So what I did was I respec-ed to a Whisperknife while using this set, tried out the new build I have posted in this guide and the results were amazing!
Could you please link me the post to your WK-build? I didn't find it and don't feel like clicking through all the pages of this thread.
I'm very interested in your feats. Specifically if you took Nimble Dodge to keep permastealth going.
When I tried the Stealth WK build before I had this set, it need extra recovery from Occult Rings/Belt/Amulet of Respite for 972 more Recovery, giving me around 30% RSI in total with a Stone included.
Aaah, just as I thought - I need more recovery. That's why I couldn't get a permastealth WK get to work.
But with this new set, everything felt really comfortable. I could effortlessly keep my Stealth up just by dodging and properly managing the CD of my Stealth Refill encounters.
It was a fun experience and I felt like a whirlwind of steel, throwing daggers and critting for 21k from Disheartening Strike and staying in the cover of stealth the entire time.
DS critting for 21k? :eek: How? Highest I get with Battlefield Scavenger weapons and about 3000 ArP is 10k on squishier targets. But I'm mainly Scoundrel and use Bilethorn. Did you take Executioner and a Vorpal to get such high damage?
Could you please link me the post to your WK-build? I didn't find it and don't feel like clicking through all the pages of this thread.
I'm very interested in your feats. Specifically if you took Nimble Dodge to keep permastealth going.
Aaah, just as I thought - I need more recovery. That's why I couldn't get a permastealth WK get to work.
With 1700 Recovery or ~2700 Recovery?
DS critting for 21k? :eek: How? Highest I get with Battlefield Scavenger weapons and about 3000 ArP is 10k on squishier targets. But I'm mainly Scoundrel and use Bilethorn. Did you take Executioner and a Vorpal to get such high damage?
Yeah, not once I got into a PvP game on Preview until now - really sad.
Here you go, man. It's not yet complete though since I haven't completed the Gear Section yet. And yes, I did take Nimble Dodge. It's really useful once you get 5/5 in Swift Footwork and if you got the Elven Resolve Boon from Sharandar. That's an extra 20% more Stamina gain which is really noticeable. It's as if you can dodge 3 times like a CW, only the third dodge will take a slight delay. That in conjunction with Twilight Adept should provide you the necessary Stealth extensions you need outside of BnS and SS.
Yes you read correctly! It's 1.7k Recovery. 1735 to be exact since I wasn't using the Stone of Allure that time. 1735 Recovery directly equates to 15% Recharge Speed Increase so that plus the 10% bonus from INT should take BnS and SS to more comfortable CD's.
Hehe 21k crit DS, it's crazy, right? Setherio (creator of the WK PVE Executioner guide) gave me a P. Vorp in Preview so I could test out some stuff with DS. But I also had 25% extra Crit Severity from Brutal Backstab and the Overrun Critical proc so those 2 contributed to the damage my DS could do.
I managed to get into some PVP matches in Preview during the time the new sets were released. It was really awesome. I LOVE Healing Depression. You should really try to arrange some matches in there sometime. You're a member of our channel, right? Just tell us if you need additional guys to come with you in Preview. I think some of them would also like to experience how it feels to PVP in the new server. It'd be a TR party though but I could take my Iron Maiden GF instead just so we'd have a little variety.
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crystal892fMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 385Arc User
lol, I saw as "posted date" 05-26-2013 and was like "wtf". But then I saw your edit from 01-24-2014 - I guess you reserved this post.
Thanks, by the way!
And yes, I did take Nimble Dodge. It's really useful once you get 5/5 in Swift Footwork and if you got the Elven Resolve Boon from Sharandar. That's an extra 20% more Stamina gain which is really noticeable. It's as if you can dodge 3 times like a CW, only the third dodge will take a slight delay. That in conjunction with Twilight Adept should provide you the necessary Stealth extensions you need outside of BnS and SS.
Hmm, I will test the PvP T2.5 set including your attributes and stats today on preview. I wanna know if Nimble Dodge is really mandatory to maintain permastealth. Otherwise I'd rather go with Scoundrel's "Underhanded Tactics" and "Nimble Blade" to increase the damage even further than Executioner does.
Or did you test it already?
Yes you read correctly! It's 1.7k Recovery. 1735 to be exact since I wasn't using the Stone of Allure that time. 1735 Recovery directly equates to 15% Recharge Speed Increase so that plus the 10% bonus from INT should take BnS and SS to more comfortable CD's.
Hehe 21k crit DS, it's crazy, right? Setherio (creator of the WK PVE Executioner guide) gave me a P. Vorp in Preview so I could test out some stuff with DS. But I also had 25% extra Crit Severity from Brutal Backstab and the Overrun Critical proc so those 2 contributed to the damage my DS could do.
In your build you mention that DS doesn't proc Overrun Critical (I wonder if this is intended or a bug). So I guess you critted with CoS till OC and threw DS then?
I am playing the character I rolled on Day 1 of Neverwinter's original beta. Initially I put all my points into Str and Dex. I respeced and tried putting points into INT and was only able to get it up to 14. It worked ok, but I did lose damage. As such, I respeced back and put them all back into Strength and Dex.
[I actually used the free Respec to test out the WhisperKnife. It was fun but this works better for my style]
Here is my current Build. [Gateway is backup so I took a recent screenshot]
I have farmed like a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for Silvery's. My right column of gear is all Silvery for Offense and all Radiant for Defense. I have all Darks for Utility and my Weapons have Radiant's for Power. I am thinking of getting some Armor Pen instead.
I bought the Raven head with 24,000 Glory points from PVP
and after successfully auctioning some Epic Gear, I bought a Water Artifact.
With those, my Recovery is in a nice state
At-Wills: Gloaming Cut, Cloud of Steel.
Encounters: Impossible to Catch, Impact Shot or Bait and Switch , Shadow Strike,
Class Features: Tactics, Sneak Attack.
Dailies: Lurker's Assault, Shocking Execution.
I change up the first At Will and my Class Features to adapt to the PVP match I am in. Lately I opt for having more speed and crit.
For PVE, I use Impact Shot for all the non bosses and ITC with the Boss.
lol, I saw as "posted date" 05-26-2013 and was like "wtf". But then I saw your edit from 01-24-2014 - I guess you reserved this post.
Thanks, by the way!
Hmm, I will test the PvP T2.5 set including your attributes and stats today on preview. I wanna know if Nimble Dodge is really mandatory to maintain permastealth. Otherwise I'd rather go with Scoundrel's "Underhanded Tactics" and "Nimble Blade" to increase the damage even further than Executioner does.
Or did you test it already?
I see - great to hear.
In your build you mention that DS doesn't proc Overrun Critical (I wonder if this is intended or a bug). So I guess you critted with CoS till OC and threw DS then?
Yes, sir. But it's pretty empty everytime I log in later in the evening (I'm european, so it's CET).
Hey Crys, no prob! And Nimble Dodge isn't that mandatory for a Permastealth but it synergizes VERY well with Twilight Adept, Swift Footwork and Elven Resolve. For more information about not taking Nimble Dodge but still getting a permastealth rotation down, you may want to check out the guide made x3lade. Another stealth build, but he doesn't have Sneaky Stabber for Gloaming Cut and instead went for +10 Points to Scoundrel (Underhanded Tactics, Nimble Blade).
And yep, didn't seem like DS proc-ed OC and it seems to be a bug. But then again we can't really be too sure. I haven't parsed enough to really make a conclusion. 21k crits are actually a rarity. Most of the time I'd get 13 - 15k, but very possible to go higher with more Power and ArPen.
And hehe same here. I get online on times that don't seem to have much people on since I'm from the other side of the world. But I'll try to catch you guys online sometime, specially in the weekends!
Dragons in general are impossible to solo as an Executioner MI. But it may be possible as an Executioner WK. It will take time, though. But Valindra swooping down from time to time for a choke is troublesome which may further complicate this. I soloed a Karrundax once when my party went down, and he had around 15% HP left. We are an insurance in parties, making sure that their efforts in taking down the boss will not be wasted because we can finish it up for them.
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crystal892fMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 385Arc User
Initially I put all my points into Str and Dex. I respeced and tried putting points into INT and was only able to get it up to 14. It worked ok, but I did lose damage. As such, I respeced back and put them all back into Strength and Dex.
So, you have not invested in INT and with Recovery and Sneaky Stabber (+ Bait and Switch and Shadow Strike, of course) alone you can maintain permastealth? Even in PvP, where most of the time you can't just safely "spam" Gloaming Cut like you can in PvE?
And Nimble Dodge isn't that mandatory for a Permastealth but it synergizes VERY well with Twilight Adept, Swift Footwork and Elven Resolve. For more information about not taking Nimble Dodge but still getting a permastealth rotation down, you may want to check out the guide made x3lade. Another stealth build, but he doesn't have Sneaky Stabber for Gloaming Cut and instead went for +10 Points to Scoundrel (Underhanded Tactics, Nimble Blade).
I did check out x3lade's guide, but I couldn't get it to work his way.
I actually tried to permastealth with my WK TR yesterday on Preview - with the new set. I had 25% cooldown reduction with INT and Recovery; 10% stamina regeneration from Strength; Swift Footwork, Twilight Adept, Improved Cunning Sneak. I tested once with the Nimble Dodge setup and once with Nimble Blade. From your experience you said with Nimble Dodge there is a bit room for error in the rotation. But when I tested it, it was VERY close. No room for error at all.
What I did: Stealth -> Bait and Switch -> Shadow Strike -> Bait and Switch -> ... - and dodge as often as possible to gain stealth via Twilight Adept.
Needless to say, with the Nimble Blade setup, I couldn't get it to work.
Only thing I'm missing is the Elven Resolve boon. But I can't imagine that these 10% stamina regeneration make such a big difference.
What am I missing here?
EDIT:
What I also would like to know: How viable is the WK TR against well geared players / in more competitive PvP? I mean, you keep distance most of the time, but if you wanna hold a point, the space in which you can move is very limited. So there is always the danger of a player getting too close to see you - and you don't have ITC as emergency power.
Nope, not INT. This is my first and only TR character and I will keep him. If I need to increase his recovery I will work on getting better Silvery's. For me, it's a little bit of pride to stick with what I rolled initially. So I am not going to throw away all the time I spent on her, just to try and get better stats. I try to combat those with player skill, Powers and Feats.
In PVP, I don't try to Permastealth. Most of the time I use Impossible to Catch, Impact Shot and Shadow Strike.
While I do utilize my stealth to a good advantage, part of my play style is to utilize coming out of stealth for extra damage. The last Scoundrel feat gives you 15% extra damage for 10 seconds after leaving stealth.
My style is a mix of throwing daggers and getting right in the mix of things.
I will use Todesfaella as a reference for my PVP effectiveness
In PVE, I can maintain Permastealth as my Recovery is 2499 with my Ion Stone summoned.
I did check out x3lade's guide, but I couldn't get it to work his way.
I actually tried to permastealth with my WK TR yesterday on Preview - with the new set. I had 25% cooldown reduction with INT and Recovery; 10% stamina regeneration from Strength; Swift Footwork, Twilight Adept, Improved Cunning Sneak. I tested once with the Nimble Dodge setup and once with Nimble Blade. From your experience you said with Nimble Dodge there is a bit room for error in the rotation. But when I tested it, it was VERY close. No room for error at all.
What I did: Stealth -> Bait and Switch -> Shadow Strike -> Bait and Switch -> ... - and dodge as often as possible to gain stealth via Twilight Adept.
Needless to say, with the Nimble Blade setup, I couldn't get it to work.
Only thing I'm missing is the Elven Resolve boon. But I can't imagine that these 10% stamina regeneration make such a big difference.
What am I missing here?
EDIT:
What I also would like to know: How viable is the WK TR against well geared players / in more competitive PvP? I mean, you keep distance most of the time, but if you wanna hold a point, the space in which you can move is very limited. So there is always the danger of a player getting too close to see you - and you don't have ITC as emergency power.
The Stealth meter drains a lot slower so "very close" is technically "a little room for error." At least by my standards. Come with me in Preview sometime. I'll show you what I do to extend Stealth indefinitely, but in summary what I do is basically this.
1. Stealth: I don't dodge yet.
2. Shadow Strike: This is important. Use this before BnS.
3. Dodge as much as possible.
4. BnS.
5. Dodge if possible.
6. Shadow Strike.
7. Dodge as much as possible.
8. BnS.
9. Rinse and repeat.
And maybe you should try it once you get the Elven Resolve Boon. 10% does not make a big difference but it helps. I think I have to watch you perform the permastealth rotation before I can tell what exactly is missing because I'm not really sure what exactly is going wrong. I'll try to record a video if I can but I've got no idea how to aside from the in-game recorder that does not show the user interface.
As for the topic of WK TR's against geared players in PVP, you'll want to use Plaguefire or Terror Enchantments after the PVP patch hits with Tenacity. Tenacity increases a players Damage Mitigation and it also gives players Critical Hit Reduction which will make Vorpal more useless. Burst damage will be reduced which will lead to players to directly debuffing mitigation instead. This is where Plaguefire and Terror will start to shine. WK's deal a consistent amount of damage thanks to Dagger Threat + DS and CoS. It'll be a fully-ranged setup so you have the luxury of positioning yourself in a place where you will have the least chances of getting detected which are the edges of the node. You can attack while staying in that place, and if someone gets too close you dodge away. But if you do not have stamina for a dodge, you use Smokebomb which is one of the most underrated CC skills in the game. When using Smokebomb in a node where there are more than 2 classes, always make it a point to use it in a place where you know the ranged class will be hit. Melees will need to get near you in order to get a shot at you, and Smokebomb will prevent them from getting close to you during its uptime. But ranged classes can pelt you from afar. But if there are no ranged classes, just use it. GWF's might go Unstoppable but what you want is the time to use Shadow Strike to go back into Stealth.
All in all, playing a permastealth isn't really all that easy as people think it is. We try to elude the attention of more than 1 enemy in a node and that's basically the challenge in stealth builds. Even more so when you're playing a Gloaming Cut melee build because you get too close for comfort. But WK permastealths have the luxury of attacking from range which makes things a little easier. You have more control over when you'll dodge as compared to melee where you have to dodge after attacking whenever possible in order to regain a safe distance from the opponent.
I will use Todesfaella as a reference for my PVP effectiveness
Yep. This guy right here's a good PVP-er. Hits REALLY hard for a sneaky rogue. We made a not-so well-known premade of a guild rage once and they were decently geared too. But it was still a close match which was fun.
And maybe you should try it once you get the Elven Resolve Boon. 10% does not make a big difference but it helps. I think I have to watch you perform the permastealth rotation before I can tell what exactly is missing because I'm not really sure what exactly is going wrong. I'll try to record a video if I can but I've got no idea how to aside from the in-game recorder that does not show the user interface.
Wow, downloading it right now! I hope you guys forgive me in advance for my horrible graphics. I'm not a high-end gamer. Looking forward to recording for you guys!
Feel free to do so, man. Out of all the 5 class forums, the TR forum is the one lacking the most guides. I'm still thinking that we could use more guides. There are still quite a few viable builds and play styles that haven't been written down yet. We need people writing more guides if we want to discover more neat stuff. INT Master Duelist Scoundrel (Almost perma ITC. It's possible.), Speed Saboteur (Tested. 65 - 75% Movement Speed anyone?), AoE Executioner Whisperknife, so much more fun stuff we can do. I'm personally shooting for INT Master Duelist Scoundrel for my next TR, only after I finish completing my GF and either CW or GWF. I just need 2 more companions for her and I'll be going for my next build, either a GWF build that has near permanent damage immunity uptime, or a CW that has 100% RSI for her Spell Mastery; whichever is cheaper to make at that time.
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solveig312Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 15Arc User
edited February 2014
It's nice build, tho. I want to ask you something. Can you do a video how you solo dungeon or something cuz i can't stand solo dungeon either go solo to any dg. Sorry for any mistake i'm not good at english/
While that was encoding I did The Moonless Knight
I slotted BnS and almost did the whole run
Both times I dropped out for a split second was user error.
So this can be done 100% in stealth
I realized the quality was lacking and vimeo suggested I up the bit rate to 5000 so I made that change and created my next video. This time I just wanted to fight in Stealth and not worry about it while grabbing treasure
This is the Dread Ring Qwest to kill Zulkir https://vimeo.com/85665247
Now that I know how to use the software, I can upgrade the quality and do some post record editing.
It's nice build, tho. I want to ask you something. Can you do a video how you solo dungeon or something cuz i can't stand solo dungeon either go solo to any dg. Sorry for any mistake i'm not good at english/
I'll try to find the time to do so (been saying this since beta but time is unfortunately not one of the luxuries I have). But yes, first and foremost you'll want to find a party who will be able to Q with you with their alts. Just tell them they can switch to their mains while you solo the dungeon.
That's the only way to solo dungeons nowadays. Back then I can just Q with friends and ask them to leave. Then I start soloing. That doesn't seem to be possible because of the horrible imposed system where players can Q for dungeons that have already started. It's silly.
While that was encoding I did The Moonless Knight
I slotted BnS and almost did the whole run
Both times I dropped out for a split second was user error.
So this can be done 100% in stealth
I realized the quality was lacking and vimeo suggested I up the bit rate to 5000 so I made that change and created my next video. This time I just wanted to fight in Stealth and not worry about it while grabbing treasure
This is the Dread Ring Qwest to kill Zulkir https://vimeo.com/85665247
Now that I know how to use the software, I can upgrade the quality and do some post record editing.
Im hoping to catch some of our PVP matches.
I hope you enjoy these.
Nice vids, Xyn! I think the quality is good. I agree, let's record some of our PVP matches when we get the time.
So I was playing around in the Preview Shard with the Perfect Vorpal that Seth lent me and tested some setups in Trade of Blades. What I found was a pretty sweet DPS setup that incorporates hard-hitting Gloaming Cut. So what I got was Gloaming Cut strikes that crit for 13k - 15k and it still has an awful lot of room for improvement as I was stacked with Silvery Enchants back then. With more Power, we would probably see higher numbers.
I was using the Alternative Build, I had the Brutal Stalker set and Perfect Vorpal. Feats are the usual from Executioner (Brutal Backstab, Critical Teamwork, Overrun Critical), and the important slotted skills are Invisible Infiltrator and Lurker's Assault. So what happens is that whenever I pop Lurker's Assault, I get a total damage increase of 40%. As long as I crit consecutively, I can bring down the training dummies in one strike, critting for as low as 11k and as high as 16k. The damage varies from time to time.
The only downside is that I can only do this when I have my Daily up and can use Lurker's Assault. But it's still surprising to see a stealth rogue that's supposed to have gimped DPS striking that hard. Wish I had a Perfect Vorpal in live as well.
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solveig312Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 15Arc User
While that was encoding I did The Moonless Knight
I slotted BnS and almost did the whole run
Both times I dropped out for a split second was user error.
So this can be done 100% in stealth
I realized the quality was lacking and vimeo suggested I up the bit rate to 5000 so I made that change and created my next video. This time I just wanted to fight in Stealth and not worry about it while grabbing treasure
This is the Dread Ring Qwest to kill Zulkir https://vimeo.com/85665247
Now that I know how to use the software, I can upgrade the quality and do some post record editing.
Im hoping to catch some of our PVP matches.
I hope you enjoy these.
These are nice. Ty for your time I want to ask you how you doing in 5 DG teams. I mean in DPS cuz every one that i meet in this 5 man team has much bigger dps from me maybe expect healer. LAst time i done PK it was like : Me 1kk dmg and 3 best ppl 3-5kk so
That's the only way to solo dungeons nowadays. Back then I can just Q with friends and ask them to leave. Then I start soloing. That doesn't seem to be possible because of the horrible imposed system where players can Q for dungeons that have already started. It's silly.
I haven't tested it, but supposedly you can set the party to closed and the queue won't replace anyone.
"We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
These are nice. Ty for your time I want to ask you how you doing in 5 DG teams. I mean in DPS cuz every one that i meet in this 5 man team has much bigger dps from me maybe expect healer. LAst time i done PK it was like : Me 1kk dmg and 3 best ppl 3-5kk so
I am normally in the middle. It depends on what I am trying to accomplish. I will slot whirlwind of blades to clear out the lower level bad guys when my daily fills and with Impact shot right now, I can do really good damage and get 4 shots. 1 freebie in stealth, then the next 2, due to me being a scoundrel have 15% extra damage then the last one.
I can't keep up with an HR, but they are flying around and sucking down potions attempting to stay alive while I could be sipping a cappuccino in one hand and stabbing a bad guy in the back with my other hand while in stealth. When the AOE que's, I just hit ITC and stay right where I am.
So I was playing around in the Preview Shard with the Perfect Vorpal that Seth lent me and tested some setups in Trade of Blades. What I found was a pretty sweet DPS setup that incorporates hard-hitting Gloaming Cut. So what I got was Gloaming Cut strikes that crit for 13k - 15k and it still has an awful lot of room for improvement as I was stacked with Silvery Enchants back then. With more Power, we would probably see higher numbers.
I was using the Alternative Build, I had the Brutal Stalker set and Perfect Vorpal. Feats are the usual from Executioner (Brutal Backstab, Critical Teamwork, Overrun Critical), and the important slotted skills are Invisible Infiltrator and Lurker's Assault. So what happens is that whenever I pop Lurker's Assault, I get a total damage increase of 40%. As long as I crit consecutively, I can bring down the training dummies in one strike, critting for as low as 11k and as high as 16k. The damage varies from time to time.
The only downside is that I can only do this when I have my Daily up and can use Lurker's Assault. But it's still surprising to see a stealth rogue that's supposed to have gimped DPS striking that hard. Wish I had a Perfect Vorpal in live as well.
My vids back up this statement. One of the cool things is you can actually see when the crit damage is added. This is when the number is immediately changed with a a second damage number that is 3000+ damage more.
Without Lurkers Assault, seems like the majority of my Gloaming cuts are 7000 damage when I am in stealth. Occasionally I drop to 3000, and when the victims health drops below 50%, I have hit for 20k when I land a Crit within 10 seconds of coming out of stealth.
I did create my own build thread. I have to fine tune it, but I gave you your well deserved credit.
Today was a tough day in PVP for me. Individually, I had a great day, but I managed to be on a bunch of teams that were more concerned with fighting than getting points. The teams kicked *** from a Kill to Death ratio, but lost the matches.
It was very frustrating. I love to kill people but I am not sure if they realized that a single cap, 300 Points, is worth 6 kills or 12 assists and everyone who helps, gets the 300 points?????
In a game where the team did play as a team, I managed to snag 3 separate 400 points.
we took the location and I double killed.
I will say, the TR's I played against today had a variety of styles and everyone represented themselves well. They all were complete Pita's and I found myself fearing and working harder against them than the GWF's
So if anyone on here remembers playing me today.
Give yourselves a pat on the back. You all rocked!!!
I am normally in the middle. It depends on what I am trying to accomplish. I will slot whirlwind of blades to clear out the lower level bad guys when my daily fills and with Impact shot right now, I can do really good damage and get 4 shots. 1 freebie in stealth, then the next 2, due to me being a scoundrel have 15% extra damage then the last one.
I can't keep up with an HR, but they are flying around and sucking down potions attempting to stay alive while I could be sipping a cappuccino in one hand and stabbing a bad guy in the back with my other hand while in stealth. When the AOE que's, I just hit ITC and stay right where I am.
Hehehe. This is true. I'm also usually in the middle when in rainbow parties. I never DD if it's not a rainbow party. Above me will be the GWF and on the top will be the CW. I dislike running with HR's simply because you can rarely find REALLY good ones that do not attract unwanted aggro.
My vids back up this statement. One of the cool things is you can actually see when the crit damage is added. This is when the number is immediately changed with a a second damage number that is 3000+ damage more.
Without Lurkers Assault, seems like the majority of my Gloaming cuts are 7000 damage when I am in stealth. Occasionally I drop to 3000, and when the victims health drops below 50%, I have hit for 20k when I land a Crit within 10 seconds of coming out of stealth.
I did create my own build thread. I have to fine tune it, but I gave you your well deserved credit.
Today was a tough day in PVP for me. Individually, I had a great day, but I managed to be on a bunch of teams that were more concerned with fighting than getting points. The teams kicked *** from a Kill to Death ratio, but lost the matches.
It was very frustrating. I love to kill people but I am not sure if they realized that a single cap, 300 Points, is worth 6 kills or 12 assists and everyone who helps, gets the 300 points?????
In a game where the team did play as a team, I managed to snag 3 separate 400 points.
we took the location and I double killed.
I will say, the TR's I played against today had a variety of styles and everyone represented themselves well. They all were complete Pita's and I found myself fearing and working harder against them than the GWF's
So if anyone on here remembers playing me today.
Give yourselves a pat on the back. You all rocked!!!
Awesome! I just saw your thread, man. I'll drop by to comment later!
And I think I'll take a couple of screenshots of the damage output my Gloaming Cut does with the setup. It's really neat. Sadly it will no longer be possible once the new patch hits because of critical hit suppression, tenacity, AC + DR and all those other things that further reduce burst.
Let's play again later when we catch each other on.
We had some games yesterday, and I got to admit that your build lived up to its nameshake. I am not sure if you needed that extra-umph to hit big, but it seemed that you could avoid targeting forever while people were busy searching for you.
Personally, I would change to Plaguefire if I didn't have access to the higher qualities of Bilethorn.
Hey, Hida. Thanks for dropping by, those games were pretty fun indeed! Hit me up whenever you catch me on and would like to have a couple of matches together. And you're right, I don't think I really need the extra burst since the goal of this build is to elude people on the node, but it'd be great if I could kill people more effectively on the side while doing it, right?
This is with Invisible Infiltrator only, no First Strike which caused my DPS to further jump when I initially tested the setup. This strategy will not work for PVP once Tenacity hits, though. Too much reduction on critical burst that Plaguefire and Terror may overtake the number of Vorp users. But I can imagine how effective it can be for PVE. I haven't parsed anything yet but I'm confident that Gloaming Cut + Lurker's Assault and Invisible Infiltrator may be more effective against a boss when its HP is below 50% as compared to Duelist's Flurry. It doesn't have the Bleed stacks but the extra 35% damage we get from hitting opponents with HP below 50% should make up for the loss in Bleeds. Vorpal is still king in PVE.
Forgive me if this has already been covered Todesfaelle, but do you have any recommendations on Boon choices? I'm using a variation of the first build in this thread (dropped Thrill of the Kill for Devastating shroud). Thanks!
Those pretty much are what I've got. Endless Consumption seems like a really great choice. I was sort of torn between that and Madness since someone said the latter procs off of DF bleeds. However the bonus LS healing when fights go bad can make a big difference. I had picked Elven Resolve prior to going to this build, but the extra stamina regen works great with the stealth refill feat (Twilight Adept?)
Soloed normal FH the other night and had my first real challenge when it became apparent that the E. Rimefire Golem could see me. Fortunately I had ITC slotted and used it from stealth when it tried to melee me, dodging when it charged. That disrupted me enough to make it hard to stay in stealth all of the time, so I kited a lot, fought the mobs when possible and the boss when it melee'd. Both Grast and Hrimir couldn't find me, but did continually spam their AOE powers, which for Hrimir made the fight more challenging. Regardless, I only felt seriously threatened a few times in the boss fights and am definitely getting better at this.
"We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
Comments
I'm very interested in your feats. Specifically if you took Nimble Dodge to keep permastealth going.
Aaah, just as I thought - I need more recovery. That's why I couldn't get a permastealth WK get to work.
With 1700 Recovery or ~2700 Recovery?
DS critting for 21k? :eek: How? Highest I get with Battlefield Scavenger weapons and about 3000 ArP is 10k on squishier targets. But I'm mainly Scoundrel and use Bilethorn. Did you take Executioner and a Vorpal to get such high damage?
Yeah, not once I got into a PvP game on Preview until now - really sad.
Here you go, man. It's not yet complete though since I haven't completed the Gear Section yet. And yes, I did take Nimble Dodge. It's really useful once you get 5/5 in Swift Footwork and if you got the Elven Resolve Boon from Sharandar. That's an extra 20% more Stamina gain which is really noticeable. It's as if you can dodge 3 times like a CW, only the third dodge will take a slight delay. That in conjunction with Twilight Adept should provide you the necessary Stealth extensions you need outside of BnS and SS.
Yes you read correctly! It's 1.7k Recovery. 1735 to be exact since I wasn't using the Stone of Allure that time. 1735 Recovery directly equates to 15% Recharge Speed Increase so that plus the 10% bonus from INT should take BnS and SS to more comfortable CD's.
Hehe 21k crit DS, it's crazy, right? Setherio (creator of the WK PVE Executioner guide) gave me a P. Vorp in Preview so I could test out some stuff with DS. But I also had 25% extra Crit Severity from Brutal Backstab and the Overrun Critical proc so those 2 contributed to the damage my DS could do.
I managed to get into some PVP matches in Preview during the time the new sets were released. It was really awesome. I LOVE Healing Depression. You should really try to arrange some matches in there sometime. You're a member of our channel, right? Just tell us if you need additional guys to come with you in Preview. I think some of them would also like to experience how it feels to PVP in the new server. It'd be a TR party though but I could take my Iron Maiden GF instead just so we'd have a little variety.
Thanks, by the way!
Hmm, I will test the PvP T2.5 set including your attributes and stats today on preview. I wanna know if Nimble Dodge is really mandatory to maintain permastealth. Otherwise I'd rather go with Scoundrel's "Underhanded Tactics" and "Nimble Blade" to increase the damage even further than Executioner does.
Or did you test it already?
I see - great to hear.
In your build you mention that DS doesn't proc Overrun Critical (I wonder if this is intended or a bug). So I guess you critted with CoS till OC and threw DS then?
Yes, sir. But it's pretty empty everytime I log in later in the evening (I'm european, so it's CET).
I am playing the character I rolled on Day 1 of Neverwinter's original beta. Initially I put all my points into Str and Dex. I respeced and tried putting points into INT and was only able to get it up to 14. It worked ok, but I did lose damage. As such, I respeced back and put them all back into Strength and Dex.
[I actually used the free Respec to test out the WhisperKnife. It was fun but this works better for my style]
Here is my current Build. [Gateway is backup so I took a recent screenshot]
http://gateway.playneverwinter.com/#char(XynTrynZia@xyntrynz1a)/charactersheet
I have farmed like a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for Silvery's. My right column of gear is all Silvery for Offense and all Radiant for Defense. I have all Darks for Utility and my Weapons have Radiant's for Power. I am thinking of getting some Armor Pen instead.
I bought the Raven head with 24,000 Glory points from PVP
and after successfully auctioning some Epic Gear, I bought a Water Artifact.
With those, my Recovery is in a nice state
At-Wills: Gloaming Cut, Cloud of Steel.
Encounters: Impossible to Catch, Impact Shot or Bait and Switch , Shadow Strike,
Class Features: Tactics, Sneak Attack.
Dailies: Lurker's Assault, Shocking Execution.
I change up the first At Will and my Class Features to adapt to the PVP match I am in. Lately I opt for having more speed and crit.
For PVE, I use Impact Shot for all the non bosses and ITC with the Boss.
I hope that helps
Scoundrels UNITE!!!
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
Hey Crys, no prob! And Nimble Dodge isn't that mandatory for a Permastealth but it synergizes VERY well with Twilight Adept, Swift Footwork and Elven Resolve. For more information about not taking Nimble Dodge but still getting a permastealth rotation down, you may want to check out the guide made x3lade. Another stealth build, but he doesn't have Sneaky Stabber for Gloaming Cut and instead went for +10 Points to Scoundrel (Underhanded Tactics, Nimble Blade).
And yep, didn't seem like DS proc-ed OC and it seems to be a bug. But then again we can't really be too sure.
And hehe same here.
And those are solid advice, Xyn! Keep it up!
I tried almost 10 times.
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
I did check out x3lade's guide, but I couldn't get it to work his way.
I actually tried to permastealth with my WK TR yesterday on Preview - with the new set. I had 25% cooldown reduction with INT and Recovery; 10% stamina regeneration from Strength; Swift Footwork, Twilight Adept, Improved Cunning Sneak. I tested once with the Nimble Dodge setup and once with Nimble Blade. From your experience you said with Nimble Dodge there is a bit room for error in the rotation. But when I tested it, it was VERY close. No room for error at all.
What I did: Stealth -> Bait and Switch -> Shadow Strike -> Bait and Switch -> ... - and dodge as often as possible to gain stealth via Twilight Adept.
Needless to say, with the Nimble Blade setup, I couldn't get it to work.
Only thing I'm missing is the Elven Resolve boon. But I can't imagine that these 10% stamina regeneration make such a big difference.
What am I missing here?
EDIT:
What I also would like to know: How viable is the WK TR against well geared players / in more competitive PvP? I mean, you keep distance most of the time, but if you wanna hold a point, the space in which you can move is very limited. So there is always the danger of a player getting too close to see you - and you don't have ITC as emergency power.
In PVP, I don't try to Permastealth. Most of the time I use Impossible to Catch, Impact Shot and Shadow Strike.
While I do utilize my stealth to a good advantage, part of my play style is to utilize coming out of stealth for extra damage. The last Scoundrel feat gives you 15% extra damage for 10 seconds after leaving stealth.
My style is a mix of throwing daggers and getting right in the mix of things.
I will use Todesfaella as a reference for my PVP effectiveness
In PVE, I can maintain Permastealth as my Recovery is 2499 with my Ion Stone summoned.
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
The Stealth meter drains a lot slower so "very close" is technically "a little room for error." At least by my standards. Come with me in Preview sometime. I'll show you what I do to extend Stealth indefinitely, but in summary what I do is basically this.
1. Stealth: I don't dodge yet.
2. Shadow Strike: This is important. Use this before BnS.
3. Dodge as much as possible.
4. BnS.
5. Dodge if possible.
6. Shadow Strike.
7. Dodge as much as possible.
8. BnS.
9. Rinse and repeat.
And maybe you should try it once you get the Elven Resolve Boon. 10% does not make a big difference but it helps. I think I have to watch you perform the permastealth rotation before I can tell what exactly is missing because I'm not really sure what exactly is going wrong. I'll try to record a video if I can but I've got no idea how to aside from the in-game recorder that does not show the user interface.
As for the topic of WK TR's against geared players in PVP, you'll want to use Plaguefire or Terror Enchantments after the PVP patch hits with Tenacity. Tenacity increases a players Damage Mitigation and it also gives players Critical Hit Reduction which will make Vorpal more useless. Burst damage will be reduced which will lead to players to directly debuffing mitigation instead. This is where Plaguefire and Terror will start to shine. WK's deal a consistent amount of damage thanks to Dagger Threat + DS and CoS. It'll be a fully-ranged setup so you have the luxury of positioning yourself in a place where you will have the least chances of getting detected which are the edges of the node. You can attack while staying in that place, and if someone gets too close you dodge away. But if you do not have stamina for a dodge, you use Smokebomb which is one of the most underrated CC skills in the game. When using Smokebomb in a node where there are more than 2 classes, always make it a point to use it in a place where you know the ranged class will be hit. Melees will need to get near you in order to get a shot at you, and Smokebomb will prevent them from getting close to you during its uptime. But ranged classes can pelt you from afar. But if there are no ranged classes, just use it.
All in all, playing a permastealth isn't really all that easy as people think it is. We try to elude the attention of more than 1 enemy in a node and that's basically the challenge in stealth builds. Even more so when you're playing a Gloaming Cut melee build because you get too close for comfort. But WK permastealths have the luxury of attacking from range which makes things a little easier. You have more control over when you'll dodge as compared to melee where you have to dodge after attacking whenever possible in order to regain a safe distance from the opponent.
Yep.
Have you tried using Open Broadcast Software ? http://obsproject.com/
Didn't test it yet as I learned about it 3 days ago.
I have a GTX Titan in my computer, so I should be able to get some high quality stuff.
I guess I should create my own Scoundrel Thread
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
https://vimeo.com/85661639
While that was encoding I did The Moonless Knight
I slotted BnS and almost did the whole run
Both times I dropped out for a split second was user error.
So this can be done 100% in stealth
https://vimeo.com/85662585
I realized the quality was lacking and vimeo suggested I up the bit rate to 5000 so I made that change and created my next video. This time I just wanted to fight in Stealth and not worry about it while grabbing treasure
This is the Dread Ring Qwest to kill Zulkir
https://vimeo.com/85665247
Now that I know how to use the software, I can upgrade the quality and do some post record editing.
Im hoping to catch some of our PVP matches.
I hope you enjoy these.
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
I'll try to find the time to do so (been saying this since beta but time is unfortunately not one of the luxuries I have). But yes, first and foremost you'll want to find a party who will be able to Q with you with their alts. Just tell them they can switch to their mains while you solo the dungeon.
That's the only way to solo dungeons nowadays. Back then I can just Q with friends and ask them to leave. Then I start soloing. That doesn't seem to be possible because of the horrible imposed system where players can Q for dungeons that have already started. It's silly.
Nice vids, Xyn! I think the quality is good. I agree, let's record some of our PVP matches when we get the time.
I was using the Alternative Build, I had the Brutal Stalker set and Perfect Vorpal. Feats are the usual from Executioner (Brutal Backstab, Critical Teamwork, Overrun Critical), and the important slotted skills are Invisible Infiltrator and Lurker's Assault. So what happens is that whenever I pop Lurker's Assault, I get a total damage increase of 40%. As long as I crit consecutively, I can bring down the training dummies in one strike, critting for as low as 11k and as high as 16k. The damage varies from time to time.
The only downside is that I can only do this when I have my Daily up and can use Lurker's Assault. But it's still surprising to see a stealth rogue that's supposed to have gimped DPS striking that hard. Wish I had a Perfect Vorpal in live as well.
These are nice. Ty for your time
I am normally in the middle. It depends on what I am trying to accomplish. I will slot whirlwind of blades to clear out the lower level bad guys when my daily fills and with Impact shot right now, I can do really good damage and get 4 shots. 1 freebie in stealth, then the next 2, due to me being a scoundrel have 15% extra damage then the last one.
I can't keep up with an HR, but they are flying around and sucking down potions attempting to stay alive while I could be sipping a cappuccino in one hand and stabbing a bad guy in the back with my other hand while in stealth. When the AOE que's, I just hit ITC and stay right where I am.
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
My vids back up this statement. One of the cool things is you can actually see when the crit damage is added. This is when the number is immediately changed with a a second damage number that is 3000+ damage more.
Without Lurkers Assault, seems like the majority of my Gloaming cuts are 7000 damage when I am in stealth. Occasionally I drop to 3000, and when the victims health drops below 50%, I have hit for 20k when I land a Crit within 10 seconds of coming out of stealth.
I did create my own build thread. I have to fine tune it, but I gave you your well deserved credit.
Today was a tough day in PVP for me. Individually, I had a great day, but I managed to be on a bunch of teams that were more concerned with fighting than getting points. The teams kicked *** from a Kill to Death ratio, but lost the matches.
It was very frustrating. I love to kill people but I am not sure if they realized that a single cap, 300 Points, is worth 6 kills or 12 assists and everyone who helps, gets the 300 points?????
In a game where the team did play as a team, I managed to snag 3 separate 400 points.
we took the location and I double killed.
I will say, the TR's I played against today had a variety of styles and everyone represented themselves well. They all were complete Pita's and I found myself fearing and working harder against them than the GWF's
So if anyone on here remembers playing me today.
Give yourselves a pat on the back. You all rocked!!!
Leaving dead question marks everywhere
Hehehe. This is true. I'm also usually in the middle when in rainbow parties. I never DD if it's not a rainbow party. Above me will be the GWF and on the top will be the CW. I dislike running with HR's simply because you can rarely find REALLY good ones that do not attract unwanted aggro.
Awesome! I just saw your thread, man. I'll drop by to comment later!
And I think I'll take a couple of screenshots of the damage output my Gloaming Cut does with the setup. It's really neat. Sadly it will no longer be possible once the new patch hits because of critical hit suppression, tenacity, AC + DR and all those other things that further reduce burst.
Let's play again later when we catch each other on.
Personally, I would change to Plaguefire if I didn't have access to the higher qualities of Bilethorn.
See you in game!
This is with Invisible Infiltrator only, no First Strike which caused my DPS to further jump when I initially tested the setup. This strategy will not work for PVP once Tenacity hits, though. Too much reduction on critical burst that Plaguefire and Terror may overtake the number of Vorp users. But I can imagine how effective it can be for PVE. I haven't parsed anything yet but I'm confident that Gloaming Cut + Lurker's Assault and Invisible Infiltrator may be more effective against a boss when its HP is below 50% as compared to Duelist's Flurry. It doesn't have the Bleed stacks but the extra 35% damage we get from hitting opponents with HP below 50% should make up for the loss in Bleeds. Vorpal is still king in PVE.
Here you go. I'll be posting the explanations for them in the first page but most probably not today. So far, however, these have been my choices.
Soloed normal FH the other night and had my first real challenge when it became apparent that the E. Rimefire Golem could see me. Fortunately I had ITC slotted and used it from stealth when it tried to melee me, dodging when it charged. That disrupted me enough to make it hard to stay in stealth all of the time, so I kited a lot, fought the mobs when possible and the boss when it melee'd. Both Grast and Hrimir couldn't find me, but did continually spam their AOE powers, which for Hrimir made the fight more challenging. Regardless, I only felt seriously threatened a few times in the boss fights and am definitely getting better at this.