Peridots and puts it in his weapon to get it to Legendary. If he can't finish before the hour is up, everyone wins a prize
"Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
0
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
Personally, I'd like to see a Livestream where Arkomatik takes 4.6 million RP worth of Peridots and puts it in his weapon to get it to Legendary. If he can't finish before the hour is up, everyone wins a prize
pffft, he hits godemode on everything he does anyways.
Everyone hates the system (well maybe 2% like the current system) but it wont change, becuase people keep buying stuff.
Its simple as this, when people stop buying stuff, they will change it. However, you can be stubborn enough to harm the game enough that you wont get people back either.
Every person who buys something from them at this time, is just helping the encouragement of the system.
I've posted this many times in the thread, but it's not really an effective "cash sink". It's a time sink. And a big one.
I don't think can agree. By the time I get my hands on an artifact, a lot of guys already have them maxed out. How's that done without paying cash? At the risk of stating the obvious...again, with dungeon runs a thing of the past, does it not seem to you that there is a deliberate attempt to eliminate in-game ways of accumulating ADs? Dangling all that potential GS and then making it more difficult to take advantage of it by farming? (Longer cool downs.) How's that not a trend towards making investment in time less a factor, and investment in cash more of one?
Comments
Exactly, they could totally make it worth our while to actually play the game by giving us RP stipends to allocate as we please. Guarantee if they did something like this there would be A LOT more people farming manually...
I can't see it being very hard to turn this into profit, either, even if they have to script some new stuff.
I hope your idea will see the ligth, because it's a really nice idea and a nice improvement to kill golld seller and bot. Great work
enchants since they require loads of RP to rank up.
Which means more people out in campaign zones.
More people out doing dailies.
More people running dungeons.
More people running Foundries.
More people doing PvP for Exp.
Basically, more people PLAYING the game. I don't see the downsides here.
And I already talked about monetization here...if there goal was to monetize refinement, they've done a not great job of it with the current system. No one is going to pay over 3 YEARS worth of a subscription to a game like WoW or FF14 for ONE item (that's going to be replaced eventually, too). And if the Average Joe feels like that's the ONLY way to get to the best items in the game, guess what? He's probably going to take his money elsewhere.
With the amount of time/money that we currently need to make our artifacts Legendary, this will fit like a glove.
Yep, this is exactly what concerned me and why I've been vocal about this because once it becomes apparent that the grind is just utterly ridiculous (or they expect some obscene payment, instead) people will walk away. It's quite obvious that more artifact items are going to be added to the game in the future, Cryptic seemingly expects anybody that wants a quick legendary is gonna cough up 600$ or whatever nonsense price on the zen store for a single orange item... I think we all know better and that a system like this is really the only way to supplement RP for artifacts and artifact items.
The sheer quantity of RP needed by these items is just completely daunting and even adding RP from your XP pools, it's still gonna be SLOW GOING unless you want to pay the above mentioned obscene zen store price for blood rubies but XP boosters will be an option as well so I feel like this does nothing aside from create more options.
100% back idea.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
If this thread has a poll, would it made a difference or at least convince the devs?
Only true in failing business. Successful business put the customer first. If you do that, the cash will flow.
Google "Elon Musk", founder of PayPal, SpaceX and CEO of Telsa. His philosophy is to put innovation and people first. And there's been no lack of success on his part.
Loads of videos: Neverwinter Video Guides!
Find Neverwinter Game Guides on DDM's Realm!
The Fyxt RPG combines digital convenience with the fun of a tabletop RPG. Play the Fyxt RPG now for free!
Play Smarter, Not Harder! ~ Karranor
Except the publisher of Neverwinter isn't Paypal, its PWE.
Exactly. I believe something like this will happen or a system will be put in place. But it wont be for a long time, not till RP is milked of every penny. Itll be a system like this for new players 2 years down the road to "catch up", or a gear reset. History will repeat itself here. The history of f2p MMOs and history of PWE. Why, because its big money. Id like them, not any player, them as in PWE to prove me wrong, but so far they havent.
Edit: I still believe this. But after clarifying what type of XP-RP ROI conversion. I am 100% backing suggetion
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
100% backing of this suggestion.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Well duh. They introduced green artifact gear with RNG nonesense that you have to spend millions of AD on to actually make it BIS instead of back then when you farmed dungeons to get the BIS ancient gear.
Which is fine. A cornerstone of MMOs is getting players to sink their time into something while new content is delivered, to try and keep them hooked in the game.
The big problems to me are:
A) The mechanics of refining are simply not fun. The system sucks, quite frankly.
C) The system hurts people trying to play multiple characters. It forces people to HAVE to focus on one toon, to make them feel like they're progressing.
D) And from an RP perspective, I think using EXP makes a lot more in-game sense than all these piles and piles of magic stones that have somehow been created. Or see a minion explode and drop 3-4 pieces of trash green loot.
Its just a blimp, heck I stopped spending money months ago when ToD came out, I hated it that much. But they dont care.
They would have to see a pretty drastic reduction for them to change something, game companies can be too stubborn sometimes.
Really sad how the F2P model works against making the best game possible for the players sometimes.
pffft, he hits godemode on everything he does anyways.
Everyone hates the system (well maybe 2% like the current system) but it wont change, becuase people keep buying stuff.
Its simple as this, when people stop buying stuff, they will change it. However, you can be stubborn enough to harm the game enough that you wont get people back either.
Every person who buys something from them at this time, is just helping the encouragement of the system.