I just want to post this here, because it sums up my feelings quite well, and I am sure, that of a great many other people..
Lawful Stupid, these people may call themselves Lawful Neutral, or Lawful Good but they lean toward such rigid adherence to the law that anybody who breaks any law, anywhere, for any reason, is the enemy. Even saying an unkind word to someone is an act of pure evil, and the Lawful Stupid can and will act as Judge, Jury, and Executioner. That is why they are called Lawful Stupid, not Lawful Neutral or Lawful Evil.
Woe be to the fellow party member who fails to live up to their obsessive-compulsive standards. If the thief so much as jaywalks, Mr. Lawful Stupid will insist on turning him in to the "proper authorities" (regardless of what alignment said authorities are), or even execute him on the spot. Then he'll berate the other members of his party for "condoning" the thief's behavior, and may turn on them as well. This makes this guy highly irritating as well as stupid for turning in his only allies. For newbie DMs, the best solution is usually a blunt force object applied to the head of the offending character -- if not the player.
In tabletop roleplaying games, it's such a common behavior for paladins (see Leeroy Jenkins) that it seems this is what everyone expects paladins to do these days. In fact, it's so common that the Dungeons & Dragons Sourcebook Book of Exalted Deeds spends a good number of pages explaining how to be Lawful Neutral or Lawful Good without being a dimwit. The creators themselves got sick of it.
I didn't intend to bump this thread actively. Since someone had just replied and that bumped this thread, I would like to take this opportunity to ask devs for this feature again.
Devs, for the sake of role playing, please introduce the magical item for players to have one more option. It could be included in a Neverwinter pack, in a promotion, or in Profession packs like how you introduced Lillend companion.
Like fashion costumes and Lillend companion, which are for players to have more flavors in game, it's just another flavor for players to choose from.
Without an useful control power, my control wizard can't run epic dungeons. Please consider adding it. Thank you.
You seem to be the only player who wants this. From what I can tell, Cryptic/PWE don't do personal requests, unless you can make some sort of financial deal with them that is. Which wouldn't be lawful stupid of you.
You seem to be the only player who wants this. From what I can tell, Cryptic/PWE don't do personal requests, unless you can make some sort of financial deal with them that is. Which wouldn't be lawful stupid of you.
Well, if it can cover role playing purpose and also generate some income, it is still viable. How many players in the game have you actually seen wear zen market fashion costumes? Not many. But after module 1 they still introduced a new fashion costume.
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dardoveMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited September 2013
I don't see how it would be financially viable to a code a new feature just for one single player.
This is so poorly thought out it borders on insane. You basically want a device, that is only useable by a single class. That in effect would give CW's access to a 5th encounter power. Why even bother to take Steal time at all once you have this magic little gizmo on your belt. You can free up that encounter slot for pretty much anything else.
Lets completely mess up game balance, make an entire skill useless, replaced by a gizmo, all so a fraction of a percentage of the population can role play. Here is a tip, the corner stone of role play is imagination. It would be far easier to use that imagination to rename steal time, in your own head. Then for Cryptic to cater to your whims and damage the game.
This is so poorly thought out it borders on insane. You basically want a device, that is only useable by a single class. That in effect would give CW's access to a 5th encounter power. Why even bother to take Steal time at all once you have this magic little gizmo on your belt. You can free up that encounter slot for pretty much anything else.
Lets completely mess up game balance, make an entire skill useless, replaced by a gizmo, all so a fraction of a percentage of the population can role play. Here is a tip, the corner stone of role play is imagination. It would be far easier to use that imagination to rename steal time, in your own head. Then for Cryptic to cater to your whims and damage the game.
That can be solved by making the item usable only after being dragged into an encounter power slot.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited September 2013
Which would require a boatload more code to make an item that functions like an encounter, that can be slotted to a place where items don't go.
Which would require a boatload more code to make an item that functions like an encounter, that can be slotted to a place where items don't go.
Exactly! They would have to recode how devices work and how power slots function just to allow a single device to mimic a single encounter power on a single character class. The justification is EXTREMELY think and borders on the narcissistic.
If Cryptic really wanted to fix this. The EASIEST solution is to simply rename the power to "Sleep" and be done with it. Of course, the lack of response seems to indicated that even that is not something they want to do. So more complex ideas are way out.
Ill suggest again to the OP. The heart of RP is imagination, imagine it is a sleep spell and be done with it. Just in the same manner that I imagine my wizzies robes are not made by bare "midriff's R us" and actually covers her up more. After all D&D has never been about having the rules constrain players, but from having players use the rules to improve story telling. The fact that you honestly seem to be hung up on this detail really misses that larger point.
Take Robin of Locksley as an example. He indeed was a pretty good man. How did he become one? By stealing... from the rich and giving the goods to the poor. There is nothing wrong with stealing time, if the intention behind it is a good deed.
Take Robin of Locksley as an example. He indeed was a pretty good man. How did he become one? By stealing... from the rich and giving the goods to the poor. There is nothing wrong with stealing time, if the intention behind it is a good deed.
cheers.
His alignment is chaotic good. My wizard's is lawful good.
My god... this thing is still being argued? Just RP that your wizard has a similar spell with a different name. It's not like we have alignments in the game, yet many of us RP it.
Wow, I thought this was a troll thread at first. I guess I just didn't realize how seriously people RP their characters.
I have to agree with other posters suggestion that you simply ignore the name of the ability or 'roleplay' that it has a different name.
You are already 'making up' a bunch of stuff that isn't in the game and applying it to your character so what does it matter if you change something that is in the game already?
Never mind that time isn't something you can 'steal' anyway. Nobody owns it. You aren't breaking any moral or ethical boundaries by 'stealing' it.
Wow, I thought this was a troll thread at first. I guess I just didn't realize how seriously people RP their characters.
I have to agree with other posters suggestion that you simply ignore the name of the ability or 'roleplay' that it has a different name.
You are already 'making up' a bunch of stuff that isn't in the game and applying it to your character so what does it matter if you change something that is in the game already?
Never mind that time isn't something you can 'steal' anyway. Nobody owns it. You aren't breaking any moral or ethical boundaries by 'stealing' it.
Thank you for the suggestion. However, I cannot simply imagine an already defined thing as another different thing in a role playing game. Personally, I think imagining already defined things as different things isn't role playing.
Even though nobody owns the time, the act which using the power performs is still bad imho because the power creator defined it as "steal" act. I don't want to follow the power creator's mindset.
All my DnD players got so used to my cynical perspective of allignment during our years of gameplay together that the default was to be "neutral" or "chaotic evil", in fact, some of the most epic and memorable campaings were on the basis that adventurers are evil on nature, Lawful Stupid (yeh, i love that allignement name too) were unable to progress on my adventures without being always consumed by regret and doubts of faith, DnD was made in very different world of the one we have today, in some aspects, the clear fight between good guys and bad guys was needed, nowadays, most of the things adventurers on DnD do would be considered crimes against mankind, genocide, slavery, etc...
Playing a non "role playing" game should be easy in that aspect, you're a dwarf, you kill orcs, you're an orc, you kill dwarfs, is like the natural order, real life is annoying enough and complicated enough to care about that kind of things in games...
But in role playing games some people likes to...well, play a role so as long as theyre not obnoxious enough to become a nuissance for other players, im totally supportive of it.
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ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited October 2013
Ian...
Zebular is about a stringent with his characters as anybody in the game.
As he leveled he took spells he thought fit his character, Old Zeb. He didn't min-max (although it kind of turned out that way anyway) and his character is 100% the result of him doing the exact same things you describe. If you ask him why he did this, that or the other thing in his specs he will always start the sentence with "Well Old Zeb would have used that kind of spell..."
I asked him why he went down the renegade wizard path and his answer was because Nightmare Wizardry sounded like something his character would do and chuckle about.
What's my point?
His character is supposed to be a Chosen of Mystra. Mystra, her chosen and many wizards in general detest necromantic spells. He is currently running around with a Terror Enchantment on his weapon...which is a necromantic source of damage.
He's pretending it's not necromantic. I'm sure he has some fictional story for what it is but he is pretending that it is not a necrotic source.
Now if you wanted an alternate power altogether maybe we'd be talking here...But you don't.
You're complaining about the name of the spell.
You aren't opposed to the spell. You aren't opposed to the effects.
You are opposed to the name. As I said on page one this is being excessively fastidious.
You don't need the developers to change the name of a spell defined by the Player's Handbook because you're being picky. If you want to use pretend and roleplay then roleplay that the spell is named something other than Steal Time. Use your imagination and say that your spell has similar effects but is actually borrowing time in some way.
This is all over a name. This is beyond credulous.
If you were playing Pen and Paper would you refuse to use that spell that you really liked because it's called Steal Time? Would you call up Wizards of the Coast and demand that they change the name of the spell?
If you would then please do so and complain to Wizards of the Coast who actually named the spell...
If you would simply use your imagination then please do so...
Or you can be stubborn and simply not use to spell. The choice is yours.
If you don't want to use your imagination like every other roleplayer to make the best out of any situation over something as trivial as a name then please just accept that you won't be using it.
The reality of the situation is that you're not against the effects of the spell. If it's not evil because of the effects then it's not evil because of the name. Either deal with the name, rename it yourself or don't use it.
Thank you very much. I appreciate your advice. Yet I still can't redefine things in the game so easily like you guys can. Imho, role playing should be strict and serious. If we simply redefine or rename whatever in the game at our will, role playing is no more.
Thanks all for posting your suggestions. I really appreciate it. If anyone still has constructive suggestion, please post it. Or I guess we can just let this thread sink.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited October 2013
Roleplaying is all about pretending things.
You're already pretending you're a goshdarned wizard, for pity's sake. Pretending a spell has a different name is a much smaller leap of the imagination than that.
You are telling a story, and while you do need to work within a provided structure, the best roleplayers are always going to be flexible. It's like improv. Improv is all about saying "yes" to keep the story going.
In short, Control Wizard has an useful control power called Steal Time, which stuns mobs. However, my control wizard's alignment is lawful-good so he doesn't want to be a stealer. Therefore he is unwilling to use Steal Time. But that causes an issue, without an efficient control power like that one, my wizard is unable to run most of epic dungeons.
It looks like introducing a new similar power or changing Steal Time's name is unlikely to happen. Then, alternatively, can we have a magical item which upon being activated will cast a similar spell? I looked up D&D resource books and found there are two powers whose effects are similar to Steal Time's. One is a level 13 encounter power from PHB; another one is a level 23 encounter power from Arcane Power.
So far we have some packs such as Hero of the North and Knight of the Feywild. How about adding a Control Wizard of Neverwinter pack and include the item in it? I wouldn't mind if the price is rather high. My wizard is really in dire need of a replacement for that Steal Time thing.
. . . . . . As a wizard in D&D, at high levels you get to make your own spells. So, role-play that you created your own version that doesn't steal time but pulls it from the Timestream istelf instead of other's links with the Timestream. You say you're roleplaying Lawful Good, so continue to do so and role-play that your Steal Time is a your own version of the spell. Call it "Time Snap."
Thank you very much. I appreciate your advice. Yet I still can't redefine things in the game so easily like you guys can. Imho, role playing should be strict and serious. If we simply redefine or rename whatever in the game at our will, role playing is no more.
. . . . . You say this yet you also say you're role-playing Lawful Good when there is no Alignment system in Neverwinter. That doesn't make much sense to me.
I just saw the news about a new companion. And an idea which can wonderfully solve the issue suddenly came into my mind. Yes, COMPANION!
You could simply introduce a CW-only companion, such as a magical orb, which acts like an ioun stone and floats around its owner. It casts a spell similar to Steal Time about every 15 seconds after it reaches rank 30. And it is immune to damage so it doesn't die.
Imho this idea really can solve the issue. And you don't need to worry about programming for a magical item to make it fit into a consumable slot.
I can't believe I didn't think of this wonderful idea before.
It's a perfect solution, isn't it?
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ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited October 2013
Sounds potentially overpowered.
That or it'll die too fast to be useful. One of the two.
Comments
LOL ^ nicely put.
Devs, for the sake of role playing, please introduce the magical item for players to have one more option. It could be included in a Neverwinter pack, in a promotion, or in Profession packs like how you introduced Lillend companion.
Like fashion costumes and Lillend companion, which are for players to have more flavors in game, it's just another flavor for players to choose from.
Without an useful control power, my control wizard can't run epic dungeons. Please consider adding it. Thank you.
They won't. Ever. Unfortunately not every forum user is prepared or willing to accept this fact.
Think about Lillend companion. Is she better than fully upgraded Cleric Disciple? Not really. But players still tried to get her.
Lets completely mess up game balance, make an entire skill useless, replaced by a gizmo, all so a fraction of a percentage of the population can role play. Here is a tip, the corner stone of role play is imagination. It would be far easier to use that imagination to rename steal time, in your own head. Then for Cryptic to cater to your whims and damage the game.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Exactly! They would have to recode how devices work and how power slots function just to allow a single device to mimic a single encounter power on a single character class. The justification is EXTREMELY think and borders on the narcissistic.
If Cryptic really wanted to fix this. The EASIEST solution is to simply rename the power to "Sleep" and be done with it. Of course, the lack of response seems to indicated that even that is not something they want to do. So more complex ideas are way out.
Ill suggest again to the OP. The heart of RP is imagination, imagine it is a sleep spell and be done with it. Just in the same manner that I imagine my wizzies robes are not made by bare "midriff's R us" and actually covers her up more. After all D&D has never been about having the rules constrain players, but from having players use the rules to improve story telling. The fact that you honestly seem to be hung up on this detail really misses that larger point.
Some thought the magic item being put in a consumable slot is overpowered, but it actually isn't because there can be workarounds. For example:
Problems solved.
cheers.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
I have to agree with other posters suggestion that you simply ignore the name of the ability or 'roleplay' that it has a different name.
You are already 'making up' a bunch of stuff that isn't in the game and applying it to your character so what does it matter if you change something that is in the game already?
Never mind that time isn't something you can 'steal' anyway. Nobody owns it. You aren't breaking any moral or ethical boundaries by 'stealing' it.
Even though nobody owns the time, the act which using the power performs is still bad imho because the power creator defined it as "steal" act. I don't want to follow the power creator's mindset.
Playing a non "role playing" game should be easy in that aspect, you're a dwarf, you kill orcs, you're an orc, you kill dwarfs, is like the natural order, real life is annoying enough and complicated enough to care about that kind of things in games...
But in role playing games some people likes to...well, play a role
Zebular is about a stringent with his characters as anybody in the game.
As he leveled he took spells he thought fit his character, Old Zeb. He didn't min-max (although it kind of turned out that way anyway) and his character is 100% the result of him doing the exact same things you describe. If you ask him why he did this, that or the other thing in his specs he will always start the sentence with "Well Old Zeb would have used that kind of spell..."
I asked him why he went down the renegade wizard path and his answer was because Nightmare Wizardry sounded like something his character would do and chuckle about.
What's my point?
His character is supposed to be a Chosen of Mystra. Mystra, her chosen and many wizards in general detest necromantic spells. He is currently running around with a Terror Enchantment on his weapon...which is a necromantic source of damage.
He's pretending it's not necromantic. I'm sure he has some fictional story for what it is but he is pretending that it is not a necrotic source.
Now if you wanted an alternate power altogether maybe we'd be talking here...But you don't.
You're complaining about the name of the spell.
You aren't opposed to the spell. You aren't opposed to the effects.
You are opposed to the name. As I said on page one this is being excessively fastidious.
You don't need the developers to change the name of a spell defined by the Player's Handbook because you're being picky. If you want to use pretend and roleplay then roleplay that the spell is named something other than Steal Time. Use your imagination and say that your spell has similar effects but is actually borrowing time in some way.
This is all over a name. This is beyond credulous.
If you were playing Pen and Paper would you refuse to use that spell that you really liked because it's called Steal Time? Would you call up Wizards of the Coast and demand that they change the name of the spell?
If you would then please do so and complain to Wizards of the Coast who actually named the spell...
If you would simply use your imagination then please do so...
Or you can be stubborn and simply not use to spell. The choice is yours.
If you don't want to use your imagination like every other roleplayer to make the best out of any situation over something as trivial as a name then please just accept that you won't be using it.
The reality of the situation is that you're not against the effects of the spell. If it's not evil because of the effects then it's not evil because of the name. Either deal with the name, rename it yourself or don't use it.
Thank you very much. I appreciate your advice. Yet I still can't redefine things in the game so easily like you guys can. Imho, role playing should be strict and serious. If we simply redefine or rename whatever in the game at our will, role playing is no more.
You're already pretending you're a goshdarned wizard, for pity's sake. Pretending a spell has a different name is a much smaller leap of the imagination than that.
You are telling a story, and while you do need to work within a provided structure, the best roleplayers are always going to be flexible. It's like improv. Improv is all about saying "yes" to keep the story going.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
1. That this thread exists.
2. That it has reached 6 pages.
Because "stealing" time from redcaps is so much less lawful and good than taking their lives :P
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
. . . . . You say this yet you also say you're role-playing Lawful Good when there is no Alignment system in Neverwinter. That doesn't make much sense to me.
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I just saw the news about a new companion. And an idea which can wonderfully solve the issue suddenly came into my mind. Yes, COMPANION!
You could simply introduce a CW-only companion, such as a magical orb, which acts like an ioun stone and floats around its owner. It casts a spell similar to Steal Time about every 15 seconds after it reaches rank 30. And it is immune to damage so it doesn't die.
Imho this idea really can solve the issue. And you don't need to worry about programming for a magical item to make it fit into a consumable slot.
I can't believe I didn't think of this wonderful idea before.
It's a perfect solution, isn't it?
That or it'll die too fast to be useful. One of the two.