it is human nature for someone who is disgruntled to want to "go tell it on the mountains" and this is the majority of what we see on the forums. personally, i don't see a lot of this activity when i'm PvPing. and i'm sure that if you compared the complaints to the number of successful pvp matches in a day or a week or over the past month, the numbers just wouldn't compare. there are less afk complaints now than there were calls for a leaver penalty just three or four months ago.
but i'm sure that PWE is monitoring the feedback, the numbers and if a change is warranted, we'll see it over time.
People AFK because they die within seconds of reaching mid.
AFKing is the result of unbalanced PVP matches. No point giving someone cough syrup for their symptoms (AFK) and not giving them an antibiotic to treat the viral infection (Unbalanced PVP).
Still amazed that people refuse to acknowledge the lopsided nature of many PVP matches.
Here is the way I see it...
In almost every MMO with PvP in it...
The Devs keep trying to "Balance" the classes. And what usually happens is that they don't get it right, they just p*ss off the PvE community in the process.
And there is nothing that can, realistically, be done to prevent that. (Unless you go with an all <only> PvP or PvE MMO.)
You just have to put up with it or move on to a different MMO and hope things are different there.
Narayan
Sweet Water and Light Laughter Till Next We Meet.
Narayan
I'm loving how keen a lot of people seem to be to use more "stick" approaches. "Penalty for X, penalty for Y, stop people doing this, stop people doing that" and so on.
These have been proven time and time again to work very poorly on the internet, where the shroud of anonymity puts any real fear of punishment far from people's minds.
As it currently stands, there is very, very little benefit to continue participating in a kerbstomp match, and little benefit to continue participating in a looong, more evenly-teamed match. The former will simply get you killed repeatedly for zero glory, and the latter will probably get you SOME glory, but at the cost of all your time. There isn't enough reward for staying with a crushing defeat, and there isn't enough reward for victory to make it worth fighting beyond a certain time-frame.
I mean, obviously everyone should be doing PvP because they want to, and the fighting and point-capping should be the reward in itself with the glory just being a bonus, but HAHAHAHHAHA no. This is the internet, and glory gets you stuff, so working out how to maximize glory returns is very much the order of business, I guess.
So I'd say "more rewards for longer matches, and more rewards for sticking with crappy one-sided matches" would be a better plan that coming up with increasingly elaborate and silly methods of punishing players who don't want to waste their time.
Things like reducing the disparity between victory and defeat: say...winners get +100 points, but actual glory awarded is based on score, so for a match that went 1000-999, both teams'd get a lot, with the winners getting an extra 100 just as a pat on the back. If we want to appeal to people's natural dickishness (since this is PvP after all), we could also make this come from a communal pool, say of 2000 points, so a 1000-999 result means 1000 points to each, whereas a 1000-100 result is more like 1800 to 200. This would motivate people to stick with a match that has gone 700-300, coz you probably won't WIN, but you might get up to 500 or so, and not only will that increase your reward, it would decrease the opponent's share of the reward.
Finally, to offset the time issue, have this pool build up over time, so a match that's over in five minutes only has a pool of 2000, whereas one that lasts 15 mins has 4000, and so on.
Yeah, you'd probably get people cap trading and extending matches forever to maximize glory rewards, but the beauty of this system is that it'd maximally reward these people only after effectively removing them from the circulating player-pool for the entire duration of their match.
morsitans, I think your idea has merit, but it would lead to less cap trading not more. Roflstomping teams wouldn't be so gracious as to permit cap trading if it meant that it would mean their glory reward would reduce. PVP guild premades would just pummel pug teams all day long and farm so much glory. So no, the glory should not come out of a common pool.
Well, on the other hand, a pugstomp wouldn't yield as much glory since it would be over so fast. You could, in theory, keep the same rules regarding minimum points, so if one team didn't manage to get over 100 or so: minimal/zero glory reward.
Ultimately we want a system that allows those who genuinely play for the experience to continue to do so, those who play for the experience (but also the glory) to feel that continued participation is worthwhile, and those who are just there for the glory to feel motivated to actually play rather than sit it out.
I might be a bit too pessimistic at times, but I credit myself of successfully foreseeing spawn camping. Leaving matches was also a development and, on its height, surely it was worse than what we see now.
The problem is, methods of how to deal with the new system as someone purely after glory just haven't spread. Truth be told, the only nerf they did was lowering the glory rewards all around. People who know how can still get their 3-4 wins in per event hour. On one char.
One last thing: In my eyes the current sloppy ELO contributes to the camping problem. People not only know that losing isn't rewarding, they also will have experienced by now that they'll eventually get an easy win handed to them by the matchmaking.
I play about 10 pvp matches per day in groups of 5. Just now this is how the 5 went for this morning.
1. total blow out my side 1000 - 70ish
2. My group consisted of 2 GF 2 Cleric 1 rogue. 1 cleric was a campfire girl, never left spawn. The other gf gave up about 4 minutes in.
3. Even looking sides. We lost the first engagement at center. disconnect of one of the team members(maybe legit, maybe not, who knows) Total blowout.
4. Us vs premade....everyone quit 5 minutes in, I simply died about 15 times, as i am stubborn. No offers of 1v1 just mass killed me. (premades are rare in my bracket to be fair)
5. My side lost 129-1000, 4vs5 as we had a campfire girl that quit later.
This is a fairly common occurance for me. I do not know if it is because of the bracket I am in or if it is normal. Evey 5 games I play though, There is at least 1 camper if not 2, and there are many more blowouts than close games.
this is pvp, and I am thinking that unless I get really good (hehe, yea right) and join a good guild, that this is how pvp will always be. If you just join the queue as random, this is representitive of what you will see.
I play half a dozen matches a day and even if I do encounter afkers, leavers, 8K GS, overwhelming wins and losses, almost half of the encounters are interesting with victory possibilities on each side.
This thread feels strangely dramatic.
Olaf, freelance guardian fighter.
Enorla, Oh so devoted cleric.
I play half a dozen matches a day and even if I do encounter afkers, leavers, 8K GS, overwhelming wins and losses, almost half of the encounters are interesting with victory possibilities on each side.
This thread feels strangely dramatic.
Maybe, maybe not. If at this point already half of the encounters go to waste, one and a half month after an update that was supposed to fix all the issues you mentioned was introduced, it's alarming.
I play half a dozen matches a day and even if I do encounter afkers, leavers, 8K GS, overwhelming wins and losses, almost half of the encounters are interesting with victory possibilities on each side.
I play half a dozen matches a day and even if I do encounter afkers, leavers, 8K GS, overwhelming wins and losses, almost half of the encounters are interesting with victory possibilities on each side.
This thread feels strangely dramatic.
so half a dozen equals 6 from which u had almost half interesting , that means 2. Yeah.. must be the drama )
Again pls put kick in place with replacement for domination. This thing was always up in Swtor and worked rly good without abuses.
Comments
Here is the way I see it...
In almost every MMO with PvP in it...
The Devs keep trying to "Balance" the classes. And what usually happens is that they don't get it right, they just p*ss off the PvE community in the process.
And there is nothing that can, realistically, be done to prevent that. (Unless you go with an all <only> PvP or PvE MMO.)
You just have to put up with it or move on to a different MMO and hope things are different there.
Narayan
Narayan
These have been proven time and time again to work very poorly on the internet, where the shroud of anonymity puts any real fear of punishment far from people's minds.
As it currently stands, there is very, very little benefit to continue participating in a kerbstomp match, and little benefit to continue participating in a looong, more evenly-teamed match. The former will simply get you killed repeatedly for zero glory, and the latter will probably get you SOME glory, but at the cost of all your time. There isn't enough reward for staying with a crushing defeat, and there isn't enough reward for victory to make it worth fighting beyond a certain time-frame.
I mean, obviously everyone should be doing PvP because they want to, and the fighting and point-capping should be the reward in itself with the glory just being a bonus, but HAHAHAHHAHA no. This is the internet, and glory gets you stuff, so working out how to maximize glory returns is very much the order of business, I guess.
So I'd say "more rewards for longer matches, and more rewards for sticking with crappy one-sided matches" would be a better plan that coming up with increasingly elaborate and silly methods of punishing players who don't want to waste their time.
Things like reducing the disparity between victory and defeat: say...winners get +100 points, but actual glory awarded is based on score, so for a match that went 1000-999, both teams'd get a lot, with the winners getting an extra 100 just as a pat on the back. If we want to appeal to people's natural dickishness (since this is PvP after all), we could also make this come from a communal pool, say of 2000 points, so a 1000-999 result means 1000 points to each, whereas a 1000-100 result is more like 1800 to 200. This would motivate people to stick with a match that has gone 700-300, coz you probably won't WIN, but you might get up to 500 or so, and not only will that increase your reward, it would decrease the opponent's share of the reward.
Finally, to offset the time issue, have this pool build up over time, so a match that's over in five minutes only has a pool of 2000, whereas one that lasts 15 mins has 4000, and so on.
Yeah, you'd probably get people cap trading and extending matches forever to maximize glory rewards, but the beauty of this system is that it'd maximally reward these people only after effectively removing them from the circulating player-pool for the entire duration of their match.
Ultimately we want a system that allows those who genuinely play for the experience to continue to do so, those who play for the experience (but also the glory) to feel that continued participation is worthwhile, and those who are just there for the glory to feel motivated to actually play rather than sit it out.
I might be a bit too pessimistic at times, but I credit myself of successfully foreseeing spawn camping. Leaving matches was also a development and, on its height, surely it was worse than what we see now.
The problem is, methods of how to deal with the new system as someone purely after glory just haven't spread. Truth be told, the only nerf they did was lowering the glory rewards all around. People who know how can still get their 3-4 wins in per event hour. On one char.
One last thing: In my eyes the current sloppy ELO contributes to the camping problem. People not only know that losing isn't rewarding, they also will have experienced by now that they'll eventually get an easy win handed to them by the matchmaking.
1. total blow out my side 1000 - 70ish
2. My group consisted of 2 GF 2 Cleric 1 rogue. 1 cleric was a campfire girl, never left spawn. The other gf gave up about 4 minutes in.
3. Even looking sides. We lost the first engagement at center. disconnect of one of the team members(maybe legit, maybe not, who knows) Total blowout.
4. Us vs premade....everyone quit 5 minutes in, I simply died about 15 times, as i am stubborn. No offers of 1v1 just mass killed me. (premades are rare in my bracket to be fair)
5. My side lost 129-1000, 4vs5 as we had a campfire girl that quit later.
This is a fairly common occurance for me. I do not know if it is because of the bracket I am in or if it is normal. Evey 5 games I play though, There is at least 1 camper if not 2, and there are many more blowouts than close games.
this is pvp, and I am thinking that unless I get really good (hehe, yea right) and join a good guild, that this is how pvp will always be. If you just join the queue as random, this is representitive of what you will see.
This thread feels strangely dramatic.
Enorla, Oh so devoted cleric.
Maybe, maybe not. If at this point already half of the encounters go to waste, one and a half month after an update that was supposed to fix all the issues you mentioned was introduced, it's alarming.
Almost half......
so half a dozen equals 6 from which u had almost half interesting , that means 2. Yeah.. must be the drama
Again pls put kick in place with replacement for domination. This thing was always up in Swtor and worked rly good without abuses.