Side note - I'll be sure to keep an eye out for you so I can thoroughly avoid grouping with you.
Back on topic,
NEED = only able to roll on the gear if it's for your class and BOP
GREED = anyone can hit greed no matter what the gear is, the item remains BOE, so it can be sold/traded
PASS = again, anyone can pass on an item
Current fix it's easy enough to see if that TR who just rolled need on a piece of TR gear is wearing the same or better already. You'll know never to group with them again OR boot them from the group immediately. At least unless you're another TR you'd know he can't do the same thing to your piece of gear you've been running that dungeon 15 times to acquire. The current change is a lukewarm solution and needs to be upped to BOP flagged items if you roll need on an item as that's the only way to fix the majority of the loot problems. No, it wouldn't fix EVERY single problem but it would fix most of them at least. Point is, this is a grouping game and unless the current fix is tweaked to address the majority of the problem (greedy ****heads rolling need on anything and everything to sell on auction house for AD or to vendor) most people wont do much grouping unless it's with friends/guildies and that isn't promoting gameplay, it's limiting it.
I think you don't understand the meaning of the word need.
The mechanic doesn't need to be fixed as you suggest - it's simply the way you would like it to be fixed.
The current fix should work fine.
There's only ever going to be two people rolling need on the same item.
That works out fine.
Still haven't heard a single reason for geared people to go back to an instance (assuming 2 of that class) if the other person is missing the piece that drops there. If you can't see how that is a problem considering the lack of content in NW, or make up ridiculous workarounds like only grouping with people who have everything, you are honestly beyond help.
Also there is approx two people in this thread besides myself that seems to understand what fairness actually entails. Turning the argument on it's head all I'm hearing is greedy people who doesn't have the item complaing that the other person who spent just as much time in the instance won't give them more than 50% chance for the item (that 50% chance which is the very definition of fairness). Giving up the loot to the other guy is charity, not fairness. And frankly, in pugs, it's every man for himself.
If there's only two people with your understanding of fairness, your understanding clearly isn't common or particularly desirable -or necessary- for this particular community.
The current fix works great for me.
I couldn't care less whether the person who rolls need is wearing the item.
At worst, it's a 50/50 chance for me to win. Those odds are fine.
0
rdurbin3000Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited June 2013
making them bind on pick up would be a good idea, but some people will need and just sell to vendor, so you will probably have to make it not sellable as well. or make it worth 1c when someone needs on item
If everyone has done their part, I'd rather gear someone who's under-geared so they have the chance to go into higher level dungeons and get even more gear. That way we have more good players doing high level dungeons and the game will be more fun and there will be a greater community.
I don't know if I care much about "good" players doing high level dungeons.
Blue and Purple items I don't equip go in the Guild Bank, so I'm helping "under-geared" players in any case.
More than one way to skin a cat.
Was commenting that the current flooding of the AH with an overflowing supply of T1-2 items is what is driving the price down. By making NEED rolled items they would be taken out of the market cycle thus lowering the supply (higher prices for those selling them, larger profit).
Lower prices=more people who can buy it=faster sell=more people gear up=more item on market . repeat tell it cheap to buy something you need on AH= more AD to turn in to zen to buy from Zen store= more money for Cryptic and PWE. I call it a win win.
FYI AH is there for people who have bad luck at getting gear that for their class but great at making AD .
Just make it so you cant need on items with a better gearscore than the items you wore to enter the dungeon (equal gearscore is fine, since you might be after alternative stats, although make it so you cant need on items where you already own them).
0
nukeyooBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
I'm curious, could you please explain the grammatical fixes that occurred to make your version of my sentence grammatically correct versus my own version.
This is a pretty crazy thread. What I'm hearing from half the people is that rolling need on equipment you can't use when other people can use it is OK because you can sell it to get more money/AD.
Let's extend this example on to the real world.
Aid supplies given to countries are fair game to everyone (even rich politicians who don't need them) because anyone can benefit from selling them.
Food rationing in war and disasters should be fair game to everyone because anyone can benefit from selling the food.
In my job, if I need certain access to subscription articles or software licenses TO DO MY JOB, everyone in my department should have a chance at it even if they already have it, because they can sell it to someone not even in my company and make some money.
Can we list the people who believe this so I never have to work wi... I mean party with them?
It's not that simple. It's not a RL topic, your life/income won't be affected. There is no need in games. There is only "want", because you don't need anything to play the game, you just want better gear to achieve x. Even the GS limit are really meaningless, considering you may equip crappy stuff or cheap enchants to get the little bump you need to queue for anything.
Imagine the buttons were want/share with the needy/pass. You see the problem with your statement now?
This was never a problem. This is not a single player game when you run one instance/dungeon and get what you want. There are hundreds of thousands of items in the game and you want a particular one to drop so when it drops, you can need on it and take it? Why changeing the system that is not broken? Explain to me what is broken! Devs are changeing the system cause you whined about need rolls, now you want to change it according to other games? Well that is stupid. No system is perfect.
And stop saying other games systems are good. If you want a good system, go play WoW or Rift. This is not WoW and Rift, this is NEVERWINTER. Different game, different manifecturer. If what you want comes true and cryptic impliment WoW or Rifts system, they can be sued for copyrights? Have you thought of that? Why taking another broken system from a broken game and put it in when you can obviously use a system that is tested for a very long time?
Whiners gonna whine, haters gonna hate, you cant change it. If you dont like the system, gtfo or adapt to it. Yes its a game but do you think you can change what you dont like in real life? NO! Keep the current system on, then we will see who will stay and Im sure only the best players will stick around.
If what you want comes true and cryptic impliment WoW or Rifts system, they can be sued for copyrights? Have you thought of that?
I didn't study laws or anything and I have no real idea of how these things work. But i'm 99% sure you can't get sued for having a similar loot system. That'd be just ridiculous.
If you dont like the system, gtfo or adapt to it. Yes its a game but do you think you can change what you dont like in real life? NO!
Yes.
Don't like your job? Work harder for a better one.
Don't like your girlfriend/wife? Get a better one.
Want more money? Work harder or get a better job.
Don't like how you look? Get new clothes and a new haircut or whatever.
The list goes on.
I didn't study laws or anything and I have no real idea of how these things work. But i'm 99% sure you can't get sued for having a similar loot system. That'd be just ridiculous.
And do you think its easy to wright down an entire new system? Do you think its like "yeah, ok. lets start building an entire new system and it will be ready next week". No programmer in the world will do this. I am a programmer myself, collage degree in software engineering, and I can tell you that takes LOTS of time. Do you think someone will start working on an entire new system just to satisfy a few kids? I dont think so.
I will tell you how it works. Its a market strategy. The whole system is made so things wount be that easy. Or in the end, after a month, everyone will be in endgame gear and they will stop playing. Do you even wanna play a game when you are all endgame gear and you have nothing to do? I dont think you do. In real life, you have to work for a very long time untill you buy a car or a house. In games its the same when you are limited to things you can do. If you dont like the system, please dont play the game and stop trying to change it to your own wishes. If you play a single player game, do you wright angry emails to the manifacturer telling him to redo this or that cause its not fair? Nope! Why should you do it here? Yes I understand its not a single player game, but still, why trying to change something? Its not a bug, its not an exploit, its just the way the game is running.
And once again, if you dont like it, stop playing it.
As one of the people here posted, I am gonna go and craft a few pairs of pants /really, the price in the market is good :P/
Yes.
Don't like your job? Work harder for a better one.
Don't like your girlfriend/wife? Get a better one.
Want more money? Work harder or get a better job.
Don't like how you look? Get new clothes and a new haircut or whatever.
The list goes on.
How old are you? 12? 14? Oh wait, the game is marked as 16+ I think? You can change those things but you wount like them soon and you will want to change them again. First you need to change yourself and dont try to change the world around you, but ADDAPT to it. Its not that hard you know. Try using your brain for things different than whining and searching for new things to complain about.
0
silveraMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
And make the item unsellable too , so no greed for gold too
You want to change everything to fit your sense of entitlement. Just stop.
The AH would tank...BOP means no gear on the AH. Don't try and tell me that you could just greed it. Why? I already greed on non class items. Why should I roll greed on items that belong to my class? No reason other than you feel slighted or someone stole yer gear and is in your base killing your menz!!!ONE!!!ELEVEN!!!
Many times I have run the dungeon repeatedly only to watch all TR gear drop one run...or CW gear etc. So I PAID my dues by running the dungeon multiple times WITHOUT any reward. Now when my gear finally does drop I get REWARDED.
The gear from dungeons is the carrot. The carrot turns into AD if you win and sell.
Take away the carrot and nobody would bother running a dungeon more than a couple times. Great now you can run that dungeon solo and get all that BOP loot that you can AH...I mean vendor for 5 gold.
seems people kept their interest while i was gone and that is a good thing.
After reading the posts that came after i went offline yesterday let me bring back this thread to it's topic.
So far the disagreements come only from people who either already have the gear and just want money (AD or Gold) or those who are not interested in gear or social enviroment and that keep saying people will press need no matter what.
To proceed i will separate 2 basic ideas, one based on present, where there are people with all the gear they want and just want money and the future, where when new content comes, everyone will want/need gear.
At same time i will try to reply more clearly to some points of disagreement arguments
I'll start with the future version where has been no disagreement unless the ones that press need just to prevent others to get it. However i want to place it seperatly to see if people come up with arguements to point negative aspects of this idea as i am reasonable and i am really interested to know the potential of this idea.
So... future
This is when this idea works best, everyone don't have the majority of the new gear that is dropping in this new content. In this case scenario, once again, there is less incentive to prevent others from getting the gear since with this idea, the gear is worth less, then it's price on the market. One other point is that people who do "steal"/prevent others from getting the gear, will get labeled as ninja looters and sooner or later people will avoid them. Even tho this idea doesn't prevent people from doing so, i have the belief that non other idea presented so far can prevent it. Making it sort of a variable i cannot control and one that since i haven't seen in any game ever controlled it... let's say not the most important point to worry about things you can't do anything about them.
Now the analysis of this side. Well, people who play more for just beeing rich and not really worrying about the content, will still have a chance of getting items, since people can only need for their class, it will happen that no one of that class will be in the dungeon, or even if there is, he/she might not need it and press greed as well.
So there will still be items to sell and their value will be much greater. Basic of Economics state that with less supply and equal demands, the price rises. So you may sell less items, but you will sell each for more.
For people who want/need the item, they will have a bigger chance to get it, enabling them to gear up quicker, reach high content quicker, explore the content of the game quicker as no one likes to get stucked in content because other people are stealing their gear.
(i think its safe to point that no one likes to play and get nothing in return cause other players are getting erything)
That last same statement can come as an argument for those (2 or 3 people that replied so far) who have a definition of fairness based on a fixed 50/50. Well, with this idea the guy who doesn't have the item has more reasons (not that they are more important, just that there are more) to get that item then the one who already has it, therefor 50/50 isn't completly fair. Not wanting to go into real life issues i will point a simple fact. It's not because you have more money to buy founder's pack as an example, that all your characters will do more damage/healing then mine, it's just that you will have certain benefits but not game breaking. Therefor the guy who has more reasons to get the item will have that 1 time chance of a higher % to get it, but that happens once, after he gets it, he is on same level as you are and that is fair. Fairness is when all people have a chance to reach what everyone else can reach.
Going for the present now.
The main debate now comes from people that already have all the gear they want and just want AD/gold (doesn't matter the reasons i will consider them all fair reasons.)
Main question i have seen is also what is the reason that end game players will have to continue do dungeons.
I think this 2 last statements are connected so will try to reply to both at same time.
before that i would like to make a point. Those ideas are very individualized and not based on the game community welffare. They are based on "What do i get in return from this idea?" and that is the known problem of people trying to bend a game for their needs. Now you can argue that my idea is bending the game to some people needs. However you have never seen me saying that i think this idea to be good for me personally. I just believe it that in general it's more fair, more just and most important that it will satisfy more people. That will mean more people playing, more people means a higher number of them will actually buy stuff with real money, ending in higher profit for the company that is making the game, enabling this company to continue their work and improve a game we ALL play.
Now getting more to the point in question.
Geared people who stated they do dungeons for money, can (i think) be separeted in 2 groups. Those who play in a guild for end game content and those who not. This separation is just to be easier to clarify all the points.
For those who have guilds and play in them for high end content, it's much more benefitial to group up together since you will be all high skilled players, making dungeons faster, getting rewards faster and so on then with pugs, so honestly this idea won't even make much effect to you. If you want i can even get you a link from youtube from a high end player who will tell you how to make a few millions of AD in a way that will not be bothered with this system.
For others who do not have such guilds i can see this idea having more impact on their gameplay. Taking in consideration that this sort of players have to pug more often then not. Now here is once again where Math comes up as i stated before.
Currently everyone needs to sell.
In 5 runs, in average 1 item of each class drops. In average 1 Person of each class will need it to get ir, resulting in 1 item if 5 runs to sell average. If there are more of each class in a run this % lowers on getting your class item. If the items that drop is not from your class and no one of that class is there, its a greed roll where you have 20% chance of getting it.
So, now knowing the % of getting extra players of same class in dungeons i cannot really point an exact % but lets consider a mid point.
In 10 runs, 5 of them have not the 5 classes presented there. and in 1 of them you have yourself and other of same class.
This makes that in 10 runs, 5 is balanced and you get an item in average, the other 5 you have a 20% chance of dropping your class item in the run you have another to compete with or the same 20% of dropping an item of the class there is no one there. In first case it depends if the other guy from your class has the item or not. and let's say he doesn't so you have a 20% chance of getting nothing in those 5 runs. In the other hand means you have 80% chance of getting something. If the item that drops is not from your class you still get another 20% chance of getting an extra item.
So in total in "first" 5 runs you have received an item in average, and then have 80% in the next 5 runs (the toher 20 i will not even count with them as they are true in any loot system, current or mine)
This points to a 90% average in each 5 runs to still get an item. (And yes this is very roughly but feel free to bring harder statistics i can manage them too )
Currently with the incomming fix without my idea, the only difference applies that even if you have someone of same class in your group and that he needs the gear, you will still need it to sell. So making those 20% you lost on my idea become a 50/50 and half of 20% is 10%, making it the 80%+10%.
The final results are in first 5 runs you have 1 class item different in each run and you get in in average (same as before) the last 5 runs you have a bigger chance, instead of 80% you now have 90%.
Making it a total of 95%.
Now i know this explanations aren't real, may not be close and they are VERY unreliable. But they are also a simple idea of how to see things.
Either if its 5% of gettimg an item in each 10 runs or even if it's twice as much... 10% less items can be easilly recovered by the upgoing of the prices on the market i believe.
So yes there are still reasons for you to do content.
Sorry for this post beeing a bit too large but i had alot of replies to cover since yesterday.
Yeah my post went a big larget then i wanted, still if people are interested they can make the effort :P lot of good stuff there
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] The Neverwinter books
0
soulsofcreationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 14Arc User
edited June 2013
Wow, that is an excellent idea. That would make people press "Need" if they require the item and plan to use it. (Else, they wouldn't be able to sell it for AD.) Otherwise, if people wanted the item for profit, then they'd really have something to gain by pressing "Greed" as it wouldn't be bound to them. Hence, there really is a tradeoff in benefits between the two options and this would almost completely stop people from "Need"-ing everything.
so then people will be running charity work for doing dungeons?
Sounds like this is being advocated.
0
nukeyooBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
I find most pug dungeon runs to be charity work, thus I have no issue with leaving the group on the final boss due to the incompetence of someone(s). My charitableness only goes so far and only so many injury kits.
There's always going to be QQ regardless of looting options. Asking for all the coding required to develop some sort of bound on need option is asinine. Let the developers use their time to develop new content and gear. So you can come here and QQ about not winning it.
Comments
The mechanic doesn't need to be fixed as you suggest - it's simply the way you would like it to be fixed.
The current fix should work fine.
There's only ever going to be two people rolling need on the same item.
That works out fine.
The current fix works great for me.
I couldn't care less whether the person who rolls need is wearing the item.
At worst, it's a 50/50 chance for me to win. Those odds are fine.
Blue and Purple items I don't equip go in the Guild Bank, so I'm helping "under-geared" players in any case.
More than one way to skin a cat.
FYI AH is there for people who have bad luck at getting gear that for their class but great at making AD .
I can still move.
I can still fight.
I will never give up!
(Fixed it for ya)
+1
(fixxeed dat fo jew;
I can still move.
I can still fight.
I will never give up!
It's not that simple. It's not a RL topic, your life/income won't be affected. There is no need in games. There is only "want", because you don't need anything to play the game, you just want better gear to achieve x. Even the GS limit are really meaningless, considering you may equip crappy stuff or cheap enchants to get the little bump you need to queue for anything.
Imagine the buttons were want/share with the needy/pass. You see the problem with your statement now?
Need -> bind on character anything won instantly
Most problems solved. =P Wow.
And stop saying other games systems are good. If you want a good system, go play WoW or Rift. This is not WoW and Rift, this is NEVERWINTER. Different game, different manifecturer. If what you want comes true and cryptic impliment WoW or Rifts system, they can be sued for copyrights? Have you thought of that? Why taking another broken system from a broken game and put it in when you can obviously use a system that is tested for a very long time?
Whiners gonna whine, haters gonna hate, you cant change it. If you dont like the system, gtfo or adapt to it. Yes its a game but do you think you can change what you dont like in real life? NO! Keep the current system on, then we will see who will stay and Im sure only the best players will stick around.
I didn't study laws or anything and I have no real idea of how these things work. But i'm 99% sure you can't get sued for having a similar loot system. That'd be just ridiculous.
Yes.
Don't like your job? Work harder for a better one.
Don't like your girlfriend/wife? Get a better one.
Want more money? Work harder or get a better job.
Don't like how you look? Get new clothes and a new haircut or whatever.
The list goes on.
I will tell you how it works. Its a market strategy. The whole system is made so things wount be that easy. Or in the end, after a month, everyone will be in endgame gear and they will stop playing. Do you even wanna play a game when you are all endgame gear and you have nothing to do? I dont think you do. In real life, you have to work for a very long time untill you buy a car or a house. In games its the same when you are limited to things you can do. If you dont like the system, please dont play the game and stop trying to change it to your own wishes. If you play a single player game, do you wright angry emails to the manifacturer telling him to redo this or that cause its not fair? Nope! Why should you do it here? Yes I understand its not a single player game, but still, why trying to change something? Its not a bug, its not an exploit, its just the way the game is running.
And once again, if you dont like it, stop playing it.
As one of the people here posted, I am gonna go and craft a few pairs of pants /really, the price in the market is good :P/
How old are you? 12? 14? Oh wait, the game is marked as 16+ I think? You can change those things but you wount like them soon and you will want to change them again. First you need to change yourself and dont try to change the world around you, but ADDAPT to it. Its not that hard you know. Try using your brain for things different than whining and searching for new things to complain about.
Take a balanced party.
Rolling Need on class items is fine.
You want to change everything to fit your sense of entitlement. Just stop.
The AH would tank...BOP means no gear on the AH. Don't try and tell me that you could just greed it. Why? I already greed on non class items. Why should I roll greed on items that belong to my class? No reason other than you feel slighted or someone stole yer gear and is in your base killing your menz!!!ONE!!!ELEVEN!!!
Many times I have run the dungeon repeatedly only to watch all TR gear drop one run...or CW gear etc. So I PAID my dues by running the dungeon multiple times WITHOUT any reward. Now when my gear finally does drop I get REWARDED.
The gear from dungeons is the carrot. The carrot turns into AD if you win and sell.
Take away the carrot and nobody would bother running a dungeon more than a couple times. Great now you can run that dungeon solo and get all that BOP loot that you can AH...I mean vendor for 5 gold.
Sarcasm runs deep with this...I am impressed!
I was impressed too and I can suggest BoP, unsellable and undestructible. So even if you take it, you wount be able to do anything with it
seems people kept their interest while i was gone and that is a good thing.
After reading the posts that came after i went offline yesterday let me bring back this thread to it's topic.
So far the disagreements come only from people who either already have the gear and just want money (AD or Gold) or those who are not interested in gear or social enviroment and that keep saying people will press need no matter what.
To proceed i will separate 2 basic ideas, one based on present, where there are people with all the gear they want and just want money and the future, where when new content comes, everyone will want/need gear.
At same time i will try to reply more clearly to some points of disagreement arguments
I'll start with the future version where has been no disagreement unless the ones that press need just to prevent others to get it. However i want to place it seperatly to see if people come up with arguements to point negative aspects of this idea as i am reasonable and i am really interested to know the potential of this idea.
So... future
This is when this idea works best, everyone don't have the majority of the new gear that is dropping in this new content. In this case scenario, once again, there is less incentive to prevent others from getting the gear since with this idea, the gear is worth less, then it's price on the market. One other point is that people who do "steal"/prevent others from getting the gear, will get labeled as ninja looters and sooner or later people will avoid them. Even tho this idea doesn't prevent people from doing so, i have the belief that non other idea presented so far can prevent it. Making it sort of a variable i cannot control and one that since i haven't seen in any game ever controlled it... let's say not the most important point to worry about things you can't do anything about them.
Now the analysis of this side. Well, people who play more for just beeing rich and not really worrying about the content, will still have a chance of getting items, since people can only need for their class, it will happen that no one of that class will be in the dungeon, or even if there is, he/she might not need it and press greed as well.
So there will still be items to sell and their value will be much greater. Basic of Economics state that with less supply and equal demands, the price rises. So you may sell less items, but you will sell each for more.
For people who want/need the item, they will have a bigger chance to get it, enabling them to gear up quicker, reach high content quicker, explore the content of the game quicker as no one likes to get stucked in content because other people are stealing their gear.
(i think its safe to point that no one likes to play and get nothing in return cause other players are getting erything)
That last same statement can come as an argument for those (2 or 3 people that replied so far) who have a definition of fairness based on a fixed 50/50. Well, with this idea the guy who doesn't have the item has more reasons (not that they are more important, just that there are more) to get that item then the one who already has it, therefor 50/50 isn't completly fair. Not wanting to go into real life issues i will point a simple fact. It's not because you have more money to buy founder's pack as an example, that all your characters will do more damage/healing then mine, it's just that you will have certain benefits but not game breaking. Therefor the guy who has more reasons to get the item will have that 1 time chance of a higher % to get it, but that happens once, after he gets it, he is on same level as you are and that is fair. Fairness is when all people have a chance to reach what everyone else can reach.
Going for the present now.
The main debate now comes from people that already have all the gear they want and just want AD/gold (doesn't matter the reasons i will consider them all fair reasons.)
Main question i have seen is also what is the reason that end game players will have to continue do dungeons.
I think this 2 last statements are connected so will try to reply to both at same time.
before that i would like to make a point. Those ideas are very individualized and not based on the game community welffare. They are based on "What do i get in return from this idea?" and that is the known problem of people trying to bend a game for their needs. Now you can argue that my idea is bending the game to some people needs. However you have never seen me saying that i think this idea to be good for me personally. I just believe it that in general it's more fair, more just and most important that it will satisfy more people. That will mean more people playing, more people means a higher number of them will actually buy stuff with real money, ending in higher profit for the company that is making the game, enabling this company to continue their work and improve a game we ALL play.
Now getting more to the point in question.
Geared people who stated they do dungeons for money, can (i think) be separeted in 2 groups. Those who play in a guild for end game content and those who not. This separation is just to be easier to clarify all the points.
For those who have guilds and play in them for high end content, it's much more benefitial to group up together since you will be all high skilled players, making dungeons faster, getting rewards faster and so on then with pugs, so honestly this idea won't even make much effect to you. If you want i can even get you a link from youtube from a high end player who will tell you how to make a few millions of AD in a way that will not be bothered with this system.
For others who do not have such guilds i can see this idea having more impact on their gameplay. Taking in consideration that this sort of players have to pug more often then not. Now here is once again where Math comes up as i stated before.
Currently everyone needs to sell.
In 5 runs, in average 1 item of each class drops. In average 1 Person of each class will need it to get ir, resulting in 1 item if 5 runs to sell average. If there are more of each class in a run this % lowers on getting your class item. If the items that drop is not from your class and no one of that class is there, its a greed roll where you have 20% chance of getting it.
So, now knowing the % of getting extra players of same class in dungeons i cannot really point an exact % but lets consider a mid point.
In 10 runs, 5 of them have not the 5 classes presented there. and in 1 of them you have yourself and other of same class.
This makes that in 10 runs, 5 is balanced and you get an item in average, the other 5 you have a 20% chance of dropping your class item in the run you have another to compete with or the same 20% of dropping an item of the class there is no one there. In first case it depends if the other guy from your class has the item or not. and let's say he doesn't so you have a 20% chance of getting nothing in those 5 runs. In the other hand means you have 80% chance of getting something. If the item that drops is not from your class you still get another 20% chance of getting an extra item.
So in total in "first" 5 runs you have received an item in average, and then have 80% in the next 5 runs (the toher 20 i will not even count with them as they are true in any loot system, current or mine)
This points to a 90% average in each 5 runs to still get an item. (And yes this is very roughly but feel free to bring harder statistics i can manage them too
Currently with the incomming fix without my idea, the only difference applies that even if you have someone of same class in your group and that he needs the gear, you will still need it to sell. So making those 20% you lost on my idea become a 50/50 and half of 20% is 10%, making it the 80%+10%.
The final results are in first 5 runs you have 1 class item different in each run and you get in in average (same as before) the last 5 runs you have a bigger chance, instead of 80% you now have 90%.
Making it a total of 95%.
Now i know this explanations aren't real, may not be close and they are VERY unreliable. But they are also a simple idea of how to see things.
Either if its 5% of gettimg an item in each 10 runs or even if it's twice as much... 10% less items can be easilly recovered by the upgoing of the prices on the market i believe.
So yes there are still reasons for you to do content.
Sorry for this post beeing a bit too large but i had alot of replies to cover since yesterday.
Bring more comments guys
I already made my thoughts known just a few posts up. (post #110)
Just to add....you have no (insert class) in a run. That means EVERYONE gets to roll GREED. Winner gets to either save for ALT or sell for AD.
Hope more people post their agreement to make this even more evident that it is an improvement and a possible one
or make the drop auto loot (automatically put inside the bag)
i know its kinda hard for autoloot(class > roll score) so i wont expect it to happen
Sounds like this is being advocated.
There's always going to be QQ regardless of looting options. Asking for all the coding required to develop some sort of bound on need option is asinine. Let the developers use their time to develop new content and gear. So you can come here and QQ about not winning it.