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Intimidation Feat proc, dmg out of control: Details inside.

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  • edited October 2014
    This content has been removed.
  • angrymanagementangrymanagement Member Posts: 487 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    ortzhy wrote: »
    http://i916.photobucket.com/albums/ad7/Yhztro/dmg_zps6dc8d80d.jpg

    seems that CA is to blame for all this (7k power)

    You should add the Flank % (shows combat advantage vs non) & Effectiveness (shows total damage multiplication effect) tabs to your ACT outgoing damage screen.
    I'm curios if the damage multipliers are indeed being multiplied instead of added.
  • ortzhyortzhy Member Posts: 1,103 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    gg-pvp_zps76677632.jpg

    GG-pvp recording @ 4.3k power in standard pvp gear(no extra pots)
  • effectensteineffectenstein Member Posts: 1,031 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    i shall stop posting, cuz i swear i see only idiotic posts.
  • magiquepursemagiquepurse Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    ortzhy wrote: »
    GG-pvp recording @ 4.3k power

    This build requires about double of what you have to start showing results.

    No worries, you will still be tanky.
  • effectensteineffectenstein Member Posts: 1,031 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    magiquepurse, who the hell are you ingame?
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    How to fix this (and not nerf this option to the ground):

    1. Decrease damage on every target hit beyond the first like the following GWF powers: Not So Fast, Wicked Strike, Weapon Master's Strike
    2. Halve power modifier for this feat, the one that applies after base damage is determined. So we don't get ridiculously low damage at the lower power levels (as some people are suggesting by halving the base damage) and ridiculously high at high power levels.
    3. Increase threat gain by 100%
  • magiquepursemagiquepurse Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    How to fix this (and not nerf this option to the ground):

    1. Decrease damage on every target hit beyond the first like the following GWF powers: Not So Fast, Wicked Strike, Weapon Master's Strike
    2. Halve power modifier for this feat, the one that applies after base damage is determined. So we don't get ridiculously low damage at the lower power levels (as some people are suggesting by halving the base damage) and ridiculously high at high power levels.
    3. Increase threat gain by 100%

    These are decent suggestions. I don't mind if stays a good AoE, I think GWF needs better PvE AoE damage. But in PvP, the main DPS should come not from procs, but from Encounters. Classic destro- GWF rotation ending in IBS is a great example of a good design rotation. You need 2 chained CCs, and stacks, and after that you can hit a monster IBS - good reward for proper execution.

    At the moment procs and dots are destroying the game and they need to be reduced to approximately where Deep Gash is - small DPS, and their damage partially moved towards encounters.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    These are decent suggestions. I don't mind if stays a good AoE, I think GWF needs better PvE AoE damage. But in PvP, the main DPS should come not from procs, but from Encounters. Classic destro- GWF rotation ending in IBS is a great example of a good design rotation. You need 2 chained CCs, and stacks, and after that you can hit a monster IBS - good reward for proper execution.

    At the moment procs and dots are destroying the game and they need to be reduced to approximately where Deep Gash is - small DPS, and their damage partially moved towards encounters.

    Well, take CaGI and DS without this feat and what do you get?

    CaGI. All it does is pulls monsters/players a few feet towards you and gives a single 30% weapon damage bonus on next hit (doesn't apply to multi-hits). The only use for that is when battling perma TRs in PvP. Little to no use in PvE. Oh, and it has like 1 second longer cooldown than IBS, which I find hillarious.

    DS. Sure, it helps mark targets, gain some determination and tank a bit, not much as the buff is only a few seconds long. But the drawbacks being small range (I can hardly believe it's 20 feet as the tooltip says, as I always miss targets 2 steps away), rather long animation, abysmal cooldown (base being at around 18 or 19 seconds). And not so useful for IV who can already mark with TR.

    All in all, I believe this feat is the right step towards what Sentinel GWF should be. However, I do agree it needs some changes, at least for PvP.
  • effectensteineffectenstein Member Posts: 1,031 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    no, the only changes should be done to gwf
    is to increase base damage by 20% , decrease destroyer purpose 1 stack = 1 % damage bonus
    CaGi and Daring shout should have better animation and be more responsive, same with sprint animation

    if it's made to be responsive than the intimidation feat should be decreased to 35% from 50%.

    mark should be decreased to 15% , now it's 20%

    Restoring Strike should be fixed.

    Instigator Path should be viable

    some other class feats should be reworked, like fereacious heals, bravery etc.

    and not last, balance all classes. BEFORE CHANGE 1 CLASS, CHANGE THEM ALL AT THE SAME TIME.



    LE: I DONT HAVE ANYTHING WITH GF AT ALL , but in comparision with intimidation, take a look at this GF damage
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anzMjRXrw5o nice
  • dante126pldante126pl Banned Users Posts: 257 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    no, the only changes should be done to gwf
    is to increase base damage by 20% , decrease destroyer purpose 1 stack = 1 % damage bonus
    CaGi and Daring shout should have better animation and be more responsive, same with sprint animation

    if it's made to be responsive than the intimidation feat should be decreased to 35% from 50%.

    mark should be decreased to 15% , now it's 20%

    Restoring Strike should be fixed.

    Instigator Path should be viable

    some other class feats should be reworked, like fereacious heals, bravery etc.

    and not last, balance all classes. BEFORE CHANGE 1 CLASS, CHANGE THEM ALL AT THE SAME TIME.

    u talk about DR ignored?coz that 20 % doesnt go into negative DR from mark
  • effectensteineffectenstein Member Posts: 1,031 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    dante126pl wrote: »
    u talk about DR ignored?coz that 20 % doesnt go into negative DR from mark

    thats more to know.
  • hypervoreianhypervoreian Member Posts: 1,036 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    .



    LE: I DONT HAVE ANYTHING WITH GF AT ALL , but in comparision with intimidation, take a look at this GF damage
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anzMjRXrw5o nice

    ^^^
    This is Ant Monster's GF.He is around 19-20gs.In the meantime you see the cws he is facing not to try to avoid him but to stand still.Like they expect he will hit like a powrie in Sharanadar.That shows to any pvper that these cws are new to pvp and unexperienced against players.So to me these cws are at 10k gs max.

    Second thing to notice is Ant he is using Knights Challenge.(The encounter that has a line between him and the target).
    This is an extremely esxremely risky approach in pvp.Cause he does 100% more damage to a target but also a target does the same to him.Also the casting of the encounter is slow.
    Notice in the node in the beggining in the video as his health goes in mid level in seconds?That is when he is facing a 11k gs CW.Against Cw pvpv specced he would die in maximum 5 secs.5? I take it back.If a CW hits you while you are in KC he can kill you in 3 secs.

    And third ANT is a great GF and he helped in the forums when GF was still the least viable class before mod3 changes.But he is also known to the baracks community that he likes to brag alot :)
    These fights are all the most spectacular he could find.Spectacular=impressive kills=vs 9k gs scrubs.


    Back to reality.GF was already nerfed 2 weeks before.SoS was nerfed.Guarded assault was nerfed.KValour was nerfed.
    Whare have you been?
    In the first 10 pages of leaderboard are 4 gfs in first page(from before the nerfs-the broken reflect glyph build) and in the next pages you ll find one GF every 24 toons.
    GF actually lacks damage.Protector cannot kill a thing.Conq has to be hit (lol) 5 times to get a neglibible damage bonus.Even then this bonus has to be maintained.
    Swordmaster damage of GF is a joke .Flourish animation last forever.WMS is doing 600k damage for an atwill.Check the tooltips.Damage immunity (steel defence feat) is bugged.
    Steel Grace is bugged.
    etc etc.....

    There is no such thing as "GF damage"It does not exist.
    It is like UFO's.All claim that have seen it somehow someday in their lives or heard about it.Don't believe in fairytales.Don't beleive is "GF Damage".it is the same concept as SnowWhite and the seven ugly GWF dwarves.What's next?Complain about DC damage?lol.......
  • nezraalnezraal Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Say I have 6.5k Power , 2k ArP and 29 CON, can anyone tell me what damage I am looking at on 42 dr% and 19% Tenacity on DS & CAGI? (even better, can anyone give me a formula)

    I don't think 8k Power and 50k HP are practical numbers.

    @hypervoreian As of now mod 4, GF has more damage, tank and a much better rotation compared to Sentinel. The fact remains, the current mod4 Sentinel do need damage. I also think GWF should be a class that focus on "single" damage and I don't like how CAGI and DS are large AOE. But I do think Sentinel need 2 single hit heavy damage and 1 stun at a "reasonable" level. I also think Destroyer tree needs a little more defense. The third column on Sentinel and 4th column of Destroyer needs to be re-worked. I also feel GWF should get bull charge instead of FLS or change Bull charge to Stun and FLS in all builds to a prone on the "nearest" target it hits.

    By the way I play both GF & GWF. GWF are behind on same GS (for me it is 18k). With increasing stats I see GF getting getting stronger by comparison to GWF. I also feel a 19k GS GF > 20.5k GWF.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    nezraal wrote: »
    Say I have 6.5k Power , 2k ArP and 29 CON, can anyone tell me what damage I am looking at on 42 dr% and 19% Tenacity on DS & CAGI? (even better, can anyone give me a formula)

    I don't think 8k Power and 50k HP are practical numbers.

    @hypervoreian As of now mod 4, GF has more damage, tank and a much better rotation compared to Sentinel. The fact remains, the current mod4 Sentinel do need damage. I also think GWF should be a class that focus on "single" damage and I don't like how CAGI and DS are large AOE. But I do think Sentinel need 2 single hit heavy damage and 1 stun at a "reasonable" level. I also think Destroyer tree needs a little more defense. The third column on Sentinel and 4th column of Destroyer needs to be re-worked. I also feel GWF should get bull charge instead of FLS or change Bull charge to Stun and FLS in all builds to a prone on the "nearest" target it hits.

    By the way I play both GF & GWF. GWF are behind on same GS (for me it is 18k). With increasing stats I see GF getting getting stronger by comparison to GWF. I also feel a 19k GS GF > 20.5k GWF.

    Sentinel GWF is an off-tank. He needs his AoEs. If you want good single target damage play destroyer . His best feats focus around single target damage.

    Although I agree that GWF should have higher base damage and less damage obtained from the buffs & debuffs & stacks. That's what set me off when playing destroyer. The hundreds of stacks required to start dealing damage... It's horrible :/
  • hypervoreianhypervoreian Member Posts: 1,036 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    nezraal wrote: »

    @hypervoreian As of now mod 4, GF has more damage, tank and a much better rotation compared to Sentinel. The fact remains, the current mod4 Sentinel do need damage. I also think GWF should be a class that focus on "single" damage and I don't like how CAGI and DS are large AOE. But I do think Sentinel need 2 single hit heavy damage and 1 stun at a "reasonable" level. I also think Destroyer tree needs a little more defense. The third column on Sentinel and 4th column of Destroyer needs to be re-worked. I also feel GWF should get bull charge instead of FLS or change Bull charge to Stun and FLS in all builds to a prone on the "nearest" target it hits.

    By the way I play both GF & GWF. GWF are behind on same GS (for me it is 18k). With increasing stats I see GF getting getting stronger by comparison to GWF. I also feel a 19k GS GF > 20.5k GWF.

    ^^^^^^

    Nezraal look......You got me wrong.
    I tried to defend my class from the CWs.Which want to keep their op in pvp.
    I do AGREE that Sents need MORE DAMAGE.
    But this damage i thiink ,must come from encounters and skillfull gameplay.And it has to be in reasonable levels.Oneshotting 3 players at once by an invinsible force is not the way to go....

    Inmstead you should ask for buffs in your existing powers ,separate from destros.And yes a good idea would be to get some Gfs encounters.Since Sent and GF are realy close now.Specially with Conq tree.Both somehow hybrids.

    Crushing pin feat would work for Sent.Enhanced Mark.Terrifying Impact.Bull charge for pvp?yes why not?
    None would be against these changes.But an invinsible proc that deals 30-40k aoe damage is not good...

    Cheers! :)
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    ^^^^^^

    Nezraal look......You got me wrong.
    I tried to defend my class from the CWs.Which want to keep their op in pvp.
    I do AGREE that Sents need MORE DAMAGE.
    But this damage i thiink ,must come from encounters and skillfull gameplay.And it has to be in reasonable levels.Oneshotting 3 players at once by an invinsible force is not the way to go....

    Inmstead you should ask for buffs in your existing powers ,separate from destros.And yes a good idea would be to get some Gfs encounters.Since Sent and GF are realy close now.Specially with Conq tree.Both somehow hybrids.

    Crushing pin feat would work for Sent.Enhanced Mark.Terrifying Impact.Bull charge for pvp?yes why not?
    None would be against these changes.But an invinsible proc that deals 30-40k aoe damage is not good...

    Cheers! :)

    30-40k? Where do you get these numbers? Don't mix 2 encounters into one. By that logic 2 IBS can as well deal 80k crits and beyond. And it's not an invisible proc. You can see the animation and dodge easily. In fact, you can simply walk away from daring shout. Its animation is that long and reach that short.

    I find it funny when ppl assume that intimidation crits everytime, can't be dodged, can't be deflected or resisted. A destroyer GWF can 1 rotation anyone with ease as well if he crits and doesn't get deflected or dodged. The only difference is that intimidation is aoe. Which can easily be nil if you don't zerg like idiots.
  • edited October 2014
    This content has been removed.
  • emilemoemilemo Member Posts: 1,718 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    nezraal wrote: »
    Say I have 6.5k Power , 2k ArP and 29 CON, can anyone tell me what damage I am looking at on 42 dr% and 19% Tenacity on DS & CAGI? (even better, can anyone give me a formula)

    I don't think 8k Power and 50k HP are practical numbers.

    @hypervoreian As of now mod 4, GF has more damage, tank and a much better rotation compared to Sentinel. The fact remains, the current mod4 Sentinel do need damage. I also think GWF should be a class that focus on "single" damage and I don't like how CAGI and DS are large AOE. But I do think Sentinel need 2 single hit heavy damage and 1 stun at a "reasonable" level. I also think Destroyer tree needs a little more defense. The third column on Sentinel and 4th column of Destroyer needs to be re-worked. I also feel GWF should get bull charge instead of FLS or change Bull charge to Stun and FLS in all builds to a prone on the "nearest" target it hits.

    By the way I play both GF & GWF. GWF are behind on same GS (for me it is 18k). With increasing stats I see GF getting getting stronger by comparison to GWF. I also feel a 19k GS GF > 20.5k GWF.

    Your feelings are all wacky man. How bout we merge the two fighters then so they get the same skills ?
    Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
    Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
  • effectensteineffectenstein Member Posts: 1,031 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    30-40k? Where do you get these numbers? Don't mix 2 encounters into one. By that logic 2 IBS can as well deal 80k crits and beyond. And it's not an invisible proc. You can see the animation and dodge easily. In fact, you can simply walk away from daring shout. Its animation is that long and reach that short.

    I find it funny when ppl assume that intimidation crits everytime, can't be dodged, can't be deflected or resisted. A destroyer GWF can 1 rotation anyone with ease as well if he crits and doesn't get deflected or dodged. The only difference is that intimidation is aoe. Which can easily be nil if you don't zerg like idiots.

    you are right !!!!
    damage from that aoe can be blocked...
    so if you dont want to die one shot, add some defensive stats.
    simple as that.

    GWF must do AOE DAMAGE !!!!! it's normal !!!!
    if they ton the damage down , they must ton from other classes as well .
    or it can be changed like this . CAgi and DAring shout on single targed deals a X damage and on more targets deals More damage.

    same with FLS, on more targets it doesnt deal alot of damage, but 1 single target it deals alot.
  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    LE: I DONT HAVE ANYTHING WITH GF AT ALL , but in comparision with intimidation, take a look at this GF damage
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anzMjRXrw5o nice

    Lmao, that guy has copied my build. But his is a bit worse than mine though.

  • nazghul22nazghul22 Member Posts: 407 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    Sentinel GWF is an off-tank. He needs his AoEs. If you want good single target damage play destroyer .

    Certainly not . The destroyer is DOMINATED by the sentinel.
    ToD = ..........
    Tired of Dailies/Tyranny of Dailies/Timers of Doom/Tricked Or Duped/Tremendously Obnoxious Dailies/Try Otherwise, Devs
  • effectensteineffectenstein Member Posts: 1,031 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    nazghul22 wrote: »
    Certainly not . The destroyer is DOMINATED by the sentinel.

    he isn't, destroyer has better control !! and do better damage on single target.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    nazghul22 wrote: »
    Certainly not . The destroyer is DOMINATED by the sentinel.

    Certainly not what? Destroyer does at least twice the single target damage sentinel could do and beats in aoe dps too (through at-wills). The only difference is that destroyer needs a ton of stacks to do that, whereas sentinel only needs mark, which makes the later preferable in PvP.
  • dante126pldante126pl Banned Users Posts: 257 Bounty Hunter
    edited October 2014
    the feat definitely need to be toned down not removed but toned down it does way too much dmg for a tank tree.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    zvieris wrote: »
    How to fix this (and not nerf this option to the ground):

    1. Decrease damage on every target hit beyond the first like the following GWF powers: Not So Fast, Wicked Strike, Weapon Master's Strike
    2. Halve power modifier for this feat, the one that applies after base damage is determined. So we don't get ridiculously low damage at the lower power levels (as some people are suggesting by halving the base damage) and ridiculously high at high power levels.
    3. Increase threat gain by 100%

    Quoting myself for these brilliant ideas to get noticed. :rolleyes:
  • edited October 2014
    This content has been removed.
  • nezraalnezraal Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    READ THIS:

    Cryptic's track record hasn't been all that stellar, especially over the last two years (pre 2010). Champions Online was meant to be the successor to City of Heroes, but critics didn't think that it had much depth beyond the robust character customization. Star Trek Online had a great license with a ready fan base, but even though the game was generally fun, it didn't cash in on that license to keep high subscription numbers. Compared to WoW, these MMOs just felt like sub-par products. (remember in 2008-2010 WoW was still a dominant MMO)

    Source: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/video-games/columns/writersroom/8143-A-Sea-Change-at-Cryptic-Studios

    Same staff following their old routine in Neverwinter, the article was written in 2010 before Neverwinter was released and WoW was popular. They haven't learnt from their mistakes in the past. They pay little attention in testing, ignore gamer feedback & continue to release unwanted material. Neverwinter started with a lot of promises, but they rolled to their usual routine of what they did with previous games.

    The game's rating (Neverwinter) is close to non-existence in top MMO in approximately 2 years after it's release. They followed the same old policies & routine. Don't waste your time explaining to the developers why CW,TR,GF,GWF,HR needs a fix, why drastic tools like Artifact Equipment or Dragon Glyph is causing unpredictable imbalance or how game mechanics are poor. Mod 4, their time is invested in creating more PvE mods and releasing "item pack" rather than fixes of their half crippled software.

    In the mind of Cryptic Studio Team "EVERYTHING IS PERFECT". In the mind of Neverwinter players "SO MANY THINGS ARE BROKEN" - there is a barrier between the two. Unless players start leaving, (which is happening, slowly) they won't get the message and by the time they do this game will be finished and they will focus on making another MMO just like Star Trek Online & Neverwinter.

    What we all need to do, is instead of fighting one another "my class OP feature < your class OP feature that's why u win waa waa waah, i want op feature too", send a clear message to cryptic together (regardless of your class), for stop releasing rubbish and give us interactive balanced stable releases. Truthfully in 4 mods after the game release there is a huge sea of difference for balance and imbalance. Future Mods, realistically what are the chances of this game getting better? Can they adapt?
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Great Weapon Fighter
    • Sentinel: Intimidation: This feat now deals 7/14/21/28/35% of your Power in damage (down from 10/20/30/40/50%).
    And intimidation got nerfed :) Not too much to make it useless, but enough to shut up some of the loudest forum trolls :rolleyes:I hope...
  • nezraalnezraal Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    NOW : Let's move on to CW & Red Glyph, GF postal burst damage + defense (I am a GF too), TR perma stealth and HR's immortal leeching. Oh by the way congratulate Cryptic for <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> tanking with Sentinel for those who were rolling with 5.5k hp (on their regular build) - what's going to happen to them now? ALL GOING 100% Destro ? The difference in GS for pvp between Sentinel (off tank) and GF is like 3.5k. :)

    Most (original) Sentinels had their Power around 5.5k or Lower - not 8k+ and the most established Sentinels were running Tebeb. enchantment because of the pathetic damage power was generating before this comic show. What's going to happen to them?

    Another rapid fast fix without thinking of the consequences by who else but our awesome development team.

    What is needed to hit 8k-10k Power:

    1. 2 Corrupted Piece (Chest + Helmet)
    2. Replace Ring and necklace with something with damage
    3. Buffs & Potions
    4. Your HP will go down from 55kish to 40k ish.

    The two above (1 & 2) sacrifices at leak 900+ defense, a ton of hp & regen. Now, if they want a "viable" damage they screwed up their 4th column too. Time for all Sentinels to retire to Destroyer. One drastic workflow fix destroyed another workflow. Now the entire tree is broken. If GWF remain with their "traditional" build how much damage is 4.5k - 5.5k power generate? Destroyers are now more tank than Sentinel for viable damage. trololol.

    p.s. I don't play Sentinel.

    Congratulations! Crush, don't forget the text in blue.
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