I agree with this idea entirely, especially as my main is an Half-Elf, and has a Racial which in the current build/s (Dilettante) does nothing for him.
That's the same race of my main. Just finished leveling the exact same toon (except race, initial ability scores) to 60. After 100s of hours on my main, was painful and redundant to have to re-level.
Some have noted that the OP's intent was to discuss Initial Ability scores. Absolutely correct. However, race is a natural addition since it follows from the same principle. I suspect those who favor the ability to re-roll Initial Ability Scores but do not favor the ability to re-roll race due so because:
Race choice didn't significantly impact their toon/s
Initial Ability Scores significantly impact their toon/s
Concern that an 'all or nothing' approach would decrease chance of cryptic allowing an Initial Ability Score re-roll token
Changing race has more lore-stigma, so easier to avoid having to defend
When you understand the 2 requests to be principally and functionally the same, it is inconsistent to distinguish them.
As mentioned above, I bit the bullet and made a new character. No dog in the hunt anymore. Still 100% support lowering the cost* of race and initial ability score re-rolls.
* Both exist in the game, but the cost is 3 months of grinding and millions of AD.
That's the same race of my main. Just finished leveling the exact same toon (except race, initial ability scores) to 60. After 100s of hours on my main, was painful and redundant to have to re-level.
Some have noted that the OP's intent was to discuss Initial Ability scores. Absolutely correct. However, race is a natural addition since it follows from the same principle. I suspect those who favor the ability to re-roll Initial Ability Scores but do not favor the ability to re-roll race due so because:
Race choice didn't significantly impact their toon/s
Initial Ability Scores significantly impact their toon/s
Concern that an 'all or nothing' approach would decrease chance of cryptic allowing an Initial Ability Score re-roll token
Changing race has more lore-stigma, so easier to avoid having to defend
When you understand the 2 requests to be principally and functionally the same, it is inconsistent to distinguish them.
As mentioned above, I bit the bullet and made a new character. No dog in the hunt anymore. Still 100% support lowering the cost* of race and initial ability score re-rolls.
* Both exist in the game, but the cost is 3 months of grinding and millions of AD.
I am not against it, but including ability rolls seems to be easier to do than changing an entire race. Changing a race includes an entire appearance change aswell, maybe you forgot about it.
A racial change could be done by throwing it into the appearance change token.
An initial stat re-roll could be done, by throwing that option into a respec token.
#BTW:Magically my post got cut in half, it better be a bug, since i havn't said anything against the ToS...
if they were going to implement initial ability score re-rolls, i think it would make sense in a separate token. they could even coin the DDO name for it: lesser reincarnation token. it would require the character to be rolled back to level 1, but you get to keep all your gear, enchants, etc. for race changes, incorporate it as a greater reincarnation token. this also rolls you back to level 1, but allows you to change your race, class, initial ability scores, etc. you would keep all of your companions, mounts, inventory, etc... perhaps this would also grant you a title. in the realm of d&d, this would make perfect sense.
Yeah and they would need 2 years to implement it, judging by the speediness they've shown, when working with more complex game features... I think my suggestion is faster and more efficient, i don't want to wait another year, which is reasonable. I feel bad, everytime i log into the game, because my character is flawed from the ground up.
I do respect your opinion and i actually like the idea of being lvl 1 again. But i guess it's too time consuming and according to a dev, the initial stat re-rolling is "something they consider implementing". This gave me/us some hope that it might happen.
if they were going to implement initial ability score re-rolls, i think it would make sense in a separate token. they could even coin the DDO name for it: lesser reincarnation token. it would require the character to be rolled back to level 1, but you get to keep all your gear, enchants, etc. for race changes, incorporate it as a greater reincarnation token. this also rolls you back to level 1, but allows you to change your race, class, initial ability scores, etc. you would keep all of your companions, mounts, inventory, etc... perhaps this would also grant you a title. in the realm of d&d, this would make perfect sense.
I see no reason that starting ability scores should have a new token honestly. The current respec already resets -some- ability scores. And I swear they said they are renaming it into a 'character' respec. No reason to not have it reset the rest when they work out how.
The idea for a reincarnation has been brought up before. And people referenced that other game before. But as I said earlier in the thread... Reincarnation in that game does more than just reset your stats. It can actually increase your ability score total. It would be unpopular to copy a feature from another game and water it down.
I could see them changing it into something else though. I could see them using it for a race change token for example. Though I'd rather they not. I'd rather them leave such things OOC. They (race changes) are a part of many MMOs, and I expect it to come eventually. But it doesn't truly fit the lore of Forgotten Realms and should be as removed from the game as possible. Not 'forced' into the lore. Again, all just my opinion on the matter.
Yeah and they would need 2 years to implement it, judging by the speediness they've shown, when working with more complex game features... I think my suggestion is faster and more efficient, i don't want to wait another year, which is reasonable. I feel bad, everytime i log into the game, because my character is flawed from the ground up.
I do respect your opinion and i actually like the idea of being lvl 1 again. But i guess it's too time consuming and according to a dev, the initial stat re-rolling is "something they consider implementing". This gave me/us some hope that it might happen.
They were considering it about half a year ago. After that I've not seen any comment by dev's on this topic
They were considering it about half a year ago. After that I've not seen any comment by dev's on this topic
They have, just not here. Check out this thread. Responses to it start on page 2 if I recall correctly. When someone asked if the renamed power respec would include starting abilitly scores.
Halgarth's Legacy-NWS-DSTGFZHFR
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crazykvexMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
They have, just not here. Check out this thread. Responses to it start on page 2 if I recall correctly. When someone asked if the renamed power respec would include starting abilitly scores.
While I have stated in the past that I am not completely against being able to change your initial ability scores, I also do not want it to be so easily accomplished that it can be done on a whim and $6. I am completely against resetting your race and ability scores. If you can do that, you are basically creating a new character, and when that happens you should be reset back to 1st level. Why should what amounts to a new character be allowed to stay at 60th level and keep all of it's gear? If you want a new character, start over. If you made mistakes, learn from them, and go from there.
While I have stated in the past that I am not completely against being able to change your initial ability scores, I also do not want it to be so easily accomplished that it can be done on a whim and $6. I am completely against resetting your race and ability scores. If you can do that, you are basically creating a new character, and when that happens you should be reset back to 1st level. Why should what amounts to a new character be allowed to stay at 60th level and keep all of it's gear? If you want a new character, start over. If you made mistakes, learn from them, and go from there.
Not until a new player who knows nothing about the builds of his/her class levels himself/herself to level 60 can he/she truly understand which build and related Ability Scores are the best choices for him/her.
Leveling one class to level 60 and finally understand it thoroughly only to find yourself made some unpleasant mistakes when you were creating the character and then start it over again is just not productive. Not to mention that there are many players who play all classes. They surely don't want to start over again on all their classes.
While I have stated in the past that I am not completely against being able to change your initial ability scores, I also do not want it to be so easily accomplished that it can be done on a whim and $6. I am completely against resetting your race and ability scores. If you can do that, you are basically creating a new character, and when that happens you should be reset back to 1st level. Why should what amounts to a new character be allowed to stay at 60th level and keep all of it's gear? If you want a new character, start over. If you made mistakes, learn from them, and go from there.
I do respect your "opinion", luckily the devs seem to have a different one on the matter, though.
I'll add my own opinion aswell: 10 initial stat points do NOT make that much of a difference, to call
a respecced toon a "new" one. The current respec lets me respec 90% more points. Would you
call these characters, new toons, too? Since the feature exists since launch? just curious.
I am completely against resetting your race and ability scores. If you can do that, you are basically creating a new character, and when that happens you should be reset back to 1st level. Why should what amounts to a new character be allowed to stay at 60th level and keep all of it's gear? If you want a new character, start over. If you made mistakes, learn from them, and go from there.
If this game were static, I would agree with you, but it is not.
At any time, Cryptic can alter the game either by changing existing mechanics or introducing new mechanics that would have retroactively changed the character building decisions you made completely. This can happen at any time, through no fault of your own, and it is not from any mistake you made or can learn from.
As this is the case, it is perfectly reasonable to expect to be able to have the option to do a full re-roll. The only thing that can't easily be changed would be your race or class, since your gear (including class/race specific quest rewards) and quest history, would become out of sync. This is not to say it is impossible, but perhaps if you do this, you will find your old gear is simply no longer usable. Replanning your initial stat allocation, however, should have always been included in a respec.
If the Devs make a change that necessitates a free-respec then that respec should also allow re-rolling of stats. But I am not in favor of a purchased respec doing that. And race/class should never be changed in a respec.
Rather than a Respec that can be bought there other ways you can augment your ability scores that fall in line with the game. Of course they would require some Dev work to accomplish but they can be done. Potions that temporarily add points to different scores. Magical Items such as Gloves of Dexterity or Gauntlets of Strength then there are Boots, Hats, Cloaks, Necklaces, Weapons, on so on for a more permanent change. All of these could be used to increase ability scores to make up for an incorrect allocation. Of course this would mean having a limit of 24 points in any ability score. There could be adventure of extreme difficulty that had reallocation as a reward.
There are two things I am against. Being able to basically purchase a min/max character that starts at level 60 and being able to reset your race.
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josiahiyonMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 396Arc User
edited November 2013
Race change token and a (probably separate) ability score token are obvious essentials. Race presents a subtle issue, as there are a few race-specific quests and items.
Class is different in that the person would have to get entirely new gear and re-enchant. It's expensive. I wouldn't be against this, though. Would save time having to re-roll. The time spent re-rolling would give you a second char, which comes w/ bag space, prayer, professions, (etc) so it's a trade-off.
Why not let us allocate our Ability Score points? This is actually the first RPG I have played that doesn't let players allocate Ability Score points and use preset/rolled sets instead.
Letting players allocate their Ability Score points like how it works in traditional D&D would hugely make this game more like a D&D game, imho.
Rather than a Respec that can be bought there other ways you can augment your ability scores that fall in line with the game. Of course they would require some Dev work to accomplish but they can be done. Potions that temporarily add points to different scores. Magical Items such as Gloves of Dexterity or Gauntlets of Strength then there are Boots, Hats, Cloaks, Necklaces, Weapons, on so on for a more permanent change. All of these could be used to increase ability scores to make up for an incorrect allocation. Of course this would mean having a limit of 24 points in any ability score. There could be adventure of extreme difficulty that had reallocation as a reward.
There are two things I am against. Being able to basically purchase a min/max character that starts at level 60 and being able to reset your race.
It's not a new character, it's an old character, so it "starting" at level 60 isn't true at all. People still had to level to 60, or whatever level you felt like rerolling at.
I am all in for rerolling ability scores too with a respec, or at least a new ability-score respec token. I have five 11.5k+ level 60 characters with 2 sets of T2 gear and rank 25 ioun stones on each. Am I really supposed to reroll each class and farm all that equipment/stones again because I had no clue what difference those ability scores would make til I played endgame multiple times? That is just counterproductive.
Alternatively, if the ability score rerolling isn't something the devs want to do, how about a new kind of utility-enchantment that lets you swap 1 ability point with another? For example if you rolled a CW with 12 strength and 15 intelligence, and want to swap those extra points in strength for intelligence, get 3 of those new utility enchantments in your head, arm and boot slots and get closer to your ideal stats.
That way, unless you rolled a character really bad, you should still be able to get near-optimal results from your character's ability scores without having to roll a new character and farm all your gear/equipment again. And you also get to pay the "penalty" for rolling the wrong stats by giving up fey blessings or dark enchantments in those slots.
Comments
That's the same race of my main. Just finished leveling the exact same toon (except race, initial ability scores) to 60. After 100s of hours on my main, was painful and redundant to have to re-level.
Some have noted that the OP's intent was to discuss Initial Ability scores. Absolutely correct. However, race is a natural addition since it follows from the same principle. I suspect those who favor the ability to re-roll Initial Ability Scores but do not favor the ability to re-roll race due so because:
When you understand the 2 requests to be principally and functionally the same, it is inconsistent to distinguish them.
As mentioned above, I bit the bullet and made a new character. No dog in the hunt anymore. Still 100% support lowering the cost* of race and initial ability score re-rolls.
* Both exist in the game, but the cost is 3 months of grinding and millions of AD.
Iyon the Dark
I am not against it, but including ability rolls seems to be easier to do than changing an entire race. Changing a race includes an entire appearance change aswell, maybe you forgot about it.
A racial change could be done by throwing it into the appearance change token.
An initial stat re-roll could be done, by throwing that option into a respec token.
#BTW:Magically my post got cut in half, it better be a bug, since i havn't said anything against the ToS...
I do respect your opinion and i actually like the idea of being lvl 1 again. But i guess it's too time consuming and according to a dev, the initial stat re-rolling is "something they consider implementing". This gave me/us some hope that it might happen.
I see no reason that starting ability scores should have a new token honestly. The current respec already resets -some- ability scores. And I swear they said they are renaming it into a 'character' respec. No reason to not have it reset the rest when they work out how.
The idea for a reincarnation has been brought up before. And people referenced that other game before. But as I said earlier in the thread... Reincarnation in that game does more than just reset your stats. It can actually increase your ability score total. It would be unpopular to copy a feature from another game and water it down.
I could see them changing it into something else though. I could see them using it for a race change token for example. Though I'd rather they not. I'd rather them leave such things OOC. They (race changes) are a part of many MMOs, and I expect it to come eventually. But it doesn't truly fit the lore of Forgotten Realms and should be as removed from the game as possible. Not 'forced' into the lore. Again, all just my opinion on the matter.
Include Ability Score Rolling When Respec-ing (Click and Comment to Show Support)
They were considering it about half a year ago. After that I've not seen any comment by dev's on this topic
They have, just not here. Check out this thread. Responses to it start on page 2 if I recall correctly. When someone asked if the renamed power respec would include starting abilitly scores.
Hey you are right! Thanks for pointing it out!
Leveling one class to level 60 and finally understand it thoroughly only to find yourself made some unpleasant mistakes when you were creating the character and then start it over again is just not productive. Not to mention that there are many players who play all classes. They surely don't want to start over again on all their classes.
I do respect your "opinion", luckily the devs seem to have a different one on the matter, though.
I'll add my own opinion aswell: 10 initial stat points do NOT make that much of a difference, to call
a respecced toon a "new" one. The current respec lets me respec 90% more points. Would you
call these characters, new toons, too? Since the feature exists since launch? just curious.
Best of luck, to you.
If this game were static, I would agree with you, but it is not.
At any time, Cryptic can alter the game either by changing existing mechanics or introducing new mechanics that would have retroactively changed the character building decisions you made completely. This can happen at any time, through no fault of your own, and it is not from any mistake you made or can learn from.
As this is the case, it is perfectly reasonable to expect to be able to have the option to do a full re-roll. The only thing that can't easily be changed would be your race or class, since your gear (including class/race specific quest rewards) and quest history, would become out of sync. This is not to say it is impossible, but perhaps if you do this, you will find your old gear is simply no longer usable. Replanning your initial stat allocation, however, should have always been included in a respec.
There are two things I am against. Being able to basically purchase a min/max character that starts at level 60 and being able to reset your race.
Class is different in that the person would have to get entirely new gear and re-enchant. It's expensive. I wouldn't be against this, though. Would save time having to re-roll. The time spent re-rolling would give you a second char, which comes w/ bag space, prayer, professions, (etc) so it's a trade-off.
Iyon the Dark
Letting players allocate their Ability Score points like how it works in traditional D&D would hugely make this game more like a D&D game, imho.
It's not a new character, it's an old character, so it "starting" at level 60 isn't true at all. People still had to level to 60, or whatever level you felt like rerolling at.
Alternatively, if the ability score rerolling isn't something the devs want to do, how about a new kind of utility-enchantment that lets you swap 1 ability point with another? For example if you rolled a CW with 12 strength and 15 intelligence, and want to swap those extra points in strength for intelligence, get 3 of those new utility enchantments in your head, arm and boot slots and get closer to your ideal stats.
That way, unless you rolled a character really bad, you should still be able to get near-optimal results from your character's ability scores without having to roll a new character and farm all your gear/equipment again. And you also get to pay the "penalty" for rolling the wrong stats by giving up fey blessings or dark enchantments in those slots.